Foobar2000 0.7.7 with matroska audio support released

[ChristianHJW]

Read here (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/index.php?showtopic=16572&st=0&#entry168270).

As fb2k is not only an audio player, but can also do format conversions and audio compression, you might find it helpful also for video processing.

[Tuning]

Thanks ChristianHJW,

Btw, I have a Q: Is foobar capable of transforming any audio to mka. Then it would be more useful.

[ChristianHJW]

Originally posted by Tuning Thanks ChristianHJW,
Btw, I have a Q: Is foobar capable of transforming any audio to mka. Then it would be more useful ... not yet ;) ...

[bond]

mka is great for storing a whole album in one file, each song seperately choosable and tagable and you can already play it, next to foobar (with the plugin from jcsston (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/index.php?showtopic=16692&hl=)), also in any dshow based player

[tiki4]

Hi,

I managed to ignore this thread up to now :confused:

Actually I like this MKA with one album inside thingie quite much. foobar2000 can already tag all the files and even replaygain them. Does anyone know if these are already the new Matroska tags? I didn't examine the files too closely, but I didn't find the usual APE2 tags used by foobar2000.

One thing that's a little limiting is that only foobar2000 can make use of the replaygain values it calculates. Is there any chance to support this in Matroska splitter? [I know the discussion about that, and that's it may be quite difficult, but any updates?]

tiki4

[The Link]

...but I didn't find the usual APE2 tags used by foobar2000.
To prevent further confusion about ape tags being used:
Foobar2000 uses ape tags for mp3s (see preferences) only if you want it to do so (especially for rg info tags). All other audio formats are tagged with their native tag format (if there is one specified!).

Regards,
The Link

[Atamido]

Originally posted by tiki4
Actually I like this MKA with one album inside thingie quite much. foobar2000 can already tag all the files and even replaygain them. Does anyone know if these are already the new Matroska tags? I didn't examine the files too closely, but I didn't find the usual APE2 tags used by foobar2000. Yes, it is using the new tagging system. It should be noted though that the new Matroska Tags are not APE2 tags, but they are somewhat similar in practice.One thing that's a little limiting is that only foobar2000 can make use of the replaygain values it calculates. Is there any chance to support this in Matroska splitter? [I know the discussion about that, and that's it may be quite difficult, but any updates?]No updates, but it is possible. The easiest way to do this would be to create either a specific ReplayGain DS filter or to integrate this functionality into something like the MatrixMixer.

[bond]

Originally posted by Pamel
The easiest way to do this would be to create either a specific ReplayGain DS filter or to integrate this functionality into something like the MatrixMixer.interesting idea, matrixmixer is already a great filter

[Atamido]

Personally, I prefer modularity. IE, if I could just have the ReplayGain abilities without needing the MatrixMixer filter installe, that would be best for me. But getting it to work at all would be nice.

[ssjkakaroto]

Originally posted by jcsston
I am sorry to say but due to the abrasiveness and anti-matroska fb2k developers. I am
discontinuing this plugin.

I am leaving the source code up so that if someone else wishes to they can continue it. :(

[Human_USB]

The maker of FB2k said he was taking over the Matroska plugin.

[Atamido]

Unfortunately the fb2k guy is not very team focused. Maybe he will improve the filter, and maybe he won't. But I doubt it will ever get very good because he will probably never ask or accept much help. It is unfortunate that this has happenned.

[The Link]

But I doubt it will ever get very good ...
We'll see ... :)

[JohnV]

Originally posted by Pamel
Unfortunately the fb2k guy is not very team focused. Maybe he will improve the filter, and maybe he won't. But I doubt it will ever get very good because he will probably never ask or accept much help. It is unfortunate that this has happenned. While I know Peter is not exactly the arch angel of friendliness, somehow few things make this sound a bit too one sided:
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/index.php?showtopic=16692&view=findpost&p=170541
I'll just bring the other side here. I don't know what to make of this, but experience says the truth is usually somewhere in between..

