audio and video dropouts

[berndy2001]

Hello,

cause the dvd has multiangles, i stripped them with dvdremake (and some other useless stuff) and exported it.

than i've done a complete dvd-rb run, after rebuilding i burnt the result on dvd. on the pc with powerdvd: all fine. but on the SA i have audio and video dropouts.

first i thougt theese were readerrors, rebuilded and burnt again on a dvd+rw

dropouts were still there.

burnt the stripped material on a +rw (without the last vob-files, because too large), no dropouts!!!

upgraded today to .58 and rebuilded again, problem still there.

Next idea was, that the m2v's are defect. so i used dvd-lab to master some of them to a dvd. look very fine...

HELP!!!

you may noticed, i'm not a native speaker...

[jdobbs]

The dropouts went away when you burned to +RW? That sure sounds like a media problem.

[jdobbs]

By the way, my son is visiting Vienna this week. If you see a good looking American (who looks like he has a really cool Dad) walking around... tell him I said "Hi."

[Rockas]

@berndy2001

If u think that u will not recognise him (jdobb's son) just remember that he looks just like his father, well the eyes' colour is a little different :) :D :p :D :) :cool:

[berndy2001]

no, you misunterstood me. (or my english is too bad ;))

there are only dropouts, if i burn the output from RB on dvd.
the input (stripped material) works very well...

please tell your son, he should wear a t-shirt with "jdobbs's son" written on it. it will be easier to recognize him... :cool:

[berndy2001]

i just shrinked it sucessfully with dvdshrink, but i want to use dvd-rb...!

[Fr4nz]

Change your set-top player! :D

[jdobbs]

I think the "SCR difference..." thread may be getting me close to a solution for this. I'm working it. I don't know what's wrong yet, but I have enough information that I think I can find it.

[berndy2001]

just tried to rebuild with 0.59 and it doesn't work.

i also checked the result with the scr.exe, the errors are gone :confused:

the movie has Aramaic and Hebrew as language, so there are very much subtitles. does that matter?

[jdobbs]

No. Subtitles are so small that they hardly have an impact.

[berndy2001]

just encoded and rebuilded with 0.60, stutters are still there...

is there an other way (other program) to rebuild, (keep menu and subtitles)?

[Sir Didymus]

berndy,

There are a lot of beautiful other proggies for doing backups of dvds. Shrink is just one of them. Use google with "backup dvd" and you get more than 3.000.000 hints. You have just to choose the one which suits more your needs. In one of your previous posts you mentioned that you tested Shrink, but you were preferring DVD-RB. You have just to take a decision if you like DVD-RB or not...

In any case, don't you think it is just unpolite to ask in this forum, focused on the development of rebuilder, if someone knows some alternatives free of bugs (and maybe even freeware) ?

You'd better understanding that rebuilder is in beta testing. It means that some bugs are known, and are expected. Every contribution for making steps and improvements is welcome...

:rolleyes:

Ok. Let me stop here.

Please in the future remind this simple rule:
think before post.

SD

[lamster]

What are you using as the encoder?

I'm using QuEnc; others have reported this problem with CCE. I don't see the problem if I use Rejig. Perhaps you can use that as a temporary solution until Rebuilder works properly even with these problematic stand-alone players.

(It might even be fixed in the next release; jdobbs mentioned a new change in the "Problem with DVD-RB and QuEnc on ntsc film sources" thread. I'm not going to get too excited about it, though, after being disappointed that the "Pack header SCR difference" fix did nothing for me...)

[jdobbs]

What problem with QuEnc are you having? (Not that I will get excited about it). BTW: A new version is posted with a QuEnc fix in it -- don't know if it applies to your problem.

[lamster]

Originally posted by jdobbs
What problem with QuEnc are you having? (Not that I will get excited about it). BTW: A new version is posted with a QuEnc fix in it -- don't know if it applies to your problem.

Hi,

Stuttering like crazy on one stand-alone player; works fine on another and with software players.

I downloaded the new release within minutes of your having posted it, and have been rebuilding for over 5 hours so far. I'll know tomorrow if this is finally the fix that does it for me.

Thanks.

[marpada]

i have constant audio dropouts in The Simpsons Season 3 Disk 1 Z1 NTSC.
First three episodes sound good though ::confused:

I used Rebuilder 0.61, all versions before failed with overflow error during rebuild phase, for all 4 disks in the season.

I'm encoding with CCE 2.67.00.27, Avisynth 2.55

My player is Philips LX3000D, no dropout problems with previous versions. No dropout in software players.

Has anybody had this problem with v0.61 ?

