PC reboots inexplicably during encoding with DVD rebuilder [Archive]

Fignon89

6th December 2004, 09:00

My PC reboots inexplicably while encoding a movie with DVD Rebuilder using CCE basic. This happens with the last 3 versions of DVD Rebuilder (0.66a, 0.67 and 0.68). This happens about 20-30 minutes into the encoding job. The CPU temp goes up to 55 C during the job and holds there throughout.
The CPU usage is only 72-78 %. This is a 3.2 GHz Intel Northwood CPU with 1 GB of OCZ Platinum Rev. 2 RAM. The power supply is 520 Watts.
This is a brand new system - 1 week old.
This did not occur with my old system at all. I used DVD Rebuilder several times without a hitch on my old PC.
Any ideas out there, please ?

6th December 2004, 13:24

since your pc is brandnew and you only have it for 1 week we better blame your system instead of rebuilder

moreover, it will be the encoder/transcoder that runs most of the time and which would be the possible scapegoat

in your case i'd run testtools to find out the weak point in your system

try something like memtest for your ram
make sure to use non-aggressive bios/memory settings
check your mainboard/chipset drivers/look for updates
what about heat-issues/powersupply?

Rockas

6th December 2004, 13:52

Here's an advice to everyone that buys a new computer... run DVD-RB and you'll know if the system is allright :)

It works better than all the testing software available on the market :)

This has been verified having in account many threads and testimonials on this forum.

and this prooves that Rebuilder is one of the best pieces of software available :D

keep it UP

TheSeeker

6th December 2004, 16:08

If I had to guess I would say this is one of two things most likely:

1. A bios setting that is a little too aggressive. For me I get these random reboots when I put my computer in "Turbo" mode in the bios. I have a msi k8t neo fis2r mobo.

2. Bad or incompatible or cheap ram. This is more likely the case. With new computer and ddr ram, getting the exact right ram is more important than ever. I suggest running Prime95's torture test on your computer overnight and see what happens.

I would say that most likely your problem is hardware related. Just out of curiosity exactly what kind of computer do you have?

Fignon89

6th December 2004, 23:20

In response to "The Seeker":
My PC is an ASUS P4C800-E DX Mobo with a 3.2 GHz 'C'processor.
I included 1 GB of OCZ Platinum Rev.2 RAM (definitely not cheap and compatible with the Mobo because I scoped it out at Anandtech first).
I haven't overclocked because I just got the system a week ago, and I don't think I'd gain much from this CPU by OC'ing anyway, BUT,
I haven't had a look at how the supplier tweaked the BIOS either. (I'll take a look there next). I plan to update the BIOS to the latest and set the "default" or "fail-safe" settings just to get back to a clean starting point in the BIOS.
The only other component I have that might play in this is an ATI Radeon Pro 9800 128MB Video Card, but I think it's compatible with this system too. The only time this PC reboots itself is while running DVD-RB (about 20 minutes into the job), so I'm thinking it must be related to something DVD-RB stesses while running the encoder (in this case CCE). CPU ?

Paced

6th December 2004, 23:33

Originally posted by Fignon89
In response to "The Seeker":
My PC is an ASUS P4C800-E DX Mobo with a 3.2 GHz 'C'processor.
I included 1 GB of OCZ Platinum Rev.2 RAM (definitely not cheap and compatible with the Mobo because I scoped it out at Anandtech first).
I haven't overclocked because I just got the system a week ago, and I don't think I'd gain much from this CPU by OC'ing anyway, BUT,
I haven't had a look at how the supplier tweaked the BIOS either. (I'll take a look there next). I plan to update the BIOS to the latest and set the "default" or "fail-safe" settings just to get back to a clean starting point in the BIOS.
The only other component I have that might play in this is an ATI Radeon Pro 9800 128MB Video Card, but I think it's compatible with this system too. The only time this PC reboots itself is while running DVD-RB (about 20 minutes into the job), so I'm thinking it must be related to something DVD-RB stesses while running the encoder (in this case CCE). CPU ?

