ReJig 0.5 Released [Archive]

E-Male

14th December 2003, 23:54

great work
and finally i also did some tests

My opinion on the interface:
well done, few lil steps, and then just wait for the burn ready result, great
just one wish: make the stream selection the last step and add a box that shows what percentage of transcoding (if any at all) is needed with this selection (so we could see if for example removing a commentary would make transcoding unneccessary or if leaving in a DTS track would make the needed transcoding too heavy)

no for my test results:

1)
randomly picked: "Rush Hour", german disc rc2 pal
well, is seems like no transcoding was needed, because rejig skiped it and still gave me an undersized disc
subs looked right and were in sync just like the audio, no complaints

2)
"M", the new restored version released by eureka, uk rc2 pal
took 1hour and 10mintues
slight undersizing (a lil more than the 30MB i selected to be safe), but nothing to worry IMO
video looked ok, the grain comes an goes suddenly and there are some artefacts, but it should be enough for TV, so i say: good job on this extremly difficult source
audio was in sync and the subs looked right

But now for the bugs i found:

minor problem: the new DVDs default to audio track 2 (in case
of M the commentary), should be 1 i think [or allow choosing the default audio and subtitle, would be best ofcourse:)]

BUG: the subs appear almost 5 sec too late! (on M, not on Rush Hour!)
(EDIT after reading the above: M only has 1 sub, Rush Hour has 2, but i only tried the first [then deleted it] so i can't tell if the second one worked)

Amnon82

15th December 2003, 00:53

BugReport:

I think it is the DVD Author of ReJig. I tryed again Dreamcatcher RC2 PAL with it, now manually. I opend IFO-Mode and rejiged the DVD and ripped the subs.

Than I go to DVD Author mode and set up the DVD. In DVD Backup mode the DVD order was so:

VIDEO
ENG AC3
DE AC3
ENG SUB1
DE SUB1
ENG SUB2
DE SUB2

Now I changed a little bit:

VIDEO
DE AC3
ENG AC3
DE SUB1
DE SUB2
ENG SUB1
ENG SUB2

Now the result:

VIDEO and AUDIO is sync.
First Subtitle has wrong colors (maybe, because I tried the 'Copy Color Function', where the '.' didn't worked, so I set it up my self...)
All other subs didn't work.

Fazit:

I think, Nic, You should work on Your DVD-Author. It take to long to Multiplex a DVD with it. It took 41 Min's to get the VOB-files!!!

With IFO-Edit I got it in 8!

The new design is nice!:sly: Go on with it.

So I'll work with 0.4i-de and fix the known bugs seperatly, till 0.5b or 0.5c is out... (I hope, these bugs will gone then...)

Here's my guide for 0.4i-de translated on the fly by babelfish.com:

Guide for ReJig by Avalon (http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/urltrurl?lp=de_en&url=http%3A%2F%2Frj-elektronik.de%2Favideo%2Fmain.php%3Fset%3Dshotan) Very funny!:scared:

[Edit] I muxed now the movie again with IFOEdit 0.96. I got working subtitles, but still in green. Plus all 30 sek async!!! It seems the 'Too many frame drop'-Bug is gone. The 'green subtitle bug' still exists, if we mux with IFOEdit. But why is it now async and in 0.4i not (if the extaction works...)?

Released ReJig 0.5aDE2 (http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/files/ReJig_05a2.exe) without 'DVD Backup' and 'DVD Author'.

pv110

15th December 2003, 02:28

What's the advantage of this app for a user???:confused: :confused: This is not a "one click solution dvd copying" Are we not going back to CCE era where we had to wait and do most of the things manually???
In my opion I just think this app needs way more work on it. My 2 cents. This is my opion and I don't mean to offend no one...

E-Male

15th December 2003, 04:36

and your point is?

pv110

15th December 2003, 04:47

@E-male

First, read carefully what I wrote. I started asking a question and I finished giving an "opinion". So, if you're not gonna answer the question your comment is a waste of typing. Just don't comment. :D

Kedirekin

15th December 2003, 04:58

It's a work in progress, as evidenced by it's 0.5 version number.

It's advantage is to those users who are excited by it's potential and want to contribute to its development by testing it and providing feedback.

'nuff said?

FWIW: I posted the above before I saw pv110's reply to E-Male.

DDogg

15th December 2003, 05:38

pv110, actually is is probably you who should not have commented in what is basically a development thread. I do realize your question had validity to you, however in effect, saying to a house builder who has just got the roof dried in, 'In my opinion I just think this [house] needs way more work on it.' is kind of senseless. Hey, all the walls are not even up yet. :) And yes, I can promise you, Nic would be the first to agree with you that 'way more work' is to be done, assuming he can get his eyes uncrossed from weeks of all nighters getting it this far along. How about we all just keep every bit of encouragement we can muster coming his way. He should get a Doom9 knighthood for his commitment. "Sir Nic" has a very nice ring to it.

Nocturno

15th December 2003, 07:46

All hail Sir Nic of Rejig..

may his reighn be long and prosperous!

:D

2COOL

15th December 2003, 09:02

@Amnon82

Originally posted by Amnon82
[Edit] I muxed now the movie again with IFOEdit 0.96. I got working subtitles, but still in green. Plus all 30 sek async!!! It seems the 'Too many frame drop'-Bug is gone. The 'green subtitle bug' still exists, if we mux with IFOEdit. But why is it now async and in 0.4i not (if the extaction works...)?

