madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[jeryll]

Originally Posted by madshi

When you play HDR demos in 10bit D3D11 FSE mode, is madVR v0.92.1 able to automatically switch your TV into HDR mode (with HDR default setting = "let madVR decide")?

Hmm, for unknown reasons with ver. 0.92.1 i can get ONLY 8bit FSE - at least that's what is OSD showing (and no HDR content is automatically recognized by TV as HDR with "let madVR decide" (FYI - TV recognizes and announces HDR, HDR10, DolbyVision))...

With ver. 0.91.11 I can get 10bit FSE (but result is the same - no HDR content is automatically recognized by TV as HDR with "passthrough HDR content ... + send HDR metadata checked ...").

[Asmodian]

Originally Posted by Oguignant

.... but I already bought the new OLED C7P that improved a lot in that aspect. With the new model, I practically do not lose detail in the dark areas with a correct calibration or a 3dlut file, also supports Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos and HDR10. It has to arrive on Monday. I do not see the time to have it and to experiment with it.

I am actually using a C7P, the 55". The black crush isn't bad at all, only 17 is crushed into 16 with clipping test patterns (Calman 2017 Color Cube 3DLUT, i1Pro2). I am very happy with the image quality overall but it does seem oddly bad at gradients (banding).

Originally Posted by Siso

Is it necessary to use 8 frames presented in advance, without using smooth motion. Or 4 are enough in example (nvidia driver sends maxium 4 pre-rendered frames), and will it affect the smoothness of the playback?

I use 4 frames presented in advance myself, I have found that to be optimal for minimal latency without presentation glitches or dropped frames. It works well for me even with smooth motion on a 144 Hz display (only 27.8 ms of buffer).

Also sometimes the driver (or maybe Windows 10?) seems to behave a little better with a small present queue (3 or 4), though it doesn't seem to matter with my current Windows version and driver combo. The "better" I noticed was a lack of presentation glitches with higher GPU loads compared to larger present queues. The sizes of the other queues didn't have an effect.

[Siso]

Originally Posted by Asmodian

I use 4 frames presented in advance myself, I have found that to be optimal for minimal latency without presentation glitches or dropped frames. It works well for me even with smooth motion on a 144 Hz display (only 27.8 ms of buffer).

Also sometimes the driver (or maybe Windows 10?) seems to behave a little better with a small present queue (3 or 4), though it doesn't seem to matter with my current Windows version and driver combo. The "better" I noticed was a lack of presentation glitches with higher GPU loads compared to larger present queues. The sizes of the other queues didn't have an effect.

I used the default "8" but sometimes for a second it goes to 5 and then up to 8 during rendering times of around 15ms-20ms, so I decided to try your method with 4 frames in advance. Thank you for the tip.

[el Filou]

Originally Posted by dvd1

I asked a lot about the 576 to 1080p but not the 1080p to 1080p
It is more impotent color upscaling, on image upscaling the filters have no effect
I apologize, you have patience for me
thank you

When you watch 1080 video on a 1080 display in fullscreen, no image scaling is needed, only chroma upscaling, so just use a chroma upscaling option that looks best to you.

Originally Posted by Siso

I used the default "8" but sometimes for a second it goes to 5 and then up to 8 during rendering times of around 15ms-20ms, so I decided to try your method with 4 frames in advance. Thank you for the tip.

Isn't that risky then? Wouldn't a 4 frame queue go down to just 1 at those moment when rendering times spike?

[huhn]

Originally Posted by dvd1

I asked a lot about the 576 to 1080p but not the 1080p to 1080p
It is more impotent color upscaling, on image upscaling the filters have no effect
I apologize, you have patience for me
thank you

try NGU AA or super xbr for chroma. the depends a lot on your screen too.

[Manni]

Originally Posted by jeryll

Hmm, for unknown reasons with ver. 0.92.1 i can get ONLY 8bit FSE - at least that's what is OSD showing (and no HDR content is automatically recognized by TV as HDR with "let madVR decide" (FYI - TV recognizes and announces HDR, HDR10, DolbyVision))...

With ver. 0.91.11 I can get 10bit FSE (but result is the same - no HDR content is automatically recognized by TV as HDR with "passthrough HDR content ... + send HDR metadata checked ...").

Thanks for confirming, unfortunately that's the behaviour to be expected from an HD7xxx GPU, which means no metadata makes it to the display. This isn't MadVR's fault, it's the driver/GPU that doesn't support HDR metadata, so the display can't switch automatically.

If you can switch manually to an HDR mode on the TV, you should be able to display HDR fine (although probably not with great bitrate/quality given the lack of GPU power and h/w acceleration for HDR10).

@Madshi, looks like it confirms there is no point trying my HD7870, unless you think Windows 10 would make a difference (I don't think so).

[Manni]

@Madshi

Given that it looks like I can't help with my old 7870, you might want to ask in the Linker, Integral (and 2015-2017 JVCs as many JVC users have purchased either of these) threads on AVS for MadVR users of the Linker/Integral with a recent AMD supporting HDR to provide the feedback you need. Although these older devices don't have an OSD like the Vertex, they have the same ability to capture the HDR metadata (from the Windows GUI), so they could provide the same information I did (just the raw HEX, not decoded). Off the top of my head, I think at least Javs and Zombie10K are MadVR users, but whether they use Nvidia or AMD I couldn't say. Most of them are probably on nVidia, but you could get lucky. If you find a candidate using MadVR+HDR capable AMD+Linker or Integral and if they don't know how to capture the HDR metadata, feel free to suggest they PM me at AVS and I'll tell them what to do, it's very straightforward. If you'd like me to ask on your behalf, I'm happy to do that too.

