madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[madshi]

Originally Posted by mclingo

Do you know what causes this, its pretty much the only problem I have left to resolve now before I'm fully stable.

Probably GPU drivers?

Originally Posted by Siso

madshi, thank you for the new build, are you planning simple crop options like crop to 1.85:1, crop to 2.35:1, crop to 2.39:1, crop to 2.40:1?

Not planned atm. Anything wrong with automatic black bar detection?

Originally Posted by Neo-XP

FHD to UHD (off / RCA@1 high) :

Sharpness freaks will not like it (if it is forced with NGU Sharp).
Personally, I think that NGU Sharp should be as sharp as possible.

Fair enough.

Originally Posted by Neo-XP

@madshi Maybe another bug in v0.92.11 :

For luma x upscaling (after doubling) Jinc AR is used, but Jinc without AR is used for luma y upscaling (after doubling). How is that possible ?

Yes, probably just an OSD text bug, caused by the (potentially) added "LL" information.

Originally Posted by mclingo

If I turn on calibration and set it to DCI-P3 / power curve 2.20 it corrects the image, surely uncalibrated should push out the same image as EVR renderer, colourwise, or has it always been this way and ive just not noticed?

What kind of movie did you test this with? Was the movie BT.709 or DCI-P3 or BT.2020?

Originally Posted by ryrynz

Madshi, is adaptive sharpen up to date?

I think so. But I still have on my to do list to revisit AdaptiveSharpen, compare the old to the new version, and maybe tweak it all over again.

Originally Posted by mytbyte

I guess it's theoretical since I do find the tone mapping very pleasing, but thought perhaps more visual "juice" could be squeezed from an average brightness monitor (200-250 nits) to get more of the HDR effect. There is quite an added punch with "compress highlights" off but it's hard-clipping so if it could be a similar visual effect to when there is no roll-off, but not quite as harsh. A user-selectable tone map would be indeed a nice touch.

Yes, it's on my to do list to research "good" ways to add more punch, potentially on the cost of mild clipping.

Originally Posted by TheShadowRunner

* removed "exclusive" / "windowed" mode OSD notification

Arg.. why?

To be fair, I had it in there mainly to help me debug problems. If we wanted to keep it in, I would have to add *a lot* more similar messages, like "overlay", "fullscreen", "10bit" vs "8bit" (which can also change when going fullscreen). "HDR" vs "SDR" etc etc etc... Or what would be the reason to just notify you about "windowed" vs "exclusive", but not about all the other things?

But in the end it sums up to that the majority of users wanted it gone (I think). Maybe it'll come back some day as an option, together with lots of other similar notifications. I don't know yet.

Of course if there are many users who're opposed to me deleting this notification, we can do a vote and check how many users want it vs don't want it. But so far you're the only one who's complained. Anybody else unhappy about this?

Originally Posted by Manni

For various reasons (primarily the lack of legit content until recent developments, as I'm only interested in playing my own discs), I had not looked into the HDR>SDR conversion in MadVR for a while. I had a quick look today and was utterly impressed by the results. Amazing work!

I don't have much time at the moment and I need to do a bit more tests with a variety of titles I'm familiar with but I might have a few questions/suggestions for you when I've had the time to take a closer look.

I just wanted to say "well done!", the result is significantly better than what I've been able to get with any custom curves, especially regarding saturation in shadow detail and highlights.

Thanks - I'm glad to hear that!

FYI, another film maker paid me good money to make the HDR -> SDR algorithm available to him via VapourSynth. He's now grading all his films (ads mostly, IIRC) in HDR only, and lets madVR do the SDR based on his HDR grade. Saves him a lot of time...

Originally Posted by Manni

The main downside is that we don't get the metadata on the HDMI out when not in pass-through mode as the content is now SDR, which means that the auto calibration switch (SDR/3D/x.v.color/HLG/HDR10) that I have designed with HD Fury for the Vertex for the JVCs doesn't work to enable my SDR BT2020 calibration, so I have to select it manually (which is just one button on the iPad, but still, automatic is nice, especially for the family).

