Matrices of the HC Encoder

[ljpp]

The search doesn't cut it, and couldn't see it in the mile long HC thread.

The number of matrices available in HC confuse me. Could someone briefly explain for what purpose each one of the was developed for? What is the recommended default for typical DVD->DVD-R tasks?

[dragongodz]

download this matrix editor
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=91929

it gives some info about the matrices it has. these include atleast some of the matrices that are in HC.

as i said here
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=93080
when you asked about using QLB , try a few for yourself at different levels. the descriptions in the matrix editor may help guide you to what areas they may specifically help with.

[ljpp]

Ok, there seems to be some info in the editor - thanks.

BTW, why on earth information like this is not colleceted & published as a sticky or on the actual Doom9 website.

[alfixdvd]

@ljpp

BTW, why on earth information like this is not colleceted & published as a sticky or on the actual Doom9 website.

I think also is a good idea.


regards
alfixdvd

[fozzieb]

Hi, I'm using avi2dvd 0.2.5 to convert my avi's to dvd. I use the HC encoder but it only allows me to choose built in matrices and i would like to use the Bdvd one, Is there a wat to do this?

sorry if this is posted it the wrong place.



Cheers

[dragongodz]

why on earth information like this is not colleceted & published as a sticky or on the actual Doom9 website.
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=90954
Xvid and mpeg 1/2 matrices. anytime you feel like finding out what they are all for and writing it up go for it. :)

[dragongodz]

sorry if this is posted it the wrong place.
fozzieb - a question for the HC thread methinks. :)

[ljpp]

@dragongodz, all

I don't think it is necessary do document all of them. Just the best ones for the most common use cases of an encoder. This whole encoding thing is a bit out of my field of expretice.

"MPEG" - This matrix is recommended for higher bitrates
"QLB" - This aims to reduce some of the smallest details, in order to improve low to medium bitrate encodings.
"HC" - What is this matrix targeted towards?

Any other useful matrices, that a Joe Average could benefit from?

[JohnG]

Originally posted by fozzieb
Hi, I'm using avi2dvd 0.2.5 to convert my avi's to dvd. I use the HC encoder but it only allows me to choose built in matrices and i would like to use the Bdvd one, Is there a wat to do this?

sorry if this is posted it the wrong place.



Cheers

Yes. I just did it last night while encoding "The Terminal". Simply select "custom matrix" and the buttoms become functional to save the BDVD matrix. You have to either type them individually (like I did) or import them (I'm guessing from a text file).
I used 1800 avg. bitrate with the BDVD matrix and KVCD motion adaptive script, HC "best" setting. It took 8 hours (which is pretty good for that demanding avs script) and the quality looked excellent on my pc...looking forward to burning and viewing it on my TV tonight.

Edit...sorry, I usually do my processing and encoding manually so I'm not familiar with avi2dvd and I don't know if it can load a saved custom matrix vs. one that Hank built into the encoder. I'm guessing though that you just have to find the right directory and format to store the BDVD text file and it will become a choice automatically on the dropdown menu of HC.

[rhayman]

Originally posted by ljpp
@dragongodz, all

I don't think it is necessary do document all of them. Just the best ones for the most common use cases of an encoder. This whole encoding thing is a bit out of my field of expretice.

"MPEG" - This matrix is recommended for higher bitrates
"QLB" - This aims to reduce some of the smallest details, in order to improve low to medium bitrate encodings.
"HC" - What is this matrix targeted towards?

Any other useful matrices, that a Joe Average could benefit from?

I have also read all the threads posted about matixes and while they are handy they can be a bit confusing for us noobs. Something like the above that just gave a short description of each matix would be really handy.

[dragongodz]

I don't think it is necessary do document all of them. Just the best ones for the most common use cases of an encoder.
the problem with that is person A will like matrix A while person B will like matrix B etc etc etc. thats why there is a forum rule of not asking whats best, the answer is different for different people.

"HC" - What is this matrix targeted towards?
i would say very low bitrates but you would have to ask hank315 to know what he intended it for.

Something like the above that just gave a short description of each matix would be really handy.
have a look at the link i gave, it was already suggested in that for a short description of each matrix such as what encoder type(mpeg 1/2/4) and what output type(low/high/other) it was meant for. you will notice i am the only one that seems to have bothered. so if you want to ask the matrix creators to give that information go for it.

[ljpp]

[list=1]
"MPEG" - For higher bitrates
"QLB" - Reduces finest detail in order to improve lower bitrates
"HC" - For very low bitrates (unverified)
[/list=1]

@dragongodz

I see the point of the rule not allowing to ask "what's the best?", when dealing with issues that are subjective. However, as I have operated websites and message forums since 1997, I have always thought that the idea is to de-mystify things, and guide the un-informed. It was a similar issue regard audio compression few years back - whats the best encoI see the point of the rule not allowing to ask "what's the best?", when dealing with issues that are subjective. However, as I have operated websites and message forums since 1997, I have always thought that the idea is to de-mystify things, and guide the un-informed. It was a similar issue regard audio compression few years back - whats the best encoder? what settings? VBR or CBR?. At first there was no a truly best solution either, be people experimented, tested and suggested their recommendations. Nowadays MP3 encoders are mature, and LAME can be concluded as the best one. Settings that are suitable most (99%) people have been developed.

I don't know shit about matrices, or other more technical issues of video compression, even though I have some use experience of almost all encoders and transcoders. Therefore I find it strange that it is me who is trying to de-mystify the matrices, and not some person with lot more expertise.

If you can't say which is best, it can't be wrong to say which is good.der? what settings? VBR or CBR?. At first there was no a truly best solution either, be people experimented, tested and suggested their recommendations. Nowadays MP3 encoders are mature, and LAME can be concluded as the best one. Settings at are suitable most cases have been found.

I don't know shit about matrices, or other more technical issues of video compression, even though I have some use experience of almost all encoders and transcoders. Therefore I find it strange that it is me who is trying to de-mystify the matrices, and not some person with lot more expertise.

If you can't say which is best, it can't be wrong to say which is good.

[dragongodz]

If you can't say which is best, it can't be wrong to say which is good.
no of course not. if people want to say their experiences with different matrices etc then thats good. however i said just describing the best ones couldnt be done because who is to say what best is. i can ,for example, say i prefer QLB for lower bitrate encodes with mpeg2 encoders. however person B will say they prefer HC matrix. do you then say ok thats all we need to know ? of course not because person C will then come along and say they prefer a different matrix again. so you cant just describe a few and say thats fine since they are the best ones is what i meant. :)

I find it strange that it is me who is trying to de-mystify the matrices, and not some person with lot more expertise.
well i gave that link where you can see i already tried to start the ball rolling by describing QLB. i have no time to chase after the other matrix creators to get their information aswell. you could try starting a thread called "whats a good mpeg2 low bitrate matrix ?" or something and ask for people to say which matrix and their experiences. then see how many reply and if it helps your choices to test for yourself.

2. "QLB" - good for mid to lower bitrates
no need to go in to more detail is there ? there is atleast 1 thread floating around, i think its in the Xvid section, describing how matrices work.