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Old 3rd October 2012, 16:31   #201  |  Link
filler56789
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^
U very-much
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Old 3rd November 2012, 01:04   #202  |  Link
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Hey!
I tried to install the Codec on Windows 8 64bit, but it says sometime like "installation error: the INF-data of a third person doesn't contain digital signatur" (I use a german windows, so I tried to translate). On Windows 7, there was no problem.
What can I do? (please nothing like: install Windows 7). Thanks!

Edit: Found a way:
From the Metro Start Screen, open Settings (move your mouse to the bottom-right-corner of the screen and wait for the pop-out bar to appear, then click the Gear icon).
Click ‘More PC Settings’.
Click ‘General’.
Scroll down, and click ‘Restart now’ under ‘Advanced startup’.
Wait a bit.
Click ‘Troubleshoot’.
Click ‘Advanced Options’
Click ‘Windows Startup Settings’
Click Restart.
press 7

http://laslow.net/2012/03/14/disable...-in-windows-8/

Last edited by Morku; 3rd November 2012 at 12:08.
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Old 12th November 2012, 12:55   #203  |  Link
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Anyone help?

I've used this lovely codec (v2.2) successfully for compressing AVI files. But when I load an FLV file into Virtualdub with the ffms2 plugin in Avisynth, and save it as uncompressed AVI, I then load the new AVI file and try to compress it with cedocida 2.2 or 2.3, I get "source image format not acceptable".

I've tried converttoRGB and yuy2, but it doesn't help. Advice gratefully received.
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Old 12th November 2012, 13:18   #204  |  Link
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source image format is not acceptable

The codec is quite strict on input format but with any particular problem doesn't say exactly what's troubling it. I had that problem too - http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...07#post1585107.

The fix is obviously to make sure your input to the codec is in DV-compliant format, including resolution.
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Old 12th November 2012, 19:49   #205  |  Link
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Thanks that's very helpful. I hadn't realised that DV had to be a specific size.
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Old 17th November 2012, 13:43   #206  |  Link
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Hi, I am trying import deinterlaced mpeg2 on virtualdub, after the installation of cedocida, and virtualdub show this:



Settings codec:



Info file:
Code:
Video
ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)
Format                                   : MPEG Video
Format version                           : Version 2
Format profile                           : Main@Main
Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes
Format settings, Matrix                  : Custom
Format settings, GOP                     : Variable
Duration                                 : 24mn 38s
Bit rate mode                            : Variable
Bit rate                                 : 7 000 Kbps
Maximum bit rate                         : 9 800 Kbps
Width                                    : 720 pixels
Height                                   : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 4:3
Frame rate                               : 23.976 fps
Standard                                 : Component
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Scan order                               : 2:3 Pulldown
Compression mode                         : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.845
Stream size                              : 1.21 GiB (92%)
Color primaries                          : BT.601 NTSC
Transfer characteristics                 : BT.601
Matrix coefficients                      : BT.601
Am I doing something wrong?
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Old 17th November 2012, 16:59   #207  |  Link
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You need fccHandler's MPEG2 plugin to open MPEG2 in VirtualDub.
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Old 17th November 2012, 20:58   #208  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neuron2 View Post
You need fccHandler's MPEG2 plugin to open MPEG2 in VirtualDub.
Thanks for your answer, I will test it when site will be avaliable.
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Old 17th November 2012, 22:36   #209  |  Link
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No need to wait:

gral.y0.pl/~fcchandler
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Old 19th November 2012, 02:40   #210  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neuron2 View Post
No need to wait:

gral.y0.pl/~fcchandler
Thanks, I tested and run perfectly.
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Old 19th November 2012, 07:11   #211  |  Link
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I have the Canopus DV codec that comes with this unit. I know earlier versions of Canopus had issues but that was several years ago.

Should I be using the Canopus still or is this one here much better?
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Old 10th November 2013, 22:40   #212  |  Link
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@Cedocida,

I wonder if you might consider implementing a DVCProHD codec to complement your existing set of excellent DV, DVCPro25 and DVCPro50 codecs.

Tried installing the free Matrox vfw codecs package, to get at their DVCProHD, but it won't install. I'm on a 32-bit XP SP3 PC.

