madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted) - Page 2592

madFloyd · 26th July 2018, 00:07

I'm trying to optimize madVR playback to avoid dropped and repeated frames. I *think* this boils down to subjects:

1) are there any obvious background processes that one should disable for a dedicated HTPC? I can't be sure that this is part of the problem, but I'm guessing it certainly wouldn't hurt.

2) My HTPC desktop runs at 3840x2160 23.979 (nVidia 1060 driver v385.28, running Kodi DSPlayer) so I don't have to change resolution (and experience HDMI handshake with my JVC projector) when playing movies.

I cannot get it to run at 23.976. I've tried custom resolutions specifying 23.976 to no avail. I've been told that only Intel graphic cards will do 23.976. If this is true, I will have to live with a frame repeat every so often and so be it, but can someone confirm?

Thanks in advance.

huhn · 26th July 2018, 00:42

1. shouldn't affect repeated dropped frames.

2. read this: http://madvr.com/crt/CustomResTutorial.html
getting 23.976 is not the point of this.

Asmodian · 26th July 2018, 01:23

I get a very nice ~1 day between drops/repeats estimated (with no drops/repeats during playback) with an Nvidia GPU, drivers 398.36, Windows 10, and a custom resolution (added and tuned by madVR) for my LG C7. It is possible on something besides Intel.

Redemption80 · 26th July 2018, 01:29

As someone who has spend about a decade being annoyed by this (eventually giving up and speeding things up to 24fps for about 4-5 years) my main advice would be do not overthink it, and use your eyes as the judge, not an OSD reporting frame drops/repeats.
Driver 390.70 and an optimised custom res was what i stuck with for most of 2018, a nice little custom res that only dropped a frame every couple of days,but every driver after that the sane custom res (Created within MadVR) would fail.

Recently Nvidia fixed their drivers and 398.36 has proper 23.976 support after years of 23.970, and from a few weeks of testing i think its great. OSD did trigger my OCD with the reported drop every 12-13mins, but i can't see it and i have really looked

Browsing this thread, i've saw that JVC projecters and newer Nvidia drivers may have issues so that may not be an option, but 385.28 should be good if you let MadVR optimise for 30-60mins and afterwards you have a good selection of custom resolutions to test.

Again, as someone who used to get overly techincal but has fallen behind with old age, my main advice would have minimal exposure to any OSD or stats.

Q-the-STORM · 26th July 2018, 07:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asmodian

I get a very nice ~1 day between drops/repeats estimated (with no drops/repeats during playback) with an Nvidia GPU, drivers 398.36, Windows 10, and a custom resolution

8 bit or 10/12 bit?

I just updated to 398.36 to see if it works with my 1080ti, but when I create a custom resolution it always switches to 8 bit.

Asmodian · 26th July 2018, 09:57

8 bit, my TV works better with 8 bit input anyway but it is a limitation of custom modes with current drivers.

ryrynz · 26th July 2018, 10:06

Has anyone documented the various issues with their latest drivers and actually reported them? I don't get why theses issues are still around almost a year after they surfaced.

Manni · 26th July 2018, 14:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redemption80

Browsing this thread, i've saw that JVC projecters and newer Nvidia drivers may have issues so that may not be an option, but 385.28 should be good if you let MadVR optimise for 30-60mins and afterwards you have a good selection of custom resolutions to test.

There is no need to run the 30-60mn optimize with the JVC, none of the options work except the default EDID/CTA, which gives one hour or so without a frame drop/repeat in 4K23p and about a day at 1080p (with 385.28).

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryrynz

Has anyone documented the various issues with their latest drivers and actually reported them? I don't get why theses issues are still around almost a year after they surfaced.

Has anyone ever had success reporting any bug to nVidia? I've never got any reply or seen any improvement, so I haven't bothered with the recent bugs, as it looks like many of them are JVC specific, so they couldn't care less as they wouldn't be able to reproduce.

Here is my recap (I've given up trying new drivers, I'll try one when someone with a JVC reports that a new driver works fine). Note that this is with the rig described in my sig, testing 4K23p RGB 12bits 4:4:4 for all 23p HD and UHD 2D content, 4K50/60p RGB 8bits 4:4:4 for all 50/60p content and 1080p23FP for 3D Mkvs. I have no idea what results others get.

https://imgur.com/a/xekcsZ6

madFloyd · 26th July 2018, 14:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by huhn

1. shouldn't affect repeated dropped frames.

2. read this: http://madvr.com/crt/CustomResTutorial.html
getting 23.976 is not the point of this.

Thank you! Fascinating stuff.

sniper · 26th July 2018, 19:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by sneaker_ger

What subtitle renderer are you using? The function doesn't work with subtitle filters that render on the video themselves ((xy-)vsfilter), only with those that use a separate subtitle interface (MPC-HC ISR, XySubFilter, AssFilter(Mod)).

