Can XviD encodes be configured to run in QuickTime player?

[SeeMoreDigital]

I apologise if this question has been asked before but I could not find any info I required by searching.

I'm trying to create some 'quality' looking Mpeg4/AAC encodes that can be played using the QuickTime player

However, whenever I generate 1 or 2 pass encodes with XviD I can't seem to find a setting that will allow them to be played without the player throwing up an warning!

Nero's Recode2 encodes seem to work fine video wise but the audio (AAC at 56kbps) is distorted... it's all very odd!

Any help would be much appreciated.

Cheers

[bond]

well you can use the .mp4 or .mov container in quicktime

quicktime itself doesnt handle mpeg-4 advanced simple profile (which means b-frames, qpel and gmc)
if you install 3ivx you can decode b-frames tough (it plays it fine even if an error message is shown up at the beginning)
so basically quicktime will always show an error if you try to play non simple profile files and if you tools, like b-frames, qpel and gmc

for aac at 56kbps i assume you used he-aac!? quicktime also doesnt handle he-aac, only lc-aac (as used in itunes for example) thats why your aac stream plays with low quality i assume (as the sbr part isnt handled)


yes i know, for maybe the most widely used mpeg-4 player around, quicktime is very weak :(

[Koepi]

AFAIK quicktime is limited to max. support simple profile @level 3 (the max. level of the simple profile).

If you set xvid encoder to S3 profile you should be on the "safe side".

Regards
Koepi

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by bond
...so basically quicktime will always show an error if you try to play non simple profile files and if you tools, like b-frames, qpel and gmc...

...for aac at 56kbps i assume you used he-aac!? quicktime also doesnt handle he-aac, only lc-aac (as used in itunes for example) thats why your aac stream plays with low quality i assume (as the sbr part isnt handled) Yes I thought this would be the case, so I made sure I did not encode using b-frames, Qpel or GMC. And no, I did not use HE either

Originally posted by bond
...yes i know, for maybe the most widely used mpeg-4 player around, quicktime is very weak :( Unfortunately I've got to generate encodes for a friends web site. And they've got to be usable in QuickTime...

Like I say, it's all very odd!

Cheers

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Yes I thought this would be the case, so I made sure I did not encode using b-frames, Qpel or GMC. And no, I did not use HE eitherinteresting, as koepi said try to set to simple profile @ level 3 in xvid or check the "quicktime compatiblity" option in nero (which should do the same as the sp option in xvid)

for aac, what do you mean with "distorted"? also did you try to encode the aac audio with quicktime/itunes? the apple codec is the best one available

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by bond
interesting, as koepi said try to set to simple profile @ level 3 in xvid or check the "quicktime compatiblity" option in nero (which should do the same as the sp option in xvid)

for aac, what do you mean with "distorted"? also did you try to encode the aac audio with quicktime/itunes? the apple codec is the best one available Just tried 'Level 3' and it was a no go too I'm afraid. However, after getting the warning, all I got this time was a 'blank white screen'.

When I tried before using an 'Unrestricted' profile, I managed to see something!

Life is great is'nt it. Just when you thought you got the hang of things. Something bites you on the ass and reminds you that it ain't so!

And for a copy of my distorted Nero AAC-LC encode, please click here (http://82.2.167.24/Uploaded_Files/Doom9_Forum_files/Distorted_Nero_AAC-LC.zip).

I've tried using MP4UI in a variety of ways, such as demuxing the video stream out of the QuickTime .MP4 and replacing it with ND's video, but MP4UI kept throwing up errors!

But I really want to use XviD because it looks much better.

I'm so fed up :(

[bond]

the audio is encoded with main profile it seems (at least winamp (faad2 plugin) reports that...
edit: wrong, main@l2 means Low Complexity, should be ok

how did you encode it?

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Just tried 'Level 3' and it was a no go too I'm afraid. However, after getting the warning, all I got this time was a 'blank white screen'.how did you mux the .mp4?

try 3ivx and also quicktime (via import) for muxing

[SeeMoreDigital]

the audio is encoded with main profile! use lc (low complexity profile)! Hmmm. This is what you get when you encode using Recode2 or Nero (via Foobar2000 or dbPowerAMP... Or at least I do!

how did you mux the .mp4? Both Foobar2000 and dbPowerAMP are able to generate AAC files either as .aac or directly into an .MP4 container. With Recode2 I encoded both the audio and video streams (from my Show Reel DVD source) directly to .MP4 and then used MP4UI to delete the video stream.

try 3ivx and also quicktime (via import) for muxing I still have not got round to trying GraphEdit!

