Welcome to Doom9's Forum, THE in-place to be for everyone interested in DVD conversion.

Before you start posting please read the forum rules. By posting to this forum you agree to abide by the rules.

 

Go Back   Doom9's Forum > Hardware & Software > Software players

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 24th July 2015, 05:30   #2721  |  Link
Anima123
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 504
When using nnedi3 as image doubler, the resulted image has a lot of little cubic as mosaic, look like the following
https://www.dropbox.com/s/mukmjum4o9...osaic.png?dl=0

There's no similar problem with madVR.

nVidia 880M with 350.30 driver, windows 8.1 64-bit.

Last edited by Anima123; 24th July 2015 at 05:35.
Anima123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 05:38   #2722  |  Link
Zachs
Suptitle, MediaPlayer.NET
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,721
Does this happen with all the files or just this?
Zachs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 05:41   #2723  |  Link
Anima123
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 504
Just tested with lower resolution videos, no this effect.

The one that I found that has this problem is when upscaling 1024x576 -> 1920x1080. Not sure other resolutions been affected though.
Anima123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 05:47   #2724  |  Link
Zachs
Suptitle, MediaPlayer.NET
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,721
Just created an image with a resolution of 1024x576 to test. I'm not seeing the mosaic effect with either NNEDI3 implementation. LAV Video Decoder set to NV12 only to simulate the typical video file output format. I've also tried with the various settings of different scalers, with or without super res etc.

NVS 4200M with 353.30, Win8.1 64-bit too.

EDIT: Are you by any chance using Bicubic 100 AR chroma upscaling? I think I found a problem with it but I don't understand why... It seems setting sharpness to 99 fixes it, if that's the same problem.

EDIT2: Nevermind. Found the cause. Will be fixed in the next release. As a temporary workaround, don't use the same settings for upscaler and downscaler. For example, if you use bicubic 100 for upscaler, and you want to use the same for downscaler, select 99 for sharpness instead. It's to do with how MPDN caches weights for render scripts.

Last edited by Zachs; 24th July 2015 at 15:08.
Zachs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 05:52   #2725  |  Link
Zachs
Suptitle, MediaPlayer.NET
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,721
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volfield View Post
I just tested your config file with Image Quality set as trade-off mode and it works fine... Not sure why you're seeing the problem. That's especially strange since both Image Quality and Render Performance modes use the UNORM textures thus share the exact same code.
Zachs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 09:40   #2726  |  Link
Belphemur
MPDN Extensions Dev
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volfield View Post
Is there any way for me to help you find solution?

P.S. screenshots include
Which version of XySubFilter are you using ?
Belphemur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 17:24   #2727  |  Link
aufkrawall
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,812
Shiandow, do you want to take a look at this sample?
It has severe banding which gives your deband filter a real struggle.
http://www18.zippyshare.com/v/0Jil84gy/file.html
aufkrawall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 17:37   #2728  |  Link
Shiandow
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 753
Quote:
Originally Posted by aufkrawall View Post
Shiandow, do you want to take a look at this sample?
It has severe banding which gives your deband filter a real struggle.
http://www18.zippyshare.com/v/0Jil84gy/file.html
You need something more than a debanding filter to get rid of banding that bad. Heck even I am not sure if some of it may not have been intentional (the circular band accros Turkey and Syria sure seems to be). It might be better to use a denoising filter for this.
Shiandow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 18:01   #2729  |  Link
aufkrawall
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,812
madVR deband with most aggressive settings takes mostly care of it.
I think the banding accross Turkey and Syria is because of some kind of vignette effect. Yes, it's terrible content, but I think it's still "unwanted" banding.
aufkrawall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 19:27   #2730  |  Link
Volfield
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belphemur View Post
Which version of XySubFilter are you using ?
XysubFiler 3.1.0.705
Volfield is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 23:14   #2731  |  Link
Shiandow
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 753
Quote:
Originally Posted by aufkrawall View Post
madVR deband with most aggressive settings takes mostly care of it.
I think the banding accross Turkey and Syria is because of some kind of vignette effect. Yes, it's terrible content, but I think it's still "unwanted" banding.
Well I agree that it's unwanted, I'm just not sure how to classify it, it really seems to be closer to 'noise' than simple banding. If it had occurred in a reliable source I'd have concluded that it was meant to be there. It's also interesting to note that MadVR set to high starts to remove the 'intentional' band across Turkey and Syria, and even MadVR doesn't successfully remove all the banding.

By the way, if you haven't tried it already, there's been a very recent update to the debanding filter which might help a little (although fixing this image is till beyond it). It should be available in the next release of the extensions, or you can just download the source.

Anyway, thanks for the feedback!
Shiandow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 23:15   #2732  |  Link
Marnes
Registered User
 
Marnes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zachs View Post
Yes this is the right place to report bugs.

I have tested this several times (over 10 times) and couldn't replicate it. If only a reboot can make it go away, that suggests it's something persistent that would go beyond the life-time of a user-mode application. As such it's unlikely to be an MPDN bug.
Guess it must be a video driver problem or something then...

