Pulldown of 25 fps to NTSC

[Guest]

It can only repeat fields. You can't do that conversion with DGPulldown.

[Xesdeeni]

Just a word of thanks for the utility. I've used it a few times, but it really shines in my latest project.

I have some PAL DiVX files I'm converting to DVD. They are a series of 13 45-minute shows at 640x360 16:9 resolution. Two shows per DVD*R would mean 6 Mbps for the video, which would be pretty good quality. But I really didn't want 7 DVDs. Four shows per DVD*R would mean 3 Mbps for the video. My experience is that MPEG-2 doesn't do so good with 3 Mbps, but that was doing mostly noisy, interlaced sources. So I thought I'd just give it a try with progressive frames and DGPulldown. I used a very good MPEG encoder and multi-pass, and the results are FANTASTIC! Even on my 65" screen, there really isn't much degradation from the already reduced DiVX quality. I attribute this to being able to encode progressive frames and avoiding the 17% extra overhead of field repetition.

So thanks for taking my idea and running with it. It works great!

Two and a half suggestions though:

1. I'm guessing it would be faster to convert if the source and destination could be on different drives. But you can't choose the destination.

1.5. It looks like the files are exactly the same size before and after. Is it possible to modify them in place without copying them?

2. A batch or CLI method would be nice, since I have to convert multiple files after encoding.

Xesdeeni

[Prodater64]

@neuron2: Despite you mentioned command line reference is in the text file, I can' find out that reference. Could you post it here, please?

[Prodater64]

2. A batch or CLI method would be nice, since I have to convert multiple files after encoding.
Xesdeeni

I think there is a cli option (I find out one reference deep in this thread). So I asked neuron2 in my previous post, but still have not answer.
Lets wait until neuron2 read these posts.

[Guest]

DGPulldown started out in life as a command line tool but it evolved into a GUI and command line support was lost. I'll keep that and the other suggestions in mind for a rainy day.

[Prodater64]

DGPulldown started out in life as a command line tool but it evolved into a GUI and command line support was lost. I'll keep that and the other suggestions in mind for a rainy day.

Is there a working old cli version?
Several encoding tools as DVD2SVCD or DIKO, and another ones not so knew, need a cli version for make life easy to users (included me :D ).
If there is any version, please post its link (I saw in all yours dgpulldown version txt files, but there is not any cli reference)

Other question: A time ago, doing some test I flaged a 25 fps stream as 29.97 (or vice versa, I don't remember now). Played in my SAP it showed ok. I think I only flaged fps and not resolution, but don't remember that also.
I did use DVDPatcher.
The question is:
Is flaging with DVDPatcher a similar method than DGPulldown?

And last one: We can use classic pulldown.exe to do same as DGPulldown, related to system change? If not, explain this point please.

Edited: Nevermind last question. I have read the answer in a previous post.

[Guest]

Is there a working old cli version? There's no CLI version with full features. You're going to have to be patient.

I did use DVDPatcher. The question is: Is flagging with DVDPatcher a similar method than DGPulldown? I'm not familiar with DVDPatcher but I would guess not, otherwise someone would have mentioned it a long time ago.

And last one: We can use classic pulldown.exe to do same as DGPulldown, related to system change? If not, explain this point please. pulldown.exe can do standard 3:2 pulldown (23.976 -> 29.97) only.

Don

[MegadetH]

I use a program called DIVX to DVD Converter,and i have some divx videos that are Pal format i just drop them into this program select force NTSC, and it coverts every time successfully, and you can allso drop VOB files in it but I havent tried this yet but i have droped a VOB file to it just to see if it would read it i will try and convert PAL to NTSC here shortly, but it will convert a PAL Divx vid. to NTSC DVD so i would convert the PAL DVD to DIvx then back to NTSC DVD.



