RealPlayer 10.5, installation, performance, etc.

[karl_lillevold]

RealPlayer 10.5, installation, performance, etc.
or How to make RealPlayer 10 behave nicely

[This is an updated information thread on how to make RealPlayer behave in a well mannered way preferred by most users in this forum. It is similar to the RealOne instructions, but easier than before]

Previous RealPlayers and RealOne players have been somewhat impolite in certain areas (Message Center with ads, file types, icons, running in the traybar). However, regarding the "spyware" allegations, I have been told one old version of realjukebox did send back some usage information by accident. The information was never even saved, because no one knew about it. That's gone years ago, but it's hard to be forgiven for that mistake, and it is so sad to see the same allegation being brought up again and again.

This RealPlayer 10 is better than before, with improvements in all areas, even though it looks relatively similar at first glance. It is faster, smaller, it has smoother video playback, less jitter, much improved media library, playlist handling, device support, incl Palm and iPod, ripping (to AAC), comes with a RV8+9+10 combo decoder DLL with better performance, that even improves RV playback in Media Player Classic when installed. It plays almost *) all formats, including AAC and HE-AAC. It even plays songs purchased in other music stores, as long WMA and Quicktime components are installed on the system. *) Playback via installed DirectShow codecs (for instance .ogg) is still not working.

However, this post is not really about performance, even though a lot more could be said about improvements in this area. More importantly in this discussion, it is also better in terms of its behaviour.

Here is a list of items experienced media player users may want to modify during or after installation:

Choose Custom Install
Uncheck the boxes you do not want for items on the desktop and quicklaunch bar.
Check only the media types you want it to play. This is the only time you will be asked this, it will never try to take back any media types. Now, is this really so bad compared to other software, in regards to media types? It's not as polite as MPC, but I have other media players which take over media types, and there is not even an option to customize this..
Start RealPlayer, Create an account, or Cancel out.
Then go to Tools->Preferences->Automatic Services, Click Configure Message Center, then uncheck "Check for new messages". Click OK on the "warning" that comes up. Now you will never see the Message Center. In the same menu, check or uncheck Auto-update in its sub-menu as well.
Optionally, go to Tools->Preferences->General and set On startup display to "Player only". That way, no browser, and it starts much quicker. You can open the browser/library with the click of a button.

So to summarize, a few clicks are needed to opt-out, you have to "sign in" the first time. That's about it.

March 2008 - PC World: how to install ad-free clean RealPlayer
Yesterday and today Steve Bass posted a nice tutorial on how to get an ad-free RealPlayer (http://blogs.pcworld.com/tipsandtweaks/archives/006661.html), as well as how to install it cleanly (http://blogs.pcworld.com/tipsandtweaks/archives/006662.html), in his Tips and Tweaks column in PC World.


Download the free RealPlayer 10 Gold here, with no re-direction:
http://www.real.com/freeplayer/?rppr=d9

And you should also know, that no one is forcing you to ever run RealPlayer 10 to play back RealVideo and RealAudio, since there are alternatives. Codec packs on the other hand may not install or uninstall properly, and could mess up your system, which is why I recommend installing RealPlayer itself. If you want to use another player, install RealPlayer, follow these instructions, then leave it alone.

For all the technical details about what's new with the Real 10 Platform, including RV 10, RA 10 (AAC), and a detailed FAQ, please see:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=68245

Codec Pack?
If you have ever installed a codec pack (RealAlternative) in the past, it appears to be necessary to first run r1pclean.exe (http://www.lillevold.com/files/r1pclean.zip). Even though it reports "cannot load setu3260.dll" it does clean up the registry enough such that after this, RP10 runs fine after the installer completes. Without r1pclean, RP10 may not start, and show only flash screen, then die. Uninstalling RealAlternative, via its uninstaller, before installing RP10, has also been reported to work.

RealPlayer 11
I should update this thread for RealPlayer 11, but there are not many changes in the topics covered here.



Note that distributing so called codec packs, which is nothing but re-distribution of codec DLLs copyrighted by RealNetworks, and a few registry keys, is a violation of RealNetworks' copyright and the RealPlayer EULA.

