16:9 + 4:3 interlaced togheter

[symonjfox]

Hi, I just went on holiday with my DV camera. I could record about 1h of tape, then the camera didn't work anymore (it had some problems with head, it must be repared by techical support).

I used the 16:9 flag (so the resolution of my cassette is 720*576 16:9 INTERLACED PAL).

So, I met some friends that come from near my country and they borrow me their DV tape, so I will use the parts where we were togheter to complete my holidays' DVD.

Their settings were 4:3, 720*576 INTERLACED.

So here's the problem:

My goal is to create a DVD that contains BOTH films, but in 1 only file and everything in 16:9.

Since both the files are INTERLACED, the problem is that I can't just RESIZE and CROP, but I think that I should SEPARE the Even and Odd fields, RESIZE and CROP them separatly; and put them togheter.

Do you have any suggestion?
Is it there another better way to do this?

Obiously I'm going to use Avisynth.
I tried to search something, and I found something useful, but I don't understand how to resize and crop every field correctly, and also to put them toghter with the same order.


Avisource("Temp01.avi")
SeparateFields()
odd=SelectOdd
evn=SelectEven
Interleave(evn,odd)
Weave()
DoubleWeave.SelectOdd()
Converttoyuy2(interlaced=TRUE)

To reach my goal, should i use:

...
odd=SelectOdd
odd=LanczosResize(odd,???,???)
odd=Crop(odd,??,??,??,??)
odd=LanczosResize(odd,720,288)
... *the same for even field


Am I right?
Is it there a program that calculates the right dimensions of resize and cropping?

Thank you

[Mug Funky]

one thing about DV cams and 16:9... they shoot 4:3, crop, then upsize. the good thing is that we know we're not going to lose a lot by doing the reverse, unlike with true anamorphic.

here's what i'd do for the 16:9 bits:



assumebff() # it's DV footage, so i'm 90% sure it'll be bff
tdeint(1,0) # smartbobbing in bff

lanczosresize(720,432) # obtained 432 by 768*9/16
separatefields().selectevery(4,1,2).weave()
# selectevery 4,1,2 turns it to DVD native TFF. use 4,0,3 for bff

addborders(0,208,0,224)
# keeps borders on macroblock edges to help compression a little

[symonjfox]

one thing about DV cams and 16:9... they shoot 4:3, crop, then upsize. the good thing is that we know we're not going to lose a lot by doing the reverse, unlike with true anamorphic.I didn't know it. I thought it captures in true anamorphic. If I knewed it, I surely captured in 4:3 :)

ok, I'm triing to open this avs but it gives me an error
"There's no function named tdeint"

Maybe do I need a dll plugin for this?

I wanted to test my theory, and it WORKS!!
Avisource("Capture.1 [00_00_00_05].avi")

SeparateFields()

odd=SelectOdd
odd=LanczosResize(odd,720,384)
odd=Crop(odd,0,48,720,288)

evn=SelectEven

evn=LanczosResize(evn,720,384)
evn=Crop(evn,0,48,720,288)

Interleave(evn,odd)
Weave()
DoubleWeave.SelectOdd()

Yes, the upsampling is not so sharp, but the result is ok for me.
I'll test your method and then I'll choose the best for me.

Thank you

[symonjfox]

I tried your AVS (yes, I dl the Tdeint plugin), but there's a problem with the AR.
If I watch it at 1:1 it's ok, but I'm going to create a DVD, so it would be stretched a lot (I did a preview in VDubMod using the 16:9 AR).

My way worked well so I will use it.

Thank you again :cool:

[Mug Funky]

when you upsize individual fields you'll get a vertical shimmer because each field is displaced by half a pixel. this is why you should bob rather than separating fields. it's a little slower (or a lot depending on what bob you use), but the results will be better.

the cropping is a matter of taste i guess. what is the destination aspect ratio you're after? remember DVD can do both, and you wont gain anything by going anamorphic off a DV cam (unless you got one of those funky anamorphic lenses).

[edit]

here's a shortened version of your script. dot syntax and "implicit last" makes things easier.


Avisource("Capture.1 [00_00_00_05].avi")

SeparateFields()
LanczosResize(720,384)
Crop(0,48,720,288)
assumefieldbased()
Weave()
DoubleWeave.SelectOdd()

the doubleweave.selectodd is to change field order, yeah?