I suspect there is conflict (possibly with your set), although I've read that Matrox codecs can be 'problematic'....and difficult to remove. I certainly don't want to replace your codecs, and merely disabling them (with VCSwap) doesn't solve it.

So owzabout it?

Cheers.
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Old 13th November 2013, 21:03   #213  |  Link
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Follow-up: Uninstalled Cedocida and the Matrox codecs installed OK, so there must be a conflict.

I've run a few tests with some PAL HDV 25p (Mpeg-2, 1440x1080. anamorphic Rec.709) clips converted to YUY2 at native resolution and down-scaled to SD (720x576, Rec.601). Encoded them with the Matrox DVCProHD and DVCPro50 vfw codecs.

First off, the Matrox DVCProHD codec does not accept anamorphic HD resolutions and requires either full res 1920x1080 or down-scaled 1280x720, which I thought strange, as DVCProHD camcorders normally record anamorphic 1440x1080. Secondly, the DVCProHD and DVCPro50 encodes both exhibited flattened luminance when I examined the YUV histograms (after converting back to YV12), regardless of whether PC (YUV 0-255) or clamped 'TV' (YUV 16-235) scales were selected (the only color space option for the compressed Matrox codecs). I had disabled DV and 'other DV' in the vfw FFDShow decoder list, so I can't imagine there were conflicts. Thirdly, the Matrox codecs slow-up loading the VDub 'Compression' library....each time.

I called Matrox (who are based not far) and they were not able to readily explain the luminance issue, except to say the most of their clients use these codecs within proprietary editing suites (Premiere principally) and that I might try their 'MPEG-2 I-Frame Only' codec to see if it had the same issue, which I did, and it did.

That said, when I uninstalled Matrox set, re-installed Cedocida and encoded the down-sized (YUY2) clips with the Cedocida DVCPro50 codec (YUY2 source input, normal quality, anamorphic), there were no such issues and the superior quality compared to standard DV(25) was immediately apparent. Some quick metric tests gave an average SSIM of 94.89 when compared with the YUY2 source and 94.6 when compared to the down-scaled YV12 decode output of the original HDV clips (converted to Rec.601); that was with DVCPro50 decoder set to YV12 output with progressive chroma sampling. Predictably, the DV encode SSIM metrics were lower; average 81.9.

I also ran a few comparisons with the Cineform vfw codec (from the free GoPro editing software). Configured to 'Higher' (the highest) quality, Progressive, PAL SD 16:9, and 'PC' RGB color-space (the only option to default Rec.709), the encodes (compared to YUY2 source) gave an average SSIM of 94.87 i.e. basically on par with DVCPro50, albeit with a lower file size.

Example, comparative file sizes (including WAV audio):

YUY2 input (FFDShow-HuffYuv): 545MB
DVCPro50: 440MB
Cineform: 372MB

DV: 226MB

Both edit very easily, with frame accuracy, although I'd give the edge to Cineform for rendering times (at least in Corel VS). Sure, 'DVCPro' carries an interlace flag, like DV, but for frame-based processing that's of no consequence, except for deinterlacing routines where field order matters, and there is no difference (as far as I know) between progressive and interlaced chroma sampling and file size - something to bear in mind when considering 'I-Frame only' x264 as an intermediate/archive format (as I have/am) where coding interlaced substantially increases file size.

So, whilst some might consider the 'DVCPro' codecs to be over the hill, I think they are still viable alternatives to the 'lossy intermediate' codecs now in vogue. Granted I haven't tried Canopus HQ/Lossless or ProRes, but I'm not inclined to purchase the Green Valley/Edius software or a MAC either. (Edit: Read somewhere that the Canopus HQ codec is also now freely available - requires Windows 7 - it's maybe time I upgraded).

Lacking though is a good, configurable (encoder and decoder), standalone vFw DVCProHD implementation. If there is one, I'd love to know. Otherwise, my plea for Cedocida (if/when he's around) to work his magic, remains . Meanwhile.....I consider that DVCPro50 is a good 'intermediate/archive' option for down-scaled HD, bob-deinterlaced (double-rate) SD and an edit-friendly proxy-file format for those who prefer/need that approach.

