Measure DVD write quality! (Only with Lite-On Drives)

alexnoe · 7th April 2003, 08:02

http://www.cdrlabs.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=10234

This can measure C1/C2 on CDs and, if you own a LiteON DVD-ROM, it can also measure PI sum 8 / PIF on DVD±R!

andyg · 7th April 2003, 14:58

Thanks for the link, Alexnoe!
Nice tool to have.

alexnoe · 7th April 2003, 16:59

This is what a disc should look like:

EDIT repaired link to scan result

boden11 · 11th April 2003, 23:01

bump for a great program to analyze burned dvd discs

SVCD4Me · 12th April 2003, 01:55

EDIT: Found it doing a search for K's CD/DVD in Yahoo.

http://home.pchome.com.tw/cool/cdtools/kprobe.zip

Anyone know another place to DL it? The page doesn't work for me and I don't have the language pack to even see what's wrong.

Thanks

SVCD4Me · 12th April 2003, 02:43

So...

Can anyone tell me what readings are good for a DVD? PI/PO Total, Average?

Thanks.

alexnoe · 12th April 2003, 08:12

The picture which I have linked to shows a very good disc.

Here's a bad one: http://www-user.tu-chemnitz.de/~noe/.../Princo_2x.gif

You can obtain kprobe here:
http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread....8&pagenumber=1

boden11 · 14th April 2003, 09:22

Taiyo Yuden DVD-R 2x using Sony DRU500a 2.0e in Win XP Home (NO SP1)

boden11 · 14th April 2003, 09:25

wtf?? i attached the pic...it looked like it upped...tried it on dvdrhelp.com too and i couldnt see the pic. is this just me and the pic IS there or am i doing something wrong?

alexnoe · 14th April 2003, 09:38

I don't see the picture either

SVCD4Me · 15th April 2003, 00:06

Here's the results from the 2 types I have. Both were written with Instant CD+DVD on Toshiba SD-R5002.

DVDPro (Princo) from Meritline. Glossy white top, light purple bottom, burned @ 1x

Ritek G03 from Meritline. Silver top, dark purple bottom, burned @ 2x.

I burned a disc the other day using DVDDecrypter because I wanted to burn a G03 @ 1x and the results were horrible accoring to KProbe. I didn't save the results and I no longer have the disc.

SomeJoe · 21st April 2003, 20:33

Pioneer DVRN-47BPD50F: Thermal/Inkjet Printable, 4x media, recorded at 4x on a Primera Bravo Disc Duplicator (Pioneer DVR-105 drive internal to the Primera Bravo).

leisuredoc · 25th April 2003, 05:14

@Alexnoe: I just bought a Liteon XJ-HD166S DVD-ROM in order to quantify some accelerated aging tests on various DVD-R media according to your earlier post on Nero DVD Speed (should be done with a DVD-ROM, not DVD burner).

Can you tell me what is the difference between this new K's analysis and Nero's DVD Speed? Of course, I could analyze aged media by both app's but would like to simplify this if I can.

Thanks!

leisuredoc

alexnoe · 25th April 2003, 08:34

Nero DVD Speed only measures speed! If your disc is of loo low quality, the reader will reduce speed. That's all.

KProbe can measure how much the error correction has to work while reading the disc

ravenone_2000 · 25th April 2003, 15:12

Allright, this is all very interesting, but can someone indicate what a good set of numbers are vs. bad numbers for PI and PO ?

Looking at the pictures posted above, the RitekG03 looks good to me compared to the Princo. Am I looking at this right?

alexnoe · 25th April 2003, 15:24

Yes, the Ritek G03 picture is pretty good.

It's hard to indicate distinct numbers which one can call good or bad. Just look at the pictures.

djadjet · 25th April 2003, 19:49

Has anybody figured out (or finally got the author to answer), what exactly these measured PI/PO are, because they are definitely NOT PI Sum 8/PIF/POF.

Are they just parity error counts per 16 (or x) LBAs or is there any other relation???

leisuredoc · 26th April 2003, 05:50

@alexnoe,

Thanks for the clarification. My LiteON XJ-HD166S is a DVD-ROM and when I run KProbe, it says it only supports LiteON DVD burners. So, alas, I'm back to NERO DVD Speed. But when my Pioneer burner bites the dust, I'll look for a LiteON burner.

