Service Pack 2 Downloads on April 12

[em64t]

Yes I am aware SP2 has been available for a while. But apparently Microsoft thinks every WXP computer needs it. I wonder if Microsoft will have adequate bandwidth. What I like to know is what are your take on it.
Here (http://www.ebcvg.com/articles.php?id=670%22) is a news article.

[Sirber]

I've got no choice since I have a troublesome HDD and the fix only works on SP2 :eek:

[markrb]

Consider their postion for a sec. You can't keep supporting, in effect, 3 operating systems (XP, SP1, SP2).
Each one would need their own unique patches and fixes at times when you need to patch a patch.
If you don't want or need to patch then there is no need to go to SP2.
Space and time are wasted if you need to identify, write, store and distribute that many variations.

Of course I agree that they should have got it right the first time, but even the best miss things at times.

As a note I am no M$ fan, but I do get this choice.


Mark

[ppera2]

There are other ways to get SP2, not only download from some (MS) site.

For instance: PC magazine cover CD or DVD's. Get it from your friend...


I had only troubles with both of XP service packs. Currently I run old XP, without any SP, what I retrieved from CD, 3 year old, where I put Ghost of set system.
It works well, but I know that SP1 is required for disks larger than 128 GB. Until I purchase such HD, I will not bother with damn service packs.
They require more RAM (I have it enough btw.), introducing new bugs etc.

[Mug Funky]

still running 2k here.

probably wont change until this machine's deep in the cold, cold ground.

but i'm getting a new box soon, so i'll see what happens there (looking at options, but i want something fast as hell, reliable and quiet enough to have in my room). maybe i'll just put win2k + linux on it (but i've been saying that about my current machine for ages and still haven't managed to do it).

[Doom9]

Consider their postion for a sec. You can't keep supporting, in effect, 3 operating systems (XP, SP1, SP2).Not only that.. there's W2K, and the server operating systems as well.

And keep in mind, it's not a 250MB download for everyone.. that's the network installation. Update via windowsupdate will be much smaller. Yet, I expect windowsupdate to come to a halt that day.. patch days with patches weighing several MBs already brought windowsupdate to its knees in the past. Yet, that's not our problem, is it?

@ppera2: considering your .net fiasco I think your problems lie elsewhere ;)

[The Geek]

I've been running SP2 since it came out, so I don't care :D

Anyways, the automatic download will only happen if you're using automatic updates. If you're not using it, you won't get SP2 automatically.
A friend of mine has XP SP1 and is on dialup, but his automatic updates are not active, so no problem for him either.

And anyone who has autoupdate enabled, deserves to get SP2. I mean, what's the reason for autoupdate if you don't want updates. It's a contradiction.

The Geek

[niamh]

The day SP2 is compulsory, is the day I go back to 2K, supported or not. SP1 irritates me often enough, and I don't need more intrusive pieces of constant advice from M$ popping up on my screen or deciding what's best for me :)

[Sirber]

"Get gentoo" they say ;)

[ppera2]

Originally posted by Doom9

And keep in mind, it's not a 250MB download for everyone.. that's the network installation. Update via windowsupdate will be much smaller. Yet, ....

@ppera2: considering your .net fiasco I think your problems lie elsewhere ;)

Why you think that it will be much smaller?

My NET fiasco is just small episode, from time when I was very upset because of shitty work of SP2 'aided' XP.
I posted here, at PC Soft & hardware description of problem, and nobody replied. Just in brief: I had troubles with capturing and HD speed, all software based, and no driver reinstall and cleaning helped. On SP2 XP, installed just 2 months earlier, without Internet access, 100% no virus or worms or similar.
But retrieving back old XP helped. Even if I changed half of my hardware in meantime.

I have more time of experience with diverse computers than many of forum members have years of life. I could start here thead about poor and sad history of PC and MS Windows, a list of very stupid and short seeing solutions plus unrealised promises.

Actually, I don't care much what I say about MS Windows. It really not deserves to be serious and careful when talk about. I just act same as MS with his costumers.

[em64t]

As expected there is a mixed response.

