Bad Blocking [v 0.51-0.63a] - Found to not be a RB problem

[godhead]

JDobbs,

I have a movie that when backed up shows very bad blocking, but I can't say it's because of compression. It's almost like some flag isn't set properly or something. This is the only movie I've seen this happen on, so I've been trying each version from 0.51 (I think that was first) up until now with 0.63a. This is with CCE SP 2.67.00.27 using MPEG2Source("source",idct=7) and 3 passes (RB not CCE). Let me know if you want my .ini

The movie is "Sympathy for Mr. Vengence" and you can see the DVD details here. (http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/DVDReview/sympathy.htm) The problem is pretty strange as it seems to only affect the blocks that are being updated in the scene. You can see the problems in the two images below. The first one is a slight problem with his hands, but the second one really shows the blocking. The problem only seems to occur starting at Chapter 5 and randomly after that. The first portion of the disc looks great. This is with software playback btw. I haven't attempted a burn yet because of the results.

Reply here or send me a PM and I can send you anything else you need to diagnose the problem. Thanks again for such a great app though. This has been the ONLY DVD that's given me problems.

http://www.angryfanboy.com/images/snapshot01.png
http://www.angryfanboy.com/images/snapshot02.png

[godhead]

Forgot to add, that I have tried it without the MPEG2Source("source",idct=7) before and that didn't seen to change anything either.

I just tried to playback the .AVS for chapter 5 in MPC and noticed the same problems, so it seems there's something screwy there. Not sure where to go from here, so let me know what you need from me.

[wmansir]

It looks like bad decoding. If it was a disc read error you should have received a CRC or read error when decrypting. Could be due to some corruption inherent to the disc, or perhaps an Mpeg2dec error.

There's not much DVD-RB can do about it. jdobbs said the next version of DVD-RB will support DGDecode, which is the most up-to-date version of Mpeg2dec, so perhaps that will fix this problem.

[godhead]

There were no read errors during the decrypt or disc errors reported. I verified that this does not occur with the ISO image I've created, so I think it's probably an Mpeg2dec error.

I'll try DGDecode seperatly and see if the resulting AVS shows the same problems. If so, guess I'll report the problem to neuron2, so he can see if there's something in DVD2AVI.

Thanks for the info and I'll keep everyone updated on what I find.

[godhead]

OK,

Just ran the end of Chapter 4 and start of Chapter 5 through DGmpgdec1012a and saw the movie is NTSC Interlaced.

Well, created a quick AVS

LoadPlugin("C:\dgmpgdec1012a\DGDecode.dll")
mpeg2source("test2.d2v",idct=7)
ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=true)


and noticed the bad frames were now fixed!!!!!

Looks like the problem will be solved when JDobbs moves over to the newest DGmpgdec. Hope he can get it in the next release as you stated. If not, I totally understand because he does this on his "free time".

Thanks again !!

[Sir Didymus]

Excellent work godhead!

On what I know this is the first instance of a situation providing some reasons (very valid, I would say...) for upgrading the "standard" Mpeg Decoding Engine...

Cheers,
SD

[TuRiSOft]

Just to make you know , I noticed the same problem on "IL_CICLONE" and,because the source was clean and the comp ratio was real_High (about 95%), tried the same things you did(New DGDecode Engine).


Being unable to back it up w/RB (due to its limitations w/DGDEcode) I decided to shrink it .

Special thanks to Robot1 for his RBOPt (before using it I was never used to watch out the avses).

[jdobbs]

@godhead

It's interesting that something like this would happen only on a certain DVD....

I've already modified DVD-RB to work with DGDECODE.DLL and have been testing it for about a week. It will be released in v0.64.

[glassvial]

Maybe DGDecode and RB .64 will solve my poor quality B&W disc problem too, it sounds like the same thing. Looking forward to giving it a shot. JDobbs, any idea of when? Not being pushy just curious/anxious ;)

[jdobbs]

I wouldn't get too excited about this... as I suspect the blockiness is the result of some illegal MPEG sequence rather than MPEG2DEC3 itself (I've seen it myself on commercially released material). My guess would be that DGDECODE probably handles the bad sequence better, but that still doesn't make the fault MPEG2DEC3's, it's still the source.

MPEG2DEC3DG.DLL from the DECODEFIX110.ZIP file has worked very reliably for me for a long time. DGDECODE.DLL adds some better random access, better handling, and speed as I recall; but the basic engine is still the same.

[glassvial]

Well the problem with the B&W disc I'm trying to backup is similar to godhead's problem, it's blocky as hell, but it doesn't look *quite* as bad as his caps. I'd be more than willing to test out .64 against it and see if it's still blocky or not.

[MAPE]

Are you sure you are using a good quality disc (Tdk, Verbatim, Ritek,...) and not a chepo one. I had this problem when I burned with Nero and used Princo, Dynam and generic discs. I recommended creating an Iso with Imagetool classic and burn it with Dvd Decrypter. For me that resolved all my blockiness problems no matter what Dvd2avi or Mpeg2dec version I tryied.
;)

[glassvial]

Originally posted by MAPE
Are you sure you are using a good quality disc (Tdk, Verbatim, Ritek,...) and not a chepo one. I had this problem when I burned with Nero and used Princo, Dynam and generic discs. I recommended creating an Iso with Imagetool classic and burn it with Dvd Decrypter. For me that resolved all my blockiness problems no matter what Dvd2avi or Mpeg2dec version I tryied.
;)
My results are from just playing off the hard drive, burning hadn't/hasn't even come into play yet. Can't speak to godhead's results, though. I'm gonna hold off until jdobbs can get .64 out and give it another go and see what happens, got nothing to lose other than more time :)

[godhead]

Originally posted by godhead
This is with software playback btw. I haven't attempted a burn yet because of the results.

As stated, all software playback from the HDD. I never burned to media because of the results I saw from HDD playback. Well I take that back, I did burn it to a couple of different +RW's to verify that it wasn't HDD fragmentation.

I'll try .64a tonight with DGDECODE and see what results I get. I have all the confidence in the world that JDobbs got it right (and special thanks to Donald Graft for his great work with DGDECODE).