<Peter> i report bugs to them, they are so thankful that they abandon foo_matroska project
<Peter> meh
<Peter> scared of me finding issues with their libraries perhaps
<JohnV> are you saying that this bug reporting is the "anti-matroska activity"? :B
<Peter> yes
<Peter> because i found that seeking is inaccurate and started to publicly rant
<Peter> because this is highly annoying on albums i have too
<Peter> they apparently prefer people not to be informed about issues in their muxer too
<Peter> and use them without being aware that gapless playback is screwed
<Peter> because it's not always obvious
<Peter> i'm hardly anti-matroska... i was interested in using matroska, but i can't use it in current state because of seeking / gapless playback issues

[ChristianHJW]

The whole thing has been cooked up much more than it actually was worth it.

It was jcsston's decision to start working on this plugin. Foobar2000 is a very well accepted audio player, especially on hydrogenaudio.org, so i certainly didnt object to that ( how could i, Jory is free to do whatever he wants ) as i was hoping on a new usergroup being developed for matroska.

However, Peter, the developer, was pointing us to a couple of flaws in

- the matroska plugin
- matroska itself ( for 'sample precise seeking' )

As JohnV is saying, Peter can have a very strange charm sometimes, and so he was pointing jcsston and myself a couple of times per day to the existing flaws.

I dont know if MP4 could do gapless playback over night, IIRC then it couldnt do it at all if being spec compliant, but it was menno making an addition to the MP4 container ( using 'atoms' ) so that the Mp4 plugin for foobar2000 can do gapless playback.

Apparently Peter was not happy with the development speed of both the plugin and the container, to adress this issue. As a result, Jory decided to stop working on the plugin. I dont know his precise reasons, he mentioned an 'abrasiveness' he was seeing in Peter's comments about the progress on the plugin. I personally believe he just didnt see any reason why anybody should be allowed to put him under pressure, especially for work he is contributing in his free time, and without any payment ....... thats it, there is not more and not less to it, and i hope everybody understands jcsston's decision !

To put it in simple words :

Jory is coding for fun, and making the plugin was no fun to him anymore. Period !

And about Pamel's comments above : our Texan friend should have added an 'IMHO' , as always ;) ....

[Atamido]

Originally posted by ChristianHJW
And about Pamel's comments above : our Texan friend should have added an 'IMHO' , as always ;) .... IMHO. :p

While Peter did point out some bugginess, he didn't do so in the nicest way, as the "arch angel of friendliness" would. He also has had several opportunities over the pas 9 months to help out, but didn't. Then they released a version of the plugin that jcsston didn't do, which makes it difficult to track down bugs when you don't know what was changed. And finally, when several solutions were offered within 24 hours for his main problem, he still complained about it.

While none of this is exactly catastrophic, you have to understand that the Matroska team is basically composed of a bunch of nice guys. And the general consensus from the Matroska team is that mean people suck, and nobody wants to work with them when there are other things that could be done with nicer people.

@JohnV: I am pretty sure that phrase has just entered my common dialog.

[Stux]

Originally posted by ChristianHJW
but it was menno making an addition to the MP4 container ( using 'atoms' ) so that the Mp4 plugin for foobar2000 can do gapless playback.


Uh, no, no "addition" was made to the MP4 container to support gapless playback. Just a matter of interpreting the spec.

[saratoga]

Pretty sure foobar does gapless decodeing of AAC/MP3 within MP4 files. I was actually concerned that foobar wouldn't do MKA at all since Peter seemed to have nailed down all the container issues with gapless mp3/aac so quickly using MP4.

Its good to see hes still interested in mka.

[Atamido]

I have already provided Peter with multiple solutions to the problem. However, I have not seen a timeframe for those to be implemented. This does not affect movies however as audio synch in movies doesn't need to be more accurate than 0.5ms.