The reason I am asking is the hardware I have WXP on has NOT been certified for SP2. I do not want to see my computer crash and burn due to a forced upgrade.

Like a number of you, I am running W2K on other computer. I even have an old dual Pentium Pro computer on WNT 4.0. The problem with the older OS, is some of the newer software does not run well or at all. Of course I use Linux as well. For these people, there is the "could care less" option.

[Shinigami-Sama]

I always have ot check my auto-updates before aplling them
I had to uninstall sp2 because it caused roughly 4 major chrashes per day
thne I uninstalled it and I'm down about 3 crashes per week thouhg I asssume most of these newer ones are from my HDD being improrly installed by my distro...
anywyas if they force me to install sp1 I'll get my win98 cd from the shelf...
win98 on this comp hehe

[Arachnotron]

I use it. I haven't found more problems with it than with the previous versions. XP was dog-slow, and it still is :)
I don't mind regular updating much, I am used to it by now. My Suse linux updates just as often, it only is less intrusive about it. ;)

In general I find the security related improvements a good thing. They may be irritating to experienced users, but they do slowly decrease the workload for the poor sods like me that have to clean up after the average n00bs that use XP for unsafe internet.

As an aside, the latest service pack for Windows 2003 finally blocks access from the internet untill AFTER all the updates are installed. I wonder how many people caught something nasty by going online with their unpatched windows machines in order to reach windows update...

M$ has a long way to go yet, but slowly they are getting there.

[Angelus]

how are they going to force me to install it? Couldn't my firewall stop this from happening?

[Doom9]

you can still chose not to install it.. just deselect it. All that really happens is that regardless of whether you have the SP2 blocker installed or not, once you go to the windowsupdate site, sp2 will one of the critical upgrades that'll automatically be selected. But unless you have the update mechanism configured to automatically download and install, you'll always have the choice.

The reason I am asking is the hardware I have WXP on has NOT been certified for SP2Hardware has nothing to do with it (well, there's the NX flag for DEP, but that's about it).

Of course, the only way to install a service pack properly is make a slipstream CD, format c: and then install again.

[em64t]

@Doom9, perhaps I worded it wrong. But the manufacturer highly recommends against installing SP2 and for users who did install on similar hardware have reported many problems in another forum. I suppose I will just disable the automatic updates.

[spuddog]

I've been running it since it came out. I haven't had any problems. I can't understand the opposition to it. If you are running any microsoft operating system, you learn to live with it or switchnto something else. if the time comes that enough people dislike microsoft, they wil switch to something else.

[em64t]

If you use Windows Update, then update from Microsoft website only. Hopefully Microsoft website does not get hacked.

http://bpm-today.newsfactor.com/bpmtechbrief/story.xhtml?story_id=32595

[ppera2]

Originally posted by Doom9
....
Hardware has nothing to do with it (well, there's the NX flag for DEP, but that's about it).

Of course, the only way to install a service pack properly is make a slipstream CD, format c: and then install again.

Right about hardware...

So, only properly way is fresh install and immediate SP ???

I hear it first time. You suggest that people destroy their hard set system, with maybe hundert or more installed programm - in other words about 1 week work while all that will be installed and set again... I'm pretty sure that 90% od people will rather choose to not install SP then.

What really offers XP SP2? Nothing unseen. We have already firewalls, popup blockers. It larms that you don't have antivirus, but give it not. And who needs then automatic update? For what?

I like to see what happening on my machine.

Too much talk about nothing... SP2 is free, but we had all it earlier, also free.

[Doom9]

But the manufacturer highly recommends against installing SP2 and for users who did install on similar hardware have reported many problems in another forum.Hmm.. hardware in itself should not cause any trouble.. but drivers potentially could. Though considering that SP2 has been out for 8 months, and that it has been feature complete and available to hard- and software makers for much longer, this does not shed a good light on company that makes your hardware.