:helpful:

[Guest]

I use a program called DIVX to DVD Converter,and i have some divx videos that are Pal format i just drop them into this program select force NTSC, and it coverts every time successfully Yes, but the question is whether it does this by using flagging or by duplicating frames. If you could supply a short VOB fragment from the output of this program, I could determine the answer to that question.

[MegadetH]

Ok how do I supply you with a fragment?

[DaveTv]

I really like this program.........the results of my conversions are fantastic.

If you don't mind a suggestion or two...

1.) Allow file to be dragged onto the gui, for loading.

2.) Allow a different destination.

Thanks.

[Guest]

Ok how do I supply you with a fragment? You chop the front of the VOB using ChopperXP and then you upload it to my FTP site and tell me the filename. 50-100 MBytes will be enough.

[Prodater64]

DGPD_PAL2NTSC by Prodater64

At the moment, and don't know for how many time, Donald Graft won't give CLI support to DGPulldown.
As 25 to 29.97 pulldown is very interesting and it would solve many problems with sync issues, I wrote a little app that gives CLI (or parsing parameter) support to DGPulldown. It means if you parse 25fps video stream name as parameter, DGPulldown will do its job and you will obtain a 29.97 flagged video stream. You can use it with original audio without change it.
You need DGPulldown.exe and DGPD.exe the litte app I wrote. There is also a DGPD.bat file that only is an example of how to call DGPD.exe.
All files should be in same folder.

Edited:

Udated.
See http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=98209

[zoinbergs]

First of all.. I'd like to say THANK YOU for the development of this program... it sure is fun to use!

I do have one question though.........

Is there any way to use this irregular flagging technology with an actual MPEG2 Encoder to physically insert the additional interlaced frames?

I'm not so much concerned about the increased file sizes I would be creating, as I am with utmost compatibility with stand-alone players / TVs. If the frames were physically there, instead of just the flags to create the frames, then 100% compatibility would ensue, and no DVD players playing my content would have to pull down anything.

I believe TMPGEnc duplicates every fifth frame to achieve 25 --> 29.97 fps, but I'm looking for a smoother transcoding procedure that something like DGPulldown's flags are creating. (But not physically creating -- which is what I want to do).

Pure and authentic 29.97 fps video, with no flags whatsoever in it, would certainly help in my search for ultimate DVD compatibility.

Any help on this subject is quite appreciated!!!!!!!!

Thank You,
William


PS- Another quick question.. where the heck does 25fps (truly) interlaced video come from? I mean, 29.97fps interlaced video usually comes from FILM that is 3:2 from 23.976fps.. but I always thought 25fps was PAL's progressive -- kinda like the US with it's 23.976 NTSC progressive. I don't believe I've ever seen 23.976fps interlaced (unless of course each frame is split into two identical fields). Could this 25fps interlaced be a pulldown from 23.976 to allow the playing of FILM on a PAL disc?

Thank you so much for any insight you may be able to provide!!!!!!!!

[Wilbert]

PS- Another quick question.. where the heck does 25fps (truly) interlaced video come from?
Sports for example. Yes, movies are usually progressive.

[SeeMoreDigital]

PS- Another quick question.. where the heck does 25fps (truly) interlaced video come from? Count yourself lucky you don't live in the UK then.... As all std-def DVB TV is broadcast as "interlaced" :scared:

[Guest]

Is there any way to use this irregular flagging technology with an actual MPEG2 Encoder to physically insert the additional interlaced frames? If the video is already in MPEG2 then you can flag the M2V elementary stream as required using DGPulldown. Then load the M2V into DGIndex and make a project with Honor Pulldown Flags. Then serve the video into your encoder and encode in interlaced mode. For non-MPEG2, you can use this method:

bob
changefps(59.94) # for 25fps -> 29.97fps
separatefields
selectevery(4,0,3)
weave

I'm not so much concerned about the increased file sizes I would be creating, as I am with utmost compatibility with stand-alone players / TVs. If the frames were physically there, instead of just the flags to create the frames, then 100% compatibility would ensue, and no DVD players playing my content would have to pull down anything. This concern of yours is overblown, IMHO. I am not aware of any player that doesn't properly honor DGPulldown'ed streams. It is perfectly ordinary and legal MPEG2 syntax.