Maybe I'm a little fatigue from a long weekend of work but when you say "muxed", do you you mean by "authored" in IfoEdit? or "remuxed"? as in you remuxed the m2v back into the original VOB?

Nic

15th December 2003, 10:18

pv110: The DVD Backup mode is pretty one click ?? Hardly any options...
(And by all means don't use it untill it's in a more ready state, I can understand that, although all feedback is useful :) Eventually, it will be the only one-click solution that users will be able to give direct feedback and change, I think that's appreciated)

@all: Well it seems there's a bug with the Subs...weird works fine on all the DVDs Ive tested. Ill try more and fix the bugs. Thanks for all the feedback.

Sorry for the early release, it does need more work, but time is running, and it's better that's out and other people can work on it too, rather than sitting on my machine doing nothing.

ReJig is still at a premature stage, but will get there with time and effort :)

Cheers,
-Nic

Amnon82

15th December 2003, 10:25

Maybe I'm a little fatigue from a long weekend of work but when you say "muxed", do you you mean by "authored" in IfoEdit? or "remuxed"? as in you remuxed the m2v back into the original VOB?

Wow 2cool! Sorry! I meant authored with IFOEdit by this...

I authored the DVD with the rejiged M2V and the AC3.
The sups I created seperatly, by VOBSUB over SUB2SUP, cos v.0.4i-de gaves me bad sups for "muxing" (authoring) in IFOEdit (Too many frame drops...)

Also the 'green subtitle'-bug I solved by hand (Paste&Copy)

JvD

15th December 2003, 10:28

I agree, its better its out so we can try it out and find all bugs.

And Nic, you dont have to apologize for an early release. We are all happy beta testing Rejig ;-) You should have credits for a work more than well done. Keep on working pal, I will (and many others) support the development as much as I/we can.

*testing it as we speak*

Amnon82

15th December 2003, 10:36

@Nic: I've no probs with early releases! The most I can handle seperatly if something goes wrong. I think bugreports are helpfully for You, "Sir Nic"...:sly:

@all: Well it seems there's a bug with the Subs...weird works fine on all the DVDs Ive tested. Ill try more and fix the bugs. Thanks for all the feedback.

Well, which DVDs did You backup? PAL ones or NTSC. I can only test with PAL (I only have one NTSC, at home...).

I tested the 'DVD Backup Mode'. All was OK, but only the Subtitle delay on the first sub. Why won't the other subs work? I never got one started...

I start today writing a Guide for ReJig 0.5a in english and german. I'll do this in htm and php and zip it to a file with all pics. So you can easier upload them to rejig.org, if it is OK. Previewing will be on my page www.dvdrpage.dl.am :sly:

JvD

15th December 2003, 10:45

My first test on 0.5

1. Nice interface Nic, i like it.
2. I tried backing up (DVD Backup feature) Magolia (appr 3h long) and it ran fine from start to end. BUT the result was only a half movie (second half). Whay! The compression levels is around 61%.
3. I would like the possibility to deside where to put the files, not only a final dest folder but also a mux folder, etc. If you have many disks (at least two) you can speed up the process alot. One folder for temp, and one muxed and one for authored. Maybe? I thought abot it before using the Ifo-mode but now also in the backup mode.

Nic

15th December 2003, 11:08

@JVD: Do you have your drive as NTFS ? I can't think why you only got part of the film. I'll put an advanced settings button in the DVD backup (I meant to, you'll be able to pick the engine, whether to keep the muxed files, etc)

@Amnon82: I've tried with PAL DVDs, Tried multiple subs and it worked fine...maybe I broke something before the release, Ill test more DVDs today and tomorrow if I find the time.

Cheers,
-Nic

JvD

15th December 2003, 11:23

@Nic: Yeah, all my disks are NTFS.
The same happens in Ifo-mode (as expected).

EDIT: A clue, the m2v-file is created, compressed at the right ratio, its in the authoring part its happens something.

jj59

15th December 2003, 11:31

Nic, thanks a lot for the great tool,
but shouldn’t supmux set the P-STD buffer info in the first spupack of a vob?
Something like
PES_extension_flag is 1.
P-STD_buffer_flag is 1.
P_STD_buffer_scale value is 1.
P_STD_buffer_size value is 58.

Amnon82

15th December 2003, 11:34

Maybe this helps You Nic to solve the sub-problem:

I created a REJIGTESTDVD with with a Scene of Die Hard 2. There are the subs different on time. So i got out, that the german and the english one is joint to one sub. Crazy it is... I can read a mix of ENGLDEUTSCH...

On this short DVD it is all sync... don't know why not also on the last DVD I tested with Rejig 0.5a...:confused:

Originally posted by Nic ...maybe I broke something before the release

Can I have the pre-release of 0.5a, or did You killed this version?

Nic

15th December 2003, 11:51

Damn it! Spotted a bug (that I introduced just before releasing), It makes all the subtitle streams have the same Stream ID (i.e. all 0xbd 0x20)...Hence only one subtitle stream is being used. 0.5b will be out tonight....

@jj59: Hmmm, interesting, maybe I should be and don't know it. Have you a link to more information on that?

-Nic

dragongodz

15th December 2003, 11:54

E-male - did you use new engine or old(through registry setting) ? Rejig 0.5 contains a bit more tweaking from mod3 for both but i only ran quality tests on the new engine since the change i did to old where small. my tweaks to new engine compared to mod versions and Makira original new all scored slightly higher PSNR and SSIM. still needs tightening though.