Is your RAM's frequency set higher than the CPU's FSB? If so, that can cause reboots on rare occasions also. I had the same problem as you a while back (CCE crashed constantly, and also rebooted my computer at the same time), and once I lowered the frequency of my RAM, the problems went away. But, to get a clearer view of what is causing your crashes, go to the "Startup and Recovery" area of Windows 2000/XP (Properties of My Computer -> Advanced tab) and untick 'Automatically Reboot.' Then, next time instead of rebooting, the dreaded 'blue screen' should appear and tell you exactly where the fault is - hopefully.

PS - I doubt it's the CPU; sounds more like a RAM problem to me. But then again, I could be wrong :D

DD51

7th December 2004, 03:20

Fignon89,

I have the same motherboard (Awesome MB) has you and same processor except I have a 3.0C northwood CPU. My system is OC'd (18%) to 3.54GHZ and my memory is 1:1 at 236MHZ x 2 (472MHZ dual channel enabled). My memory (Kingston KVR400X64C3AK2/1G) "suks" compared to what you have! I specifically use DVD Rebuild with CCE to test any OC'd system as it's the best software to test the stability of a OC'd computer! If I go to 20% or 3.6GHZ it crashes!
My system is ROCK solid! Never crashes! (@18% OC)

You said that your Norhtwood goes as high as 55C. In my opinion that's your first hint to your problem. It's way to high of a temp for a NON OC'D computer. I am using the orginal fan supplied and never ever reached 50C. The highest I hit was 49C. Something is definately not right. I agree it has nothing to do with DVD Rebuild. Make sure your cpu heatsink is seated right!

Your system with NO overclock should be ROCK stable. You can fire as many programs at it and should NOT/NEVER crash at all!!!!

I sincerely doubt it's the memory (dam good too).

Your system should be overclockable and ROCK stable past 3.65GHZ.
You may also want to check what your CPU core voltage is at. I set mine at 5.875v

Make sure your cpu heatsink is seated right!

Please let us know how you make out! I'm definately curious!
email me if you wish...I'll gladly help the best I can.

Regards,

candsh

7th December 2004, 04:33

Another thing you might check. Disable your screen saver during encodes. CCE is a real cpu hog when it is running and if your screeensaver tries to come on at a peak moment can cause this to happen, also your e-mail program if it is running in the system tray. Had this happen to me a few times when I forget to shut them down. Easier to check this than to start reconfiguring your computer

Fignon89

7th December 2004, 07:11

In response to DD51;
Thanks for the very interesting and informative post. It has come at an appropriate time because I had just flashed my BIOS with the latest version and then set the "Default" settings because I was not sure what the supplier had done in the BIOS prior to delivery to me.
Funny thing; during the EZ Flash procedure, just before the flashing occurred I heard a voice come over my speakers stating, "something failed to due CPU overclocking". I didn't catch the "something".
Anyway, I thought it odd because I had not done anything to OC this system. After resetting the BIOS defaults I ran DVD-RB once again with the same movie and watched to see what would happen. This time the CPU temp climbed to only 50C (the very same temp you suggest it should not surpass if not OC'ed)and sat there throughout until the suceessful encoding of the movie completed. Of course, I still don't know what the supplier had done prior to my receiving my PC, so I don't know what setting in the BIOS they may have "tinkered with" to cause my grief. I'm still concerned my CPU may be a little weak or flaky in not being able to tolerate 55C for any period of time. I would have thought it should be able to handle a higher temp, and, what if I do want to OC in the future? I still plan to check the heat sink fitting and make sure there's enough goop between it and the CPU. Will also look at fan adjustments if neccessary to increase cooling to the CPU, but, is 55C a reasonable temp for this CPU to fail, or not?

DD51

7th December 2004, 15:39

but, is 55C a reasonable temp for this CPU to fail, or not?

