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Old 13th October 2009, 14:55   #10081  |  Link
Lincoln Burrows
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New bug spotted on MPC-HC: It can't play the m2ts from "Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country" which is the movie itself, with 25.5 GB, using MPEG-4 AVC. Don't ask me why, but when I open this m2ts alone (using MPC) it's painfully slow (video and audio), and speeding the video won't do any good. I can't blame the m2ts file because both BSPlayer PRO and TMT from Arcsoft are playing just fine, normal speed for video/audio.

It's the first time EVER that I see a m2ts file with such issue. So far I have tested dozens of different m2ts files from different titles/sources and MPC-HC played all of them, with no problems.

Can you guys guess where the problem is? Or should I assume MPC-HC is not 100% fixed and might have this kind of bug once in a while when playing decrypted Blu-rays?
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Last edited by Lincoln Burrows; 13th October 2009 at 15:00.
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Old 13th October 2009, 16:52   #10082  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercury_22 View Post
I'm not sure about quality (although Microsoft's seems better) but for me microsoft dtv-dvd decoder it's much stable and as you've said it's definitely able to play more h264 files !

P.S. All this for windows 7 and DXVA !!!
interesting, my card doesn't do h264 decoding but using the ms decoder, it uses only slightly a bit more CPU than CoreAVC, like maybe 5 percentage point more on a X2 3800+ @2.5ghz. That is pretty good compared to other decoders. this is with EVR. with haali, cpu usage is very high; with vmr9, very choppy. so it is giving me some acceleration.

hey, MS is good for something
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Old 13th October 2009, 17:19   #10083  |  Link
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As for me, performance of MS's decoder is worse then CoreAVC, DiAVC, DivX, FFmpeg-mt. It can't be pretty good compared to other decoders. it can be good compared to MPC-HC internal software decoder/ffmpeg-libavcodec. "like maybe 5 percentage" sounds strange to me. If you looking on CPU load whuile playing some video - this is very inaccurate results.

Last edited by Keiyakusha; 13th October 2009 at 17:26.
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Old 13th October 2009, 17:44   #10084  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saint-francis View Post
@mark0077

Can you upload a sample of a problem area so others can experiment? Due to the inability to consistently reproduce the issues it doesn't sound like it has a chance of being classified as a MPC HC "bug".

Also, what revision of MPC HC does this occur on?
Hi Saint-Francis.

It occurs on build 1299 of mpc-hc, but I went back as far as build 1043 and it still happens. Just can't understand it. At least if someone can reproduce this then I might get closer to a solution.

Here is the file (1 minute clip), about 35 seconds into the clip, the james bond intro credits start, and depending on .... well what seems like luck, you might hear the audio slowdown / speedup anywhere between 30 and 37 seconds.

Its very subtle but its definitely audible and can't be heard when the file is reconverted to any other format.

I can reproduce with or without ffdshow audio, with haali and internal mkv splitter.

Most of the time, if I seek backwards in mpc-hc to say the 20 second point, and play over the same 30-40 second region of the clip again, the problem won't be heard..... which to me might indicate some software / cache / buffer problem..... Just guessing of course.

Just hope someone can reproduce and help figure out whats going wrong.

50 MB File
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=3GZ9J6TZ
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Old 14th October 2009, 11:03   #10085  |  Link
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Is there a way how to call property page of standalone MPC video decoder? "rundll32.exe MPCVideoDec.ax,Configure" doesnot work
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Old 14th October 2009, 12:48   #10086  |  Link
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Can MPC-HC deal with a BR folder? (folder which contains a BDMV and CERTIFICATE folder). If so, how? I tried to OPEN DVD in MPC and select the complete folder but nothing loads.
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Old 14th October 2009, 12:59   #10087  |  Link
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Greetings Casimir.

Arcsoft Video Decoder connectivity issue

Arcsoft has added support for media type {31435657-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71} in its latest decoder (version 160) for VC-1 contents, but the decoder is not getting loaded in MPC. MPC defaults to WMVideo Decoder DMO even when Arcsoft decoder is set to preferred in the external codec list. If WMVideo Decoder DMO is disabled, MPC complains about not finding a suitable decoder.

The new Arcsoft Video Decoder connects with MPC Source filter as well as other source/splitters in Graphedit and other DS players. For some reason it gets ignored in MPC. Would appreciate if you could kindly look into this issue.