Amnon82

15th December 2003, 12:16

I up now a short cutout of Die Hard 2. I rejiged it with 3% for space!
Nic, look at the subs. The first one is german. The second ins english but don't workring! Plus the german one is mixedup with the english...

I rejiged it with Your original 0.5a version...

Download REJIG TEST ENCODE (http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/files/REJIGTESTENC.exe):sly:

by Nic: Damn it! Spotted a bug (that I introduced just before releasing), It makes all the subtitle streams have the same Stream ID (i.e. all 0xbd 0x20)...Hence only one subtitle stream is being used. 0.5b will be out tonight....

K, then I fix it with IFOEdit and take again a look on my test enc...

Q: Why are the subs in my encode blue?

Nic

15th December 2003, 12:28

"The second ins english but don't workring! Plus the german one is mixedup with the english..." That is caused by the bug I mention...all the subs are getting mixed into one stream. Will be fixed tonight

The subs are blue? If that's because you muxed in IFOEdit, you need to copy the colors from the original IFO to your new IFO. The Doom9 IFOEdit authoring guide explains it better...
(However, ReJig automatically copies the colors for you at the end of the encode :) )

-Nic

Amnon82

15th December 2003, 12:46

NO ERRRKKK! I muxed it with YOUR DVD Author and got blue subs!

If I'd muxed in IFOEdit all will be fine ...

... waiting for the bugfix ...

... writing now the guide:sly:

Nic

15th December 2003, 13:10

@Amnon82: You need to give me more info. Did you supply the original IFO when using my DVD Author and tell it to copy from the correct PGC?

-Nic

jj59

15th December 2003, 13:12

Nic, just checked with vobedit on a couple of streams.
it seems to be used for all first packs of a vob, video, audio or spu
P_STD_buffer_size value
Video seems to be 232 (even for MPEG-1)
Private_stream_1 (AC3, DTS, LPCM and Spu) is 58.
You could get the source of submux-dvd 0.5 at Jan Panteltje’s dvdpage which includes the values for spu and works fine on soft- and hardwareplayers.
http://home.zonnet.nl/panteltje/dvd/

Nic

15th December 2003, 13:16

Cheers jj, I dont think it's causing a problem at the moment, but I guess it might with some players...Ill try to add that in.

Amnon82

15th December 2003, 13:43

ReJig 0.5 Guide now online ...

Started a new thread for my guide ReJig Guide Thread (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=66827):sly:

@ Nic: Read my new guide. I only entered the paths of M2V, the AC3 files, the subs, the output directory and hit 'Create'. 'Copy Colours'-Function was not available... I can't enter the path to the original IFO. The '.'-button has no function.

E-Male

15th December 2003, 15:39

@dragongodz:
My regkey is still set to the old engine
on my next tests I'll compare both engines against each other

robot1

15th December 2003, 17:55

Nic,
great work.
I tried DVD Backup mode, and it crashes as soon as i click "Open" in the "Open DVD source" dialog box.
I was testing The Matrix (R2, with White rabbit feature"). I tested also an other dvd without problem.
Is it due to the structure of the film (DVDshrink reported 37 titles)

Bye

mrbass

15th December 2003, 19:19

no rush ...but if possible allow angle support. Tried 'Spirited Away' and it picked the angle where it shows just the drawing board of the whole movie. Not sure if subs were in synch or not..too hard to tell. Looks great...total time was 38mins from start to finish.

rakaz

15th December 2003, 20:02

I think I found a problem with the labeling of the audio tracks in IFO mode and DVD backup mode. I am using Buffy Season 1 Disk 1 DVD to test.

It lists three audio streams in VTS_01, PGC 0:
0x80 - Audio - AC3 / 2ch / Francais
0x81 - Audio - AC3 / 2ch / Francais
0x82 - Audio - AC3 / 2ch / English

The problem is that 0x80 is not Francais but English. The way IfoEdit lists it is as follows:

Audio 1: English (Dolby AC-3) 2ch 44Kbps DRC (ID: 0x80)
Audio 2: Francais (Dolby AC-3) 2ch 44Kbps DRC (ID: 0x81,0x80)
Audio 3: English (Dolby AC-3) 2ch 44Kbps DRC (ID: 0x82)

robot1

15th December 2003, 20:48

I did a backup of Matrix Reloaded, for testing pourpose.
Speed was great.
I often notice pixellation in high motion scenes.
I used the default (new) enginem, with a ratio of about 75%
Mich

Fabiano

16th December 2003, 00:17

Hi,

I've been looking for a few days how the requant engine works, and I have a few comments how we could get more quality from it.

