HDTV-MPG2DVD - How?

[Cela]

HDTV will become an issue in the near future. There is demo data around in the net. There are test transmissins by PRO7. These can be recorded with programs like WatchTVpro Premium Edition.

There will be 15-20 GB of mpg data per 2 hour film that wants to be resized and compressed to 4,3 or 8,4 GB to fit on a singele or double layer DVD.

But how? That is the question.

Isn't that an issue for DVD2SVCD with RoBa? Any ideas? Step by step guide?

[hoozdapimp]

I think it would be great to have a one click program as well...I have been trying to convert HDTV, but all my video keeps coming out really choppy, and I suspect it has to do with going from 60fps to 23.976 fps....I have asked in the HDTV forum, but nobody has answered my question about what AVS script to use.

[Nick]

OK, I don't have HDTV at my disposal.
How is it compressed? Is it MPEG2?
What is the resolution, fps and is it interlaced or progressive?

I'm sure this must be possible. But from the sticky in the HDTV forum there are so many possible configurations? What is commonly broadcast?

[Cela]

Originally posted by Nick
OK, I don't have HDTV at my disposal.
How is it compressed? Is it MPEG2?
What is the resolution, fps and is it interlaced or progressive?

I'm sure this must be possible. But from the sticky in the HDTV forum there are so many possible configurations? What is commonly broadcast?

Thank you for your interest. I am afraid I do not have too much useful information yet, but, if you want, I could PM you a link from where you can upload some seconds (~ 100 MB out of 20 GB) of my recently captured mpg from an AstraHD demo transmission for your experiments.

Living in PAL country in Europe I capture Astra transmissions.

Some information can be found on http://www.ses-astra.com/products/broadcast/hdtv/index.shtml
in the Press Release "ASTRA launches its HDTV Demo Channel"

To ensure a uniform roll-out and avoid a fragmentation of the nascent market in Europe, SES ASTRA and its industry partners have agreed on the minimum technical specifications for HDTV broadcasts, based on e.g. the open MPEG-2 or MPEG-4 AVC standards. These technical specifications include:
- HDTV ready displays need a minimum of 720 lines vertical resolution
- Scan formats of 720P50 and 1080i25 for HDTV
- Standard interfaces for peripheral equipment

More information is displayed in the German language pages on
http://www.ses-astra.com/market/deutschland/hdtv/empfang-technik.htm

They talk about 3 technical standard sizes:
SDTV (Standard Video): 720 x 576 i = 414.700 Pixel (normal PAL DVD)
HDTV = 1280 x 720p = 921.600 Pixel on Demo Channel AstraHD
HDTV = 1920 x 1080i = 2.073.600 Pixel on Demo Channel Euro1080
25 fps on Astra for PAL

Some more links: www.hdtvforum.org and www.video-magazin.de

The German privte TV station PRO7 started occasional test transmissions of complete movies. http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/56988 has the story (in German). There I read: 1080i/50 with 1920 x 1080 pixel with 50 fps and Dolby Digital 5.1 audio. PRO7 test happen very seldom. I missed all of them. So I do not have any test data available.

I currently can make capture tests with WatchTVpro Premium Edition 1.12.
WatchTVpro receives some 18.4 Mbit/s from AstraHD (1280 x 720p, 25 fps)
and some 16.0 MBit/s from Euro1080 (1920 x 1080i). From Euro1080 transmission I only get a dark screen without mpeg audio and WatchTVpro only records some raw (ac3) data but nu mpeg data. Maybe its scrambled. I don't know.