[berndy2001]

i wont be unpolitely @Sir Didymus. i did not want to use another programm, i was asking for another solution.

@jdobbs: no, im useing cce 2.67.00.27 with eclcce 1.81

but i'll try QuEnc, may this helps... :cool:

(i only have pal-dvds to backup)

[Faust2]

@Berndy

maybe you should try this thread (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?postid=548842)

maybe ask someone how exactly you must change the .ecl to turn off scene change detection??

[Sir Didymus]

@Faust2

Maybe some clarification is helpful on a simple test to carry out [drawback is that it requires to reencode, at least some cells, of the title].

The simplest way (reencoding the full title) is this one:

1. Put DVD-RB in three click mode, using CCE as encoder.
2. Run Prepare
3. Edit the file rebuilder.ecl, in the d2vavs folder, and change the entries of the cells you want to test from "fix_gop_length=0" into "fix_gop_length=1" in all, or in some specific [item] sections
4. Rebuild
5. VERIFY WITH VULEN that no errors are reported [if you reencode the whole title this step is easier, since no errors at all should be reported; if you reencoded just some parts of the title, this step is less obvious...]

Please consider that the procedure is just an experimental test, useful to collect information and feedbacks from people experiencing dropouts; nothing more [and please do not raise expectations on the matter...].

Cheers,
SD

[Faust2]

I for myself don't have any dropout issues; just wanted to make your findings a little more known :)

thanks anyway for the clarification; I hope somebody can test it out...

I think rebuilder is making really big steps these days...

/crossing fingers
:cool:

[berndy2001]

ok, just tested it.

with the standard-setting (fix_gop_length=0), vulen.exe found 4 errors in the first vob-file. one with 320ms.

with fix_gop_length=1, vulen.exe doesn't find any errors in all vob-files.

dont know, if the stutter should have gone now, but they are still there.

[jdobbs]

That establishes that at least in your case the runt VOBUs have no impact on stutter.

[jdobbs]

Have any of the "dropout people" tried version 0.67 yet? I'd like to get some feedback on the STD buffer changes I implemented.

[berndy2001]

//edit: thank you

[jdobbs]

@ berndy2001

Check your PM.

[berndy2001]

ok, just tested it with cce 1pass vbr, i'm sorry to say it, but dropout is still there. especially in chapter four.

movie: The Passion of the Christ
Player: Denon DVD-1400

[jdobbs]

Could you try using 2 pass VBR? There are lots of additional variables associated with 1 pass.

[berrani]

Originally posted by jdobbs
Have any of the "dropout people" tried version 0.67 yet? I'd like to get some feedback on the STD buffer changes I implemented.

Hi Jdobbs, I'll test it as soon as you release it to public, early December (I've tested all last public version with my Pioneer 444, one with audio dropout problem :( ).


Thank for you great work :cool:

[psdos]

the passion of christ is the film i use to test RB with audio drops, i test with 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 pass and gop_fix=1 in .ECL and the time 00:28:10 is presents audio drops.

[jdobbs]

Anywhere else? I'm not trying to fix one drop in one movie, that could be a discontinuity for all I know. I'm trying to see what impact the change in STD buffer allocation had.

[candsh]

I can't figure out why someone would use, to try out a program, versions in the early to mid 50's that were known to have the problems he is referring to when the lastest versions, that have addressed most of these problems are in the mid to late 60's and have even more features available. Am I missing something here

[Rockas]

All I can say is that I've made a backup of PASSION OF CHRIST AC3 only (region 2) and I got no problems with it :)

keep it UP

[candsh]

Concerning the drop outs all I can say is that I have not experienced any (none) problems with the back-ups I have done. But, I have never done any preprocessing of any kind and always used the current version. I almost feel like I should apologise for not having any problems, but, ........ I'm happy. Sent you a few extra bucks again. Thanks

[jdobbs]

Believe me, you are in the vast majority. The audio dropout problem is virtually non-existent. I have never experienced it and therefore can't even confirm that it is truly related to DVD-RB or some other part of the processing. I've heard it related to certain players, only to have others (including myself) find that it plays fine on those same players. 99% of all stutters relate back to cheap discs and go away if the exact same image is burned to another better quality disc.

But -- I want to make sure I address any reported problems so I continue to work on it. Because in some presented examples there is evidence to indicate DVD-RB is at fault.

It is, though, by no means something that the vast majority of DVD-RB users need to worry about. I know I don't.