To compare quality I'm using an AviSynth Script:
LoadPlugin("MPEG2Dec3.dll")
source=MPEG2Source("original.d2v")
test=MPEG2Source("rejiged.d2v")
test=converttoYUY2(test)
source=converttoYUY2(source)
compare(source,test,"","result.txt")

The video file (m2v) I'm using is The Terminator 3 Trailer in HDTV (1280x720p). Using the "new engine" (ReQuant.cpp) from Rejig 5.0a at 90% I have that output from AviSynth:
-----------------------------------------------------------
Filesize: 16377kb (original 18245kb)
Total frames processed: 602

Minimum Average Maximum
Mean Absolute Deviation: 0.0000 0.2796 1.7377
Mean Deviation: -0.3827 -0.0085 +0.1803
PSNR: 38.4123 56.0047 110.7865
Overall PSNR: 51.5328
-----------------------------------------------------------

Now, using a mod version of the ReQuant.cpp that only slightly recompress B-frames:

@ReEncode
if (ID == 0x00) // pic header
{
LOCK(4)
picture_coding_type = (cbuf[1] >> 3) & 0x7;
if (picture_coding_type < 1 || picture_coding_type > 3)
{
DEBF("illegal picture_coding_type: %i\n", picture_coding_type);
validPicHeader = 0;
}
else
{
validPicHeader = 1;
cbuf[1] |= 0x7; cbuf[2] = 0xFF; cbuf[3] |= 0xF8; // vbv_delay is now 0xFFFF
}

//by Fabiano (just recompress B-frames)
switch(picture_coding_type)
{
case I_TYPE:
case P_TYPE:
validPicHeader = 0;
break;
case B_TYPE:
break;
}

COPY(4)
}
else if (ID == 0xB3) // seq header

@getNewQuant
case B_TYPE:
//by Fabiano
//if curQuant is 7,8,10,12,... it doesn't recompress
if (curQuant >= 7) // only for 90% compression
mquant = curQuant;
else
{
int mquant2;
mquant2 = increment_quant(increment_quant(curQuant));

// ReQuant original mquant calculation
mquant = intmax(scale_quant(curQuant + 80*stress_factor), increment_quant(curQuant));

// lock mquant to a maximum of 2 increments
mquant = intmin(mquant, mquant2);
}
break;

I get that output from AviSynth (Rejig re-compression factor of 90%):
-----------------------------------------------------------
Filesize: 16425kb (original 18245kb)
Total frames processed: 602

Minimum Average Maximum
Mean Absolute Deviation: 0.0000 0.0663 0.3307
Mean Deviation: -0.1709 -0.0153 +0.0493
PSNR: 52.1587 79.6029 110.7865
Overall PSNR: 64.7286
-----------------------------------------------------------

It is very easy to see an improvement in quality. And by not compressing I and P-frames, there isn't error propagation over subsequent frames.

Of course, not compressing I and P-frames means staying at compression factor around 90%, otherwise the remaining B-frames have to be highly compressed to compensate that.

I think the best way of having higher quality output from ReQuant, would be select what kind of frames to compress based on the re-compression factor, let's say, for example:
  factor 100%-90% -> slightly compress B-frames;
  factor 90%-75% -> slightly compress P-frames + compress B-frames;
  factor 75%-66% -> compress P-frames + compress B-frames;
  factor 66%-down-> compress all frame types;
DVDShrink uses something like that, if I'm not wrong....

I also noticed that the last 5% of the file does not get compressed, and the 2 first gops get too much compression. I have to test more files, but so far, it seems to me the code controlling the compression level per frame is responding too fast for variations in how much compression is needed.

I'm still figuring out how the compression control code really works.
Until then that is my 2 cents.

pv110

16th December 2003, 03:03

Hello people,

This goes back to my first post on page 1. I just wanted to know a different view of this app. that's all. I know this app is on the beta stage and I really wish them good luck on it :D. It seems promising and powerful once they get it done. It'd be more power to us (users).

dragongodz

16th December 2003, 04:21

Fabiano - i have to agree and disagree. :)

i actually think reaction time of the new engine is too slow. it allows falling behind of target bitrate for quite a bit before reacting. then it has to work hard to make it up. if i can tighten that up to react sooner then both B frame and P frame requant amounts can be lowered to give a smoother more consistant and constant change. as it is the new engine over compresses then under compresses then has to over compress to catch back up etc etc etc. B frame have the highest burden in this of course but if reaction times can be lowered then P frames can also take some of that pressure away allowing better B frames.
so yes you are right for very small recompression just B frames would look better but the moment you get higher then B frames are really going to suffer and cause blocking. try the old engine and see what happens when only small amount is done to P frames(use something like 70% compression) and B frames get hit the most, the version in rejig has tighter reaction so i think is better than the original which blocked very badly.

you can also do SSIM tests with

LoadPlugin("MPEG2Dec3.dll")
LoadPlugin("ssim.dll")
source=MPEG2Source("g:\test\original.d2v")
test=MPEG2Source("g:\test\test.d2v")
ssim(source,test,"ssim-test.cvs","simm-test.txt",lumimask=false)

up to you if you want lumimask true or false. the .txt gives you the overall and .cvs shows all frames. more info can be found in the avisynth forum.

as for engine ideas check out the old rejig thread and i say several ways to get better quality etc but the current engine would need some major rewriting to make some of those changes.

dragongodz

16th December 2003, 05:54

Fabiano - ok i went away and had a good think about this and came up with a few ideas.

first the example given as you say is no good for higher compression levels as is. it can also be bad for lower restricting only upping quants if above 7. dark or static films can have B frames with higher quants than that naturally but they would not be upped when they actaully could be. bad for correct resizing.
a better idea would be a ratio/scale for processing done per frame type per compression ratio with no limit on what the original quant was. this should increase quality at lower compression levels while maintaing some accuracy for higher compression amounts. i will look at implamenting something like that in the next day or 2.