PS- Another quick question.. where the heck does 25fps (truly) interlaced video come from? From 50 fields/sec video cameras used in PAL countries.

I mean, 29.97fps interlaced video usually comes from FILM that is 3:2 from 23.976fps.. No, that is not interlaced content; it is telecined content.

You need to distinguish the nature of the content from the final analog signal that goes to an interlaced display. At the display everything is "interlaced"; but the content may not be.

[zoinbergs]

Thank you, thank you, thank you neuron2!

Your wisdom is very much appreciated!

I was quite skeptical about keeping the flags, but I'll trust your word that it is indeed legal MPEG2 syntax. Believe me, I did NOT want to re-encode all this PAL material I have!

And yes, you're correct.. there is a big difference between telecined and interlaced content. I guess I have to wonder now instead... is true 29.97fps interlaced content twice as smooth as 29.97fps progressive? Because in essence there'd be twice the movement (like in a pan for instance).. moving from one field to the next? Would there be 59.94 individual (non-identical) fields, or is the bottom field for one frame the same (camera shot) as the top field for the next frame?

Sorry if that sounds confusing.. I just have some interlaced content here that doesn't look like it came from a progressive source (so it's not telecined).. but rather from some other source... I presume from an interlaced video camera. Every single frame shows one (top) field from the previous frame, and one (bottom) field from the next one. Does that make any sense?

Oh wait a second! I think I got it.. if both fields for each frame were from the same camera shot, then it'd be progressive, right? Even if it's encoded as interlaced it'd still show no horizontal lines that (true) interlaced content shows. So what I have is simply put, interlaced content! Still 29.97 frames.. but divided into fields that are split between those frames. Right?

I've read over and over again what interlaced content is.. but my mind just can't wrap itself around it (yet).

Hopefully I just answered my own question here though!


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


I hate to ask now.. (because I don't want to feel like I'm milking you guys for answers).. but I have just one more question.

I have a progressive NTSC video stream at 29.97fps that has clearly been converted by someone else from a PAL source at 25fps. I know this because every fifth frame has been phyiscally duplicated.

So is there any way to undo this conversion so I can add DGPulldown's flags to it.. so I can make a smoother video in the end?

I hope there's an easy answer to this one.. but if there isn't.. don't bother spending too much time on it! It's only a question..

I tried using TMPGEnc to do the trick, and ended up with 3 unique frames and a duplicated one! Every fourth frame was deleted.. when the fifth frame was supposed to. Boy does it look funny though!


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Thank you so very much guys for all your support! Hopefully I can be as knowledgable on this stuff as you are.. so I may someday be the one to answer people's questions.. thus giving you a break from doing it. =)

"You can give a man a fish, and feed him for a day. Or you can teach a man to fish, and watch him drink beer in a boat all day."

[Guest]

I guess I have to wonder now instead... is true 29.97fps interlaced content twice as smooth as 29.97fps progressive? Temporally, yes.

Would there be 59.94 individual (non-identical) fields Yes. Each field is sampled at a different temporal moment. The moments are defined by the field frequency.

Sorry if that sounds confusing.. I just have some interlaced content here that doesn't look like it came from a progressive source (so it's not telecined).. but rather from some other source... I presume from an interlaced video camera. Every single frame shows one (top) field from the previous frame, and one (bottom) field from the next one. Does that make any sense? Once you know a simple notation, it's easy to describe these things. I use a letter to indicate a temporal moment, so a and b are two different moments. Also, use [] to denote frame boundaries. The first letter in [] is the top field and the second is bottom. Then, this is interlaced:

[ab][cd][ef]...

This is progressive:

[aa][bb][cc][dd]...

This is progressive with a one-field phase shift:

[.a][ab][bc][cd]...

