QMatOp for DVD-RB : QMat Optimization

[SAPSTAR]

QMatOp 0.13b for DVD-Rebuilder

[EDIT] Last version 0.13b available on my website http://qmatop.9k.com/main.html



This software is designed to optimize the Quantization Matrix of each cell in the ECL file generated by DVD-Rebuilder. It's using dctune2.0 from the NASA, and also avs2avi from Christophe PARIS in order to sample each cell and determine what is the best matrix according to the current average and max bitrate.

INSTALLATION:
You must have Sun JRE 1.4.2 or higher installed. The java command must be in the environment variable 'PATH'. The whole directory structure as contained in the ZIP file must be kept.

CONFIGURATION:
Edit the QMatOP.ini file, change the value of the workdir variable to your current workdir in DVD-RB.
Then execute QMatOP, wait and enjoy......

Or

Run QMatOPGUI.exe, change the values, click on the Big Green Checkmark button.....wait and enjoy....

In case of any issue, feel free to contact me in DOOM9.

HISTORY:
Changes in 0.13b :
- Added an Auto GOP feature - Still being tested and to be tweaked.
- Created a GUI for starting the whole process - Still to be improved
- Added a progress bar
- Improved the way smallest segments are managed. Should be faster now.
Changes in 0.12b :
- Corrected a bug in the WaitForPrepare procedure when spaces are present in the QMatOp path.
- Added a new function to adjust automatically for each cell the Quality Prec. parameter(only for CCE). QualityPrecAuto is by default activated. CCESP26X specifies if you are using CCESP26X, as the range for Quality Prec was different with CCESP 2.6x.
- Added a new function to adjust automatically for each cell the Vbr Bias. parameter(only for CCE). QualityPrecAuto is by default activated.
- One click mode detection added to prevent strange behaviors.

[aaron10]

The download link is awaiting approval I surmise?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by aaron10
The download link is awaiting approval I surmise?

Yep....:(

[samuelal]

Thank you for the contribution !!! (even though it's not available to be downloaded yet).

This sounds very promising!

I am looking forward to it though I would sure like to hear from the more experienced users here if sort of calculations can in fact contribute to the final output quality of the backup which we create.

BTW: If this program finds a certain cell to be encoded in a more/less compressed manner (quant-wise), would it affect the final output size of the project and thus not utilizing the entire ~4.3 GB available for each disc? If it does affect the output size, is there a way to overcome it?

Any comments on this would be welcome!

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by samuelal
Thank you for the contribution !!! (even though it's not available to be downloaded yet).

This sounds very promising!

I am looking forward to it though I would sure like to hear from the more experienced users here if sort of calculations can in fact contribute to the final output quality of the backup which we create.

BTW: If this program finds a certain cell to be encoded in a more/less compressed manner (quant-wise), would it affect the final output size of the project and thus not utilizing the entire ~4.3 GB available for each disc? If it does affect the output size, is there a way to overcome it?

Any comments on this would be welcome!

Thank you....About the size, it won't change anything, it will just allow the encoder to compress more some part and so it will be able to allocate more bitrate in some other frames.

My current algorithm is still "beta", I'll most probably tune it day after day....But my first encode which was Ghost In The Shell 2, was really promising, especially in the Half-D1/Half-space cells.

[samuelal]

My current algorithm is still "beta", I'll most probably tune it day after day....But my first encode which was Ghost In The Shell 2, was really promising, especially in the Half-D1/Half-space cells.

Cool!!

Any new word as to when and if it's going to be approved?

Edited: sorry, just noticed that you already took care of it! thanks!

[Fishman0919]

SAPSTAR about how long should it take to run??

[Fishman0919]

Ok, it has been about a hour and nothing...


Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\*.ppm
Could Not Find C:\QmatOp\frames\*.ppm
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\tempavs -o a -c XVID




and thats it, did I miss something?


Edit: You forgot to include you have to have Xivd installed :D

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
Ok, it has been about a hour and nothing...


Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\*.ppm
Could Not Find C:\QmatOp\frames\*.ppm
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\tempavs -o a -c XVID




and thats it, did I miss something?

Hmmm do you have XVID installed on you computer ?? I know it may sound stupid, but avs2avi needs a codec name, even it's not really used in our case.....I may have to find a codex installed on any computer ?!? Any suggestion ???

Anyway, about the time, it depends on the length of the total video, I mean movie + extras. On Santa Clause 2 for example, it took about 30-40 minutes on my AMD 2600......

[Fishman0919]

lol, we posted at the same time

see edit above

working fine now...THX


Edit: You should include that in your readme

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
lol, we posted at the same time

see edit above

working fine now...THX


Edit: You should include that in your readme

Yep :o thank you, I changed it to MSVC, which is supposed to be installed by default in 95, 98 , 2000 and XP....should be ok now...

[Fishman0919]

Outstanding SAPSTAR... just plain OUTSTANDING!!!


Just other reason everyone should use DVD-RB!


EDIT: On 1 machine I did Elektra full disc, 33% extras...Looks incredible including extras and on another did LOTR -2 towers full... well, outstanding...THX

[hutch1711]

Am I the only dummy on the planet? SAPSTAR I'd love to try your program but JAVA confuses the crap out of me. I downloaded j2re 1.4.2.8 from the Sun site and loaded it onto my computer. I haven't got a clue what to do next. How do you make the java command a path environment variable :confused:

[Fishman0919]

If you installed java without changing default setting, its all set. You don't need to do anything else with java.

Just follow the readme with QmatOp

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by hutch1711
Am I the only dummy on the planet? SAPSTAR I'd love to try your program but JAVA confuses the crap out of me. I downloaded j2re 1.4.2.8 from the Sun site and loaded it onto my computer. I haven't got a clue what to do next. How do you make the java command a path environment variable :confused:
If you just installed JRE, it should be ok. My explanation is not very clear, I meant that you must add the java command path to the default path variable.
Select 'My Computer', then right click, then select properties, then choose the Advanced tab, there you should find a button 'Environment Variables'.
Choose the System variable Path press Edit, and add the path to your java command.

Example :
C:\Perl\bin\;C:\WINNT\system32;C:\WINNT;C:\WINNT\System32\Wbem;C:\Program Files\ATI Technologies\ATI Control Panel;C:\j2sdk1.4.2_08\bin\

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
If you installed java without changing default setting, its all set. You don't need to do anything else with java.

Just follow the readme with QmatOp

Again at the same moment ! :)

[hutch1711]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
If you installed java without changing default setting, its all set. You don't need to do anything else with java.

Just follow the readme with QmatOp

Thanks for responding Fishman0919.

Okay. I said when it came to JAVA I was a dummy! I don't see any console window, how does one activate it??? I have a separate directoty for SUN and QMatOp, I trust this is correct.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by hutch1711
Thanks for responding Fishman0919.

Okay. I said when it came to JAVA I was a dummy! I don't see any console window, how does one activate it??? I have a separate directoty for SUN and QMatOp, I trust this is correct.

you just have to open a command window and then go to the QMatOp dir.

[hutch1711]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
If you just installed JRE, it should be ok. My explanation is not very clear, I meant that you must add the java command path to the default path variable.
Select 'My Computer', then right click, then select properties, then choose the Advanced tab, there you should find a button 'Environment Variables'.
Choose the System variable Path press Edit, and add the path to your java command.

Example :
C:\Perl\bin\;C:\WINNT\system32;C:\WINNT;C:\WINNT\System32\Wbem;C:\Program Files\ATI Technologies\ATI Control Panel;C:\j2sdk1.4.2_08\bin\

SAPSTAR thank you also for your responses. I note in your example you refer to j2sdk1.4.2_08. This not the version I downloaded - could this be my problem?

[Fishman0919]

Ok, the easy way to do this is...hum...oh...ya

Go in to your "qmatop" folder, does not matter where you put it...

Right click on the "QMatOp.bat" file and choose "Create Shortcut"

Now, right click on the shortcut file you just made and choose "properties"

Now at the top it should be on the "Shortcut" tab...now next to "Target:" you should see something in the box like...
C:\##@@\%%$$\QMatOp\QMatOp.bat

After "QMatOp.bat" add where your DVD-RB working folder "d2vavs" is

Sorry, it should look something like this if your dvd-rb working folder is C:\dvd-rb
C:\##@@\%%$$\QMatOp\QMatOp.bat c:\dvd-rb\d2vavs

Now, after you run the "Prepare" phase of DVD-RB in 3 click mode...2 click on the shortcut you just make and edited...after this is done...10 to 30 min... go to DVD-RB and click "Encode"

Hope this helps

Edit: LOLOLOL, we need to stop this

[hutch1711]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
Ok, the easy way to do this is...hum...oh...ya

Go in to your "qmatop" folder, does not matter where you put it...

Right click on the "QMatOp.bat" file and choose "Create Shortcut"

Now, right click on the shortcut file you just made and choose "properties"

Now at the top it should be on the "Shortcut" tab...now next to "Target:" you should see something in the box like...
C:\##@@\%%$$\QMatOp\QMatOp.bat

After "QMatOp.bat" add where your DVD-RB working folder "d2vavs" is

Sorry, it should look something like this if your dvd-rb working folder is C:\dvd-rb
C:\##@@\%%$$\QMatOp\QMatOp.bat c:\dvd-rb\d2vavs

Now, after you run the "Prepare" phase of DVD-RB in 3 click mode...2 click on the shortcut you just make and edited...after this is done...10 to 30 min... go to DVD-RB and click "Encode"

Hope this helps

Edit: LOLOLOL, we need to stop this

Fishman0919

Excellent instructions. Thank you so much.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
Ok, the easy way to do this is...hum...oh...ya

Go in to your "qmatop" folder, does not matter where you put it...

Right click on the "QMatOp.bat" file and choose "Create Shortcut"
[...]
Hope this helps

Edit: LOLOLOL, we need to stop this

Well thank you for helping the rookie, Fishman0919; Do you think I should make an autoinstall or what ?:confused: I thought, it was rather simple....like that.

[Carpo]

this seems like a good little tool to have in your audio/video toolkit, gonna test it out on a few films later :)

on the java issue does it have to be 1.4.x or can you use the 1.5.x version?

auto install? might be an idear, seeing as you have ppl with different levels of experience, may also cut down on the support posts you have to deal with ;)

[Fishman0919]

An autoinstall would problly be better, I thought it was rather simple but some may not... I think setting up DVD-RB is rather simple but alot of people can't and use Rockas DVD-RB installer.

Again, THX and great job SAPSTAR


on the java issue does it have to be 1.4.x or can you use the 1.5.x version?

I'm using java 1.5.2 or something like that with no problems.

[Rockas]

Do you think I should make an autoinstall or what ?

Believe me... you should, and by the way... include theJava package on it :)

[Carpo]

Target Perceptual Error: 1.5800781250
Compressed JPEG File Size is: 46087
Compression Ratio: 22.496908
Input Uncompressed File Size: 1036815
(Bitrate Optimization) Target File Size: 46080
(Bitrate Optimization) File Size Tolerance: 2304 (5.0 Percent)
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 1 Target Perceptual Error: 1.0000000000
--Compressed JPEG File Size: 58299
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 2 Target Perceptual Error: 50.5000000000
--Compressed JPEG File Size: 7142
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 3 Target Perceptual Error: 25.7500000000
--Compressed JPEG File Size: 7548
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 4 Target Perceptual Error: 13.3750000000
--Compressed JPEG File Size: 7973
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 5 Target Perceptual Error: 7.1875000000
--Compressed JPEG File Size: 12001
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 6 Target Perceptual Error: 4.0937500000
--Compressed JPEG File Size: 22085
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 7 Target Perceptual Error: 2.5468750000
--Compressed JPEG File Size: 32248
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 8 Target Perceptual Error: 1.7734375000
--Compressed JPEG File Size: 41441
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 9 Target Perceptual Error: 1.3867187500
--Compressed JPEG File Size: 47785
Target Perceptual Error: 1.3867187500
Compressed JPEG File Size is: 47785
Compression Ratio: 21.697499

is what i get on near all vids i have tried this program on - i wont ask if its supposed to be like that cus when ever i see the word error its never good ;D

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Carpo
Target Perceptual Error: 1.5800781250
Compressed JPEG File Size is: 46087
Compression Ratio: 22.496908
Input Uncompressed File Size: 1036815
(Bitrate Optimization) Target File Size: 46080
(Bitrate Optimization) File Size Tolerance: 2304 (5.0 Percent)
(Bitrate Optimization) Iteration 1 Target Perceptual Error: 1.0000000000
[...]
Target Perceptual Error: 1.3867187500
Compressed JPEG File Size is: 47785
Compression Ratio: 21.697499

is what i get on near all vids i have tried this program on - i wont ask if its supposed to be like that cus when ever i see the word error its never good ;D

Yes it's normal, this is the DCTune2.0 log, this screenshot is the analysis of just one frame, it says perceptual error, because as you may know the JPEG/MPEG2 compression are not lossless, the purpose is to reduce this perceptual error as much as possible.

Once everything is finished, you should be able to find two REBUILDER files in your D2VAVS directory, one is .BAK (the old one), .ECL is the new one, optimized by QMatOp.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Rockas
Believe me... you should, and by the way... include theJava package on it :)
I'll work on it......maybe next version.

[Carpo]

learn something new everyday - error sometimes = good :D

[cobra21041968]

Hi
Since I think is very interesting this Sw , I would like to test it, but I got an error just after run the Qmatop, here is a sreenshot of what I have:


°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°

Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

H:\>c:

C:\>cd Program Files

C:\Program Files>cd QMatOp

C:\Program Files\QMatOp>dir
Volume in drive C is Local Disk
Volume Serial Number is A8E0-D462

Directory of C:\Program Files\QMatOp

11/04/2005 14:30 <DIR> .
11/04/2005 14:30 <DIR> ..
18/06/2003 17:55 225,280 avs2avi.exe
02/04/1998 16:42 136,192 dctune2.0.exe
07/04/2005 11:31 737 ECLItem.class
10/04/2005 21:25 <DIR> Frames
10/04/2005 20:15 <DIR> Inter
10/04/2005 21:25 <DIR> Intra
10/04/2005 21:25 <DIR> Pics
10/04/2005 20:11 428 QMatOp$1.class
10/04/2005 20:11 428 QMatOp$2.class
10/04/2005 08:54 41 QMatOp.bat
10/04/2005 20:11 12,009 QMatOp.class
10/04/2005 20:13 1,243 README.txt
07/04/2005 15:57 851 StreamGobbler.class
9 File(s) 377,209 bytes
6 Dir(s) 7,198,527,488 bytes free

C:\Program Files\QMatOp>QMatOp c:\test\D2VAVS
Exception in thread "main" java.lang.ArrayIndexOutOfBoundsException: 500
at QMatOp.D2VAVSParsing(QMatOp.java:194)
at QMatOp.main(QMatOp.java:46)

C:\Program Files\QMatOp>QMatOp c:\test\D2VAVS
Exception in thread "main" java.lang.ArrayIndexOutOfBoundsException: 500
at QMatOp.D2VAVSParsing(QMatOp.java:194)
at QMatOp.main(QMatOp.java:46)

C:\Program Files\QMatOp>QMatOp c:\test\D2VAVS
Exception in thread "main" java.lang.ArrayIndexOutOfBoundsException: 500
at QMatOp.D2VAVSParsing(QMatOp.java:194)
at QMatOp.main(QMatOp.java:46)

C:\Program Files\QMatOp>


°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°
it look like a java problem , but the first time that I get this error I was using 1.4.2 and after update the the Java i'm still getting the same error.
Any suggestion is welcome here.
Thanks

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by cobra21041968
Hi
Since I think is very interesting this Sw , I would like to test it, but I got an error just after run the Qmatop, here is a sreenshot of what I have:


C:\Program Files\QMatOp>QMatOp c:\test\D2VAVS
Exception in thread "main" java.lang.ArrayIndexOutOfBoundsException: 500
at QMatOp.D2VAVSParsing(QMatOp.java:194)
at QMatOp.main(QMatOp.java:46)

°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°
it look like a java problem , but the first time that I get this error I was using 1.4.2 and after update the the Java i'm still getting the same error.
Any suggestion is welcome here.
Thanks
First bug, hmmm it's not related at all with your java version, that's a memory pb, I'll correct it. Your DVD must have a lot of different cells.(check the number of .avs files, must be huge).....It will be corrected in the next version.

[cobra21041968]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
First bug, hmmm it's not related at all with your java version, that's a memory pb, I'll correct it. Your DVD must have a lot of different cells.(check the number of .avs files, must be huge).....It will be corrected in the next version.

Thanx for your quick reply.
You right my dvd is quite long , is the Lord of Ring two towers.
The reason of why I want to try your software is that all matrices that I have test so far I get not very good results. I'm wondering how could be with your toy. :)

[Fishman0919]

Humm..I ran LOTR - 2 Tower as one of the first disc I did with QMatOp and it worked fine.... :confused:

I ran two towers with the first ver. of QMatOp

[Carpo]

poss could be due to amount of mem in the system

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
Humm..I ran LOTR - 2 Tower as one of the first disc I did with QMatOp and it worked fine.... :confused:

I ran two towers with the first ver. of QMatOp
It may come from the DVDRB version, I noticed that in the last version some really small segment are generated, before jdobbs was ignoring them...

For everybody, could you include the DVDRB version used, when reporting a pb. Thx.
[EDIT] More info on the movie too, like PAL/NTSC ? Sometimes zone 2 and zone 1 versions are totally different. (from a structure point of view)

[cobra21041968]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
Humm..I ran LOTR - 2 Tower as one of the first disc I did with QMatOp and it worked fine.... :confused:

I ran two towers with the first ver. of QMatOp

I need to clarify how I do my backup.
I use to separate the end titles from the main movie, and using DVDshrink I use to create pictures for the end titles (saving space) every 0.5 seconds. So doing this i have at the end a huge number of files ( more that 1000 I think ).
That's could be the reason of why I got the problem.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by cobra21041968
I need to clarify how I do my backup.
I use to separate the end titles from the main movie, and using DVDshrink I use to create pictures for the end titles (saving space) every 0.5 seconds. So doing this i have at the end a huge number of files ( more that 1000 I think ).
That's could be the reason of why I got the problem.
Yep this is the problem....By the mean time I release the next version (most probably tomorrow), you could try on the original DVD. (Half-D1/Half-space extras for example)

[Fishman0919]

Sorry, DVD-RB .83 pro and LOTR - The Two Towers NTSC R1

[cobra21041968]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
Yep this is the problem....By the mean time I release the next version (most probably tomorrow), you could try on the original DVD. (Half-D1/Half-space extras for example)

Ok
Thank you

DVD-RB 0.80 freeware
LOTR - The two Towers PAL

[cobra21041968]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
Sorry, DVD-RB .83 pro and LOTR - The Two Towers NTSC R1

Did you try with other matrix before QMatOp? If yes did you see any differences? I tried many matrix without success, I can't resist to see what I could get with QMatOp.

[Fishman0919]

It made a difference. small but.. the biggest diff was the opening mountain scene... looked nicer with more detail on my 65" HD TV

[SAPSTAR]

See my first message...major changes in the way it's used and configured, should be easier now. The autosetup is for the next version, I have also an idea of improvement for the Half-D1/Half-space.....

[Fishman0919]

SAPSTAR, I'm getting an error with DVD-RB .83 pro and QMatOp .4b

I started to run The Hulk ntsc r1 with qmatop .3b after the "prepare" phase of dvd-rb and I noticed you had put up a new ver of qmatop.

I stopped qmatop .3b and After downloading qmatop .4b and installing I reran the "Prepare" phase of dvd-rb... then after editing the QMatOP.ini file with my dvd-rb working path I click the QMatOP.exe file and I get...

The device is not ready.
Execing cmd.exe /c move H:\DVDTemp\D2VAVS\REBUILDER.ECL H:\DVDTemp\D2VAVS\REBUILDER.BAK

over and over

Looks like it's still looking for it in the default dir from the .ini file...I did change it to my dvd-rb dir path

tried reboot for SAG's but still the same error

[TuRiSOft]

Now I'm tryin this:
1. I did the prepare phase w/rb0.83pro;
2. changed some vts to OPV w/rb-opt0.17
3. ran QmatOp0.3b on the result.

Now I'm going to start encoding and I'm trying to figur out if all those steps will get me to a big oversized output!

I'll let you know.
This is only a try!!!!

[HolyChain]

Hi there!

I'm getting the same error with QmatOp0.4b, that Fishman reported. Editing of the ini File doesn't seem to have an effect.

Little Update: i'm using DVD-RB 0.83 pro (yeah!). i've just deleted the ini file from within the qmatop directory and started the exe. it's still looking for the dvd2avs directory as defined by standard in the ini file. maybe the exe is ignoring the ini file?

But anyway: great little tool and thank you for contributing it :-) .

Greetings
HolyChain

[Carpo]

simple work around is to rename the hdd for the moment nad make the folders it says it wants, although this is a serious bug and will prob be fix rather quick :)

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
SAPSTAR, I'm getting an error with DVD-RB .83 pro and QMatOp .4b

[...]
The device is not ready.
Execing cmd.exe /c move H:\DVDTemp\D2VAVS\REBUILDER.ECL H:\DVDTemp\D2VAVS\REBUILDER.BAK

over and over

Looks like it's still looking for it in the default dir from the .ini file...I did change it to my dvd-rb dir path

tried reboot for SAG's but still the same error

Raaaaaaah ! :o :angry: Corrected ! My stupid brain just forgot to call the function reading the INIFile in the main program !!!!

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by HolyChain
Hi there!

I'm getting the same error with QmatOp0.4b, that Fishman reported. Editing of the ini File doesn't seem to have an effect.

Little Update: i'm using DVD-RB 0.83 pro (yeah!). i've just deleted the ini file from within the qmatop directory and started the exe. it's still looking for the dvd2avs directory as defined by standard in the ini file. maybe the exe is ignoring the ini file?

But anyway: great little tool and thank you for contributing it :-) .

Greetings
HolyChain
Last express version should work now.........raaaaaaaaah :o

[cobra21041968]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
Last express version should work now.........raaaaaaaaah :o

mmmhh..I download the 0.05b on your web, but I got always the same error, look like is always the 0.04b.
Do I miss something?

