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18th June 2021, 00:18 | #2 | Link |
HeartlessS Usurer
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Apparently so,
quite often, in this [where this is posted, ie MPEG-4 ASP] forum, there are way - way more forum visitors than anywhere else on the D9, so yes, ASP/XVID/DIVX is still quite popular, but I cannot say nor understand why. EDIT: Right now, in forum "MPEG-4 AVC / H.264" there are 10 Viewing, in this MPEG-4 ASP forum, there are 87 Viewing, it beats me why it is still so popular, especially given the very significant quality difference for a given filesize. [I guess many still use hardware players from pre-Android era].
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I sometimes post sober. StainlessS@MediaFire ::: AND/OR ::: StainlessS@SendSpace "Some infinities are bigger than other infinities", but how many of them are infinitely bigger ??? Last edited by StainlessS; 18th June 2021 at 11:55. |
11th August 2022, 16:13 | #4 | Link |
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Lots of car DVD players and lots of small TVs with integrated DVD players out there which support MPEG4 ASP but without support for H.264, and which still serve their owners faithfully. So, most people in this situation will download the H.264 version (usually MP4 or MKV) for their big screen TVs and the AVI file for those other devices. With a 30Mbit connection, downloading the AVI file takes like 3 minutes (disclaimer: I am talking about legal downloads yadda yadda).
Last edited by kurkosdr; 11th August 2022 at 18:59. |
18th June 2021, 16:02 | #5 | Link |
李姗倩 Lǐ Shān Qiàn
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I use Xvid as a quick way to get the list of scene-change frames (as the list of keyframes). Keyframes from x264 are not so simple as those used in Xvid (a scene-change may not be a keyframe). The list is then used to programmatically detect subtitle end-time overruns (bleed) and underruns, start-time overruns and underruns.
I also use Xvid for test-encoding and checking when typesetting a moving sign, because it's quicker. For similar reasons, I sometimes use Xvid.avi for typesetting in general, rather than e.g. using x264.mkv via ffms2.dll. Xvid is quicker and not using much memory. Although, personally I no longer use Xvid as the codec for final encoding, it's still convenient for me for various purposes. There are many countries in the world, and some people are still using older CPU for various reasons. Such users may prefer Xvid.avi, as newer codecs might be too CPU-intensive for them. |
19th June 2021, 14:50 | #6 | Link | |
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I used to XVID a lot in my encodes until I learned of better methods and even then I did not change that easily. I am slowly transitioning to other codecs for my encodes but I still have a fondness of XVID due to low disk space and general ease-of-use. I used it for my encodes in the past but I am starting to move on to other encoders as I want to "keep up with the times."
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19th June 2021, 19:21 | #7 | Link | ||
HeartlessS Usurer
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Right now 19 in AVC forum and 67 in ASP forum, nearly always the same.
A few months ago [maybe] PoisonDeathRay pointed out something like 650 online in ASP forum, its uncanny EDIT: OK, maybe more than a couple of months ago [2018] Quote:
EDIT: Arh, you already said that. Quote:
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I sometimes post sober. StainlessS@MediaFire ::: AND/OR ::: StainlessS@SendSpace "Some infinities are bigger than other infinities", but how many of them are infinitely bigger ??? Last edited by StainlessS; 19th June 2021 at 19:29. |
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19th June 2021, 20:42 | #8 | Link |
Broadcast Encoder
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That's odd... but hey, apparently there are still people using it for... compatibility purposes?
I don't know... Besides, I thought MPEG-2 was far more common than Xvid, not just for DVDs that are still being produced for some odd reason, but also for all the SD 480i or 576i TV channels out there that are still on air and also HD/FULL HD standards like XDCAM which just don't wanna die... It feels weird to talk about these things in 2021, but hey, they're still a thing... |
11th August 2022, 16:35 | #9 | Link | |
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However, MPEG-2 was never big on the internet, due to the fact it can only do widescreen at 720x480/576 resolution in its most common form (DVD-Video), which in turn forces high bitrates (together with the usual inefficiency of MPEG-2). And let's be real, nobody wants a file with mediocre SD video that weighs 4 frickin' gigabytes at minimum. So, MPEG4 ASP in AVI (aka Divx/Xvid) is the lowest common denominator on the internet. Sure it looks bad, but at least it's small and it plays even on most non-H.264 standalone players. Of course, it's always a good idea to also provide an H.264 version of the content. Last edited by kurkosdr; 11th August 2022 at 19:00. |
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12th August 2022, 19:48 | #10 | Link | |
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2. Mpeg-2 and Mpeg-4 ASP are not far apart in regards to compression efficiency if both encoder employ the same strategies. Mpeg-4 having the edge obviously. |
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13th August 2022, 13:44 | #11 | Link | |
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2. As previously said, the problem with MPEG-2 is that, in its most common form (DVD-Video), it forces you to use 720x756/480 resolution if you want widescreen. This means you are looking at a 4GB file at minimum for an ordinary movie. Last edited by kurkosdr; 13th August 2022 at 13:49. |
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13th August 2022, 18:48 | #12 | Link | |
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In the case of MPEG-2 DVD or DTV the 720x756/480 or 'D1' pixel frame size is always encoded along with either 4:3 or 16:9 DAR (ie: aspect ratio signalling). It is never distributed at 1:1...