EDIT #1: thanks, Alexnoe & djadjet, all I had to do was choose the "Write Strategy" tab with the recorded media in the LiteON DVD-ROM drive. Cool tool! Will be reporting back on some comparisons of same video on different DVD-R's. I'd like to put this to work...

EDIT #2: after a bit of trial and error, I found excellent repeatibility (almost identical scan of the same disk each and every time with K's Probe provided that you:
1). Allow computer to be on awhile before scanning. Don't just turn on the computer and run K's Probe!
2). Reboot before each use of K's Probe.
3). Of course, it's a good idea to clean the media using "CD Cleaning Cloths" before scanning. A little bugger of dust will give you an error spike.
4). Save image, both upper and lower, for future reference.
5). Print image from another graphics editing app, not K's Probe. Printing from K's Probe won't show the statistics. -Enjoy!

leisuredoc

djadjet · 26th April 2003, 05:59

@leisuredoc

You can measure PI/PO using KProbe with LiteOn DVD-ROM, but not tracking.

alexnoe · 26th April 2003, 08:21

According to Karr, the PI/PO data is read as RAW data from the drive, but is not interpreted by KProbe.
The author assumes that PI is just PI over one ECC block, but for PO, I have no idea. Funny is that crap discs can show PO > 100 values

7th April 2003, 08:02	#1 \| Link
alexnoe Banned Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 1,737	Measure DVD write quality! http://www.cdrlabs.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=10234 This can measure C1/C2 on CDs and, if you own a LiteON DVD-ROM, it can also measure PI sum 8 / PIF on DVD±R!

7th April 2003, 14:58	#2 \| Link
andyg Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 79	Thanks for the link, Alexnoe! Nice tool to have. __________________ Andy G.

7th April 2003, 16:59	#3 \| Link
alexnoe Banned Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 1,737	This is what a disc should look like: EDIT repaired link to scan result Last edited by alexnoe; 11th April 2003 at 23:14.

12th April 2003, 01:55	#5 \| Link
SVCD4Me Registered User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 95	EDIT: Found it doing a search for K's CD/DVD in Yahoo. http://home.pchome.com.tw/cool/cdtools/kprobe.zip Anyone know another place to DL it? The page doesn't work for me and I don't have the language pack to even see what's wrong. Thanks Last edited by SVCD4Me; 12th April 2003 at 02:19.

12th April 2003, 08:12	#7 \| Link
alexnoe Banned Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 1,737	The picture which I have linked to shows a very good disc. Here's a bad one: http://www-user.tu-chemnitz.de/~noe/.../Princo_2x.gif You can obtain kprobe here: http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread....8&pagenumber=1 Last edited by alexnoe; 12th April 2003 at 08:35.

11th April 2003, 23:01	#4 \| Link
boden11 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 28	bump for a great program to analyze burned dvd discs

12th April 2003, 02:43	#6 \| Link
SVCD4Me Registered User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 95	So... Can anyone tell me what readings are good for a DVD? PI/PO Total, Average? Thanks.

14th April 2003, 09:22	#8 \| Link
boden11 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 28	Taiyo Yuden DVD-R 2x using Sony DRU500a 2.0e in Win XP Home (NO SP1)

14th April 2003, 09:25	#9 \| Link
boden11 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 28	wtf?? i attached the pic...it looked like it upped...tried it on dvdrhelp.com too and i couldnt see the pic. is this just me and the pic IS there or am i doing something wrong?

14th April 2003, 09:38	#10 \| Link
alexnoe Banned Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 1,737	I don't see the picture either

15th April 2003, 00:06	#11 \| Link
SVCD4Me Registered User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 95	Here's the results from the 2 types I have. Both were written with Instant CD+DVD on Toshiba SD-R5002. DVDPro (Princo) from Meritline. Glossy white top, light purple bottom, burned @ 1x Ritek G03 from Meritline. Silver top, dark purple bottom, burned @ 2x. I burned a disc the other day using DVDDecrypter because I wanted to burn a G03 @ 1x and the results were horrible accoring to KProbe. I didn't save the results and I no longer have the disc.