[berndy2001]

ok, just burnt it on dvd (2 pass with cce), the stuttering at the beginning is gone away, but at the beginning of the fourth chapter (about 0:30:00) the stutter is still there. i also checked 0:28:10, yes, i also have stuttering there.

i don't think, the stutters are cause of bad quality discs. as i noticed this problem first time, i tried other discs and reencoded the movie again, 'cause i thougt there was a problem during encoding or burning.

but i have to say, this is the first and only movie in my collection where the stuttering exists.

[Rockas]

Ok... here's a solutions for all shutter problems and dropouts...

buy a 40€uros Denver DVD player :D

Ok, I admit I'm kidding but you can search the all forum and you'll never find any problem with DVD Rebuilder submited by me :)

Why? well I never bought a single "so called" good DVD player... the bad ones cost less (here in Portugal I've seen some on sale for 25€!?!?!?) have 2 years warranty (at least here in Portugal) and when they broke down... I can alway buy another... and they read everything I put on it :)

keep it UP

ps.
offtopic (SKINS) :)
@jdobbs
the VTS and STATUS boxes still don't get the size entered on the .txt files

[psdos]

Rockas it not true, i test with players of 40€ and have dropouts, so it not is the solution.

[Rockas]

Did you tested any recent Denver? (this is not advertise :))
I've done tests on four different models and they go just fine... I'm refereng to models of this year but I can tell you only the number of mine 438(mpeg 4 ;))... the other ones I don't know (my brother has two different and my sister another one but they don't live with me :( )

keep it UP

edit: sorry... the price of mine is 75€ - In Portugal

[jdobbs]

Originally posted by psdos
Rockas it not true, i test with players of 40€ and have dropouts, so it not is the solution. I think you may have problems that are outside of DVD-RB... your problems are way outside of the norm. It seems that every time anyone mentions anything you have a problem with that one too. Have you tried working with a different burner?

[gizzin]

im sorry to say jdobbs your program is at fault, no offence not that you program is good. There are many people reporting dropouts usually with pioneer players. It probably has nothing to do with compliance of the DVD. I've done a encode a movie with 1pass all the audio dropouts where gone, but when i did a mutlipass they were present. This was with a previous version so this must say something.

[psdos]

@jdobbs

I test different burns and different mark of disc. There is very much films with audio drops, not only the passion of christ have problems.

[jdobbs]

@gizzin

I disagree. Define "many". I'd be surprised if you could go back through the DVD-RB posts and find 20 names of people who are experiencing dropouts. I use a Pioneer -- which was reported to experience "dropouts" and have never had one. Others have reported using Pioneer players without dropouts.

Why have so few reported it?

I can only speak to the current version. It fixed an issue that has been reported to fix it by others. If anything happened on an earlier version it no longer applies -- as it is yesterday's news.

I've spent an inordinate amount of time on this issue -- never once knowing if it is even real, only because I want to support the people who report problems -- even though the number of people reporting it was so extremely small.

[jdobbs]

@psdos

There are very many films that get dropouts "for you" -- that is not the same thing as "there are very much films with audio dropouts"

What brand of blank DVD do you use?

[gizzin]

sorry for my poor grammmar, i meant to say good program.

[KamikazeCJ]

Wow... great app Jdobbs. People like you making DVD backup a lot easier for wannabes like me. (Just in time for release of dual layer media too)hehe... Used to use you as a backup to DIF4U but finding to use you more. Done maybe close to a dozen now.
Anyway small talk aside, I ran across a stutter (or glitch) in the video "Matrix". Seems to happen around the areas of "Follow the white rabbit". (In both regular play and white rabbit play). The video has a brief pause (dropout) during BOV in area and area around re-entry into movie. Saw this thread for stuttering but don't know for sure if this classifies as that or maybe some seamless/nonseamless cell issue. I read where you used Matrix in your multiangle testing of V.65 Did you experience anything?
I did use Remake 2.6 something.
And only your public version 66a rebuilder. Not sure if 67 may have solved this?
Almost forgot... Playing this on a Sony dvp NC650V

[psdos]

Verbatim+R 8X Photo Printables copied to 2,4X (with booktype DVD-ROM)
Ritek -R G04 Grade A 4X copied to 2X

[psdos]

Pioneer A06
NEC 2500A
LiteOn 832

[psdos]

With Shrink o CloneDVD2 same films all ok, but if you dont test passion of christ to say one, we will never solve this.

NOTE: There is more films, not only passion of christ. Disney films for example.

[gizzin]

jdobbs didnt you get cells with the present dropouts in them and the originals from sir didymus? isnt this enough proof?, is it possible that a simple thing like not having enough ram on your computer could cause a dropout because it isnt providing enough information during the rebuild phase (not talking about the std buffer thing). I have a 1.6gig p4 with 256megs or sdram. this is just an idea

[gizzin]

or = of

heh.