x264 vod usage

[svizi]

Hi

I am trying to build a vod application using x264 codec.
I have a problem about who to bill my "customers", making the stream only accesible on those who pay for it.
I wonder if transforming the steam using YUV transformations ( making the color different than the real ) would be an answer to that or should i go with key encryption and who

Thanks

Stefanos

P.S : I don't know if i posted at the correct part of the forum so feel free to move it.

[temporance]

Hi svizi,

I can't help with your question (I don't really understand it), but I feel I should point out that you would be guilty of patent infringement if you use x264 for a pay-for service. As soon as you start making $$$ out of H.264, MPEGLA will be wanting some royalties.

So, you could buy a license from MPEGLA. This leaves you with another problem: x264 is licensed to you under GPL. The GPL requires that if you buy a patent license to use x264, that license must allow unrestricted use of x264 for all your users and anyone they might distribute onwards to. So you'd need to go to MPEGLA and ask for a license for every x264 user in the world. Unless you're Bill Gates, I don't think you could afford this ;)

This crazy situation was the brainchild of the GPL authors. They hate software patents and have written the GPL license to ensure that GPL and patents don't play nicely together.

In short, it's safer to use a commercial codec for your VoD service: then the codec vendor takes responsibility of all the licensing and patent issues for you.

[len0x]

Originally posted by temporance
So, you could buy a license from MPEGLA. This leaves you with another problem: x264 is licensed to you under GPL. The GPL requires that if you buy a patent license to use x264, that license must allow unrestricted use of x264 for all your users and anyone they might distribute onwards to. So you'd need to go to MPEGLA and ask for a license for every x264 user in the world.

If x264 is only used for encoding and not sold as a part of encoding application, then the above statement is not applied. You pay royalties to MPEGLA for using the format (i.e. for services that are covered by different licensing agreement), not for selling encoder based on AVC technology.

Originally posted by temporance
In short, it's safer to use a commercial codec for your VoD service: then the codec vendor takes responsibility of all the licensing and patent issues for you.


Not true again - you don't have to pay a cent for using x264 or any other free codec, but you have to pay license fee for ditributing AVC material and even if you buy commercial AVC encoder you are not automatically buying distribution license for the content that is produced with it.

[hpn]

So, hypothetically If I shot some tree on the street with my video recorder and then use the completely free x264 encoder to make a video, I can't set up a site and start selling this video (my own copyrighted footage) without paying royalties to some guys I've never heard about simply because x264 uses Advanced Video Coding (AVC) ?

[len0x]

indeed (same applies for MPEG4 ASP codecs like XviD, btw)

[svizi]

First of all i'll use x264 for a university subject and this will not go any further than that.
Secondly, sorry for my bad english. If you didn't understand what I mean i'll explain.
Over here in Europe channels that you receive via sattelite or cable are somehow encrypted. With the satellites i believe that this is happening with some encryption keys. We will implement vod using ip and computer networks. I don't know how we can encrypt our stream in order not to be able people not subscribed in the service to view the stream.

[hpn]

Why do you need to encrypt the videos? It seems easier just to set up a simple password protected page, for example by using .htaccess plus "AuthUserFile" to store the paid accounts, and then just send the login info (user names+password) only to those people who have paid for your VoD. Of course if what len0x says is true, you'll still have to pay AVC royalties if you use x264, unless it's free of charge for universities, which I doubt.

[Latexxx]

Screwing up colours etc is an analog way of doing pay-tv. It has no use in digital domain.

[Chaos Creator]

Originally posted by hpn
So, hypothetically If I shot some tree on the street with my video recorder and then use the completely free x264 encoder to make a video, I can't set up a site and start selling this video (my own copyrighted footage) without paying royalties to some guys I've never heard about simply because x264 uses Advanced Video Coding (AVC) ?


That's why Theora is going to be so good!!!
You can do anything you want without paying a cent!:D

[akupenguin]

Originally posted by svizi
I am trying to build a vod application using x264 codec.
I have a problem about who to bill my "customers", making the stream only accesible on those who pay for it.
I wonder if transforming the steam using YUV transformations ( making the color different than the real ) would be an answer to that or should i go with key encryption and who

There's nothing you can do to the YUV signal that wouldn't interfere with compression. If you want to encrypt a video, use a normal encryption algorithm on the compressed stream. But I agree that the simplest solution is to perform authentication before allowing downloads.

[svizi]

Which normal encryption algorithm?
As for the authentication you know something that i can use?

[hpn]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=bg&q=%22password+protected+page%22&lr=

[Disabled]

First of all: Tell us a little more about your project.
Are you just doing it for the university just for studying? I believe then you don`t have to worry at all about licences.

Do you want the Video being copy protected, as you might know the Audio files you download from Itunes and such are copy protected?
Or do you simply want that only Customer A and B who payed for Film1 can download Film1 and not CustomerC who payed for Film2? That would be an easy task, but the wrong forum for, as this is simply a website creating issue.

[svizi]

I do want my material to be copy protected.

[Sharktooth]

... so you have to ENCRYPT your data with conventional encryption algorithms. But if you know nothing about encrypting digital video you dont have a chance in doing it.
Believe me, this stuff is really complicated and you could have issues with MPEG licensing since you sell your videos...
Probably you underestimated the problems in creating a VOD service...

[svizi]

I will not sell anyhting.
This project is only for university purpsoses.
I do understand that is complicated.

[svizi]

Originally posted by Sharktooth
But if you know nothing about encrypting digital video you dont have a chance in doing it.


Encrypting digital video will make my streaming video unable to be recorded by my clients as i assume. Is tis correct?

[unmei]

Maybe impossible in a lossless way, but as you can imagine, anything that can be presented can also be copied in some more or less cumbersome or lossy way. Foe movies you can always capture the signal sent to the display or speakers as a last resort (VCR on a analog output :D ...)

[akupenguin]

Originally posted by svizi
Encrypting digital video will make my streaming video unable to be recorded by my clients as i assume. Is tis correct? No. Encryption prevents the data from being read by anyone who doesn't have a key. It does nothing to prevent the intended viewer from doing whatever they want with the data. And it doesn't prevent the intended viewer from giving a decrypted copy to someone else.
If you want a technological method to prevent that, you're out of luck. DRM doesn't work, and only annoys the people who did pay.