I spent far too much time converting my friends show reel from DigiBeta to DVD already. I never thought I would get stuck converting them from DVD to an XviD Mpeg4 format that QuickTime likes!

I'm still confused and ever so slightly annoyed now

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
[B]Hmmm. This is what you get when you encode using Recode2 or Nero (via Foobar2000 or dbPowerAMP... Or at least I do!i guess its maybe the old wrong samplerate input problem with nero...

try encoding directly with nero burning rom or with besweet, foobar (cause these should be able to handle the samplerate thing correctly)

I still have not got round to trying GraphEdit!time to do so, its not difficult ;)

or try the import function from quicktime to import the avi directly

[SeeMoreDigital]

Ok, I'll give it all another shot tomorrow.

Cheers

[Stux]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Unfortunately I've got to generate encodes for a friends web site. And they've got to be usable in QuickTime...


The easiest way to do this is to use the 3ivx Video Encoder, 3ivx Audio Encoder and 3ivx Media Muxer to create an MP4.

When it comes to Simple Profile, the 3ivx Video Encoder produces virtually the same quality as XviD.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by Stux
The easiest way to do this is to use the 3ivx Video Encoder, 3ivx Audio Encoder and 3ivx Media Muxer to create an MP4.

When it comes to Simple Profile, the 3ivx Video Encoder produces virtually the same quality as XviD. I've generated some simple profile 3viX streams.

However, as soon as I mux them into an MP4 container I get the same problems as with XviD and DivX. That said, 3viX encodes don't seem to hang as much as the other codecs.

I will obviously try again if there are some settings you can give me.

Thanks guys


Message to mods..
Given that this is now not just an XviD related query, I think it probably best that this thread be moved to another section of the forum and renamed to something like "Can XviD, DivX, 3viX etc encodes be configured to run in QuickTime's player?"

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
However, as soon as I mux them into an MP4 container I get the same problems as with XviD and DivX. That said, 3viX encodes don't seem to hang as much as the other codecs.you must be doing something wrong on the muxing side...

plz describe the exact steps you did to create this last file?

[SeeMoreDigital]

Ok here goes...

Step 1: I created an AAC-LC audio stream @ 56kbps using Foobar2000 or dbPowerAMP. With both these applications it's possible to generate AAC as an elementary .aac stream and/or in an MP4 container.

Step 2: I create an 1pass or 2pass Mpeg4 (3viX, XviD or DivX) video stream using MPEGmediator, in an AVI container.

Step 3: Launch MP4UI (v1.0 beta2) and open the required AAC-LC audio stream. Click on 'Import' and navigate to the required Mpeg4 video stream.

Step4 4: If the streams have muxed ok. Try and open the encode in the QuickTime player

Step 5: Cry when it does not work and kick the dog!

Cheers

[Stux]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital

Step 3: Launch MP4UI (v1.0 beta2) and open the required AAC-LC audio stream. Click on 'Import' and navigate to the required Mpeg4 video stream.

Step4 4: If the streams have muxed ok. Try and open the encode in the QuickTime player

Step 5: Cry when it does not work and kick the dog!


Stop banging your head against the wall and use the 3ivx Media Muxer to make the MP4 file!

I'll say it clearly :

MP4UI WRITES BAD MP4 FILES.

[S_O]

I created QT-compatible MPEG-4 files without any problems:
Encoded movie with VirtualDub to avi using XviD 1.0 RC3:

640x480 25fps
Simple @ L3
600 kbps single pass CBR (more than allowed at Simple @ L3)
Adaptive Quant.
Motion search Ultra High / VHQ 4
Chroma Motion
Trellis
Chroma Optimizer

Audio encoded to aac with faac and muxed to mp4 with foobar2000 (should also work with Nero LC-AAC mp4-audio files)

Muxed to mp4 using GraphEdit and 3ivx Muxer:
video.avi -> Avi Splitter ----------> 3ivx D4 Media Muxer -> movie.mp4
audio.mp4 -> 3ivx D4 Media Splitter --^
Output plays fine in QuickTime and in any other DirectShow-based player using the 3ivx-Splitter / ffdshow Decoder (except in MediaPlayerClassic, no sound, must be the new internal AAC Decoder, when I deactivate it it also works fine).
Better use 3ivx Muxer to create mp4 files, mp4UI seems to be broken.