21st April 2003, 20:33	#12 \| Link
SomeJoe Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 315	Pioneer DVRN-47BPD50F: Thermal/Inkjet Printable, 4x media, recorded at 4x on a Primera Bravo Disc Duplicator (Pioneer DVR-105 drive internal to the Primera Bravo). __________________ - SomeJoe

25th April 2003, 05:14	#13 \| Link
leisuredoc Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Near Ground Zero Posts: 68	K's versus Nero DVD Speed @Alexnoe: I just bought a Liteon XJ-HD166S DVD-ROM in order to quantify some accelerated aging tests on various DVD-R media according to your earlier post on Nero DVD Speed (should be done with a DVD-ROM, not DVD burner). Can you tell me what is the difference between this new K's analysis and Nero's DVD Speed? Of course, I could analyze aged media by both app's but would like to simplify this if I can. Thanks! leisuredoc __________________ Intel Northwood P-4/2.4 in MSI 845E, 256MB DDR/533 FSB, 80 GB Maxtor @ 7200 rpm/NTFS, W-2K PE/SP3, 3DForce S-128 (SIS) AGP 4X, Pioneer 'A04 burner (Firmware 1.30), LiteON XJ-HD166S DVD-ROM drive, 3Com NIC card

25th April 2003, 08:34	#14 \| Link
alexnoe Banned Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 1,737	Nero DVD Speed only measures speed! If your disc is of loo low quality, the reader will reduce speed. That's all. KProbe can measure how much the error correction has to work while reading the disc

25th April 2003, 15:12	#15 \| Link
ravenone_2000 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 60	Allright, this is all very interesting, but can someone indicate what a good set of numbers are vs. bad numbers for PI and PO ? Looking at the pictures posted above, the RitekG03 looks good to me compared to the Princo. Am I looking at this right?

25th April 2003, 15:24	#16 \| Link
alexnoe Banned Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 1,737	Yes, the Ritek G03 picture is pretty good. It's hard to indicate distinct numbers which one can call good or bad. Just look at the pictures.

25th April 2003, 19:49	#17 \| Link
djadjet Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 64	PI/PO Count Has anybody figured out (or finally got the author to answer), what exactly these measured PI/PO are, because they are definitely NOT PI Sum 8/PIF/POF. Are they just parity error counts per 16 (or x) LBAs or is there any other relation???

26th April 2003, 05:50	#18 \| Link
leisuredoc Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Near Ground Zero Posts: 68	Requires LiteON Burner @alexnoe, Thanks for the clarification. My LiteON XJ-HD166S is a DVD-ROM and when I run KProbe, it says it only supports LiteON DVD burners. So, alas, I'm back to NERO DVD Speed. But when my Pioneer burner bites the dust, I'll look for a LiteON burner. EDIT #1: thanks, Alexnoe & djadjet, all I had to do was choose the "Write Strategy" tab with the recorded media in the LiteON DVD-ROM drive. Cool tool! Will be reporting back on some comparisons of same video on different DVD-R's. I'd like to put this to work... EDIT #2: after a bit of trial and error, I found excellent repeatibility (almost identical scan of the same disk each and every time with K's Probe provided that you: 1). Allow computer to be on awhile before scanning. Don't just turn on the computer and run K's Probe! 2). Reboot before each use of K's Probe. 3). Of course, it's a good idea to clean the media using "CD Cleaning Cloths" before scanning. A little bugger of dust will give you an error spike. 4). Save image, both upper and lower, for future reference. 5). Print image from another graphics editing app, not K's Probe. Printing from K's Probe won't show the statistics. -Enjoy! leisuredoc __________________ Intel Northwood P-4/2.4 in MSI 845E, 256MB DDR/533 FSB, 80 GB Maxtor @ 7200 rpm/NTFS, W-2K PE/SP3, 3DForce S-128 (SIS) AGP 4X, Pioneer 'A04 burner (Firmware 1.30), LiteON XJ-HD166S DVD-ROM drive, 3Com NIC card Last edited by leisuredoc; 22nd May 2003 at 02:28.

26th April 2003, 05:59	#19 \| Link
djadjet Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 64	@leisuredoc You can measure PI/PO using KProbe with LiteOn DVD-ROM, but not tracking.

26th April 2003, 08:21	#20 \| Link
alexnoe Banned Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 1,737	According to Karr, the PI/PO data is read as RAW data from the drive, but is not interpreted by KProbe. The author assumes that PI is just PI over one ECC block, but for PO, I have no idea. Funny is that crap discs can show PO > 100 values

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