I/O Error - Media or Drive?

[rickola1977]

I've been trying to get some insight on this and so far I haven't really found anything helpful. I have an AMD Athlon 64 3400+, with 1GB DDR400, WinXP SP2, and a Pioneer DVR-108 with firmware 1.14.

I use DVDDecrypter and DVDShrink to make my backups. I bought a 100pk of RIDATA 8X DVD-R's Model DRD-478-RDCB100 and in the beginning I burned over 10 at speeds as high as 12X.

Lately though, it seems whenenver I don't limit the burn to 4X (i.e. if I select a higher speed or MAX)I always end up with an I/O error at right about 97% while burning to DVD with DVDDecrypter.

Is this just a media problem? I really hope so, but it doesn't seem to happen as much (but still does sometimes) at 4X speeds. I've been tossing a lot of DVD's because of this. I also have a Samsung W08A in my Athlon XP 2000+ computer and it also has the same I/O errors at about 97% completion sometimes if I don't limit the speed to 4X.

If it's the disks how do you find the good media? I hear a lot of talk about RITEK G04's etc.. but how do you KNOW when you're buying RITEK G04's when you're in the store????

Also, if it COULD be the drive, what are some things that could be causing this?

Anyways, I appreciate any help I get with this!

[rickola1977]

I can't believe no one's replied to this. At least answer my DVD Media question for chrissakes!


Anyhow, the problem is not the media, the problem is not the burner, the problem is not the IDE cable (give me a break!), the problem is not the DMA setting, the problem once again is that Micro$oft can't fix one problem without causing 20 more! The problem is WindowsXP SP2! I did a fresh install of SP2 and had the same exact problem, so I went back and did a fresh install of WindowsXP SP1a and immediately I burned two perfect DVD's at 12X speed using the same drive and media.

I have another computer with SP2 on it as well, and was also having the same problem of not being able to burn faster than 4X without an I/O error towards the end. I can bet when I re-install WindowsXP SP1a on that system, that it'll burn no problems at 8X (Like it should anyway).

Not that I expect much help from anyone on this forum (won't even give the time of day if you ask), but if anyone knows which SP2 service(s) to disable to fix this problem I'd really appreciate an answer.

I'd also appreciate it if someone would answer my question about DVD media as well.

[LIGHTNING UK!]

Your post was very hard to answer actually. You didnt help matters by not actually quoting the error message.

Because you were burning the majority of the disc okay, I would have just said you had cheapo media - known to error out at the best of times!

Of course you're denying that this was the problem, claiming that SP2 caused your problems.

That kind of thing is impossible to diagnose without actually doing what you did - rebuilding the pc!

The system rebuild should not have effected the error messages your system was throwing up, after all, they're supposed to come from the drive itself - which shouldnt give a monkeys about what software you have installed.

Anyway, I'm glad you've fixed your problem by going back to SP1.

For the media question, the simple answer is: You cant!
Unless the dye id is specified on the packaging, you cant tell until you put the disc in the drive. That's why you don't buy these things from stores, but instead get them from online places that actually perform that little function on your behalf and then add it to the description of the product. Weird as it may seem, buying online is actually the safer option.

[mudda_t]

Is your 108 firmware 1.14 the hacked version?

[rickola1977]

Originally posted by LIGHTNING UK!
Your post was very hard to answer actually. You didnt help matters by not actually quoting the error message.

Because you were burning the majority of the disc okay, I would have just said you had cheapo media - known to error out at the best of times!

Of course you're denying that this was the problem, claiming that SP2 caused your problems.

That kind of thing is impossible to diagnose without actually doing what you did - rebuilding the pc!

The system rebuild should not have effected the error messages your system was throwing up, after all, they're supposed to come from the drive itself - which shouldnt give a monkeys about what software you have installed.

First off, didn't burn "the majority of dics" ok unless I limited it to 4X on a 16X drive using 8X media (you see the problem). Before SP2 I was burning at 12X using the normal non-hacked firmware. SP2, nothing but I/O errors if you try anything other than 4X.

As for posting the error, you should know what it says there's only one message when you get an I/O Error menu on DVDDecrypter.