[scharfis_brain]

never ever use separatefields().resize().weave() !

it will (besides of the bad-quality resizing) place the new genrerated fields in a spatial (vertical) incorrect position, causing diagonals become jaggy and the image becoming slighty jumping on TV.

better use for the easiest method, which at least creates a correct field-placement:

bob()
resize()
converttoyuy2() # only, if YV12
assumebff() # for BFF output
#assumetff() # for TFF output
separatefields()
selectevery(4,0,3)
weave()

for much better result use a more advanced bobber, like tdeint, kernelbob or tmcbob.

But this already has been explained by Mug Funky

[symonjfox]

Ah, ok, I understood.

But the first script you post gives to me a strange video. The result is not 720*576 that must be flagged to 16:9, but a 1:1 video (720*864) with big black borders on top and botton.

Also I don't understand the difference between TFF and BFF. I know that I must chose the even or odd field as first. I tried to read on the avisynth documentation but it doesn't explain anything.

the doubleweave.selectodd is to change field order, yeah?Yes, because if I encode it in CCE without it, I get wrong field order; while if I do the doubleweave.selectodd I get the right order. I know that I can choose the first field in the encoder (CCE or TMPGEnc) but I do this because these records are 4 files from 4 different cassettes, so I want to be sure that the whole movie will be ok.

Now I tried this one and it seems to be ok (I hope)

Avisource("Capture.1 [00_00_00_05].avi")

assumebff() # it's DV footage, so i'm 90% sure it'll be bff
tdeint(1,0) # smartbobbing in bff
LanczosResize(720,384)
Crop(0,48,720,288)
assumefieldbased()
Weave()
DoubleWeave.SelectOdd()

Is this AVS correct? I VDubMod is perfect (if seen as 16:9), and this time I bobbed instead of separatefield.

The final result must be 720*576 to be encoded AS 16:9. It doesn't matter if the quality is damaged. If I don't reencode it as 16:9, I can't join the 2 different AR cassettes, you understand?
The other solution is to convert my 16:9 cassette into a 4:3 one, but I prefer to convert the other cassette.

[scharfis_brain]

no it is wrong.
it halves vertical resolution.


better use:

Avisource("Capture.1 [00_00_00_05].avi")
tdeint(1)
lanczos4resize(720,432) #only 432 lines will result in a correct AR
converttoyuy2() # only, if YV12
assumefieldbased()
assumebff()
separatefields()
selectevery(4,0,3)
weave()
addborders(0,72,0,72)

[symonjfox]

Originally posted by scharfis_brain
no it is wrong.
it halves vertical resolution.

better use:
Avisource("Capture.1 [00_00_00_05].avi")
tdeint(1)
lanczos4resize(720,432) #only 432 lines will result in a correct AR
converttoyuy2() # only, if YV12
assumefieldbased()
assumebff()
separatefields()
selectevery(4,0,3)
weave()
addborders(0,72,0,72)
Your AVS is good if I would create a DivX file (so the AR is 1:1).

I don't! I want to create a DVD with 16:9 AR. So I expand the vertical resolution (from 288 to 384) and then I crop 48 lines on top and 48 lines on bottom. The result is PERFECT.

The part I doubt is the BOB and WEAVE settings. They should be ok.

[scharfis_brain]

this script is NOT suitable for divx or others.
it is not a square-pixel format. it delivers DVD conform 1:1.094 PAR.


but if you want upsize 4:3 to 19:9 use this:
(I always thought, you wanted the opposite!)

Avisource("Capture.1 [00_00_00_05].avi")
tdeint(1)
crop(0,72,0,432)
lanczos4resize(720,576)
converttoyuy2() # only, if YV12
assumefieldbased()
assumebff()
separatefields()
selectevery(4,0,3)
weave()

also, I have to repeat myself:
384 active lines are not representing 16:9!

704x432 = proper 16:9
(704 -> 768x432 = 1.777777 = 16:9)

704x384 = 2.000 inbetween 16:9 and 1:2.35

[symonjfox]

OK, this is perfect. Thank you.

I don't remember how I found 384, I'm not so good in maths.

Never mind. This script works, I'll use it.

Thank you again