Any players that support OGM and Mkv?

[Ersan_Hakki]

Well I did actually do some research before posting this and it seems that Mkv is not supported by any player at the moment, however I think it still deserves a more recent thread to cover the issue :D.

I'm just a newbie so I don't really know what the differences between OGM and MKV are...they both seem to share the same advantages over Avi (multiple streams, etc). Recently I came across the "H & B DX-3255 DVD Mpeg4 Player" and it claims to support OGM's with both CBR and VBR audio. Can someone please tell me if this is true and whether it holds the possibility to play MKV files?

Thanks for your time.

[SeeMoreDigital]

At the time of writing, there are no stand-alone players offering support for playing audio and video streams within .OGM or .MKV

Sorry about that.... and welcome to the forum ;)

[Ersan_Hakki]

Thanks, guess I'll have to just keep a look out for any news.

Here is the player with the misleading specification -
H & B DX-3255 DVD Mpeg4 Player (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?rb=9445856404&action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=86836)

Its dirt cheap so I'll probably get anyway :).

[SeeMoreDigital]

Thanks, guess I'll have to just keep a look out for any news.

Here is the player with the misleading specification -
H & B DX-3255 DVD Mpeg4 Player (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?rb=9445856404&action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=86836)

Its dirt cheap so I'll probably get anyway :).That particular player is fitted with a MediaTek MT1389xx chip-set, so it should be able to play most MPEG-4 ASP implementations (apart from 3 warp-point GMC).

When you get the player home, I think you'll find it will be able to play Vorbis audio streams only in .OGM

But if you discover anything different... please let us know?


Cheers

[Y.T.]

At the time of writing, there are no stand-alone players offering support for playing audio and video streams within .OGM or .MKV
Sorry but that statement is wrong with respect to OGM.

My Sigmatek XM-400 Pro (http://xm-400.sigmatek-players.com/index.php?page=tech&lang=en) plays back DivX and XviD video and MP3, OGG Vorbis or AC3 audio inside OGM files. It also supports several audio streams in one OGM file and can switch between them. Subtitles inside the OGM file do not work at the moment but external Subs do.

For a fairly comprehensive list of stand-alone players which support OGM files check out this link:
http://divx-compare.com/section-1-lecteur-dvd-divx.htm?ogm=1
(The website is in French but it should not prevent you from reading the player names and specifications.)

Yours truly,
Y.T.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Sorry but that statement is wrong with respect to OGM.

My Sigmatek XM-400 Pro (http://xm-400.sigmatek-players.com/index.php?page=tech&lang=en) plays back DivX and XviD video and MP3, OGG Vorbis or AC3 audio inside OGM files. It also supports several audio streams in one OGM file and can switch between them. Subtitles inside the OGM file do not work at the moment but external Subs do.This is very interesting news.... Bond and I were discussing this issue only a few days ago!

I don't think I have any .OGM samples with MPEG-4 video and audio, whether it be MP3, OGG Vorbis or AC3.... Would you be able to e-mail some to me please?


Cheers

[Ersan_Hakki]

Hmm...when examining the Sigmatek XM-400 specification, it is clearly puts in brackets that the OGM container is only compatible with Xvid and Ogg.

Unfortunetly I won't be able to test the H & B player because I've found that almost all my video files are MKVs, therefore the player would serve little purpose.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Hmm...when examining the Sigmatek XM-400 specification, it is clearly puts in brackets that the OGM container is only compatible with Xvid and Ogg. Now... I only have one "OGG" test sample file (which was provided by a Doom9 forum member a couple of years ago). It contains DivX MPEG-4 video with 3No 2Ch MP3 audio tracks and it carries the .OGG file extension (which I understand should really carry the .OGM file extension).

Anyway, I burned this file to CD~R with the .OGG file extension and again with the .OGM file extension.... and would you believe it... it played in my Pioneer DV-575A.

I then decided to generate some Vorbis audio test files from some 2Ch and 6Ch AC3 sources... and these played too!

In fact, the 6Ch Vorbis file (in .OGG) I generated using HeadAC3he (of all things), produced a correctly mapped audio stream, when passed via my players analogue outputs.... amazing!