Reinstalled SP1a and am now burning again at 12X speed, so in fact the diagnosis is quite simple. DVDDecrypter is the problem running under SP2. I have had many people tell me on other forums that they had the same problems with DVDDecrypter and certain versions of Nero under SP2.

[jel]

for someone with only 3 posts to their name, you have done an excellent job of insulting the entire forum along with belittling the author of (one of) the best dvd rippers out there!

conrgratulations! gold star for you :rolleyes:!

if you hadnt realised, no-one on this forum gets paid to help others out. we do it because we have an interest in DVD/video conversion, and enjoy sharing that knowledge with the community. we are not here to serve you .. if no-one answers it is not because they are ignoring you but simply that they either do not know the answer, or that you had not provided sufficient details to get a correct response.

now, if you HAD asked for the time of day, i would have happily replied with 'time.windows.com' and all would be well ... as it is, i believe you need a serious attitude re-adjustment before anyone will go out of their way to make your life easier.

[rickola1977]

I meant no offense to anyone on this forum. But I've been to DVDDecrypters forum and many other forums and evertime someone has a problem with DVDDecrypter it's always the fault of some hardware, or it's the fault of the DVD media, or it's the fault of this and that.

I didn't mean to belittle anyone on this forum and their help is appreciated, but that "author of (one of) the best dvd rippers out there" insults far more people than I do on a daily basis along with everyone else on DVDDecrypter's forums. But I've read many posts (dealing with DVDDecrypter) where people are basically told they don't know what they're talking about and it's their media, etc... so they go out spend another $30 or more (buying better media) and end up having the same problems when all someone has to say is "Hey, it's more than likely SP2 causing the problem".

Everyone trys to make DVDDecrypter out to be angelic software that has no errors. Now, I personally love DVDDecrypter and I'd rather roll back Windows to SP1a just to be able to use it and have it work great, BUT there is not ONE post where anyone will actually admit there might be a compatability issue with SP2. Just admit that that MIGHT be the problem. It's no strike against DVDDecrypter or the author. It's just another example of how Micro$oft can't fix anything without causing a bunch of other problems.


But I do sincerly apologize for my attitude in the previous post and truly mean no offense to those who give possible solutions.

[D3s7]

Erm...
Wow... If that was an apology I'd hate to see you when think your right....

anyway... I don't believe I have seen a time when Light_UK has ever insulted anyone short of maybe a few users requesting something that's extremely dumb... now... if you have a problem with DVDDecrypter forum, please keep it there... we don't want to mix problems here..

Now that aside, I personally am running Windows XP with SP2 and have no problems with it.. so I doubt that's your issue but good for you if it works... However I would tend to agree your media is probably touchy when it gets to the end of the disk... I've had a many brands that have issues. I personally stick w/ Ritek's / TDK / Verbatium

Now the proper solution to your issue would be describe in more details the error.. send the error log and report any entry in your event logs.... If there ends up to be an actual issue with SP2.. then maybe you could have helped "The Author" fix it for yourself and future users.

[rickola1977]

Originally posted by D3s7
Erm...
Wow... If that was an apology I'd hate to see you when think your right....
Now that aside, I personally am running Windows XP with SP2 and have no problems with it.. so I doubt that's your issue but good for you if it works...

Now the proper solution to your issue would be describe in more details the error.. send the error log and report any entry in your event logs.... If there ends up to be an actual issue with SP2.. then maybe you could have helped "The Author" fix it for yourself and future users.

Seriously D3s7, I am a little confused because I really meant no attitude in my last repsonse and I hope this post doesn't come across that way either.

It's just the attitude that you and others show in your response (I use SP2 and have no problems so I dont' think that's your issue..but good for you if it works). Why not? It is possible for some to use SP2 with no problems while many others have problems. All I am trying to say is, why does it always feel like there's a DVD Decrypter Gustapo out there everytime someone mentions a "possible" link between it conflicting with another program or what-not.

I'm not downing the program but there's always that underlying feeling in responses like yours that anyone who trys to make a connection between DVD Decrypter and problems that they're wrong or don't know what they're talking about and don't appreciate the program. If anything I'm downing SP2 and I'm not alone there.

I'm only stating the facts that I had the drive in two different systems, and in both systems no problems under SP1, problems under SP2, re-install SP1 and no problems. It's the same on my other computer with a completely different drive altogether. SP2, problems, SP1a, no problems, but still you say that "I doubt that's your issue". Why not? The only variable is whether or not I'm using SP1 or SP2.

