My dream program for DVD backups

[DevilsChild]

I've been thinking alot lately about the frontend programs which are commonly used for DVD backups, and what features should be incorporated into a modern DVD backup tool.

It seems to me that most frontends for video encoding are too complicated for elementary users, yet they lack many of the features which hard-core video geeks demand.

As far as I know, there is no true "one click" solution for backing up a DVD to 1CD. At the same time, there is a lack of support for more advanced video/audio codecs and containers.

Here is my idea of the perfect DVD backup program:

1. My dream DVD backup program would automate both ripping and encoding. The user should be able to put a DVD in his drive and not have to worry about decrypting/demuxing the vob files himself.

2. My dream DVD backup program would use internal routines as much as possible. The user shouldn't have to install too many codec packs or external programs which may destabilize his computer. This would be achieved by integrating the efforts of various open source projects (AviSynth, VirtualDubMod, XviD, Matroska, OGM, Besweet, etc). See #3.

3. My dream DVD backup program would be open source, but could support closed source codecs such as DivX5, RealVideo 10, or VP6 (which would have to be installed separately).

4. My dream DVD backup program would automatically check for updates to its routines, which would be available for download as a series of patches on a periodic basis.

5. My dream DVD backup program will operate in 3 different modes:

Moron Mode - The user puts a DVD in his drive and presses a big button labeled "Start". Outputs an AVI with MPEG-4 Simple Profile video and 128 kbps cbr MP3 audio for maximum compatibility. Basically the same as AutoGK, but with integrated decrypting of the DVD and no options for the user to screw up.

Standard Mode - Accepts DVD's or any compatible video files for input. Supports any VfW codecs installed on the computer (as well as RealVideo 10). Supports output of MP3, Vorbis, or HE-AAC audio. Supports AVI, MKV, OGM, and MP4 containers. Prompts the user with a sequence of options for video, audio, subtitles, and container format. Options are greyed out to reflect incompatibilities between different video/audio/container formats. Offers options for MPEG-4 SP, MPEG-4 ASP, or proprietary codecs. The user still doesn't have to bother with codec settings.

Genius Mode - Same as Standard Mode, except all settings can be set manually. Gordian Knot on steroids.


I wish someone would make a program like this!

[avih]

i like the big red "Convert my DVD to CD" button in morons mode :)

[stax76]

"It seems to me that most frontends for video encoding are too complicated for elementary users, yet they lack many of the features which hard-core video geeks demand."

the DVX projects aims to serve new users and experts as well

"As far as I know, there is no true "one click" solution for backing up a DVD to 1CD. At the same time, there is a lack of support for more advanced video/audio codecs and containers."

it would be possible to make a tool with only one click but that's not really professional and definitively not what's 95 % of the users in this forum are about. I don't no about other tools, in DVX by default the user is challenged to make a comptest because before a comptest possibly filters must be applied and the video must be cutted, these things cannot be automated, the rest can be configured to be fully automated. Supported formats are avi, ogm, mkv, vorbis, ac3, VP6, WM9, DivX, XviD and soon Reel Video via plugin, the program can be configured to support pretty much everything what BeSweet and VirtualDubMod supports

"1. My dream DVD backup program would automate both ripping and encoding. The user should be able to put a DVD in his drive and not have to worry about decrypting/demuxing the vob files himself."

supported by DVX

"2. My dream DVD backup program would use internal routines as much as possible. The user shouldn't have to install too many codec packs or external programs which may destabilize his computer. This would be achieved by integrating the efforts of various open source projects (AviSynth, VirtualDubMod, XviD, Matroska, OGM, Besweet, etc). See #3."

I think it would require a genius. It wouldn't make no sense anyway because software components that nicely integrate have major advantages. Software should be about components

"3. My dream DVD backup program would be open source, but could support closed source codecs such as DivX5, RealVideo 10, or VP6 (which would have to be installed separately)."

DVX support most popualar VFW codecs including WMV9 and VP6, a Reel Video plugin is currently developed. With some of the codecs there are technically problems

"4. My dream DVD backup program would automatically check for updates to its routines, which would be available for download as a series of patches on a periodic basis."

supported by DVX via plugin

"5. My dream DVD backup program will operate in 3 different modes:

Moron Mode - The user puts a DVD in his drive and presses a big button labeled "Start". Outputs an AVI with MPEG-4 Simple Profile video and 128 kbps cbr MP3 audio for maximum compatibility. Basically the same as AutoGK, but with integrated decrypting of the DVD and no options for the user to screw up."

see point 0

"Standard Mode - Accepts DVD's or any compatible video files for input. Supports any VfW codecs installed on the computer (as well as RealVideo 10). Supports output of MP3, Vorbis, or HE-AAC audio. Supports AVI, MKV, OGM, and MP4 containers. Prompts the user with a sequence of options for video, audio, subtitles, and container format. Options are greyed out to reflect incompatibilities between different video/audio/container formats. Offers options for MPEG-4 SP, MPEG-4 ASP, or proprietary codecs. The user still doesn't have to bother with codec settings."

support for all VfW codecs would be possible without problems but it would add complexity

formats not supported by VDM could be supported via plugin in DVX, a Reel video plugin in on the way, there was also a AAC/MP4 plugin but nobody did maintain it. I wish there would be a standard so I wouldn't have to fiddle with all the formats

"Genius Mode - Same as Standard Mode, except all settings can be set manually. Gordian Knot on steroids."

in DVX there are no modes but advanced settings are hidden in sub dialogs that don't have to be used because the main dialog offers profiles and presets created in the sub dialogs

"I wish someone would make a program like this!"