[phrentec]

RealPlayer 10 is behaving very nicely,
I have not a clue why some people complain too much about the player itself, either way Thanks Karl.

[The Edge]

Thanks Karl. ;)

Hmmmm.....HE-AAC :)

[thop]

The ONLY thing that keeps me from installing any RealPlayer is the volume slider. When you change the volume on it the volume of the whole soundcard gets changed! So when you got winamp and realone player open, and adjust the volume in Real the winamp volume gets adjusted as well.

Got some test encode with sound, but dont want to hear the sound and instead some MP3? Drag the Real slider to zero, and *poof* your MP3 volume is gone as well. That is really a royal PITA. It has been like that forever with Real, and it's the only app i know that does this.

[karl_lillevold]

@thop: excellent question. RP 10 is now finally using DirectSound for its sound output, and there is no reason the Volume Slider should affect system wide sound level. In fact, I thought this problem had been fixed. I was very disappointed to find it was not, so I will try my best to make sure it will be fixed in an update.

[thop]

that sounds excellent to me :)

[thop]

This just came to my mind: With update do you mean online update (in the near future) or next version (RV11 ... in the not so near future?)?

Also if you ask me it is a real shame that a piece of software, that was known to be the most bloated and invasive piece of crap ever created (sorry, but it's true), is crippling the RV codec in some way now. RV10 seems to behave nicely, but there is still room left for improvement.

All the things like a web browser, cd burning, library and whatnot may be nice features, but are not needed for people who just want to view or stream some rm files. IMO Real should make a Real(ly)Slim player with the same GUI (which is nice, no doubt) but with only the ability to play/stream (stop/pause/rewind/ff) rm files and nothing else. Cut everything else completely out. No unnecessary options, no tools, no printing, no browsing, no burning, nothing. All the people who like all the extra features and all that stuff can still use the regular player (which can be 10$ then or sth. like that). Ironically enough i'd rather pay for a slim player than for the player with all the extras.

Now i understand Real needs to make money, so this won't be possible. But i believe what Real needs the most now is market share. The more people use the real codec the more people will consider buying RealPlayer some day. And like i said the RealPlayer is holding the codec severly back. There are some alternatives (like RealSplitter) but only tech nuts like us know about it, there's no chance the average joe will ever know about it. Besides, they don't support streaming (if yes tell me how :p).

And even the average joe, who might not be so picky like we are, will only like to be plagued by a player so often before he uninstalls the damn thing and switches to another player. I assume it takes 10x as much effort to win such a customer back, compared to a new customer.

These are just thoughts by a mere codec user, i may be talking about things i have no clue about, or be completely wrong :)

[karl_lillevold]

@thop: you are preaching to the choir. With this I mean that most of the techie people at RealNetworks, developers as well as many others, agree. RealPlayer 10 is one good step in the right direction of behaving nicer, but it may not be enough, considering how bad the reputation is (yes, we do get the feedback, us developers more than the marketeers, since chances are higher we read the tech forums).

A super-slim player is perhaps what we need to earn back trust. The Helix Player will be such a player on Linux. RealOne for OS X is actually also exactly what you suggest, no extras. It has gotten plenty of good feedback. It's the Windows version that includes everything but the kitchen sink.

At least I am happy there are alternatives on Windows, such that the use of RV10 is not prevented by lack of player choice.

Volume slider
Also, I am sad to report that the volume slider will not be fixed anytime soon. It worked the right way for a while, but I received a reply that indicated it was reverted to the old behavior, because usability tests indicated some users were not able to adjust the volume when they wanted to, specifically when a flash app in the browser part of RealPlayer was making sound. Sorry. This is another example how we perhaps could use a lean and mean Windows player for the experienced computer user.

[thop]

That is very unfortunate with the volume slider :( I was thinking it might be sth. like this.

I completely understand that there may be users that like or need these features/behaviours, and i don't want to dictate them what features are bad for them and should be removed just because i don't like them. There should be an alternative though.

It appears to me Real tries to compete with WMP, which is equally bloated in its recent incarnations, but at least you can still use WMP6.4 (also works for streaming) if you want to, which is simple and clean.

A thought just came to my mind: Why can't the volume slider behaviour be an option? Make current way default but make it an option so the more advanced users can change it.

