Capture Cards

[Master Yoda]

Ive never captured vhs to pc before, but i have some stuff i would like to get on dvd, so i just done a test capture with vdub and the quality seems really good, this would be due to the tape has only been recorded on once and played once.

Now i have a nvidia geforce 4 ti4200 myvivo edtion, but the capturing on it does not give you meny option.It will only let me capture to UYVY YUY 4:2:2 interleaved it wont let me do YUY2.It also wont let me do half dvd resolution 352x576.

So i would like to know what good quality capture cards there are that dont cost too much as im not gonna be capturing that much. ??


I would like to be going vhs > hdd > dvd(encodeing method cce)

[hartford]

Well, just a suggestion:

Why not capture and then use AviSynth to change the capture to your
requirements? Very easy to do. Cost is some of your time.

[sh03z]

Yes, I've had the same problem with my old card, I recently bought an ATI AIW, but that's beside your point...

I wanted to know, are you capturing in half DVD resolution to get rid of the pesky lines???

That's what I did also,

but "Arachnotron" correctly informed me:

If you look at it after capping frame by frame it looks like that. But once you have made a DVD out of it and play that back it will look ok again.

Software DVD players deinterlace on the fly, and for a regular TV interlacing is not a problem.


PS I'm also using CCE, it's great for this purpose.
I bought 2x DVD-R's, the cheapest TDK's I could find at my local retail store.

Hope this helps a little, as I am still learning myself also =D

[Master Yoda]

No not to get ride of lines, i wanted to capture at 352x576 because every where that i read about capturing it is suggested to capture at half res, and that full 720x576 is overkill for vhs captures or 720x576 does'nt look as good.
Plus i wanted to capture with YUY2 and geforce card with my vivo wont do it.

So thats why i want to look into getting a capture card . Then at least then i have choose a range of resolutions to test with.

[Wilbert]

No not to get ride of lines, i wanted to capture at 352x576 because every where that i read about capturing it is suggested to capture at half res, and that full 720x576 is overkill
Depends. This isn't the case for bt8x8 or ati, because they have lousy resizers at that size. But, it is true for saa71xx. If you want to see evidence, you will have to wait till the new version of the analog cap guide is ready :)

[trevlac]

@Master Yoda

I take it there is a saa7108 chip on your card. If that is the case, then your hardware is really quite good. From what Wilbert is saying, Philips resizer works well. You can find the full specs on the chip, below....

http://www.semiconductors.philips.com/cgi-bin/pldb/pip/saa7108e/v1


So .... it appears that your hardware is good, but your driver does not support all the features of your chip. I would look around for drivers if I were in your spot. Although, drivers for an all in 1 board like yours may be a bit of a pain.

[Master Yoda]

Sorry but not too sound rude but you've lost me with the bt8x8 and saa71xx, im guessing there chipsets.Now i have'nt got a clue what capture chip set the leadtek geforce 4 ti4200 my vivo edtion use's.All i know is it only wants to let me select one colour space UYVY and only has a set amount of resolutions.I would like to be able to capture at both 720x576 and 352x576 to test and see what i thinks better , or not better all round , better for my viewing.

Asfar as i can see my geforce card cant do half res and cant do YUY2.Im would guess this is because its a graphics card and dont a dedicated capture card.

This is why im after getting or thinking of getting a capture card, but i dont know what good cards there are.

[trevlac]

Originally posted by Master Yoda
Sorry but not too sound rude but you've lost me with the bt8x8 and saa71xx, im guessing there chipsets.Now i have'nt got a clue what capture chip set the leadtek geforce 4 ti4200 my vivo edtion use's.All i know is it only wants to let me select one colour space UYVY and only has a set amount of resolutions.I would like to be able to capture at both 720x576 and 352x576 to test and see what i thinks better , or not better all round , better for my viewing.

Asfar as i can see my geforce card cant do half res and cant do YUY2.Im would guess this is because its a graphics card and dont a dedicated capture card.

This is why im after getting or thinking of getting a capture card, but i dont know what good cards there are.

I'm doing quite a bit of guessing here. But If you pull the card out and look at it, you may be able to find the chip the does the analog to digital conversion. I think it is a Philips saa7108. It would say right on the chip.

If it is, then you have good hardware but bad drivers/software. They are what keep you from using multiple options. I do not know if there are drivers available for your card that use the full functionality of the chip. Hey, I might even be wrong about the card. I don't have one. It's probably worth a look, and worth trying to see if there are newer drivers.

[Wilbert]

start -> settings -> control panel -> display -> Settings tab -> Advanced -> here is a tab with GeForce on which the chipset is listed (Philips 7108 in my case = saa7108)

Btw, I also have a geforce 4 ti4200, and can't capture at 352x576 :(

[trevlac]

Originally posted by Wilbert
start -> settings -> control panel -> display -> Settings tab -> Advanced -> here is a tab with GeForce on which the chipset is listed (Philips 7108 in my case = saa7108)

Btw, I also have a geforce 4 ti4200, and can't capture at 352x576 :(

Don't tell me you don't do YUY2. Tell him how to do YUY2 ... what codec takes UYVY ?

