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Old 12th July 2016, 15:36   #561  |  Link
Music Fan
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Ok, interesting.
For captures I already did in Lagarith, I guess I can convert them in MagicYUV yuy2 if I need to edit them in Vegas.
By the way, why are they treated differently by Vegas ? Isn't there any trick to avoid clipping ?
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Old 12th July 2016, 15:37   #562  |  Link
kolak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raffriff42 View Post
Agree, HuffYUV is not the way to go any more. I meant to say, compare them on speed only, as a way to cancel out (as much as possible) everything outside the decoder. They have roughly similar compression ratios, therefore roughly similar data throughput.
If you test pure decoding speed in RAM then there should be no bottlenecks and definitely not at 400fps for HD frame (this is just 1.6GB/sec). I had speeds way above 1000fps on dual Xeon machine.

Last edited by kolak; 12th July 2016 at 15:41.
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Old 12th July 2016, 15:55   #563  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Music Fan View Post
Ok, interesting.
For captures I already did in Lagarith, I guess I can convert them in MagicYUV yuy2 if I need to edit them in Vegas.
By the way, why are they treated differently by Vegas ? Isn't there any trick to avoid clipping ?
If you adjust your captures at the source to Y = 16-235 , you'll be "safe" using other lossless YUV codecs. It's only if you have "superbrights" or "superdarks" that you'll lose data in those regions

I don't know why it's treated differently; vegas does all sorts of things differently. Generally, native camera sources get studio RGB treatment, everything else gets computer RGB treatment, including most lossless YUV codecs. You can read about it more in the Glenn Chan article series or do some testing
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Old 12th July 2016, 17:14   #564  |  Link
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Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
If you adjust your captures at the source to Y = 16-235
How to do this ?
With Lagarith, there is only the choice between RGB, yv12 and yuy2, I chose yuy2.
With Ut there is rgb, rgb 10 bit, 4:2:0 BT 601, 709 ... I would select 4:2:2 BT 601 for VHS captures.

And with MagicYUV I don't know how to select it, but I just saw it was not free thus I probably won't test it, I make too few captures to buy it.

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You can read about it more in the Glenn Chan article series
Where is it ?

Last edited by Music Fan; 12th July 2016 at 17:17.
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Old 12th July 2016, 17:47   #565  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Music Fan View Post
How to do this ?
Adjust your capture hardware setup so everything is in "legal range". Otherwise it will get clipped when using YUV lagarith or ut video in vegas



Quote:
Where is it ?
Search for "Glenn Chan" and "Vegas"

http://www.glennchan.info/articles/articles.html
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Old 15th July 2016, 10:00   #566  |  Link
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Originally Posted by poisondeathray;1773825[url
http://www.glennchan.info/articles/articles.html[/url]
Thanks.

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Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
Adjust your capture hardware setup so everything is in "legal range".
I believe all I can do is to select the appropriated colorspace (4:2:2) in the capture software, there is nothing about 16-235 and 0-255.
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Old 17th July 2016, 17:49   #567  |  Link
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He means you need to manually ensure the levels are set so that nothing you care about reaches outside 16-235, using the capture device's proc amp, an external proc amp, etc.
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Old 17th July 2016, 19:14   #568  |  Link
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Ok, but I don't know how to do this, it is maybe not possible with my hardware. Anyway I guess that the card does only 16-235 and adapt the signal for this when digitizing the analog signal.
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Old 22nd July 2016, 07:00   #569  |  Link
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I just found MagicYUV today. I'm using Avisynth with VirtualDub. I captured video and compressed it with MagicYUV as YUY2. At a point in my workflow I'm trying to convert the YUY2 to RGB24 using MagicYUV. I know I can not upsample directly so I add ConvertToRGB24 to the end of my script. VirtualDub is set to Fast Recompress and the Color Depth output format to compressor is set to same as decompression format. I also have compress as is selected in MagicYUV.

The saved file shows RGB32. Now I'm no expert, so this may be completely normal. Is RGB32 & RGB24 the same as far as MagicYUV is concerned? Am I misunderstanding something?