Nic

16th December 2003, 10:44

http://nic.dnsalias.com/ReJig.zip
http://nic.dnsalias.com/ReJig_src.zip (Sourcecode)

Only a very minor update:
1) Now puts the Subs into their own streams (so they aren't all added into 0xbd 0x20)
2) Fabiano's fix for his HDTV streams
3) Fixed minor bug that could crash file mode
4) Made the '.' button for the original IFO in DVD Author mode do something ;)

Ill look at the other issues & features mentioned soon.
i.e.
1) Crashing on Matrix
2) Add Angle support
3) Better Transport Stream support
4) Improved IFO parsing
5) Find out why subs might be out of sync (Tried three other DVDs last night (Xmen2, fist full of dollars and gangs of new york...all worked fine)

I don't want to ask for donations as you know, but if anyone has any duplicates of DVDs they don't need that dont work with ReJig. Id appreciate them, as it's working fine with my DVD collection so far...
:(

-Nic

ps
Just now re-uploaded it, now compiled with Intel Compiler 8.0 so should be a little quicker...

E-Male

16th December 2003, 11:36

when you get to angle support, could you first add an option that allows choosing what video from the disc to use (atm rejig seems to pick hte longest one automatically)

and about non working DVDs: i could rip the ifo plus the first chaper as vob with dvddecrypter and send it to you, might help you find something
of course only if this is ok lawwise

edit: i'll also plan to do some more test, but x-mas might come into the way

bill_baroud

16th December 2003, 12:18

5) Find out why subs might be out of sync (Tried three other DVDs last night (Xmen2, fist full of dollars and gangs of new york...all worked fine)

I just encounter problems with subs, with an NTSC movie. When rejig encode a m2v stream (ifo mode), the output m2v is non-drop frame. The problem is that Maestro care about ndf/df m2v stream to calculate timestamp for subtitle, and SubRip output drop frame subtitle by default.
Well it's a problem particular to Maestro (or so it seems), but i tried :

non-drop frame video (rejig) + non-drop frame SubRip : not synched (i suspect subrip & maestro here)
non-drop frame video (rejig) + drop frame Subrip : not synched
drop frame video (rejig & pulldown -nopulldown -drop_frame true) + drop frame SubRip : still waiting muxing

a topic about it is here : http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=54620&highlight=Maestro+subtitle

Perhaps the desynching issue of subtitles is due to something similar ?

E-Male

16th December 2003, 12:22

well, my problem (subs ~5secs to late) was on a pal disc ("M", uk)
also the subs in this case seem to be all euqally to late

so this might be 2 different problems

Logiqx

16th December 2003, 13:01

Along the same lines as rakaz, I have just been playing with v0.5b and the PAL version of Rock Star [the only DVD that I could find here in the office ;)]. The IFO parsing says that stream 0x80 is Italian but it should actually show up as English (as reported by DVDDecrypter).

I have uploaded the IFO for you but you may need to open it in a fresh browser window (cross-linking is not allowed by my hosts):

[edited out link...no IFOs..read stickies]

Logiqx

Nic

16th December 2003, 13:09

Thanks alot Logiqx...That will help lots :) I've told maven his IFO Parsing doesn't work, but he doesn't seem to bothered about fixing it for now. Ill fix is ASAP (I hope ;) ).

Edit: Ok, managed to fix that, will report correctly in next release.

Logiqx

16th December 2003, 14:17

Thanks Nic.

bill_baroud

16th December 2003, 15:05

Result of my post above :

drop frame video (rejig & pulldown -nopulldown -drop_frame true) + drop frame SubRip : sub are synched \o/

So Nic, a little request, could you please add a check box "Drop frame" when encoding ? it would speed a little the processus ;) and should be less space demanding (since pulldown create another m2v).

Well i have absolutly no clue if this feature is hard to implement.

And a big big thanks for your great tool :)

Nic

16th December 2003, 15:19

@bill: Would you be up for testing a beta of the tool? As far as I can see it's very easy to implement (ive already implemented it). I just have to turn on the first bit of the GOP header (the drop frame bit). So if you want to test a version that does this let me know...

bill_baroud

16th December 2003, 15:45

Ok thanks :)

I couldn't resist, and deleted my previous working file to test with the beta :D

EDIT : Ok, at first glance, looks like it worked, Maestro show the timestamp with a ";" (00:01:59:08;28) instead of ":", so it detected the drop frame flag correctly. Now i should test by muxing, but i've to work more on subtitles before that. Should be ok, thought.

mmgrover

16th December 2003, 19:18

I put 0.5b on the web site :-)

mike

2COOL

17th December 2003, 02:54

@mmgrover

You're doing a superb job with www.rejig.org but is it possible to add more information on the news page as what was fixed or still buggy? It's for people coming unto the scene looking to see a sort of a summary on how ReJig's progress is developing. Just needed more than a "released" comment.;)

News:

(12/16/03) Nic has released version 0.5b.
(12/14/03) Nic has released version 0.5a.
(12/04/03) dragongodz has released version 0.4i-mod3.
(11/26/03) Nic has released version 0.4i.
(11/26/03) Mike has released version 0.4h.
(11/26/03) Nic has released version 0.4g.
(11/22/03) Nic has released version 0.4e.
(11/22/03) Nic has released version 0.4d.
(11/21/03) Nic has released version 0.4c.
(11/05/03) Nic has released version 0.4a.
(11/04/03) A small bug with the file open dialog under Win 98 fixed.
(11/04/03) Downloadable setup version avaiable.
(11/04/03) New Enhancements added to web site, Check them out.
(11/03/03) Nic is under the weather, Let's wish him a speedy recovery!

buzzqw

17th December 2003, 08:17

hi all
i reathored (ifo mode : 2 pass/adjust audio delay/convert sub/automatic authoring) a dvd with rejig 0.5, but subtitle come out green.
so i copy/paste color with ifoedit and all is ok.