Edit: Spelling. Stux was faster, but he confirms it, mp4UI is currently (1.0 beta 2) broken.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Ok, ok, ok... I'm gonna have to accept that MP4UI won't do what I want on this occasion and start using GraphEdit and 3viX.

I guess I've got to learn sometime and now is as good a time as any!

Thanks for your patience so far everyone... but stand by your beds for some dumb ass GraphEdit and 3viX questions!

Cheers

EDIT: The sources vary between 15 seconds and 60 seconds in duration!

[SeeMoreDigital]

Ok well I fired up GraphEdit.

But I'm buggered if I can workout how to input both an XviD .avi and an AAC.mp4 into the application and mux it with 3viX to create/output an QuickTime compliant .MP4 file!

Has anybody made/can direct me to a step by step 'How to' document I can read for this type of exercise?

Sorry to be a pain but I guess I must be suffering from brain fade!

Cheers

[Soulhunter]

MP4UI is easy to use but bug-loaded... :(

GraphEdit + 3viX seems to work nicely but is not really easy to use... :(

Still waiting that someone (not me...) makes a easy-to-use and bug-free mp4 tool... :o


Bye

[Stux]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Ok well I fired up GraphEdit.

But I'm buggered if I can workout how to input both an XviD .avi and an AAC.mp4 into the application and mux it with 3viX to create/output an QuickTime compliant .MP4 file!

Has anybody made/can direct me to a step by step 'How to' document I can read for this type of exercise?


Take a look at http://forums.3ivx.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard/topic.cgi?forum=11&topic=309

Basically, a multi-source graph is one of the more complex things to setup since you can't just do it by dragging onto graphedit.... or maybe you can, did you try just dragging both source files at once into the graphedit window?

I normally do this by adding the Async File Source and selecting my second source file, after already dragging my first source file onto graphedit's icon.

The other thing is, learn to love the "Render Pin" right-click pin menu :)

[bond]

also look here (http://www.3ivx.com/support/windows/encoding/ge_avi2mp4.html)

note that of course you dont need to use the audio encoder if you already have an aac stream

[S_O]

I yust noticed a problem when playback mp4-files in QuickTime which doesn´t occur in MediaPlayerClassic (most likely a bug in QT):
Audio is not in sync, it is all the time about half a second to early. After seeking or pausing everything is perfect in sync and stays in sync.
Also if it´s a bug in QT, is there a workaround?

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by Stux
Basically, a multi-source graph is one of the more complex things to setup since you can't just do it by dragging onto graphedit.... or maybe you can, did you try just dragging both source files at once into the graphedit window? Yep, I tried that but it does not work. Only one of the streams opens to form a graph!

Originally posted by Stux
I normally do this by adding the Async File Source and selecting my second source file, after already dragging my first source file onto graphedit's icon. Are you able to provide more information please?

bond posted a link to a 3viX 'How to... create an MP4 file from an AVI file using GraphEdit' This proved very useful. At least I can now generate XviD 'video only' streams that open perfectly in QuickTime's player.

However, as I prefer to generate the XviD video and AAC audio streams separately, I really do need to learn how to mount each stream separately into GraphEdit.

Once done I'll write an 'How to... Guide' of my own and post it on my web site.

Why is it always me who wants to do something out of the ordinary?

Cheers

[S_O]

First I´ve found a solution for that quicktime async problem, I repaired the 3ivx generated stream with mp4box:
mp4box -isma -inter 1000 -out movie_out.mp4 movie_in.mp4

However, as I prefer to generate the XviD video and AAC audio streams separately, I really do need to learn how to mount each stream separately into GraphEdit.If you have an ADTS-AAC source (.aac, not .mp4) you need to mux it first to mp4. It´s very easy with the player foobar2000: Yust drop the aac in the playlist, right click on it -> MP4 utilities -> Convert to MP4 (same directory). Now you have an mp4 file with the same name in the same directory with your aac audio muxed into. This is also required if you have the AAC DS-Parser installed, because it doesn´t work correctly for muxing.