This is 3:2 telecine:

[aa][ab][bc][cc][dd]...

You can also have blended fields:

[a a+b][b+c c] (and many variants thereof)

Oh wait a second! I think I got it.. if both fields for each frame were from the same camera shot, then it'd be progressive, right? Yes, but it could be shifted (see above).

What pattern are you seeing in the above notation? Look at a scene with constant motion.

I have a progressive NTSC video stream at 29.97fps that has clearly been converted by someone else from a PAL source at 25fps. I know this because every fifth frame has been phyiscally duplicated.

So is there any way to undo this conversion so I can add DGPulldown's flags to it.. so I can make a smoother video in the end? Sure. Do this:

Telecide() # You can omit this if there are no field shifts
FDecimate(25)

Now you encode progressive MPEG2 at 25fps and then apply DGPulldown. The result will not actually be smoother because you haven't added any new temporal information, but it will have less "judder" and that is perceived as smoother.

[zoinbergs]

Ooh, that's some juicy information man! Thank you!

I believe I was viewing some progressive shifted video running at [.a][ab][bc][cd]...

I believe Telecide() would shift it back, correct? Or would there need to be a parameter to insert in those there parenthesis?



I think I'm gettin the hang of this stuff! Who knew video could be so difficult to work with though...

[zoinbergs]

Well neuron.. I believe I'm gonna stick with DGPulldown flags to go from PAL to NTSC!

I tried doing the conversion the long way like you had talked about.. and boy was it funny looking! I don't know what happened exactly.. but a lot of my frames turned out to be blended ones (from the de-interlace before resize to 720x480 I presume).. that were then interlaced again (because I chose to encode that way!)

WHAT A MESS I told myself, and decided to scratch the whole idea. I like flags very much so now. ;)

[Guest]

I believe Telecide() would shift it back, correct? Or would there need to be a parameter to insert in those there parenthesis? Correct. Please refer to the documentation for parameter descriptions. Often the defaults you get if you don't specify anything are fine.

I tried doing the conversion the long way like you had talked about.. and boy was it funny looking! I don't know what happened exactly.. but a lot of my frames turned out to be blended ones (from the de-interlace before resize to 720x480 I presume).. that were then interlaced again (because I chose to encode that way!) Of course, if you have interlaced video and you don't mind deinterlacing it, then sure, just apply DGPulldown. But if you want to change the rate ofinterlaced material while keeping it interlaced (full temporal content), then the long method can be used. You got blends because you used blend mode when you deinterlaced. But DO NOT deinterlace progressive content; use a field matcher like Telecide() to realign the progressive frames, then apply DGPulldown.

[zoinbergs]

Well neuron2, I've definitely mastered the art of DGPulldown! No more blended fields either, thanks to the wonderful Telecide paramater finally being used correctly! (The lack thereof was indeed my problem).

Here's something for you to ponder though! You'd better sit down for this one.........

Okay, so I'll try and keep this short! But please forgive me if I write too much..

So after running DGPulldown (25 --> 29.97) on a 720x480 25fps Progressive video, I got what I had expected, an NTSC DVD-compliant MPEG2. The newly flagged video passed right through my TMPGEnc DVD Author v1.6.34.89 just fine, also what I had expected.

But when I ran it through my TMPGEnc DVD Author v2.1.9.90, it crashed it! I mean, it totally crashed it. I got as far as the where the actual DVD authoring takes place, but after writing the menu, it said it failed to write the VOB.

After that I tried burning a previously known-to-be-good video, and that had crashed it too! So I'm pretty sure the unusual flagging pattern did something to the entire program, disabling burning capabilities altogether.

So, I uninstalled the program, restarted my computer, and then reinstalled the program. STILL NO BURNING CAPABILITIES. DGPulldown's flags I thought had permanently disabled my TMPGEnc DVD Author!

I decided to uninstall v2.1.9.90 again, and go ahead and install my old trusty v2.1.7.88. Low and behold, it burned my known-to-be-good video with no problems! BUT, as soon as I tried the flagged video, it crashed that version too.