You could try the madVR option "process HDR" instead of "convert HDR". That way madVR would do the tone and gamut mapping, but still send HDR to the JVC. However, the content would be sent as PQ, so the JVC would still have to some processing of its own. Not sure how the end result would look like.

Originally Posted by chros

I need to use this option with FSE on Win8.1 (see my signature for details) and it's working. So if the reason of the question was a potential removal of it then please don't

I know that the option is still needed in Windows 8.1, I've no plans to remove it.

Originally Posted by clsid

Please add an option to apply RCA only in combo with NGU. So only when it is almost free performance wise.

Hmmmm... Interesting idea. What is the motivation for such a new option? Wouldn't you get the same result by creating a simple profile based on video resolution (e.g. disable RCA for 4K content, but enable it for lower res content)?

Originally Posted by clsid

And also let the settings interface remember the last viewed page.

That should already be the case! The only exception is if you have a "?" device, in that case the settings dialog always jumps there, to motivate you to tell madVR which display type it is.

[ryrynz]

The settings page is remembering the last viewed page for me, no probs.

[Siso]

Originally Posted by madshi

Not planned atm. Anything wrong with automatic black bar detection?

It gave me BSOD, and it detects incorrect aspect ratios, I sent you a sample few months ago...

[SamuriHL]

I vote for no exclusive/windowed message.

[Manni]

Originally Posted by madshi

You could try the madVR option "process HDR" instead of "convert HDR". That way madVR would do the tone and gamut mapping, but still send HDR to the JVC. However, the content would be sent as PQ, so the JVC would still have to some processing of its own. Not sure how the end result would look like.

Thanks for the suggestion, but the idea is to avoid the HDR processing in the JVC entirely, so I favour Convert HDR. On my model (RS500), the HDR mode is buggy so I use the Vertex to never enable it, and I've created custom curves using Arve's tool which are much better than the factory implementation, but are not as good as MadVR's conversion. I can't really use "Process HDR" because as you say it sends PQ so we would still need the display to process HDR, and then we'd have too many variables (MadVR + custom curve).

What's great about MadVR's conversion is that the only thing you need is a good SDR BT2020 calibration, which is easy and straightforward to create, at least as a baseline.

I've looked into this a bit more and here are the main issues I'm trying to solve:

1) If using "process HDR", it works great with an SDR BT2020 calibration in the projector, but I can't apply a 3D LUT anymore. Ideally, I would like to be able to apply a 3D LUT (generated in Calman with a BT2020 SDR Gamma 2.4 target) to improve my baseline, so that the calibration is perfect, yet still use MadVR to do the HDR>SDR conversion. I don't see an option to do this at the moment, but I might have missed it. If I select "your display is already calibrated" pointing to a BT2020 calibration to get SDR BT2020 with Pixel shader math, I can apply any 3D LUT.

2) In order to get the best SDR BT2020 calibration for HDR, I need to open my iris wide, select high lamp and select the filter, to maximize peakY and gamut cover. This gives the best result for HDR content (would be even better if I could apply a 3D LUT without losing MADVR's pixel shader conversion), but it's not ideal for SDR: loss of on/off contrast, higher lamp noise and lower lamp life. I don't really want to keep this calibration on all the time and let MadVR convert to rec-709 etc.

3) This means that I have to select my SDR BT2020 baseline when playing HDR content, and only when playing HDR content. For all other HTPC content, I have to select my rec-709 calibration, which is completely different (lower iris setting, low lamp, no filter). I already have 3D LUTs for this (and PAL/NTSC) that I would ideally like to be able to go on using. Unfortunately, as I have to select "your display is already calibrated" with a BT2020 calibration to get SDR BT2020 out of the pixel shader conversion, I don't think I can keep using these 3D LUTs profiled from my rec-709 baseline/calibration in the projector anymore.

4) I could use the external command when playing HDR content (I already have a separate profile for HDR to deal with 4K60p content, as you might remember that there is a bug in the JVC with that content if metadata is sent with passthrough, so I disable metadata specifically for this at the moment), and then bring back the rec-709 calibration when leaving the HDR profile. However, I understand that the feature is broken at the moment. I also have no idea what the commands are to control the JVCs. I mean, I know the JVC commands, I use them with iRule or the Vertex, but I don't know the syntax to send them from a command line with MadVR.