[karl_lillevold]

problems installing RealPlayer 10 if codec pack installed

I wanted to add this information in this thread, since there are a few users of RealAlternative here, and they may have problems installing RealPlayer 10, if they ever wanted to..

Based on reports on hydrogenaudio.org about installer problems with RealPlayer 10, and how it would simply die after the flash screen, even though the installer appeared to run fine, I tried the following to reproduce:

Un-installed RealOne V2 from my secondary computer.
Set System Restore point
Installed RealAlternative 1.04
Ran installer for RealPlayer 10 Beta. No errors, no need to re-boot
Try to start RP10. Flash screen. then nothing!
Restored system to earlier restore point.
So, in at least some cases, I am pretty sure the codec pack is to blame. I will add this to a bug report I have filed on this issue, so we can hopefully make our installer work even in the face of this.

In either case, I also tested the un-installer/cleaner that comes with R1P, r1pclean.exe (http://www.lillevold.com/files/r1pclean.zip). Even though it reports "cannot load setu3260.dll" it does clean up the registry enough such that after this, RP10 runs fine after the installer completes.

[iwod]

@ thop....

If you have been reading this forum for a long time i think you will understand Karl wantedwhat we wanted as well. I bet if he have the choice he would even make a RealCodec Pack that does everything. Just like WinMedia And Vp6 or Divx have there own decoding pack. However as in any company the marketing department is the one that is normally to blame for. ( i remember something similar in Borland where delphi is good.... but .... )

Anyway......... i am sure someday we will figure it out ourself. RealAltenative is a start. ( only if it opens up more on what is does and how it does...) you could make a rv playback only.

But like you said normal user just don't know. The only way to incrase populariy with Rv10 is that somehow you could make WMP and Winamp... or even PowerDVD or WinDVD be able to play Real files as well.. That way Real get free advertising. ( Like a new PowerDVD comes out and out of the box saying Able to play Real Media File )

Anyway... there is still a lot of thing needed to improve. Things like coverting from rm to mkv is consider as bridging the liscense....

To be honest with you i am quite scare that vp6 will take the lead. EVD player will come down in price in matter of months. ( you know how things happen quickly in china ) by then buying a vp6 player will be cheap and playing DVD with vp6 files with ease. While Real is still concentrating on Mobile Devices....

Anyway i hope the new post processing do come before Realplayer 10 turns final and there may be some hope on EHQ 100....... etc...

[DaWolf]

While upgrading I got notified that if I did so I would lose my premium features of the already installed RealOne... Apart from the version number I wouldn't want to call this a major upgrade and resent being asked for money again....

The libary now has a sort of sidebar a la XP. Unlike XP's sidebar I cannot click this thing away though, resulting in loss of screen estate. Not a good idea.

I like it that the video library now supports artists instead of just genre.

I enjoy the one-click rating for files.

Auto-playlist still insists on mixing up audio and video files...

Note: I use Real as player & media library on a multimedia machine for the family. All content is on HD. Real's library allows them to quickly select a movie (or song) and play it without hassle. Being able to arrange the movies by genre *and* 'artist' (title/alphabet) is a plus.
The New option is extremely handy as I always had to point out to them what content had been added :-)

Ruud

[karl_lillevold]

While upgrading I got notified that if I did so I would lose my premium features of the already installed RealOne... Apart from the version number I wouldn't want to call this a major upgrade and resent being asked for money again....
That's understandable, if you use any of the Premium features, included with Superpass or the previous Plus player: *10 Band Equalizer, *More Video Control, *Audio Cross Fader, *Convert Media, *MP3 encoding above 96 kbps (Encoding with AAC is available at all bitrates)

[weidai]

How do I stop realsched.exe from starting up automatically with Windows? I've already done everything listed in the first post, and realsched.exe is still being started automatically.

[opsis81]

Delete it!;)

[karl_lillevold]

Ah, yes, thanks for reminding me. This realsched.exe just will not go away, and I was going to file a bug on it yesterday, but someone already had. In the meantime, I have added instructions for how to get rid of it. It's as simple as opsis81 suggests: go to c:\program files\common files\real\Update_OB, and move it away (or delete it)

[thop]

I just realised that the burning engine is just a plug-in and apparently not part of the real player core, shouldn't it be possible to uninstall it then? I'm also curious what the device transfer plug-in is or does. Unfortunately "Tell me more" doesn't know anything about it either ;)

[ookzDVD]

@karl,

finally I can download the realplayer10beta yesterday.