On a different note, will there be improvements to startup speed and such soon? I've been a big fan of mpdn for a while now because the image quality is so good, resource usage is low and the fluid motion filtering is just perfect, but I didn't realize until I installed potplayer that mpdn easily takes 5x as long to open and start playing. Even with my fast ssd, mpdn takes kinda annoyingly long to open when you're trying to go through many files. I tried to look for a replacement for fluid motion (the main reason I don't want to use other players anymore) but all that's available is interframe (haloing artifacts and different end goal) and other avisynth stuff (tedious to set up).

Last edited by Marnes; 24th July 2015 at 23:21.
Marnes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th July 2015, 23:53   #2733  |  Link
burfadel
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,229
Not sure what version of NET Framework it is compiled in. Not sure if compiling with NET Framework 4.6 (Windows 10) would change performance any.
burfadel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2015, 00:20   #2734  |  Link
aufkrawall
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,812
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiandow View Post
Well I agree that it's unwanted, I'm just not sure how to classify it, it really seems to be closer to 'noise' than simple banding. If it had occurred in a reliable source I'd have concluded that it was meant to be there. It's also interesting to note that MadVR set to high starts to remove the 'intentional' band across Turkey and Syria, and even MadVR doesn't successfully remove all the banding.
Yes, still some banding can be perceived. However, I think the high setting is a good compromise between sustaining detail and fighting banding.
My interpretation of this map would be that it's not supposed to contain any banding. There are many gradients, which I think should be smooth and are just meant as eye candy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiandow View Post
By the way, if you haven't tried it already, there's been a very recent update to the debanding filter which might help a little (although fixing this image is till beyond it). It should be available in the next release of the extensions, or you can just download the source.

Anyway, thanks for the feedback!
Will try the next extensions, I'm really bad with anything text/script-related.
I hope my feedback can be helpful in some way.
aufkrawall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2015, 01:19   #2735  |  Link
Marnes
Registered User
 
Marnes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 11
Would it be possible to invert the color scheme on the status bar when the black theme is enabled btw? The black-on-white bar is a bit of an eye sore right now while everything else is dark.

I feel I should point out that I do appreciate Zach's and everyone else's (if anyone, I've no clue about the project's scale) work on mpdn It's a great player
Marnes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2015, 01:26   #2736  |  Link
aufkrawall
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,812
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zachs View Post
BTW, while we're on the subject, has anyone noticed the SM5 NNEDI3 is now around 10% faster with the same neurons vs OpenCL with the recent Nvidia drivers? At least on my Fermi cards, it was neck and neck (with SM5 just a touch faster) when we first implemented it. We haven't updated the NNEDI3 code and the only thing that's changed would've been the drivers. Just wondering if anyone's noticed the speed improvements.
With Maxwell 2.0, OpenCL is still a bit faster, but they are almost equal. In my memory, the gap was wider, maybe SM5 has really improved by driver.
My benchmark results (720p -> WQHD 64 neurons, chroma bicubic, max quality mode, everything else turned off, GTX 980 OC 353.49 driver on Windows 10):

OpenCL:
~20,5ms
~47% GPU usage
1126mhz

SM5:
prefer vector:
~22,7ms
~50% GPU usage
1126mhz

prefer scalar:
~24ms
~54% GPU usage
1278mhz

madVR result is interesting too, it's quite faster:
~13,9ms (maybe can't be compared directly)
~34% GPU usage
1126mhz

Both renderers used D3D11 and the same settings/queue lengths, as far as this can be possible.

Last edited by aufkrawall; 25th July 2015 at 01:29.
aufkrawall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2015, 04:14   #2737  |  Link
Zachs
Suptitle, MediaPlayer.NET
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,721
You'll need to cripple MPDN a bit for a fair comparison. MadVR doesn't have a max quality mode.
Zachs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2015, 13:20   #2738  |  Link
aufkrawall
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,812
Is MPDN's processing queue using more than 16 bit in max quality mode?
aufkrawall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2015, 13:29   #2739  |  Link
huhn
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,921
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...75&postcount=3

looks like max quality is still using 32 bit float.
huhn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2015, 13:38   #2740  |  Link
foxyshadis
Angel of Night
 
foxyshadis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Tangled in the silks
Posts: 9,559
Quote:
Originally Posted by aufkrawall View Post
Yes, still some banding can be perceived. However, I think the high setting is a good compromise between sustaining detail and fighting banding.
My interpretation of this map would be that it's not supposed to contain any banding. There are many gradients, which I think should be smooth and are just meant as eye candy.


Will try the next extensions, I'm really bad with anything text/script-related.
I hope my feedback can be helpful in some way.
My interpretation is that it's not possible to correct all encoding defects. I actually don't see any problem with the green nations, perhaps because mine is set a little higher than yours, but the blue water is horrifying. That looks like round-off, encoding, further processing, then round-off and re-encoding. What it does dither well (the green area) still improves the quality, even if it doesn't improve it maximally.
foxyshadis is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
direct3d, mpdn, nnedi3, opencl, reclock

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 19:06.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.