I run more than 20 WinXP SP2 on old hardware (BX chipset, P3s) without a glitch and I've installed a number of slipstreamed SP2s on other PCs.. not one single problem here. I presume as usual most problems come from a screwed up Windows installation and doing a complete reinstall with SP2 preloaded would not result in any of those problems. There's a few softwares that initially had problems, but if they haven't been fixed by now, they probably never will and you better start looking for something else. There will be a time when you can forget about patches and security updates unless you use SP2 (not sure if that's going to happen just right now.. but at least support for plain WinXP without any service pack has been canned already). So either way, you'll have to deal with the service pack sooner or later.

I had to uninstall sp2 because it caused roughly 4 major chrashes per dayThat's not the service pack.. that's your hardware (or perhaps very poorly written software that messes at a point of the system where it really shouldn't... drivers are most prone to such behavior). Since W2K, Microsoft's stability track record has been quite good (can't compare it to other operating systems, but still considering it's Microsoft and what used to happen with pseudo 32 bit operating systems before, it is a major improvement). If W2K or XP regularly crashes on you, chances are quite good it's not Microsoft's fault.

[Doom9]

So, only properly way is fresh install and immediate SP ???It's been like that forever.. like it or not. But suit yourself.. you're the one with the messed up system.. the ones I'm running work just fine and with 13 years of installing and maintaining PCs on my back, perhaps I might just have a very small idea of how to do things... or perhaps I'm just the luckiest guy on earth.

What really offers XP SP2? If you take the average PC out there.. it is a huge improvement in security. Blaster, Sasser, and Co are much less likely to ocurr and in the end that benefits us all, not just those who have been affected.

[ppera2]

Originally posted by spuddog
I've been running it since it came out. I haven't had any problems. I can't understand the opposition to it. If you are running any microsoft operating system, you learn to live with it or switchnto something else. if the time comes that enough people dislike microsoft, they wil switch to something else.

That's your luck. It means not that it's problemless.

Real problem with M$ and Windows is that we actually don't have real alternative. Windows established so big monopole that it killed much efforts (remember BEOS, Glide etc). Only Linux is live at moment, but it is not for exactly same circle of users. And not to talk about that you simle will not find many attractive titles in Linux version. There is only few high-class game for Linux - like Quake 1-3, I don't know about Doom3, but it's probably exists, because John Carmack programs in Linux. Unreal Tournament and not much more.

Where is most popular multiplayer game Counterstrike for Linux? Correct me if it arrived in meantime (I'm not follow it regularry).

And of course we have long list of 'Video backup' software what exists only in Win version.

Most of people actually dislikes M$ in this moment, but they simple can't switch, because no where...
This is closed circle - nobody will make software for some OS with few users, and nobody will make OS, because they expect that it will be without software, drivers (tested!).

Only hope is that M$ will destroy himself, as evil Romulian empire :D

[Shinigami-Sama]

Originally posted by Doom9
That's not the service pack.. that's your hardware (or perhaps very poorly written software that messes at a point of the system where it really shouldn't... drivers are most prone to such behavior). Since W2K, Microsoft's stability track record has been quite good (can't compare it to other operating systems, but still considering it's Microsoft and what used to happen with pseudo 32 bit operating systems before, it is a major improvement). If W2K or XP regularly crashes on you, chances are quite good it's not Microsoft's fault. [/B]
well then explain how my comp only crashes a few times a week due to overuse and hrad drive issues
Right after I un-installed sp2 it didn't crash slow down hiccup or even burp for well over four months. so therefore I conculed it was sp2 which caused the crashes. espeicly seeing as how the troubles I have now aer with my HDD and when I exect limits of my PSU

[communist]

There is a long list of unpatched software that will crash or show unexpected behaviour under SP2. Mostly games I know of that wont be patched because the creators arent any more / out of business.

Other than this I dont see (although I know there a lot of changes regarding security like no attacking point for Blaster etc.) a big difference to my old xp -no sp installation. I could use SP0 / SP1 aswell but due to recent HDD upgrade I was more or less 'forced' to install sp1 or sp2.

If you had few or no problems with XP by running up to date AV / Firewall software chances are that you'll have the same amount of problems with SP2 (except you run 'unpatched' software).

