High Quality Up-Conversion filter

audiohominis · 31st December 2009, 21:07

Hi guys. In your experience, what would you consider to be AVISynth filter equivalents closest to commercially available up-scaling plug-ins like InstantHD, BlowUp, Genuine Fractals, etc. The rez of some 640x360p vids need doublin' but I'm looking for something sharper than what the conventional bi-linear, bi-cubic, etc algorithms have to offer.
I looked for some pages comparing images produced with various AVISynth filters aimed at that but couldn't find anything satisfying.
Thank you in advance.

DarkT · 31st December 2009, 21:17

I think NNEDI 2 or something like that is famous for its "blow up" capabilities?

*shrugs*

audiohominis · 31st December 2009, 23:04

Thank you for your reply. It looks pretty good.

DarkT · 1st January 2010, 00:27

glad I could help... I'm usually the one who gets helped here

.

Happy new year people, btw

.

10L23r · 1st January 2010, 01:44

ya nnedi2 is the best upscaler for avisynth... probably better than commercial plugins too.

for linear interpolation... the best would be lanczos and spline

thetoof · 1st January 2010, 01:54

Don't forget the new (and still in testing) eedi3 - http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...68#post1343668

audiohominis · 1st January 2010, 02:43

Some pretty impressive de-interlacing results there.

DarkT · 1st January 2010, 03:33

I tried eedi3 with mixed results... at some places it caught some stuff, at others it performe worse than yadif+nnedi2 / tdeint+nnedi2, but it's certainyl worth a shot

.

Blue_MiSfit · 1st January 2010, 07:07

Using nnedi / nnedi2 in double height mode will probably be your best option

If you're doing upscaling, you might want to look into some form of noise reduction, and possibly sharpening - though you should probably go easy on them both! Over filtering is always a bad idea.

Take a look at LSFMod for sharpening, and FFT3DFilter / MDegrain are both excellent denoisers. Tune them carefully.

~MiSfit

Didée · 1st January 2010, 18:18

If you think about what NNEDI actually is doing, you'll come to the conclusion that the result of NNEDI-upscaling *should* be sharpened in some way. Remember that NNEDI is not a scaler, but an interpolator for missing-by-decimation data. In a smooth progressive frame, there is not any data missing in this special way. E.g. a 1-pixel line with 1-pixel antialiasing on either side will be much broader in the upscaled frame than it should be ideally.

orig: 10 10 14 20 14 10 10

NNEDI: 10 xx 10 xx 14 xx 20 xx 14 xx 10 xx 10

Not quite sure how to put this in a few words ... what about "Nyquist interpolation / restoring" ? Those parts of detail that are somehow close to Nyquist frequency in the source frame, those need to be thinned in the NNEDI-upscaled frame.

DarkT · 1st January 2010, 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Didée

Not quite sure how to put this in a few words ... what about "Nyquist interpolation / restoring" ? Those parts of detail that are somehow close to Nyquist frequency in the source frame, those need to be thinned in the NNEDI-upscaled frame.

Sorry man, I lost you at "nyquist" *grins*

But the basic idea is that because NNEDI is trying to restore lost (or missing?) data, and a progressive frame has no lost data, what happens is that some stuff which NNEDI *thinks* is lost data, gets strengthened, I think, no?

shoopdabloop · 1st January 2010, 22:34

a different "sharpening" mode could be used when dh=true.

Undead Sega · 3rd January 2010, 03:14

If NNEDI is an interpolator and not a scaler (even though it does provide good results) what would be the best upscaling filter in Avisynth (just to help answer the OP's question)?

Can TGMC be used as an upscaler???

DarkT · 3rd January 2010, 04:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undead Sega

If NNEDI is an interpolator and not a scaler (even though it does provide good results) what would be the best upscaling filter in Avisynth (just to help answer the OP's question)?

Can TGMC be used as an upscaler???

Dude, you used the B word! *awaits for neuron2* *chuckles*

It is an interesting one though... To be honest though, I didn't find much difference between lanczs and nnedi... Maybe I wasn't lookign good enought? *shrugs*

Undead Sega · 3rd January 2010, 04:37

Quote:

Dude, you used the B word! *awaits for neuron2* *chuckles*

ohhh crap, i totally forgot about that, im not going to edit that post as i will take up for that little typo, what i really meant to say was "what would be the better upscaling filter in Avisynth instead of using conventional resizing methods like Bicubic, Lancz and Spline?"

Quote:

It is an interesting one though... To be honest though, I didn't find much difference between lanczs and nnedi... Maybe I wasn't lookign good enought? *shrugs*

Are you refering to when i mentioned TGMC as an upscaler? i mentioned that because of its motion-compensated analysis of frame(s) which it naturally yields excellent and 'rich' results. Cant it be using that algorithm for upscaling?

markanini · 3rd January 2010, 06:41

How about HybridFuPP?