So both versions were rendered useless, no matter how many uninstalls and reinstalls I did of each.

So that got me thinking.. maybe TMPGEnc DVD Author doesn't actually "uninstall" its registry entries when you remove the program from your computer. Sure, the registry entries were removed physically (from the Software/Pegasys, Inc./TMPGEnc DVD Author v2.0 folders in various users and the local machine), but everytime I reinstalled each version, I got the same error message when trying to burn perfectly good MPEG2 files (not the flagged ones).

The reason I think this is, is because I finally did a hard uninstall, and deleted the registry entries myself, along with the program folder in C:\Program Files too. Before I was going through Add/Remove Programs in my control panel, but that way wasn't working, so I thought I'd get creative!

So, after the hard uninstall, I reinstalled (from scratch you could say -- registry entries and all) the latest version of 2.1.9.90.... and IT WORKED! My burning capabilies were back, for compliant videos that is, but of course, still not for flagged videos.

What I'm wondering is if TMPGEnc DVD Author v2.0 (both revisions) just move their registry entries somewhere else when "uninstalled." The fact everything worked after I hand-removed the entries just boggles my mind!

Alright, so anyways, the moral of the story is that DGPulldown is NOT compatible with TMPGEnc DVD Author v2.1.9.90 OR v2.1.7.88 in any way, shape or form. But with your suggestion about using Honor Pulldown Flags in DGIndex, I'm definitely still a happy camper when I rencode my videos using the newly hard-telecined material!

I thought you'd might like to know this though, neuron2. Maybe there's something you can do about it? I'm not concerned about the issue though, if that's what you're thinking. I'm VERY satisfied with your wonderful program DGMPGDec! Your work is flat out brilliant, and I commend you for it.

It seems to me like you're ahead of the game, and feeble little programs like TMPGEnc DVD Author just can't keep up with you. ;)

[Guest]

The pulldown is perfectly legal and normal MPEG2 syntax. If DVD Author can't accept it, then seek support from TMPGEnc. I haven't heard this from anyone else though.

[zoinbergs]

The pulldown is perfectly legal and normal MPEG2 syntax. If DVD Author can't accept it, then seek support from TMPGEnc. I haven't heard this from anyone else though.


That is precisely what I think too! Perfectly legal MPEG2 syntax.

I wasn't implying that something was wrong with your DGPulldown, was I? Because the program is brilliant. :)

I'll have to indeed haggle some TMPGEnc DVD Author customer support representative to see what he might know on the subject! Chances are he knows little though. Isn't "customer service" an oxy-moron? Just kiddin...

Thanks for all your hard work though, man. In my opinion, you're a total genius, and your work is priceless! I don't know what I'd do without the technological advancements you have made in this community. Please keep up the good work! ;)

[Paulcat]

Is there some good reason to upgrade from TMPGEnc DVD Author 1.6.xx to 2.1.xx, support for subtitles perhaps?

I am running 1.6.xx and find it just fine for most applications but I have to turn to Muxman when adding subtitles.

Also, if you use DGPulldown to convert a 23.976 file to a 29.97 file, does TDA still crash? Or is it just the flagging from PAL to NTSC that does it?

Paul

[zoinbergs]

Is there some good reason to upgrade from TMPGEnc DVD Author 1.6.xx to 2.1.xx, support for subtitles perhaps?

I use v2.1.9.90 for the FANTASTIC menu navigation features. I arrange pretty weird menus for my DVDs, and in v1.6 it doesn't show how each button is accessed (using left-right-up-down buttons).. and too many times have I created orphan buttons that can't be accessed with a remote!

Fortunately v2 has the layer to show arrows (backward and forward) from each button to the next, completely eliminating such a problem. I simply arrange my buttons based on the arrows.

I'm not sure about subtitle support, but I'll look into it for ya!