Last edited by Micheal813; 22nd July 2016 at 07:02.
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Old 22nd July 2016, 12:02   #570  |  Link
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In Virtualdub, you can choose the decompression format and the format sent to the compressor. Go in the Video menu, select Normal Recompress (or Full Processing Mode, but at least Normal Recompress is required) and from there, select 24bit RGB (888).
If you know the source format, in some cases you may want to select the decompression format there instead of leaving it on autoselect.
In rare cases, some codecs have quirks and compress yuy2 content but when an application like virtualdub opens the file, the same codec enumerates several output formats (for example rgb24, yv12 and last yuy2) and by default they do an extra color space conversion to give Virtualdub RGB24 or something like that. By changing the autoselect, you may sometimes speed decoding by forcing the codec to not do a color space conversion before passing the raw video frames to Virtualdub.

Of course, you could also set YUY2 at both decompression format and output to compressor, so the frames just pass through Virtualdub and configure MagicYUV to do the conversion from YUY2 to RGB24 inside.

You should also keep in mind that most modern codecs like h264 (with x264.exe as most known encoder) or hevc (x265.exe being most known encoder) default to using YV12 and Youtube and other video playback sites default to YV12 so whatever you'd upload would be reconverted. So it makes no sense to keep videos around in RGB24 unless they're for your own use, for archival, some specialized cases like old video game captures etc
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Old 22nd July 2016, 20:27   #571  |  Link
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Originally Posted by mariush View Post
In Virtualdub, you can choose the decompression format and the format sent to the compressor. Go in the Video menu, select Normal Recompress (or Full Processing Mode, but at least Normal Recompress is required) and from there, select 24bit RGB (888).
Thanks for the response, but this did not work. I want it to be RGB24 for Neat Video denoiser. Neat Video works in and outputs RGB24. I know it can just do the conversion itself, but I like to take care of the conversions myself when possible.

My script is:

Avisource("YUY2Video.avi")
AssumeTFF()
ConvertToRGB24()

I open this with Virtualdub and select the above settings. If I add Info() to the script it show Colorspace as RGB24. I save the avi. Then to check it, I use this script:

Avisource("NewVideo.avi")
AssumeTFF()
Info()

It shows RGB32 as the colorspace.


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Originally Posted by mariush View Post
Of course, you could also set YUY2 at both decompression format and output to compressor, so the frames just pass through Virtualdub and configure MagicYUV to do the conversion from YUY2 to RGB24 inside.
I thought MagicYUV could not do upsampling. Isn't YUY2 to RGB24 considered upsampling? Am I misunderstanding? I don't see any setting to make it convert the YUY2 to RGB24.



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Originally Posted by mariush View Post
You should also keep in mind that most modern codecs like h264 (with x264.exe as most known encoder) or hevc (x265.exe being most known encoder) default to using YV12 and Youtube and other video playback sites default to YV12 so whatever you'd upload would be reconverted. So it makes no sense to keep videos around in RGB24 unless they're for your own use, for archival, some specialized cases like old video game captures etc
Yes, after I convert it to RGB24, and process it with Neat Video's VDub filter, I plan on converting to YV12 and compressing with x264 to save a lot of space. I have lots of video to process.
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Old 22nd July 2016, 22:05   #572  |  Link
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You can put converttorgb32() instead of ConvertToRGB24(), this way you are sure the conversion to rgb32 is done by avisynth, that's what I do when using Neat.
And you don't have to create any lossless video before to compress in x264, you can use Neat in your avisynth script (look at Neat's user guide).
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Old 22nd July 2016, 23:29   #573  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Music Fan View Post
You can put converttorgb32() instead of ConvertToRGB24(), this way you are sure the conversion to rgb32 is done by avisynth, that's what I do when using Neat.
And you don't have to create any lossless video before to compress in x264, you can use Neat in your avisynth script (look at Neat's user guide).
So going from YUY2 to RGB32 will be just a good as YUY2 to RGB24? I'm trying to keep as few color conversions a possible.

Neat works in RGB24. Is capturing with MagicYUV in YUY2 ----> RGB32 for Neat ---> YV12 for x264 just the same as MagicYUV in YUY2 ---> RGB24 for Neat ---> YV12 for x264?

I'm really just not understanding why it is not being saved as RGB24 when it shows up as RGB24 in Vdub when I add Info() to my script.