YES! For Northwood CPU you DON'T want anything higher than 50C
60C for Prescott CPU.
A couple of things...
How did you get your temp reading?
Did you get it off the ASUS Probe???
If you did then I'm affraid to tell you but you should add 5C to the current reading.
Use Everest home edition (free) to get a more realistic reading.

What version BIOS are you using?
I suggest Version 1018. It's the most stable!
1019 and 1020(beta) and not stable!

I hope you have good ventilation on your case.
I suggest a minimum of an exhaust fan. Ideally you want an exhaust plus an intake fan.

You did the right thing by resetting your BIOS when you flashed the BIOS. You should always do that after a BIOS flash. Then you can OC.

Please let me know if you need more info. I'll be more than happy to do soo.

Good luck

Regards,

Fignon89

7th December 2004, 17:17

DD51:
Yes, I did get the temp reading from ASUS Probe.
I will run the test again with Everest Home Edition.
I used BIOS version 1019.
My case should have good ventilation. I got the Coolermaster Stacker.
It has a 120mm intake fan up front blowing across the hard drives, a 120mm exhaust fan out the back, and, a 80mm fan on top blowing straight down over the Mobo.
I did notice in the BIOS my CPU Heatsink fan was set to the lowest setting (11/16 of full speed) by default. I will use the "Q-Fan" feature to adjust that up to a higher speed. Also, I will pull the heatsink tonight and ensure there is enough goop spread evenly over the CPU. I haven't done that before but I had a guy at work show me the tape they put on some cpu's for the heatsink and he found that the tape only covered about 2/3 of the surface area of his CPU. I wonder if mine might look about the same?
Once I have the heatsink checked, the fan tweaked and Everest Home set to monitor I will do another test run with DVD-RB.
Hopefully I can get the temp down under 50C consistently (even lower because I have not yet OC'ed).
Just curious, where did you get the Max temp figures for these CPU's?
I looked at Intel's site and they have some Thermal Info for their processors but the chart only showed "Max Case Temp", "Max Recommended Fan Inlet Temp", and "Processor Thermal Design Power(W)".
No Max CPU temp???

Fignon89

7th December 2004, 19:13

One more thing I noticed that I'm wondering about - My CPU usage was showing only 73-78% while using DVD-RB on this machine, not 100% as I have seen on other machines while using DVD-RB. Is it possible my PC is throttling back on the processor because of the heat buildup?

DD51

7th December 2004, 21:32

Fignon89,

You have excellent ventilation. No problem there!
Thats what I have too, except for the 80mm fan blowing onto the MB (bonus there).

The 70%+ CPU usage is normal cause of the HT working. That's fine. Leaves room for you to do
other stuff.

You write making sure there's enough GOOP!. Please do not put alot!!!
You have to put a THIN LAYER. Too much is not good! You're CPU heatsink should have copper underneath
in the middle. (I would not put tape there, if there is some I'd remove it!)
Arctic Silver 5 is probably the best thermal best outhere. You may want to consider it.

Regarding Max temp for the CPU: It is NOT the Maximum it can handle but what is recommended for maximum
longivity of the CPU. I get all my information from the extreme overclocking forum. (great place if you
want to OC a computer. Very knowledgable people there). I'm a rookie compared to most in there!

I would definately go back to 1018 if you intend to overclock! or else you should be fine with 1019 (it
boots faster).

Once I have the heatsink checked, the fan tweaked and Everest Home set to monitor I will do another
test run with DVD-RB.Hopefully I can get the temp down under 50C consistently (even lower because I have
not yet OC'ed).

I have Q-Fan Control set to off! To me it's not a good featuer. CPU temp is best ran the lowest possible!
I doubt you'll hear the difference. It's already very quiet!
I'd be surprised if you passed 43-45C with your setup even OC'd!

Thanks for keeping me posted. I wish I was there to help.