I guess critics could argue that the YV12-to/from-YUY2 conversion introduces the potential for more re-sampling error, especially if post-edit processing is performed exclusively with AVISynth YV12 filters. Same could be said for Cineform, which I understand is 10-bit 4:2:2. On the other hand, is YUV 4:2:2 not a better format for video editors that perform color manipulation at the RGB level? Furthermore conversion between MPEG-2 YV12 and DV YV12 is via a YUY2 intermediate (at least Cedocida, does it that way) and so there is no more re-sampling involved than if HDV (or AVCHD) were down-scaled to DV and thence to DVD, MPEG4 etc.

And then does Cineforms 10-bit 4:2:2 make for more or less accurate sampling to and from 8-bit YV12 than 8-bit YUY2? I guess it depends on how Cineform makes that transformation. Interesting that Cineform first came into vogue as an edit format for DVCProHD and HDV before GoPro took it as their action-cam capture medium. The 'Go-Pro' Cineform codec config still includes DVCProHD as one of the input options.
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Old 14th November 2013, 05:42   #214  |  Link
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matrox codecs incur an intermediate RGB step hence the clipping

On modern computers, native HDV editing isn't very slow ; surely "original" sampling is better than any other manipulation ? Moreover, many NLE's can "smart render" HDV if you're performing cuts type editing - so why not edit HDV natively ?
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Old 15th November 2013, 05:46   #215  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
On modern computers, native HDV editing isn't very slow ; surely "original" sampling is better than any other manipulation ? Moreover, many NLE's can "smart render" HDV if you're performing cuts type editing - so why not edit HDV natively ?
I take your point entirely; native HDV editing is fine if one is happy with results of the hybrid (original/re-rendered) MPEG2 output, in terms of desired/uniform quality, color characteristics and playability. Native HDV editing 'Smart frame-accurate rendering’ has come on a long way, at least in the higher-end editing suites.

But me not, at least with the editing software I use (Corel Video Studio). I prefer to edit in an intra-frame format that is intrinsically ‘frame accurate’, ‘smart render-able’ and one which then can then serve as a master and intermediate format for AVISynth processing and archiving, preferably with some economy in file size. So, either lossless or as ‘losslessly-lossy’ as is possible, preferably in YV12 (for preferred AVISynth filters/functions), or in a YUV format that be efficiently interchanged with YV12 over several generations, at least. Oh yes….and ideally one that has some pedigree, developmental-stability and well-defined configurability (that is a word)….so not one ‘in-development/experimental’ that could leave me in several years searching for an older version so that I can access my video files.

At present HuffYuv-YV12 (FFDShow variant) best fits that bill, for me; I know there are other well established lossless variants, several of which I rigorously tested a few years back, but each to his own. Rather, I was looking to see if there are viable alternatives that might offer more economy in file size.

Hence, the consideration of DVCProHD on one hand, Cineform on the other, and just maybe x264 (I-frame only) some where in between.

I had used the Matrox DV codec quite extensively before Cedocida came along. Had, maybe still has, a Top Field First interlace flag, contrary to accepted DV convention. But I don’t recall there being an issue with luminance, as I have now observed with the DVCProHD and Mpeg-2 I-Frame codecs.

I'm not sure if by 'clipping' you are referring to what I would term 'clamping' i.e. truncation of Y values below 16 and above 235, as opposed to back-scaling? If, so that's not what I observed. From the histograms (AVISynth Histogram - mode "levels" - after reconversion to YV12) the codecs seemed to behave as prescribed with respect to optional 'PC' 0 - 255 and 'TV' 0 - 235 scales. What I observed was a flattening of theY (luminance) plot. I'm sure some RGB sampling nuance is involved, but I’m not particularly inclined to get the bottom of it or reinstall the codec pack as their presence makes accessing the VDub codecs library very slow.

So, without a DVCProHD codec, I resorted to some comparative testing of DVCPro50 and Cineform in SD, with the assumption that this might reflect a similar behavior at the HD level. Which is not unreasonable, as DVCProHD (100) was developed as an extension of DVCPro50 by doubling the number of DV codecs, working in parallel, from two to four. There was DVCPro Progressive (in 4:2:0) at one point which, like HDV-SD, was introduced as an intermediate format (for sports, news gathering etc) during the transition from SD to HD.

That said, whilst the comparative SSIM scores I mentioned yesterday were encouraging, I thought my query about the efficiency of the involved YV12/YUY2 conversions might be better answered by some ‘in-use’ generation tests i.e. successive encoding, with each cycling through YV12 (as would be used for AVISynth processing and final target output), to see how well the quality was preserved.