[Shinigami-Sama]

Originally posted by communist
There is a long list of unpatched software that will crash or show unexpected behaviour under SP2. Mostly games I know of that wont be patched because the creators arent any more / out of business.

If you had few or no problems with XP by running up to date AV / Firewall software chances are that you'll have the same amount of problems with SP2 (except you run 'unpatched' software).
yeah htats mostly it I like to use games that jsut barly have support for xp which probly hte reason why sp2 hates me and hte the reason I'll never upgrade to it I'd rather use my old win98 at least 99% of my s/w would run bugless on that os

[Doom9]

well then explain how my comp only crashes a few times a week due to overuse and hrad drive issuesThat's not supposed to happen, period. Try Linux, your PC will most likely still crash. You said it yourself, you don't trust your system.

And if you like to live in the past (dos games).. go live there and use operating systems that belong there. Doom and Duke 3D never ran better than under DOS. Games made in the pre-32 bit era (W3.x, W9x) work best with the appropriate OS.

And please learn how to type and use a spell checker now.. you've been told many times.

@communist: MS won't keep patching XP without a service pack, and while MS has a really bad security track record, installing the latest security patches should be a must for everyone. *nix boxes get hacked too when people don't apply security patches.

[Shinigami-Sama]

I don't use dos games anymore I use old emulators mostly seeing as how my ol consols deied also as I;ve said many times before I have something calls dislexia I'm sure some of you have heard of it before and this seems to be hte only board that seems to have a problem with it
everyother board has accept the fact I have a medical condihtion but here aldut boards kid boards jsut not here makes me think
and I try and check thouhg my opsts and I don't have access to a spell checker considering I don't have enough money to my m$ word and all I highly daught that xp has it built in
now to keep this on topic
my system jsut recently devopled HDD issuse after a power outage durning a defrag
also sp2 offers no great anything imho so if they force me get it I'll just remove it

[communist]

Originally posted by Doom9
MS won't keep patching XP without a service pack, and while MS has a really bad security track record, installing the latest security patches should be a must for everyone. *nix boxes get hacked too when people don't apply security patches.
Yep - totally correct and I wouldn expect them to support 3 flavors of WinXP. Sooner or later everyone who uses his XP machine for intenet etc. should/will upgrade, either because they get hit by a 'old' exploit or because they upgrade in advance.

Originally posted by Doom9
And if you like to live in the past (dos games).. go live there and use operating systems that belong there. Doom and Duke 3D never ran better than under DOS. Games made in the pre-32 bit era (W3.x, W9x) work best with the appropriate OS

Nah not that old ;)
I was referring to a rather long list of games similar (this is just about default firewall blocking) to this (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/842242), or different behaviour like mentioned here (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/884130), though I cant find it anymore.
For ex. one game will always crash and display an error message when exiting, sometimes you'll have to call up task manager and manually kill it but the game itself runs ok. Just a little inconvenience ;)

[Arachnotron]

Many problems with older programs and recent service packs originate with the programs not being fully XP or even Windows compatible. You cannot blame M$ for all of that.

In the past, M$ has leaned over backwards to remain backwards compatible, which resulted in windows 95 being one of the most instable OS'ses ever. XP-sp2 is not so forgiving any more. There are guidelines on how to write a Windows compatible program, but somehow some programmers never bother with those. Especially with drivers, this can have deadly consequences for your OS.

I still encounter programs that will only run with full administrator rights, more than 10 years after M$ introduced the first user right management options and NTFS. I still encounter programs that dump temporary and config files in the strangest places (Firefox and Mozilla come to mind; a cache should be under local settings, NOT application data) playing havock with things like roaming user profiles.

Cleanly written fully windows compatible code will mostly survive service packs (there are always exceptions). But there is more to that than "hey, it starts on my PC, so it must work everywhere"

And before you acuse me of being pro-MS: try installing the latest Linux distro and running a binary from 10 years ago. Or better still, a driver..... Even if you still have the source and re-compile it, it will most likely fail.