Now in GraphEdit it´s also really easy: Yust create the graph as you did when you muxed video only with the avi source only. Now insert a new filter called "File Source (Async.)". When you insert it will ask you for a file to open. Yust select the mp4-audio-file. There is a second input pin at the 3ivx muxer, just connect the output pin of the file source to this input. The 3ivx splitter will be inserted automatically between the muxer and the file. If you want to add additional audio streams yust do this again, as you see a third input pin has been created at the muxer.
Now you can press play and after graph rendering is finished enjoy your new mp4-movie!

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
At least I can now generate XviD 'video only' streams that open perfectly in QuickTime's player.great :)

Originally posted by S_O
[B]First I´ve found a solution for that quicktime async problem, I repaired the 3ivx generated stream with mp4box:
mp4box -isma -inter 1000 -out movie_out.mp4 movie_in.mp4hm interesting
what does -inter 100 do? afaik 3ivx produced mp4 files are already isma compliant

This is also required if you have the AAC DS-Parser installed, because it doesn´t work correctly for muxing.hm also interesting
what does it do wrong?

[S_O]

hm interesting
what does -inter 100 do? afaik 3ivx produced mp4 files are already isma compliantFrom the gpac homepage:# -inter : interleaves media data in chunks of desired duration. This is usefull to optimize the file for HTTP/FTP streaming. All meta data are placed first in the file, allowing a player to start playback while downloading the content. To interleave an mp4 file with a chunk duration of 1 sec (1000 ms):
MP4Box -inter 1000 myfile.mp4Interesting is also this displayed by mp4box while converting:Removing system track ID 3
Removing system track ID 4hm also interesting
what does it do wrong?If I connect the AAC Parser to 3ivx muxer the final mp4 length is shown wrong and different all the time (about 9 hours instead of 4 minutes). Video and audio are completly out of sync, seeking also doesn´t work correctly, video is not played smooth and it freezes/jumps sometimes.

[bond]

Originally posted by S_O
Interesting is also this displayed by mp4box while convertinghm i think thats simply because mp4box replaces the 3ivx produced systems tracks with own ones (but i dont think that qt uses them anyways)

If I connect the AAC Parser to 3ivx muxer the final mp4 length is shown wrong and different all the time (about 9 hours instead of 4 minutes). Video and audio are completly out of sync, seeking also doesn´t work correctly, video is not played smooth and it freezes/jumps sometimes.good to know

[SeeMoreDigital]

Hello again,

I think I'm nearly there, unfortunately I don't seem to be able to connect my AAC.mp4 stream to the '3viX D4 Media Muxer'

http://82.2.167.24/Uploaded_Files/Doom9_Forum_files/GraphEdit_01.gif

What am I doing wrong now?

[shitowax]

Basically, you just have to connect your source .mp4 to the muxer. It should in theory insert automatically the 3ivx splitter in between. If it doesn't, try to insert it manually.

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
What am I doing wrong now?nothing simply go with the mouse over the point right to "audio out", left click and drag the arrow to "input 2" of the 3ivx muxer :)

than push play

[SeeMoreDigital]

That's what I thought!

However, I've just tried both suggestions, but all I get is the following notification: -

http://82.2.167.24/Uploaded_Files/Doom9_Forum_files/GraphEdit_Warning.gif

:(

[iradic]

hi

this is the way it works for me...
1) open graphedit and insert 3ivx muxer and file-writer filter
2) render media files you want to mux (file -> render media file) - graphedit will auto set output pins to 3ivx muxer...

hope it helps...

[SeeMoreDigital]

Maybe it's my files.

Can you guys try with these (http://82.2.167.24/Uploaded_Files/Doom9_Forum_files/Graphdit_Test_Files.zip) and let me know if they work OK?