If anybody else has some short .OGG or .OGM test sample files I can try, please post them?


Cheers

[Y.T.]

If anybody else has some short .OGG or .OGM test sample files I can try, please post them?
I don't have any short ones but I can cut a sample out of some of the long OGMs I have this weekend if I find the time.
Meanwhile, you could try out the sample files hosted in the official MPlayer samples repository:
ftp://ftp.mplayerhq.hu/MPlayer/samples/ogg/

E.g. ftp://ftp.mplayerhq.hu/MPlayer/samples/ogg/DShow-NEW/bgc.sub.dub.ogm
is described as:
this little clip is an except of an ogm file that contains two language
versions and subtitles

There are also DivX + Ogg Vorbis in OGM samples:
ftp://ftp.mplayerhq.hu/MPlayer/samples/ogg/DShow-OLD/anOTHERS_DixX_in_Ogg_Sample.avi
ftp://ftp.mplayerhq.hu/MPlayer/samples/ogg/DShow-OLD/divx-bandits-sample.avi
and XviD + AC3 in OGM samples:
ftp://ftp.mplayerhq.hu/MPlayer/samples/ogg/DShow-NEW/ogm+ac3/

(I haven't downloaded and checked any of them, I'm just going by the descriptions given in the text files on the ftp server...)

[Ersan_Hakki]

If you need even more OGM samples I'd be happy to send you some relatively small files (although the smallest one is still 6 Megs).

[SeeMoreDigital]

If you need even more OGM samples I'd be happy to send you some relatively small files (although the smallest one is still 6 Megs).Thanks guys.....

In the end I decided to give myself a kick up the ass and worked out how to generate OGM muxes in VirtualDubMod :)

By-the-way...During a simple mux test, when I compared the file sizes of the four most popular (MPEG-4) containers.... Look which one offered the smallest over-head: -

http://img318.imageshack.us/img318/702/containercomptests1mj.png


Cheers

[Doom9]

how did you create the mkv? Before the Matroska fans come here to blast you, better make sure that you're using mkvmerge or AVI Mux GUI which offer the most space efficient Matroska muxing mechanisms. MKV Overhead should be considerably lower than AVI, especially when VBR audio is used.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I used the newest version of AVI-mux GUI (with default settings) for generating the AVI and MKV muxes ;)

EDIT 1: CBR MP3 audio was used.

EDIT 2: Just generated the AVI, OGM and MKV muxes again using VirtualDubMod. Which should help pacify the MKV clan (YAMB was used to generate the .MP4 mux): -

http://img306.imageshack.us/img306/8393/containercomptest021jd.png


Cheers

[multicone]

These files sizes ( 1.8 MB only ) are completely rubbish, as the basic size of the container headers will be bigger for the more powerful containers like MKV and MP4, compared to the real video and audio data. Mkvtoolnix for example, with default settings, will reserve space for tagging in the MKV file, so that lateron tags can easily be added without the need to rewrite the file. Make a REAL 400 - 2000 MB mux and compare again.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Well.... here (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/seemoredigital/Test_Files/Mux_Comp_Tests.7z) are the streams I used.... Knock yourself out ;)


Cheers

[stephanV]

The point multicone was trying to make is that those samples are too short to make a good comparison. The size of the header is of too much influence with short samples and thus does not simulate the overhead situation for a file of more common duration (say 20 minutes for an episode or 70-90 minutes for a movie.

Overhead comparisons are rather silly anyway. Lets take a bad case of overhead with a 1 hr standard AVI @ 25 FPS with 48000 kHz VBR MP3 muxed with VirtualDubMod. I believe the header is always padded to 10,000 bytes, we have 25*3600 = 90,000 video chunks and (48000/1152)*3600 = 150,000 audio chunks. The total overhead therefor is 10,000 + (90,000 + 150,000) * 24 = 5,770,000 bytes.

5,770,000 bytes in our case would mean that the overhead would have a "bit rate" of 12.8 kbps. And this is worst case scenario! So for any thing other than very low bit rate encodings (where did i say that more today?) saving on overhead is rather silly.

[Ersan_Hakki]

Well can't argue with any of that...mainly because I have no idea what that means :p