[KpeX]

I hope this project continues it's quite promising. Matroska will pick up a lot of steam from this especially if MKA muxing is implemented. The new tagging system is very nice, and tagging a full album in one MKA file with the freeDB plugin works very well. :D

[IvS]

Originally posted by Pamel
While Peter did point out some bugginess, he didn't do so in the nicest way, as the "arch angel of friendliness" would. He also has had several opportunities over the pas 9 months to help out, but didn't.
First of all, there's no rule that says one should do things in the nicest way possible, some people prefer to act real.
He might have had opportunities to help, but as you probably know he's been busy with quite many other things related to foobar2000. And yet he DID help! Stop spreading lies.

And finally, when several solutions were offered within 24 hours for his main problem, he still complained about it.
He "complained" about it because those solutions were not good enough. Non accurate seeking is a major issue to Peter, and since he chose to point it out, "some people" decided to claim he's "matroska-unfriendly".
While none of this is exactly catastrophic, you have to understand that the Matroska team is basically composed of a bunch of nice guys. And the general consensus from the Matroska team is that mean people suck, and nobody wants to work with them when there are other things that could be done with nicer people.
I didn't know that nice guys go around spreading accusations about people being "mean" and that they "suck" which are baseless. Peter was never "mean" to jcsston regarding his plugin. And I think you should prove your claim if you intend to stick with it, if you don't, good.

Then they released a version of the plugin that jcsston didn't do, which makes it difficult to track down bugs when you don't know what was changed.
here's what Peter has to say:
<DEATH> yes, as much as one edit since jcsston's version
<DEATH> he (Pamel) is spreading FUD
<DEATH> gee thanks i can stop releasing new versions and drop it too
<DEATH> and stop fixing bugs in it
<DEATH> foo_matroska source will be kept open
<DEATH> if jcsston decided to stop working on foo_matroska, then he (Pamel) should be happy that someone bothers bugfixing it
<DEATH> and its not like they report bugs to me

This does not affect movies however as audio synch in movies doesn't need to be more accurate than 0.5ms.
Says who? You? And why should that be? Peter and other developers don't agree with that and neither do I.
Accusing developers of other software of being matroska-unfriendly doesn't help Matroska. My suggestion is for you to change this attitude.

I'm a regular at the #foobar2000 channel, ShyK.
If you think you should attempt to prove any of your claims, do so.

[Atamido]

Originally posted by IvS
Stop spreading lies. Excuse me? Where are the lies? I said he helped, and you said he helped. What are you getting at? Is it that I said he's not nice? If so, get over it. This may be a news flash to you, but nobody is liked by everyone. If I say someone is not nice, its not a lie, its an opinion. And no, I certainly don't miss the irony in a nice guy calling someone else mean.

Yes, we were all most appreciative for the input from Peter about the accuracy of sample seeking in current MKAs. However, he never said anything about there being an issue with any of my solutions. If he would have told me, then this perhaps is a lie or misinformation from you? If you have any questions about my solutions, then feel free to contact me on Doom9, HA, or irc.corecodec.com/matroska

As far as how accurate you need the audio synch to be for video, even DEATH agrees with me. <Case> ChrisHJW: that inaccuracy in matroska must cause sync problems with video and audio
<Case> and make inaccurate video seeking also impossible
<DEATH> not with +-1ms inaccuracy
<DEATH> i wonder what kind of sound lag console/whatever emulators have
<ChrisHJW> Case : you wont notice a lag between video and audio of 1 ms
<Case> that's still unacceptable
<DEATH> Case: emulators probably have 30ms+ sound lag, and people still dont notice that Not to worry though, there are options being kicked around to include in the tools to allow sample accuracy in movies also, but I doubt anyone will care.

[ChristianHJW]

Hey guys, keep the peace please, ok :) ?

