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Old 1st November 2015, 22:23   #21  |  Link
manolito
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kolak View Post
Set CCE to progressive frame type and than you should have frame type=progressive, but progressive sequence should not be set for DVD to 1! It will work, but DVD spec requires it to be set to 0, so don't try to fix it with Restream.
I don't believe you, can you please provide some proof for this statement?

From an older post:
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mp3dom
25th December 2011, 21:18
Yes, if you set the progressive sequence it means that ALL the stream is indeed progressive so a progressive scan player doesn't ever need to deinterlace. If you mark only frametype progressive, it means that *that* frame is progressive but the sequence can potentially have a mixture of both progressive and interlaced contents.
Progressive sequence is in specs as long as frametype progressive is ON and TopField is OFF. I've made a lot of commercial dvds in that way and none of them have created any problem.

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Old 1st November 2015, 22:31   #22  |  Link
srfscenar
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I too agree. Apart Progressive Frametype CCE sets, you have to set it to Progressive Sequence in restreamer too.
If you don't, some players will try to play some parts as interlaced and the result is flickering.
At least, I always set it and it always passes QC reports.
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Old 1st November 2015, 23:56   #23  |  Link
kolak
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No. I also thought that some time ago, but this is incorrect.

DVD spec does not support Progressive Sequence=1 as DVD spec was never made for the real progressive footage.

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...quence&f=false

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...%20ben&f=false

As I said many times- SP3 encoder is all about strict DVD compliancy. It uses same header signalling as Toshiba encoder and Sony Vizaro.

Fact that some software/hardware players make video flickering has nothing to do with DVD spec. This is player issue and comes from fact that DVD spec was "made" for interlaced chains/TVs.

Which QC reports? Strict check with proper DVD video stream verifiers?

Last edited by kolak; 2nd November 2015 at 00:30.
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Old 2nd November 2015, 14:17   #24  |  Link
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Still not convinced...

So far Mr. Waggoner seems to be the only person to make this statement (and he may be wrong). The original DVD specs are not public, and everybody else (like DVD Demystified and others plus several encoder manuals) seem to agree that the Progressive Sequence flag is not illegal for DVDs.

Of course you cannot set the Progressive Sequence flag if you also set the TFF flag, this is in fact illegal.

Just for fun I checked all the MPEG2 encoders on my HDD, and this is how they behave:

Libavcodec based encoders (FFMpeg and QuEnc):
Both the Progressive Frame Type and the Progressive Sequence flags are set.

ProCoder 2 and 3:
Exactly the same behavior.

CCE SP 2.5 and 2.67:
Progressive Sequence flag not set, but Progressive Frame Type plus the TFF flags are set.

HCenc:
Also sets Progressive Frame Type and TFF flags when the "progressive" option is used. The Progressive Sequence flag can be specified separately.


Another strong indication that the Progressive Sequence flag is legal for DVDs is that MuxMan accepts these streams for authoring. I always found that if MuxMan accepts elementary streams for authoring, then these streams are 100% DVD compliant.



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Old 2nd November 2015, 22:05   #25  |  Link
kolak
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I'm rather convinced as Toshiba and Sony Vizaro encoders use the same signalling as SP3. I also had good relationship with Cinemacraft and know that their software is 100% DVD/BD complaint (they had both specs). There is a reason why Progressive Sequence is set to 0 and this reason is that this is required by DVD spec.
Mr Waggoner will be one of not many people who could have access to DVD spec, so I don't think that he is wrong. He may give us an answer as he is still an active doom9 user.

ProCoder DVD output never was strictly DVD complaint (some players don't like streams from ProCoder)- this is not a reference source at all, neither HCenc or Muxman. Has any of these tools been written by person with DVD spec in hand? SP3 was and has even settings which are not required by the spec, but has been reported as problematic for some players (which I have also seen), e.g. GOPs without B frames.

Scenarist will also import files with Progressive Sequence=1, but Scenarist is not checking mpeg2 files deeply. Does only some checks needed for correct muxing.
You need to run your project through Panasonic verifier, to claim that it's strictly DVD complaint. Your source of validation are very weak in my opinion.

Saying this I have not seen any problems with such a such a files, so this shouldn't be a problem in real world, specially with current generation of players.

Last edited by kolak; 2nd November 2015 at 23:05.
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