Can you not see what I'm trying to say? There is no malice in my words and I seriously mean no offense and I hope most people reading this can see that. If you truly feel I've got an attitude problem then I will refrain from posting in the future.

I would, however, like to post the error and event logs if I get the chance. That would mean putting SP2 on my system again which I'll gladly do if it's the only way to prove that's where the problem lies.


"You can't shake hands with a clenched fist"

~Ghandi

[LIGHTNING UK!]

Basically the problem here is that you're probably not a programmer. As such you cant possibly understand my program how I do.

You'll have no comprehension of how CDB's are passed to the drive / drivers and how the results are interpreted.

I don't pretend to fool anyone into thinking DVD Decrypter is perfect, obviously it's not or I'd have stopped at version 1.0! I do however know how to spot a bug - generally speaking, I/O Errors are never bugs.

As for posting the error, you should know what it says there's only one message when you get an I/O Error menu on DVDDecrypter.

Dunno what the hell you meant about that... LOL

There are hundreds of possible errors - again proving my point that you just dont understand what's actually going on behind the scenes. You cant even tell the difference between error messages when they're shoved in your face.

If SP2 is causing problems on your machine, maybe... just maybe it's something else in your machine that's not compatible with it? Applications are probably the last things to be effected by updates such as service packs. The OS has an API that programmers use to perform functions. These (by design) should never change and so an application wouldn't know the difference. The problem could well lie with your drivers which run at a much lower level and so ARE effected by changes in the OS's underlying code.
When updating the service pack, you should also ensure you've got up-to-date drivers for your pc.

DVD Decrypter is just a single exe. It relies on Microsoft's own SPTI layer for communication with drives. As I've mentioned before, if for some reason that returns a spurious error (20 times I might add! - due to internal software retries), I can do nothing more than take it's word for it and display it to the user.

I hope you can understand that the last thing you expect to be at fault is the OS itself, it's no wonder that people put write failures down to the media.

Nobody knows your PC like you do. It would seem pretty simple to me that if you were burning fine 1 minute, installed SP2 and then the next minute couldn't burn for toffee that SP2 was causing some problems. Personally I wouldn't even bother posting up about it because you already know your answer... there is some issue with SP2 on your machine. Just because not all programs are effected doesnt mean a problem doesnt exist. Not all program work in the same way, nor issue the same API calls.

[rickola1977]

Originally posted by LIGHTNING UK!
Basically the problem here is that you're probably not a programmer. As such you cant possibly understand my program how I do.

There are hundreds of possible errors - again proving my point that you just dont understand what's actually going on behind the scenes.


I think this has been made quite obvious. :o

If SP2 is causing problems on your machine, maybe... just maybe it's something else in your machine that's not compatible with it? Applications are probably the last things to be effected by updates such as service packs. The OS has an API that programmers use to perform functions. These (by design) should never change and so an application wouldn't know the difference. The problem could well lie with your drivers which run at a much lower level and so ARE effected by changes in the OS's underlying code.
When updating the service pack, you should also ensure you've got up-to-date drivers for your pc.

This is the best response I've gotten on this issue. This is the kind of information I was looking for. I never meant to sound like I was placing blame directly on Decrypter, just that something about SP2 was causing it to fail a lot near the end.


I hope you can understand that the last thing you expect to be at fault is the OS itself, it's no wonder that people put write failures down to the media.

Nobody knows your PC like you do. It would seem pretty simple to me that if you were burning fine 1 minute, installed SP2 and then the next minute couldn't burn for toffee that SP2 was causing some problems. Personally I wouldn't even bother posting up about it because you already know your answer... there is some issue with SP2 on your machine. Just because not all programs are effected doesnt mean a problem doesnt exist. Not all program work in the same way, nor issue the same API calls.

I agree with you and I really didn't know the problem when I first posted. I first used this drive in a different system under SP1 and then when I bought my AMD 64 system put it in that one with SP2 also upgrading to SP2 on my AMDXP as well. So I didn't catch it that easily as it could have been hardware/software conflicts.