The matter is quite simple

- we are extremely thankful for Peter's input, the point is understood now from our side
- there are a couple of solutions discussed to achieve sample accurate seeking in MKA, and also gapless playback
- we will decide on what we think is best, and ask Peter's opinion on that. If he agrees, we will add it to the specs before matroska goes 1.0
- either the team or him, or maybe even together we will continue with this plugin. If jcsston is busy with soemthing else, we will ask the other devs to help

Does that sound good to you :) ?

[tiki4]

I'm glad about your post Christian. That sounds much more sensible than bashing each other all the time.

tiki4

[robUx4]

Originally posted by ChristianHJW
- there are a couple of solutions discussed to achieve sample accurate seeking in MKA, and also gapless playback

Mmm, nothing needs to be added in Matroska to allow sample accurate seeking or gapless playback. Or it has never been said to me.

[Siku]

Originally posted by ChristianHJW
- either the team or him, or maybe even together we will continue with this plugin. If jcsston is busy with soemthing else, we will ask the other devs to help

That sounds very good. I hope you'll find a way to develop this plugin together.

Regards,
Siku

[IvS]

Pamel:
Excuse me? Where are the lies? I said he helped, and you said he helped. What are you getting at?
Excuse me? It appears as though you have forgotten about what you wrote, as well as failed to prove claims.
He also has had several opportunities over the pas 9 months to help out, but didn't.
And no, i couldn't care less whether you like him or you don't, it's about spreading lies and FUD about people (see nice guys & mean guys part) which i do NOT appericiate nor do i think it helps any of the sides.
And as for audio/video sync, yes, of course it may not be noticable on playback, but it will also not be accurate and true to the original or true to what people want to do when editing videos, simply does not give full accuracy. And that's unacceptable and i'm sure you understand this and that's why accuracy is being worked on.

robUx4:
Mmm, nothing needs to be added in Matroska to allow sample accurate seeking or gapless playback. Or it has never been said to me.
Then it has never been said to you.

[robUx4]

Well, I've heard about the problem and tried to find the right solution. And finally we came to the conclusion that nothing needs to be added in the format for sample-accurate seeking. So the discussion ended there... Then it's only a matter of code to handle the Matroska data correctly.

[Atamido]

Originally posted by IvS
robUx4:

Then it has never been said to you. IvS, please calm down and get your facts strait. Nothing needs to be added to Matroska to acheive sample accurate seeking. All issues that were experienced were due to the tools being used. It will be nice to get the tools to write files that contain more accurate timecodes, however, sample accurate seeking can be obtained with currently written files simply by changing the playback tool.

In other words, everything could be made to work for sample accurate seeking by simply by updating foo_matroska.

Oh, and by the way IvS, I think you're mean to. ;)

[Neo Neko]

@IvS

I am not picking on you because you are the new guy. Just warning/asking you as a new guy to calm down. We welcome your oppinion. But only ask you to be a bit less antagonistic and a bit more informative. Your inability to do so could eventually reult in a strike or worse and that is not something I think anyone wants.

For instance. If someone is wrong don't just say they are. That gets everyone nowhere fast and only exasperates the situation. If someone is wrong and you can show it then at least give some cryptic hint if not an oughtright explanation of how they are. If you believe someone is wrong and can not prove it then the best terminology would be simply "I disagree.". And leave it at that.

Having said that; this goes for everyone. Let us keep things civil and respectfull. You don't have to agree with everyone. But you should do your best to show respect to others as you would have them show it to you. ;)

[Atamido]

Originally posted by Neo Neko
I am not picking on you because you are the new guy. Just warning/asking you as a new guy to calm down. For some reason I thought this was reffering to me. Next time I'll remember to bring a tether.