Many thanks and best regards.

PS:
Did you also get a chance to look at my earlier post?


Quote:
Originally Posted by mariner View Post
1920x1080x60p H264 mp4 playback problem, build 1290

Greetings Casimir.

1. Thanks for your continuing effort to improve MPC. Playback of 1920x1080x60p

h264 mp4 content no longer gives a back screen with Arcsoft MP4 Splitter/MPC

Decoder, but drops half the frames and plays at 30fps.

Using the internal splitter/MPC Decoder still produces a black screen.

2. The source frame rate reported by the OSD is somewhat suspect, as you can see

from the caps. It reports 59.937 with internal splitter, and 25.00 when MS

decoder is used. Hope you'll look into this.

3. Is there a reason the internal Matroska Splitter shares the same

clsid as Arcsoft Martroska Source filter -
{0A68C3B5-9164-4A54-AFAF-995B2FF0E0D4} ?

4. It seems that internal filters are no longer used when external filters are

set to preferred. Is this the correct behavior? I have always thought that

internals filters are always used when selected, regardless of the external

filters setting. Has this been changed?

Tested on Win 7 using EVR/CP.

Many thanks and best regards.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mariner View Post
1440x1080x60p VC1 WMV playback problem, build 1290.

Greetings Casimir.

Just to let you know the internal MPC Video Decoder had problem with the above in

DXVA mode.

Tested fine with Arcsoft, MS MFT and NV MFT.

Link:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...7&postcount=63

Best regards.

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Old 14th October 2009, 17:51   #10088  |  Link
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For the audio guys, as I posted this in the ffdshow thread, I also feel it should be posted here.

I notice 3 bugs related to audio in mpc (bugs as far as my current understanding goes).

1) Surround channels in 5.1 are sent to back L and back R, rather than side L and side R. This can be checked in ffdshow in its input section, you can see back R and back L coming in as input.
2) When playing 7.1 files given by Mercury_22, the dolby digital plus, and dts-hd, and true-hd files all show up in "Navigate" -> "audio" as having 6 channels rather than 8. Only the LPCM one shows 8 channels.
3) Also the internal audio filter configuration dialog within mpc-hc doesn't seem to have an option for 7.1. The most I can get is 5.1 ("3 front and 2 rear").
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Old 14th October 2009, 18:09   #10089  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark0077 View Post
For the audio guys, as I posted this in the ffdshow thread, I also feel it should be posted here.

I notice 3 bugs related to audio in mpc (bugs as far as my current understanding goes).

1) Surround channels in 5.1 are sent to back L and back R, rather than side L and side R. This can be checked in ffdshow in its input section, you can see back R and back L coming in as input.
2) When playing 7.1 files given by Mercury_22, the dolby digital plus, and dts-hd, and true-hd files all show up in "Navigate" -> "audio" as having 6 channels rather than 8. Only the LPCM one shows 8 channels.
3) Also the internal audio filter configuration dialog within mpc-hc doesn't seem to have an option for 7.1. The most I can get is 5.1 ("3 front and 2 rear").
How do you explain then that TMT and PowerDVD have the same mapping ?
P.S. You can use the trial versions to verify
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Old 14th October 2009, 18:13   #10090  |  Link
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Why should I need to explain it.... if dolby site suggest that surround == side channels, then I would think software like powerdvd and mpc-hc should respect this, instead of basing mpc-hc's workings on other software?

I don't think we should verify mpc-hc's correctness against something like powerdvd or tmt anyways.

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/home_e...ide/index.html

It clearly distinguishes that there is L and R "Surround" and L and R "Back", meaning as you seem to suggest, that powerdvd, tmt and mpc-hc are all incorrect in sending "surround" also to the "back"...... It should be sent to "Surround" or "Side" as some people call it.

I can use my Xonar to swap Back and Side in a 7.1 config, and this shows that Asus also seem to think "Surround" should mean "Side". I havn't found any reference or site to suggest otherwise... apart from the actual software that in my opinion isn't correct (ie mpc-hc, powerdvd, tmt). Of course I would be happy to be proven incorrect, in which case the likes of Asus should be contacted but Dolby seems...... like a more reliable source when it comes to this?