I installed it on my home pc (no internet connection), the player
is still need to download something (audio codec) while playing
rv10 .rmvb with aac. :(

Thank you.

[Sirber]

raac or racp it's trying to download?

[karl_lillevold]

everything should be included to play AAC in RM. If you are trying to play .aac files, it will need to download a renderer plugin (will indicated some other weird name). The only commonly used codec that's not included with RP10 is the one used for amazon previews, called dnet (RealAudio 3.0 I think). Is there any indication as to what it says it needs to download?

[ookzDVD]

Originally posted by Sirber
raac or racp it's trying to download?

it's just .rmvb which produced by your Real Anime.

[karl_lillevold]

I think RealAnime uses HE-AAC, so please see the "Playback problems with HE-AAC" in the FAQ in thread on the Real 10 Platform (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=68245) : "RealPlayer 10 can not currently play back HE-AAC in RM due to two bugs: 1) the AAC renderer plugin does not recognize the 4cc racp for HE-AAC, triggering an auto-update request. Hex-edit to raac is possible. However, then 2) raac.dll will crash, due to another bug. Both bugs have been fixed, and will be included in the Gold release of RealPlayer 10."

Neither of these bugs affect how MPC plays back AAC or HE-AAC, even when it uses raac."

The detailed explanation of what happens here is that #2 triggers the download request. This is a problem in the renderer for AAC which does not recognize the 4cc racp (for HE-AAC), even though the decoder DLL raac.dll can correctly decode it. However, if you hex-edit the file to have 4cc 'raac', it should only freeze the playback or crash the player. Both bugs have already been fixed, but a new release of the fixed DLLs will not happen until the Gold release of RealPlayer 10. In the meantime, you should be able to use Media Player Classic to play back HE-AAC in RM.

I will update the FAQ with this information. thanks!

[31 Flavas]

Does the new version of RealPlayer10 beta released because of security vulnerabilities (http://www.service.real.com/help/faq/security/040123_player/EN/) include the fixes for he-acc playback? Or do we still have to wait until the Gold release for the he-acc playback fixes?

[karl_lillevold]

I just checked that earlier today, and unfortunately it includes only the realsched.exe fix + those security fixes. The HE-AAC fix was probably not categorized as critical. It will be included in Gold.

[l.s]

The RealPlayer is using the wrong folder as temp dir on Systems >= NT5. Is there any chance, to direct the temp folder to the local settings folder of a user, for all users of a system/domain (and keep the path relative to the profiles dir of the current user). It is a real problem, when all those temp data is squeezed through the network, when using server based profiles.

Is there any chance to disable (or move the position) the clip cache during the installation? As no normal user has write permission, where it is located.

Regards, Lars

[karl_lillevold]

Lars: I have not run into those issues, but I understand they can be problematic. I will file bug reports for both, but I do not know how they will be prioritized. Thanks!

[Demi9OD]

http://www.real.com/freeplayer/?rppr=d9 no longer is a direct download, it attemts to launch some kind of download manager IE plugin, but it's not working at all for me. Two days ago when I downloaded it, there was a direct link.

[Sirber]

Works #1 with Mozilla Firebird :D

http://forms.real.com/netzip/fromrde.html?promo=http://www.real.com/R/RDX.fail-redir.R/software-dl.real.com/13c7e007ab175eb34f15/windows/RealPlayer10Beta.exe&type=dl_rp10&rppr=d9

[thop]

Still works for me with IE.

[karl_lillevold]

Originally posted by Demi9OD
http://www.real.com/freeplayer/?rppr=d9 no longer is a direct download, it attemts to launch some kind of download manager IE plugin, but it's not working at all for me. Two days ago when I downloaded it, there was a direct link.
Odd, it has been working for a long time now. But I never use IE, where it will try to launch some kind of download manager. I stick with Opera, to support my friends in Oslo :)

P.S. Going right to www.real.com is not that bad any longer. Try if you like. The first time you go there you get a big orange button offering to Download the Free Player. And it does! However, a couple of reloads, the button changes to Download the Player. Then you are taken to a 2nd page, which on 2/3 offers the Premium Player, and one the gray 1/3 page to the right, offers the Free Player (with no more hassle than that). I'd say it's better than before.

