Strange behaviour after converting menu with VobBlanker

[Charly_s]

Hello,

I have changed a moving menu into a still menu (with sound) with VobBlanker (Minority Report). The time of the PCG is the same as in the original menu, and if I play the menu with WinDVD 4 everything works fine, just like I wanted it.

But if I burn the DVD and play it on my Philips DVD player, the menu shows up for just halve a second, disappears, and comes back again, and this keeps going on and on and.....

The only thing I could see is that when I look at the preview of the menu, and select info, the timestamp says 0:00:00. :confused:

I have checked this with another movie which also has a still menu and music, and there the timestamp says 0:01:00, which is exactly the time of the PGC.

Off course I can edit the still time of the PGC/cell, but then I do not have the music anymore.

Is there a way to change the timestamp of the still menu, or are there other solutions?

Charly_s

[jsoto]

I'll check it. I believe I can manage to get a copy of this DVD.

Just to know:
which version of VobBlanker: 1.6.0.6 or 1.6.0.5
DVD Region , PAL, NTSC..
Did you blank something in menus? (no-button cells i.e.)
Does menushrink produces the same problem?

jsoto
PS: In any case, be careful: motion2still is experimental. Not always produces a good output.

[Charly_s]

Hello,

I used version 1.6.0.6

the disk is a region 2 pal version.

I left the menu in it's original version, just hide some of the buttons, but not in the first menu that comes up

If you like I can provide you with the menu files for analysis that I use for testing myselve, it's only about 15 Mb, so I don't have to burn a complete DVD.

unfortunally I do not have the original files anymore

Charly_s

[blutach]

@Charly

This 1/2 second thing is representative of an intro cell that flashes by, usually without buttons. It should be blanked or by-passed. and then lead in to the main menu with buttons. There may be a repeat link somewhere, for some reason, or a stop that's not being recognised.

As jsoto said, does MenuShrink exhibit the same problem?

The timestamp is not an issue - the software player is telling you it's a still.

Can you upload your IFOs?


@jsoto - I have MR, R4, which is probably like R2 (both being PAL). I'll have a look at it today :)

Regards

[jsoto]

OK, found MR Region 2 PAL.

Done a test and it works like a charm in my Thompson 5200 and in my Airis 103...

EDIT: My menu is 25 MB , with 2 LUs English and spanish.. (12 and 14 MB IIRC)

jsoto

[Charly_s]

Hello,

i have tested the DVD in my older Philips player, and that plays it without any problem.

My Philips DVD recorder however does not, very strange.

The other DVD also with still does work perfectly

If you still want the files, just let me know where you want them.

we can use http://s24.yousendit.com if you like

thankx

Charly_s

[jsoto]

Originally posted by Charly_s
If you still want the files, just let me know where you want them.
No, I got the DVD. But I'd like to have your DVD recorder... Could you send it to me? :p
Well I'll look inside the files to see if there is something strange there...
Could you check if menushrink show the same problem?

jsoto

[blutach]

R4 MR had no probs with either MenuShrink or VobBlanker. Played on all my players, incl. PowerDVD v6 and 2 standalones.

Regards

[Surf]

I too like to examine the Philip recorder. :D

Menu2still works like a charm and I am immune to the audio truncated warnings that shows up on the log.

As to Charly's problem, perhaps stilling at the cell level and choose CUSTOM marking would solve it?

[Charly_s]

Hi all,

I have tried it with MenuShrink as well, with the same result,
the menu just is flashing, an no music is playing (With WinDVD everything works fine).

I have looked at another movie with a still menu with music as wel, and here the timestamp, when I look at the preview of the menu, also has the full length of the clip.

@ Surf and Jsoto: If you like I can send you a copy of my DVD recorder by E-mail:D

Any ideas?

Is it possible to edit the timestamp of the still? (just for testing purposes) and where do I do that?

Charly_S

[Surf]

aaw, I'll settle for a pic of the recorder then.

Like I said earlier, this may solve your problem. Access the menu, choose CELL, select the CELL, click the STILL button, slide the slider to the desired frame, choose CUSTOM from the dropdown, MARK the spot, upto you to keep audio, OK, ACCEPT and exit. Hope this works.