Thanks

BHH

2COOL

17th December 2003, 08:34

@buzzqw

Originally posted by buzzqw
hi all
i reathored (ifo mode : 2 pass/adjust audio delay/convert sub/automatic authoring) a dvd with rejig 0.5, but subtitle come out green.
so i copy/paste color with ifoedit and all is ok.

Were you doing PAL or NTSC?

buzzqw

17th December 2003, 13:06

pal dvd

Thanks (not a big problem , i am just learning ifoedit...)

BHH

Amnon82

17th December 2003, 22:53

Sers Nic and All...

Had anybody made a backup of Matrix? (The Matrix - The first movie...).
I've the White Rabit Edition with 37 titles!!! The main-movie is title 1,6-15 (told by DVDShrink...).

ReJig sucks in IFO- and DVD Backup Mode!!!:angry:

So what to do? ... here the original IFOs and BUPs out of the original DVD. [edited out link by moderator...read stickies please] Download IFOs and BUPS of Matrix 1 GER [/URL] (Nic, I think this helps alot...)

In File Mode I can select the one title and work so with it.

Onby: The authormode is TTTTTOOOOOOOO slow!!!! First it muxs the M2V and the AC3s to VOB, than it muxes the Subs into it, and than splitts it to VTS_01.VOB etc. ... take about 45 min or so on my Athlon 2800+ SATA Machine!!!!! IFOEdit did it in 8 Min for the same JOB!!!!!

It seems: It is lot work to do on this part...

Bug: Blue Subs: In Intervideo WinDVD 5.0 they are blue. in PowerDVD white ...

daddy_fizz

17th December 2003, 23:30

i'm not a stickler for rules or anything, but i would watch out, if you read the forum rules, you are not supposed to post ifo files, etc...

just trying to save you some trouble

~Fizz

mmgrover

17th December 2003, 23:35

@2COOL

I'll see if I can get with Nic to Display More Info
On news page

mike

Nic

17th December 2003, 23:55

@Amnon82: Here's a clue. If your just going to badmouth and say things suck, dont use the software and dont post in this thread again. Thanks.

@mmgrover: Shout me for any info you need. Hopefully Ill have more time over Christmas to write more docs. Really have to get round to writing the basis of 0.6 soon too :)

-Nic

MackemX

18th December 2003, 00:18

Originally posted by Amnon82

ReJig sucks in IFO- and DVD Backup Mode!!!:angry:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=59607

Nic

18th December 2003, 00:25

Well,

http://nic.dnsalias.com/ReJig.zip
http://nic.dnsalias.com/ReJig_src.zip

Even if Amnon82 presented the information badly, and really shouldn't have posted those IFOs, they did help ;)

Changes:

IFO mode can handle lots of data now (I had a 25k buffer for handling debugoutput text, which I thought was plenty big enough, but overflowed.doh..bad coding practice ;) )

Auto DVD Author in IFO Mode adds the correct colours from the original IFO now.

Can now set the Engine Mode, Drop Frame Flag from a settings menu.
(ask bill_baroud about the Drop Frame Flag, I don't really understand why it's sometimes necessary ;) )

Horribly done buttons ;) (will change for next release or so, with multiple language support and proper drawing rather than BMP)

Minor Bug Fixes...

Cheers,
-Nic

Makira

18th December 2003, 01:47

I took a day to improve the engine. Made a lot of changes, I won't enumerate them. The gain is anywhere between 1 to 3 db, compared to previous version (v1.2.1 from dvdremaster). The gain is biggest when compression factor is small.

#orig file size was 98948919 bytes, 7 samples from 7 different movies concatenated
ver factor nb_of_frame avg_mse avg_psnr med_mse med_psnr worst_mse worst_psnrfilesize size_error_mb
old 1.1 3401 2.67 43.87 0.82 48.98 436.19 21.73 89236584 0.68
old 1.3 3401 4.82 41.30 2.10 44.92 517.39 20.99 75818864 0.28
old 1.5 3401 6.19 40.22 2.91 43.49 581.10 20.49 65965036 0.00
old 1.7 3401 7.29 39.50 3.63 42.54 594.76 20.39 58204280 0.00
old 2 3401 8.74 38.72 4.60 41.50 687.77 19.76 49474956 0.00
old 2.3 3401 10.98 37.73 6.29 40.14 710.17 19.62 43226312 -0.20
old 3 3401 15.32 36.28 10.47 37.93 839.61 18.89 36116936 -2.99
old 4 3401 15.88 36.12 10.48 37.93 915.26 18.52 35975016 -10.72
new 1.1 3401 1.30 46.99 0.47 51.44 49.71 31.17 89543000 0.39
new 1.3 3401 2.74 43.76 1.21 47.29 256.50 24.04 76114032 0.00
new 1.5 3401 4.29 41.81 2.34 44.44 279.15 23.67 65965448 0.00
new 1.7 3401 5.42 40.79 3.03 43.31 310.03 23.22 58204868 0.00
new 2 3401 6.83 39.78 4.05 42.06 484.34 21.28 49474080 0.00
new 2.3 3401 8.01 39.09 5.01 41.13 346.86 22.73 43182364 -0.15
new 3 3401 10.34 37.99 6.41 40.06 817.84 19.00 33080416 -0.09
new 4 3401 13.29 36.90 8.87 38.65 870.76 18.73 25623704 -0.85
diff 0 0 -1.37 3.13 -0.36 2.47 -386.48 9.43 306416 -0.29
diff 0 0 -2.08 2.46 -0.88 2.38 -260.89 3.05 295168 -0.28
diff 0 0 -1.90 1.59 -0.57 0.95 -301.95 3.18 412 0.00
diff 0 0 -1.87 1.29 -0.59 0.77 -284.72 2.83 588 0.00
diff 0 0 -1.90 1.07 -0.55 0.56 -203.43 1.52 -876 0.00
diff 0 0 -2.96 1.37 -1.28 0.99 -363.31 3.11 -43948 0.04
diff 0 0 -4.99 1.71 -4.06 2.13 -21.77 0.11 -3036520 2.90
diff 0 0 -2.59 0.77 -1.60 0.72 -44.50 0.22 -10351312 9.87