My solution has been to keep an old machine about for old games and such. It's a P-III running windows 98SE which has been hacked so I can boot into dosmode too. It has my old Voodoo2 SLI , riva TNT and soundblaster AWE in it, so I can run virtually any old dos or windows game on it. Needless to say, it is not connected to the internet.

[Doom9]

I have something calls dislexia a spellchecker will come in very handy then and there are free ones that come as an IE plugin..

I still encounter programs that will only run with full administrator rightsAnd years after MS introduced halfway useable multi-user facilities with XP. It is a shame really. Hopefully they see things through with Longhorn (but I can already see the bitching mob..)

[Shinigami-Sama]

Originally posted by Doom9
a spellchecker will come in very handy then and there are free ones that come as an IE plugin..
I don't use IE and probly never will again

[Doom9]

I don't use IE and probly never will againSo... they also exist for Mozilla/Firefox. Here's a forinstance (found using the search;): http://spellbound.sourceforge.net/

[Audionut]

I've been using winxp pro with SP2 for some time now, with no problems. In fact I think the system is alot better overall compared to SP1.

Of course I get rid of all the crap I don't need before installing the OS. (http://nuhi.msfn.org/download.html)

[ppera2]

Originally posted by Arachnotron
...
In the past, M$ has leaned over backwards to remain backwards compatible, which resulted in windows 95 being one of the most instable OS'ses ever...


That is what M$ propaganda says. But it is only partially true. Main reason why W95 and 98-ME were instable is in kernel. XP uses NT based kernel which is much more robust. They now completely abandoned old kernel, what was expected and announced. Why it not happened before? Simple, NT kernel is much more demanding, so in past it would be limiting factor for users with machined with less RAM and slower CPU.
As everything real good, NT kernel is also not developed by MS team, at least not in beginning.

[Arachnotron]

That is what M$ propaganda says. But it is only partially true. Main reason why W95 and 98-ME were instable is in kernel. XP uses NT based kernel which is much more robust. They now completely abandoned old kernel, what was expected and announced. Why it not happened before? Simple, NT kernel is much more demanding, so in past it would be limiting factor for users with machined with less RAM and slower CPU.
As everything real good, NT kernel is also not developed by MS team, at least not in beginning. I canot fully agree with this. The last "old" version of Windows was Windows ME. By then, MS had hidden the dos mode (though it was still available with a few hacks) and tacked on so much extra stuff that in the end Windows NT 4.0 actually ran faster than Windows 98 ME. The difference may have had more to do with the extra's than with the "pure" kernels involved, but still. Any new M$ OS that comes out pushes the hardware and runs slugish on older hardware (and after a while sluggish on new hardware too :D)

I know M$ bought themselves a tame VMS developer, but I wouldn't go as far as to say they kept the whole kernel.

[leadman584]

XP SP2, is not really a problem. If you can make a slipstream disk with SP2 integrated, problems should be nil. I have built several systems for people, and installed OEM XP SP2, without incident. Unfortunatley, every attempt to install SP2 as a patch, has failed miserably. It is quite likely my fault, and not Microsofts. Nevertheless, 4 computers in my house, do not have SP2 installed.

This thread:
http://forums.divx.com/eve/ubb.x/a/tpc/f/511101651/m/448103052

Is my attempt to get ideas, and give suggestions, on how to run XP, with minimal problems. The last time I had to clean install windows, on one of my boxes, was entirely my fault. I knocked a SATA cable loose, from one of the 4 drives running in RAID0, in my encoding box. I learned a valuable lesson. Image everything. An ASR will restore a system to it's former state, with very little trouble. All of my systems run 24/7. They are encoding video or folding at 100% CPU usage.

I've been reading, and hopefully learning, how to carry out a successful sysprep. You can integrate SP2 into the needed files, and eliminate .dll conflicts from SP1 to SP2 upgrade. Strip away machine specific drivers, and image it. Much easier said than done. I'm still real fuzzy on how to make the needed registry mods. Plenty more reading to do. If anybody can identify some of the conflicts that occur, when upgrading from SP1 to SP2, please post them.

