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Old 3rd March 2024, 13:35   #25161  |  Link
flossy_cake
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Post a clip of a low volume video so we can look at dB meter to see what the actual level is
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Old 3rd March 2024, 15:37   #25162  |  Link
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I was able to hear a difference with the LAV DRC option on an old bluray rip but it was small and I decided it is best used under one of two conditions:

1) You are normalizing/loudness equalizing the volume in Windows (e.g. Realtek Audio Console) or HC- do NOT use DRC option.
2) You are NOT normalizing/loudness equalizing the volume in Windows or HC- go ahead and use the DRC option if downmixing to stereo from 5.1.
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Old 3rd March 2024, 16:52   #25163  |  Link
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IMHO the best solution would be a good normaliser/compressor in lav audio or in mpc-hc.
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Old 3rd March 2024, 19:42   #25164  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flossy_cake View Post
Post a clip of a low volume video so we can look at dB meter to see what the actual level is
Everything seems to be affected.
But on further research. Apparently the mediaplayer might be at fault. Fired up mpc-hc and it had the same volume as foobar. But not potplayer.

(not sure about the DVB tuner app)
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Old 3rd March 2024, 19:57   #25165  |  Link
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It's weird. If I change the output to the TV (via HDMI) it is much lower volume. If I use the PC output it's only somewhat more silent. I also have the output of Potplayer set to 7.1 (No such thing possible with Foobar) so Windows Sonic would activate. So maybe that raises the volume a bit?

Also, if i set mixing volume to 200 from 100 in potplayer it's louder on PC output, but Foobar is still much louder when I switch to the TV. What a mess.

Last edited by mzso; 3rd March 2024 at 20:02. Reason: More findings...
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Old 4th March 2024, 00:05   #25166  |  Link
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MPC-HC's volume normalization adjust the volume in a noticable way, you can spot when the volume is adjusted, not what I'm looking for.
Well, suggestions on how to improve the algorithm are welcome. Create an issue on GitHub.
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Old 4th March 2024, 04:21   #25167  |  Link
Sunspark
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I won't be the one to create the issue, but were one be created I could suggest one thing for consideration here.. perhaps just copy the code from VLC's compressor as it has numeric input boxes for: RMS/peak, attack time, release time, threshold level, ratio, knee radius, makeup gain.

Then an audio expert could figure out "good" values if not using the already chosen values.
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Old 4th March 2024, 10:07   #25168  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunspark View Post
I won't be the one to create the issue, but were one be created I could suggest one thing for consideration here.. perhaps just copy the code from VLC's compressor as it has numeric input boxes for: RMS/peak, attack time, release time, threshold level, ratio, knee radius, makeup gain.

Then an audio expert could figure out "good" values if not using the already chosen values.
Or add 3-4 presets, will be much easier than to tweak the values endlessly.
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Old 4th March 2024, 13:02   #25169  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siso View Post
IMHO the best solution would be a good normaliser/compressor in lav audio or in mpc-hc.
Remember rule 12:

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Do not ask "what's best" because this question cannot be answered objectively. Each and everyone has their own view about what's best in a certain area. The best is what works best for you!
For me the best solution is not use normaliser or compressor.

Each user can have different preferences depend on their audio players don't exist the best solution.

Talking about compressor, AFAIK LAV Filters only can apply DRC included in Dolby audio, and can't recommend use it or create a new filter.
It must be a player (software or hardware) option.

About Normalize don't exist good or bad, if you want Normalize you have the risk of low volume mix, if not you can have clips and now you can protect it or not with the risk of change clips to sudden volume changes. That is all.

In my opinion the Mixing Tab in LAV Filters is all you need to downmix multichannel audio.
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Old 4th March 2024, 14:53   #25170  |  Link
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maybe that works better: https://www.ac3filter.net/download-ac3filter/

different audio level between application still cries windows audio mixer.
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Old 4th March 2024, 15:19   #25171  |  Link
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maybe that works better: https://www.ac3filter.net/download-ac3filter/