You can get it at http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/m2vrequant_171203.tgz

Now all tweakable variables are at the top. I've made a statistical test (which took about 24 hours for 432 samples), and hand picked some preset, them compared to previous version, and got the above table.

Have fun!

This is the basis for dvdremaster v1.2.2, which isn't yet released. I thought I could share the improvements, and perhaps use some feedback before making a release. Also, note the new version doesn't make a big error on filesize like the old, and that the worst psnr is 9 (!) db better with new version at factor 1.1.

Makira

18th December 2003, 02:06

best thing is, it's slightly faster:

makira% cat ori.m2v > /dev/null ; time ./old 2.0 0 98948919 ori.m2v /dev/null ; \
cat ori.m2v > /dev/null ; time ./new 2.0 0 98948919 ori.m2v /dev/null ;
M2VRequantiser by Makira.
Using 2.000000 as factor, 98948919 as m2v size.
11.020u 1.270s 0:12.60 97.5% 0+0k 0+1io 0pf+0w
M2VRequantiser by Makira.
Using 2.000000 as factor, 98948919 as m2v size.
10.100u 1.220s 0:11.60 97.5% 0+0k 0+0io 0pf+0w

12.6/11.6 - 1 = 0,08 = 8% gain

mmgrover

18th December 2003, 04:04

@Nic and all

I posted 0.5c to web site and added a changelog :-)

Let me know if this works for everybody?

mike

@Makira

Thanks for posting changes, Your work is very appreciated!

ReJig Team....

E-Male

18th December 2003, 04:11

OK, tried M again (pal)
rejig 0.5c, new engine

took ~63 minutes, picture qualiyt was good, considering the dificult source (comparing from memory better then my last try)

subs still are ~4sec to late (constantly)
and second audio is still default

Nic

18th December 2003, 09:56

@Makira: Thanks loads for the support. Ill put that into a 0.5d release later today, time allowing.

@E-Male: Thanks for your testing, Im out xmas shopping today, and If I see M ill buy it so I can fix the problem. Cheers.

-Nic

DDogg

18th December 2003, 15:48

Nic, I think it admirable that you don't take donations, however it upsets me to think of you actually spending money to fix/find a problem for your free work. Might I suggest you set up an Amazon wish list with dvds and other stuff you need for testing? An example is the wishlist page (http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/wishlist/27RJ4XCOKJ78Q/ref=wl_em_to) dvd2svcd uses. You could do something similar with all the books and test DVDs you might need for this wonderful project. That's not even a donation, it is just the stuff you should not need to spend *your* money on in order to continue this project.

Fabiano

18th December 2003, 17:27

@NIC: I was looking at your last release v0.5c, and found that the hack I've posted is not the one I should had. Completely removing the if clause is not a very wise thing to do, because it could lead invalid data to be used by ReQuant. Here is a better version of the hack:else if (ID == 0xB3) // seq header
{
LOCK(8)
horizontal_size_value = (cbuf[0] << 4) | (cbuf[1] >> 4);
vertical_size_value = ((cbuf[1] & 0xF) << 8) | cbuf[2];
// NICK: Hack to allow HDTV, not good. But good find by Fabiano :)
if ((horizontal_size_value & 0xF) || (vertical_size_value & 0xF))
/* || horizontal_size_value > 720 || horizontal_size_value < 352
|| vertical_size_value > 576 || vertical_size_value < 480) */
{
DEBF("illegal size, hori: %i verti: %i\n", horizontal_size_value, vertical_size_value);
validSeqHeader = 0;
}
else
{
validSeqHeader = 1;
}
COPY(8)
}
else if (ID == 0xB5) // extension

Sorry about that, I should have thought about it at the first time... :o

bill_baroud

18th December 2003, 19:06

(ask bill_baroud about the Drop Frame Flag, I don't really understand why it's sometimes necessary )

It's necessary to synch subs and video when you use Maestro with a ntsc movie, because the timestamps are not calculated the same.

running the rejig ouput's m2v throught "pulldown -nopulldown -drop_frame true" is the same, but to have the option in Rejig is definitly a major plus, speed & space wise :)

2COOL

18th December 2003, 19:36

Can anyone who does File Mode, test out this guide (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?threadid=66964) I put out in the IFO/VOB Editors forum? Just wanted to see if it works for others too.