SP2 is an honest attempt by Microsoft, to make systems more secure, and trouble free. I have a hard time justifying this patch for systems that are running flawlessly, without it.

http://www.hardfolding.com/ftag.php/mem/6206.png (http://www.hardfolding.com?go=38&id=6206)

[Halcy0n]

You people who claim to crash 3 times a week must've configured something wrong. I have 3 computers (including an old P3 500 mhz) that I've installed SP2 on with no problems.

I don't know what you guys are whining about, there's no huge changes from sp1. The firewall and security center can be disabled. Someone also released a patch for that 10 maximum new connections per second limit too. It's a lot more secure than previous versions and I don't see a real reason not to upgrade.

[ppera2]

Originally posted by Arachnotron
I canot fully agree with this. The last "old" version of Windows was Windows ME. By then, MS had hidden the dos mode (though it was still available with a few hacks) and tacked on so much extra stuff that in the end Windows NT 4.0 actually ran faster than Windows 98 ME. The difference may have had more to do with the extra's than with the "pure" kernels involved, but still. Any new M$ OS that comes out pushes the hardware and runs slugish on older hardware (and after a while sluggish on new hardware too :D)


You are right of course. Kernel is not everything. If you fill OS with lot of more or less necessary stuff it will be slower (and slower).
It is problem by XP too. They inserted too many 'helping' services, functions. But they act in many cases as stupid and too helpful servant - just irritate user (master).
There is no easy way to switch off such 'services', we have some tweak programs and registry hacks.

For instance 'service' witch turns off DMA by IDE discs is very un-user friendly realised. It silently turns off DMA, and user has no idea about it until observes that something is slowed down. Target (inexperienced) user can't solve it alone. There is nothing in help files about it. If someone gives here at least one reasonable explanation why is it so solved, I will never say a word again M$ and Windows here :)

[communist]

AFAIK it gets disabled after several failed read / write attempts. See 'explanation' here (http://users.bigpond.net.au/ninjaduck/itserviceduck/udma_fix/) ;)

[Doom9]

@ppera2: I just found you a reason to upgrade. See the article here: http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=817472

Windows XP
This problem was first corrected in Microsoft Windows XP Service Pack 2.

Plus, you can turn all the fancy GUI stuff off... go to the control panel, system, advanced - performance - settings and set the radio button to "adjust for best performance". Using TweakUI you can disable even more, and then there's msconfig, where you can turn off annoying little things like the msn messenger. It takes you 5 minutes tops to do all that, but those are 5 minutes well spent. I'm sure somewhere out there you'll also find a registry fix for the "send problem report to microsoft" for program crashes.

Target (inexperienced) user can't solve it alone.If you tell target that your drive access mode has been reset because of too many CRC errors.. target will feel confused and helpless as well. And there's actually that KB article.. it's not if Microsoft just put it under the rug. You'd be surprised to learn for how many issues there's actually a KB article with a solution or workaround. But, most people will never even think about searching and instead just blame Bill Gates once more.

[niamh]

I'm sure somewhere out there you'll also find a registry fix for the "send problem report to microsoft" for program crashes.
You can get rid of it in msconfig and some other place I keep forgetting about right after I access it.

The firewall and security center can be disabled.
It comes back after every reboot if you happen to have only a hardware firewall or some such :rolleyes: maybe there is a place in msconfig to get rid of that;it would be nice

Since this is the 11th, I'd like to know if there are updates that are worth it (i.e. actually useful), because tomorrow I'll be stuck :D. I run bare SP1 right now.

On another note here is a direct link (http://www.softwarepatch.com/windows/winxpsp1download.html) to SP1a, in case of future reformats, it might come in handy to have it on the hard drive for those who refuse sp2. (I've been waiting for microsoft.com/downloads for the last 20 minutes, they're looking busy :D)

[Doom9]