On my AMD 64 system using a Pioneer DVR-108 fm1.14, I did a fresh install of SP2, only installing the OS, DVD Decrypter, and DVD Shrink and I still had the same problems. So I did the a fresh install of SP1a, again with only DVD Decrypter and DVD Shrink installed and started burning again with no problems. (I do get an occasional I/O error which I have no doubt truly is media related).

I repeated this procedure on the AMD XP 2000+ using a Samsung W08A and got the same results. I'm sure many people out there have SP2 with no problems, when I posted I was speaking of my 2 systems. Nobody can speak for everyone elses system. I was frustrated at the time for having thrown away bunches of perfectly good DVD's (well ok, decent dvds). I'd use DVD Decrypter over Nero any day. I've tried Nero and had countless problems (after burning an image, the drive was no longer recognized). Again, I can only speak of my system.


I think this issue has been dealt with enough and would like to put this thread to rest.


On a lighter note, it would be really sweet to see a version of DVD Decrypter that runs on Linux! IMHO. ;)

[rickola1977]

Originally posted by jel
for someone with only 3 posts to their name, you have done an excellent job of insulting the entire forum along with belittling the author of (one of) the best dvd rippers out there!

Originally posted by D3s7
Erm...Wow... If that was an apology I'd hate to see you when think your right....

Originally posted by Lightning UK!
Basically the problem here is that you're probably not a programmer. As such you cant possibly understand my program how I do.

You'll have no comprehension of how CDB's are passed to the drive / drivers and how the results are interpreted.


I've been reading my posts and thinking about everything and I feel really bad for how I handled myself in this post. To make matters worse, this wasn't the only forum. I was in a very bad mood when I posted, about things not even related to PC's and DVD Burning, and it all started coming out when dealing with the DVD problem which was really frustrating but hardly anyone here's fault.

To top it off, after exploring the matter more, I can't even say that it was definitely SP2 that was to blame. I am having less problems than when under SP2, but as many of you have mentioned that could be due to God know's how many things. As for two different systems having the same problem, again it could be two completely different things causing it in either system. I should'nt have been so hasty in posting the first solution that appeared to work. Especially in the manner in which I posted.

The damage has been done but for what it's worth,

jel,
I apologize for the attitude I've displayed and for offending you. I'm sure you know a hell of a lot more about these problems than I do.

D3s7,
I also want to apologize for my attitude and this time it's not a half-assed apology. This entire post has been unconstructive other than it's been a humbling experience for me.

mudda_t,
I can't believe you even replied without comment about my asshole behavior. Regardless, I want to apologize to you as well.

Lightning UK!
Hell, what can I say? Getting an attitude about a program you wrote like I know what the hell I'm talking about. Ignore my stupid remarks and please accept my apology.

To those who read this thread without reply and were offended by my attitude. I aplogize to you all as well. In the future I will not take my bad day out on people who spend so much free time only trying to help others without pay. I will never post again in a way that is unconstructive or critical of any person. This is not how I really am I swear!

[jel]

hey mate,

definitely no need to apologise to me, although the gesture is very much appreciated. the reason why i responded in the fashion i did, was because of the large number of people that post things such as:
'help me fix ...'
'why wont anyone help me ..' (5 minutes later)
'you guys suck' (10 minutes after that)

because the forum only exists in the written form, we cant read into anything more than the way in which you post.
we cant tell if your having a bad day, or that you are at your wits end trying to get things to work ... and unfortunately we cant all sit down at the local, over a pint or 30, and workshop the problem.

which is why so much so much emphasis gets placed on the 'tone' in which you write ... and to be honest you really did come across as a demanding, self-important prat :D
but dont worry about it ... we all have thick skins and have been known to make more than the occassional mistake (i happen to specialise in those), and trust me : no-one will remember this thread by the time you next post.

once again, thankyou for the apology.

peace

jon

[rickola1977]

I got an answer off another forum which probably makes more sense, and consequently is an even smaller problem than my earlier rants.

The problem more than likely was due to DVD Shrink making my ISO's too large. So, as I was burning a DVD, it would almost finish and run out of space thus giving me an I/O Error stating a write error and that the media is an icompatible format. I believe that the reason the DVD's burned with no errors at 4X is probably due to overburning done by the drive. This is not the definitive answer, and I haven't had the chance to really investigate it, but this is the most likely the cause of the problems.