I do my best, your chances for such a tool would be higher if you would help a existing project or even start your own

[SeeMoreDigital]

Your application looks quite nice!

But why did you have make it so we have to install M$ .NET Framework?

I don't like the idea of having to install .NET Framework on my PC when I don't use it for anything else!

Cheers

[stax76]

did you read my short .NET explanation in the current DVX topic? Additionally I recommend you to visit http://osnews.com regularly to learn about software platforms. If you realy want to understand why .NET is the best programming model to create a application like DVX you must learn about programming

[bilu]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Your application looks quite nice!

But why did you have make it so we have to install M$ .NET Framework?

I don't like the idea of having to install .NET Framework on my PC when I don't use it for anything else!
@SeeMoreDigital

You have no idea how much of these answers Dolemite had/had to bear... :rolleyes: Everybody thinks the program is nice but won't install the colossal .NET framework because it has so little use...

The unfair part is that people avoid his program not for its value bur for its framework. The fair part is that this has been Dolemite's decision from the beginning, to challenge and resist these negative .NET feedback ;)

My hat for Dolemite for his courage and persistance. :)


Bilu

[SeeMoreDigital]

As I don't know anything about programming, I confess I don't know the reasons as to why .NET Framework has to be installed. So I apologise for that.

That said, why are so many people reluctant to install it. And what's the worst thing (or things) that can happen to your PC if you have it installed?

Cheers

[bilu]

.NET framework has to be installed for the same reason you need Python to run Python scripts and Java VM to run Java programs: it's a framework, programs are built around it. Just like the VB Runtimes :)

Main problems: slow to load at beginning and about 30 MB download.

The download size gets a bit ironic here because Dolemite's program is less than 1 MB but people won't download 30 MB just to use it :devil:

I do think that the next Windows will include .NET so this will stop being a problem. But not just yet. :D


Bilu

[Kedirekin]

I think most peoples objections (correct me if I'm wrong) is basically having to install a bloated runtime. I can remember similar feelings towards vbrun and the MFC librairies.

Now, nobody thinks twice about vbrun or MFC, partly because by today's standards they're quite small, but also because they've become trusted (acceptance breeds acceptance).

I think .NET will take exactly the same path. In two or three years it'll will be just one more mainstay component you pretty much have to have installed on every windows PC, and no one will think twice about it.

[stax76]

That said, why are so many people reluctant to install it.


there are various reasons, the problem is there are not enough applications. Only if there are many cool applications and there is no way around people will stop to fight it, this will take some more years. On one side it is disappointing the way people react on .NET, if I had known before DVX probably wouldn't be what it is today, but on the other side it's great there are enough people who appriate what DVX does and working with a technology with the format of .NET is a great pleasure. There are many people saying .NET and Micosoft's development environment VisualStudio are the best products Microsoft ever created and I'm on of them.


And what's the worst thing (or things) that can happen to your PC if you have it installed?


there shouldn't happen anything bad although there were people who said something different

[SeeMoreDigital]

Can it make your PC more exposed to hackers and the like?

[stax76]

Can it make your PC more exposed to hackers and the like?


any application can be vulnerable don't matter what's it's based on but if you don't run a vulnerable application I don't think your system is more vulnerable with .NET

[SeeMoreDigital]

Hi Dolemite

Well I've given DVX a quick try and I have to say my first impressions are that it's not all that easy to use!

Cheers

[stax76]

I'm sorry to hear that because that's the purpose of the program, ease of use. This kind of feedback is rarely but it happens from time to time. Possibly the used concepts are not what you think such a program should be designed. After all there are different approaches and appears that the approaches used in DVX don't appear naturally to you. Are there any specific things you had problems with or are there things you know a better solution for or is it a overall impression? Most of the concepts are quite popular like having project level and program level settings etc. Maybe you was just overwhelmed by the large amount of available features, in the last two years there were hundreds of feature requests and ideas integrated. I could try to explain why the program is designed like it is but I'm not sure if somebody gains something from it

regards

[oddball]

I've never really understood the term 'DVD backup' being used in context with recompression. In my eyes DiVX etc is inferior quality so I would not consider it a backup at all. If I have the original DVD guess which one I will be watching? The only instance I can see this term being correct is when actually making a 1:1 copy onto a DVD-R.

Of course there is the argument that you can use the recompressed version for others to play (Like the kids). But as for 'DVD Backup' I'd say that's a hazy term.

[stax76]

<ot>
DivX or XviD or whatever copy might be a better term, for some reason backup is the most used term here, in many cases might be wrong because additionally to your explanations it means also owning the original disk
</ot>

[SeeMoreDigital]

Agreed,

Using the expression 'backing up' also implies that you possess the original!

Cheers