Also, if you use DGPulldown to convert a 23.976 file to a 29.97 file, does TDA still crash? Or is it just the flagging from PAL to NTSC that does it?

I haven't tried 23.976-->29.97 yet, as I have not been in contact with true film footage for awhile.

Actually, I take that back. I have some film footage that already has the flags in it (from the producers)... does anybody know a quick and easy way to strip these flags off so I can add them via DGPulldown? That'll give me a sample to try with TDA2.1 then.

I hope it's only my system that may have this incompatibility issue, but I doubt it.. I am a freak when it comes to perfectly running PC systems. I very rarely run into any sort of problems.

I've contacted TMPGEnc for any light they may be able to shed on the situation, but I haven't received any e-mail back yet.

[foxyshadis]

By setting a custom pulldown of 29.97->23.976, you should be able to strip the flags and keep from introducing more. It probably only works if the underlying content is pure film, and might not work at all. ymmv.

I wonder if dgindex can do it with ignore pulldown flags or force film, when extracting m2v while processing.

[zoinbergs]

By setting a custom pulldown of 29.97->23.976, you should be able to strip the flags and keep from introducing more. It probably only works if the underlying content is pure film, and might not work at all. ymmv.

I don't believe this method works.. I tried it. Then again, I'm using DGPulldown. Perhaps the old fashioned regular Pulldown.exe would work?

I wonder if dgindex can do it with ignore pulldown flags or forced film, when extracting m2v while processing.

I just tried these two methods as well. DGIndex only ignores the flags in its newly created *.d2v project. The demuxing just passes the original video through, flags and all.


Hmm... I'm almost positive there's another thread I need to find that explains flag stripping in detail! No sense in getting off topic in here.. we're dealing with PAL-->NTSC conversions, right?

Time for some research. =)

[Guest]

You don't have to strip the flags first. Just run DGPulldown and it will overwrite the flags with the new ones.

If you do want to remove pulldown with DGPulldown, you set the source rate to the destination rate. E.g., 23.976 -> 23.976. As described in the help file. :)

[zoinbergs]

You don't have to strip the flags first. Just run DGPulldown and it will overwrite the flags with the new ones.

I had a feeling it would do such wonders..

If you do want to remove pulldown with DGPulldown, you set the source rate to the destination rate. E.g., 23.976 -> 23.976. As described in the help file. :)

Brilliant! I must have overlooked that in the help file. BTW, your explanations of (practically) everything you write about are something of another world.. :) You make is so easy to learn this stuff! I really do appreciate the help you have given the a/v community!



Alright.... time to go test some material....



And I'm back! Looks like DGPulldown's flags using 23.976-->29.97 are working in TDA2.1 -- so I presume at this point that TDA doesn't know what to do with irregular flag patterns aside from 3:2 pulldown.

Oh well I say.. as long as DGIndex keeps honoring the flags, I'm set!

And that concludes our little experiment for today...

[zoinbergs]

Dear neuron2,

I have working for hours trying to figure out the parameters to use for Telecide().

I know there's a riduculously easy answer to this question too.. of which I'm gonna hit myself upside the head for if you answer it! Hopefully you can give me a quick and dirty rundown? Thanks in advance if you can!


Okay so here's my problem:

I'm trying to phase shift a 25i clip, that has sections in it that were derived from film. It's a promotional video for a movie (that was released in 23.976p), and it was released in PAL @ 25i--phase shifted.

The previous encoder did a very good job to phase shift everything equally.. which means that I want to keep ALL the original frames, and simply match every field with the next one.. no matter what source it was derived from.

While using the default parameters for Telecide() I'm getting some mismatches, mostly in the film footage sections of the clip. Understandable I believe, since there was prolly some 24-->25 pulldown going on in the initial creation of the clip.

So I don't want Telecide to try and guess what progressive frames to restore (because it's trying to create 24fps again).. I just want a good old blind field matching and nothing more. Just every field with the next one.. consistently throughout the enitre clip.