[TuRiSOft]

Originally posted by TuRiSOft
Now I'm tryin this:
1. I did the prepare phase w/rb0.83pro;
2. changed some vts to OPV w/rb-opt0.17
3. ran QmatOp0.3b on the result.

Now I'm going to start encoding and I'm trying to figur out if all those steps will get me to a big oversized output!

I'll let you know.
This is only a try!!!!

Only 70Mb oversize! Good!

[HolyChain]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
Last express version should work now.........raaaaaaaaah :o

Hi there!

Works like a charm over here now :-) Thank you very, very much for your effort. Great Work.

Greetings
HolyChain

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by cobra21041968
mmmhh..I download the 0.05b on your web, but I got always the same error, look like is always the 0.04b.
Do I miss something?

Most probably because of your internet explorer cache, try now...I renamed the zip file including the version name, it should prevent any cache file pb when downloading it.

[cobra21041968]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
Most probably because of your internet explorer cache, try now...I renamed the zip file including the version name, it should prevent any cache file pb when downloading it.

Now is working...I 'll let you know the results.:)
Thank you

[Fishman0919]

SAPSTAR, I've noticed something on a few movies done with QMatOP.
It looks like you have a 5% Tolerance but I have seen a couple final target perceptual error over that (6%-8%) and sometimes the final Iteration may be high in error (say 4.342245%) then the second to last one (say 3.524351245%)


just something I have noticed...Hope that helps

[Axlemar]

I wanted to try out the program, so I set it up like the instructions said and ran it for a while. Eventually I get the message:

execing cmd.exe /C move c:\documents and settings\joe\desktop\out\d2vavs\rebuilder.ecl c:\documents and settings\joe\desktop\out\d2vavs\rebuilder.bak
The syntx of the command is incorrect.

It seems to run fine for a while, but then this message just loops over and over again after about 30 minutes. Did I set something wrong? Using the newest version of both programs.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Axlemar
I wanted to try out the program, so I set it up like the instructions said and ran it for a while. Eventually I get the message:

execing cmd.exe /C move c:\documents and settings\joe\desktop\out\d2vavs\rebuilder.ecl c:\documents and settings\joe\desktop\out\d2vavs\rebuilder.bak
The syntx of the command is incorrect.

It seems to run fine for a while, but then this message just loops over and over again after about 30 minutes. Did I set something wrong? Using the newest version of both programs.

I know what it is !!! The spaces in the directory name...I never thought about it !!! Something I'll have to correct, before that you can try by changing your directory to a more "regular" one....without spaces I mean.

[EDIT] Should be corrected in the new current version 0.06b

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
SAPSTAR, I've noticed something on a few movies done with QMatOP.
It looks like you have a 5% Tolerance but I have seen a couple final target perceptual error over that (6%-8%) and sometimes the final Iteration may be high in error (say 4.342245%) then the second to last one (say 3.524351245%)


just something I have noticed...Hope that helps

The 5% of tolerance is about the final size of the frame not the perceptual error. The perceptual error is not a percentage. Anyway, thank you for the info.

I may add some parameters in the .ini file to play with the tolerance percentage ?!? I was thinking about a parameter allowing to set the frame splitting rate (currently I take one frame every 20 seconds...) It could be changed....

[Fishman0919]

Very well.. THX for clearing that up....


Again THX for your work

[Axlemar]

This may sound like a stupid question, but do we have to do anything after it is done running and automatically closes? Q matrix is off by default so do we have to enable it or anything?

[onesoul]

@ SAPSTAR

QMatOp seems interesting but I have some questions.

Could you make sort of a guide explaining in more detail what is being done and what does the log describes as some other files created mean?

After the job done, for example, I have the intra and inter directories with some log files, why does appear 3 log files in each directory? What are the meaning of those values?
And I have the pics directory with 6 pics, 3 pics with "intra" description and other 3 with "inter" description, what does that mean, why only those 3 pics and why does the intra looks so much better?

And for last at anytime those new values for the matrix would fall off the standard ones?

I hope you don't mind all these questions, that's why a tiny guide would be appreciated.

Thanks

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Axlemar
This may sound like a stupid question, but do we have to do anything after it is done running and automatically closes? Q matrix is off by default so do we have to enable it or anything?
Nope...The REBUILDER.ECL is modified to take into account the matrices.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by onesoul
@ SAPSTAR

QMatOp seems interesting but I have some questions.

Could you make sort of a guide explaining in more detail what is being done and what does the log describes as some other files created mean?

After the job done, for example, I have the intra and inter directories with some log files, why does appear 3 log files in each directory? What are the meaning of those values?
And I have the pics directory with 6 pics, 3 pics with "intra" description and other 3 with "inter" description, what does that mean, why only those 3 pics and why does the intra looks so much better?

And for last at anytime those new values for the matrix would fall off the standard ones?

I hope you don't mind all these questions, that's why a tiny guide would be appreciated.

Thanks

I promise...as soon as I have the opportunity to do it...I'll do it.
Maybe this coming weekend...before I would be surprised.

First quick answer, the intra pics are better because they are less compressed than the inter....About the remaining logs and pics, in fact they could be deleted, they are the remaining of the last cell processed. The previous cells created the same kind files but were deleted after being processed. Anyway, I'll explain more, how it works in the promised document.

[EDIT] Just added a small pdf file in the last released zip file. (QMatOp006b.zip)

[SAPSTAR]

Added two new options in the .ini file to control the accuracy of the matrices. See my first message or my web site.(plus a small pdf file explaining a bit more)
[EDIT] RTF file not PDF
[EDIT] Don't play too much with the framesplitperiod parameter, as I just noticed it's not fully taken into account in the final result. So don't lose too much time by decreasing it until the next version is released.

[sreg0r]

i got an "There was an error opening this document. The file is damaged and could not be repaired" message when i tried to open the .pdf document.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by sreg0r
i got an "There was an error opening this document. The file is damaged and could not be repaired" message when i tried to open the .pdf document.
Thank you for the info..The pdf file must be corrupted...I'll create another one later. Sorry.

[EDIT] I recreated the ZIP file and put a rtf file instead of a pdf file.

[onesoul]

Hi, I read the rtf file but I still need to ask if the inter matrix is the non-intra matrix? (I don't really know what are the differences between intra and non-intra matrix :))
-Normalization of the previous result. (Matrices are moved if under the MPEG2 standard) Do you mean matrices are changed or recalculated accordingly the MPEG2 standard?

Cheers

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by onesoul
Hi, I read the rtf file but I still need to ask if the inter matrix is the non-intra matrix? (I don't really know what are the differences between intra and non-intra matrix :))
Do you mean matrices are changed or recalculated accordingly the MPEG2 standard?

Cheers

Inter matrices = non-intra matrices, they are mostly used in the P and B frames.
Matrices are moved according to the MPEG2 standard, because in the MPEG2 standard the first "cell" in the intra matrix must be 8, and in the inter must be at least 8. (it means the base level in MPEG2 is 8)

Example : My first cell has a 6 value, I will move by 2 the whole matrix, in order to be standard. Some people may say why don't you multiply instead of moving the matrix. I say, you're wrong guys by multiplying you will amplify the steps between the details tresholds.

[SAPSTAR]

IMPORTANT CORRECTION IN THIS RELEASE NOBODY SHOULD USE THE 0.07b VERSION !!! :scared:
An error was introduced in the 0.07b, the average is wrongly calculated. :(

[EDIT] Now I'm freezing the current version for few days, I want to test more my versions before releasing them from now, too many stupid errors were introduced in the past.

[Axlemar]

Its cool. Thanks for the quick update.

[Fishman0919]

@SAPSTAR, THX again.

PS Damm u, :D just finished run QMatOp 0.07b over night w/ 1%t and 1sf to wake up to a warning not to use ver 0.07b....lol that will learn me not to use the max settings...joke :D

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
@SAPSTAR, THX again.

PS Damm u, :D just finished run QMatOp 0.07b over night w/ 1%t and 1sf to wake up to a warning not to use ver 0.07b....lol that will learn me not to use the max settings...joke :D
WOW !!! Must have been long ? With 0.08b, I ran a 1% tolerance with 10 seconds period...and I found it long....let me know the results if you ever try again the "1 1" with 0.08b. Sorry again for the error !:scared:
[EDIT] By the way, I just noticed a memory allocation part where I think you could have some pb with a framesplitperiod of 1. If I were you, I would stay above 4 or 5 until I correct this possible memory allocation error.

[ernstblaauw]

Why is jdobbs not participating in this discussion? Does he not like this program?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by ernstblaauw
Why is jdobbs not participating in this discussion? Does he not like this program?
Don't know...Ask him :D

[Fishman0919]

rerun 0.08b w/ 1%e and 1st and got an error... couldn't catch what it was but something like:

Error: java/...lan.......245........
Error: java/...lan.......246........
Error: java/...lan.......247........


over and over...but it did propuce a matrix



hope this helps

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
rerun 0.08b w/ 1%e and 1st and got an error... couldn't catch what it was but something like:

Error: java/...lan.......245........
Error: java/...lan.......246........
Error: java/...lan.......247........


over and over...but it did propuce a matrix



hope this helps
See the EDIT of my previous reply to you...I noticed a possible memory overflow in the case of a very low FrameSplitPeriod, I think that's what you just encountered, until I correct it, you should stay above 4 or 5.(depending on the biggest cell you have)
I think that the result when overflowed just take into account the first 100 seconds of the current cell.

And thank you very much for you testing, it helps, because it confirmed what I feared about this possible memory overflow.

[Fishman0919]

Ya, I noticed your post and wanted to let you know...

Re-ran 0.8b with 5% + 5st and no errors, process took about 2 hours on an AMD 64 3800+

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
Ya, I noticed your post and wanted to let you know...

Re-ran 0.8b with 5% + 5st and no errors, process took about 2 hours on an AMD 64 3800+
Good ! Again thank you for your testing :thanks:...FYI I'm now sure that it's only related to the framesplitperiod, you can keep the tolerance at 1, it will work.
Lucky man, you have a fast computer !!!! Your encoding must be very fast too !

[Fishman0919]

I'll do Family Guy Season 3 Disc 3 with 1% and 3st.. see now that goes

Lucky man, you have a fast computer !!!! Your encoding must be very fast too !

about an hour for 2 passes with CCE.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
I'll do Family Guy Season 3 Disc 3 with 1% and 3st.. see now that goes about an hour for 2 passes with CCE.
Let me know the quality of the result, plus did you choose any specific matrix in DVD-Rebuilder settings ? (If yes, they influence the result).
I'm thinking about including an option to indicate if it's a "NORMAL" movie or a cartoon type.....just to help the internal algorithm, currently a way to "help" it, is to choose a "smart" matrix in the DVD-Rebuilder settings.
Example : if you chose a CG matrix, the optimization will be for a CG kind of movie. If none was specified, it just does its best by itself.

[Fishman0919]

I'm encoding the movie now, play some of the .m2v files and they look real good.

no I didn't choose any specific matrix in DVD-Rebuilder settings ..just encoder default

If you like I can run Family Guy on a diff machine (got 4 to play with) and choose "Smooth CG" in DVD-RB let you know the diff.

Edit: I got alittle time on my hands right now, went sking two weekends ago and got blindsided by a 10 year old girl who was going out of control... I was standing still wait to go over a hill and she hit me from behind...broke my left leg in 2 spots. Anyway lucky for laptops and wireless connections...hehe

[Axlemar]

If you don't mind, I am going to ask questions along with my results:

I backed up the same animation dvd twice using the newest cce sp 2.70, once using rebuilder 84.1 by itself and again using qmatop .08b with 2% tolerance and 10 seconds. Both times I used default matrix settings in rebuilder. When I compared the two outputs on several different players, qmatop had introduced a considerable amount of static on its output that was originally 5.47 gigs in size (low compression rate). I also noticed that the audio skipped on some of my players during high action scenes from the qmatop version while the rebuilder version didn't (probably the result of the player not liking QMat). To try and make sure it wasn't a bad burn, I backed up another disc from the same animation series that had the same previews, and the previews skipped in the same places and on the same players as the first one did. So overall: Some players played it fine and the final output size was good, just more static was introduced than with the default rebuilder matrix settings with QMat disabled. I will run another test with the same source using 1% tolerance and 5 seconds.

Now my questions: Is this supposed to replace CCE version of QMat by formulating and adjusting matrices through the series of programs you have set up? Also, could my settings have introduced the static because they were too strict or not strict enough. I have copied animated series using rebuilder with CCE QMat enabled and the output didn't have the kind of static I get from qmatop. Thanks.

(Also about using different matrices in rebuilder, I heard using things like the cg matrix uses cce filters that can cause very strange results. The best quality would come from having QMatOP analyze every second with a low tolerance so that the original picture's available bitrate is optimised across the detail in the image right?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Axlemar
If you don't mind, I am going to ask questions along with my results:

I backed up the same animation dvd twice using the newest cce sp 2.70, once using rebuilder 84.1 by itself and again using qmatop .08b with 2% tolerance and 10 seconds. Both times I used default matrix settings in rebuilder. When I compared the two outputs on several different players, qmatop had introduced a considerable amount of static on its output that was originally 5.47 gigs in size (low compression rate). I also noticed that the audio skipped on some of my players during high action scenes from the qmatop version while the rebuilder version didn't (probably the result of the player not liking QMat). To try and make sure it wasn't a bad burn, I backed up another disc from the same animation series that had the same previews, and the previews skipped in the same places and on the same players as the first one did. So overall: Some players played it fine and the final output size was good, just more static was introduced than with the default rebuilder matrix settings with QMat disabled. I will run another test with the same source using 1% tolerance and 5 seconds.

Hmm interesting, what I would like to know first, did you do any test with the first version ??? I ask that because, in the first version, quantifiers rarely went above 190, and I heard some players may have difficulties with very high Quantifiers, I may have to chnage my "normalization" function in order to come back closer to usual MPEG2 standard ?!? For example, I'm not sure if all players are able to handle an inter matrix non starting by a value between 8 and 16.....Even if the pure MPEG2 standard doesn't specify anything about that.

About the static, what do you exactly mean ?


Now my questions: Is this supposed to replace CCE version of QMat by formulating and adjusting matrices through the series of programs you have set up? Also, could my settings have introduced the static because they were too strict or not strict enough. I have copied animated series using rebuilder with CCE QMat enabled and the output didn't have the kind of static I get from qmatop. Thanks.

QMatOp replaces the matrices define in each cell, in the ECL file. If you chose any matrix before, it will be taken into account.(less if you increase the framesplitperiod). I don't think your settings are the problem. I'll check with the framesplitperiod parameter, I may have introduced a bad side effect, I may have to tweak a little more this part.

(Also about using different matrices in rebuilder, I heard using things like the cg matrix uses cce filters that can cause very strange results. The best quality would come from having QMatOP analyze every second with a low tolerance so that the original picture's available bitrate is optimised across the detail in the image right?
Yep exactly...for the intra part, but I'm still looking for a way to improve my inter (non-intra) part. This part is rather difficult to optimize. I have an idea, but I fear the processing will be too long.

[Axlemar]

Sorry, I never used the first version so I can't say if it would fix the skipping. I am in the process of doing everything with 1% tolerance and five seconds just to see if there is a difference. The values in every matrix started at 8 and then varied, but some went up to as high as 242 (I need to learn more about this kinda thing. I don't know if that is significant or not). On some of my players, QMat done by CCE SP without QMatOP made the images kinda jumpy (once again the compat with QMat), but some played them fine and there wasn't the kinda static that I got, so this process must be doing things much different then CCE. By static, I mean that the overall image, especially during movement, had a lot of small breaks in it that kinda looks like static. If some objects moved, you can notice the space around them kinda ripple and break. Usually I see similar results in very low bitrate compression with CCE, but the source in my test was only about half way in 5 gig.

As for improvements, if you think that you may have found a way to optimize your program in anyway that will yield higher quality results, even at the cost of time, I encourage you to do them. The point of including another program is to spend extra time improving the output anyway, and besides you can always include options to change the mode if people don't want to wait. By the way, what exactly would the -m switch do in dctune? Thanks for your hard work.

(Ok I finished a 1% tolerance and 5 seconds. The quality is a bit better, the motion breaks (static) aren't as appearent. It still skips in the same places on the same players (which I guess it should cause the matrices are calculated in the same fashion with the same ranges. When you fix the memory problem, I will run a 1% and 1 second to see if there is a big difference or not. Thanks).

[SAPSTAR]

I just released the last version of QMatOp, I corrected some bugs (see README.txt), now you can run with a 1s framesplitperiod.
I also added the possibility to automatically start the encoding after the processing. (you have to keep dvd-rb open...)
I totally changed the way inter matrices are processed, it will be a little bit longer, but I expect a lot of quality from this one.

A special greeting to FishMan0919, who helped me a lot by testing it deeply....thank you man !

[Fishman0919]

Very nice SAPSTAR.... like the autostart of DVD-RB

[Carpo]

so what do ppl suggest for

tolerance=x
framesplitperiod=x

atm i have it as 1 and 5 - is this too much/too little ?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Carpo
so what do ppl suggest for

tolerance=x
framesplitperiod=x

atm i have it as 1 and 5 - is this too much/too little ?
If you have a fast computer, I would say :
tolerance=1
framesplitperiod=1

I have an AMD 2600, so I keep framesplitperiod=5 for my current tests.
tolerance can be 1, as the runtime doesn't change so much with it...

[Axlemar]

I ran the newest version at 1% tolerance and 5 seconds and it still produces too many ripples and breakes during motion for me to use it over the quality of rebuilder and CCE SP alone. Can someone else please back up an animated series with and without this program and compare them?

[Fishman0919]

ME...ME...oh ...I did... I did a few of the the Family Guy Season disc with and without QMatOp testing for SAPSTAR and the new ver look just a little better (to me on my 65' HDTV) then without... I did a few DragonBall Z and GT disc with QMatOp and got the same results.

[onesoul]

@SAPSTAR

I don't want to sound depreciative towards your work, I find it an interesting tool. I tried 1% and 4s split on monsters_inc. I encoded the resulted matrices, aswell the mpeg standard, on the referred cell, it was very disappointing, the calculated matrices made the encode with too much artifacts that didn't show up on the other one.

I will try sometime 1% and 1s, but I feel this tool isn't yet fully optimized, maybe because of dctune?

Cheers

[Axlemar]

I am having a similar problem with "artifacts" appearing more in the final encodes. I have tried 1%/5 and 1%/1 and it still seems to have more artifacting then without using it, which is odd because dctune sounds like a pretty cool piece of technology. Maybe it has something to do with the conversion from avs to avi and maybe something is being mapped incorrectly?

[Fishman0919]

onesoul and Axlemar, what encoder are you using???

I found with HC and QuEnc I got some MacroBlocking in some movies but with CCE SP 2.70 and w/adaptive Q-matrix switching turned on there was some noticeable improvement in quality then without using QMatOp. I didn't try any encodings w/ CCE SP 2.67 but it does not have adaptive Q-matrix switching so results may be the same as with HC and QuEnc.

[SAPSTAR]

@onesoul
Of course, it not yet fully tuned...it's released for about one week :)
Anyway, it doesn't really come from dctune it self, dctune is only optimizing the matrix for a frame given several parameters. I'm still trying to figure out the best settings, especially for the inter matrices. The intra part is rather easy, I think that it's already good. The pb is for inter matrices, they are used ofr the encryption in P and B pics...which are difficult to assess, that's why in the last version I tried to work with delta frames (differences between succesive frames...)...But I'm still trying to find the best parameters for them.
@axlemar
avs2avi is only used to interpret some AVS scripts which are creating the frames, no conversion is really performed.....I didn't want to rewrite an AVS interpreter.....

@all
When giving some issues, could add more info :
Kind of movie (animation , regular), PAL/NTSC, encoder, matrices specified or not specified in DVD-RB (remember that's a way to help QMatOp, myself I always select some smooth matrices in DVD-RB before running QMatOp for animations, it gives a clue to the processing).

I really hope obtaining some really good final results, I will have to improve it but I need help for that. Especially for the inter/non-intra matrices, this part is really driving me crazy....yesterday I tried several possibilities without success :(

Up to now, I have the feeling that the pbs are mainly with animations, correct me if I'm wrong....I need to know.

[Axlemar]

I will have to try it with some other sources before I can tell you if the problem is with animation or not, but animation is almost the only thing I back up. I always use CCE SP 2.70 (the newest verison with the newest patch) and almost always ntsc.

I was told earlier that you don't have to enable the QMat switch and that QMatOP handles it for you (I guess from inserting the matrices directly into the ecl file?). I never change the default matrix cause I don't like the idea of using filters on the source and I know it is possible to achieve good quality without them. It would seem that the biggest problem is between succesive frames (the motion breaks I tried to describe) like you said you were working on.

What would happen if I entered the QMat switch in rebuilder? Would it do QMat without using QMatOP's values or would it just use QMat's values but sway them depending on the scene or something?

I wish I could help you on a more technical level, but I have limited knowledge on how I can apart from testing sources.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Axlemar
...I was told earlier that you don't have to enable the QMat switch and that QMatOP handles it for you (I guess from inserting the matrices directly into the ecl file?). I never change the default matrix cause I don't like the idea of using filters on the source and I know it is possible to achieve good quality without them....
BEWARE !!! You always use some QMat in any MPEG2 encoding !!! That's the baseline of the MPEG1/2/4 algorithm. By default, CCE uses its own matrix, which is, from my point of view not really good for any kind of movie/animation.(mosquito noise) The usage of a specific QMat is NOT the usage of a filter!!!!! The QMat is used to tell what details it has to encode and what details it can ignore, as the MPEG2 codec is NOT a lossless encoding method , it's based on the fact that the human eye can't really some levels of details.(levels of difference of light in fact)
So my purpose is just to try to find the best matrix for each encoding instead of using a default average matrix.
Even if you don't use QMatOP, I encourage you to use at least some animation dedicated matrices in the future.....