From AstraHD I get an mpg-file with the following properties documented by the programs which I use to process that file:

First I demultimplex it with ProjectX:

AstraHD HDTV Sample Info by
ProjectX 0.81.9 Halloween Edition (29.10.2004)
Log file:

<<< session infos >>>

-> working with collection 0

-> normal log file
-> write all video data
-> write all other data
-> create *.idd Projectfile on demux: Mpeg2Schnitt idd version: V2/A3
-> patch c.d.flagged infos of pictures
-> add sequence end code

-> write output files to: E:\Videos\AstraHD HDTV\
-> 2 cutpoint(s) defined ( (0) use BytePos. for cuts )

-> Input File 0: E:\Videos\AstraHD HDTV\_AstraHD HDTV_07.March.2005.23.09.23.mpg (2308275590 bytes)
-> File is MPEG-2 PS/SS (Video/Audio PES)
-> demux
-> found PES-ID 0xE0 (MPEG Video) @ 32
-> found PES-ID 0xC0 (MPEG Audio) @ 73760
-> cut-in @ GOP# 0 / new vframe 0 / new Timecode 00:00:00.000
-> saving cut PTS value (75454) to file..
-> video basics: 1920*1088 @ 25fps @ 0.7031 (16:9) @ 19000000bps, vbvBuffer 488
-> starting export of video data @ GOP# 0
!> dropping useless B-Frames @ GOP# 0 / new Timecode 00:00:00.000
-> cut-out @ GOP# 65
-> saving cut PTS value (2872655) to file..

-> Video: fr/ ct/ 1p/ cg/ og/ dg -> 775/ 1/ 64/ 65/ 0/ 0
-> Video length: 775 frames @ 00:00:31.000
-> GOP summary: min. 18, max. 24 fields; contains interlaced & progressive frames
-> avg. nom. bitrate 19059138bps (min/max: 15010800/26204000)
-> set first sequenceheader bitrate to 9800000bps
---> new File: E:\Videos\AstraHD HDTV\_AstraHD HDTV_07.March.2005.23.09.23.mpv

--> MPEG Audio (0xC0)
Audio PTS: first packet 00:00:00.191, last packet 00:00:32.036
Video PTS: start 1.GOP 00:00:00.918, end last GOP 00:00:31.918
-> adjusting audio at video-timeline
-> src_audio: MPEG-1, Layer2, 48000Hz, stereo, 256kbps, CRC @ 00:00:00.000
-> 42 frame(s) (1008ms) inserted @ 00:00:12.312
audio frames: wri/pre/skip/ins/add 1292/0/0/42/0 @ 00:00:31.008 done...
---> new File: E:\Videos\AstraHD HDTV\_AstraHD HDTV_07.March.2005.23.09.23.mp2
...

Then I would cut it with Mpeg2Schnitt:

AstraHD HDTV Sample Info by
Mpeg2Schnitt Information Window:

Sequenceheader:
Width: 1920
Hight: 1088
Seitenverhältnis: 9/16
Framerate: 25 Bilder/sek.
Bitrate: 9,8 MBit/sek. (up to 20 MBit/sec)
VBV-Puffer: 976 KByte
Profile/Level: Main/High
Colorformat: 4:2:0
Low Delay: Nein
------------------------------------
Frameheader:
Frametype: I-Frame
DC Prezision: 10
Frame structure: Frame
Top Frame First: Yes
------------------------------------
Audioinformation:
Mpeg 1, Layer 2
Bitrate: 256 KBit/sek.
Samplerate: 48000 Hz
Channel Modus: Stereo
Framelength: 768 Byte
Framelength: 24 ms

Then I would attempt to mux a 1280x720p, 25fps non-standard DVD (with IfoEdit(Author New DVD) in order to get a VIDEO_TS as input for compression and resizing to 720x576p DVD format with DVD2SVCD.

The ProjectX and Mpeg2Schnitt steps work fine.
Now I have that portion of the original mpg file which contains the material I want to put on DVD. But after ProjectX and Mpeg2Schnitt I do not have it any longer as properly muxed mpg file. What I have now are the elementary streams of cutted film: mpv, mp2 or m2v, mpa and ac3 (when I manage to record PRO7).

My first problem is now to mux or author these elementary streams:
I fail to produce the VIDEO_TS because IfoEdit refuses to process the streams which are off the DVD standard. After less than a second IfoEdit reports the following error messages: "Stream E0: data will arrive too late.... Too many frame drops!"

Questions:
Is there another way to produce a VIDEO_TS for DVD2SVCD from such non-standard elementary streams?
Alternatively, how could I mux these elementary streams to a new mpg file and how could I get DVD2SVCD to accept this mpg-file?
Finally, the most important question, can DVD2SVCD and CCE properly process such non-standard data?