[IvS]

@ Neo Neko
I am not picking on you because you are the new guy. Just warning/asking you as a new guy to calm down. We welcome your oppinion. But only ask you to be a bit less antagonistic and a bit more informative. Your inability to do so could eventually reult in a strike or worse and that is not something I think anyone wants.
First of all, i have no idea why i'm being threatned/warned by you.
Secondly, i think it's pretty obvious who started the "antagonism", and if attempting to correct "facts" being stated here is unwelcome, then i don't know what is. And being "informative"? Well, one would think that all i do here is being an "antagonist". Other than posts in this thread, i've posted 30 something others as well you know.
If you believe someone is wrong and can not prove it then the best terminology would be simply "I disagree.". And leave it at that.
First of all there is a difference between "someone is wrong" and "someone knows what he's doing and spreads wrong info," be it due to his hatered towards an individual or what ever motive. One might disagree and say that wasn't the case, but i think it was and calculated what type of reply would be suitable. Suitable to statements of facts, and not of opinions. If it was a case of "I'm positive video codec x is way better than codec y, codec y is just plain inefficient" that would be a matter of opinion which can't be proven and i'd say "I disagree".
"I disagree" is most definately incorrect because some of what had been discussed here is not about opinions, and to statements that are false and misleading i can only reply using my own statements, and not my opinion, because it has nothing to do with it and would solve nothing.
If this is what you require people to do, which is something like "just say "I disagree," don't even attempt to correct facts because it is unwelcome here" then i'd understand why i'm being warned.
Having said that; this goes for everyone. Let us keep things civil and respectfull. You don't have to agree with everyone. But you should do your best to show respect to others as you would have them show it to you.
? Since it went for me as well: I act respectfuly. I didn't curse, I didn't go around mentioning which people I hate, I didn't write something like "oh, and by the way <person>, i think you're mean too" followed by a ";)" to make it seem like a (very bad) joke. And i could mention some more things.
Anyway, i just felt like writing this reply because i believe the warning was very unnecessary as well as wrongly aimed for showing me as a "trouble maker" which i definately believe *I* haven't been. If you just don't like me, go ahead and ban me, that thing that "neither of us wants" is wanted by me if that's what you want to do.
And why is this post so long? Well, because people don't like to be wrongly accused. And be sure that i understand others don't like reading such posts either, which i'm sorry for, but since Neo Neko chose to warn me publically what else can i do?

[Atamido]

Yes, anyway the this thread is about the Foobar2000 Matroska plugin. While jcsston has stopped developing the plugin because of personal differences, we all hope that the development will continue. Peter from fb2k is currently in charge of it. And while there is currently a small issue with seeking with an accuracy greater than 0.5ms, this will be resolved with updates to the tools.

[Neo Neko]

Originally posted by IvS
@ Neo Neko
First of all, i have no idea why i'm being threatned/warned by you.
Secondly, i think it's pretty obvious who started the "antagonism", and if attempting to correct "facts" being stated here is unwelcome, then i don't know what is.

Simply put I have dealt with everyone else here on prior occasions and have a pretty good understanding of their personalities etc. You are new to me so I thought I would politely ask you among others to tone it down a bit. Nothing more nothing less. Don't read anything more into it.

Originally posted by IvS
And being "informative"? Well, one would think that all i do here is being an "antagonist". Other than posts in this thread, i've posted 30 something others as well you know.

I have not read your other 30 posts. I never said your presence here is unwanted. I help patrol this part of the forum and as such this is the first time I encountered you. Nothing more. I would however review your other posts before I took off and gave you a strike. ;) But I would rather not. I don't think at this point it is called for.

Originally posted by IvS
First of all there is a difference between "someone is wrong" and "someone knows what he's doing and spreads wrong info," be it due to his hatered towards an individual or what ever motive. One might disagree and say that wasn't the case, but i think it was and calculated what type of reply would be suitable.

Originally posted by IvS

robUx4:

quote:Mmm, nothing needs to be added in Matroska to allow sample accurate seeking or gapless playback. Or it has never been said to me.


Then it has never been said to you.

Just to let you know I consider that an instance of not being at all informative and all together antagonistic. I don't remember seeing a single instance in this thread where you posted how anyone was wrong. You are quick to say however that they are very. Is there some refference in your other 30 posts I should read?

