Welcome to Doom9's Forum, THE in-place to be for everyone interested in DVD conversion. Before you start posting please read the forum rules. By posting to this forum you agree to abide by the rules. |
|
View Poll Results: When will the AV2 spec be final and published? | |||
2023 | 1 | 4.00% | |
2024 | 8 | 32.00% | |
2025 | 10 | 40.00% | |
2026 | 6 | 24.00% | |
Voters: 25. You may not vote on this poll |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread | Display Modes |
24th May 2021, 19:35 | #1 | Link |
Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 4,770
|
Guesses on when AV2?
So, it's still in early stages, but I was wondering when folks here think AV2 would have a final spec, and when it would start appearing in HW.
I've heard some strikingly different estimates, and so am interested in what the consensus here might be. So, Doom9, when do you think AV2 will be done and available? |
25th May 2021, 09:32 | #5 | Link |
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,126
|
AV1 hardware decoders took ages to appear. VVC/h266 was ratified 10.5 months ago, no news of hardware decoders for that yet. I think AV2 won't be released until at least 2024, waiting for h264 patents to expire in 2024-2026 would be very helpful. Regarding patents unifiedpatents has filed lots of lawsuits about hevc/av1 patents and has lost all the lawsuits that have been concluded apparently. So it seems that companies will likely have to pay sisvel to licence patents if they want to use vp9 or av1. Thankfully sisvel's fee is low.
Last edited by hajj_3; 25th May 2021 at 23:38. |
25th May 2021, 12:58 | #6 | Link |
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 16
|
I agree that they will probably wait until several significant H.264 patents expire. The latest ones do so in 2027-2028, however the vast majority will be available to use by 2025, 22 years since the first version, 20 years since the addition of High/High 10 profiles (IANAL though, so I may be slightly wrong).
2025 also seems probable in order to be ahead of MPEG which may launch a competitive codec around that time. HEVC was standardized in 2013 and VVC in 2020, so a H.267 release in 2027 is not impossible. If at that time there are available AV2 hardware decoders / optimized software decoders (à la dav1d) it could make the adoption of the patented alternative less likely. |
25th May 2021, 22:31 | #7 | Link |
The Crazy Idahoan
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Idaho
Posts: 249
|
I voted for 2025, because I remember that the initial AV1 standard seemed to take quite a while to beat out. Since then, even more companies have come to the table which always seems to drag out a standard.
Hardware implementation timeline will depend on 2 things. 1. Getting current AV1 hardware implementations 2. How different is AV2 from AV1. My assumption is that AV1 will be more like AV2 than it is different from it which will mean that hardware rollout shouldn't take as long as AV1 rollout did (though, I would have expected AV1 rollout to be faster given how similar it is VP9.) With that said, for "not much different" rollout could be in less than a year. For "OMG, this is a whole new codec!" 2 or 3 years. If the aom group wants to improve this situation, they could do what ARM does and publish reference hardware decoders. They certainly have companies with experience in doing just that. Last edited by cogman; 25th May 2021 at 22:40. |
26th May 2021, 02:23 | #8 | Link | ||
Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 4,770
|
Quote:
The challenge for AV2 is to be enough better than AV1 technically and than VVC technically+licensing without taking so long that it competes with "well, H.267 is almost here." AV1 would be pretty much ignored on a purely technical basis; its attention is due to the free speech/beer promise and major web browsers hard coding out passthrough to HW for competing codecs. Technically, the most interesting thing about AV1 is mandatory film grain synthesis. But SoCs are being built with those at a different layer, making it pretty straightforward for HEVC or VVC to include AV1's FGS metadata and utilizing it for playback on any AV1 capable HW. The HW decoder people I talk to are generally much more enthusiastic about VVC, and were sort of hoping they wouldn't have to do AV1. Quote:
|
||
Tags |
av2 |
|
|