Cheers

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Can you guys try with these (http://82.2.167.24/Uploaded_Files/Doom9_Forum_files/Graphdit_Test_Files.zip) and let me know if they work OK?i could mux fine here, also i can play the file correctly (without any error message) in quicktime,
but i dont hear the audio in dshow (graphedit) - tested both coreaac and the 3ivx audio decoder (tough if i play the audio-only .mp4 file in winamp (faad2 plugin) or with the 3ivx decoder it works fine)
also when i try to play the a+v file in winamp i get an error message (maximum number of streams exceeded or so)

wierd :confused:

[S_O]

i could mux fine here, also i can play the file correctly (without any error message) in quicktime, but i dont hear the audio in dshow (graphedit) - tested both coreaac and the 3ivx audio decoder (tough if i play the audio-only .mp4 file in winamp (faad2 plugin) or with the 3ivx decoder it works fine)
also when i try to play the a+v file in winamp i get an error message (maximum number of streams exceeded or so)I yust muxed it, my file plays fine in QT, but in MPC the video always freezes for about half a second in MPC, not at special positions, always different. Also fixing (-isma -inter 1000) with mp4box doesn´t help. But the original avi is played fine.

Edit: in GraphEdit it plays fine. In MPC not, no matter if internal AAC decoder is activated or not.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Maybe the audio only aac.mp4 stream is shagged!

Can you see if you can do any better with this .AC3 stream (http://82.2.167.24/Uploaded_Files/Doom9_Forum_files/GraphEdit_audio_only_(ac3).zip)?

I did manage to A/V create an MP4 encode that would play in QuickTime but I used the .aac stream (not aac.mp4) and managed to connect it to the muxer by having an AAC parser between.

However, (as bond found), the QuickTime player could not playback the audio element!

I'm really confused now

[S_O]

and managed to connect it to the muxer by having an AAC parser between.The AAC Parser doesn´t work! Create a mp4 of your aac using foobar2000!

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by S_O
The AAC Parser doesn´t work! Create a mp4 of your aac using foobar2000! I have no problems creating aac.mp4 streams. I generate them all the time for use with MP4UI.

But for some reason they will not connect to the 3viX muxer, even if I manually insert the 3viX splitter!

S_O I find it strange that your encode worked OK in the QuickTime player when bonds did not. Did the QuickTime slide bar work as well?

Cheers

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
I find it strange that your encode worked OK in the QuickTime player when bonds did not.it worked fine here in qt too!
only in graphedit i couldnt here the audio

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by bond
it worked fine here in qt too!
only in graphedit i couldnt here the audio I see.

I guess something must be broken somewhere. Strange that I was able to get GraphEdit to see and mux an .aac stream. Can either of you do this: -

http://82.2.167.24/Uploaded_Files/Doom9_Forum_files/GraphEdit_02.gif

Can either of you provide a link to the encode you both managed to successfully create?

Cheers

[S_O]

I´ve uploaded my sample: freezing_video_bug.mp4 (1,74MB) (http://l.b.oltmanns.bei.t-online.de/freezing_video_bug.mp4)
I have no problems creating aac.mp4 streams. I generate them all the time for use with MP4UI.mp4UI is known to create invalid mp4-streams, that´s most likely why 3ivx splitter cannot connect to the file. Try creating it with foobar2000, it´s more than easy and it works.

I can build the graph you posted, too. But the output file is not really playable (details described in earlier post in this thread).

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by S_O
...mp4UI is known to create invalid mp4-streams, that´s most likely why 3ivx splitter cannot connect to the file. Try creating it with foobar2000, it´s more than easy and it works. Eurrm!

As I think I already mentioned I use either Foobar2000 or dbpowerAMP to generate my aac.mp4 streams. I like both apps because they use Nero's AAC codec. I guess this is the same codec that you use?

Originally posted by S_O
I can build the graph you posted, too. But the output file is not really playable (details described in earlier post in this thread). Well at least I know know that I'm not able to do something that nobody else can :)

Thanks for providing a link to the file. It seems to work, and yep the audio works too!

Tomorrow, I'll try GraphEdit on another PC and use a smaller image pixel frame size for the XviD .avi stream.

Thanks for your help so far. Cheers

[S_O]

Eurrm!