Originally posted by IvS

Suitable to statements of facts, and not of opinions. If it was a case of "I'm positive video codec x is way better than codec y, codec y is just plain inefficient" that would be a matter of opinion which can't be proven and i'd say "I disagree".

I am affraid this whole thing that has been started seems a matter of oppinion to me. And that is why I sugessted you stick to that. You can't tell anyone other than yourself that they do or do not like someone else. And you have not given any hints as to how to fix the seek problem which is the other issue you keep addressing. Or what exactly the seek problem is. So at this point anything you have posted smells more of opinion than any sort of fact to me.

Originally posted by IvS

"I disagree" is most definately incorrect because some of what had been discussed here is not about opinions, and to statements that are false and misleading i can only reply using my own statements, and not my opinion, because it has nothing to do with it and would solve nothing.

Then all I can ask is that if you can't solve anything at this point lets not start anything. ;)

Originally posted by IvS

If this is what you require people to do, which is something like "just say "I disagree," don't even attempt to correct facts because it is unwelcome here" then i'd understand why i'm being warned.

My fact filter must have been on. Cause I did not see many or any facts in your posts. Irregardless the lions share of the exchange was you and others picking at eachother. Which I am not going to stand for from either side any further in this thread.

Originally posted by IvS

? Since it went for me as well: I act respectfuly. I didn't curse, I didn't go around mentioning which people I hate,

The word hate was used aproximatly 3 times in this thread as far as I can see. And each time it was by you but thankfully not in refference to anyone. I have seen no one else use "hate".


Originally posted by IvS

I didn't write something like "oh, and by the way <person>, i think you're mean too" followed by a ";)" to make it seem like a (very bad) joke. And i could mention some more things.

As I said I am rather familliar with Pamel. He was just being playfull. They get like that down there sometimes. ;) Texas IIRC. :P On the other hand I was not sure if you were being playfull. But if so I suggest you both take it to PM on IRC because such things are a bit out of place here.

Originally posted by IvS

Anyway, i just felt like writing this reply because i believe the warning was very unnecessary as well as wrongly aimed for showing me as a "trouble maker" which i definately believe *I* haven't been.

I aimed it at you because you were rather new here. But it was not all on you. Pamel knows better. But I am fairly sure he will get the clue. Not that I think he would have taken it further anyway. Don't read much into a warning. When you get a strike then get concerned. My warnings are free. The strikes cost. ;)

Originally posted by IvS

If you just don't like me, go ahead and ban me, that thing that "neither of us wants" is wanted by me if that's what you want to do.
And why is this post so long? Well, because people don't like to be wrongly accused.

Hey I had parents. I know this game. Don't make me pull this car over! ;) There were plenty of times I got punished when I though I was innocent. Or at least claimed to be. This warning has no implications to your future here. So don't dwell on it. We all get carried away from time to time. And I am willing to accept that is the case this time for all those involved. Including yourself. You are a full member in standing without a blemish on your record at this point. But if this goes much further any party involved might see some blemishes. Something I would rather not see. So from now on lets try and keep things more academic and less Jerry Springer here. ;)

Originally posted by IvS

And be sure that i understand others don't like reading such posts either, which i'm sorry for, but since Neo Neko chose to warn me publically what else can i do?

I did it publicly because the issue was not entirely yours. Rather than see anyone else picking at you or vice versa I am here to tell everyone to take it down a notch. Lets stick to the facts and keep things civil.

P.S. IvS if you don't mind where are you from? More than once I have seen fights and arguments break out over simple cultural differences. If that may be an issue I would like to adress that and offer any help I may to clear things up.

As to Peter(A.K.A. PP) I don't think anyone here hates him. Just because someone in my oppinion might seem a little mean does not imply that I hate them. I have a lot of respect for Peter. His plugins were the best ones for winamp. And when he abandoned winamp so did I. And I have been very happy. Because so far foobar2k has been pure genius. I must say I am very pleased. As I am sure everyone who has posted to this thread is. I have heard some like Oddsock from time to time groan about the constantly changing nature of the foobar2k SDK and having to re-code or re-compile. But I don't think that they hate him.