[Fishman0919]

Axlemar, QMatOp and adaptive Q-matrix switching in CCE SP are two diff thing (kinda of the same but diff).... QMatOp analyzes each cell that DVD-RB creates in the "Prepare" phase and then QMatOp creates an optimized matrix for that cell from a set of parameters (avr bitrate, max bitrate....). Adaptive Q-matrix switching in CCE SP analyzes each GOP (Group of Pictures) it is encoding and adjusts the matrix it is using so to give maximize video quality. Having adaptive Q-matrix switching turned on in DVD-RB w/CCE SP will give you better video quality but some (very, very few) DVD Players do not like it...

from the CCE SP guide...

Disable adaptive Q-matrix switching
Cinema Craft Encoder SP (later than 2.67) adjusts quantization matrix
automatically to improve the quality of image when Multipass
VBR is selected. However, some DVD player does not support such
MPEG streams as encoded with adaptive quantization matrix, and
may cause the block noise when playback. When you encounter the
problem, you can avoid it with this option.


What is adaptive Q-matrix switching ?
There are some cases that Cinema Craft Encoder SP cannot keep
the minimum bitrate. It is considered to be caused by that the lowest
quantization scale cannot raise the bitrate under a single quantization
matrix. To solve the problem, Cinema Craft Encoder SP automatically
creates other matrices cutting the value of each element in the
matrices by half, quarter and so on, and applies another one to produce
a much lower distortion for much higher bitrate. This switching
of quantization matrix can occur at every GOP.
Thus, adaptive Q-matrix switching can improve the quality of image,
especially with lower bitrate sources or CG works or the edge of
fading out.

If you have been using CCE SP 2.70 with DVD-RB for awhile you have had adaptive Q-matrix switching on because it is turn on by default in CCE SP, just resently jdobbs turned it off by default in DVD-RB with an option to turn in on.

Hope this helps

[onesoul]

@ Fishman0919

Doesn't make much sense activating the adaptive Q-matrix option when using QMatOp because a complete new set of matrices will or could be used. So QMatOp would do no much difference I think.

I used HC, on pal anime Monsters_Inc.

edit: @ SAPSTAR

I tried an earlier version 0.05 I think, but didnt actually encode but I noticed that the generated inter pictures looked better than on this later version. It already not looked so good with artifacts but on the later it is blackened, almost can't see it.

[Fishman0919]

@onesoul

Yes a new matrix will be created but base on what matrix is being using... so if you have a matrix closely optimized for that cell... maybe not perfect yet but close... CCE SP will bring it to what it needs to be when it needs to.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by onesoul
@ SAPSTAR

I tried an earlier version 0.05 I think, but didnt actually encode but I noticed that the generated inter pictures looked better than on this later version. It already not looked so good with artifacts but on the later it is blackened, almost can't see it.
If you are talking about the generated pics in the QMatOp tree, that's perfectly normal !!! As inter pics are no more real frame but delta frames (difference between successive frames) as inter matrices are used to encode P/B pics !!!!
So you can't deduct anything from what you can see in the QMatOp directory.
[EDIT]I just finished calculations (on an old sheet of paper :) ), and found a new formula, which may improve things especially concerning the non-intra part, and I really hope it will make the artifacts disappear. I forgot to take into account the GOP structure, in my previous versions.

[SAPSTAR]

Thanks to FishMan0919, a major issue is to be solved, CCE SP doesn't handle quantifiers >127, it means that even matrices like the HVS series must not be used with CCE SP !!! Anyway, I'm to correct this pb, the new release should give really good results.
@axlemar & onesoul : I think the issue you had with high bitrate/speed anime are related and also all the artifacts you noticed!!!! That's really a major flaw in CCE SP. I'm a bit disappointed as the MPEG2 standard is a range of 8-255 values for the matrices.

[Axlemar]

Cool. I will be glad to try it out as soon as it is available.

[onesoul]

I also noticed today in pdf file of cce, the 127 quantifier limitation, I was about to point that also, although I used HC before.
But cool, I will surely try the new version.

[SAPSTAR]

This one was tested by Fishman0919 on several cases which allowed to tune it and remove some major bugs !!!
Special thanks for his help, and good luck for all your encodings, this time this is really close from my initial target.

[Carpo]

beofre i start to use this on all backups can anyone tell me if they have noticed any difference when using this tool on their backups

On a few test samples i did i couldnt see a diff (my poor eyes ;) )

[Fishman0919]

Up until the latest ver, it's been a trade off.... better quality (Too Me) in the lower action (or slow/still) parts of the movie and lesser quality in fast moving part of the movie. Now with the new ver. it's real close for me... still getting the the good quality on slow parts and the fast stuff is about the same.

[Carpo]

so u say to use v0.10 or to wait a bit longer ?

[Fishman0919]

Use it, see if it work well for you. For me the fast action scenes look equal to the an encoding without it but the slow scene and stills look much, much better

[gilligan2]

Hey guys,nice job on this proggie here. I have a question though. I was wondering if someone could take a look at my .ini file and see if they see anything that would be causing the program to take over 8 hours to complete.

I have a Dual Xeon 3.06 GHz machine and i know these programs aren't tuned for SMP but i see times of 1/2 hour and 2 hours and mine took 8 hours so i was looking for some recommendations to speed it up some.

workdir=E:\Movie\D2VAVS
tolerance=1
framesplitperiod=5
AutoEncode=1


Any input would be appreciated.This was with the version 9b i believe or whichever version was before the latest.

Thanks,

g:)

[ernstblaauw]

With version 9b and all settings to 1: The time to complete was 21 hours. I have an Athlon64 3000+.

[gilligan2]

ok,well that's good to know that i wasn't screwing something up and it can take that long.

Thanks,

g:)

[Fishman0919]

workdir=E:\Movie\D2VAVS

You need to change that to your dvd-rb work dir

workdir=C:\dvd-rb\D2VAVS


something like that or whatever yours is - edit, sorry nevermind :o

I've been testing alot(real lot) for SAPSTAR and

tolerance=2
framesplitperiod=10

is real good and cut time down alot

Make sure you are using the latest version 0.10b, much better results

[gilligan2]

OK,i'll try those settings.
Thanks Fishman0919 !


g:)

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
....

tolerance=2
framesplitperiod=10

is real good and cut time down alot

Make sure you are using the latest version 0.10b, much better results
Those settings are most probably for PAL, in the case of NTSC, a framesplitperiod of 15 should be equivalent.
Rule of thumb : FrameRate / 2 is a good ratio
=> PAL 12 should be good
=> NTSC 15 or 12 depending on interlaced or non interlaced DVD.

And thanks again to FishMan0919 who really made me correct bugs and tune the beast really quickly !!!! With so many tests in a so short period, I was able to figure out a lot of things.

[gilligan2]

OK SAPSTAR,thanks for the advice ;)

g:)

[Carpo]

so gil ur no longer a virgin to this prog - took u enuff time to have a look at it after i told you about it :D

[gilligan2]

Originally posted by Carpo
so gil ur no longer a virgin to this prog - took u enuff time to have a look at it after i told you about it :D

LOL,yes,i am using it now for a few to see how it turns out since the CCE bug was found. I used it with HC Enc for one and it looked good.

g:)

[Axlemar]

The quality is definitely much improved using CCE SP on animation now. The stills look fine, but high motion scenes still seem to fall short of CCE SP by itself. I will try the animation setting. but if you don't mind can you explain what it does differently? Thanks.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Axlemar
The quality is definitely much improved using CCE SP on animation now. The stills look fine, but high motion scenes still seem to fall short of CCE SP by itself. I will try the animation setting. but if you don't mind can you explain what it does differently? Thanks.
To summarize, instead of having a range of values 8-127 like regular movies, for animations the range is now 8-55, I tried yesterday Princess Stories Vol. One, the usage of the animation flag definitely improved the final result ! I would recommend you to use it for high speed animations. Anyway, I'm still thinking about an improvement for animations, for regular movies, I'll leave it for a while as the results are really good for now.

[hutch1711]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
CCE SP doesn't handle quantifiers >127
That's really a major flaw in CCE SP. I'm a bit disappointed as the MPEG2 standard is a range of 8-255 values for the matrices.

Some questions.

Was QMat developed only to be used with CCE SP, or can it be used with other encoders?

Does HC, or any of the other available encoders, have the ability to use the MPEG2 8-255 range of values for matrices?

If any of these encoders can use the MPEG2 standand would it make any sense to have another version of QMAT that would take full advantage of the MPEG2 8-255 values for the matrices?

[hank315]

Does HC, or any of the other available encoders, have the ability to use the MPEG2 8-255 range of values for matrices?With HC you can use values up to 255 without any problem.

[Fishman0919]

CCE SP 2.66 and up, HC Encoder and QuEnc (I think it's .57 and up that can import matrixs) work with QMatOp and DVD-RB. HC Encoder worked real well in the tests(seems like 1000's) I did for SAPSTAR.

[hutch1711]

Originally posted by Fishman0919
CCE SP 2.66 and up, HC Encoder and QuEnc (I think it's .57 and up that can import matrixs) work with QMatOp and DVD-RB. HC Encoder worked real well in the tests(seems like 1000's) I did for SAPSTAR.
Were those tests done using an earlier version of QMatOp, or am I wrong to assume the latest version is limited to a range of 8-127?

[Fishman0919]

HISTORY:
Changes in 0.10b :
- Corrected the formula for the size of each intra/inter frames
- Limited the max values to 127 (CCE restriction) Thanks again to Fishman0919 !!!
- Changed the way the final average calculation is processed
- Corrected an error when the framesplitperiod is over 30s.
- Corrected an error when avg = min bitrate. Thanks again to Fishman0919 !!!
- Added a new parameter for Animations, the optimization is different in this special case. Be careful with this parameter, it's still being tested.

[hutch1711]

Thanks Fishman0919. Okay, then if you were using HC, or any of the encoders that can use the full MPEG2 8-255 range, would you be better off using an earlier version of QMatOp?

[Fishman0919]

- Changed the way the final average calculation is processed

This help alot in the final quality, ver .9b was better good but ver .10b is by far the beat one yet.

Most of the test I ran were with HC, I think ver. .10b worked the best.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by hutch1711
Were those tests done using an earlier version of QMatOp, or am I wrong to assume the latest version is limited to a range of 8-127?
Well, you're right the last version of QMatOp is limited to a range of 8-127, if some people are interested, I could put it in parameters, I mean, a parameter like RangeLimitation, so if you wish to go further, it could be taken into account...at your own risk ! :)

[hutch1711]

:)

[Carpo]

im using

tolerance=2
framesplitperiod=15

NTSC R1 version of pulp fiction

used v0.10 of qmatop and hc0.14 and the test bit i did had the vid looking spot on (as well as undot().cnr2() ) - so think my days of 5 pass cce are gone

good work to SAPSTAR and hank :)

[Axlemar]

The quality with the animation switch turned on seemed good to me. Its getting very close to being as good or better than rebuilder and CCE SP by themselves.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Axlemar
The quality with the animation switch turned on seemed good to me. Its getting very close to being as good or better than rebuilder and CCE SP by themselves.
Thank you...and I'm to release an improved version of it, I'm not yet totally satisfied about the results with animations.

[Carpo]

any chance you might tell us when this new version will be out SAPSTAR ?

have a few backups to do and would like to use newer version if it gives better results - or is it that new version will only give better results on animation and im good to go with 0.10 ?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Carpo
any chance you might tell us when this new version will be out SAPSTAR ?

have a few backups to do and would like to use newer version if it gives better results - or is it that new version will only give better results on animation and im good to go with 0.10 ? It will be improved for animations only, as I'm currently satisfied with the current quality of "regular" movies. The next version should be released soon...most probably tonight or on Monday.

[Carpo]

ok SAPSTAR - will test it out then on a few animation dvds i have :)

[gilligan2]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
To summarize, instead of having a range of values 8-127 like regular movies, for animations the range is now 8-55, I tried yesterday Princess Stories Vol. One, the usage of the animation flag definitely improved the final result ! I would recommend you to use it for high speed animations. Anyway, I'm still thinking about an improvement for animations, for regular movies, I'll leave it for a while as the results are really good for now.

Would this same logic then hold true for high speed action movies,like for instance, porn where all that "moving" is happening ?

g:)

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by gilligan2
Would this same logic then hold true for high speed action movies,like for instance, porn where all that "moving" is happening ?

g:)

:D Hmmm no .... The Animation flag must be reserved for smooth material as Animations, CG, .... Especially, with the last version I will release tonight. I ran some tests, and now, I'm satisfied...I'm running a last test, if it works...I release it just after it...should be close from 9-10 pm EST tonight.
[EDIT] I was wrong I did it before :)

[SAPSTAR]

I finally had time to release it...
Some new features, "AutoRebuild" and "WaitForPrepare", it means you choose your settings in DVDRB, you press Prepare, then you just have to start QMatOp, the rest will be automatic...Only restriction, keep DVD-RB open.
I also improved the animation part....It seems really good now in the tests I ran, especially with HC.
[EDIT] I forgot to mention I also introduced a RangeLimit parameter to allow the change of the upper limit in the matrices. Currently, it's partially ignored in Animation mode.

[gilligan2]

OK,thanks.

Now here is my other question. In the older versions it would go through a routine in the command prompt box saying all the 'Perceptual Error" and show the matrices,etc. Now when i do the auto,it just shows like the pic.Is this normal ? It shows QMATOP using 100% CPU but not avs2avi or dctune never getting called.Even when i set the Auto's at 0 or remove them form the ini it still just gives me this Command Prompt Box now and hangs

Thanks.

Tom

EDIT-Pic not showing up. Give me a minute. LOL

Click on link for pic-Thanks-

http://www.dvderotica.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=318&stc=1

[SAPSTAR]

@gilligan2

I can't access you pics, I have no account on dvderotica, anyway, did you create a shortcut to start QMatOp ??? If yes, you have to specify its directory as a work directory if you don't understand try to click directly on it without using a shortcut.....

[gilligan2]

OK,i'll give it a try tomorrow when i have some more time.I did create a shortcut but i created one before also on 10b and it worked fine but now it won't work even when i remove all references to DVDRBInterface and DVDRBEncode in the .ini file.I can't get it to work just normally with 11b. I get the same hanging. I'll try to cut down the size on the pic and post it again. Even when i try it directly without the shortcut,same trouble. I got 10b to work fine so i don't think i'm doing anything wrong.

Thanks,

g:)

[Carpo]

yay! im not the only perv out there :D

[Carpo]

Originally posted by gilligan2
Would this same logic then hold true for high speed action movies,like for instance, porn where all that "moving" is happening ?

g:)


havent you hear of safe posting - start waring a rubber ;D

[gilligan2]

One other thing i noticed is that it never looks for the default work folder either. It just hangs and it used to give me all kinds of errors if i didn't change the like in the .ini file that says "workdir=H:\DVDTemp\D2VAVS". It never seems to get that far,even with both the others set on 0 like this:

workdir=H:\DVDTemp\D2VAVS
tolerance=2
framesplitperiod=15
AutoEncode=1
AutoRebuild=1
Animation=0
RangeLimit=127

or this

workdir=H:\DVDTemp\D2VAVS
tolerance=2
framesplitperiod=15
AutoEncode=0
AutoRebuild=0
Animation=0
RangeLimit=255

It just hangs like this no matter where i put it .If i put it in the DVD Rebuilder folder it still just hangs. Am i doing something wrong ? Any one else have 11b working and can give me some step by steps on how they did it differently than 10b which works fine for me ?

Execing cmd.exe /C .\DVDRBInterface.exe WAITPREPARE C:\Documents and Settings\Administrator\My Documents\QMatOp11b\QMatOp\.\WAITDVDRB

I get this message with either 0 or 1 in the auto encode and auto rebuild lines.


thanks,

g:)

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by gilligan2

...
Execing cmd.exe /C .\DVDRBInterface.exe WAITPREPARE C:\Documents and Settings\Administrator\My Documents\QMatOp11b\QMatOp\.\WAITDVDRB
...
g:)

I know what is the problem now, the spaces in the QMatOp directory name, I forgot that some people may use this kind of directory name...I will correct this stupid error, just try to install it in a "regular" directory, like C:\QMatOp .......it will work.
This part can't be deactivated, it waits for Prepare to end before starting.....

[gilligan2]

OK,thank you SAPSTAR !
I will try it out now and see.

g:)

EDIT-It worked so thanks very much and keep up the nice work.

g;)

[SAPSTAR]

Well.. except the small bug in the WaitForPrepare function, it seems that QMatOp is now rather stable....

Do you have now suggestions ??? any idea of improvements ??? any bad quality detected in some special cases ?

[Axlemar]

I am not sure if the changes made to the animation setting has made things better or worse, anyone else notice a difference?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Axlemar
I am not sure if the changes made to the animation setting has made things better or worse, anyone else notice a difference?
I may be biased ;) but in the last encoding I did the animations copies were perfect...I mean identical to the original ?! Not for you ?

[hutch1711]

Just finished backing up a 2 disc set of Pride and Prejudice.
I'm absolutely astounded by the picture quality on my 50 inch Sony.
QMatOp is a wonderful tool and I urge everyone to give it a try.
Sapstar I don't know what you can do for an encore.
Job well done!

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by hutch1711
Just finished backing up a 2 disc set of Pride and Prejudice.
I'm absolutely astounded by the picture quality on my 50 inch Sony.
QMatOp is a wonderful tool and I urge everyone to give it a try.
Sapstar I don't know what you can do for an encore.
Job well done!
:cool: Thank you !!! I'm to release a new version with a function to auto adjust the Quality Prec for each cell, of course, it's useful only with CCE.....

[genericuser]

I am getting ready to try version .11. I have downloaded it and installed it. I am not doing cartoons. I am wondering a couple of things:

Do I have to mess with the matrix setting used in dvd-rb itself? I just have it set to the default matrix.

I am using cce 2.7 and I am planning on turing on the QATMAT option in cce too. I think people in this thread have said that was ok as well.

If I read the thread correctly, I just have to set up my .ini file to point to the dvd folder that gets created, set the sample rate and precision and such.

I think that using .11 I "prepare" in dvd-rb and everything flows from that. Is that correct thinking?

Thanks!

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by genericuser
I am getting ready to try version .11. I have downloaded it and installed it. I am not doing cartoons. I am wondering a couple of things:

Do I have to mess with the matrix setting used in dvd-rb itself? I just have it set to the default matrix.

I am using cce 2.7 and I am planning on turing on the QATMAT option in cce too. I think people in this thread have said that was ok as well.

If I read the thread correctly, I just have to set up my .ini file to point to the dvd folder that gets created, set the sample rate and precision and such.

I think that using .11 I "prepare" in dvd-rb and everything flows from that. Is that correct thinking?

Thanks!

Adapt the QMapOp.ini file to your DVD RB work directory, activate or deactivate what you wish(Splitperiod, tolerance, ...), then open DVD-RB without One-Click mode (in the next release I`ll check that), deselect/select all your stuff. You can choose any setting you wish in DVD-RB. Then click Prepare, start QMatOp....and that`s it.

I think you fully understood what to do.

[Axlemar]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
:cool: Thank you !!! I'm to release a new version with a function to auto adjust the Quality Prec for each cell, of course, it's useful only with CCE.....

Auto prec? Sounds like interesting stuff. Well, I have compared the different versions for a while and it does seems like the newest one is the best so far. Please continue to add or use any features that you think will improve the quality (even though it seems good now). Thanks.

[Carpo]

prob a stupid question but - will this work with MS java - i have a pc here that i use for compiling sources and it has C++ 6.0 on it which installs ms java machine

also any updates on new version of qmatop ? :)

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Carpo
prob a stupid question but - will this work with MS java - i have a pc here that i use for compiling sources and it has C++ 6.0 on it which installs ms java machine

also any updates on new version of qmatop ? :)
About MS Java....well, Frankly, I have no idea ! About, the next version with auto Qprec + auto VbrBias, I should release it tonight, if my own test is successful, and if I receive a feedback from FishMan0919 who tested it on Bandits.

[SAPSTAR]

Read carefully the RTF file, as three new parameters were introduced :
QualityPrecAuto
CCESP26X
VbrBiasAuto

CCESP26X must only be activated if you are using CCE SP 2.6x, those parameters are useless if you are not using CCE.
Let me know the results...I really need some feedbacks in order to improve QMatOp if needed.

[Hostile_Monk]

SAPSTAR:

I'd like to personally thank you for the work you've done. I've been following this project for a few days now; I've used v.11 on a lot of my movies with simply amazing results. Auto quality prec and vbr_bias sounds awesome, I can't wait to try it out! Is there any specific way you'd like me to report my results, other then viewing with my naked eye and posting if it's significantly better? I know one dvd9 that has given me some trouble, Pulp Fiction, I can't get it to emulate the original(quality wise) no matter what I try, this will be a good test! Once again, thanks for all the good work.

[Carpo]

would the vbrbias in qmatop conflict or cause issues with the same setting in dvd-rb?

atm in dvd-rb i have vbrbias as 0 - was told this gives better results - and from the 20 films i have done i have never had any probs

if in doubt i can do a test encode - just it would save me time :)

[Fishman0919]

QMatOp will change your setting of VBR Bias and Quality Prec no matter what you have them set to in DVD-RB. It will Optimize them for each cell.

[Carpo]

will have to do a few test encodes to see if it helps - although the prog to date has helped so i cant see it making things worse :P

[SAPSTAR]

@Hostile_Monk : Thank you for the support ! :D And please let me know about the result of your test with Pulp Fiction, I would be interested to know.

@Carpo : Fishman0919 is right (as usual ;) )....whatever your settings are in DVD-RB, they will be changed, if you activated the the function in QMatOp of course....FYI : 0 as Vbr Bias is the settings of all other encoders (HC, ...). So if you really want to use the full power of CCE, just play with Vbr Bias :). By the way I heard that hank315 was to implement the equivalent in HC. Anyway, thank you for your support and let me know your results, I'm really interested in them, as you are used to another kind of value.....
@FishMan0919 : Thank you for all the testings you did ... and the good feedbacks.

[raddygast]

So for regular NTSC movies, what split is recommended? 15? or 12?

I don't know if my stuff is interlaced or not -- but it's just regular studio movies. I assume non-interlaced?

