doubling playback framerate (in mpc-hc) by adding interlaced frames?

cafevincent · 17th December 2018, 01:50

I am playing around with SVP (smooth video project) and I can't help but think that a simple interlaced frame insertion method (or whatever name it carries) might produce double framerate with less noticeable artifacts than SVP. I would like to try this, is it possible to try something like this (using MPC-HC as the player)?

Asmodian · 17th December 2018, 02:00

On an interlaced display this might be true, but on our current progressive sample and hold displays it would be horrible.

edit: you can do it pretty easily with Avisynth but it won't look good. This is called Telecine or 2:2 Pulldown and usually the point is to remove it for non-interlaced displays.

cafevincent · 17th December 2018, 02:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asmodian

On an interlaced display this might be true, but on our current progressive sample and hold displays it would be horrible.

because the interjected interlaced-looking frame would have to be drawn progressively? meaning this would lessen the smooth high-framerate feel?

then is this SVP the go-to product for this sort of thing? no alternatives?

huhn · 17th December 2018, 02:33

if you are interlance a progressive source you are not getting more frames.

and if you apply a frame addptive deinterlancer(which are considered as one of the better deinterlancer) on a progressive source it will just double each frame so nothing really changes.

if you run it without a frame adaptive deinterlancer like nnedi you will just end up with doubles the frame number and half the resolution plus frame wobbling.

cafevincent · 17th December 2018, 02:46

ok then this is what I mean: we have original frames 1 and 2. we want to add frame B to go in between 1 and 2. for this we take half the lines of frame 1 and drop the rest, take another half of lines from frame 2 and drop the rest. combine for a "fake" interlaced looking frame with combing being the only artifacts, which IMO should be lesser than those huge artifacts present in SVP.

huhn · 17th December 2018, 02:54

ever watched an interlanced file with out deinterlancer?
it would be just like that. it doesn'T even make the image smoother it just destroys it.

BTW. doing that on an 24 hz file will end up with 48 hz which is a already a problem.

i'm not using avisynth for a while but interlancering the 24 hz stream and than interleaving it with the orginal stream would create this abomination.

cafevincent · 17th December 2018, 03:03

48 is not a standard of any kind but that's totally fine. doubling the framerate is the best option in SVP too, too many inserted frames just brings out more artifacts per second, with hardly any noticeable added smoothness. I am currently testing this method, not sure how it works exactly... double framerate with latest mpc mini guide

huhn · 17th December 2018, 03:23

that's frame adaptive deinterlancing you can just go use madVR and press control+shift+alt +d to actived deinterlancing and the results is repeated frames nothing else. not a signal new frame will be created.

48 hz played at 60 hz will create the same kind of judder as 24 hz at 60 hz not smooth at all.

17th December 2018, 01:50	#1 \| Link
cafevincent Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 111	doubling playback framerate (in mpc-hc) by adding interlaced frames? I am playing around with SVP (smooth video project) and I can't help but think that a simple interlaced frame insertion method (or whatever name it carries) might produce double framerate with less noticeable artifacts than SVP. I would like to try this, is it possible to try something like this (using MPC-HC as the player)?

17th December 2018, 02:00	#2 \| Link
Asmodian Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: San Jose, California Posts: 4,424	On an interlaced display this might be true, but on our current progressive sample and hold displays it would be horrible. edit: you can do it pretty easily with Avisynth but it won't look good. This is called Telecine or 2:2 Pulldown and usually the point is to remove it for non-interlaced displays. __________________ madVR options explained Last edited by Asmodian; 17th December 2018 at 02:03.

17th December 2018, 02:46	#5 \| Link
cafevincent Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 111	ok then this is what I mean: we have original frames 1 and 2. we want to add frame B to go in between 1 and 2. for this we take half the lines of frame 1 and drop the rest, take another half of lines from frame 2 and drop the rest. combine for a "fake" interlaced looking frame with combing being the only artifacts, which IMO should be lesser than those huge artifacts present in SVP. Last edited by cafevincent; 17th December 2018 at 02:51.

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17th December 2018, 02:33	#4 \| Link
huhn Registered User Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 8,086	if you are interlance a progressive source you are not getting more frames. and if you apply a frame addptive deinterlancer(which are considered as one of the better deinterlancer) on a progressive source it will just double each frame so nothing really changes. if you run it without a frame adaptive deinterlancer like nnedi you will just end up with doubles the frame number and half the resolution plus frame wobbling.

17th December 2018, 02:54	#6 \| Link
huhn Registered User Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 8,086	ever watched an interlanced file with out deinterlancer? it would be just like that. it doesn'T even make the image smoother it just destroys it. BTW. doing that on an 24 hz file will end up with 48 hz which is a already a problem. i'm not using avisynth for a while but interlancering the 24 hz stream and than interleaving it with the orginal stream would create this abomination.

17th December 2018, 03:03	#7 \| Link
cafevincent Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 111	48 is not a standard of any kind but that's totally fine. doubling the framerate is the best option in SVP too, too many inserted frames just brings out more artifacts per second, with hardly any noticeable added smoothness. I am currently testing this method, not sure how it works exactly... double framerate with latest mpc mini guide

17th December 2018, 03:23	#8 \| Link
huhn Registered User Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 8,086	that's frame adaptive deinterlancing you can just go use madVR and press control+shift+alt +d to actived deinterlancing and the results is repeated frames nothing else. not a signal new frame will be created. 48 hz played at 60 hz will create the same kind of judder as 24 hz at 60 hz not smooth at all.