It used to worked before with just the "don't draw subtitles" option checked, I haven't changed any settings since last year.

pirlouy · 26th July 2018, 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asmodian

I get a very nice ~1 day between drops/repeats estimated (with no drops/repeats during playback) with an Nvidia GPU, drivers 398.36, Windows 10, and a custom resolution (added and tuned by madVR) for my LG C7. It is possible on something besides Intel.

I'm jealous !

With the same driver, I can't create custom resolutions, either with madVR or nVidia tool. It doesn't let me add custom resolution because it considers I already have a 23 & 24 resolution.
If I delete 24 in my EDID, I can add a custom resolution, but only 23 and not 24 (since the 23 is considered a 24, old bug). So in case I had a 24fps video, I wouldn't be able to play it correctly.
So I gave up and use nVidia new standard 23.976Hz (resulting in 1 frame repeat every 11-12 minutes).

veggav · 26th July 2018, 21:01

After reading you guys talking about the 23p situation on nvidia I tried to see if I could fix it on my end.

I'm on driver 398.36 and I'm using
Horizontal: 1276 + 88 + 416
Vertical 8 + 10 + 60
pixel clock 301.58 mhz.

In the OSD I get 23.97670hz but the composition rate changed to 23.978 instead of sticking to 23.976xx

Also in the optimized timming parameters I get 1 frame repeate every 4:40 minutes and it seems it doesn't matter that timing or pixel clock I choose.
Every time I change the current timing it shows the same 4:40 minutes, even if I use one of the optimized pixel clock that show no frame drops/repeats after a reboot it shows 1 frame repate every 4:40 minutes.

Also, I'm trying full screen exclusive now and while in FSE I get composition rate 60hz? Is that a bug or something?
The display is at 23.976

arcspin · 26th July 2018, 21:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by veggav

In the OSD I get 23.97670hz but the composition rate changed to 23.978 instead of sticking to 23.976xx

Hi,
Can someone please explain what the composition rate is and why it is different from the osd refresh rate.

(I asked this question earlier in this thread but I think my question got lost in a couple of other questions I had in the same post.)

Cheers,
Peter

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

veggav · 26th July 2018, 21:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by arcspin

Hi,
Can someone please explain what the composition rate is and why it is different from the osd refresh rate.

(I asked this question earlier in this thread but I think my question got lost in a couple of other questions I had in the same post.)

Cheers,
Peter

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

Yeah, I actually would like to know this myself.

Asmodian · 26th July 2018, 22:33

The composition rate is the Desktop Window Manager which controls when screen updates actually happen. It is pretty good in Windows 10 (though Windows 8.1 is the best one according to madshi), and it is required for proper playback.

el Filou · 26th July 2018, 22:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manni

Has anyone ever had success reporting any bug to nVidia? I've never got any reply or seen any improvement, so I haven't bothered with the recent bugs, as it looks like many of them are JVC specific, so they couldn't care less as they wouldn't be able to reproduce.

Last year I reported a bug, never got any feedback, but then it was fixed in the next driver branch. No idea if it was luck or if me reporting it helped.

arcspin · 26th July 2018, 23:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asmodian

The composition rate is the Desktop Window Manager which controls when screen updates actually happen. It is pretty good in Windows 10 (though Windows 8.1 is the best one according to madshi), and it is required for proper playback.

Great and thank you for an concise answer.
Is the composition rate anything to take into account when trying to set custom refresh rate or is it what it is. Is the Composition rate something that can and should be changed.

For me I have different refresh rates showing in Nvidia, Win 10 composition rate and in Vertex.

Again, thank you for sharing. This is s very interesting topic.

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

Asmodian · 26th July 2018, 23:52

I would not worry about small differences in the composition rate, but it will cause trouble if the composition rate is 60 Hz while the refresh rate is 23.976 Hz or drastic mismatches like that. The composition rate should be close to the refresh rate, e.g. Windows 10 will set it to 24.000 Hz for a 24 Hz refresh rate or 23.977 Hz for a 23.976 Hz refresh rate.

arcspin · 26th July 2018, 23:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asmodian

I would not worry about small differences in the composition rate, but it will cause trouble if the composition rate is 60 Hz while the refresh rate is 23.976 Hz or drastic mismatches like that. The composition rate should be close to the refresh rate, e.g. Windows 10 will set it to 24.000 Hz for a 24 Hz refresh rate or 23.977 Hz for a 23.976 Hz refresh rate.

Great info,
My composition rate is set to 23.978 which sounds about right for me.

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

amayra · 27th July 2018, 00:19

do i need new GPU with HDR support to watch 10bit video in my 10bit display with madvr ?