5) I don't need to have the metadata sent to the Vertex when MadVR is doing the conversion as it seems to be doing such a great job. If I find a way to select my SDR BT2020 calibration on the projector when HDR content is played, that's fine.

6) As I need other calibrations in the projector for non MadVR sources (such as my bluray player for x.v.color and 3D, my UHD Bluray to stream SDR, HDR and HLG content, my Humax Satellite box etc), the easiest way to go for me would be to keep using the Vertex to switch my calibrations automatically in the PJ for any kind of content, and when MadVR plays HDR to get MadVR to select my SDR BT2020 calibration and do its magic. The Vertex selects the calibration according to content (I have one SDR rec-709 for film, one for TV content with frame interpolation, one for 3D (until the frame drop every 3mn issue is fixed with nVidia, I'm still using my standalone player to play 3D whenever possible), one for HLG Rec709, one for HLG BT2020, and one for HDR10 (which wouldn't be used with MadVR). MadVR then adds either its 3D LUT (for Rec709, PAL and NTSC, all based from a single rec-709 profile) or its HDR>SDR conversion (for HDR10). Ideally, as discussed above, if I could also get an SDR BT2020 3D LUT applied (on top of my SDR BT2020 baseline calibration after a JVC Autocal, to improve further the accuracy) when MadVR does its SDR conversion, that would be great.

7) What I don't want for MadVR re HDR10 is either MadVR doing only the processing (I'd rather use passthrough in that case if the display still has to deal with PQ) or MadVR applying a 3D LUT that would also do the tonemapping, as Calman doesn't support BT2390 yet and I suspect the result wouldn't be as good as MadVR anyway, due to all the options available in the MadVR pixel shader conversion. Lightspace supports BT2390 but I'd rather do all my calibration from Calman.

I hope it makes sense. Please let me know if you have any suggestions or if I got something wrong with this initial assessment. It's a complex cinema room set-up, so I might have missed a far simpler way to do this.

Otherwise, for me the questions/priorities would be:

1) Is there a way to get the MadVR HDR to SDR conversion and still apply an SDR BT2020 3D LUT to improve the accuracy of the baseline calibration in the PJ further, without losing the pixel shader conversion?

2) Is there a chance for the external command in the custom profiles to be fixed in the near future, and if yes please could you point me in the right direction regarding the way to pass JVC commands to the projector using a batch file? I don't need the JVC commands themselves, only the way to send them (and which format I'm supposed to use).

Thanks!

[-Hitman-]

Hi Guy's,

Been using a pre-hdr version of madvr for some time with no issues with my Dell monitor (used for desktop/web) and my Denon AVR - LG TV as an extended display (for movies), both on intel HDMI motherboard outputs.

I have just updated my PC to an 8700K system for UHD playback and installed the latest madvr, however my displays are not being correctly detected

My Dell is listed as the only detected display but the identification EDID within the Dell display properties is my Denon AVR and every time I use the Denon a new identification appears under the Dell display device, again showing the Denon edid, these Id's just mount up each time I use the Denon-TV display, weird.

Can anyone help in fixing this issue, I've added an image snip of madvr devices page - showing the Dell display and numerous identifications within it, each id has been created every time I use the Denon - Tv display.

Thanks for any help.


https://i.imgur.com/4w4aH85.png

[mclingo]

Originally Posted by madshi

What kind of movie did you test this with? Was the movie BT.709 or DCI-P3 or BT.2020?

.

Hi, it was a straight bluray UK bluray remuxed, not sure, cant seem to pull that info from mediainfo.

Control J clocks it as BT709 but there is some more odd behavior.

If I play the movie with calibration disabled its all overblown in red like I say. If I then press control s to bring up the settings, when the settings screen comes up the colour reverts to normal like the rendering path is being broken, this is with FSE off using MPC-BE.

What I have also noticed is that setting MADVR calibration to Bt.2020 it even more natural, DCI-P3 was still a bit red. With MADVR set to b3.2020 the colour is almost identical to standard EVR rendering in MPC.