[bond]

moved to the software player forum, as it isnt really related to codec issues

[karl_lillevold]

RealPlayer 10 Gold is now available for download. http://www.real.com. By default RealPlayer 10 now rips music CDs to AAC at 192 kbps in the M4A (MP4) container format. The M4A container format is iPod compatible. Thanks to the feedback from hydrogenaudio and doom9! It was part of the reason M4A was chosen.

This is a bug fix release, with not that many new features since Beta. For instance the HE-AAC playback bug is now fixed and the DLL update from Helix Binary Downloads is no longer needed.

Here is a list of some changes:

* Support for AAC (M4A) files, which includes library import,
playback, CD ripping, CD burning, and transfer to portable devices.

* Users can now simultaneously burn a CD and playback a media clip.

* Users can initiate playback of a file that's being download using
another application ("progressive download").

* Installation speed has been improved and the number of icons
installed on the user's machine has been reduced.

* RP10 detects changes in network settings and prompts the user to
set bandwidth, which improves playback if the bandwidth has changed
(such as a laptop that is disconnected from a LAN).

* Improved user interface to make Transfer and Synchronization easier
with portable devices.

* Support for third-party store content including nodes in the Library
to catalog a variety of purchased content types (movies,
audio books, etc.).

* A variety of improvements to Help, How To, Tell Me More, and More Info.

[bond]

great news, karl :)

now we only need mpeg-4 video decoding back! (dont take me too serious ;) )

[kamiller42]

Thank you Karl and all of the Real Networks & Helix developers! I've been enjoying RealJukebox and RealPlayer for years.

Karl,

It is nice to see RA & AAC support. In an earlier thread, you and I discussed an optimal compression level for a music library. I was settled on 192 RA because it was actually AAC. Now there is 192 AAC and 192 RA. Is 192 RA still AAC? What is the difference between the two?

P.S. Would you know of a good skin for use on a HTPC? RP is my HTPC jukebox, but the standard skin is not NTSC TV friendly.

[karl_lillevold]

Thanks! It is nice to hear feedback like this.

192 kbps RealAudio is also AAC, just in the RealMedia container format, so the difference is in the container format only. One can losslessly convert from one to the other and back. If you have the Plus player this functionality should be built in there, maybe also in standard player, but I have not yet verified this myself. The dtdrive cmd line tool (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=73279) works as well.

I am sorry I don't know any good skins for HTPC. How is the skin not NTSC friendly? Too small resolution details being lost in interlace flicker, or too large frames?

[kamiller42]

Originally posted by karl_lillevold
Thanks! It is nice to hear feedback like this.

192 kbps RealAudio is also AAC, just in the RealMedia container format, so the difference is in the container format only.
That's what I figured. I was worried for a moment that Real decided to stay with Cook for all .RA files and put AAC support in its own container. Unless you can tell me what advantage there is of a Real container over M4A, I'm going to use M4A as my next library format. Of course, the help file explains as little as possible about the difference between audio formats, leaving the reader scratching his head and asking "And?!" :-(

I am sorry I don't know any good skins for HTPC. How is the skin not NTSC friendly? Too small resolution details being lost in interlace flicker, or too large frames?
The problems I have with the interface on a tv are the following:
1. Too much white making a difficult situation worse.
2. Fonts can't be sized making it very difficult to read the media browser and other GUI widgets because the font is so small.
3. Buttons need to be larger to allow easy clicking when manuvering the mouse with a remote or at best, a Gyration mouse in the air.

I kind of wish Real did get into HTPC software market like SnapStream or myHTPC, but I guess selling media is the direction Real's going. Nothing wrong with that, but...