[Master Yoda]

Mine also says philips 7108 in the tab , i have the myvivo wdm drivers installed.I think these are the only drivers avalible for the leadtek geforce ti4200 my vivo edition.So i cant capture at 352x576 or YUY2.

[ppera2]

There is a incompability between Virtual Dub (and his mods) and WDM capture drivers. That's reason why you can't capture at 576 lines vertical. V Dub is older programm, and is made for VFW capturing, not WDM, what is used now, and almost all cards have only WDM capture drivers.

There is few solution for this problem:
Usage of another capture program - Virtual VCR is free, and works with WDM drivers. It's for AVI capture.
Usage of some Mpeg(2) capture programm like Win DVR, but it's not free. Usually people get some Mpeg capture programm with their cards, another is Cyberlink VCR for example.
There is less problem with A/V async with Mpeg capt. programs, by experience.

Solution can be installation of BT Wincap drivers, but I would not recommend it. It's only for BT 8x8 based cards, and has some issues.

[Master Yoda]

Ive just checked the capturing program that came with the card, Winfast MyVivo, i checked in the options of that and that program will also not let me use 352x576, plus it does'nt let me select the colour space.

Ive just installed and checked Virtual VCR, this too will only use colour space UYVY and cannot use 352x576 as its not there in the options.

[Wilbert]

Don't tell me you don't do YUY2. Tell him how to do YUY2 ... what codec takes UYVY ?
Yes, I can't do YUY2. I guess almost all codecs. I never had problems with that.

There is few solution for this problem:
Usage of another capture program - Virtual VCR is free, and works with WDM drivers. It's for AVI capture.
What can I say? VirtualVCR also doesn't let me capture at 352x576 :(

I thought the BT Wincap drivers also work for saa7134? Maybe I should just try it once.

[ppera2]

Originally posted by Wilbert

What can I say? VirtualVCR also doesn't let me capture at 352x576 :(

I thought the BT Wincap drivers also work for saa7134? Maybe I should just try it once.

Then it's probably capture driver issue. Can you capture at 384x576?
I don't think that BT Wincap will work with saaxxxx chips. Try, but pray while... that it not screw up some registry entries.

[trevlac]

@Wilbert,

On the UYVY thing ... I learn (quite a few) things here everyday!

Here is a comment from Huffyuv source ...

// 0=unknown, -1=compressed YUY2, -2=compressed RGB, -3=compressed RGBA, 1=YUY2, 2=UYVY, 3=RGB 24-bit, 4=RGB 32-bit

Now I wonder ... since Avisynth only accepts YUY2 and there would be no compressor to convert it ... If you cap uncompressed UYVY, does the OS change it to YUY2 for AVS? Probably yes. PS: Huffyuv seems to treat VYUY as YUY2... maybe they are the same, but I refuse to go back to that microsoft page. I got in trouble last time I read it. ;)


@Master Wilbert & Master Yoda,

Have you guys looked at http://www.ab.ru/~lookin/ ??

As ppera2 implied, don't go installing software when you don't have time on your hands to fix your pc after everything breaks :)

But that seems like a package with a home grown driver that claims to offer access to all functions on the chip. Also seems like a bunch of nifty tools ... but hard to say.

Personally, I can't imagine that the BTWincap drivers would work ... :)

[Wilbert]

There is a incompability between Virtual Dub (and his mods) and WDM capture drivers. That's reason why you can't capture at 576 lines vertical. V Dub is older programm, and is made for VFW capturing, not WDM, what is used now, and almost all cards have only WDM capture drivers.
False. He can capture at 720/704 x 576 in vdub (I assume, because I can). So, this is not related to the non-full resolution cap problem.

The btwincap drivers and wrapper (for bt8x8/c2388x) lets you also capture at 576. So in case you can't capture at 576, it is the wdm driver/wrapper combo which doesn't work correctly.

Then it's probably capture driver issue. Can you capture at 384x576?
Nope. But I agree it is a driver issue.

[Arachnotron]

The btwincap drivers and wrapper (for bt8x8/c2388x) lets you also capture at 576. So in case you can't capture at 576, it is the wdm driver/wrapper combo which doesn't work correctly.

The BTwincap drivers support Bt848, Bt849, Bt878 and Bt879 but NOT the CX2388x. (Yet??)

[ppera2]

Originally posted by Wilbert
False. He can capture at 720/704 x 576 in vdub (I assume, because I can). So, this is not related to the non-full resolution cap problem.
The btwincap drivers and wrapper (for bt8x8/c2388x) lets you also capture at 576. So in case you can't capture at 576, it is the wdm driver/wrapper combo which doesn't work correctly.


Not all Ti 4200 cards have same capture chip, and not same drivers.

It's matter of formulation how we say it - incompability, driver/wrapper non working combo...

By experience, more than half people can't capture in V Dub over 288 lines vertical.