[hutch1711]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
Rule of thumb : FrameRate / 2 is a good ratio
=> PAL 12 should be good
=> NTSC 15 or 12 depending on interlaced or non interlaced DVD.

This should help.

[raddygast]

Yeah, I had read that already. Was just looking for someone to tell me whether to use 15 or not, since QMatOP defaults to 2/12 anyway.

Hey, how long is it taking you guys? I'm running QMatOP right now with 2/12 settings, and it seems to be only about 25% of the way into disc 1 of Fellowship of the Ring extended edition.

It's been running an hour now. With settings of 2% tolerance, 12 split, should it really be taking like 4 hours on something under 1h30m of video?

My computer isn't crazy fast, but it's not garbage either. It's a Pentium 4 2.4 GHz. Am I doing something wrong, or is this QMatOP only for the totally obsessive? It looks like it's going to take as long as or even longer than the encode itself!

[Fishman0919]

If you are doing a Movie (something that has 23.976 fps).... 12 should work great...if you are doing a season disc (some kind of TV show (29.97 fps or something like that))) 15 would be better.


Edit: I did Lord of the Rings - The Two Towers with 12fs ans 2%t and it took about 1 hour on my AMD64 3800+ OT to about 4000+

[raddygast]

Ok cool. So 12 for non-interlaced (movies) and 15 for interlaced (TV), right? Or maybe I got that backwards regarding the interlaced status.

By the way -- it's not supposed to take this long with 2-12, is it? I'm thinking it's gonna take over 2 hours to complete the run for Fellowship disc 1. At this rate I'm gonna have to think of QMatOP as something that I only run on really really special sources.

Also, a suggestion for SAPSTAR:

For future releases, I wonder if you can build in some integration with DVD-RB's ini file so that QMatOP can be used in batch mode. That may not be too easy to do, though.

The next best thing would be for QMatOP to have its own "batch" protocol. But the first step there is to be able to define multiple working dirs. I use DVD-RB in batch mode so my working-dir is different for each project. Currently the way I do things is I set up each project and run a prepare on it, then tweak settings in RBOpt or whatever. When all the projects have been prepared, I simply add each project file to a batch, and then run the batch from inside DVD-RB. That encodes and rebuilds each DVD before moving onto the next. It works great.

At the moment I see no way to work that in with QMatOP, though. And especially because it seems to take an eternity to run, automation is really advantageous. You made a great first step with the AutoEncode and AutoRebuild options, but I'm wondering if you can think of a way to add batches too.

The way RB does it, I believe, is simply through project files. Each project file seems to reset the rebuilder.ini. Maybe there's a way that QMatOP could poll that file?

But I don't see a way to build QMatOP into RB's batches; that would require DVD-RB to have an option to call QMatOP externally.

So the best thing I can think of is to abandon DVD-RB batch mode altogether. Instead, run prepare on each and every movie in DVD-RB, setting up each movie's working-dir. Then have some kind of working-dir list in QmatOP.ini, but with the autoencode and autorebuild options on. Then after each optimize, it would trigger RB to encode, then rebuild, and after that was done it would move onto the next film and start the optimize.

Still, I think RB might need its own project files, which is a bit of a nuisance I guess.

[Fishman0919]

Ok cool. So 12 for non-interlaced (movies) and 15 for interlaced (TV), right? Or maybe I got that backwards regarding the interlaced status.

Yes ;)

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by raddygast
Ok cool. So 12 for non-interlaced (movies) and 15 for interlaced (TV), right? Or maybe I got that backwards regarding the interlaced status...

The rule of thumb is FrameRate/2...So 12 will work in any case (PAL, NTSC, interlaced, non-interlaced) but it's not fully time-optimized...


By the way -- it's not supposed to take this long with 2-12, is it? I'm thinking it's gonna take over 2 hours to complete the run for Fellowship disc 1. At this rate I'm gonna have to think of QMatOP as something that I only run on really really special sources.


It can be long, on my Athlon XP 2600, it can run for 2 hours on regular movies....but if you want the best quality on highly compressed movies, the time is not really important, is it ?


The next best thing would be for QMatOP to have its own "batch" protocol. But the first step there is to be able to define multiple working dirs.

I'll think about it....There may be a way, my only issue is I don't know how to locate DVD-RB, maybe another parameter ?

[raddygast]

If you say framerate/2, then why does interlace vs. non-interlaced play a role? I thought NTSC was always 30 fps. Maybe that's just TV sources. I think I read somewhere about film being 24.

About locating RB, yeah.... just use another parameter. But the problem is that RB isn't going to call QMatOP, so maybe QMatOP needs to be running the show. Is there a way you can get QMatOP to force DVD-RB to load another project? I'm wondering how you get it to do the encode and rebuild in the first place.

About the time, yeah -- I guess it's not too important as long as I can automate things. But I was thinking about running QMatOP as part of the preparation work, and for that it takes too long, unless I want to encode films over several computer sit-down sessions. :)

[Axlemar]

Does QMatOP take into account the different values used to calculate the bias and prec for different CCE versions? If I don't use the 2.6x switch will it work correctly for the newest 2.7?

[Fishman0919]

Yes, if you are using CCE SP 2.70 set the switch to CCESP26X=0

[Trevorontario]

Yes, if you are using CCE SP 2.70 set the switch to CCESP26X=0

If you are using CCE SP 2.50 should the switch be set to zero as well?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by raddygast
If you say framerate/2, then why does interlace vs. non-interlaced play a role? I thought NTSC was always 30 fps.
Wrong...Interlaced movies are 23.976fps.....

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Trevorontario
If you are using CCE SP 2.50 should the switch be set to zero as well? Yep !

[Carpo]

2 things

1 - is CG classed as animation - cus im going to do a backup of final fantasy and am not too sure

2 - when i have used dvd2avi to check if a source is progressive or interlaced it has given 29.97 (something like that) are you saying that its wrong and its really 23 - if so i will need to redo a film with qmatop

i know i have been asking many stupid questions but when re-encoding it takes time and its always best to ask questions than to waste time :P


v0.12 kicks ass btw - extra 3 options really do work well (did on the film i tested it on anyway :))

[raddygast]

So wouldn't it be better to use 2/15 for most movies (except interlaced ones), and 2/12 for interlaced sources (like most TV)?

It's just that I think Fishman gave the opposite recommendation.

[Carpo]

from what i understand for pal use 2 - 12

and for ntsc use 2 - 15

DGMPGDec - show most of the interlaced stuff i have used as 29.97 - so thats why im a bit confused atm

[onesoul]

Wrong...Interlaced movies are 23.976fps..... I wouldn't call it interlaced but progressive film instead which with use of pulldown flags, interleaves repeated fields to achieve 29,97fps.
DGMPGDec - show most of the interlaced stuff i have used as 29.97 - so thats why im a bit confused atm If it reports 29,97 interlaced then it is almost certain pure interlaced ntsc.

[SAPSTAR]

@carpo,raddygast : There is no bad choice....It's just a question of time passed to split, just use 2-12, an it will work in any case, when I say work I mean : 25/12 ~= 2, 23.976/12 ~= 2, 29.97/12 ~= 2.5. So the only diff is in the last case...you will have more info, the result will be more accurate.... It's just a question of time/quality. more time => more quality....and there is a good compromise at Framerate/2.....that's it.

[Carpo]

reguarding my 1st Q - do you have to use the animation flag on CG stuff like final fantasy ?

also i use 2 - 12 for pal and 2 /15 for ntsc - and have never had any probs so i'll stick with them :P

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Carpo
reguarding my 1st Q - do you have to use the animation flag on CG stuff like final fantasy ?

also i use 2 - 12 for pal and 2 /15 for ntsc - and have never had any probs so i'll stick with them :P

Well, about CG, frankly I'm not sure as I never really tested them....But if I were you, I would try with Animation flag first....as when I designed it, I also thought about the CG stuff, without being able to test it.....

[Fishman0919]

I did Titan AE (a pretty good looking CG)with the animation flag on and it looked great

[Carpo]

what does the ccd26x setting actually do? and is there a poss that you could put an option for cce 2.7 (when all the bugs are ironed out of course) :p

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Carpo
what does the ccd26x setting actually do? and is there a poss that you could put an option for cce 2.7 (when all the bugs are ironed out of course) :p
:sly: Hmmm you should read the RTF file coming with each release....In CCE SP 2.6x, the range for Quality Prec was 0-64 instead of 0-100 like the other CCE versions....That's why I had to add this parameter, you have to set it ONLY if you're using CCE SP 2.6x...any other CCE version will work with CCESP26X=0.

[Carpo]

still trying to work out if i should use (buy as well) cce 2.6 or cce 2.7 - (seems that version is hit or miss tho) :mad:

[alfixdvd]

I have Sun JRE 1.5.0_02 installed, and QmatOp 012, and Dvd_Rb 0.85 free.

I get the following error:


C:\DvdTools\QMatOp>QMatOP.exe
Execing cmd.exe /C .\DVDRBInterface.exe WAITPREPARE "C:\DvdTools\QMatOp\.\WAITDV
DRB"
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\Intra*.ppm
No se encuentra C:\DvdTools\QMatOp\frames\Intra*.ppm
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\temp.avs .\avs2avi.log -o l -c MSVC

AVS2AVI v1.31 (c) 2002,2003 Christophe PARIS (christophe.paris@free.fr)
Contributions by: int21h
Additional code (c) 2002,2003 David Leatherdale (dave@leatherdale.net)

Source:
* Filename: .\temp.avs
* Bit depth: 32
* FOURCC: none (RGB)
* Frames: 240
* Resolution: 564x80
Compressor:
* Name: Microsoft Video 1
* FOURCC: MSVC

Pass 1/1 frame 0/240, 0.00fps, ETA: , size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 88/240, 295.30fps, ETA: 00:00:00.514, size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 176/240, 294.31fps, ETA: 00:00:00.217, size: 0.00MB

* Frames: 0
* Key frames: 240
* Size: 0.000MB
Pass 1/1, compression time 00:00:00.897 (0.00fps).
Finished
Execing cmd.exe /C del .\temp.avs
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\Inter*.ppm
No se encuentra C:\DvdTools\QMatOp\frames\Inter*.ppm
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\temp.avs .\avs2avi.log -o l -c MSVC

AVS2AVI v1.31 (c) 2002,2003 Christophe PARIS (christophe.paris@free.fr)
Contributions by: int21h
Additional code (c) 2002,2003 David Leatherdale (dave@leatherdale.net)

Source:
* Filename: .\temp.avs
* Bit depth: 32
* FOURCC: none (RGB)
* Frames: 240
* Resolution: 564x80
Compressor:
* Name: Microsoft Video 1
* FOURCC: MSVC

Pass 1/1 frame 0/240, 0.00fps, ETA: , size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 88/240, 295.30fps, ETA: 00:00:00.514, size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 175/240, 290.97fps, ETA: 00:00:00.223, size: 0.00MB

* Frames: 0
* Key frames: 240
* Size: 0.000MB
Pass 1/1, compression time 00:00:00.897 (0.00fps).
Finished
Execing cmd.exe /C del .\temp.avs
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\intra\*.* > NUL
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\inter\*.* > NUL
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\pics\*.* > NUL
Execing cmd.exe /C .\Calculate.bat 34 23
Exception in thread "main" java.lang.ArithmeticException: / by zero
at QMatOp.AverageMatrix(QMatOp.java:529)
at QMatOp.ECLCalculate(QMatOp.java:289)
at QMatOp.main(QMatOp.java:61)

C:\DvdTools\QMatOp>

What's wrong ?

Where is calculate.bat ?

Please help me.

Best regards

[gilligan2]

Something is wrong before QmatOp.Look at your resolution,564x80. You have a problem in you avs script or somewhere else that may or may not be your main problem but it should read 720x480 or 720x576 or another DVD Standard size. Check your AVS script in notepad and see what is going on.

g:)

[SAPSTAR]

@gilligan2 : :thanks: I didn't see it....I was to read my code! there must be something wrong in the AVS....DVD-RB wouldn't have work either !

@alfixdvd : gilligan2 found your pb !!! Check your DVD-RB config...then use QMatOp, once everything is working correctly without QMatOp.

@all : I'm currently testing (with Fishman0919 as beta tester) a new function of Auto GOP Structure.....

[alfixdvd]

@sapstar and @gilligan2

Thanks.

When I edit an avs file, I see that I make a mistake: I missed to specify the path to Dgdecode.dll at DVD-RB config.

I'm sorry

Best regards.

[gilligan2]

No problem guys,glad to help !!

g:)

[TheSeeker]

Sorry if this has been answered already I, admittedly, did not read the whole thread. But what makes this tool different than, say, using CCE's AQM features? The fact that it changes QMat's on a per cell basis?

Im always looking for ways to tweak the quality of my encodes. And this looks like the next great add on for DVD RB.

[Carpo]

taken from the RTF file


I – Purpose
This software is designed to optimize the Quantization Matrix of each cell in the ECL file generated by DVD-Rebuilder. It's using dctune2.0 from the NASA, and also avs2avi from Christophe PARIS in order to sample each cell and determine what is the best matrix according to the current average and max bitrate.



III – Usage
The QMatOp.ini file must be edited according to the D2VAVS directory you are using.
Some other parameters exist:
tolerance: it controls the error tolerance for each frame size after compression (see IV – How it works). The default value is 5 (meaning 5%)
framesplitperiod: it controls the period used for splitting each cell into analysed frames. The default value is 30 (meaning every 30 seconds)
AutoEncode: it controls if you want QMatOp to start the encode after the processing.(You have to keep DVD-RB open)
AutoRebuild: it controls if you want QMatOp to start the rebuild after the processing.(You have to keep DVD-RB open)
Animation: it controls whether the movie to encode is an animation or not, this function is still being tested. I would recommend to test first without it. The default value is 0, meaning not activated.
RangeLimit: It allows you to change the range for the matrices, with CCE must be 127, which is also the default value; with HC you can use 255 at your own risks.
QualityPrecAuto: It activates or deactivates the auto Quality prec function, useless if you are not using CCE.
CCESP26X: To be activated, if QualityPrecAuto is activated and if you are using CCE SP 2.6x, otherwise must be deactivated.
VbrBiasAuto: It activates or deactivates the auto VBR Bias function, useless if you are not using CCE.
IV – How it works (Quick explanation)
The REBUILDER.ECL is read, for each cell the following is done:
- Extraction of N intra frames in PPM format (raw format) into the Frames directory
- Extraction of N inter frames in PPM format (raw format) into the Frames directory
- Calculation of the intra matrices of each frame, according to the max and average bitrate of the current cell. (Intra directory for the matrix file, Pics directory for the compressed frames)
- Calculation of the inter matrices of each frame. (Inter directory for the matrix file, Pics directory for the compressed frames)
- Processing of the average intra and inter matrices (it also takes into account the initially chosen matrix in the ECL file, if any)
- Normalization of the previous result. (Matrices are moved if not compliant to the MPEG2 standard) + not compliant to the CCE specs
Then the REBUILDER.ECL file updated according to the results. A copy of the ECL file is created REBUILDER.BAK

[jdobbs]

Originally posted by Carpo
still trying to work out if i should use (buy as well) cce 2.6 or cce 2.7 - (seems that version is hit or miss tho) :mad: I get random reports of problems with 2.70 (missing M2V files)... but honestly I've only had it fail once for me on an HBO whitescreen section. I then tweaked the calculation of the maximum bitrate a little and it hasn't reappeared. I've been using it on a lot of discs, too, because I want to see if I can make it happen... but it just keeps doing fine. It's possible there may be a questionable hack out there somewhere. I really can't explain it.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by TheSeeker
Sorry if this has been answered already I, admittedly, did not read the whole thread. But what makes this tool different than, say, using CCE's AQM features? The fact that it changes QMat's on a per cell basis?

Im always looking for ways to tweak the quality of my encodes. And this looks like the next great add on for DVD RB.
AQM is just an internal function from CCE which adjust a little bit the QMat from a pure compression point of view, but if the given matrix is not good for what your are encoding the result will be mixed. What QMatOp does, is calculating a VISUALLY optimum matrix for each cell. It's using DCTune from the NASA in order to keep the best visual quality and compresses as much possible. And it's working with other encoders than CCE SP 2.7 !!

@By the way, yesterday I did an experiment with HC, and I chose the range value 0-255 in QMatOp...the quality was really good !!! Better than CCE SP 2.70. (It was a an interlaced movie, with a very high compression level so low bitrate)

[Carpo]

Originally posted by jdobbs
I get random reports of problems with 2.70 (missing M2V files)... but honestly I've only had it fail once for me on an HBO whitescreen section. I then tweaked the calculation of the maximum bitrate a little and it hasn't reappeared. I've been using it on a lot of discs, too, because I want to see if I can make it happen... but it just keeps doing fine. It's possible there may be a questionable hack out there somewhere. I really can't explain it.

ye i had it once with cce 2.7 - so thats why i am umming and ahhing about which to get - still undecided yet :/

[raddygast]

Wait a second. I've never heard of a case where CCE was *worse* than any other encoder. This is really alarming. I thought the problems with CCE had to do with obscure bugs (occasionally) -- not with quality.

Isn't CCE the undisputed king of quality?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by raddygast
Wait a second. I've never heard of a case where CCE was *worse* than any other encoder. This is really alarming. I thought the problems with CCE had to do with obscure bugs (occasionally) -- not with quality.

Isn't CCE the undisputed king of quality?
Here you are wrong...on very low bitrates, it is known that CCE SP is not so good...interlaced materials are also a big deal for it, for example Procoder is better on Interlaced stuff than mant other encoders....Don't think that CCE is the ultimate encoder.....

[TheSeeker]

If you take into account a quality/speed ratio it IS the king. And for the most part, for most people CCE is usually the best bet. Great quality on the most sources, with great speed. Procoder is pretty much ONLY good for interlaced low bitrate sources, yet HC is starting to encroach on CCE quality territory for sure.

[Fishman0919]

I think CCE is a B+/A- encoder... it not the best at everthing but it real good all around (with some tweaking you can get it pretty good on most sources). For most people who want speed and quality you can't go wrong with CCE.... but to to say CCE the undisputed king of quality is really incorrect.

[raddygast]

Alright. So what is the undisputed king of quality? Is it this HC thing I've heard talk about? I thought that was free?

I was under the impression that CCE was what was used by the big-time studios for DVD authoring. Certainly the Pro version of CCE costs enough to suggest that it is a "big league" encoder.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by raddygast
Alright. So what is the undisputed king of quality? Is it this HC thing I've heard talk about? I thought that was free?

I was under the impression that CCE was what was used by the big-time studios for DVD authoring. Certainly the Pro version of CCE costs enough to suggest that it is a "big league" encoder.
In fact each encoder has its own strength...If you're looking for the best ratio speed/quality then CCE is your king ! But if speed is not a problem for you, but just the quality, then depending on the source you may choose a different encoder.
[EDIT] I think that HC is the king for the ratio Quality/price !!!
[EDIT] Maybe we should talk about this in another thread, as this one was originally for QMatOp...not for the eternal fight of CCE vs others. :thanks:

[raddygast]

Right you are. It's just that QMatOp, being what it is, has sparked all this discussion of "maximum" quality. Otherwise we'd all be using DVD Shrink or Nero Recode or some other transcoder. So it just seemed natural to start discussing whether CCE really is the best option, or if it's worth switching to HC. Using QMatOp already adds so much time to the process that I don't mind using a slower encoder.

I am really glad I found DVD-RB and all the other awesome tools I've used so far. Now the only killer feature I'm waiting for is for some way to run multiple projects with QMatOp. I don't even mind if a given film takes 8 hours total to process (prepare/qmatop/encode/rebuild) -- as long as it can do that unattended.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by raddygast
....I'm waiting for is for some way to run multiple projects with QMatOp. I don't even mind if a given film takes 8 hours total to process (prepare/qmatop/encode/rebuild) -- as long as it can do that unattended.
Be patient it may come :)...The next version will add a new feature of auto GOP (useful for CCE, useless for HC), and most probably a GUI. Then the version after will most probably allow you to run it in batch !

[hutch1711]

SAPSTAR, am I right to assume it really doesn't matter what matrix is used in the DVD-RB prepare stage as QMatOp will do it's own thing and workout the best matrix, regardless of which matrix was initially used?
Also, is there any way QMatOp might adapted to AVI material, or for that matter any other source material not using DVD-RB in the prepare stage, being coverted to DVD?

[Carpo]

yes - is the answer to the first question as i asked excatly the same thing :D

interesting point on your second question tho :P

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by hutch1711
SAPSTAR, am I right to assume it really doesn't matter what matrix is used in the DVD-RB prepare stage as QMatOp will do it's own thing and workout the best matrix, regardless of which matrix was initially used?
Also, is there any way QMatOp might adapted to AVI material, or for that matter any other source material not using DVD-RB in the prepare stage, being coverted to DVD?
For your first question, I say NO, explanation :
If no matrix is specified, then it will do everything by itself.
If a matrix is specified, then it will be taken in to account in the final average. Depending on the framesplitperiod you chose, its role will change....smaller is the framesplitperiod, smaller is the importance of this matrix.
Conclusion: You can specify a matrix in DVD-RB, if you want to give a small hint to QMatOp, otherwise you don't care.

About the AVI, well it could be adapted (I suppose Divx or Xvid)....but I may have to develop either a separate exe, either a special mode.

@carpo : you didn't exactly ask that, you asked me if it was working without choosing a matrix in DVD-RB. Anyway, with a framesplitperiod < 15, it doesn't really matter that you specify any matrix. :)

[hutch1711]

Thanks for the quick reply and I'm looking forward to your next version of QMatOp with auto GOP. This program is evolving so quickly you dare not blink :)

[Carpo]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
For your first question, I say NO, explanation :
If no matrix is specified, then it will do everything by itself.
If a matrix is specified, then it will be taken in to account in the final average. Depending on the framesplitperiod you chose, its role will change....smaller is the framesplitperiod, smaller is the importance of this matrix.
Conclusion: You can specify a matrix in DVD-RB, if you want to give a small hint to QMatOp, otherwise you don't care.