As I think I already mentioned I use either Foobar2000 or dbpowerAMP to generate my aac.mp4 streams. I like both apps because they use Nero's AAC codec. I guess this is the same codec that you use?Sorry, I read "I generate them all the time with MP4UI." instead of "I generate them all the time for use with MP4UI.". Then it´s really strage the file source won´t connect to 3ivx splitter. Does the audio-mp4 plays in MPC alone without video?

I also use the Nero encoder for final results, but for testing I use faac, because it´s easier.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I have another question about GraphEdit....

Now that I've learned how to 'mux' my AAC audio and XviD video streams safely into an MP4 container. Is it possible to use GraphEdit to demux audio and video streams from out of an MP4 container?

Cheers

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Now that I've learned how to 'mux' my AAC audio and XviD video streams safely into an MP4 container. Is it possible to use GraphEdit to demux audio and video streams from out of an MP4 container?sure connect a muxer filter (ie avi mux, ogm or matroska muxer...) to the 3ivx splitter, and connect this muxer to file writer
its basically the same as if muxing mp4

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by bond
sure connect a muxer filter (ie avi mux, ogm or matroska muxer...) to the 3ivx splitter, and connect this muxer to file writer
its basically the same as if muxing mp4
I have to check becuase I think this PC is playing up again. Are you saying it should be like this: -

[A/V MP4]-->[3ivx splitter]-->[3ivx muxer]-->[file writer]

By using this method is it possible to generate Mpeg4 video and AAC audio as elementary streams - ie: .m4v and .aac?

Cheers

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
I have to check becuase I think this PC is playing up again. Are you saying it should be like this: -
[A/V MP4]-->[3ivx splitter]-->[3ivx muxer]-->[file writer] nope i meant
[A/V MP4]-->[3ivx splitter]-->[avi/ogm/mkv muxer]-->[file writer]

afaik you cant produce .aac or raw mpeg-4 video streams with graphedit, also i very much doubt that the avi mux filter handles aac input

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by bond
nope i meant
[A/V MP4]-->[3ivx splitter]-->[avi/ogm/mkv muxer]-->[file writer]

afaik you cant produce .aac or raw mpeg-4 video streams with graphedit, also i very much doubt that the avi mux filter handles aac input Thanks.

I just ran the Mpeg4.avi stream thru' Gspot and it's 4CC is identified as being mp4v... I wondered how it would be reported?

Anyway I've not been able to extract the aac stream, even to an .mp4 container!!!

Must be this darn PC

Cheers

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
I just ran the Mpeg4.avi stream thru' Gspot and it's 4CC is identified as being mp4v... yes 3ivx outputs "mp4v", use the fourcc changer coming with xvid to change it to DIVX or XVID or whatever...

Anyway I've not been able to extract the aac stream, even to an .mp4 container!!!perfectly works here

[SeeMoreDigital]

Thanks for the confirmation, it's much appreciated seeing as though this PC is doing weird things.

Without doubt, using GraphEdit and 3viX tools etc is a much more effective and stable way of muxing and de-muxing!

Here's a weird one - not related to GraphEdit or the QuickTime player....

The other day I generated two anamorphicly signalled .AVI's. One XviD one 3viX. When I played the 3viX encode in MPC it automatically opened up at the correct AR (using 3viX's decoder). When I played the XviD encode in MPC it does not open at the correct AR, not even if you change encodes 4CC to 3IV2. Why is this?

If however I play them in Nero's ShowTime player (with NeVideo.ax filter v1.1.7.35) both encodes open up at the correct AR!

Cheers

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
The other day I generated two anamorphicly signalled .AVI's. One XviD one 3viX. When I played the 3viX encode in MPC it automatically opened up at the correct AR (using 3viX's decoder). When I played the XviD encode in MPC it does not open at the correct AR, not even if you change encodes 4CC to 3IV2. Why is this?thats because 3ivx uses some special workaround, which xvid doesnt use

but if you mux both encodes into .mp4, the ar (also the xvid one)should be decoded as it should be with 3ivx

If however I play them in Nero's ShowTime player (with NeVideo.ax filter v1.1.7.35) both encodes open up at the correct AR!the nero decoder analyses the ar info on the bitstream and resizes internally, which should work with all files, no matter which codec was used (the 3ivx decoder doesnt do this internally)

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by bond
thats because 3ivx uses some special workaround, which xvid doesnt use

but if you mux both encodes into .mp4, the ar (also the xvid one)should be decoded as it should be with 3ivx

the nero decoder analyses the ar info on the bitstream and resizes internally, which should work with all files, no matter which codec was used (the 3ivx decoder doesnt do this internally) I see.