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13th August 2022, 21:27 | #13 | Link |
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Isnt most Divx/Xvid content on the internet derived from DVD ? I remember it was in the year ~2000. That just came about with people starting to re-encoding DVDs with the hacked Divx 3.11 Alpha codec in resolutions like 640x360. People could have used some Mpeg-2 encoder too but there was no one available for free I guess. MP3 started off the same, with some hacked Fraunhofer encoder and Napster. Ah, piracy... "Sure it looks bad, but at least it's small". Mpeg-2 video could have done this as well, SVCD being one popular standard.
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19th June 2021, 21:39 | #14 | Link |
李姗倩 Lǐ Shān Qiàn
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It's not uncommon for a subbing group to do double or triple releases - the same content both as HD x264 and as SD xvid, for example. Which means, significantly many people still prefer xvid versions. I don't really know why, but I know this as a fact first hand - the download count may be like 2:1 or 3:1. (I suspect some of them are "file collectors", getting both versions "just in case").
Xvid may not be better in visual quality but it does have its forte. It's lightweight, tried and tested, player-side is always ready. Have you ever tried for example x264 with output color space 422 or 444 or even RGB? I don't think player-side is always ready yet if you use not-so-common options. Of course that does not mean newer codecs are bad - they're good and loved. But do we have to disrespect xvid just because we use newer codecs? Like, MP3 is still popular, even though there are Vorbis, AAC, Opus. |
20th June 2021, 00:03 | #15 | Link | |||
Broadcast Encoder
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Still, I understand the "legacy" thing and the fact that most groups have been doing SD releases in Xvid since... well... forever and they're still doing it, so... fair enough. Quote:
Last edited by FranceBB; 20th June 2021 at 00:06. |
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21st June 2021, 13:52 | #16 | Link | |
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When I was young and going to school, my portable music player looked very much like this: Mind you that's way more fancy than the one I owned because FM radio didn't exist and the Cue function was, if I remember correctly, a manually implemented feature involving holding the play button half way down while fast-forwarding and hoping it wouldn't end in tears. The only psychoacoustic model I was aware of when I went to school involved a portable player's lack of Dolby B to make pre-recorded cassettes sound brighter. Ahhh... how I fondly remember performing regular maintenance on my player's storage medium with a hexadecimal pencil. Seriously though.... The folks at hydrogen audio are confident the LAME MP3 encoder is transparent using the default VBR mode, despite MP3's limitations, https://wiki.hydrogenaud.io/index.ph...coder_settings which makes me happy because my current MP3 player doesn't support AAC and a quick google indicates Cowon's latest players still don't support it. I assume they've decided to save themselves the licence fee. You've inspired me to start a new thread on portable players though, as I'm considering the possibility of contemplating upgrading mine, but rather than sidetrack this thread any further I'll start a new one in the General forum. Last edited by hello_hello; 21st June 2021 at 14:52. |
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21st June 2021, 22:15 | #17 | Link | |
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The adoption of DAB+ (HE-AAC) has been very slow and sloppy here, primarily due to the quantity of early DAB radio adoptees who's devices don't support DAB+...
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Last edited by SeeMoreDigital; 21st June 2021 at 22:18. |
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22nd June 2021, 12:53 | #18 | Link | |||||
Broadcast Encoder
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Wow... I think about FM as something that has always been there... You guys must have been amazed by the sound quality when you moved from LW and MW to AM and FM ehehehehehehe Quote:
I mean, we're here talking about H.266 VVC getting ready soon-ish and there are people still encoding in XVID... It definitely makes you wonder... |
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22nd June 2021, 17:18 | #19 | Link |
Life's clearer in 4K UHD
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Actually... all 'first generation' DAB is MP2
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11th August 2022, 16:48 | #20 | Link | |
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Also, the problem with MP3 is not quality but space. A bitrate of 320Kbps with a good encoder can give a result that easily covers most audio setups out there, but with M4A (aka AAC-LC) you could get the same result with 192kbps. And let's be real, "golden ears" will use FLAC anyway. The real problem is that MP3 players without M4A support are still being made today, and there are lots of car MP3 players out there without M4A support that can't be easily upgraded, so most people will download the MP3 and maybe the FLAC version and call it a day. Last edited by kurkosdr; 11th August 2022 at 18:46. |
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