[Charly_s]

@ surf

Hi,

I have tried this, and it really makes no difference, it still plays for about half a second, and then starts over again.

I see no problem when I use my software DVD player.

by the way, here is my dvd recorder:

http://www.p4c.philips.com/files/h/hdrw720_00/hdrw720_00_tlm_.jpg



Charly_s

[sweetness]

Originally posted by Charly_s
Is it possible to edit the timestamp of the still? (just for testing purposes) and where do I do that?
don't know if that will help. but if you want to try(or just for the sake of knowing)
open the ifo of the menu with ifoedit. click VTSM_PGCI_UT and then your PGC-Menu_X(X being your menu PGC that is stilled). if the PGC is only one cell this is easy just change the Playback Time (BCD) to 65600 (00:01:00.0. 25/fps) then go down to cell playback: and change that BCD to the same number. if there are more cells you would have to play around a little more. see here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?threadid=71176#post449000) for more info. the cell times have to add up to the PGC time.
but i don't think that will help.

BTW have you tried with out the audio?

edit:link

[jsoto]

Which "timestamp" are you talking about? The one which is shown in Info panel, Audio section?

jsoto

[Charly_s]

@ Sweetness

I have looked into the IFO file, but it allready has the right value.
What I meaned it the stimestamp of the still in the VOB file.


@Jsoto

If I open the VIDEO_TS folder with PGCEdit, select the PCG with the menu, and click on preview and ten click on Info it shows the timestamp.

I now have looked at 2 different movies with still menu with audio, and in borth movies the timestamp is the length of the PGC.

If I look at the timestamp of the still menu created with menushrink or VobBlanker is is 0:00:00. Maybe my DVD player does not like this, because this is the only thing I could see that is different from the other movies.

Charly_s

[jsoto]

@Charly_s
As you can see in the image (MR menu), after VB processing, in non-blanked cells the timestamp is not zero in my case :confused: This timestamp is the length of the cell.

http://www.videohelp.com/~jsoto/temp/timest.jpg

Could you check if you are in a blanked (non-buttons) cell?. If yes, may be your settop does not like blank cells (no stills) in menus. Try unchecking the "blank cells without buttons" checkbox

If you are previewing a PGC and the first cell has been blanked, the timestamp shown will be zero, because it is the one of the first cell (Actually, the blank cell length is 12 frames, 0.4 secs)

I'm not going to investigate much more this issue, I don't know what to do...

jsoto

[Charly_s]

Hello,

thanks for your help, but I have given up.

I changed the still time in the cell from 0 to 255, and now the menu's work, however I do not have sound (music). :(

It works, but it is not what I wanted.

anyway, thanks for your assistance

Charly_s

[jsoto]

Did you try to change from 0 to 1 instead of 255?
I had a similar issue in my Thompson, but in stills w/o audio.

jsoto

[Charly_s]

Hello Jsoto,

I have tried it with the cell time set to 1.

Now it stay on the screen just a little longer, but is still keeps on restarting the cell.

greetings,

Charly_s

[jsoto]

Could you try
A) blanking the no-buttons cells. Just feed the current DVD in VB and select again still with audio, but check the "Blank no-buttons cells" checkbox. (Use Input folder, skipping all the rest and processing only menus, and you will get it in a few secs)
B) Loading/Saving in PGCEdit. Your IFO has one unused sector in the middle. It shouldn't be a problem, but who knows...

jsoto

[nwg]

I did Minority Report R2 this week with MenuShrink. It plays fine on both PowerDVD and all my players (mainly Sony)

[Charly_s]

Hello,

I have tried it with the DVD I already had shrunk, but it did not matter, still the same. (I did not have the original source anymore).



Charly_s

[Charly_s]

@Jsoto.

I have tried your menu, but it does excactly the sam as the one I allready had, is just flashes.
As I stated before, it might be a DVD Recorder issue, since it's software is updated about once every 6 months. :rolleyes:

I will see if I can test this with some other DVD's I have.

thanks,

Charly_s

[Charly_s]

Hello,

I have tried VobBlanker with another movie (StarWars II), and the same thing happened, the menu just shows for a short time (a little longer now, the music start playing, en then it restarts again).