Regards,

dannyv

7th December 2004, 22:03

Originally posted by Fignon89
DD51:
I will pull the heatsink tonight and ensure there is enough goop spread evenly over the CPU. I haven't done that before but I had a guy at work show me the tape they put on some cpu's for the heatsink and he found that the tape only covered about 2/3 of the surface area of his CPU.

DD51 is absolutly correct you never want to put to much heatsink compound on the cpu or heatsink. He is also correct about artic silver being the best to use.

What you need to do is make sure your heatsink and fan is correct for the CPU. It should have a round copper core and the fan should be large enough for the cpu type (thermatech make excellent fans).

Next you want to prepare the surfaces of both the cpu and the heatsink base. You do this by cleaning both surfaces with alchole making sure you get all old compound off.

Next put a small amount of artic silver compound in the middle of the copper core of the heatsink and rub it in then wipe it completely off leaving a transparent thin film. What this does is fills in the groves, scratches and valleys of the copper core.

Next put a small amount on the CPU being careful not to get any on the surrounding waffer components or solder points and spread it thin with a credit card or small screw driver.

Next mount the heatsink to the CPU.

Fignon89

8th December 2004, 19:38

Thank you DD51 and dannyv for your latest posts.
I checked my CPU-Heatsink conductor and it was a tape substance but it appeared to be applied fairly well. I was able to rub this off with my finger quite easily. I haven't yet applied the new compound (I had to go to work :)). However, before I did this I ran another couple of tests with DVD-RB. The first test (with default BIOS settings) failed about 10 minutes into the job with a blue screen (1st one of those so far). I have 1GB OCZ Platinum Rev. 2 RAM and I understand it requires 2.75V which is a little higher than normal, so I decided to specify that voltage in the BIOS for the DRAM Voltage. I ran DVD-RB again with this change and the job completed successfully BUT the CPU temp ran at 53-54C throughout(for an hour). I also noticed my CPU fan speed is a constant 2576-2596RPM; it never goes higher. I have noticed the fan on my PC at work increases from 3100RPM to 4100RPM running the same job (DVD-RB)and the temp held at 54-56C throughout, so it seems the fan increases speed in an attempt to provide more cooling at the heat builds up but it still managed at an even higher temp?? I also found this article at http://www.guru3d.com/article/content/61/2 which shows even higher temps for this processor without problems. Now, I'm not as convinced the CPU temp is the actual cause of my problems even though I would like to get it cooler to prolong the life of my CPU and increase it's efficiency. So, if I get the best heatsink/fan setup I can get with perfectly applied compound, that is all I can do to address the CPU heat. Maybe there is another problem such as an incorrect BIOS setting? DD51 - any possiblity you can give me some of the key BIOS settings you are using for this Mobo? - You have the same Mobo and your processor is the same with just a small difference in speed.

TheSeeker

8th December 2004, 20:31

54-56 celcius really isnt that bad considering the processor is under heavy load for a while. I would just make sure you get good thermal compound on your processor and maybe a little faster fan and try that out. Run some test apps like Prime95 which totally stresses your computer to the max. Will do 100% cpu usage and use all of your ram running calculations for as long as you want. It really is a good test of system stability.

Fignon89

8th December 2004, 22:52

Thanks for the input, Seeker.
I'll do that.
I would imagine the stock Intel heatsink/fan combo supplied with the processor should be sufficient to do the job it was intended to do, but, ....
does anyone have experience (actually measured improvements in cooling by degrees) with a better heatsink/fan combo they could recommend? (I'm not interested in water cooling or refrigeration units at this point :)).