Isn't it funny, it starts all over again, history repeats itself: In the old days we compressed (SD) DVDs to SVCD or to VCD usind DVD2SVCD, today we compress DVD2DVD using DVD2SVCD, in the near future we will compress HDTV to SDTV, and put it onto DVD using DVD2SVCD/RoBa, until the HDTV equipment will become affordable.

Hope that dream can become true! :)

[ChickenMan]

I use a quick and dirty way to encode MPEG2 mpegs via DVD2SVCD. Simple rename the *.mpg file to VTS_01_1.VOB and copy to the same folder a VTS_01_0.IFO copied off any dvd. I have re-encoded MANY mpeg2 files to DVD specs this way and NEVER had a problem :)

[hoozdapimp]

can anyone confirm that this will work with HDTV clips (which are usually in .TS format).

[ChickenMan]

If the TS file is an MPEG2 and can be openned and read by DVD2AVI (or the newer DVD2AVIDG ) then it will work. Do you know where I can d/l a trial *.TS file (thats SMALL, I'm stuck on dialup :( )

[Nick]

OK. Not a perfect solution by any means but perhaps something to experiment with.

Use tbarry's HDTV version of DVD2AVI ( http://www.trbarry.com/DVD2AVIT3.zip )to create a D2V project file from the transport stream or a demuxed elementary stream.

Import the d2v file into avisynth using DGDecode.dll, with a script like this.

loadplugin("Drive:\path\DGDecode.dll")
v = mpeg2source("Drive:\Path\file.d2v")
a = directshowsource("Drive:\path\audio.***")
Audiodub(v,a)

Run it through VFAPI and then through AVI2DVD

Audio delays might be a problem in some cases...

But it's a starting point.

[ChickenMan]

Firstly, thanks Nick for that small *.TS file. I was also able to d/l another from http://www.dododge.net/roku/ts-samples.html as well (the one at the bottom of the page).

They were both HDTV 1080i TS streams. I was able to simply convert the TS file to an MPG using HDTVtoMPEG2 (http://www.midwinter.com/%7Ebcooley/). Then simple rename that mpg file to VTS_01_1.VOB and copy a VTS_01_0.IFO file off any DVD and convert using DVD2SVCD as per normal. End results were perfect :)

D2S was able to extract the audio correctly so no probs there. One issue was aspect ratio. I selected "Anamorphic (encode as 16:9)" however it kept trying at 55 pixel borders top and bottom (both were NTSC mpegs), so I simply selected "Edit as part of video encoding" in the Frameserver tab. I did not attempt to de-interlace the file either, so in CCE Advanced Settings/MPEG2 Settings I had all boxes un-ticked except DVD Compliant.

Hope that helps someone. I must get myself a HDTV card for the PC one day as I can see I could have a lot of fun with it :)

[Nick]

What DVD2AVI are you using and what MPEG2DEC dll?
I get a "MPEG2Source: Could not open file" Avisynth error when I try that with the same file.
Hence my complicated workaround.

Since vertical resizing will be involved in HDTV2DVD conversions, I guess deinterlacing is a must.

[ChickenMan]

I'm using DGIndex.exe 1.1.0 renamed to DVD2AVIDG.exe so that it can be addressed by D2S. I'm also using the DGDecode.dll that came with that as well.

[cw_uk]

theres a problem i have hit and thats with the capture cards that splitt at the 100mb mark, even when you process the whole lot in HDTV2Mpeg and output 1 file for processing you end up with problems in the audio track in the joins causing sync issues. the best thing for the audio is to use ProjectX load all your files in and use the default settings and demux it will fill in the spaces with silence keeping everything in sync.

[Nick]

@ChickenMan
Yep. That works :)

[HONDNL]

there is even a hdtv group on usenet now ( alt.binaries.hdtv & "".repost)
I just downloaded a couple of files to see what the quality was ,
really superb ..
Many new Series ( like rome) are now availbe in HDTV , I am trying to convert them to skvcd at the moment .. I saw a couple of people doing this before and I will ask them how they handle the audio and acpect ratio...