Any idea what going on here Madshi?

[TheShadowRunner]

Originally Posted by SamuriHL

I vote for no exclusive/windowed message.

I vote for a simple toggle, even via registry key, to enable it if we want.
I use madVR mainly for its perfect stability, and the windowed/exclusive info is the most important to me (replying as to why this info versus others), besides the code already exists ^^;
As sometimes i'm swtching from 720p@60 to 1080p@24 and madVR doesn't always go to exclusive mode in that case, with the OSD at least I know.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by Siso

It gave me BSOD, and it detects incorrect aspect ratios, I sent you a sample few months ago...

BSOD is almost always a GPU driver bug. And when it's not, then it's a hardware problem.

I'm sure you sent me a sample, I probably didn't have time to look into that yet. I have a folder with "black bar detection" samples that I need to look at, when I find some time.

Originally Posted by Manni

Unfortunately, as I have to select "your display is already calibrated" with a BT2020 calibration to get SDR BT2020 out of the pixel shader conversion, I don't think I can keep using these 3D LUTs profiled from my rec-709 baseline/calibration in the projector anymore.

That's not true, at least it's not intended to be that way. You should be able to select "convert HDR to SDR with pixel shader math" and then set the display to "calibrate with external 3dlut", and if you then supply both a BT.709 SDR 3DLUT and a BT.2020 SDR 3DLUT, madVR should automatically use the BT.709 3DLUT for BT.709 content and the BT.2020 3DLUT for DCI-P3 and BT.2020 content. And the pixel shader math HDR -> SDR conversion should then not downconvert the gamut if there's a BT.2020 3DLUT.

Originally Posted by Manni

2) Is there a chance for the external command in the custom profiles to be fixed in the near future

It's already in v0.92.11!

Originally Posted by -Hitman-

Been using a pre-hdr version of madvr for some time with no issues with my Dell monitor (used for desktop/web) and my Denon AVR - LG TV as an extended display (for movies), both on intel HDMI motherboard outputs.

I have just updated my PC to an 8700K system for UHD playback and installed the latest madvr, however my displays are not being correctly detected

My Dell is listed as the only detected display but the identification EDID within the Dell display properties is my Denon AVR and every time I use the Denon a new identification appears under the Dell display device, again showing the Denon edid, these Id's just mount up each time I use the Denon-TV display, weird.

Can anyone help in fixing this issue, I've added an image snip of madvr devices page - showing the Dell display and numerous identifications within it, each id has been created every time I use the Denon - Tv display.

Uh, that's weird! And is the raw data of all those identifications identical? Try deleting *all* of them. Does that stop the madness?

Originally Posted by mclingo

Hi, it was a straight bluray UK bluray remuxed, not sure, cant seem to pull that info from mediainfo.

Control J clocks it as BT709 but there is some more odd behavior.

If I play the movie with calibration disabled its all overblown in red like I say. If I then press control s to bring up the settings, when the settings screen comes up the colour reverts to normal like the rendering path is being broken, this is with FSE off using MPC-BE.

What I have also noticed is that setting MADVR calibration to Bt.2020 it even more natural, DCI-P3 was still a bit red. With MADVR set to b3.2020 the colour is almost identical to standard EVR rendering in MPC.

Sounds like something is completely broken in your GPU driver setup or something. The settings screen coming up shouldn't change anything. I don't really know what to recommend here. Try resetting GPU control panel to default settings. Not sure if that helps. Also try different modes in madVR, e.g. D3D9 vs D3D11, exclusive on vs off. Maybe the GPU does bad things in only one of those modes?

[ryrynz]

Originally Posted by madshi

It's already in v0.92.11!

He mentioned it being fixed, is there something wrong with it?

Originally Posted by nevcairiel

Otherwise, madshi may fix the run external program on profile switch thing, then you could build a profile around the matrix and automate anything with an external command as much as you want.