different audio level between application still cries windows audio mixer.
It doesn't decode dolby digital plus audio.
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Old 4th March 2024, 15:24   #25172  |  Link
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it doesn't have to decode anything.
just use it as a processor.
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Old 4th March 2024, 15:37   #25173  |  Link
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it doesn't have to decode anything.
just use it as a processor.
Is it possible? And how to use it as a processor?
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Old 4th March 2024, 19:51   #25174  |  Link
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as long as lpcm and pcm are enabled it will always be loaded when the audio is decoded.
even with default settings is should still load with audio codex it doesn't know because these are decoded to pcm/lpcm be something else.
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Old 4th March 2024, 21:47   #25175  |  Link
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I was able to hear a difference with the LAV DRC option on an old bluray rip but it was small
If I'm not mistaken LAV's DRC will only work if the audio track is AC3 and contains DRC metadata, so most of the time it won't do anything at all, and even when it does, it's entirely dependent on how much compression the authors decided to encode.

Personally I find peak normalisation to be sufficient , and it doesn't change the dynamic range or artistic intent. Although I was watching an episode of Seinfeld this evening which was sourced from Google's streaming service and the speech has volume issues even with peak normalisation so I ended up going with the speech slow DRC preset in avisynth and that worked ok. The speech fast one gives pumping but that is an outlier preset with 300ms decay which is too fast. 1000ms seems to work ok .
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Old 6th March 2024, 19:17   #25176  |  Link
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If I'm not mistaken LAV's DRC will only work if the audio track is AC3 and contains DRC metadata, so most of the time it won't do anything at all, and even when it does, it's entirely dependent on how much compression the authors decided to encode.
First of all Microsoft MFF decoder decodes DRC differently. Second of all, EAC3 and AC3 are supported, yes, TrueHD is not. Encoder on ffmpeg for eac3 does not support DRC, but all official sources will use DRC even on Atmos EAC3, so this is highly misleading. Basically only applies to ffmpeg encoder.
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Old 7th March 2024, 09:34   #25177  |  Link
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For me the ffmpeg encoder is ok when don't add DRC metadata to AC3/EAC3 encodes.

The Dolby system DialogNormalization/DynamicRangeCompression was intended to equalize the audio volume but the consequence is just the inverse:
Like you can see in the image with the profile "film standard" (the most common applied) you limit the peak audio volume to -20 dB.
If you change to listen a audio CD (see the 'loudnness war') or a TV advertisement or other movie without AC3/EAC3 audio you need modify the volume.
In DVD times everybody say than DTS track are better than AC3 track, when are both present. For better quality? not always, but for high volume.

If a user want audio compression there are filters (see VLC) to apply it to all audio sources, not only AC3/EAC3, and you equalize all audio volume.
In my opinion the compressor must be a player job but if clsid want include it in the LAV filters no problem.

Maybe Dolby have experience about compression and the Dolby presets can be emulated for all audio sources, in the flossy_cake post there are a way to do it with the SoxFilter. But of course there are other compressors in free soft ffmpeg.
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Last edited by tebasuna51; 7th March 2024 at 10:13.
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Old 7th March 2024, 09:49   #25178  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tebasuna51 View Post
For me the ffmpeg encoder is ok when don't add DRC metadata to AC3/EAC3 encodes.

The Dolby system DialogNormalization/DynamicRangeCompression was intended to equalize the audio volume but the consequence is just the inverse:
Agreed... It's an evil thing that Dolby did
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Old 7th March 2024, 11:14   #25179  |  Link
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Originally Posted by tebasuna51 View Post
Like you can see in the image with the profile "film standard" (the most common applied) you limit the peak audio volume to -20 dB.
If you change to listen a audio CD (see the 'loudnness war') or a TV advertisement or other movie without AC3/EAC3 audio you need modify the volume.
Yep and thats why I use Normalize() to recover back the -20db. But I think it recovers slightly less because the compressor attack time is nonzero , so the volume can go temporarily above -20 until such time the average audio level over the attack period goes above -20 , then it will be quickly reduced to -20. So the loudest sample in the whole audio track after compression could still be something like -15 and in that case Normalize would only do +15 gain instead of +20.
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Old 11th March 2024, 22:29   #25180  |  Link
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For interlaced material that is 29.976 which is originally from a DVD, for the quicksync hw deinterlacing option, which is better?

The checkbox says 50/60 (Video) is recommended, and it makes the source filter 60, but the other one for 25/30 (Film) makes the source filter 30 which is what it is with the original interlaced video.

Both seem to work, the interlacing is removed. How do I know which one is most optimal in terms of quality?
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