Pioneer DV-383 (Awesome)

[dreamvampire]

hey people, this is my first Mpeg4 standalone player and i am pretty happy with it, it plays Divx , Xvid, & Nero Digital Rips ( nero digitals have to be converted to normal Xvid like avi's, not mp4's ) anything that is mpeg4, it reads, but small problem with Xvid though, i notice very occasional weird jumps in XVID, i wonder because it only says DIVX Certified product, does anyone have problems like this?

[ozbaggie]

I have also noticed that when playing NTSC .avi files that the plyback is jerky. I have tried all possible settings on the 383 together with my amp / Tv etc.

In the end I swapped the 383 out and used a cheaper player - no problems at all. Also when playing back on my PC i don't have any problems.

I have raised this issue with Pioneer (Australia) as the 383 is the same as the 380 player (rest of the worlds number for this player).

I will post an reply I get back from Pioneer - but don't hold your breath

[SeeMoreDigital]

I have also noticed that when playing NTSC .avi files that the plyback is jerky. I have tried all possible settings on the 383 together with my amp / Tv etc.I have an Pioneer DV-575A and I'm able to see "jerky/animated" playback of NTSC MPEG-2 (as well as MPEG-4) progressive content!

It is a bit strange because my Xcard displays NTSC MPEG-2 (and MPEG-4) progressive content perfectly..... I'm wondering whether it could be a power supply interactivity issue with some Pioneer units.


Cheers

[zilog jones]

Is there anything in the menus to select between NTSC or PAL (some also have an "auto" option too)? If there is, could you try playing the video in NTSC mode (you should still get colour if you're using RGB SCART or component cables)? I've noticed a lot of DVD players these days do crappy NTSC->PAL conversions (or the other way round).

If it's outputting a proper 60Hz signal (be it PAL-60, NTSC, RGB, or whatever), you'll notice that the on-screen display on your TV is slightly stretched vertically (and scanlines may be more noticable).

[Scarpad]

When you say Nero digital has to be converted to .avi's you mean you have to convert the file again? Isn't that losing quality?

[dreamvampire]

I don't think so, what you have to do is, simply rip the .avi file out of the nero digital mp4 container, and MUX it with a mp3 ripped soundtrack using virtualdubb or avi-mux, whola it works perfectly, there is no actual Video Conversion for that method, it's the original Nero Digital Video Track + Newly Ripped Mp3 track, in AVI Cotainer, not Mp4 audio + Mp4 container

[Zhnujm]

If the playback of NTSC files is not smooth its most likely a NTSC->PAL conversion like zilog jones said.
Unfortunaly theres no option in the Pioneers setup (at least not with the 575) to change this, you have to press a button during power on to switch between PAL/NTSC/AUTO.
I dont remember wich button but there was a description in the manual.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I dont remember wich button but there was a description in the manual.It's the "fast-forward" button on the player!

However, even adjusting this setting to force NTSC output, does not make any difference (at least not for me). The effect I see is not the obvious looking NTSC-PAL frame dropping, it's more like strobing (tiny amounts of juddering). It's constantly there but far more apparent during high motion scenes and/or when an object moves across the screen!


Cheers

[ozbaggie]

I still have not received a reply from Pioneer on this issue. But I have tried all of the possible setups using the FF and Power on button. In Auto it picks up the .avi file as NTSC - same as forcing the Pioneer box into NTSC.

However no matter which input type you choose NTSC/PAL/AUTO the result is always the same.

It definately seems like an NTSC to PAL conversion issue and I await Pioneers comments. Will post their reply - if i get one

I cannot replicate this issue with other (cheaper) boxes which play perfectly using the same .avi files. Also no matter which software is used to create the .avi files the result is always the same.

[ozbaggie]

Noticed this blurb on their web site
High quality images every time
Pioneer’s PureCinema Progressive Scan system reproduces smooth high-resolution cinema-like images, making the picture quality absolutely amazing. You will notice the difference!

PAL/NTSC Progressive Scan
Pioneer's DV383 provides smooth, natural cinema-like images thanks to Pioneer's Progressive Scan, both on PAL and NTSC signals.

Willl be interested to see their reply

[ozbaggie]

Just as a thought i did some more investigation on this problem - starting with these forums. It could be related to the type of chipset in use and also if the .avi file has a packed bitstream (see below). Has anyone else checked out this possibility???


XviDs are stuttering...