[iradic]

hi...

is there any reason to dload new real-player 10 ... i have beta with all updates ... (it's 9 mb and i'm on dial-up 56k)

for riping and burning audio cd's i use other tools... so i use player only for watching rmedia videos...

thanks

[kamiller42]

Originally posted by iradic
hi...

is there any reason to dload new real-player 10 ... i have beta with all updates ... (it's 9 mb and i'm on dial-up 56k)


More than likely includes bug fixes. It's a free download. Go for it! :-)

[wata]

is realplayer going to add stretch support, i hate black border on the left and right screen

[kamiller42]

Originally posted by wata
is realplayer going to add stretch support, i hate black border on the left and right screen
Are you maximizing the screen or going to Full Screen? I have noticed the bars in full screen.

[karl_lillevold]

Originally posted by wata
is realplayer going to add stretch support, i hate black border on the left and right screen
Hmm, not sure I understand the problem. RealPlayer has always supported full screen with stretch. Ctrl-3 is the keyboard shortcut to change to full screen.

[wata]

i know realplayer support fullscreen but not with stretch option
play a video with 352x288 resolution fullscreen will result in black bar on left and right, i can't find any option to stretch the picture to cover the whole screen

[karl_lillevold]

Okay, I understand now. You would like an option to change the display aspect ratio (AR) for a video that might have been encoded with an incorrect display AR.

This is because 352x288 is not 4:3, which your computer screen is. Unfortunately, RealPlayer does not have this option, but there are a few ways to do it:

0) It would have been best to encode the video with the correct display AR in the first place, either resize down to 352x264 or 320x240, or increase the size to 384x288. When the output size is larger than input, Producer will not actually resize, but encode at 352x288 and set a flag so the player displays at 384x288.

1) transmux RM file to MKV. Then use Matroska Shell Extension GUI to change the Display AR to 384x288.

2) hex-edit the RM file and edit 352 to 384. RealPlayer will then fill your screen.

Ideally, RealPlayer should have been able to adjust AR on the fly. Media Player Classic, which can also play RM files with RealPlayer installed, has many features to adjust display properties like AR, offset, and zoom.

[el divx]

@karl_lillevold: Every time I try to load a windows media file, the player crashes. Can you explain it? Oh, and I am using realplayer 10 gold.

[karl_lillevold]

el divx: sorry, I do not know what is wrong. It works for me, and I do not work on the WM plugin, nor do I frequently use RealPlayer to play WM. However, if you PM me the latest crash<n>.log in
C:\Documents and Settings\<username>\Application Data\Real\RealPlayer\ErrorLogs
I will file a bug report.

[wata]

Originally posted by karl_lillevold
2) hex-edit the RM file and edit 352 to 384. RealPlayer will then fill your screen.

Ideally, RealPlayer should have been able to adjust AR on the fly. Media Player Classic, which can also play RM files with RealPlayer installed, has many features to adjust display properties like AR, offset, and zoom. [/B]

part 2 is the easier for me, i have lots of video, however can't find the ascii to change 352 to 384, so which offset to modify the hex

ps: i am using mpc for most of the realmedia but some clips i would like to adjust the contast with realplayer limit video controls

[karl_lillevold]

wata: it's not ASCII text, but search for VIDORV40, the two numbers after this, are width and height, for instance:

000000d0h: 00 22 00 00 00 22 56 49 44 4F 52 56 34 30 01 60 ; ."..."VIDORV40.`
352 = 160h, so change 160h to 180h, and all should be well. Well, at least it will now fill the screen and display at the correct AR. I would also recommend D-C's RMVB shell extension (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=55392).. Not as advanced as the Matroska Shell extension, but it will show you the basic properties of an RM file, including the display size that you just changed.

[el divx]

@karl_lillevold: Hey there, I managed to resolve this. Instead of trying to reinstall RealPlayer 10, I installed RealOne Player 2 and I started downloading all the updates except RealPlayer 10 until I had installed all that were available for RealOne Player 2 and after a reboot it was working perfectly, and without any problem on WM files. Then, I installed RealPlayer 10 it through the update system of RealOne Player 2, and bingo, it works! I've also put the latest updates and even the ogg plugins and works without any problem!

[iradic]

why does real player wants to sign-in no mattar if i choose "i have no internet connection" ?

not all my comps are connected...

[Blkbird]

Has RealOne Enterprise Desktop been updated to RealPlayer 10 Enterprise Desktop? If no, is it going to happen any soon?