DVD to MKV?

[Swin]

Hi, excuse for the newbie type question here, but I've just started looking a Matroska as an alternative container to AVI, mainly for chapter and OGG Vorbis support. From what I have read though, the structure would seem to lend itself perfectly for complete DVD backups.

Would it be possible to rip a DVD, convert to DivX and place into a Matroska file, with menu systems, additional video streams, audio streams of choice, subs etc etc?

I suppose the type of thing you are looking for at the end of the day is a kind of cross app that takes in the features of a DVD backup app such as DVD Shrink and a DVD2AVI conversion app like GKnot, yet will be able to give all the feature you would see from a DVD in an MKV.

Swin

[Swin]

Ok, I'm blind and it's late. I thought others must have had the same idea: -

From http://matroska.org/links/index.html

We have DVX and DVD2OGM, both with Matroska Outputs.

I wonder if anyone here has used them?

[EDIT] - these arn't what i thought they were, they are simply apps similar to GKnot.

All thats needed now is a nice little tool called DVD2MKV!

[Atamido]

There is not currently any menu support in Matroska.

[Swin]

Are you sure? If this is the case why would the Matroska (http://matroska.org/) project Home page indicate that they do: -

Matroska is designed with the future in mind. It incorporates features you would expect from a modern container format, like:

- Streamable over internet (HTTP and RTP)
- Fast seeking in the file
- High error recovery
- Menus (like DVDs have)
- Chapter entries
- Selectable subtitle streams
- Selectable audio streams
- Modularly Extendable


This I can see being a VERY desirable option within an MPEG 4 style container and it would seem really odd for them to indicate the they support such features when in fact they don't?

Clarification would be useful here. And if Matroska isn't able to support such features, what type of container can, and do the original questions get answered with the use of that container?

Many thanks.

Swin

[Hiro2k]

If you look on the matroska page, it has a timeline of when things will be released. Currently Matroska is in stage 2 and menus are not going to be implemented untill stage 4.

Right now the only container that has menus is MP4. Please read the FAQ on MP4 at the top of this forum.

[Human_USB]

Menus would be nice but I have everything I need now. Happy New Year Hiro2k.

[Atamido]

Of the items listed, only Menus and Streaming are currently missing. However, streaming won't necessarily require any changes to the file, just a streaming program that supports it.

[bond]

Swim, the mpeg-4 standard itself provides everything you need to do a complete dvd copy with the mpeg-4 container MP4 (which supports all things you mentioned and even more)

i wrote a guide and a script, called mp4menu, (you will see whats that for later) to make this process as easy as possible (there currently arent any easy-to-use "one-click" tools or so around)

you will find everything you need (i hope) here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=66583)

[Swin]

Many thanks for these replies.

I had thought of looking at the MPEG-4 standards but have just not got around to doing it. I will look over the documents listed though.

@Hiro2k. I do try my best to look for the answers before posting. On this occasion I could see no timeline that you mentioned. Since this post I have gone back to look at the site and have found some kind of reference to the project position in terms of rounds and procedural and coding definitions, but still no reference to what is likely to be implemented when.

I think that they should make it clear on the home page what features are already implemented, are planed to be implemented in the near future, and are planned for the more distant future. Don’t get me wrong, I believe and hope that this has a future but it does seem a little silly to claim that it does something when it clearly doesn’t!

I am hoping that one day VERY soon we will see standalone hardware devices that will play an MPEG 4 type file that will be able to act like a DVD so I want to try to look at containers that support these features now. Although I like the idea of Matroska and they even mention of there news pages that they are “talking” to hardware manufactures, It seems as though the big money is behind the MP4 standard so it may well be just as well to follow this route now.

Swin

[Hiro2k]

Originally posted by Swin
Many thanks for these replies.

@Hiro2k. I do try my best to look for the answers before posting. On this occasion I could see no timeline that you mentioned. Since this post I have gone back to look at the site and have found some kind of reference to the project position in terms of rounds and procedural and coding definitions, but still no reference to what is likely to be implemented when.

I think that they should make it clear on the home page what features are already implemented, are planed to be implemented in the near future, and are planned for the more distant future. Don’t get me wrong, I believe and hope that this has a future but it does seem a little silly to claim that it does something when it clearly doesn’t!


I've been going to the matroska page for a long time and I know the information was once there. But when I went there again, that timeline was gone. All that you requested I can swear was on the matroska page once upon a time. Like Pamel said Menus and Streaming are the only things currently missing, so there is not much to be said about the future changes of Matroska.

[P0l1m0rph1c]

How about control tracks?

[robUx4]

Originally posted by bond
Swim, the mpeg-4 standard itself provides everything you need to do a complete dvd copy with the mpeg-4 container MP4 (which supports all things you mentioned and even more)

i wrote a guide and a script, called mp4menu, (you will see whats that for later) to make this process as easy as possible (there currently arent any easy-to-use "one-click" tools or so around)

you will find everything you need (i hope) here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=66583)

Can you put Ogg Vorbis or FLAC in MP4 ? And even if you can technically, it will never be supported officially.

[Swin]

Originally posted by robUx4
Can you put Ogg Vorbis or FLAC in MP4 ? And even if you can technically, it will never be supported officially.

Indeed, this was one of the things that I wanted to do. Is is possible and practical to do in MP4? Specifically, I was looking to OGG for 6 channel (5.1) support. If not, then come on Matroska!

@Hiro2k - many thanks, sorry if it seem like I was having a go, I wasn't. Information changes so quickly on the Net. It's a bit difficult (and probably inappropriate) to keep asking "where are these features?" and "why havn't they been implemented yet?", especially from and open source project. I just wish my programming and understanding of such maters was at a level that I could actual do something useful. But is isn't, so I can't.

Maybe though, someone who is on the team can give us a general ball park figure as to these time lines?

Swin

[bond]

Originally posted by robUx4
Can you put Ogg Vorbis or FLAC in MP4 ? And even if you can technically, it will never be supported officially.yes the standard covers adding non-mpeg-4 streams to mp4 with private track ids

that way it is already possible to add vorbis and vobsubs in mp4
if it will "officially" supported is another question, i think it depends if other providers adopt these private track ids or not (also not all providers support h.264, although its "officially" allowed in mp4)

Originally posted by Swin
Indeed, this was one of the things that I wanted to do. Is is possible and practical to do in MP4?from what i heard vorbis-in-mp4 will not be adopted from other providers, so i would say its not practically usable in mp4

Specifically, I was looking to OGG for 6 channel (5.1) support. ogg vorbis is not really usable for multichannel purposes as it doesnt support channel coupling (you get similar bitrates than with ac3 with it)
use he-aac for multichannel, which you can also put in all new containers: mkv, ogm or mp4...

search around in the audio forum about multichannel

[Atamido]

Originally posted by P0l1m0rph1c
How about control tracks? Not done yet. Still at the planning stages trying to decide what is needed and what method to use for it.