I wonder what's the difference between a DVD where the default menu is a still with music, and a dvd which is changed into stills with music by VobBlanker (or menushrink). My DVD player does not like the last one. :confused:

Charly_s

[jsoto]

I wonder what's the difference between a DVD where the default menu is a still with music, and a dvd which is changed into stills with music by VobBlanker (or menushrink). Me too... I'll try investigate this.

jsoto

[jeanl]

I'm interested too... But it's hard for us to find where the problem is, since we can't reproduce the problem!
jeanl

[Charly_s]

No, No, that's not completely true, you can reproduce the problem just like me.:D :D

It is just that only my DVD player (Philips HDRW 720) is the one that does not like the menu modified with VobBlanker / Menushrink.

Charly_s

[jeanl]

right! So you're suggesting we just need to get one :)!
Or maybe you can ship it to us just for the time for us to get the problem sorted out :D
jeanl

[CoNS]

LOL! Well, just wanted to let ya know that I've also had various
problems in the past playing backed up discs with one of the first standalone Phillips DVD-recorders that came out some years ago...

Even though my backups worked fine in other players, the Phillips DVD-recorder was unable to play some of them. Please notice that this was before the era of Motion2Still and MenuShrink!

[Charly_s]

Hello,

I just had some thoughts (please forgive me if I am making some mistakes, my technical knowledge on the subject is limited ;))

I personally do not think that the problem is in the IFO files, since no one else is having problems, and I can play the DVD in other DVD players and software players without problems.

I think that the problem lies in how my DVD recorder handles the DVD.

Instead of just looking at the IFO file when playing the menu PGC, it seems to look at the info in the VOB file. There should be some info on how long the still should be visible, I am just unable to find it (I have tried to find out with Vobedit, but the info is too complex for me.)

As I said before, I do have some DVD's with still menu's containing music, and those my DVD recorder plays without any problem.

Maybe this can guide you in the right direction?

Anyway, I saw that the new VobBlanker is out, and I will do some tests with the new one.

Charly_s

[jsoto]

There are no changes in VobBlanker motion2still internal engine..

But I had an idea..
Could you get a working DVD (original) with a still+audio menu and reduce it with VobBlanker or menushrink?. If the new DVD does not work, it should be easy to compare the two VOBs. (one cell should be enough)

jsoto

[Charly_s]

Hello Jsoto,

I have done this.

The files a both the same size (because nothing has been thrown away)
but the menu after I used VobBlanker has the same problem I had with the other movies.

would you like to have a look at the files (since I am not able to see the difference, or what to check it with)

Each menu is a little less than 3 Mb

Charly_s

[jeanl]

Charly_s,
This is great! I would be very interested in taking a look at both versions! You can send this to me at jean(dot)laroche(at)free(dot)fr

jsoto, I wonder if this isn't a case where the various pointers we're not really adjusting (VOBU_SRI, SYNCI etc) are coming back to bite us! It should be easy to see and fix...

Thanks in advance!

jeanl

EDIT: If you're interested, you can look at the files yourself. Open the VOB corresponding to the menu that's not working with vobedit and find the right VOB/CELL ID (you'll have to determine which VCID corresponds to that menu, which you can do either in vobblanker, or in PgcEdit, with the previews). Then in vobedit, I would look at the first navpack of that cell, in the original and modified versions, and try to see if there are any differences... That's what I'll do if you send me the files....

[Charly_s]

Hello Jean,

I have send you the files.

Let me know if (and where) you find anything,



Charly_s

[jsoto]

Hey! Please send them to me too...
My email is limited to 5 Mbytes, but you can do it with www.yousendit.com

jsoto

[jeanl]

jsoto, I took a quick look, and I don't see many differences, except in the SYNCI and VOBU_SR areas... But I'll look further tonight.
jeanl

[jsoto]

@Charly_s

Please open your After/VTS_01_0.VOB in VobEdit and change the values of Highlight end time and Buttons end time (offset 0x93 and 0x97) in the first Nav Pack to the original value. In After files it has been changed to -1 (0xFFFFFFFF)

The original value was: 5435107

Alternatlively, you can download the processed files from

http://s23.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=2KQAR22VV7YV63B7XRNNFHU1R4

Let us know what your settop does.

jsoto

[Charly_s]

@Jsoto,

thank you for taking all this time just to look into my problem.:)

I do not want to look too stupid, but I cannot find the values where you are talking about :confused:

I am using VobEdit 0.6, but you did not mention in which LBA those values are.