For Cedocida DVCPro50, I merely set the encoder input and decoder output options to ‘YV12 Progressive’ sampling, so relying on the codecs internal transformations to and from YUY2. For Cineform I let the encoder accept YV12 input and then returned the decode YUY2 output with ConvertToYV12 (interlaced=false). What I found rather disappointed me. I’ve yet to fill in all the dots, but by 4 generations the quality of the DVCPro50 encodes (as judged by the SSIM scores) started to deteriorate, dropping from 94.84 to 93.89, and by the 10th generation it was down to 91.80, approaching the quality of (one generation) DV, with a certain loss of definition and more mosquito-noise.

Cineform held up rather better and by the 5th cycle had only dropped from 94.85 to 94.25. Excluding the ConvertToYV12 step (i.e. letting the codec cycle in YUY2) it was a little better – 94.47 after 5 cycles, which is probably not even statistically significant. I’ve yet to complete the series, although up to 5 cycles would not be an unrealistic reflection of use as an edit/processing intermediate, unless you are a "single pipe-liner". Some people have reported edge 'pixelization' artifacts with Cineform, and others blockiness, possibly related to use of non-standard resolutions. But frankly the encodes looked very clean to me, for SD. I'll test some more at HD.

I did do a few SD-level tests with x264. An ‘Intra’ (keyinterval =1) profile (Medium preset, FastDecode, Auto-level, no Tune preset) at crf 7.0 was slightly better (SSIM 95.06) than (the first generation) DVCPro50 and Cineform encodes. At crf 2.0 it was up to 97.97 with a file size (342MB) similar to that of the Cineform encode. Dropping right down to crf 0 (I know ‘lossless’ mode is technically in 4:4:4 format) however file size was up (530MB) on par with Huff-YV12 and YUY2. I couldn’t run the SSIM as DGAVCINdex threw an error. So I don’t think there’s anything to be gained in using I-Frame only x264 as a ‘lossless’ alternative to HuffYuv. Clearly it has potential use as a ‘less-lossy’ intermediate, albeit less convenient unless I use the vfw version (forgive me for even thinking that). Maybe an option for more economic archiving though.....at least progressive video.

Needless to say, I've modified my opinion somewhat on the usefulness of DVCPro50 (and, by extension, DVCProHD) as an 'intermediate' format.It was after all developed as a 'capture' format.

That’s enough for one day.
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Old 15th November 2013, 15:08   #216  |  Link
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Interesting reading:

https://cineform.zendesk.com/forums/22372092-Codec-Technology
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Old 15th November 2013, 16:53   #217  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WorBry View Post
I take your point entirely; native HDV editing is fine if one is happy with results of the hybrid (original/re-rendered) MPEG2 output, in terms of desired/uniform quality, color characteristics and playability. Native HDV editing 'Smart frame-accurate rendering’ has come on a long way, at least in the higher-end editing suites.
I see Pegasys (aka TMPGenc) have a mid-priced MPEG 'Smart' renderer that claims 'lossless' frame-accurate cut-editing/rendering.

http://tmpgenc.pegasys-inc.com/en/product/tmsr4.html

Maybe give the trial a whirl.
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Old 13th July 2017, 17:06   #218  |  Link
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Can someone explain in detail the difference between decoding to YV12 with DV vs MPEG2 chroma sampling?

And how are these different from YUY2 + AviSynth ConvertToYV12?

Edit: There some discussion in this thread. Though I'm still not sure how YUY2 + ConvertToYV12 would compare.

Last edited by shae; 13th July 2017 at 21:34.
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Old 10th October 2021, 16:03   #219  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shae View Post
Can someone explain in detail the difference between decoding to YV12 with DV vs MPEG2 chroma sampling?

And how are these different from YUY2 + AviSynth ConvertToYV12?

Edit: There some discussion in this thread. Though I'm still not sure how YUY2 + ConvertToYV12 would compare.
So my answer is NO. There is no problem. You dont need to use reinterpolate420 or other functions. Just keep YUY2(yv16) output from canopus (grass valley) or cedocida till the end of processing. After encoding to mpeg2 mpeg4 (anyway its YV12) all is going to be ok.

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