About the AVI, well it could be adapted (I suppose Divx or Xvid)....but I may have to develop either a separate exe, either a special mode.

@carpo : you didn't exactly ask that, you asked me if it was working without choosing a matrix in DVD-RB. Anyway, with a framesplitperiod < 15, it doesn't really matter that you specify any matrix. :)

well i asked about vbrbias in dvd-rb and what qmatop would do with it - thought same might have applies to matrices :o

also on a iff subject - it seems you cant use ms java - installed vs 6 earlier - which installs ms java - to test i remove suns version and told xp to use ms version of java and qmatop didnt like it :D

[Carpo]

think may have found a poss bug

a friend of mine ask if i could do a back up of one of the films his parents sent him from japan seeing as his pc is broken (dont ask what its called as i couldnt tell as its in japanese :P), no prob i thought - ran it thru dvd-rb and it looks to have made 65 segmants.

now when qmatop hits the 53rd segmant it just freezes sticks on

Pass 1/1 frame 12/20, 3.21fps, ETA: 00:00:02.496, size: 0.00MB - repeats this line continuously

yes i have pre processed which is why i say poss bug (and also could be issue my end - although this is the only film i have had issues with) - thing is tho if it does this many segmants on main movie - if i leave the rest in how many more will it make :/

i will try in the morning on un prorcessed film and let you know what happens

dvd-rb 0.90apro QMatOp 0.12b cce 2.67

[SAPSTAR]

@carpo: thank you for info about ms java...(not really surprised in fact :) ) - let me know about your pb. Are you able to play the AVS file from the concerned segment (with any video player... I mean)???

[Carpo]

yip i can play the avs files ok - did a radom check on a few of them - im checking now using unprocessed source and if worse comes to worst i will re-install as i have install a few things that i wouldnt norm install (vs6 sdk headers) and poss wondering if it could be the left overs of that causing it

will have a bit of a muck about with it and let you know

also any eta on v0.13 :cool:

well tried it on un processed and it still sticks at

Pass 1/1 frame 12/15, 0.00fps, ETA: 00:00:00.000, size: 0.00MB

on segmant V01005100001052.AVS - its only 1 sec long tho - dunno if that will have any impact on the issue, have also noticed that avs2avi.exe hits around 50% cpu useage and just sits there but runs fine up till segmant 52- also i will try a diff film see if it really is my pc or not

will see what you have to say b4 i re-install just in case ;)


right ran final fantasy thru dvd-rb and then ran qmatop no issues baring in mind there was only 47 segmants for it to look at - so its either the amount of segmants thats an issue or the fact that its only a second long

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Carpo
...right ran final fantasy thru dvd-rb and then ran qmatop no issues baring in mind there was only 47 segmants for it to look at - so its either the amount of segmants thats an issue or the fact that its only a second long
Amount of segments...nope ! I already handled this case in one of the very first version. About the one second long, I also managed that. I really don't see what it can be, because avs2avi is used in rather simple way, execution of an AVS script to sample the original one....there must be something wrong in the installation...could you try on another PC ?

[EDIT] Stupid question : do you have enough free space where is located QMatOp ? Did you reboot ? Did you try to reinstall Sun Java ?

[Carpo]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
Amount of segments...nope ! I already handled this case in one of the very first version. About the one second long, I also managed that. I really don't see what it can be, because avs2avi is used in rather simple way, execution of an AVS script to sample the original one....there must be something wrong in the installation...could you try on another PC ?

[EDIT] Stupid question : do you have enough free space where is located QMatOp ? Did you reboot ? Did you try to reinstall Sun Java ?

have about 150GB left on the drive where QMatOp sits

yes i uninstall Sun and MS Java and re-installed sun

im gussing its a source issue as i have done FF fine 4 times this morn

[hutch1711]

This may not be an error, but I thought I should report it anyway. I backed up a movie using HC, changing the QMatOp RangeLimit to 255. When I compared the matrix values computed in the Rebuilder ECL file, with those extracted from the M2V files, by a program called MatrixExtractor 1.10, any value over 127 in the intra-frame side is shown as follows 128=0 129=1 130=2 131=3 132=4 etc.

[hank315]

Just checked Matrix Extractor for values > 127.
For non-intra correct values are displayed, for intra it screws up if values > 127.

[hutch1711]

So intra values >127 are being coded correctly by QMatOp, and the bug is in Matrix Extractor?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by hutch1711
So intra values >127 are being coded correctly by QMatOp, and the bug is in Matrix Extractor?
...are coded correctly by HC !!!! QMatOp only passes matrices to HC...it's not the encoder !

[hutch1711]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
...are coded correctly by HC !!!! QMatOp only passes matrices to HC...it's not the encoder !
I knew that! My dummy :)

[Carpo]

ne news on a new ver ?

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by Carpo
ne news on a new ver ?
Well...the GUI is finished. But FishMan0919 found a bug on National Treasure....and I'm waiting for a test from him...The Auto-GOP feature is not yet fully tuned. It should be a question of one or two days before the next release.

[Carpo]

perfect timing that is.......should be a few days before my hdds defrag and i can start to backing up dvds again :D

[SAPSTAR]

First a special thanks to FishMan0919 who tested a lot of alpha version before finding a pb with National Treasure.

Changes in 0.13b :
- Added an Auto GOP feature - Still being tested and to be tweaked.
- Created a GUI for starting the whole process - Still to be improved
- Added a progress bar
- Improved the way smallest segments are managed. Should be faster now.

You start QMatOPGUI, then go !!! Everything will start automatically once the Prepare phase is finished. Don't panic if you can't see any window...QMatOp is in the background waiting for DVD-RB.

The AutoGOP function is still being tested...I will most probably tweak it in a near future.

[Carpo]

testingout the new autogop on a pr0n film - if it screws it up (no poun) no loss :P

seems this version is rather fast took about half the time to do the same film than when i used 0.12b :)

[Axlemar]

Originally posted by Carpo
testingout the new autogop on a pr0n film - if it screws it up (no poun) no loss :P

lol at least your honest. Anyway, I will be sure to use the new version in the next day or two. Thanks for the work on it.

[hutch1711]

Sapstar, I know you mentioned in this forum that the new auto GOP feature would not work with HC, but I notice it's not noted in the version history :)

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by hutch1711
Sapstar, I know you mentioned in this forum that the new auto GOP feature would not work with HC, but I notice it's not noted in the version history :)
You're right...too be more precise, HC has an auto GOP function which is already included and most probably better than the one from QMatOp...I think that HC is optimizing the GOP structure for every GOP, in my case I can only optimize for each segment...
So if you activated the QMatOP's AutoGOP, it will be ignored in HC but it won't bring any issue.

[artoor]

I have one question :) What will happen if I'll push "stop/pause" button in DVD-RB when it will be working along with QMatOp to resume encoding process later (or next day)?? Should I open "QMatOPGUI" before resuming again??

Sorry for (probably) weird question but I'm layman in this case. Nevertheless I'd like to try this - as many people say - great software and get to know more about QMatOp :)

Regards!

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by artoor
I have one question :) What will happen if I'll push "stop/pause" button in DVD-RB when it will be working along with QMatOp to resume encoding process later (or next day)?? Should I open "QMatOPGUI" before resuming again??

Sorry for (probably) weird question but I'm layman in this case. Nevertheless I'd like to try this - as many people say - great software and get to know more about QMatOp :)

Regards!
If you stop the encoding, just restart it later...but don't restart QMatOp again( The ECL file is already adjusted) ! The only issue you may have is with the AutoRebuild, not sure if it would work....

[artoor]

If you stop the encoding, just restart it later...but don't restart QMatOp again( The ECL file is already adjusted) !
Uhmmm... the ECL file is already adjusted so I can continue encoding process even after restarting my PC (but without opening QMatOp again as You've said). Have I understood You right?

The only issue you may have is with the AutoRebuild, not sure if it would work....
Let's assume worse option (sorry ;)). If it wouldn't work. Will be there a chance to backing up my DVD until the end?? (by hand instead of auto like just is in DVD-RB 3click mode) Can You tell me?? (I've never used QMatOp so forgive me my concern)

Thanks for Your answer :)

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by artoor
...Have I understood You right?...
yep !

.. If it wouldn't work. Will be there a chance to backing up my DVD until the end?? (by hand instead of auto like just is in DVD-RB 3click mode) Can You tell me?? (I've never used QMatOp so forgive me my concern)

You just have to manually press Rebuild in DVD-RB as if QMatOp was never used.

[artoor]

One more time - Thank You!! :)

[raddygast]

Well, it pains me to have to post this, but I've been using QMatOP for at least a week now, have encoded several films, including all six discs of the Lord of the Rings extended editions.

Unfortunately, I was not satisfied with some blockiness that I noticed in a few scenes. So I re-encoded one of the discs without QMatOp and viewed one or two scenes as a frame of reference for comparison (Two Towers Disc 2, at around 1:39:47, as well as some other scenes with Elvish subtitles).

The result was that using CCE encoder default looked far better than the QMAT optimized output. The QMat version was much blockier. This was confirmed by using the "Digital Zoom" feature of PowerDVD at 4x. The QMat version looks horrible zoomed in, but the Encoder Default version looks much much better.

The same was true for Elvish subtitles (in the video source, not a subtitle stream). There is a definite "halo" of blockiness or noise around the subtitles. It is most minimal in the original source (not re-encoded). The encoder default version is a bit more blocky, but acceptable. The QMAT version is the most blocky and messed up. Again, I also checked with zoom at 4x.

I understand the zoom algorithm could be faulty, but it was just confirming what I saw with my own eyes before zooming, so I tend to trust it.

Now I have no argument with QMatOP as a program -- I thought it was a fantastic idea and am glad for SAPSTAR's effort. Especially nice was the auto gop and auto quality prec/auto vbr bias. But if the results are going to look like this, I may as well just save my time.

Now I realize that maybe there are parts of the film that greatly benefit from QMatOp, where the Qmat-opped output will look better than the encoder default output. But I checked some more "action" type sequences and the default version always either looked better to my eyes, or the same.

Is this perhaps a case of my having a preference for "smoothness" vs. sharpness? Anyway, if anyone wants to check, the main test I used besides subtitles was the scene at 1:39:47, where Merry and Pippin are in the flooded spoils of Isengard, and the camera is slowly zooming in on them (before it goes to a full close-up on Pippin). Merry's face, in the distance, looks really blocky, and much better in the encoder default version.

Mind you I preprocessed the source and removed a bunch of audio tracks, and used MenuShrink to get the menus down to almost nothing. But the bitrate was quite ample, something like 4155 avg. I was very disappointed with how the QMat version looked.

NOTE: Both encodes were done with the EXACT same pre-processed source tree, so that can be eliminated as a variable. TargetSectors was set to the same thing as well in both RB projects.

Is this a case of actual practice disproving the theory (the theory being that QMatOp uses perceptual error algorithms to optimize the output in the best way possible, whereas the CCE default matrix is a compromise)?

I'm open to discussion. I'm not trying to trash this, just wanted to be a heads-up because at first I thought with all these rave reviews that there was NO way QMatOP didn't improve quality.

[Carpo]

do you have a lcd monitor ?

i have and sometimes films do look blocky - yet when i play them on standalone player and 42" tv they look fine

few ppl i know say that lcds screens are not as forgiving as norm tvs

just my 2 pennys worth :)

[raddygast]

No, I watch DVD's on a 19" CRT. It's true that on a non-HD TV, from far away, the blockiness is probably not visible, but the issue is that it's there to begin with. Just because I may not be able to *see* a loss of quality from a certain viewing configuration doesn't mean it's irrelevant. It's sort of the principle of the whole business that has my panties in a twist.

[onesoul]

I'm sorry but I have to agree with raddygast. Maybe the problem is dctune itself.

[archaeo]

Well I must say that I am glad to be reading some feedback in this thread like raddygast's that discuss actual quality results obtained with QmatOP. Somebody doing some actual side by side comparisons. I haven't had the time to beta test the program myself, but have been looking through this thread for some feedback that indicates the results are worth the extra processing time. In theory it sounds like an awesome program, and I'm grateful for SAPSTAR's work on this, but up to this point there hasn't been much dialogue on this issue.

[raddygast]

Yeah, I mainly posted my bit in the hopes that someone who swears by QMatOp (Fishman maybe) can give some examples of its performance. Maybe if we all had the same frame of reference, say a common movie with a particularly difficult scene to encode.

I just went by the assumption that QMatOp knows what it's doing. I seriously doubt it has to do with algorithm bugginess, but maybe there's something flawed in the approach (not the algorithm). Comparing perceptual error for still frames seemed at first like a great idea, but maybe that's not the best way? I have no idea what other technique would be better though.

In theory, wouldn't it be possible to get a series of say 30 frames that differed (perceptually) minimally from the source, but when played together over the course of a second might give the impression of "blockiness" or "fuzzy noise" ?

Seriously, I have no clue about the theory behind matrices and so forth, so I don't know how much of this makes sense. All I can remark on is the quality that I noted. I don't want to rain on this parade AT ALL -- just want to be pointed in the right direction. Maybe those scenes bugged me, but there may be a bunch of other scenes in the film where QMATOP really shined.

Still, for noww I won't be using it until further investigation.

[Axlemar]

I didn't see anyone state what encoder version they were using or what setting they used. I thought the quality was good with 1%/5 seconds and CCE 2.70. Try more aggressive settings and see if it is still worse.

[borgraf]

First of all, kudos to SAPSTAR for working on this very cool tool :)

Originally posted by Axlemar
1%/5 seconds and CCE 2.70. I used exactly that on two test sources and compared them to runs with QLB, which won both times.

The problem with my QMatOp runs can be decribed as a lack of detail. One was Alexander R2, ~3060 bps with partly stripped menu. One scene in the beginning had a harbor looking like a still, another scene about 1h 22m in has a wide shot with little movement of Alexander in a room with all his commanders; when he turns his head it's "jerky" and looks pretty bad. The QLB run was fine on both these examples and more. I'll be testing some more in the near future. Maybe the problem is only with lower bitrates?

I agree with Carpo that LCD screens are not as forgiving. So a film will look "better" on the TV, but the LCD is also great for comparing runs and finding "flaws" :)

Keep up the good work coders and testers!

[SAPSTAR]

@raddygast : What were your settings in QMatOp ???? QMatOp was highly tested and optimized with 2% / 10 fps. I'm not sure if by going under the 10 fps the formulas are acting well.

You said you tested the material on a 19" CRT ? It's a REALLY small screen, I wonder how you could notice anything ?!?! Myself I'm using a 120" screen with an Infocus projector...and I didn't have the kind of issue you talking about ?!?! Pay attention not to activate the ANIMATION mode. About the AutoGOP, I would say...avoid it for now, it's not really stable.

@borgraf : You're saying that QLB was better than CCE SP 2.70 (with or without QMatOP) ?!?! [EDIT] About low bitrates, if you are using HC + QMatOp, you'll have VERY good results at very low bitrates, even with Half-D1.

@all : I think you misunderstand what QMatOp really does, it optimizes the Quantization Matrices in the REBUILDER.ECL, to really compare what it does you have to keep the same encoder in each test !!!! I mean, process a movie with CCE SP alone, then QMatOP + CCE SP, otherwise you're comparing apples with pears. By the way, you can use QMatOP with any encoder in DVD-RB : HC, QLB, CCE SP, it doesn't matter.....That's why I really don't understand your test : (CCE SP 2.70 + QMatOP) vs QLB ?!?!
Try (QLB + QMatOp) vs QLB or (CCE SP + QMatOP) vs CCE SP or (HC + QMatOp) vs HC........

[Fishman0919]

@ All

If you are view your movies mostly on your computer... QMatOp might not be for you and you might have better viewing with out it. Some of the movies I have tested didn't look as good as I hoped on my computer, but viewing them on my 65" Pioneer Elite HDTV... 9 out of 10 movies looked as good if not better (to me). I had a professional technician come to my home and calibrate my tv to as close to NTSC standard as possible and I am view my movie in an optimal environnement(dark with minimal light).

Some people like a smooth more flat picture... Qmatop might not be for you scene it will give you a sharp, detailed picture... maybe to sharp sometimes. Lets remember its a beta and every movie might not look great. I have tested a lot of movies for SAPSTAR and a few looked pretty bad.. but after some tweaking he got them to look better.

If QMatOp doesn't work for you, then it doesn't work for you, you don't have to use it... it's an add-on to a great program to help people who want a better quality encoding... but if it doesn't work it doesn't work... it adds time to the encoding process that you don't need and you can enjoy your movie sooner.

If you like, please comment on ways to help improve the results and quality by posting what movies and settings and/or matrices you used. Please don't make insults like some person who I won't mention.

Like I said it's a program to help you with the quality of you encoding but if it doesn't work for you, sorry.... but if it does...Enjoy.

[raddygast]

2%/12 was what I used. Anyway, it's whatever setting is the default in QMATOP.ini. I didn't change it (though I thought about doing so). Also, I used the same encoder consistently, on the same sources. And Animation was not selected.

19" is a small screen, but I should have clarified it was a computer monitor, not a TV. As such I sit much closer to it. As Fishman has now allowed, qmatop results may not look so great on a computer screen, maybe even worse than default CCE (as is my experience). He contends that it can look better than default on an actual TV screen viewed from a proper distance. I can't argue with this because I have no means to try it.

I can groove with the option than qmatop results may be "sharper", i.e. perhaps a little too sharp sometimes. Certainly up close to a computer monitor, I prefer smoothness. But perhaps on one of those insanely expensive screens like you have, I'd notice the difference and nod in favour of QMATOP.

Anyway, like I said I'm not here to bash. I love the idea of stuff being figured out for me automatically. But I guess for my current purposes and setup, default is better (for now).

Finally -- what do you guys think about DVD-RB's "CCEAQM=1" option you can insert in rebuilder.ini? Apparently it tells CCE to adjust qmats automatically and dynamically within each cell. What principle does it work on?

[Fishman0919]

@ raddygast,
Sorry my point was not pointed at you as a source of insults and sorry if you thought so...

CCEAQM=1 or Adaptive Q-matrix Switching is, in short, a way that CCE SP can automatically adjusts and creates a new matrix for each GOP if the lowest quantization scale cannot be raise to the minimum bitrate under a single quantization matrix. I find that having this turned on help on some movie with qmatop, adjusting the matrix if qmatop has not got it just right. It will help with any martix, CCE Standard, MPEG Standard, QLB... some say that they don't like it but it can only help... when the encoder needs help on a hard to encode GOP, Adaptive Q-matrix Switching adjust the matrix for better quality and only then.

I really don't see why it should be turn off... but that my opinion. :D

[Axlemar]

But if you turn Adaptive Q-matrix Switching on with the default matrix and turn the animation on in qmatop wouldn't all the matrices calculated by qmatop be overwritten? Also, wouldn't Adaptive Q-matrix Switching kind of defeat some of the purpose of using qmatop since it is supposed to be kind of similar to it? If not, then the only reason people shouldn't use Adaptive Q-matrix Switching is because some players will give odd results or skip like crazy.

[Carpo]

Originally posted by raddygast
2%/12 was what I used. Anyway, it's whatever setting is the default in QMATOP.ini. I didn't change it (though I thought about doing so). Also, I used the same encoder consistently, on the same sources. And Animation was not selected.




did you use that for all films ? ntsc and pal - seeing as i dont know what format you have im only guessing here but if you used 2/12 on ntsc that might be a reason for your poor results

as has been posted before norm its 2/12 for pal and 2/15 for ntsc


if you have used the right settings above ignore my post :D

[raddygast]

They were NTSC, but SAPSTAR previously posted that half the framerate is a good compromise between speed and quality. He said that using 2/12 was foolproof in that it was half of PAL and interlaced TV sources, and it was perhaps a bit slow with NTSC 29.97 fps films but certainly not poor quality -- if anything, better quality than running 2/15.

But maybe I misinterpreted him.

[Carpo]

what i always do is check the vobs using dgmpgdec130 if it says pal 25fps - i use 2/12 if it says 29.97 - which it does 9/10 i use 2/15

and i never seem to have any probs - although i have just experienced my first oversized disc but dunno if thats cus of qmatop or HC encoder which i have been using for last few films - so have to get shrink out to squash it down :/

[borgraf]

Wow.. tough crowd in here :)

1) By QLB I mean the Quenc Lower Bitrate matrix supplied with DVD-RB, and that I used it with CCE 2.70. So I was indeed comparing apples to apples.

2) I never use my monitor to view entire films

I thought I was fairly clear, but I guess i'll have to be more specific in the future. Atleast in this thread :)

[Carpo]

where in the rebuilder ini would CCEAQM=1 go ?

options or cceoptions ?

[archaeo]

<options>

[SAPSTAR]

@raddygast: About the results on a computer monitor, I'm not surprised as this kind screen is not managing the video as a reg. screen. I know by experience, that some well known matrices give artifacts on Computer screens, but those artifacts disappear on a a regular screen.....
Everything is based on the perceptual view of pictures, but I suspect that the perceptual view is not the same on a computer screen. So QMatOP must not be for you if you're watching DVDs on your computer.
(For example, with interlaced movies it's horrible to watch them on computer screen, you watch them on a TV.....and taaadaa perfect.)

@borgraf: I didn't understand that you used the QLB matrix on the same encoder. I suggest you to try : 1%/10fps instead of 5fps....then let me know your results. I'm really surprised because up to now I had really good results with almost all movies I did.

@all : About the AutoQMat in CCE SP, it can cause pb in some DVD players because the matrix is not changed at each cell, but at each GOP !!! And I think, that's it's only adjusting it a little bit so if the passed matrix is already good, it will be able to adjust it more accuratly.

@all : Something else, I'm ready to try to tweak QMatOp, if you can provide more info on the pb....QMatOp settings, movie, symptom, ....

[EDIT] I may for example, add parameters to change your screen config. Some parameters in the whole algo are depending on "physical" parameters....(dpi, distance from the screen...)

[Fishman0919]

@ Axlemar

No, only when CCE SP can't raise to the minimum bitrate under a single quantization matrix... that may happen for 50 GOP's in a row, it may happen for the whole movie or it may not happen at all. The closer the matrix is to being correct for the GOP being encoded the less CCE SP will have to adjust the matrix with Adaptive Q-matrix Switching if at all.