[Clown shoes]

Hi all,

probably a dopey question but it's been a long couple of days and I'm having one of those pandora's box situations, where I was initially trying to do something that I thought would be straightforward, but have now had to teach myself half a dozen different things to make it happen

Basically I started off by trying to calibrate my new TV about a week ago, but quickly discovered I have colour space issues with parts of my chain... long story short I was looking for an alternative way of running calibration patterns on my TV via my laptop, but discovered that for some unknown reason my laptop (Dell xps15 9550) plays the 0-255 black and white clipping files (mp4s from AVS HD 709) as 16-235, or at least I think that is what is happening, there is no information showing from 0-16 or 235-255.

Where I am slightly confused and the reason I am here is because the only way I can make the file play back correctly on my laptop is by selecting 'TV levels (16-235)' in the properties tab of MadVR.

I'm probably being very stupid here and missing something very obvious, but this is the opposite of what I was expecting. Why does 16-235 reveal the information and 0-255 clip it? Have I done something wrong?

Cheers

[huhn]

asically I started off by trying to calibrate my new TV about a week ago, but quickly discovered I have colour space issues with parts of my chain... long story short I was looking for an alternative way of running calibration patterns on my TV via my laptop, but discovered that for some unknown reason my laptop (Dell xps15 9550) plays the 0-255 black and white clipping files (mp4s from AVS HD 709) as 16-235, or at least I think that is what is happening, there is no information showing from 0-16 or 235-255.

that's the point of the file.
if they are >not< shown than BTB and WTW are properly clipped as it should be.

[psyside]

Hi, can anyone tell me how to enable VP9 in Potplayer? i got GTX1050 ti if that helps regarding settings, thanks.

[austinminton]

Originally Posted by ryrynz

He mentioned it being fixed, is there something wrong with it?

I can confirm profile execution is working fine. I don't have to run any scripts manually for 3D, all built into profile execution. Thanks madshi.

[austinminton]

I can even enable and disable 3D on the fly during runtime by setting keyboard shortcuts on the 3D profiles, simply amazing! Finally we have fully automated switching for both 3D and HDR on nvidia. Thanks again madshi for this outstanding release.

[Blackwalker]

finally i got a MSI 1060 6GB Yesssssssssssssssss
i'll try later

[nussman]

Originally Posted by psyside

Hi, can anyone tell me how to enable VP9 in Potplayer? i got GTX1050 ti if that helps regarding settings, thanks.

This thread is for madVR and not for general support.

[psyside]

Originally Posted by nussman

This thread is for madVR and not for general support.

Yes sorry! i was sleepy :/

[pankov]

Originally Posted by mytbyte

After a short PM correspondence, the poster with original problem has tried the MPC-BE instead of Zoom player and it worked, so it's probably a player-related problem.

If it's the same person that posted in the Zoom Players forum it turned out that he was using DirectVobSub in his ZP setup/graph while in MPC it was a straight connection from LAV to madVR. After he configured ZP to correctly use xySubFilter everything started working perfectly in Zoom Player.

[Manni]

Originally Posted by madshi

That's not true, at least it's not intended to be that way. You should be able to select "convert HDR to SDR with pixel shader math" and then set the display to "calibrate with external 3dlut", and if you then supply both a BT.709 SDR 3DLUT and a BT.2020 SDR 3DLUT, madVR should automatically use the BT.709 3DLUT for BT.709 content and the BT.2020 3DLUT for DCI-P3 and BT.2020 content. And the pixel shader math HDR -> SDR conversion should then not downconvert the gamut if there's a BT.2020 3DLUT.

Thanks, but isn't this assuming the SAME profile/calibration is used in the display for all the 3D LUTs? As I can't do this, I have to use the custom profile external command to enable the correct calibration in the display, so that I can have iris open / high lamp / filter for HDR (SDR BT 2020) and iris closed / low lamp / no filter for SDR, correct?

Originally Posted by madshi

It's already in v0.92.11!

Great news, will be very useful for 3D and nVidia users, sorry if I missed this in the change log.

So do you have an answer to my question: how do I select the calibration in the PJ with a batch file? I don't need the JVC commands themselves, I know them, I just need to know how to send them from a batch file. A user has posted how to do it in Python in the JVC thread, but I don't know how to call a python script from a batch file.

So any information (ideally an example of a batch file sending any command to the JVC) about achieving this would be very useful.

Thanks!