I don't know if you are or have any aspiration to become a contributor to open source projects. But it is always important to keep in mind that those who do owe us nothing at all. So when addressing them try to keep your criticism constructive and your tone polite and respectful. IE butter them up till there is no tomorrow. That is the best way to get through. Besides everyone likes a little love and addoration. So with that run, be free, debate! ;)

[IvS]

Just to let you know I consider that an instance of not being at all informative and all together antagonistic.
The Matroska tools != Matroska? Wrong. And robUx4 explained well what he meant, the Matroska format itself. But of course Pamel felt it was necessary to push it further.

I don't remember seeing a single instance in this thread where you posted how anyone was wrong. You are quick to say however that they are very. Is there some refference in your other 30 posts I should read?
Excuse me? Posted how anyone was wrong? You mean i should bring proof how Peter was NOT mean? And so on? No. Pamel should have brought proof that he WAS, which he didn't, end of discussion. It's getting tiring anyway.

You can't tell anyone other than yourself that they do or do not like someone else.
Excuse me? Maybe you should go through the posts here once more and you'll realize that i don't need to say for anyone if he likes or dislikes someone, it's already been said.

And you have not given any hints as to how to fix the seek problem which is the other issue you keep addressing. Or what exactly the seek problem is. So at this point anything you have posted smells more of opinion than any sort of fact to me.
Too bad. Once again maybe you should reread the posts here.

Then all I can ask is that if you can't solve anything at this point lets not start anything.
If this is supposed to be funny it isn't really. No one ever solved anything by not even trying to do whatever he can. And i believe i did solve something, people probably understand some things that were said were untrue. That's good enough for me.

My fact filter must have been on. Cause I did not see many or any facts in your posts.
Again what kind of facts exactly would you like? Me proving how someone was NOT mean? Or maybe you'd like to be reasonable and see proof how someone WAS mean, by Pamel.

Anyway, i can see you like being in the high position you are, and i won't disturb you to continue showing you're in this position.
And you know where i'm from, i don't need to tell you.
More than once I have seen fights and arguments break out over simple cultural differences. If that may be an issue I would like to adress that and offer any help I may to clear things up.
I have no idea where this came from, if you're suggesting i have problems with anyone due to his/her origiin, i DO NOT appericiate it. And if it was some offer of help for me, thanks but i have no idea what you mean and i don't need it.

[ChristianHJW]

Originally posted by IvS
[B]The Matroska tools != Matroska? Wrong. And robUx4 explained well what he meant, the Matroska format itself. ... no, this is fully correct. You can not judge matroska from the tools that are currently existing to make matroska files. If anybody would judge the MP4 format from the tools that exist today to create and edit them, he had to come to the concludion that it sucks and is inferior to AVI. Of course, we all know this isnt the case, MP4 is clearly superior to AVI, it just takes some time until a new Avery Lee will come and make a Virtualdub for MP4 one day.

Current matroska tools are made for video. Period. It was my mistake to take these tools and advertise them in the audio world, with only the best intentions and because i was convinced matroska could be a good thing for the audio world. I had no clue what 'gapless playback' and 'sample precise seeking' were, until you guys told me. I also had no clue that mkvmerge doesnt write timestamps in matroska so that the two are possible.

ShyK, now please let this come to an end. Mosu made clear he will not implement this into mkvmerge, as he has neither the time nor the motivation to do it. Here in the video world, nobody needs that. Our audio tracks are very often off by 20 - 30 ms, and nobody notice that. 0.5 ms is simply no issue for us. And as our tracks have no gaps, we also dont need gapless playback, its as simple as that.