EDIT: Not that its more trustable, but the wikipedia page also suggests that 7.1 audio, the "surround" channels go to the sides, distinct from the "surround back" which go to the back.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surroun...olby_TrueHD.29

Last edited by mark0077; 14th October 2009 at 18:56.
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Old 14th October 2009, 18:38   #10091  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulonet View Post
I having problems playing certain (bigger) mkv files through my wired network. Buying a new router is impossible at this time. I tried increasing the buffer in haali splitter and renderer and the files play very well about 3 to 5 minutes but then MPC craches. Is there another buffer setting?
KMPlayer has an option to add a 50MB buffer for network drives, see if that helps..if it does, maybe it can be implemented in MPC.
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Old 14th October 2009, 19:18   #10092  |  Link
Mercury_22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark0077 View Post
Why should I need to explain it.... if dolby site suggest that surround == side channels, then I would think software like powerdvd and mpc-hc should respect this, instead of basing mpc-hc's workings on other software?

I don't think we should verify mpc-hc's correctness against something like powerdvd or tmt anyways.

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/home_e...ide/index.html

It clearly distinguishes that there is L and R "Surround" and L and R "Back", meaning as you seem to suggest, that powerdvd, tmt and mpc-hc are all incorrect in sending "surround" also to the "back"...... It should be sent to "Surround" or "Side" as some people call it.

I can use my Xonar to swap Back and Side in a 7.1 config, and this shows that Asus also seem to think "Surround" should mean "Side". I havn't found any reference or site to suggest otherwise... apart from the actual software that in my opinion isn't correct (ie mpc-hc, powerdvd, tmt). Of course I would be happy to be proven incorrect, in which case the likes of Asus should be contacted but Dolby seems...... like a more reliable source when it comes to this?

EDIT: Not that its more trustable, but the wikipedia page also suggests that 7.1 audio, the "surround" channels go to the sides, distinct from the "surround back" which go to the back.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surroun...olby_TrueHD.29
Read more in your dolby link and you'll see that the back channels are also called surround

Only in a 7.1 config the surround channels are separated in back and side So you're saying that windows windvd tmt and Powerdvd and FFDshow and MPC are all wrong ?
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Old 14th October 2009, 19:26   #10093  |  Link
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No windows isn't incorrect from what I know. It sends "surround" in 5.1 and 7.1 config (for me) to sides when I perform speaker test (but this may be driver dependent of course).

The text below from Dolby doesn't say surround back. Wikipedia says there is "surround" and "surround back". Everything to me suggests sending surround to the side is correct. Where would a developer go for definitions on stuf like this. I can only base my judgement on these links you provide and those references that I find myself

"A 7.1-channel surround system has seven discrete, full-range channels of sound—Left, Right, Center, Left Surround,Right Surround, Left Back, and Right Back—plus a subwoofer that delivers low-frequency information only."

I don't believe it would be just upto developers of software to just decide whether to send 5.1 surround channels to 7.1 side or back. It would be just like flipping a coin then, everyone would choose one or the other with no concensus. If this does turn out to be the case however and this isnt set in stone then each software app shouldn't just choose one or the other, it should be optional within that piece of software.

GTA 4 the game gives this option, now that I think of it, to use side, or back. It also defaults to side. Xonar HDAV Deluxe gives option to swap back/side channels but also defaults to having surround as the sides and its pdf documentation says for 5.1 configs, surround speakers should be connected to sides. tetsuo has told me before that sides is correct but I will clarify with him why he thinks / knows this and get back to you here.

In any case, mpc-hc sends to back without any option at all.

At least if all software had the option then the physical connections could be left as Is. I hope this is clearly defined somewhere though. Better if this was not negotiable and either side or back could be confirmed to be correct for 5.1 on a 7.1 setup.

Last edited by mark0077; 14th October 2009 at 20:42.
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Old 14th October 2009, 20:33   #10094  |  Link
saint-francis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark0077 View Post
Hi Saint-Francis.

It occurs on build 1299 of mpc-hc, but I went back as far as build 1043 and it still happens. Just can't understand it. At least if someone can reproduce this then I might get closer to a solution.

Here is the file (1 minute clip), about 35 seconds into the clip, the james bond intro credits start, and depending on .... well what seems like luck, you might hear the audio slowdown / speedup anywhere between 30 and 37 seconds.

