Koepi ok, Nic & CD oversized?

[palesi]

Hi. I'm a former DivX user who has just switched to XviD, so I'm noob.

I tried to do a simple DVD to XviD conversion of this movie, "O Brother Where Art Thou", using three different codecs, namely Koepi 20122004, Nic 141204 and Celtic Druid. My box is a Pentium 4 3GHz with Win XP SP2. I did a two-pass encode using the DEFAULT settings of each codec, just setting the target size to 485799 kbytes. The final filesizes were:

485684 kbytes with Koepi
527012 kbytes with Nic
527002 kbytes with CD

Nic and CD are oversized. Why?

[Leak]

Originally posted by palesi
Nic and CD are oversized. Why?

Probably because they are compiles of XviD CVS HEAD and not of the stable 1.0 branch like Koepi's. And IIRC Koepi uses some slightly different default settings for rate control.

You might want to try to set the minimum quantizers to 2 and up the overflow treatment values to 10 or so. That should generally help.

Just a guess, though.

np: Pan Sonic - Joskus (A)

[chilledoutuk]

looking at the dates he quoted they all seem to be 1.1 compiles.

Anyways I also had this problem when using quant 1-31 range on some of the newer builds. it was however solved by changing the quant range to 2-31.
This remineded me of when the defaults were changed some time ago from 2-31 to 1-31 because people were complaining about undersized encodes. back then when they first released the rate controll had difficulty with controlling encodes that used quant 1's.

[celtic_druid]

XviD-1.0.3-20122004.exe

So the Koepi build used is 1.0.3, the others are cvs head (1.1) builds I guess. Nic's definatly would be as that is the only build avaiable. I have 1.0.x builds available, however I am assuming that it is my cvs head build from 2004.12.20 which you would expect to behave basically the same as Nic's, being only slightly newer so faster b-vop VHQ and 1.0.x branch merges.

[Koepi]

I think the installers of Nic and CelticDruid don't reset the registry data (codec settings) after install. Make sure to hit "load defautls" after instaling those, maybe that helps solving the issue.

Cheers
Koepi

[celtic_druid]

Mine deletes HKCU\Software\GNU\XviD. That is enough isn't it?

[Koepi]

Yupp, that does the trick. Hm, so it's not a "old settings" issue.

Time to further investigate :)

Cheers
Koepi

[palesi]

If it can be of any help, I used SmartRipper 2.41 to rip the vobs in Movie mode, then I used DGIndex 1.0.12 to create the d2v file, which begins like this:


DGIndexProjectFile06
7
24 C:\rip_brother\rip_1.vob
24 C:\rip_brother\rip_2.vob
24 C:\rip_brother\rip_3.vob
24 C:\rip_brother\rip_4.vob
24 C:\rip_brother\rip_5.vob
24 C:\rip_brother\rip_6.vob
24 C:\rip_brother\rip_7.vob

Stream_Type=1
iDCT_Algorithm=5 (1:MMX 2:SSEMMX 3:FPU 4:REF 5:SSE2MMX)
YUVRGB_Scale=1 (0:TVScale 1:PCScale)
Luminance_Filter=0,0 (Gamma, Offset)
Clipping=0,0,0,0 (ClipLeft, ClipRight, ClipTop, ClipBottom)
Aspect_Ratio=16:9
Picture_Size=720x576
Field_Operation=0 (0:None 1:ForcedFILM 2:RawFrames)
Frame_Rate=25000
Location=0,0,6,ACE5


Then, AVS2AVI v1.39 with this AviSynth script:


LoadPlugin("C:\VIDEO\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\DGDecode.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\VIDEO\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\AutoCrop.dll")
mpeg2source("C:\rip_brother\rip.d2v")

LanczosResize(640,360)
AutoCrop(mode=0,threshold=20,samples=10)


The resulting avi is 640x272.

The only thing I changed from the default settings was Display encoding status, which I turned off. But I doubt this could interfere.

[Koepi]

Well, maybe the movie is very compressable. Disallow for quant1 frames (quant range: 2-31 instead of 1-31). If you get an undersized file then we know it's codec saturation. You'd need to set the curve treatment values to 10-20% instead of 5% then together with q1 frames to hit the desired size.

Cheers
Koepi

[palesi]

So, I uninstalled Koepi, checked the registry to be sure HKCU\Software\GNU\XviD wasn't there, and reinstalled Nic 141204. Then I changed the quantizers from 1-31 to 2-31 and re-ran the job: 526954 kbytes this time. Still off.

Well, one thing I've noticed is that the Profile @ Level setting is different between the codecs' defaults: Koepi is set to AS @ L5 while Nic is set to (unrestricted). Could this matter?

[Sharktooth]

No, the profiles just limit some codec features. AS@L5 is the highest profile and should not interfere with rate control.
The default settings should always work well.

[CruNcher]

@palesi
if you have the time could you try this http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=77022 ?

[palesi]

Ok, I tried CruNcher's codec with the default settings and it's right on spot: 485528 kbytes.

It's slower than Nic though:

cruNcher: 2h 25m 25s
Nic: 1h 50m 17s

[Selur]

@palesi: did you try changing the overflow treatment settings like Leak mentioned? This normally does the job for me,...