Do you happen to know of the correct parameters I can set to achieve such results? I'm guessing that it's gotta do something with setting the pattern guidence to mode 2, and the gthresh to 0.0? Or have I got it backwards?

Here's what I need in terms of matching:

Original =

[.a][ab][cd][de][ef][fg][gh][hi][....


Strictly & Consistently Shifted (throughout the entire clip):

[aa][bb][cc][dd][ee][ff][gg][hh][ii][....


No pattern to match other than perfectly phase shifted 25i. (I'm trying to get the FILM sections to undergo the same phase shifting, no matter what.)


Now I believe I wouldn't need any post-processing because the FILM footage that was used isn't interlaced. Actually, none of the clip is true interlaced material, I don't think. It's all just been phase shifted from an entirely progressive source. There's no patterns needing to be matched, nothing.

Also, I'm a little confused about [b]dthresh and vthresh. If I am correct, dthresh picks out the interlaced frames of the clip for use in post-processing, and vthresh decides how much of those picked frames to deinterlace after that?

Thank you SO MUCH for any help you may be able to provide me! I'm trying my best to understand your tutorials and guides (which has gotten me incredibly far too by the way..... I think I've just hit a small road block with this clip, that's all.

Hope to hear from you soon!

Sincerely,
William

[Guest]

If it's a consistent phase shift then there is no reason to match fields.

separatefields()
trim(1,0)
weave()

No field matcher is perfect because they rely on heuristics to compare the fields.

BTW, this query is off-topic here. You should have started a new thread.

[zoinbergs]

Ahhhhh! I knew it had to be as simple as that!!!! :eek: Thank you SO much for the insight!


BTW, this query is off-topic here. You should have started a new thread.

I guess I forgot to tell you that I'm phase shifting the 25i clip so that I can have a progressive source to conduct a pulldown to 29.97 with.

But a new thread would have had the same effect, huh?

Don't worry... I'm a learning... :)

[Piper]

Is there an issue with DGPulldown 25 -> 29.97 on HCenc (0.18) encoded mpeg-2 files? The reason I ask is this; I have an NTSC capture of a UK broadcast which I've restored to 25 fps. It's in anamorphic widescreen format (720x480) and I run it through HCEnc with the following switches:

profile: best
dc prec: 10
aspect ratio: 16:9
scene change: checked (all others unchecked, including pulldown, interlaced etc)
GOP length: 18 (also tried 15)

The length of the resulting m2v file is: 43:41:120
After running it through DGPulldown (1.0.9) the length increases to: 45:30:08

At first I thought it might be a GOP issue, so I tried 15 as well with the same results.

I've successfully used this procedure many times with TMPGEnc encoded files without issue. Can anyone speculate on what might be causing this?

Thanks

[Mr_Odwin]

How are you determining the length of the m2v files?

[Piper]

Using DVD Architect, however I get the same results (albeit less accurate) if I open them in Zoom Player.

[Guest]

Try making a project using DGIndex on the pulled down M2V and then do Parse D2V to get the running time (see bottom of log). What is it?

[Piper]

@neuron2: Thanks for the tip (and the apps). Both the original and pulldown .m2v files are 43 minutes, 41 seconds. Finally some sanity! The issue here is with DVD Architect whereas using the same files with DVD Author worked perfectly.

Thanks!

[unixfs]

Yesterday I merged in mencoder's mpeg muxer (in svn) neuron2's generalized teleciner code.
Thanks neuron2!
P.S. some comment in the source code (especially in the generate function) wouldn't really hurt ;)

[ad25]

I have an interlaced PAL video that I would like to create an NTSC DVD from. I just want to confirm my understanding from reading through the thread.

1. Use Avisynth to deinterlace and resize to 720x480
2. Encode to a 720x480 25fps progressive MPEG-2 file
3. Use DGPulldown to flag the 25fps file to 29.97fps
4. Author DVD

Is there anything I'm missing? Thanks in advance.