Its very subtle but its definitely audible and can't be heard when the file is reconverted to any other format.

I can reproduce with or without ffdshow audio, with haali and internal mkv splitter.

Most of the time, if I seek backwards in mpc-hc to say the 20 second point, and play over the same 30-40 second region of the clip again, the problem won't be heard..... which to me might indicate some software / cache / buffer problem..... Just guessing of course.

Just hope someone can reproduce and help figure out whats going wrong.

50 MB File
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=3GZ9J6TZ
All is fine with this sample here. Haali, mpc hc video and ffdshow audio.
Sorry
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Old 14th October 2009, 20:38   #10095  |  Link
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OK Thanks for testing. Might try a reformat, been a while but strange that no other movies show the problem, and only when in mkv form.. cheers.
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Old 14th October 2009, 20:50   #10096  |  Link
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I think I get what you are saying. If you are using Reclock that probably makes it more obvious as it has to rebuffer at any discontinuity.

This is what I see consistently at the start of the credits using the Gothsync branch.

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Old 14th October 2009, 20:51   #10097  |  Link
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Oh sweet, cheers for that, I couldn't see anything like that when using the "normal" mpc-hc's graph. Does this suggest a problem with the file?

Thanks alot, I can send to makemkv developers if this turns out to be the case. I assume its what caused the problem with this as it doesn't happen with the original DVD.
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Old 14th October 2009, 21:33   #10098  |  Link
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I'd say its a file problem yes. As it happens in the same place and certainly isn't normal behaviour.
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Old 14th October 2009, 22:34   #10099  |  Link
leeperry
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I can send to makemkv developers if this turns out to be the case. I assume its what caused the problem with this as it doesn't happen with the original DVD.
some mkvmerge versions are know to give frozen frames I think.
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Old 14th October 2009, 23:29   #10100  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark0077 View Post
No windows isn't incorrect from what I know. It sends "surround" in 5.1 and 7.1 config (for me) to sides when I perform speaker test (but this may be driver dependent of course).

The text below from Dolby doesn't say surround back. Wikipedia says there is "surround" and "surround back". Everything to me suggests sending surround to the side is correct. Where would a developer go for definitions on stuf like this. I can only base my judgement on these links you provide and those references that I find myself

"A 7.1-channel surround system has seven discrete, full-range channels of sound—Left, Right, Center, Left Surround,Right Surround, Left Back, and Right Back—plus a subwoofer that delivers low-frequency information only."

I don't believe it would be just upto developers of software to just decide whether to send 5.1 surround channels to 7.1 side or back. It would be just like flipping a coin then, everyone would choose one or the other with no concensus. If this does turn out to be the case however and this isnt set in stone then each software app shouldn't just choose one or the other, it should be optional within that piece of software.

GTA 4 the game gives this option, now that I think of it, to use side, or back. It also defaults to side. Xonar HDAV Deluxe gives option to swap back/side channels but also defaults to having surround as the sides and its pdf documentation says for 5.1 configs, surround speakers should be connected to sides. tetsuo has told me before that sides is correct but I will clarify with him why he thinks / knows this and get back to you here.

In any case, mpc-hc sends to back without any option at all.

At least if all software had the option then the physical connections could be left as Is. I hope this is clearly defined somewhere though. Better if this was not negotiable and either side or back could be confirmed to be correct for 5.1 on a 7.1 setup.
How are your speaker labeled ?

e.g. Logitech Z-5500 a 5.1 digital surround sound speaker system:
Digital Satellites:
Left/Right: 62 watts RMS x 2 (into 8 ohms, @ 1khz, @ 10% THD)
Center: 69 watts RMS (into 8 ohms, @ 1kHz, @ 10% THD)
Rear Left & Right: 62 watts RMS x 2 (into 8 ohms, @ 1kHz, @ 10% THD)


Or from Creative T6200 also a 5.1 speaker system :

Flexible layout options
Get the perfect speaker system for a place with limited space. The design of the speakers allows you to stack the rear satellite speakers on top of the front satellites and enjoy frontal surround experience.


P.S. Previously I was referring to windows's dolby decoder, or better to WMP
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Last edited by Mercury_22; 14th October 2009 at 23:36.
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