31st December 2009, 21:07	#1 \| Link
audiohominis Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 129	High Quality Up-Conversion filter Hi guys. In your experience, what would you consider to be AVISynth filter equivalents closest to commercially available up-scaling plug-ins like InstantHD, BlowUp, Genuine Fractals, etc. The rez of some 640x360p vids need doublin' but I'm looking for something sharper than what the conventional bi-linear, bi-cubic, etc algorithms have to offer. I looked for some pages comparing images produced with various AVISynth filters aimed at that but couldn't find anything satisfying. Thank you in advance. __________________ CPU: Intel® Core™i7 930 @ 2.80GFz 2.79 GHz (8 cores) GPU: NVIDIA® GeForce® GTS 250 SYS: Windows 7 Ultimate x64 RAM: 6.00 GB

31st December 2009, 23:04	#3 \| Link
audiohominis Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 129	Thank you for your reply. It looks pretty good. __________________ CPU: Intel® Core™i7 930 @ 2.80GFz 2.79 GHz (8 cores) GPU: NVIDIA® GeForce® GTS 250 SYS: Windows 7 Ultimate x64 RAM: 6.00 GB

1st January 2010, 01:54	#6 \| Link
thetoof Sleepy overworked fellow Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Maple syrup's homeland Posts: 933	Don't forget the new (and still in testing) eedi3 - http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...68#post1343668 __________________ AnimeIVTC() - v2.00 -http://boinc.berkeley.edu/- Let all geeks use their incredibly powerful comps for the greater good (no, no, it won't slow your filtering/encoding :p)

1st January 2010, 02:43	#7 \| Link
audiohominis Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 129	_m Some pretty impressive de-interlacing results there. __________________ CPU: Intel® Core™i7 930 @ 2.80GFz 2.79 GHz (8 cores) GPU: NVIDIA® GeForce® GTS 250 SYS: Windows 7 Ultimate x64 RAM: 6.00 GB

1st January 2010, 07:07	#9 \| Link
Blue_MiSfit Derek Prestegard IRL Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 5,989	Using nnedi / nnedi2 in double height mode will probably be your best option If you're doing upscaling, you might want to look into some form of noise reduction, and possibly sharpening - though you should probably go easy on them both! Over filtering is always a bad idea. Take a look at LSFMod for sharpening, and FFT3DFilter / MDegrain are both excellent denoisers. Tune them carefully. ~MiSfit __________________ These are all my personal statements, not those of my employer :)

31st December 2009, 21:17	#2 \| Link
DarkT Registered User Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 280	I think NNEDI 2 or something like that is famous for its "blow up" capabilities? shrugs

1st January 2010, 00:27	#4 \| Link
DarkT Registered User Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 280	glad I could help... I'm usually the one who gets helped here . Happy new year people, btw .

1st January 2010, 01:44	#5 \| Link
10L23r Registered User Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 122	ya nnedi2 is the best upscaler for avisynth... probably better than commercial plugins too. for linear interpolation... the best would be lanczos and spline

1st January 2010, 03:33	#8 \| Link
DarkT Registered User Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 280	I tried eedi3 with mixed results... at some places it caught some stuff, at others it performe worse than yadif+nnedi2 / tdeint+nnedi2, but it's certainyl worth a shot .

1st January 2010, 18:18	#10 \| Link
Didée Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 5,391	If you think about what NNEDI actually is doing, you'll come to the conclusion that the result of NNEDI-upscaling should be sharpened in some way. Remember that NNEDI is not a scaler, but an interpolator for missing-by-decimation data. In a smooth progressive frame, there is not any data missing in this special way. E.g. a 1-pixel line with 1-pixel antialiasing on either side will be much broader in the upscaled frame than it should be ideally. orig: 10 10 14 20 14 10 10 NNEDI: 10 xx 10 xx 14 xx 20 xx 14 xx 10 xx 10 Not quite sure how to put this in a few words ... what about "Nyquist interpolation / restoring" ? Those parts of detail that are somehow close to Nyquist frequency in the source frame, those need to be thinned in the NNEDI-upscaled frame. __________________ - We´re at the beginning of the end of mankind´s childhood - My little flickr gallery. (Yes indeed, I do have hobbies other than digital video!) Last edited by Didée; 1st January 2010 at 18:23.

1st January 2010, 22:34	#12 \| Link
shoopdabloop Registered User Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 166	a different "sharpening" mode could be used when dh=true.

3rd January 2010, 03:14	#13 \| Link
Undead Sega Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 713	If NNEDI is an interpolator and not a scaler (even though it does provide good results) what would be the best upscaling filter in Avisynth (just to help answer the OP's question)? Can TGMC be used as an upscaler???

3rd January 2010, 06:41	#16 \| Link
markanini Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 299	How about HybridFuPP?