I am sorry i cant tell you any different, but these are the facts :

- the current matroska specs allow writing of audio tracks that do allow sample precise seeking
- there are currently no tools to do that
- the main devs of matroska creation tool wont look into this, because its not on their priority list

Maybe the most simplest solution would be if PP would add a matroska output module to fb2k, and write timestamps accordingly with it. As fb2k can do a lot of very useful audio conversions already, and will read a lot of input formats, there is a good chance some users will convert to it ( from BeSweet ) for creation of their soundtracks. mkvmerge can then mux these MKA tracks into the video unaltered .... and everybody is happy :) ...

[Tuning]

Originally posted by ChristianHJW
mkvmerge can then mux these MKA tracks into the video unaltered .... and everybody is happy :) ...

Need one more option, VDM, doesn't allow direct muxing( selecting to be precise..) of mka to any video. Eventhough VDM internally supports mka.(AFAIK). Then more pleasure. :rolleyes:

[KpeX]

I really hope that someone from the Matroska team can continue working on this plugin, especially considering that the tags written are not valid Matroska tags (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&postid=431299#post431299).

[Rash]

How do I make a single Matroska file with several tracks in it? Is there a guide or something? :D

[ChristianHJW]

Originally posted by Rash
How do I make a single Matroska file with several tracks in it? Is there a guide or something? :D

Pick one of the 2 options and i'll tell you briefly here in this thread :

1. Make one huge track ( complete album ) and divide songs by chapters

2. Make each song a new track

[Rash]

Humm... I think 2. Thanks a lot Christian. ;)

[ChristianHJW]

Creating these files is as easy as that :

1. Download the mkvtoolnix win32 binaries (http://mkvmerge.matroska.org) and the mingw runtime libraries ( link is a few lines below ) and extract them into any folder on your PC

2. Run the mkvmerge GUI, mmg.exe, by double clicking on it. The press 'add' and select each of your songs. They can be .mp3, .aac., .ogg, .flac, whatever. You can assign a name for every song in the 'track name' field.

3. Specify an output folder and file name for your MKV

4. Press 'start'

This will create a MKV file, where each song is an audio track of its own, similar to having many different languages in a movie, but here every song is like an own language.

Now, unfortunately you wont be able to play this file in foobar2000 yet AFAIK, as i dont think it does allow audio track switching already, but will only play the first track ( = song ). I could be wrong though, maybe PP implemented this already.

Your best bet to play this file is either any good DirectShow based player with an internal stream switcher, like MPC, TCMP, Zoomplayer, BSplayer, or to use VLC.

In any case, you need to select every song separately, as i dont think any of them will allow to play audio tracks of a MKV file consecutively.

if you ask me, method 1 is much much better right now ;) ....

[Rash]

Originally posted by ChristianHJW
if you ask me, method 1 is much much better right now ;) ....
OK then... ;) Hehe
Don't bother explaining mkvmerge. I forgot to tell you but I'm quite familiar with it. I just haven't found any option to produce multiple songs in a mka file. :)

Thanks a lot Christian.

[KpeX]

I have a batch file that parses a group of mp3s, creates a chapters file with track titles, and joins the mp3 into one track with Besplit, and merges them all together with MKVmerge into one MKA.

However I think it's not a good idea to use MKA audio right now until the Foobar plugin applies valid tags (if anyone keeps working on it).

[ChristianHJW]

Originally posted by KpeX I have a batch file that parses a group of mp3s, creates a chapters file with track titles, and joins the mp3 into one track with Besplit, and merges them all together with MKVmerge into one MKA. :o .... it would be cool if somebody would write a small and handy GUI for this, to generate this batch files automatically. Anybody volunteering :) ?

However I think it's not a good idea to use MKA audio right now until the Foobar plugin applies valid tags (if anyone keeps working on it). ... Peter is caring personally about the plugin now, as he was telling me yesterday on IRC. He already could change the internal fb2k API to avoid clicks when reading MKAs on chapter transitions, and will look at jcsston's tag code again, as soon as its fixed ....