[manolito]

Everything about your procedure looks alright to me. (I think you know that you have to demux your video before step 1)

Just a little advertising here: If you happen to use DVD2SVCD, have a look at http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=971974#post971974
This is an automated procedure to convert PAL to NTSC with the additional bonus that the chapter points you might already have in your PAL video will also be converted.

Cheers
manolito

[Xesdeeni]

I have an interlaced PAL video that I would like to create an NTSC DVD from. I just want to confirm my understanding from reading through the thread.

1. Use Avisynth to deinterlace and resize to 720x480
2. Encode to a 720x480 25fps progressive MPEG-2 file
3. Use DGPulldown to flag the 25fps file to 29.97fps
4. Author DVD

Is there anything I'm missing? Thanks in advance.If it's truly interlaced (each of the 50 fields contains motion), I wouldn't recommend that process, which is best for progressive frame sources. You would be converting 50 "instants of time" to 25. Instead, I'd recommend that you:
1. Use AVISynth and a plugin (LeakKernelBob, SmoothDeinterlacer, etc.) to deinterlace the video to 50 (progressive) Fps.
2. Scale the video to 720x480.
3. Use ChangeFPS() or ConvertFPS() to convert/change the frame rate to 59.94 (progressive) Fps. Which one you use depends on your personal preference. ConvertFPS() blends frames. ChangeFPS() replicates frames. I prefer ChangeFPS().
4. Divide the frames into fields and throw out every other one (SeparateFields().SelectEvery(4,0,3) or SeparateFields().SelectEvery(4,1,2), depending on your destination field polarity).
5. Encode to a 720x480@29.97 interlaced Fps MPEG-2.
6. Author DVD.

Xesdeeni

[ad25]

Conclusion:

1. DGPulldown method for Progressive PAL to NTSC.
2. ChangeFPS/ConvertFPS method for Interlaced PAL to Interlaced NTSC.

Thanks for the replies.

[Guest]

We don't make blanket statements about "best" around here. :)

[ad25]

Sorry about that. I have reworded my reply.

[laserfan]

I resurrected this old thread because I think Xesdeeni and DG aka neuron2 have done a wonderful thing creating the DGPulldown tool. Hasn't gotten enough pub IMHO and it surely deserves it (never was a "DGPulldown" thread created per se, was there?). Anyway...

I bought a pricey DVD set from Sweden (PAL) which I did not want to convert to 720x480 because I thought my media players (networked ShowCenters) would play the original ripped 25fps MPEG2. Turns out at least my analog NTSC TV didn't like the original much (jerky, prolly had something to do with 25x2 vs 29.97x2 :p). Anyway, a simple DGPulldown from 25-->29.97 did the trick.

Amazingly, I was able to re-mux (using IfoEdit that didn't care this was non-standard stuff) the original 720x576 and 25fps AC3 audio with a brand-new subtitle track I made for it and it all plays beautifully! Just want to say THANKS you guys especially neuron2 for exe-cuting this! :cool:

[Guest]

I've never heard of anyone doing that before. Thanks for bringing it to our attention, and thank you for your kind words.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I actually did some tests a few years ago with (PAL) 720x576 MPEG-2 sources running at (NTSC) 29.970fps and 23.976fps speeds.... And vice-versa.

From what I remember, most, if not all my DVD players managed to puke out an NTSC signal... which was a positive step.

I was however unable to find a DVD authoring tool that would allow me to create "non DVD standard" VOB sets suitable for burning onto DVD.


Cheers

EDIT: Found a thread: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=83499

[laserfan]

From what I remember, most, if not all my DVD players managed to puke out an NTSC signal... I was however unable to find a DVD authoring tool that would allow me to create "non DVD standard" VOB sets...Well, as I said IfoEdit worked for me. I had intended to sacrifice a DVD+R to try my VIDEO_TS with, and based on your post I have a better-than-zero chance of actually seeing it work on any of my NTSC players! I'll try it today!