I have a couple of DVD Player including the 2nd DVD Player Pioneer made (DV-05), one of the pickyest DVD Player there is... no problems with qmatop.

[hutch1711]

Sapstar, I just want to say I think this is a great tool!
I've had excellent results backing up region 1 material using 2% tolerance and a framesplitperiod of 15. I've had some issues with picture quality from contouring noise in flat wide areas (looks like a speading puddle of water), since QualityPrecAuto and VbrBiasAuto were added, but not on all sources. Switching these features off in the .ini file, and using only the tolerance and framesplitperiod features, usually corrects the problem. One of the nicest aspects of this tool is the ability to switch on and off certain properties and adjust others.

[raddygast]

that puddle of water effect sounds like what I was getting on the within-video-source subtitles. The original source had them, faintly, but QmatOp made them much more noticeable.

[Axlemar]

(edited) nevermind

[borgraf]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
I suggest you to try : 1%/10fps instead of 5fps....then let me know your results.During the week i've been running 9 different encodes of a PAL project, 3h12m at 2950 bps "typical". It gives me a chance to test and compare both QMatOp and HC to my usual routine with CCE or ProCoder. I'll do some more comparing over the weekend, but what i've seen so far the combo of CCE 2.70 4pass+QMATOP (with QualityPrecAuto=0, VbrBiasAuto=0 and 1%/10fps) finished in last place. Second from the bottom is the same setup except for QualityPrecAuto=1, VbrBiasAuto=1. I did not use GOPAuto or Animation.

Compared to the other encodes, the QMatOp runs have more "artifacts" throughout and one segment in particular stands out as looking fairly bad. It's encoded at vbr_brate_avg=2103 and QMatOp produced this matrix:

qmat=
8 11 11 11 17 64 123 123
10 11 11 13 17 42 123 124
11 12 18 24 37 123 124 124
13 14 28 123 123 124 124 125
16 26 123 123 124 124 125 125
105 123 123 124 124 125 125 126
123 123 124 124 125 125 126 126
123 124 124 125 125 126 126 127
21 120 121 121 122 122 123 123
120 121 121 122 122 123 123 124
121 121 122 122 123 123 124 124
121 122 122 123 123 124 124 125
122 122 123 123 124 124 125 125
122 123 123 124 124 125 125 126
123 123 124 124 125 125 126 126
123 124 124 125 125 126 126 127

The first run used DVD-RB defaults and the second run QMatOp produced these values:

quality_prec=21
vbr_bias=10

I'll compare some more over the weekend, maybe I can come up with something more useful :)

[SAPSTAR]

@borgraf
What is the movie ???
Did you try HC + QMatOP with a 255 limit + AutoVBR??
On low bitrates that's the combination I found more efficient....

Oh..something else REALLY important on what kind of screen did you compare the results ?
I ask that because some matrices can show artifacts on a computer screen and are perfect for TV screens......I may have to introduce a parameter for that, it's depending on the screen DPI.

[borgraf]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
@borgraf
What is the movie ???It's a project of the Extended Edition of Lord of the Rings - Fellowship of the Ring, 2 discs joined to 1.

Did you try HC + QMatOP with a 255 limit + AutoVBR??
On low bitrates that's the combination I found more efficient....What's AutoVBR? I have a run with HC at BEST and QMatOp with RangeLimit=255. Here's the matrix for the same segment as in my above post:

qmat=
8 11 11 12 17 65 180 181
10 11 11 13 17 42 180 181
11 12 18 24 37 180 181 182
13 14 29 167 181 182 183 185
15 28 166 181 183 184 186 188
105 179 180 182 184 187 191 194
130 180 181 183 186 191 196 202
181 181 182 185 188 194 202 211
21 136 136 136 137 138 139 141
136 136 136 136 137 138 139 142
136 136 137 137 138 139 141 143
136 136 137 139 141 142 145 147
137 137 138 141 144 147 150 154
138 138 139 142 147 152 158 164
139 139 141 145 150 158 167 176
141 142 143 147 154 164 176 192

This also have the "artifacts" that only the QMatOp processed tests have. I would describe it as funny edges and things shifting in and out of focus. My clean runs with CCE 4 pass, HC at BEST and ProCoder 2 at Mastering Quality shows none of these.


Oh..something else REALLY important on what kind of screen did you compare the results ?
I ask that because some matrices can show artifacts on a computer screen and are perfect for TV screens......I may have to introduce a parameter for that, it's depending on the screen DPI. I'm using both monitors: 17" TFT and 19" CRT, but mostly a high-end 32" CRT TV. I can see the same things on the monitors as on the TV, of course the TV is a bit more forgiving. In my experience that is always the case, and QMatOp makes no exception.

[SAPSTAR]

@borgraf : By looking at the inter matrix,....I can tell that QMat had to compress at the maximum this part....it indicates a very low bitrate for highspeed scenes. How long is the movie ???

@all : Would you be interested if I introduce 2 new parameters : Screen Size + Screen Quality level ???? It may solve certain kind of visual issues for some people......

[Carpo]

i would say yes but would also say to fix autogop first :)

[jdobbs]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
@borgraf : By looking at the inter matrix,....I can tell that QMat had to compress at the maximum this part....it indicates a very low bitrate for highspeed scenes. How long is the movie ???

@all : Would you be interested if I introduce 2 new parameters : Screen Size + Screen Quality level ???? It may solve certain kind of visual issues for some people...... Making the output to a DVD tailored to a specific screen type? That doesn't sound like a very good idea...

[borgraf]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
@borgraf : By looking at the inter matrix,....I can tell that QMat had to compress at the maximum this part....it indicates a very low bitrate for highspeed scenes. How long is the movie ??? The answers to both your questions about bitrate and film length are in my previous posts. And my encodes with CCE, HC and ProCoder without QMatOp used the same bitrate and came out just fine.
Originally posted by jdobbs
Making the output to a DVD tailored to a specific screen type? That doesn't sound like a very good idea...
amen to that :)

[Carpo]

thats why they are (hopefully) selectable options ;)

use them at your own peril :D

[Carpo]

range limit atm is set to 127 (default) but according to the mpeg standard how far above that could you actually go ?

[Fishman0919]

Originally posted by Carpo
range limit atm is set to 127 (default) but according to the mpeg standard how far above that could you actually go ?

Well 127 is the default because CCE SP only supports that.... MPEG Standard is 255... HC Encoder will do that.... not sure about QuEnc

[Carpo]

even new cce ? if so stupid cce ;D

[Fishman0919]

Originally posted by Carpo
even new cce ? if so stupid cce ;D

From the CCE SP 2.70 user guide

Create quantization matrices
On Quantize matrices setting window, you will see two matrices, one
for Intra block and another for Non-intra block. You can set these
matrices separately. To modify a matrix, type the value directly on
the matrix.

 Allowable range of the value is : 1 to 127 (3).
 (1, 1) element in intra block must be 8 under MPEG standard.
And the buttons below a matrix will help you to modify the value.
• button copies (i, j) element and put them in (j, i) when i < j.
• button copies (i, j) element and put them in (j, i) when i > j.
• Transpose button interchanges rows and columns in a matrix.
It means the interchange of (i, j) and (j, i) elements.

(3) Cinema Craft Encoder SP limits the value to 127 in spite of MPEG standard
255.

yes, very stupid cce :angry:

[Carpo]

bummer :angry:

guess i give HC a go and set it as 255 :)

[SAPSTAR]

@all : I'm not releasing anything new because I'm currently working on an encoder. And because QMatOp seems to be rather stable, I'll add new functionalities once I'll find time to do it ! :)

[alfixdvd]

Please help me

When I run Qmatop I get java.Io.IoException error=2

[Fishman0919]

Originally posted by alfixdvd
Please help me

Help you with what???

[alfixdvd]

Sorry

I edited the post

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by alfixdvd
Sorry

I edited the post
Please paste the whole message......

[Hostile_Monk]

Thanks for all the hard work Sapstar, can't wait to try out the encoder!

[alfixdvd]

Originally posted by SAPSTAR
Please paste the whole message......

The problem was a corrupt cmd.exe

I replaced it with the cmd.exe of another PC and all's right.

Thanks

[alfixdvd]

Why when QmatOP starts after Prepare phase of Dvd Rebuider I get the message:

Can't find the file c:\DvdToos\QmatOp\frames\Intra*.ppm

Qmatop continue working normaly.

[SAPSTAR]

Originally posted by alfixdvd
Why when QmatOP starts after Prepare phase of Dvd Rebuider I get the message:

Can't find the file c:\DvdToos\QmatOp\frames\Intra*.ppm

Qmatop continue working normaly.
It just makes some cleaning before starting....but most of the time useless. The message is just a warning not an error....

[alfixdvd]

Thanks Sapstar

[SAPSTAR]

@all : alfixdvd discovered a bug with the latest version of DVD-RB (0.93.2).
A correction is available on my website......

:thanks: alfixdvd !

[unbx]

Hi, i recently used this program and i found with one of my dvds, that the bitrate flew everywhere, from 4.5Mbs to 11.0 like every few seconds. This may not be qmatop but i found this odd and i found that on one of my dvd players, the sound cut out where the bitrate was at its highest.

Just wondering if this is abnormal.

[Lo_RaT_PeNaT]

SAPSTAR, as I have written in another post, I use the version 93.2 PRO, of the rebuilder and I/you had not observed anything strange, but when reading that written by Alfixdvd, let us stay observing the behavior of the DVDRBInterface.exe, and so much the one that comes included in the version that you can discharge in your you paginates, as the new one that you have put, I observe that Prepares when finishing the phase and to begin the qmatop, the DVDInterface.exe, disappeared of my toolbar, as finishing your function, to my I/you seemed normal, until I have used another version of the Rebuilder again, in short the For 0.92, in this case, the icon doesn't even disappear in the phase Encode, for what I must suppose that something happens, he/she looks at this that I comment you, because you really happens this way, and you even happens me with the new version that you have put in your you paginates of the Interface, you even disappears during the first phase. A greeting waits you understand what I am commenting you.

[alfixdvd]

if with the new DvdInterface and DvdRebuilder 0.93.2, Qmatop's windows closes as quick as finishes Prepare phase of DvdRebuilder. Please check the next:

workdir in qmatop.ini points to the correct working directory of DvdRebuilder
MPEG2DEC in rebuilder.ini points to DgDecode.dll in DvdRebuilder's directory.

[Lo_RaT_PeNaT]

Rebuilder ini

[Options]
CCETargetSectors=2268965
HCTargetSectors=2261000
CCE=3
LoadPlugin=1
Completed=106
EncoderMinimized=1
HalfExtras=0
idct7Opt=1
DECOMBFlag=1
Mode=5
OneClick=1
HalfD1=00
Convert_16_9=00
DisableInterlace=10
Reminder=80
SkinVersion=5
HC_Quality=3
HC_OPV=1
DCPrec=3
MovieOnly=0
ISO_Output=0
iDCT=7
[CCEOptions]
VBR_bias=20
Quality_prec=12
eclPasses=6
OPV=0
[Paths]
CCENEW=C:\Archivos de programa\Custom Technology\CCE SP Trial Version\cctspt.exe
Source=D:\PELICULAS\EL AVIADOR REMAKE\
Working=D:\PELICULAS\AVIADOR\
MPEG2DEC=C:\Archivos de programa\DVD-RB PRO\DGDecode.dll
DECOMB=C:\Archivos de programa\DVD-RB PRO\Filters\Decomb521.dll
REJIG=C:\Archivos de programa\DVD-RB PRO\Encoders\ReJig\ReJig.exe
Output=D:\PELICULAS\AVIADOR\
HC=C:\Archivos de programa\DVD-RB PRO\Encoders\HC Encoder\HCbatch.EXE
QuEnc=C:\Archivos de programa\DVD-RB PRO\Encoders\QuEnc\QuEnc.exe
ProCoder=C:\Archivos de programa\DVD-RB PRO\Encoders\EclPro\EclPro.exe
[Audio]
Selected=11
[Subpictures]
Selected=111

As you can observe in the rebuilder ini, I have on position the dgdecode.dll, in the place where you indicate, and I assure you that anything but to begin the qmatop, the DVDRBInterface.exe, disappears in the version 0.93.2 For of the Rebuilder, I didn't seize in the version 0.92 For

Qmatop.Ini

workdir=D:\PELICULAS\aviador\D2VAVS
tolerance=2
framesplitperiod=12
AutoEncode=1
AutoRebuild=1
Animation=0
RangeLimit=255
QualityPrecAuto=1
CCESP26X=0
VbrBiasAuto=1
GOPAuto=1

[hutch1711]

I have been using QMAPOp on a number of test DVDs using different encoders. Each time I have to run QMAPOp after the DVD-RB preparation stage to optimize the matrices. Since (and I assume this is correct) the matrix values are the same, I would like to save the matrix values produced the first time around on subsequent encodes, using different encoders. Any ideas? Or maybe it just can't be done. Thanks.

[SAPSTAR]

I have been using QMAPOp on a number of test DVDs using different encoders. Each time I have to run QMAPOp after the DVD-RB preparation stage to optimize the matrices. Since (and I assume this is correct) the matrix values are the same, I would like to save the matrix values produced the first time around on subsequent encodes, using different encoders. Any ideas? Or maybe it just can't be done. Thanks.
It could work if DVD-RB was not refusing it :) I mean that once a REBUILDER.ECL file has been created...if you change the kind of encoder, DVD-RB is refusing to start with the current REBUILDER.ECL it asks for a new prepare phase...so you lose all the matrices :( Maybe I should backup the matrices in separate file, to be able to reuse them....sounds possible...

[EDIT] If you are really courageous, you can make a backup of the REBUILDER.ECL, then paste the matrices in the new REBUILDER.ECL :devil:

[hutch1711]

Sapstar :thanks:

[curious d]

Sorry about the troubleshooting post in the other thread. I hope this is the appropiate thread to troubleshoot. I configured the QMatOPGUI accordingly. I unrar'd parts 1 and 2 into the same QMatOP folder in the DVD-RB folder. I have unclicked the one click option. I restarted my computer and it still isn't an automated function for me. DVD-RB will prepare the first VOB file then stop. QMatOP does not automatically start for me. I have to click on the QMatOP icon to get it to run. How does one get it to run for the entire movie and not just for the first VOB file? Sorry for the ignorance. I'm certain this seems all so very basic to everyone else, but I'm getting the feeling that I'm missing something very simple. Thanks.

[hutch1711]

Curious D, the problems you are having are not likely caused by QMatOp. QMatOp is run after DVD-RB completes the preparation stage, and if I hear you correctly DVD-RB processes the first VOB file and then quits. QMatOp, which you will start manually after the DVD-RB preparation stage, hasn't even begun to work it's magic yet. Your problem is probably in your DVD-RB setup, and it's been suggested in other posts that you use Rockas Installer for DVD Rebuilder to ensure it is configured correctly.

[curious d]

Thanks for response. I should correct myself in saying that the preparation stops after the first VTS. That leaves the extras and the menu behind (with the movie only selection NOT selected). When I got the Pro version, there were two versions available. The installer version and the zip version. I used the installer version. I don't know if it was there is a Pro version with Rockas installation unless the installer version was the Rockas version. Certainly, the installer version did not come with the bundle that the freeware version came with. Does Pro come with that bundle?

Incidently, I am able to make a back up of my discs without QMatOp if that is of any help to my query.

Thanks again.

[hutch1711]

If you downloaded the pro version .93 exe it includes the rocka files. I'm confused by your statement of being able to backups without QMatOP. QMatOp isn't required by DVD-RB to produce backups. It's a helper program to optimize the matrix values using the data produced by DVD-RB in the preparation stage. Are you saying that you previously backed up the disc that is currently giving you trouble with DVD-RB?

[curious d]

Acutally, my question really is about using QMatOp. My understanding to this program is that it should used when DVD-RB is in the three click mode. I thought that when the prepare phase is done, then QMatOp should start automatically. But it doesn't for me and so I start it up. After QMatOp finishes its task, then I press encode. I have read that after encoding, some users get QMatOp to run again at this stage before rebuilding. Is this necessary to get optimal results?

My initial concerns about getting only the first VTS file did not pan out as when it finished, the whole movie was in place. So now my question only pertains to its use as stated above. Thanks.

By the way, I also was wondering what the difference between part 1 and part 2 of the downloads for QMatOP? Thanks again.

[BadServo]

Forgive this question as it is most likely one of ignorance. After reading through the relevent posts, I've got the recommended QMatOp parameters for NTSC/PAL and Interlaced/Non-Interlaced seared into my brain. I'm also aware of what parameters are ignored by non-CCE encoders. However, I'm curious about the absolute best parameters to use, assuming processing time was of no consequence.

I should say up front that after a week of tests churning out comparison samples on 3 PCs, I'm a die-hard HC Encoder user. Am I correct in making the following assumptions based on what I've read?

-When using HC, use 255 as Range Limit
-Set Frame Split and Tolerance to 1
-Diable the AutoGOP, as HC's is presumed superior

From what I can gather, these settings would give the longest processing time, but also the best possible quality and would be suitable for all source material.

Any opinions or corrections would be very graciously accepted.

[Djuby]

Hi everybody,

Can someone recommend matrix setup of DVD-RB for HIGH/LOW/TYPICAL Bitrates: 3,645/120/2,894 or I should just use decoder default?

Djuby

[SAPSTAR]

...
-When using HC, use 255 as Range Limit
-Set Frame Split and Tolerance to 1
-Diable the AutoGOP, as HC's is presumed superior
....

If you're ready to wait for a long time : BINGO ! :) Let me know the results I'm interested in it......

[SAPSTAR]

Hi everybody,

Can someone recommend matrix setup of DVD-RB for HIGH/LOW/TYPICAL Bitrates: 3,645/120/2,894 or I should just use decoder default?

Djuby
Hmmmm depends on the movie...but as a general advice I would try :
HVS Good Picture for Main Movie
AVAMAT6 for >3000
QuEnc for lower bit rates
and Bach1 for extras.....

[Djuby]

This is a series disk (Star Trek Enterprise). I only use CCE for encoding (IMO the best encoder out there). My question is more like, out of the preconfigured matrices that come with DVD-RB, which one should I use for the above mentioned bitrates?

Djuby

[BadServo]

Well, a while ago I finished up my 22 hour-long QMatOp session. Here are my results.

Source Length: 3 Hours
Source Format: NTSC Interlaced
Encoder: HCBatch 0.14

I have to admit that this test really surprised me. I am suspecting that I chose a poor source material for the test, as it is animation, and older animation at that, making ti harder to judge quality.

I ran this encode 3 times, each time using HC Encoder on the "Best Profile". The first encode was done without QMatOp at all, using that encoder defaults for Matrix settings.

The second run was encoded using QMatOp with what I'll call teh "standard" settigns for this type of source (2,15,127) with CCE specific options disabled. Quality was quite good. However, for the most part I noticed no significant quality change between using these settings and using the HC defaults. Again I blame the source. The on exception was during a scene with rapid motion of white-blue light on a pitch black background. There was some visible artifacts at the intersections of color luminosity.

The third run used the insane settings of (1,1,255). Not unexpectedly, the the resutl was very much the same. In fact Identical to the second attempt. Although the artifacting from encode 2 did seem to be slightly diminished.

Based on my 3-person comparison test, I feel that this test would definately have been better served by some clean CGI source material with sharp contrasts. When time permits, I'll rerun it. I feel confident in saying that there's no real reason anyone should need to use such high-settings for QMatOp, but to each his own. ^_^

I also want to note, that on every previous test comparing encodes with and without QMatOP (using both CCE and HC) QMatOp has always produced a superior image on lengthy source material. This is the first descrepency in that "norm."

[hutch1711]

I thought that when the prepare phase is done, then QMatOp should start automatically.
No, QMatOp must be started manually.
After QMatOp finishes its task, then I press encode.
If you check off the AutoEncode and AutoRebuild boxes in the QMatOpGUI the process will be done automatically.
I have read that after encoding, some users get QMatOp to run again at this stage before rebuilding. Is this necessary to get optimal results?
I have never tried this so I'll let Sapstar answer this one.
I also was wondering what the difference between part 1 and part 2 of the downloads for QMatOP?
Just a guess, but I believe there are 2 parts because it has something to do with being a rar file.

[BadServo]

It's a single RAR archive split into 2 peices. YOu need both to extract, and by extracting part1, part2 will be referenced and extracted automatically.

[Hostile_Monk]

Interesting results BadServo, did you enable the animation flag to "1" in the .ini settings?

[BadServo]

No, at this point, I'm leaving the expirimental animation flag off. I felt this would provide a better evaluation, and also, using that flag limits the range as I understand it. I wanted to run a test with the most extreme settings possible. I intend to run a repeat of this test with a live-action or CG source later in the week.

[Hostile_Monk]

Oh ok, that's understandable. I used the animation flag on some Family Guy DVDs that I owned and felt that the results were significantly better then with it off. Of course the only way to tell would involve gathering a large sample with a wide variation of animation and comparing the results. Anyway, I'll look out for your results with live-action and/or CG when you get around to it, good luck!

[liftruck]

It's a single RAR archive split into 2 peices. YOu need both to extract, and by extracting part1, part2 will be referenced and extracted automatically.

Hello BadServo,

I extract part 1 into folder in DVRB directory and then extract part 2. Part 2 overwrites most everything. Is this the correct way as I cannot get QMAT to work.

I have downloaded the latest java, followed all the directions several times to no avail. Installed rebuilder using the installer. Still no luck.

All I get is "The system cannot find the file specified. Execing cmd-exe/c del /Q. 1 intra \x.x>nul.

Any help would be much appreciated as this is over my head now.

Thanks

Liftruck

[Hostile_Monk]

You extract everything from Part 1 and you should be good to go. Make sure you configure the settings (QMatGUI) and you shouldn't get any errors.

[BadServo]

Yes, also.. there is no reasont oe xtract the files into the DVD-RB folder. instead, make a seperate folder for QMatOp. In addition to the 2 RAR files, you need to download the DVDRebuilderInterface file and place it int eh same folder as the extracted contents of the 2 RARs.

