+10m w/NO Chapter Break = Subtitle DeSync | But RW = No Desync

[LB]

I'm editing this thread to propose the question in the easiest way I know how because I just tested it again, and am really starting to believe it's an issue. So here goes.

I do episodic encoding. Each episode is around 20 minutes. I have no chapter breaks in the episode itself.

5m mark, I can notice the subtitles slowly going desync.
10m mark, the subs are a good .5 to 1s desync.
14m the subs jump back in sync.

Now, I timed this myself, so the timing according to an avi file is dead accurate. Also, I correctly added all assets drop frame and properly converted the subtitles to drop frame. I also verified the timecodes in the .son file, and the subs were no more than ~.3s desync due to the drop-frame conversion, meaning a full 1s desync WAS NOT in my .son file.

Okay, so here is where it gets REALLY weird. At the 10m mark, when the subs were really desync, I watched a particular sub, noticed the desync, then quickly Rewound the footage and watched the sub again, and it was in perfect sync! So this got me thinking... maybe no one has noticed this before because they have chapter breaks every 4m or so (i.e., in most movies and other shows, there are chapter breaks usually at every 4m mark). What do chapter breaks have to do with this? Well, I use maestro and only create 1 movie -

Movie1 (asset) = intro, ep1, ep2, ep3, ep4, ep5, ending

And use a playlist to designate the play order -

intro, ep1, ending, intro, ep2, ending, intro, ep3, ending, etc

The begining of each chapter is ALWAYS in perfect sync, which is why I believe that a lack of chapter breaks every ~5m, can result in very noticable desync issues with the subtitles... I am going to do some massive testing on this, but can't at the moment due because I'm busy with work, so I wanted to throw this question out there and see if others have experienced the same issue before.

Oh, and as for why the subtitles re-sync around the 14m mark in my episode, even though no chapter break was hit, well I have no idea about that... So, what do you all think?

[LB]

Here is an update on what I have found out so far.

The gradual de-sync has nothing to do with chapter breaks. Rather, I think it's a bug in my player (maybe). I use an APEX 3-DVD changer for my player, and the de-sync is present there. However, I did several tests on my XBOX DVD player and there is NO de-sync. And remember, we're talking a .6ms to 1s de-sync. So, nothing major, but if you have good eyes and are anal perfectionests, then yeah, it's a problem. I also tried re-authoring WITH intermittant chapter breaks, but it did nothing.

The only strange thing though is that on all other DVD's I've watched, I never noticed a de-sync issue. But, that might have been because I didn't time the episodes myself.

So, I'm going to get my buddy to test this out on his Pioneer player, since they are built to DVD Spec., unlike an Apex. (Apex are great players, but horrible machines to test stuff on). I'll get another update later but if you got an apex player, you might want to do some tests for yourself.

[LB]

Tested the disc out on a pioneer player, and no de-sync either. So, there is some bug in the Apex players that lags the subs. I guess the reason I never noticed this before is that I never timed any other DVDRs before... makes me somewhat pissed because I like(d) apex obve all other players...