All the same, I find it interesting that even though both codecs store the AR signalling in different places within the .AVI container, the AR flagging still works (for both) when they are muxed into an .MP4 container. Both AR perfectly when played back in 'hardware'.

Cheers

[bond]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
All the same, I find it interesting that even though both codecs store the AR signalling in different places within the .AVI container, the AR flagging still works (for both) when they are muxed into an .MP4 container. Both AR perfectly when played back in 'hardware'.hm, afaik they dont store it on different places, but 3ivx stores it somewhere additionally to make the avi workaround work

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by bond
hm, afaik they dont store it on different places, but 3ivx stores it somewhere additionally to make the avi workaround work Ahhh got you!

This probably explians why the FFvfw codec acts in the same way as the XviD codec, with regard to AR signalling!

Cheers

[SeeMoreDigital]

Sorry, it's taken me some time, getting round to posting this update!

I'm happy to confirm that with all your help I was able to create the type of encodes I needed for my friends web site. And find a way to make them stream (depending on connection speed of course).

For testing purposes I've only put up one XviD/AAC (in .MOV) for you to watch. Which should begin streaming instantly!

Some of you may have already seen this commercial on TV already. Anyway here's the link:

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/seemoredigital/StuTest/ubs.htm

Please let me know what you think?


Cheers

PS: It will only be up for a few days.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Well the file has been downloaded/streamed by nearly 100 people!

Has nobody got anything to say?


Cheers

[works]

Looking good, no highly visible compression artifacts, but the gamma/brightness seems off.

Anyways, congrats that you got this to work, are you going to put up a small "guide" of how to do this? Especially I would greatly appriciate it since I'm currently limited to the QT Pro version of Sorenson3 and would like to experiment with different codecs in .mov container.

[neo75903]

hmmm nobody came up with mp4creator?

it works fine for me, the only thing is as mentioned you need to encode video in Simple Profile level 3.

http://mpeg4ip.net/

binaries can be found here:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=77881&highlight=mp4creator

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by neo75903
hmmm nobody came up with mp4creator? Do you have any 3ivx tools installed?

If you do this is why your encodes generated with mp4creator will play (QuickTime is using some bits of 3ivx). I currently test my encodes on an dual-boot system (one boot without 3ivx) to be 100% certain

That said, as I haven't tried mp4creator for a while I don't know for sure if they've cracked this little problem!

Also, the sad fact is that Mpeg4/AAC files in .MOV appear to stream much better than when in MP4... and the QuickTime player works better too!


Cheers

[neo75903]

true, except from a warning the file plays fine.

quicktime also doesnt supports multichannel audio neither. Hope they will fix this soon.
In the meanwhile i am using VideoLan player as my reference player.
It does the things quicktime does not so far.
-play xvid encoded files without error warning.
-support for multichan audio

something to note: when i stream the file from a darwin server, it does not show me the error, if someone can explain this ...

is there a way to automate the mp4 creation for 3ivx?
I have lots of avis in which i would to put it into a mp4 container for streaming purposes. My only option so far is to use mp4creator because its command line.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by neo75903
true, except from a warning the file plays fine. Yes, this appears to be a problem with all tools based on MPEG4IP.

3iv'x muxer is far more compliant, so is Ahead's now.

And we can't have these "little warnings" appearing everytime we want to stream an encode, can we?

If you have an 512K (or more) speed connection, the encode should stream ok. Did it for you?

Remember, the pixel frame size is based on a PAL VCD frame size - ie: 288 pixels high.


Cheers

[neo75903]

i encode all my tv recorded movies into
512x288 for wide screen 16:9
512x384 for 4:3

all encoded in 500kbps, its a good balance between quality and file size.

Streaming works fine since i dont stream through the internet (I am not rich enough to defend myself on court ;)) It is just for personal use on our local LAN.
Streaming has the advantage not to have copies on different computers, it is now far more simple to maintain the library on 1 dedicated pc/server.