First Play PGC problem

[sweetness]

hi i have a little problem i'm trying to edit the First Play PGC for the VIDEO_TS.IFO so it will jump to the root menu of a title set (VTS_01_0.VOB) I tried a post command of jump to titleset menu, titlenr=1, titlesetnr=1, menu=root. this works OK but it jumps to the second cell of the menu (where all the buttons are active) I want to jump to the first cell before this one (the little intro where no buttons are active.) i seen on some other IFO's that they used a set GPreg to some number then use a CallSS VTSM root menu resume cell=1. this dosen't work when i try it to play the dvd in ifoedit i get a illegal navigation.

[sweetness]

now that i'm looking at this for some time now i see something (little that it is)

Language Menu Unit 1: [English]
Menu 1: [Root-Menu] (entry PGC) (Programs: 0) (Cells: 0)
Menu 2: [Audio Menu] (entry PGC) (Programs: 2) (Cells: 2) (uses VOB-IDs: 13,14)
Menu 3: [Sub-picture Menu] (entry PGC) (Programs: 1) (Cells: 1) (uses VOB-IDs: 15)
Menu 4: [Chapter (PTT) Menu] (entry PGC) (Programs: 6) (Cells: 6) (uses VOB-IDs: 4,7,8,9,10,11)
Menu 5: [entry only] (Programs: 2) (Cells: 2) (uses VOB-IDs: 5,6)
Menu 6: [Angle Menu] (entry PGC) (Programs: 0) (Cells: 0)
Menu 7: [entry only] (Programs: 0) (Cells: 0) Menu 8: [entry only] (Programs: 2) (Cells: 2) (uses VOB-IDs: 2,12)
Menu 9: [entry only] (Programs: 2) (Cells: 2) (uses VOB-IDs: 3,16)
Menu 10: [entry only] (Programs: 1) (Cells: 1) (uses VOB-IDs: 17)
Menu 11: [entry only] (Programs: 2) (Cells: 2) (uses VOB-IDs: 1,18)
Menu 12: [entry only] (Programs: 0) (Cells: 0)

when i jump to the root menu it goes to VOB-ID 6 (why?) i want it to go to VOB-ID 5 then from VOB-ID 5 it links to VOB-ID 6. I trie looking in the VTSM_PGCI_UT under the root menu and i can make anything out(same thing in the other menus.

[Kedirekin]

First-play is often very complicated. Most often, first-play links to warning screen and studio logo PGCs. These PGCs often have pre and post commands that 'pre-program' registers before entry into a menu collection, and the menu collection itself can be a complicated little program of pre and post commands.

What you're describing sounds like the behavior of common menu collections. The little menu-intro with no buttons only plays the first time after you put the DVD in the player. After that, jumping back to the menu bypasses the menu-intro and takes the user to the buttons with minimum delay (as we would want it to - speaking from experience with DVDs that force you to watch the little intro over and over and over again).

I think it's likely that, when you changed first play to go directly to the menu, you lost the 'pre-programming' that tells the menu-collection to play the little menu intro VOB_ID. There is no easy way I know of to find the pre-programming. You basically need to analyze the pre commands of the menu PGCs, and possibly all the pre and post commands of all the PGCs from the original first play PGC through to the menu (following all the jumps and calls from one PGC to another). In other words, you need to do a manual trace, building up a kind-of flow chart in our mind. In my experience, this can be very complicated and often confusing, but there is no help for it if that is what you want to do.

In the end, it may be easier to just let the original first-play trace happen as intended, but pypass the unwanted PGCs' cell playback by copying post commands (and possibly cell commands) to pre-commands.

[sweetness]

yes you are right Kedirekin i lost the 'pre-programming' and had to do a manual trace (building up a kind-of flow chart in our mind) more like write it down a few times :D . So i found all the GPRM's and copy and pasted them in the First Play PGC as pre-commands then i jumped to the root menu and everything worked the way i wanted. After a few times it started to get a little easier to follow, it would be nice if there was a program that did a trace and set a flow chart with all the GPRMs and SPRMs and links? only wishing.
I could not change everything to per-commands becuase what i did was do a movie only backup, paste the menu vobs and then merged menu tables.

Note to anyone how wants to try this, you must read The Unofficial DVD Specifications Guide (http://www.dvd-replica.com/DVD/index.php) to get a better gip of things