Fignon89

8th December 2004, 22:58

I would like to thank everyone for their input regarding this matter.
I now realize this situation is no longer a DVD-RB matter but a cooling matter and/or a BIOS setting matter and this Forum is probably not the appropriate place to address this concern, so I'll drop the subject here and pursue the solutions suggested and if necessary I'll follow up in a more appropriate Forum.
Any suggestions for good hardware/bios related Forums? :)

Fignon89

9th December 2004, 18:49

Just a note to let everyone who helped me out with this heat issue the final outcome. I put the new heatsink compound on as instructed and ran DVD-RB again to test. The CPU heat actually dropped 2 degrees Centigrade throughout so that was an improvement, but still 52C, hot for a Northwood processor. Then, while monitoring with "Everest" I flipped through a couple of the other screens and discovered that my supplier put in a PRESCOTT processor, not a NORTHWOOD processor as I spec'd. No wonder it runs hotter than a Northwood! But it actually runs pretty cool for a Prescott. :). Anyway, my Northwood processor is on the way. As far as the system crashes are concerned, they stopped after I tweaked the BIOS and set the DRAM Voltage to 2.75 to match the requirements of the OCZ RAM. Thanks all.

DD51

10th December 2004, 15:38

Fignon89,

I apologize, I was gone away a couple of days.
I'm glad you made some good progress and others chiped in to help.

So it's a prescott processor. So the temps you're reading are NORMAL then. Prescotts run hotter than Northwoods do.

A couple more things...I would choose 2.85v for your DRAM voltage. That's what I use.
If your interessted in Top of the line CPU cooler, get the Thermalright XP-90. You'll be glad!

If ever you decide to OC the comp, let me know and I'll help the best I can.

Good luck and hope all goes well.

Regards,

TheSeeker

10th December 2004, 16:15

P4 Procs run pretty hot. My Athlon64 under full load after encoding for like 13 hours, gets up to like mid 40's celcius max.

Fignon89

19th December 2004, 00:12

Just to let everyone who contributed posts to my CPU heat issues.
My new 3.2GHz "C" Processor arrived along with a Zalman CNPS7000B-Cu Heatsink I ordered and a tube of Artic Silver 5 thermal compound.
The results were dramatic. Previous temp with Prescott CPU and stock heatsink 52-55 degrees C while using DVD-RB.
New temp with Northwood CPU and Zalman heatsink with Artic5 compound is 38-40 degrees C while using DVD-RB. Also, was able to complete a rebuilding of Two Towers (movie only) in 1hr.20min. total time.
I've never seen that speed before; typical movie rebuild was taking about 2hr. with the Prescott CPU (same speed 3.2GHz)and with my previous CPU (a 1.4GHz Intel P4 with Rambus RAM)it would usually take over 3hr.
I haven't tried Overclocking this new CPU yet but the next test will be to see if I can get to 3.6GHz with the processor remaining comfortably cool.

DD51

19th December 2004, 05:45

Fignon89,

I haven't tried Overclocking this new CPU yet but the next test will be to see if I can get to 3.6GHz with the processor remaining comfortably cool.

I'll bet you any amount you will!
Even at 3.75GHZ.
My avg. speed is between 3.6 to 4.1 with DVD-RB and CCE

I'm very happy to hear your results...congrats!

Now OC that baby and don't be shy! ;)

dizzyhazy

26th December 2004, 06:11

Originally posted by Fignon89
My PC reboots inexplicably while encoding a movie with DVD Rebuilder using CCE basic. This happens with the last 3 versions of DVD Rebuilder (0.66a, 0.67 and 0.68). This happens about 20-30 minutes into the encoding job. The CPU temp goes up to 55 C during the job and holds there throughout.
The CPU usage is only 72-78 %. This is a 3.2 GHz Intel Northwood CPU with 1 GB of OCZ Platinum Rev. 2 RAM. The power supply is 520 Watts.
This is a brand new system - 1 week old.
This did not occur with my old system at all. I used DVD Rebuilder several times without a hitch on my old PC.
Any ideas out there, please ?

This may sound weird, but one of my computers crashes almost every time when using Rebuilder in one button mode. Using the 3 button mode, it hardly ever crashes. Worth a try....