26th July 2018, 00:07	#51821 \| Link
madFloyd Registered User Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 8	Couple questions about optimizing madVR I'm trying to optimize madVR playback to avoid dropped and repeated frames. I think this boils down to subjects: 1) are there any obvious background processes that one should disable for a dedicated HTPC? I can't be sure that this is part of the problem, but I'm guessing it certainly wouldn't hurt. 2) My HTPC desktop runs at 3840x2160 23.979 (nVidia 1060 driver v385.28, running Kodi DSPlayer) so I don't have to change resolution (and experience HDMI handshake with my JVC projector) when playing movies. I cannot get it to run at 23.976. I've tried custom resolutions specifying 23.976 to no avail. I've been told that only Intel graphic cards will do 23.976. If this is true, I will have to live with a frame repeat every so often and so be it, but can someone confirm? Thanks in advance.

26th July 2018, 01:23	#51823 \| Link
Asmodian Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: San Jose, California Posts: 3,702	I get a very nice ~1 day between drops/repeats estimated (with no drops/repeats during playback) with an Nvidia GPU, drivers 398.36, Windows 10, and a custom resolution (added and tuned by madVR) for my LG C7. It is possible on something besides Intel. __________________ madVR options explained

26th July 2018, 01:29	#51824 \| Link
Redemption80 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 15	As someone who has spend about a decade being annoyed by this (eventually giving up and speeding things up to 24fps for about 4-5 years) my main advice would be do not overthink it, and use your eyes as the judge, not an OSD reporting frame drops/repeats. Driver 390.70 and an optimised custom res was what i stuck with for most of 2018, a nice little custom res that only dropped a frame every couple of days,but every driver after that the sane custom res (Created within MadVR) would fail. Recently Nvidia fixed their drivers and 398.36 has proper 23.976 support after years of 23.970, and from a few weeks of testing i think its great. OSD did trigger my OCD with the reported drop every 12-13mins, but i can't see it and i have really looked Browsing this thread, i've saw that JVC projecters and newer Nvidia drivers may have issues so that may not be an option, but 385.28 should be good if you let MadVR optimise for 30-60mins and afterwards you have a good selection of custom resolutions to test. Again, as someone who used to get overly techincal but has fallen behind with old age, my main advice would have minimal exposure to any OSD or stats. Last edited by Redemption80; 26th July 2018 at 01:33.

26th July 2018, 09:57	#51826 \| Link
Asmodian Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: San Jose, California Posts: 3,702	8 bit, my TV works better with 8 bit input anyway but it is a limitation of custom modes with current drivers. __________________ madVR options explained

26th July 2018, 21:01	#51832 \| Link
veggav Registered User Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 79	After reading you guys talking about the 23p situation on nvidia I tried to see if I could fix it on my end. I'm on driver 398.36 and I'm using Horizontal: 1276 + 88 + 416 Vertical 8 + 10 + 60 pixel clock 301.58 mhz. In the OSD I get 23.97670hz but the composition rate changed to 23.978 instead of sticking to 23.976xx Also in the optimized timming parameters I get 1 frame repeate every 4:40 minutes and it seems it doesn't matter that timing or pixel clock I choose. Every time I change the current timing it shows the same 4:40 minutes, even if I use one of the optimized pixel clock that show no frame drops/repeats after a reboot it shows 1 frame repate every 4:40 minutes. Also, I'm trying full screen exclusive now and while in FSE I get composition rate 60hz? Is that a bug or something? The display is at 23.976 Last edited by veggav; 26th July 2018 at 21:17.

26th July 2018, 00:42	#51822 \| Link
huhn Registered User Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 5,965	1. shouldn't affect repeated dropped frames. 2. read this: http://madvr.com/crt/CustomResTutorial.html getting 23.976 is not the point of this.

26th July 2018, 10:06	#51827 \| Link
ryrynz Registered User Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 3,227	Has anyone documented the various issues with their latest drivers and actually reported them? I don't get why theses issues are still around almost a year after they surfaced.

26th July 2018, 22:33	#51835 \| Link
Asmodian Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: San Jose, California Posts: 3,702	The composition rate is the Desktop Window Manager which controls when screen updates actually happen. It is pretty good in Windows 10 (though Windows 8.1 is the best one according to madshi), and it is required for proper playback. __________________ madVR options explained Last edited by Asmodian; 26th July 2018 at 22:55.

26th July 2018, 23:52	#51838 \| Link
Asmodian Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: San Jose, California Posts: 3,702	I would not worry about small differences in the composition rate, but it will cause trouble if the composition rate is 60 Hz while the refresh rate is 23.976 Hz or drastic mismatches like that. The composition rate should be close to the refresh rate, e.g. Windows 10 will set it to 24.000 Hz for a 24 Hz refresh rate or 23.977 Hz for a 23.976 Hz refresh rate. __________________ madVR options explained

27th July 2018, 00:19	#51840 \| Link
amayra Quality Checker Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 231	do i need new GPU with HDR support to watch 10bit video in my 10bit display with madvr ? __________________ *I love Doom9*

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