-> Probably the XviD has packed bitstream and your player doesn't support it. See Section 3.3.
Another possible reason could be bad interleaving in the file. Cyberace describes this easy way to fix that:
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyberace
To fix this problem use VirtualDub on your Windows computer to "Direct-Stream" both the video and audio which saves a new fixed file, (this does not affect the quality of the file as all it does is demux the audio from the video and mux them back correctly by interleaving the video with the audio data). Since VirtualDub creates a new header (internal index), it usually automaticly fixes any problems with bad/corrupt headers, too.

Section 3.3
- XviD with Packed Bitstream (N-VOP) and more than one consecutive B-VOP (DivX with PB is no problem at all): Most Mediatek-based players do not properly supports this. Note that apparently players based on the old ESS Vibratto chips had no problems with packed bitstream XviD but since the Mediatek chip is superior in pretty much all other aspects I would not recommend ESS-based players. The problem occurs only if the XviD in question has more than one B-VOP at a time (one B-VOP seems to work fine) and usually leads to video stuttering (dropped frames) and loss of audio sync. This problem is actively being solved in many firmware releases right now. My Sigmatek XM-400 Pro, with the current official firmware, can handle any packed bitstream XviD thrown at it. Packed bitstream support also seems to have been implemented on the Targa DP-5100x, RJ-800DVX and LG 8900P as this article points out: http://www.divxtest.com/article.php3?id_article=93. This might mean that in the future firmware hackers will be able to implement N-VOP support in other Mediatek-based players as well. In the meantime, if your player does not support N-VOPs, the solution is quite simple yet bothersome: Get MPEG4 Modifier from http://www.moitah.net/. This simple tool can check if your XviD uses packed bitstream and disable it without having to re-encode the whole movie. MPEG4 Modifier runs with .NET on Windows or with Mono on Linux and MacOS as the command-line version (I have used it successfully on all three OSes).

[ozbaggie]

Here is the first reply I have received from Pioneer after I also forwarded them the issues with Mediatek chips.

"The unit's main processor is dedicated to DVD and it may not have the same type of processor when compared to other players which give you a better .avi file picture. Our players main function is to give you the best quality DVD picture. It may be difficult to improve the quality of the reproduction of .avi files. with this model"

I have replied to them with

Thanks for the reply but it does not help. Obviously the box is not able to produce the result claimed on your website (see below)
High quality images every time
Pioneer’s PureCinema Progressive Scan system reproduces smooth high-resolution cinema-like images, making the picture quality absolutely amazing. You will notice the difference!

PAL/NTSC Progressive Scan
Pioneer's DV383 provides smooth, natural cinema-like images thanks to Pioneer's Progressive Scan, both on PAL and NTSC signals.

So again I ask the question - what are Pioneer going to do about the problem.

You state "It may be difficult to improve the quality of the reproduction of .avi files. with this model". What can be done to improve the situation in order to "provide smooth, natural cinema-like images".

I have attached an excerpt from a forum in the USA that I found which may in part explain this problem. The forum also detailed the current class-action taken out against Pioneer in relation DVD players not performing as per specified

I will post more replies as they come to light but unless they can replace the chip or upgrade the firmware I believe the only other solution will be a refund as it does not do as advertised

:rolleyes:

[ozbaggie]

PIONEERS REPLY -


our DivX certified players are capable of playback of DivX encoded mpeg4 video files. the ntsc/pal is irrelevant as is the 16:9 and progressive/interlaced scanning on the output of the picture at a data decoding level, this is simply to talor the output of the player to suit the video hardware used with it. and to suit the individual taste in video output (i prefer interlaced scanning at twice the rate to progressive at single frame rate.)


the weblink provided is a discussion on the compatibility of XVid (not DivX) this is an open source version of mpeg 4 compression very simlar to DivX .. but not exactly the same.

the soloution would be for him to re encode his video files using a DivX codec version supported entirely by the player. (i think its 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 but check the user manual.

Xvid may be a better compression algorithm in terms of speed and playback quality however as it is open source it is illegal for us to certify our player as Xvid compatible and charge for it. Although our player may partially (or fully) playack an mpeg4 encoded file encoded with a packed bitsream or unpacked version of the Xvid codec, it is not specified to do so and therefore it is not "underperforming it's specification"

[dreamvampire]

guys, just remember, XVID rulez, even if doom9 bans me i will say that, XVID RULEZ,