Greetings,

Charly_s

[jeanl]

Charly_s, jsoto said to do that in the first navpack which is at the top of the VOB file. Try to change the values at LBA 0 as in this:

http://img131.exs.cx/img131/1890/foo8sm.png (http://www.imageshack.us)


jeanl

[Charly_s]

Ah,

I did not have the "Button" selection checked :o , that's why I could not see the values that neede to be changed . I will test this when I get home from work tonight.

Charly_s

[Charly_s]

Hi,

I have tried the menu with the values changed, but it does not matter, the menu still flashes.

Charly_s

[jsoto]

So, it should be the VOBU_SRI pointers... May be I can give you an exe to test yourself.

jsoto

[jeanl]

Originally posted by jsoto
So, it should be the VOBU_SRI pointers... May be I can give you an exe to test yourself.

jsoto
Yes, I strongly suspect that. These values seem to be the only ones that differ. Looks like we're going to have to do it after all! I'm curious to see which of these guys is responsible for the problem Charly_s is seeing...

jeanl

[Charly_s]

Hello,

yes, you can send me an exe file to test

The problem must be in the VOB file, I used the before ifo's and the after vob and the menu kept restarting.

The I used the after IFO's and the before VOB, and the menu played correctly.

maybe this info is of some use for you?

greetings,

Charly_s

[jsoto]

One additional test... (I hope you are using a DVD-RW..)

Try this.
www.videohelp.com/~jsoto/temp/VobBlanker_2002b1_exe.zip

It fixes the SRI closest pointers (Prev and Next VOBUs). Seems to me the most critical ones, (and the easiest to fix, BTW).

jsoto

BTW, the beta also includes blutach's request (drag&drop parent folder)

EDIT: I've forgot to check the condition "with audio" when fixing the pointers, so probably "without audio" it does not work fine. Do not use this beta in motion2still without audio

[Charly_s]

Hi,

I have tried it with the files I send to you and it works, Now I could see the menu and listen to the music. Thank you. :) :)

To night I will also test of I now can convert a moving menu into a still one with music.

greetings,

Charly_s

[Charly_s]

Yes, yes, yes, It work's

I tried to convert a moving menu to a still with audio : ok

When I "converted" the menu that went wrong the first time( there was nothing to convert since it allready was a still with audio), it worked too after I burned it on a dvd

:thanks:

thank you

Charly_s

[jeanl]

jsoto, can you tell me which pointer you had to fix to make the resulting DVD work well? I'll try to add that to MenuShrink as well...
Thanks!
jeanl

[jsoto]

Good!.

jsoto

[jsoto]

I've fixed the pointers:
Previous VOBu (except in the first Vobu)
0x545
0x549

Next VOBu (except in the last one)
0x53d
0x541

Previous code

/ SRI pointers
Put4bytes(0xBFFFFFFF,&m_buffer[0x4F1]);
for (i=0;i<19;i++)
Put4bytes(0x3FFFFFFF,&m_buffer[0x4F5+i*4]);
Put4bytes(0x3FFFFFFF,&m_buffer[0x541]);
Put4bytes(0x3FFFFFFF,&m_buffer[0x545]);
for (i=0;i<19;i++)
Put4bytes(0x3FFFFFFF,&m_buffer[0x549+i*4]);

Put4bytes(0xBFFFFFFF,&m_buffer[0x595]);

Added after:

ilastpack_old=ilastpack;
ilastpack= GetNbytes(4,&m_buffer[0x40f]);
// Adjust Previous VOBU pointers
if (!bFirstVobu && bAudio)
{
Put4bytes((UINT)0x80000000+(UINT)(ilastpack_old+1),&m_buffer[0x545]);
Put4bytes((UINT)0x80000000+(UINT)(ilastpack_old+1),&m_buffer[0x549]);
}
// Adjust Last VOBU pointers
if (!bLastVobu && bAudio)
{
Put4bytes(ilastpack+1,&m_buffer[0x53d]);
Put4bytes(ilastpack+1,&m_buffer[0x541]);
}


jsoto