Once this is done, open the QMatOp.ini file and fill int eh path to your DVD-RB working folder.

Start DVD-RB and prepare a disc. Once this is done, run the QMatOPGUI.exe file and set your chosen parameters, then press teh button marked with a green check. A confirmation box will appear, informing you that QMatOp will begin after the prepare stage is finished. Click "OK" and the box will disappear and be replaced by a small Progress bar windows (assuming you have Java properly installed).

Over time the progress bar will move to 100% (although this can take alot of tiem dependeing on your CPU speed and chosen options). At which time, the encoding will begin automatically in DVD-RB is you selected teh AutoEncode option int eh QMatOPGUI interface.

[liftruck]

I have done everything as you said previously and still the file missing errors. Java was installed to the default paths. Went into environmental variables and set path for Java. Nothing works.

Try install of Qmat, Rebuilder and Java on a backup computer with same results. Both computers show "The system cannot find the file specified. Execing cmd-exe/c del /Q. 1 intra \x.x>nul"

Clearly I must have something not configured right. Does the file missing error provide any clues?

[SAPSTAR]

No, at this point, I'm leaving the expirimental animation flag off. I felt this would provide a better evaluation, and also, using that flag limits the range as I understand it. I wanted to run a test with the most extreme settings possible. I intend to run a repeat of this test with a live-action or CG source later in the week.
Hmmm with animations I would highly recommend the usage of the flag, as it's not only a limitation....the way the inter-matrix is calculated is different.

[SAPSTAR]

.... I have read that after encoding, some users get QMatOp to run again at this stage before rebuilding. Is this necessary to get optimal results?...
Nope useless....as QMatOp only optimizes the parameters before the encoding....once everything was encoded....you can start rebuild without having anything else to do.

[SAPSTAR]

I have done everything as you said previously and still the file missing errors. Java was installed to the default paths. Went into environmental variables and set path for Java. Nothing works.

Try install of Qmat, Rebuilder and Java on a backup computer with same results. Both computers show "The system cannot find the file specified. Execing cmd-exe/c del /Q. 1 intra \x.x>nul"

Clearly I must have something not configured right. Does the file missing error provide any clues?
This message is normal but is not an error...just a warning..you must have something else after that !

[MaDxCrEaM]

I have a question. I was looking at some of the pics in the pic directory while qmatop is running. I've noticed that sometimes the pics are screwed up. Not sure if any of you know what the glowing edges effect like in photoshop is, but the picture is really black with wierd outlines of some of the objects, while other pictures are normal like the movie is suppose to be. Just curious if this is normal, or what the problem may be.

Hope you understand. Thanks for any info.

EDIT:

hope this is okay. Here is a sample of a screwed up picture I'm talking about:

http://webpages.charter.net/cybercream/Inter000213.jpg

[SAPSTAR]

@MaDxCrEaM : Perfectly normal as Inter frames are delta frames....difference between succesive frames as the Inter matrix is mainly used for B and P frames......

[MaDxCrEaM]

@MaDxCrEaM : Perfectly normal as Inter frames are delta frames....difference between succesive frames as the Inter matrix is mainly used for B and P frames......

Thanks for fast reply and good news even though it's too technical for me :)

[liftruck]

This message is normal but is not an error...just a warning..you must have something else after that !


SapStar

The error message is continuous as thought it cannot find the files Rebuilder has prepared and the percentage does not register anything but zero.

I have checked all paths many many times. Installed uninstalled reinstalled and the counter stays at 0 %. Any idea on what errors other than the ones mentioned I should look for?

Thanks

[SAPSTAR]

SapStar
....Any idea on what errors other than the ones mentioned I should look for?...
Thanks
Could you send me by PM the exact messages ? (copy and paste)

[MaDxCrEaM]

I am noticing something weird using QMatOP. I've been backing up Greatest american hero Season 2. I've tried using QMatOP on dvd4 and dvd5. Seems everything looks great, but the red is really blocky. Just curious why a certain color would look blocky. The rest of the color spectrum is fine. Any ideas?

Also, just tried playing it in my Philips dvd player, and I see noise in the picture coming in and out. I didn't see the noise in my other player, just the blockyness of the red.

I used HC to encode also.

[SAPSTAR]

@liftruck
Hmmm I received your PM....My only explanation would be the usage of a shortcut or something like that, without specifying the "start in" directory....Try to run directly from the dir where you unrar it, if it's working just adjust your shortcuts properties.....

@MaDxCrEaM
Interesting......did you try without QmatOp ?!? But I wonder why the red color only...I'll have to think about it....

[MaDxCrEaM]

@sapstar yes I did encode with HC without QmatOP and it turned out fine. When I did QmatOP I used range limit to 255 since using HC, tolerance 1, frame split 15. Had quality prec auto, vbr bias auto, autoencode, autobuild checked. I'm curious why on my other dvd player I see so called "noise" come in and out. Could some of the range limits be too high for the dvd player to handle?

I'm pretty newbie-ish when talking about all this stuff. If you need any info, just let me know. I deleted the directory and stuff already, but I could run qmatop on it again and send you any information you would like to look at. Thanks.

[SAPSTAR]

@sapstar yes I did encode with HC without QmatOP and it turned out fine. When I did QmatOP I used range limit to 255 since using HC, tolerance 1, frame split 15. Had quality prec auto, vbr bias auto, autoencode, autobuild checked. .
Bingo !!! The pure MPEG2 specs gives a 8-255 range for matrices, but as some encoders don't support more than 127...I suspect DVD-players are the same....you should try using some lower limits....like 127 !

[MaDxCrEaM]

will do and get back to you sapstar

[liftruck]

I had originally run the program from the directory with the same results. I guess Qmat will not work for me.

[SAPSTAR]

I had originally run the program from the directory with the same results. I guess Qmat will not work for me.Hmm why a software would work and not for others....anyway If you wished to give up that's your choice...LAST HINT: Sometimes long dir names with blank spaces can be sources of pb....as a rule,I'm always using for any tools simple path C:\QMatop and C:\DVDTemp\D2VAVS for example in our case......Something else, did you copy DCTune2.0 in you dir ?!

[alfixdvd]

Hi liftruck

Try to obtain another copy of cmd.exe ( in another PC ) and to replace yours at windows\system32

[MaDxCrEaM]

@sapster Hey, tried using range limit of 127 here is the findings.

The red still seems a little blocky on my dvd player downstairs. The bright red is what looks bad, the darker reds are ok. I'm not sure if you know Greatest american hero series, but his suit he wears you can really tell.

The dvd player upstairs no longer has the so called "Noise" I was seeing, but the bright reds didn't look blocky, just seemed to be really bright, saturated.

I'll try using CCE here today and using QMatOp and see what happens. I'll keep all the output directory of the HC one in case you want to look at any of it.

[liftruck]

anyway If you wished to give up that's your choice...L

I don't want to gvie up but nothing seems to work.

AST HINT: Sometimes long dir names with blank spaces can be sources of pb....as a rule,I'm always using for any tools simple path C:\QMatop and C:\DVDTemp\D2VAVS for example in our case......Something else, did you copy DCTune2.0 in you dir ?!

Changed all paths to as simple as they can be and updated those paths in Rebuilder and QMat.

DCTune2.0 is in the QMat directory on C drive.

I also tried the other suggestion and replaced cmd.exe with one from my laptop. Did not work

Thanks for trying

liftruck

[MaDxCrEaM]

@sapster CCE seemed a little better, but the problem still there. I'll just encode not using QMatOp on this.

[SAPSTAR]

Hi all...I thought you may be interested in knowing I just released my encoder with an improved QMatOp technology built in....
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=672309#post672309

[Carpo]

just checked out a few of the films i did uing qmat and Jawor's 1CD Quantization Matrix and played it on the pc the xbox my laptop and the cheap little dvd player i got from asda (£50) and it players sweet as you like - and looks top notch too :P

[SAPSTAR]

just checked out a few of the films i did uing qmat and Jawor's 1CD Quantization Matrix and played it on the pc the xbox my laptop and the cheap little dvd player i got from asda (£50) and it players sweet as you like - and looks top notch too :P
Good to know ! Did you test AQE ??? I improved the QMatOp built-in feature in comparison with the QMAtOp standalone.......The last version I'm to release is also faster ...and at least as good !

[Carpo]

not yet have been waiting for the little dir issue and speed increase in next rls b4 i test - makes sense - saves me doing an encode and then u rlsing the newer version (as always happens with dvdrb) hehehe :D

[MaDxCrEaM]

QMatOP is hung at 94%. My question is does QMatOP make changes during the running of the program or does it write everything at the end? I just wondering if I can encode it since what it got stuck on is the credits, which I don't care about, so if it updates while it's processing, then I would like to encode now instead of rerunning the whole process. Thanks for any info.

[Carpo]

it makes changes to the ecl as it goes - i had this before but it was because my drive was heavily fragmented - defrag the drive and give it another try

[Insane2986]

can't seem to download the files...

nm, just don't use "save as"

[Insane2986]

can anybody help me?

I'm a huge newbie to dvd encoding, and I'm wondering if there's some way I can compare a DVD encoded using the default DVDRB settings to the same one using QMatOp. Like are there graphs of the differences I can look at? I watch the two dvds and I can't tell any differences between them. For all I know they're exact duplicates! :confused:

[Fishman0919]

can anybody help me?

I'm a huge newbie to dvd encoding, and I'm wondering if there's some way I can compare a DVD encoded using the default DVDRB settings to the same one using QMatOp. Like are there graphs of the differences I can look at? I watch the two dvds and I can't tell any differences between them. For all I know they're exact duplicates! :confused:


Are there graphs... Sorry but no.... If they (the two encodings) look the same to you and you can't see any diff, then you may not need to use QMatOp... most of the time the resulting movie/disc will look better but if you can't see anything diff... why take the extra time to encode. I've probably used QMatOp (a whole bunch of testing) more then anyone and most Disc look better with QMatOp then without but it can take some bit of time to use.
Maybe reserve QMatOp for those hard to encode, real long Discs... Lord of the Rings Trillogy, Star Wars Trillogy....

[Insane2986]

Well, preferably I'd like to use QmatOp for all my encodes. I hate the trial-and-error way of guessing which VBR Bias and Quality Prec values to use. I'd much rather automate the whole process of choosing the best values for each dvd, that way I can let a computer make the decisions rather than my untrained eye. It's just wierd because the DVD I ran QMatOp on is the same size as the one I didn't use it on. It could just be a coincidence, but it's almost as if it had no effect.

Also, can anyone explain the difference between QMatOp and AutoQMatOp to me? I'm not sure which one I should be using.

[Insane2986]

so I just compared the two directories (one from qmatop, and the other without) and both are exactly the same. Does this happen often? I must've done something wrong. Prepare, run QMatOPGUI.exe, click big green check box and wait to finish, then encode/rebuild. Right? Anyone know what I did wrong :confused:


http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7403/qmatop7qs.jpg

Thanks for any help

[Fishman0919]

Also, can anyone explain the difference between QMatOp and AutoQMatOp to me? I'm not sure which one I should be using.

Difference between QMatOp and AutoQMatOp, QMatOp is a matrix optimizer that will work with most encoders that works with DVD-RB (CCE SP 2.66 and up, QnEnc and HC Encoder). AutoQMatEnc is it's own encoder that can work in place for CCE SP with a highly tweak QMatOp built in. AutoQMatEnc is in the early stages of development but in some tests I did (again with the tests) AutoQMatEnc looks better then CCE SP at mid to low bitrates (say 3000k and down)

[Fishman0919]

so I just compared the two directories (one from qmatop, and the other without) and both are exactly the same. Does this happen often? I must've done something wrong. Prepare, run QMatOPGUI.exe, click big green check box and wait to finish, then encode/rebuild. Right? Anyone know what I did wrong :confused:


http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7403/qmatop7qs.jpg

Thanks for any help

The only files that should be the diff are the .VOB files, they contain the video the rest should be the same.... but if you are getting the same for all files... most likely you are doing something wrong.

[gigah72]

how can i get the same qmat like from autoqmatenc?

[SAPSTAR]

how can i get the same qmat like from autoqmatenc?
You can't....the algorithm was improved in AQE, and I didn't update QMatOp yet...

[SAPSTAR]

so I just compared the two directories (one from qmatop, and the other without) and both are exactly the same. Does this happen often? I must've done something wrong. Prepare, run QMatOPGUI.exe, click big green check box and wait to finish, then encode/rebuild. Right? Anyone know what I did wrong :confused:

Thanks for any help
When you say identical ? Did you compare them byte per byte ?! Because the matrices change the visual quality...not the DVD structure !

[gigah72]

You can't....the algorithm was improved in AQE, and I didn't update QMatOp yet...

is qmatop still an active project from you, or did you drop it in favor of your encoder?
i'd like to use an other encoder, your is far too slow for me.

[Axlemar]

To give you a quick answer, it seems that all planned future development is now into the encoder. It may be slow, but if it turns out to have the highest quality overall than it will be worth it (for me at least)

[alfixdvd]

Hi Sapstar.

Qmatop 0.13b don't work with Rebuilder 1RC2.

It seems the problem is similar with version 0.93.2

When I run Qmatop, while Rebuilder is at Prepare phase, Qmatop start, show the ProgressBar and closes with the next message:


c:\DvdTools\QMatOp>QMatOP.exe
Execing cmd.exe /C .\DVDRBInterface.exe WAITPREPARE "c:\DvdTools\QMatOp\.\WAITDVDRB"
Error : no good ECL found

c:\DvdTools\QMatOp>

[Carpo]

works ok here i used it this morning on xfiles mythology dvd - used with HC - try it with cce 2.6 as i know its more geared towards that format of ecl

[alfixdvd]

@ carpo
With Rebuilder 1.0 and HC 0.15 Qmatop 0.13b at my PC don't works. I don't test with CCE, but surely don't works. I think the problem is again with DvDRbInterface.exe.

It seems the problem is similar that it happened with version 0.93.2. Sapstar released a new version od DVDRBInterface.exe to correct the problem.

Jdobbs surely has changed the button code sent when pressed, and DVDRBInterface.exe don't work again.

The problem is that Qmatop goes directly to Encode phase and the ecl file has a lenght of zero bytres.


With 0.93.2 all's rigth., with CCE and with HC.

[Carpo]

it sometimes plays up but all i do is del the file called waitfordvdrb and then goto the tray (where the clock is) and stop the qmat prog running there and then qmtaop starts working - 9/10 it goes thru without an issue anyway

[alfixdvd]

Hello Sapstar

Qmatop is dead ?

[SAPSTAR]

Hello Sapstar

Qmatop is dead ?
QMatOp is not dead....but I'm working on AQE, and I have no time to work on several projects...I'm working 9-5...I have 3 kids under 6 yo....so I don't have so much freetime !

[alfixdvd]

Hello Sapstar

Bad news.

Best regards.

[Axlemar]

Please just worry about the encoder, which has the potential to be quite awesome. We all appreciate your work.

[hutch1711]

I have 3 kids under 6 yo....
Those french guys are always busy! :D

[alfixdvd]

Qmatop has any problem with multi-angle movies ?

[Carpo]

it shouldnt do as it will only tune up (as it were) the files that dvdrb make while in prepare

[Insane2986]

Is there anyway to use AutoQMatEnc to adjust the matrices, but not encode? I'm wondering if I should use AQE or stick with QMatOp before I encode with DVD-RB/CCE..

[SAPSTAR]

Is there anyway to use AutoQMatEnc to adjust the matrices, but not encode? I'm wondering if I should use AQE or stick with QMatOp before I encode with DVD-RB/CCE..
Nope AQE is a full encoder not a CCE File tweaker...But I highly recommend you to try AQE 0.32.0.2 (available in the beta testers area). Up to now results are all very good from a quality + sizing point of view.

[Carpo]

# Beta Version 0.32.0.3

* Display version info in the log
* Create New VAF parameter taken into account now
* Multithread enabled version (Highly experimental) - Posix Threads used.
o Parameter : threads=## , ## begin the number of threads.

i would use this version as i do have a ht cpu but the words highly and experimental throw me off a bit

if only cce used ht

Q. Does CCE support dual processors ?
A. Yes. We recommend dual CPUs for high speed MPEG2 encoding.

Q. Does CCE support Hyper-Threading technology ?
A. No. CCE is a really optimized software, and we do not recommend using Hyper-Threading technology.

just out of interest does HC support ht ?

can anyone suggest a good matice for anime/cartoon eg for titan ae

[gilligan2]

I am trying the newest experimental version on a dual Xeon machine but am still only getting one processor being used. I installed everything to a directory and so do i have to do anything "special" to get it to use more than one thread or should it do so automatically ?

Thanks !!

g:) :)

[Carpo]

Parameter : threads=## , ## begin the number of threads. - guessing that has to go in the ini file

[gilligan2]

Parameter : threads=## , ## begin the number of threads. - guessing that has to go in the ini file

OK,i'll try that in the DVD-RB .ini file and see if it works.


@SAPSTAR-Thanks again for all your time and effort and you confirm where to put the threads parameter if you could ?

Thanks,

g:)

[gilligan2]

Nah,adding it to the RB.ini didn;t make any difference to my machine. :confused:

OK,looks like it goes in the "REBUILDER.ecl" file after the prepare stage.

g:)

[Carpo]

reckon we should slap sapstar around a bit with an updated readme :sly:

[gilligan2]

Nah,adding it to the RB.ini didn;t make any difference to my machine. :confused:

OK,looks like it goes in the "REBUILDER.ecl" file after the prepare stage.

g:)

mmm,maybe not unless i have to put it at the begginning of every segment, I'll have to wait for SAPSTAR to clarify for me I suppose. LOL

g:)

[SAPSTAR]

@gilligan2,carpo
It's easy, you just have to open the REBUILDER.ECL file with notepad for example, and then Edit-Replace stereo=2 by threads=4 for example as the stereo parameter is not used.....

[gilligan2]

OK,thanks much SAPSTAR,and Happy Holidays to everyone and your families ~!!


g:)

[gilligan2]

OK,so i do this but i have to do it for every single [item] in the REBUILDER.ecl ?

The moivie i'm working on has 53 items so i have to manually add the command to the parameters 53 times or is there a quicker way ?

Thanks again.

g:)

[Carpo]

http://www.massfileeditor.com/ - grab the prog from that site - it will allow you to selct what type of file you want to edit (multiple files) and what you want to add or remove from the files :P

hth

[gilligan2]

http://www.massfileeditor.com/ - grab the prog from that site - it will allow you to selct what type of file you want to edit (multiple files) and what you want to add or remove from the files :P

hth

Thanks,bu i don't think this will work for this purpose Carpo because if you look at the REBUILDER.ecl file,you have to add the same line "threads=4" in one file,but at 53 different places (after it says "[item] xxxxxxxxxxxx.m2v"

I'll take a look at it and see so thanks for the idea.

g:) :)

[rendez2k]

I haven't tried it yet, but won't the 'Edit-Replace' function of Notepad work as suggested by SAPSTAR?

[Carpo]

Thanks,bu i don't think this will work for this purpose Carpo because if you look at the REBUILDER.ecl file,you have to add the same line "threads=4" in one file,but at 53 different places (after it says "[item] xxxxxxxxxxxx.m2v"

I'll take a look at it and see so thanks for the idea.

g:) :)

looking back no it wouldnt be of use - but seeing a was rather drunk it read quite differently :D

too much christmas cheer you could say :cool:

[gilligan2]

I haven't tried it yet, but won't the 'Edit-Replace' function of Notepad work as suggested by SAPSTAR?

I'll have to try that function. I honestly wasn't aware it existed.Thanks for the "heads-up" !

g:)

[Carpo]

so its
2 for smp
4 for dual core right ?

[gilligan2]

No,the opposite. 4 would be for INtel Xeon with 2 physical processors using hyper-threading also. 2 would be for the AMD x2 processors or an Intel single core with HT.

g:)

[Carpo]

latest beta just errors out all the time here :(

[gilligan2]

I just installed it myself so i'll check it out after i eat dinner.

g:)

[Carpo]

22:35 here so im off to bed i'll try it out on the 27th :D

[SlipGun]

QMatOp does not actually change the bitrates assigned to each cell by DVD-RB, does it?

[Carpo]

no it tweaks the matrix used

[Insane2986]

Please just worry about the encoder
Noooooo! :(

[SAPSTAR]

Noooooo! :(
No what ?! :sly:

Anyway...FYI the very last beta version is stable and multithreaded !
(In order to use the 0.32.0.6b you absolutly need to copy first the 0.32.0.3 which contains some new DLLs ofr the posix multithreading...)

[gilligan2]

I notice on the latest beta that i am using 8 threads. I have a Dual Xeon system with HT enabled so it should be 4 threads,correct ? Does using 8 actually become a detriment since there are only 4 that can be used and slow down the process since the other 4 have to wait ?

And even though it says 8 threads,it only shows using around 53% of my CPU resources so it doesn't seem to be maxing out the HT area.

Thanks again for all your efforts !!

g:)

[Carpo]

mine says its using 4 threads and i have a smp ht cpu - dunno if thats right or not, cpu at about 90%

also says something about create new vaf is on - how you turn that off ?

[Insane2986]

No what ?! :sly:
Just voicing my support for qmatop :cool:

[sw01]

Just voicing my support for qmatop :cool:

ditto

[SAPSTAR]

I notice on the latest beta that i am using 8 threads. I have a Dual Xeon system with HT enabled so it should be 4 threads,correct ? Does using 8 actually become a detriment since there are only 4 that can be used and slow down the process since the other 4 have to wait ?

And even though it says 8 threads,it only shows using around 53% of my CPU resources so it doesn't seem to be maxing out the HT area.

Thanks again for all your efforts !!

g:)
The 8 threads are correct, I also noticed it doesn't use the whole CPU, but I suspect the bottleneck is the disk, I mean the CPU is able to crunch data faster than the disk is able to feed ?!?!
And no the threads are not waiting each other, otherwise it wouldn't be multithread, it would be sequential.