[ryrynz]

Originally Posted by Dorohedoro

Madshi if I use ffdshow raw I will never be able to use your hdr options? I love the denoise options of ffdshow.

Don't use ffdshow for 10 bit or HDR content it will harm your picture quality. Madshi will add native denoising at some point so either use your TV's built in denoising or just not at all, you really shouldn't need it for any decent quality content nowadays anyway.

[cork_OS]

I'm using ffdshow raw due to SVP. Since ffdshow blocks interaction between LAV and madVR, some PAL DVDs and 25p clips are detected as 29.97 and display doesn't switch to 75 Hz mode.

[70MM]

Ive never really been able to understand what madvr settings to use for DVD 480 from the USA and 576 from UK. I upscale everything to 4K with the 1080ti card.

If I set deinterlacing to Auto I get massive repeated frames on the USA 480 discs, if I leave that section unticked its perfect.

Yet when I play a UK disc 576 with deinterlacing unticked I get tearing of the image...
Can someone please help explain how this should be set up for 480 and 576 material?
Everything is perfect for BD upscaled to 4K, but I still struggle with DVD...

[huhn]

first of disabling deinterlancing (unticking it) is generally not a good idea.

and i need a screen of the OSD to say more.

[aufkrawall]

If I had to guess: Increase queue lengths.

[HillieSan]

Yesterday, I have watched a 4K HDR movie with MadVR + MPC-BE + LAV (all latest versions) and the colors were correct in windowed mode and incorrect (=looks pale) in FSE mode. The movie in FSE was not as colorful as in windowed mode.

I use Windows 10 (latest version) with HDR turned on, with AMD RX 480 and JVC X5000 projector (RGB 4:4:4 full).

It is not clear to me if the HDR data is blocked in FSE mode. Turning off HDR gives an ugly image.

Is there a solution?

[Manni]

Originally Posted by HillieSan

Yesterday, I have watched a 4K HDR movie with MadVR + MPC-BE + LAV (all latest versions) and the colors were correct in windowed mode and incorrect (=looks pale) in FSE mode. The movie in FSE was not as colorful as in windowed mode.

I use Windows 10 (latest version) with HDR turned on, with AMD RX 480 and JVC X5000 projector (RGB 4:4:4 full).

It is not clear to me if the HDR data is blocked in FSE mode. Turning off HDR gives an ugly image.

Is there a solution?

Switch HDR off in the OS, and don't use FSE unless you need to, it's not necessary anymore for HDR 10bits.

[HillieSan]

Thanks Manni, turning off HDR in the Windows panel did it. I am happy with the windowed mode, because the display does not have to switch between frequency modes all the time. The JVC X5000 is quite slow at switching. In windowed mode it switches at the beginning of the movie and after closing MPC BE.

[pirlouy]

About the display mode switcher, there's something wrong (to me), but it has nothing to do with new custom resolution tool, it was already here before 0.92.
In display modes list, I have: 1080p30, 1080p60 (1080p30 is working)
Now I open a 30 fps file. I'd want madVR to switch to 1080p30 and not 1080p60. But, no, madVR will use 1080p60 no matter the order.

I can understand why: higher refresh rate is often considered better. There's one exception though: motion interpolation.
If I want my TV to do a better motion interpolation, I have to use a lower refresh rate. I know you think the interpolation is the same between 1080p30 and 1080p60 but it is not, and it's from an eye perspective.

So, IMO, madVR should follow "written order" chosen by people, and not "higher from lower order".

[sneaker_ger]

Originally Posted by pirlouy

1080p30, 1080p60 (1080p30 is working)

So if you remove 1080p60 from the list it does successfully switch to 1080p30?

[nevcairiel]

I've never heard of native 30 fps content. The only thing I know is 29.97 NTSC, which is interlaced or telecined, so either 24p or 60p. What content would be native 30p?
Interlacing is a key problem here, with at least most "30p" content being interlaced, using a 30p mode would not allow proper deinterlacing, as that would result in 60 fps.

[pirlouy]

@sneaker_ger: for a 29,97 fps progressive file:
If I remove 1080p60, it will use 1080p59.
If I remove 1080p59, it will use 1080p50.
If I remove 1080p50, it will use 1080p30.
If I remove 1080p30, then it will use 1080p29.

@nevcairiel:

Video
ID : 0
Format : MPEG-4 Visual
Format profile : Advanced Simple@L5
Format settings, BVOP : 2
Format settings, QPel : Yes
Format settings, GMC : No warppoints
Format settings, Matrix : Default (MPEG)
Muxing mode : Packed bitstream
Codec ID : XVID
Codec ID/Hint : XviD
Duration : 54mn 16s
Bit rate : 1 699 Kbps
Width : 544 pixels
Height : 304 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 29.970 (29970/1000) fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.343
Stream size : 659 MiB (94%)
Writing library : XviD 1.0.3 (UTC 2004-12-20)

These are old videos indeed, and I didn't know it was that rare. If indeed it's not a standard then that explains Madshi choices.

[sneaker_ger]

Originally Posted by pirlouy

@sneaker_ger: for a 29,97 fps progressive file:
If I remove 1080p60, it will use 1080p59.
If I remove 1080p59, it will use 1080p50.
If I remove 1080p50, it will use 1080p30.
If I remove 1080p30, then it will use 1080p29.

I don't understand. You said your list was "1080p30, 1080p60".