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Old 26th October 2023, 23:52   #1  |  Link
James_b
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10 bit settings

Hi Guys!

Can i setup this encoding profile in Handbrake?
It is from Topaz and give stellar Q with low file size.
The bitrate do not show up in meta data tho.

Topaz:

Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media
Codec ID : isom (isom/iso2/mp41)
File size : 9.46 MiB
Duration : 8 s 880 ms
Overall bit rate : 8 932 kb/s
minor_version : 512
major_brand : isom
compatible_brands : isomiso2avc1mp41
encoder : Lavf60.14.101

Video
ID : 1
Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile : Main 10@L4@Main
Codec ID : hvc1
Codec ID/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Duration : 8 s 880 ms
Bit rate : 8 735 kb/s
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 10 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.168
Stream size : 9.25 MiB (98%)
Color range : Limited
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
Codec configuration box : hvcC



Handbrake: (my best try, 5 times slower with this setting)

Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID : mp42 (mp42/iso2/mp41)
File size : 33.0 MiB
Duration : 8 s 880 ms
Overall bit rate : 31.2 Mb/s
Encoded date : UTC 2023-10-26 22:34:34
Tagged date : UTC 2023-10-26 22:34:34
Writing application : HandBrake 1.6.1 2023012300

Video
ID : 1
Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile : Main 10@L4@Main
Codec ID : hvc1
Codec ID/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Duration : 8 s 880 ms
Bit rate : 31.0 Mb/s
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0 (Type 0)
Bit depth : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.597
Stream size : 32.8 MiB (99%)
Writing library : x265 3.5+1-f0c1022b6:[Windows][GCC 10.2.0][64 bit] 10bit
Encoded date : UTC 2023-10-26 22:34:34
Tagged date : UTC 2023-10-26 22:34:34
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
Codec configuration box : hvcC
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Old 27th October 2023, 09:22   #2  |  Link
excellentswordfight
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James_b View Post
Hi Guys!

Can i setup this encoding profile in Handbrake?
It is from Topaz and give stellar Q with low file size.
The bitrate do not show up in meta data tho.
It does:

Bit rate: 8 735 kb/s

Havnt used handbreak for years, but I assume constent quality is the crf setting? If so, 7 is veeery low, and its no surprise that it will result in some very large files. Try changing the preset to slow or slower for some speed increase (veryslow's speed penalty is rarely worth any petential compression gains) and depending on content 8Mbps should be somewere in the crf15-20 range if thats what you are aiming for.

Last edited by excellentswordfight; 27th October 2023 at 09:26.
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Old 27th October 2023, 19:31   #3  |  Link
James_b
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!

Quote:
Originally Posted by excellentswordfight View Post
It does:

Bit rate: 8 735 kb/s

Havnt used handbreak for years, but I assume constent quality is the crf setting? If so, 7 is veeery low, and its no surprise that it will result in some very large files. Try changing the preset to slow or slower for some speed increase (veryslow's speed penalty is rarely worth any petential compression gains) and depending on content 8Mbps should be somewere in the crf15-20 range if thats what you are aiming for.
Thanks! i can't believe how i missed that I will try and see if that low will produce any visible compression.

So dynamic bitrate is not available?
Cheers!
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Old 27th October 2023, 20:13   #4  |  Link
StainlessS
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Here is a MeGUI hint for x264 crf, [lower crf = higher bitrate, better quality (up to some maximum quality where extra bits just a waste of space)]
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Last edited by StainlessS; 27th October 2023 at 20:17.
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Old 28th October 2023, 04:05   #5  |  Link
RanmaCanada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James_b View Post
Thanks! i can't believe how i missed that I will try and see if that low will produce any visible compression.

So dynamic bitrate is not available?
Cheers!
Instead of CRF you would use the average bitrate toggle.

But yeah CRF 7 is beyond insane haha. If you're trying for a transparent CRF 16-18 for HEVC should be more than enough. Though some users here have no problems with much higher.
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Old 28th October 2023, 21:29   #6  |  Link
James_b
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Thanks guys!
I have done some testing now.

crf 16, 10 bit was pretty much the same as the Prores lossless originals.
To get no compression signs in 265 8bit , i had to go for much larger files, so the 10 bit seams very efficent in maintaining Q.

If i used an encoder who run on the RTX 2060 (nvec) a whole film took only 11 mins. And the same on the Ryzen 5700g took 55 mins.

There is also an AMD VCE 265, and it took 14 mins.
But i got best Q with no nvec support (the settings was different).
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Old 29th October 2023, 01:52   #7  |  Link
RanmaCanada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James_b View Post
Thanks guys!
I have done some testing now.

crf 16, 10 bit was pretty much the same as the Prores lossless originals.
To get no compression signs in 265 8bit , i had to go for much larger files, so the 10 bit seams very efficent in maintaining Q.

If i used an encoder who run on the RTX 2060 (nvec) a whole film took only 11 mins. And the same on the Ryzen 5700g took 55 mins.

There is also an AMD VCE 265, and it took 14 mins.
But i got best Q with no nvec support (the settings was different).
Software encoding is currently the best in regards to quality, though current gen Intel quicksync is very close to par. NVENC is a distant second, and AMD is so far behind they aren't even worth looking at. If you want more information I would suggest you check out the "current state of hardware encoding" thread, as it has about a decade of information in there and you can see how far things have progressed.

If you're concerned aobut time for encodes, you could pick up an A310 or A380 and use quicksync, with some of the settings in the hardware encoding thread, to get very good results.
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Old 30th October 2023, 16:53   #8  |  Link
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Originally Posted by RanmaCanada View Post
Software encoding is currently the best in regards to quality, though current gen Intel quicksync is very close to par.
Really? Do you have more details on that? I just got a workstation with one of the latest Xeons, and could do some head-to-head comparisons.
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Old 30th October 2023, 20:36   #9  |  Link
RanmaCanada
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Originally Posted by benwaggoner View Post
Really? Do you have more details on that? I just got a workstation with one of the latest Xeons, and could do some head-to-head comparisons.
The only results I have are from Rigaya, which are from December 2022. I am sure you of all people would have seen it somewhere in your travels haha. Hopefully Battlemage will have updated ASICS. The Arc A380 was on par with x265 medium when this testing was done. I would like to at an A310 to try it out and compare between it and my i5-1235u, and software encoding.

Last edited by RanmaCanada; 1st November 2023 at 23:01. Reason: fat fingered the date
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Old 31st October 2023, 20:31   #10  |  Link
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December 2012 ? What a prophet. December 2022 I suppose ;-)
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Old 1st November 2023, 23:01   #11  |  Link
RanmaCanada
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Originally Posted by Emulgator View Post
December 2012 ? What a prophet. December 2022 I suppose ;-)
OH yes, haha. Fat fingers are bad.
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Old 2nd November 2023, 17:36   #12  |  Link
benwaggoner
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Originally Posted by RanmaCanada View Post
The only results I have are from Rigaya, which are from December 2022. I am sure you of all people would have seen it somewhere in your travels haha. Hopefully Battlemage will have updated ASICS. The Arc A380 was on par with x265 medium when this testing was done. I would like to at an A310 to try it out and compare between it and my i5-1235u, and software encoding.
Ah, thanks. "On par with --preset medium" is a great goal for lots of scenarios, but insufficient for most of my use cases. I pretty much start with --preset slower and complexify things from there.
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