Something else : I dont read quite often this thread as "QMatOp" project is finished...I only work on AQE (AutoQMatEnc). The official forum is : www.vmesquita.com/forum/index.php?board=41.0

Anyway thank you for your support !

[SAPSTAR]

mine says its using 4 threads and i have a smp ht cpu - dunno if thats right or not, cpu at about 90%

also says something about create new vaf is on - how you turn that off ?
The reason why you have that message is the create_new_vaf is on, so the message just warns you that if you were to restart your encode the first pass will be reprocessed. There is no issue there.....

[TuRiSOft]

No what ?! :sly:

Anyway...FYI the very last beta version is stable and multithreaded !
(In order to use the 0.32.0.6b you absolutly need to copy first the 0.32.0.3 which contains some new DLLs ofr the posix multithreading...)

It'd be better you add this info on the homepage of your app , or at least in the beta testers area !!!! I had a hard time understanding why it was crashing every time !!!!

[SAPSTAR]

It'd be better you add this info on the homepage of your app , or at least in the beta testers area !!!! I had a hard time understanding why it was crashing every time !!!!
Betaversions are for beta testers : People ready to encounter some pbs and live with them + it was mentioned in the official forum threads.
And a more friendly attitude would be appreciated as we are talking about something which didn't cost you a cent!!!!!!

[ernstblaauw]

Betaversions are for beta testers : People ready to encounter some pbs and live with them + it was mentioned in the official forum threads.
And a more friendly attitude would be appreciated as we are talking about something which didn't cost you a cent!!!!!!
I totally agree with you, Sapstar! Thanks for your great apps!

[TuRiSOft]

Betaversions are for beta testers : People ready to encounter some pbs and live with them + it was mentioned in the official forum threads.
And a more friendly attitude would be appreciated as we are talking about something which didn't cost you a cent!!!!!!

I apologize , you probably misunderstood me. I had the problem and solved it on my own . I wrote in red only to let other people to take in account my experience and solve their problems faster. That is another feature of Betaversion and free software in general , isn't it ?
Anyway , it was not my intention to be not friendly , probably I used the wrong words !!!

[Skunk]

OK. I am the first to admit I'm not the brightest penny in the fountain and I am left a bit confused. So I will leave a few questions for those of you who know the deal :

1) Can I use QMatOp with any encoder? (I assume not procoder, since it
doesn't support custom matrixes)

2) Does QMatOp make custom matrixes, or is there a list it chooses from
somewhere?

3) As far as AutoQMatEnc goes, how exactly is it related to CCE? Are you
tring to emulate CCE as close as possible?

4) I have experimented off and on with Rockas' Matrix Editor. I don't typicaly use it, but when
space is getting tight it can make a noticeable difference. If I were to run QMatOp on a
project would it eliminate the need for RME?

[SAPSTAR]

OK. I am the first to admit I'm not the brightest penny in the fountain and I am left a bit confused. So I will leave a few questions for those of you who know the deal :

1) Can I use QMatOp with any encoder? (I assume not procoder, since it
doesn't support custom matrixes)
First, as I mentioned before...this thread should be closed as I'm not working anymore on the standalone version of QMatOp. Ans advanced version of it is embedded in AutoQMatEnc. But it was made to work with DVDRB whatever encoder you choose.


2) Does QMatOp make custom matrixes, or is there a list it chooses from
somewhere?
QMatOp builds its own matrices by the mean of DCTune2.0 a tool from the NASA allowing to optimize the visual perception of JPG pictures


3) As far as AutoQMatEnc goes, how exactly is it related to CCE? Are you
tring to emulate CCE as close as possible?
In order to be easily usable, it uses the same ECL files (parameter file) than CCE SP 2.60.


4) I have experimented off and on with Rockas' Matrix Editor. I don't typicaly use it, but when
space is getting tight it can make a noticeable difference. If I were to run QMatOp on a
project would it eliminate the need for RME?
Yep...as QMatOp or AQE builds its own matrices which are supposed to be optimized for a given video segment.

[archaeo]

QmatEnc seems to offer good enough quality, but I have found some jerkiness in the playback on my own test runs. :(

[SAPSTAR]

QmatEnc seems to offer good enough quality, but I have found some jerkiness in the playback on my own test runs. :(
Which version ?!

[jptheripper]

im confused..

if you use autoqmatenc, are you still using cce or are you using the built in encoder

[Skunk]

I was sort of wondering the same thing JP. The description makes it sound as if it uses the CCE encoder basically with QMatOp built in. Either way, I think I will run a few tests with it to see what it can do.

[SAPSTAR]

im confused..

if you use autoqmatenc, are you still using cce or are you using the built in encoder
AutoQMatEnc is an encoder....you use it instead of CCE SP.

QMatOp was a first project of mine which was standalone. But AutoQMatEnc is a full encoder by itself, and it has the "QMatOp" technology integrated....

FYI : The 0.32b is to be released very soon.....It was greatly improved...Multithreaded, Better RC, better quality, faster, ......

[jptheripper]

thats what i figured. Is it still possible to use the qmatop technology with cce? or is it deidcated to autoqmatenc now

[SAPSTAR]

thats what i figured. Is it still possible to use the qmatop technology with cce? or is it deidcated to autoqmatenc now
Now AutoQMatEnc is a full encoder by itself, and the embedded QMatOp technology cant be reused...except manually of course (for each video segment a matrix file is generated)

[jptheripper]

okay thanx good to know. I will have to try it out. especially with my dual core on the way

[archaeo]

Which version ?!


SAPSTAR,
It appears I used v.31b, downloaded from your http://www.autoqmatenc.com/
website. Do I understand that your new version is v.32? I didn't see it there on the page, so I assumed the version there was the latest release.

[jdobbs]

The 0.32b is to be released very soon... the answer is in the quote

[Carpo]

SAPSTAR,
It appears I used v.31b, downloaded from your http://www.autoqmatenc.com/
website. Do I understand that your new version is v.32? I didn't see it there on the page, so I assumed the version there was the latest release.

there is a 0.32 release in the beta testers area, the link to which is at the bottom of autoqmatencs website, besure to get Beta Version 0.32.0.3 first as it contains new files for use on dual core systems then get Beta Version 0.32.0.9 - or you could just wait till 0.32 final is released :)

[rendez2k]

Has anybody done any comparative tests to other encoders with the new versions? What are peoples experience of the quality? I keep meaning to test myself!

[archaeo]

there is a 0.32 release in the beta testers area, the link to which is at the bottom of autoqmatencs website, besure to get Beta Version 0.32.0.3 first as it contains new files for use on dual core systems then get Beta Version 0.32.0.9 - or you could just wait till 0.32 final is released :)

thanx Carpo

I have a dual processor, so I'm looking forward to trying this version.

[Fishman0919]

Has anybody done any comparative tests to other encoders with the new versions? What are peoples experience of the quality? I keep meaning to test myself!

Have done a lot of testing in the passed with AQE and most of the time it's on-par with HC and CCE... my testing has been limited recently because of new job, lots-o-hours and building a new home... but I did just do a test of "The Bourne Identity" with CCE Basic 2.70.01.08, HC .16a and AQE 0.32.0.9... hard movie to encode... very dark with lot of detail...all three did great work but I liked AQE because dropping the extra 25% and they still looked outstanding with AQE where with HC and CCE Basic the extras wasn't as good, the the dark scenes also looked great with AQE w/QMatOp and the dark engine SAPSTAR has.

[jdobbs]

Are the encode speeds comparable?

[rendez2k]

Jdobbs, any plans to add native support for AQE, I mean as a proper selectable encoder with options rather than having to use the CCE option?

[jdobbs]

I'm not sure it makes a difference... since it works anyway.

[rendez2k]

I'm not sure it makes a difference... since it works anyway.

Guess it would be nice to include it with DVDRB (as HC etc) - can't have too many enocders! I'd also like to keep seperate settings for both CCE and AQE.

[archaeo]

I ran some quick tests to visually compare the results of an encode using SAPSTAR’s AutoQMatENC (v.32.0.9) to an encode using CCE SP 2.70.1.5 (Trial). To set up this comparison, I chose a small test clip (85 MB) from ‘Lawrence of Arabia’, a long movie (227 min) with a compression factor of 56% and an average bitrate of 2200 Mbs when placed on a DVD-5. For this test I used RB-Opt to make sure the average bitrate of the encoded clips was the same average I would receive if I encoded the whole movie onto a DVD-5 disc.

So here's the visual comparison (shown @200%) between an encoded result of AutoQMatEnc (w/self generated matrix) and that of CCE SP (w/standard MPEG matrix):


5398
(see attached)


Visually, the results are pretty distinct in the side by side comparison. The artifacts in the CCE SP encode (using MPEG matrix) are more noticeable (but do hold some detail), while the image quality of the AQE generated matrix shows less artifacts and looks smoother, but perhaps has lost a little detail as well. That's to be expected with a compression of 56% and such a low bitrate. I think the picture quality of the AQE image looks very good, better in my eyes than the standard MPEG encoded clip generated by CCE.

Overall, I found that the program worked very well, no glitches. In addition, I was able to utilize the HT feature in AQE since I run dual processors (PIII xeon 1gHz).For the record it took 9 minutes for AQE vs 4 minutes for CCE.


In case you’re interested, here’s the matrix from the original clip that I extracted thru Rockas’ RME
(turned out to be Fox Home Entertainment matrix):

8, 8, 9, 11, 13, 13, 14, 17
8, 8, 11, 12, 13, 14, 17, 18
9, 11, 13, 13, 14, 17, 17, 16
11, 11, 13, 13, 13, 17, 18, 20
11, 13, 13, 13, 16, 17, 20, 24
13, 13, 13, 16, 17, 20, 24, 29
13, 12, 13, 17, 19, 23, 28, 34
12, 13, 17, 19, 23, 28, 34, 41

8, 8, 8, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10
8, 8, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10, 10
8, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10
9, 9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10
9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 11
9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 11, 11
9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 11, 11, 11
10, 10, 10, 10, 11, 11, 11, 11


Here’s the matrix generated by AutoQMatEnc:

8, 14, 17, 23, 42, 69,110,251
10, 19, 17, 22, 42,100,239,255
11, 17, 34, 56,103,209,255,255
19, 21, 47,152,216,240,255,255
36, 33,113,220,255,255,255,255
72,100,216,255,255,255,255,255
174,230,255,255,255,255,255,255
185,251,255,255,255,255,255,255

18, 23, 24, 31, 41, 57,104,149
23, 29, 27, 30, 35, 47, 68,115
24, 26, 38, 45, 50, 63,105,141
31, 30, 43, 61, 92,122,145,185
38, 35, 49, 90,135,169,214,229
52, 45, 58,115,161,220,238,251
81, 58, 93,141,207,239,253,255
127,104,129,169,224,250,255,255


As you can see these are some very high values, thus explaining the loss of detail in the AQE image.

[m1ckran]

I'm not sure it makes a difference... since it works anyway.


The difference is that if you don't include the options in DVD-RB, it looks as though you don't really endorse the product. People might think it is merely an unoffical deviation from the standard system.

I'm really interested in this, though I've not tried it. I'm waiting for you to approve its use by incorporating it into DVD-RB.

Thanks for fabulous software. :)

[Fishman0919]

Are the encode speeds comparable?


No, CCE Basic was about 100 mins, HC was about 140'ish and AQE was about 250 mins

[archaeo]

No, CCE Basic was about 100 mins, HC was about 140'ish and AQE was about 250 mins


That's in line with the times I got from my short clip tests - about twice as long as CCE.

[Skunk]

Visually, the results are pretty distinct in the side by side comparison. The artifacts in the CCE SP encode (using MPEG matrix) are more noticeable (but do hold some detail), while the image quality of the AQE generated matrix shows less artifacts and looks smoother, but perhaps has lost a little detail as well. That's to be expected with a compression of 56% and such a low bitrate. I think the picture quality of the AQE image looks very good, better in my eyes than the standard MPEG encoded clip generated by CCE.

As you can see these are some very high values, thus explaining the loss of detail in the AQE image.

OK. Between thess statements I am a bit confused. You explain that AQE has some extra loss of detail, but you think the quality is better?

I am a total matrix noob, but those ones generated by AQE are way higher than any others I've seen around. Is that the reason there is soo much loss?

[archaeo]

OK. Between thess statements I am a bit confused. You explain that AQE has some extra loss of detail, but you think the quality is better?

I am a total matrix noob, but those ones generated by AQE are way higher than any others I've seen around. Is that the reason there is soo much loss?


This is completely subjective, but yes, in this instance I'd rather see some smoothing in the image and loss of some detail than heavy artifacting around the edges.

I agree, the AQE generated matrix has some really high values, similar to what you see in Bulletproof's heavy compression matrix. It's a lot more aggressive than what I would have picked as a custom matrix. All I can say is that between these two images, I prefer the one generated by the AQE matrix. Perhaps some further tests with other custom matrices would offer more comparisons.

[Skunk]

I think the custom matrix is an awesome feature of AutoQMatEnc. It could save a ton of time on picking through matices for every scene.
I do agree (now that I can actually see the comparison attachments) that AQE looks noticeably better overall. I also see what you mean about loss of detail. Its like the CCE one is over-sharp.

Wonder what that shot would look like if you ran QMatOp on that project and THEN ran it through CCE? Do you think the CCE encoder would do a better job if it had the same 'edge'?

I'm not asking which encoder is better, just wondering how much of an edge AQE actually gets by customizing matices.

[jptheripper]

can aqe handle avisynth filters? such as resizing, sharpening, etc.. just curious

[Fishman0919]

....I haven't had any pb's with AQE and filters...

[Insane2986]

Anyone know why my Qmatop stopped working? I click the green checkmark and do the standard "delete WAITDVDRB file, close DVDRInterface.exe in system tray." The progress bar pops up but then closes almost immidiately :(

[Insane2986]

bump :stupid:

[Carpo]

seeing as the author stoped work on this ages ago its doubtfull you'll get a solution to your issue - unless someone else has had the same issue and found a solution

[moviefan]

When starting QMatOp the progress bar appears, but I get errors in the command line. A very confusing thing is that the resolution is totally wrong (496x56), although the avs script is correct (tested). This is what QMatOp returns in the command line:

Execing cmd.exe /C .\DVDRBInterface.exe WAITPREPARE "C:\Programme\DVD Rebuilder
\QMatOp\.\WAITDVDRB"
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\Intra*.ppm
C:\Programme\DVD Rebuilder\QMatOp\frames\Intra*.ppm konnte nicht gef
unden werden
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\temp.avs .\avs2avi.log -o l -c MSVC

AVS2AVI v1.31 (c) 2002,2003 Christophe PARIS (christophe.paris@free.fr)
Contributions by: int21h
Additional code (c) 2002,2003 David Leatherdale (dave@leatherdale.net)

Source:
* Filename: .\temp.avs
* Bit depth: 32
* FOURCC: none (RGB)
* Frames: 240
* Resolution: 496x56
Compressor:
* Name: Microsoft Video 1
* FOURCC: MSVC

Finished
Execing cmd.exe /C del .\temp.avs
Pass 1/1 frame 3/240, 0.00fps, ETA: , size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 129/240, 427.61fps, ETA: 00:00:00.264, size: 0.00MB

* Frames: 0
* Key frames: 240
* Size: 0.000MB
Pass 1/1, compression time 00:00:00.594 (0.00fps).
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\Inter*.ppm
C:\Programme\DVD Rebuilder\QMatOp\frames\Inter*.ppm konnte nicht gef
unden werden
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\temp.avs .\avs2avi.log -o l -c MSVC

AVS2AVI v1.31 (c) 2002,2003 Christophe PARIS (christophe.paris@free.fr)
Contributions by: int21h
Additional code (c) 2002,2003 David Leatherdale (dave@leatherdale.net)

Source:
* Filename: .\temp.avs
* Bit depth: 32
* FOURCC: none (RGB)
* Frames: 240
* Resolution: 496x56
Compressor:
* Name: Microsoft Video 1
* FOURCC: MSVC

Pass 1/1 frame 8/240, 0.00fps, ETA: , size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 136/240, 446.67fps, ETA: 00:00:00.237, size: 0.00MB

* Frames: 0
* Key frames: 240
* Size: 0.000MB
Pass 1/1, compression time 00:00:00.601 (0.00fps).
Finished
Execing cmd.exe /C del .\temp.avs
IntraMatrix : W01000000001001
8 16 16 16 17 18 21 24
16 16 16 16 17 19 22 25
16 16 17 18 20 22 25 29
16 16 18 21 24 27 31 36
17 17 20 24 30 35 41 47
18 19 22 27 35 44 54 65
21 22 25 31 41 54 70 88
24 25 29 36 47 65 88 115
InterMatrix : W01000000001001
18 18 18 18 19 21 23 27
18 18 18 18 19 21 24 29
18 18 19 20 22 24 28 32
18 18 20 24 27 30 35 40
19 19 22 27 33 39 46 53
21 21 24 30 39 50 61 73
23 24 28 35 46 61 79 98
27 29 32 40 53 73 98 127
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\Intra*.ppm
C:\Programme\DVD Rebuilder\QMatOp\frames\Intra*.ppm konnte nicht gef
unden werden
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\temp.avs .\avs2avi.log -o l -c MSVC

AVS2AVI v1.31 (c) 2002,2003 Christophe PARIS (christophe.paris@free.fr)
Contributions by: int21h
Additional code (c) 2002,2003 David Leatherdale (dave@leatherdale.net)

Source:
* Filename: .\temp.avs
* Bit depth: 32
* FOURCC: none (RGB)
* Frames: 240
* Resolution: 496x56
Compressor:
* Name: Microsoft Video 1
* FOURCC: MSVC

Pass 1/1 frame 3/240, 0.00fps, ETA: , size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 128/240, 420.00fps, ETA: 00:00:00.271, size: 0.00MB

* Frames: 0
* Key frames: 240
* Size: 0.000MB
Pass 1/1, compression time 00:00:00.601 (0.00fps).
Finished
Execing cmd.exe /C del .\temp.avs
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\Inter*.ppm
C:\Programme\DVD Rebuilder\QMatOp\frames\Inter*.ppm konnte nicht gef
unden werden
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\temp.avs .\avs2avi.log -o l -c MSVC

AVS2AVI v1.31 (c) 2002,2003 Christophe PARIS (christophe.paris@free.fr)
Contributions by: int21h
Additional code (c) 2002,2003 David Leatherdale (dave@leatherdale.net)

Source:
* Filename: .\temp.avs
* Bit depth: 32
* FOURCC: none (RGB)
* Frames: 240
* Resolution: 496x56
Compressor:
* Name: Microsoft Video 1
* FOURCC: MSVC

Pass 1/1 frame 3/240, 0.00fps, ETA: , size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 127/240, 420.88fps, ETA: 00:00:00.273, size: 0.00MB

* Frames: 0
* Key frames: 240
* Size: 0.000MB
Pass 1/1, compression time 00:00:00.597 (0.00fps).
Finished
Execing cmd.exe /C del .\temp.avs
IntraMatrix : W01000100002001
8 16 16 16 17 18 21 24
16 16 16 16 17 19 22 25
16 16 17 18 20 22 25 29
16 16 18 21 24 27 31 36
17 17 20 24 30 35 41 47
18 19 22 27 35 44 54 65
21 22 25 31 41 54 70 88
24 25 29 36 47 65 88 115
InterMatrix : W01000100002001
18 18 18 18 19 21 23 27
18 18 18 18 19 21 24 29
18 18 19 20 22 24 28 32
18 18 20 24 27 30 35 40
19 19 22 27 33 39 46 53
21 21 24 30 39 50 61 73
23 24 28 35 46 61 79 98
27 29 32 40 53 73 98 127
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\Intra*.ppm
C:\Programme\DVD Rebuilder\QMatOp\frames\Intra*.ppm konnte nicht gef
unden werden
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\temp.avs .\avs2avi.log -o l -c MSVC

AVS2AVI v1.31 (c) 2002,2003 Christophe PARIS (christophe.paris@free.fr)
Contributions by: int21h
Additional code (c) 2002,2003 David Leatherdale (dave@leatherdale.net)

Source:
* Filename: .\temp.avs
* Bit depth: 32
* FOURCC: none (RGB)
* Frames: 240
* Resolution: 496x56
Compressor:
* Name: Microsoft Video 1
* FOURCC: MSVC

Pass 1/1 frame 3/240, 0.00fps, ETA: , size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 130/240, 426.67fps, ETA: 00:00:00.262, size: 0.00MB

* Frames: 0
* Key frames: 240
* Size: 0.000MB
Pass 1/1, compression time 00:00:00.601 (0.00fps).
Finished
Execing cmd.exe /C del .\temp.avs
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\frames\Inter*.ppm
C:\Programme\DVD Rebuilder\QMatOp\frames\Inter*.ppm konnte nicht gef
unden werden
Execing cmd.exe /C .\avs2avi .\temp.avs .\avs2avi.log -o l -c MSVC

AVS2AVI v1.31 (c) 2002,2003 Christophe PARIS (christophe.paris@free.fr)
Contributions by: int21h
Additional code (c) 2002,2003 David Leatherdale (dave@leatherdale.net)

Source:
* Filename: .\temp.avs
* Bit depth: 32
* FOURCC: none (RGB)
* Frames: 240
* Resolution: 496x56
Compressor:
* Name: Microsoft Video 1
* FOURCC: MSVC

Pass 1/1 frame 3/240, 0.00fps, ETA: , size: 0.00MB
Pass 1/1 frame 131/240, 422.95fps, ETA: 00:00:00.262, size: 0.00MB

* Frames: 0
* Key frames: 240
* Size: 0.000MB
Pass 1/1, compression time 00:00:00.600 (0.00fps).
Finished
Execing cmd.exe /C del .\temp.avs
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\intra\*.* > NUL
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\inter\*.* > NUL
Execing cmd.exe /C del /Q .\pics\*.* > NUL
Execing cmd.exe /C .\Calculate.bat 17 1
Exception in thread "main" java.lang.ArithmeticException: / by zero
at QMatOp.AverageMatrix(QMatOp.java:589)
at QMatOp.ECLCalculate(QMatOp.java:347)
at QMatOp.main(QMatOp.java:68)

Can anyone help?