I really don't want to bother learning how to use Neat with Avisynth. I'm more comfortable with the Neat GUI in VDub. I convert to x264 with MeGUI or Handbrake.

Last edited by Micheal813; 22nd July 2016 at 23:35.
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Old 23rd July 2016, 00:22   #574  |  Link
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If you see RGB24 in Source Information this means nothing.
What goes to codec depends on your setting in out section for Color Depth settings:



If you have it set this way (or RGB32) than MagicYUV should use RGB mode for encoding. MagicYUV may require RGB32, I'm not sure, but you can try.

Last edited by kolak; 23rd July 2016 at 00:26.
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Old 23rd July 2016, 00:25   #575  |  Link
Micheal813
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Originally Posted by kolak View Post
If you see RGB24 in Source Information this means nothing.
What goes to codec depends on your setting in out section for Color Depth settings:

I have tried that but it still ends up as RGB32 according to VLC Media Player and VDub.
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Old 23rd July 2016, 00:27   #576  |  Link
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This is fine- I think this is how MagicYUV works. Most likely original data is RGB24, but it's decoded to RGB32 (RGB24+ dummy/empty alpha channel) for better compatibility with apps. Nothing to worry about.

Last edited by kolak; 23rd July 2016 at 00:30.
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Old 23rd July 2016, 08:19   #577  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Micheal813 View Post
I really don't want to bother learning how to use Neat with Avisynth. I'm more comfortable with the Neat GUI in VDub.
I do both :
-I open my script (without Neat function) in Vdub,
-configure Neat,
-save the settings (dnp and nfp files),
-close Vdub,
-add the Neat lines in the script (referring to these dnp and nfp files),
-open the script in the x264 encoder (I use Hybrid).

Last edited by Music Fan; 23rd July 2016 at 08:21.
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Old 24th September 2016, 12:44   #578  |  Link
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Still can't use MagicYUV as preview codec format in Adobe Premiere, like described in http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...&postcount=415
Yes, i see it in vdub
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Old 24th September 2016, 13:21   #579  |  Link
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Still can't use MagicYUV as preview codec format in Adobe Premiere, like described in http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...&postcount=415
Yes, i see it in vdub
I'll try to take a look.
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http://magicyuv.com - MagicYUV: a new fast lossless video codec for the 4K and multi-core era...
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Old 24th September 2016, 15:00   #580  |  Link
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Originally Posted by djonline View Post
Still can't use MagicYUV as preview codec format in Adobe Premiere, like described in http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...&postcount=415
Yes, i see it in vdub
OK, here is the solution:
  1. Open this file with a text editor: c:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Premiere Pro CC 2015.3\Settings\EncoderPresets\SequencePreview\9678AF98-A7B7-4bdb-B477-7AC9C8DF4A4E\Microsoft AVI.epr
  2. Search for the line: <PresetComments>...</PresetComments>
    For me it looks like this:
    Quote:
    <PresetComments>IsConstrained,dsv2,dsvn,dsvp,VUYI,ELRM,CVSM,YVYU,012v,BID,SGAL,2YLU,GRLU,ARLU,g01R,k01R,k01r,yuV2,yuv2,yvyu,DHFC,dsvd,52vd,1hvd,05vd,SEMM,407M,107M,507M,207M,201M,401M,101M,301M</PresetComments>
  3. I think you are getting the clue by now...
    Remove the content between those tags, so it looks like this: <PresetComments></PresetComments>
After this, all the VFW codecs should show up.

Now, whether they will work or not, that's a different question. I don't know, and as I haven't got the foggiest at all how to use Premiere, I didn't test, but if you do, please report back your findings.

rant:
Did I mention I LOVE this type of hackery? It's the same madness you have to do for 10bit+ QuickTime codecs to show up in AE. Only this time, it's a hard-coded list in the app directory.
Next time we'll be hex-editing DLLs...
Whoever comes up with these brilliant ideas of hard-coded FCC lists should be awarded something...


Greets,
I.
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http://magicyuv.com - MagicYUV: a new fast lossless video codec for the 4K and multi-core era...

Last edited by Ignus2; 24th September 2016 at 15:06.
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