It comes back after every reboot if you happen to have only a hardware firewall or some suchYou can configure it to assume you're using your own firewall and virus scanner.. then it leaves you alone. I've never seen the security center since the first windows start after installing a slipstreamed sp2. I suppose you'll also have to configure the update wizard, but should you not be able to fully disable this (bad idea imho.. at least checking if there are new important upgrades makes sense.. you can still decide to install them later), at least you can set it to notify you only.. and here obtrusiveness works towards your advantage.. you get rid of the notification if you install the upgrade, and in case of important patches.. it makes sense to install them, even should you happen to use an alternative browser (as an example)

btw, the company I work for has automatically distributed the sp2 blocker.. it'll be interesting to see what happens when I start up my machines tomorrow morning (all the boxes I administrate on my own have been upgraded shortly after SP2 was released.. but those run outside the control of our IT so they couldn't stop me from using SP2).. they do automatically distribute patches, but I guess most people have still configured automatic update checking.. I'm guessing our Internet access will be unavailable for a while.. perhaps I should work at home until the mayhem is over.

[communist]

Security Center?
Originally posted by niamh
It comes back after every reboot if you happen to have only a hardware firewall or some such :rolleyes: maybe there is a place in msconfig to get rid of that;it would be nice
Start -> Run -> services.msc [ENTER] -> double click on Security Center, change Startup Type from Automatic to Disabled.
I have seen it only one time after installing SP2 this way.

[ppera2]

Originally posted by communist
AFAIK it gets disabled after several failed read / write attempts. See 'explanation' here (http://users.bigpond.net.au/ninjaduck/itserviceduck/udma_fix/) ;)

I know why it gets disabled. I just said that it is not good that OS does not says anything about it.
What you would say if traffic control just simple decreased power of your engine to 10%, instead of warning you that you drive too fast?

[Doom9]

What you would say if traffic control just simple decreased power of your engine to 10%, instead of warning you that you drive too fast?Actually, high end cars do just that.. you cannot drive as fast as the engine would permit.. at some point there's an electronic override and you can press the accelerator all you want, the car just isn't going to get any faster. At the same time, certain french cars prevent you from breaking some time ;)

[ppera2]

Originally posted by Doom9
@ppera2: I just found you a reason to upgrade. See the article here: http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=817472


Nice. It shows that MS learns and does some good stuff. Little slow and on too complicated way... Administration is there, in every byte of every programm :D

Btw. I installed SP1 on one of my computers, which is not connected to Internet. Reason was attaching of large HD.
I learned something in meantime: must deinstall Alcohol 120%, and probably other Virtual CD drives, or SP1 will complain about that some program uses ATAPI.SYS, and will not install.

[ppera2]

Doom9:

Yeah, I read about it, long time ago. I think that some BMW, series 7 or something like has it some 10 years ago. But it is described in 'manual', certainly (otherwise can be dangerous too by wild overtaking attempts).

[Doom9]

I learned something in meantime: must deinstall Alcohol 120%, and probably other Virtual CD drives, or SP1 will complain about that some program uses ATAPI.SYS, and will not install.Don't tell me they haven't fixed that in newer versions? If not, blame that on the software maker, not Microsoft.. Microsoft does provide many resources for developers to ensure compatibility. I rememeber that Deamon Tools had some issues with SP2 initially but that was quickly resolved as well. I can't understand how you can blame Microsoft for software makers not upgrading their tools when the OS gets adapted. Do you blame Linus as well if the binary drivers for your add-on card only work with a previous kernel? As operating systems get updated, software has to be updated as well.. it has always been like that and this is by no means limited to the Windows platform.

We get this on a weekly basis at work that some of the products we're installing are not officially incompatible with the latest service packs.. but the customers put the blame on the proper programmers.. not Microsoft (they provide patches that are important for our customers), but the software maker that doesn't keep up.

[ppera2]

Originally posted by Doom9
Don't tell me they haven't fixed that in newer versions? If not, blame that on the software maker, not Microsoft.. Microsoft does provide many resources for developers to ensure compatibility.

This was not intended to blame Microsoft. I just wrote it with idea that it can help someone with such problem.

Btw. currently I don't have Linux installed (I had it). Simple have no time for too many OS and computer... Must go now :)

[DigitAl56K]

Nevermind SP2, anyone running Windows Update today will see this critical update: "Microsoft Windows Installer 3.1", which I thought was pretty funny ;)