Also, can anyone tell me how to get more accurate muxed sizes with the .m2v files ReJig created? I've pretty much been trialing and erroring.

ffroms

18th December 2003, 20:16

I've done something like you wrote. I've used VobEdit to see audio delay and it was 0 but ReJig found delay -60ms. Anyway I rejig the main movie (using file mode) and remux it back with IfoEdit (VobEdit gave me nothing but trouble) and done Get VTS and corrected VOB and IFO through Vob Extras. Everything went well (no audio or sub delay).
To calculate percentage I've used DVDShrink(?) 'couse I already shrunk everything else to right size. I've set everything to No Compression except main movie and look what percent he gave me and used on rejig and final size was off by 20MB (smaller) :D .
The movie was Matrix and I've used ReJig 0.5b

FFS

2COOL

18th December 2003, 20:36

Originally posted by ffroms
I've used VobEdit to see audio delay and it was 0 but ReJig found delay -60ms. Hmmm...maybe a bug? What version were you using and what DVD?

A lot of versions has gone by so is it just me? or no one sees that the Stream IDs in File Mode's Stream List are wrong. Audio has subtitle stream Ids and vice versa. And another note is that all the correct Sub stream IDs are the same for all subs detected. Nic?
Anyway I rejig the main movie (using file mode) and remux it back with IfoEdit (VobEdit gave me nothing but trouble) and done Get VTS and corrected VOB and IFO through Vob Extras. Everything went well (no audio or sub delay).I wouldn't have written the guide as it is if I didn't have any problems with delayed streams. I've pretty much put alot of testing time remuxing m2vs into delayed VOBs only to come up with bad sync.:( Maybe it's because that I'm doing NTSC and you are doing PAL? Just a theory.
To calculate percentage I've used DVDShrink(?) 'couse I already shrunk everything else to right size. I've set everything to No Compression except main movie and look what percent he gave me and used on rejig and final size was off by 20MB (smaller) :D .
The movie was Matrix and I've used ReJig 0.5bI thought about doing that too but I was looking to cut down on backup time and using less hard disk space. Edit: I brainfarted. I was assuming you went ahead and transcoded with DVD Shrink but remembered that I can set the %s prior to without actually starting the process.

I know there's someone out there who's good with math, knowledgable in VOB parsing for stream sizes, and programming could come up with a tool to guesstimate muxed sizes.

E-Male

18th December 2003, 20:44

OK, another test:

DVD: Natural Born Killers pal rc2 german laser-paradise deluxe

Program/Options: rejig 0.5c, new engine, dvd backup

Results:

Picture Quality: mostly just fine, only in the grainy scenes the trancoding was noticable, but again i think it's good enough for TV and overall a good result

Authoring: Just fine, rejig wasn't troubled by the strange (bad?) authoring of the source disc

Problems:
1) minor: second audio is still default
2) sync issue: the 2nd last subtitle (german, for the audio commentary) goes out of sync at a lil after half of the movie, it then is too early, i can't tell if it's then continously or getting more out of sync
sub 1, 2 & 3 (german, german, english) are in sync all through

ffroms

18th December 2003, 21:15

Originally posted by 2COOL
Hmmm...maybe a bug? What version were you using and what DVD?

Actually, read in previous posts (old thread) that VobEdit have bug and sometime don't report delay but that is fixed with ReJig. I've tried with DVD2AVI to get audio delay and it was -60ms.

A lot of versions has gone by so is it just me? or no one sees that the Stream IDs in File Mode's Stream List are wrong. Audio has subtitle Ids and vice versa. Nic?

Haven't notice that 'couse I only needed ReJig for movie and didn't use demux option

[b]I wouldn't have written the guide as it is if I didn't have any problems with delayed streams. I've pretty much put alot of testing time remuxing m2vs into delayed VOBs only to come up with bad sync.:( Maybe it's because that I'm doing NTSC and you are doing PAL? Just a theory.

You could be right. Mine is PAL version of Matrix.

[b]I thought about doing that too but I was looking to cut down on backup time and using less hard disk space. I know there's someone out there who's good with math, knowledgable in VOB parsing for stream sizes, and programming could come up with a tool to guesstimate muxed sizes.

I had some problems when remuxing DVD menu so I use DVDShrink to shrink extra parts (that I want to keep) and keep movie with no compression. Than I see how much movie is oversized and calculate percentage manually (simple division of numbers).

FFS

unixfs

19th December 2003, 08:59

Makira, your new version makes wonders!!

It took 20 minutes to encode a 8.7 GB movie (on linux using fifos) and it compressed down well to 25% (I'm still testing how much more it can compress, but surely the 33% barrier is broken).

Overall quality (at least with my movie) is better now at 25% than it was previously at 33%: blocks are fewer and less evident.

Marvellous :)

unixfs

19th December 2003, 10:24

update:
I could compress at 1 / 7.4, so the new lowest threshold seems to be 13.5 %.
Images wer terrible to look at, as expected.

E-Male

19th December 2003, 21:06

ok, bug report time again

Eagles - hell freezes over:
rejigs dvd backup crashes after the 2nd pass

katjarella

19th December 2003, 22:43

Hello Nic, can't ReJig into the DVDAuthor import mode LPCM?

The multiplex is more better than with IfoEdit. Multiplex Test@Doom9German (http://forum.gleitz.de/showthread.php?t=8035).

Thanks for the beautiful program !!!!

2COOL

19th December 2003, 22:50

It was kinda hard to read since it was in German so I ran it through Google. Here's the translated post (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fforum.gleitz.de%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D8035&langpair=de%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=%2Flanguage_tools)

E-Male

19th December 2003, 23:00

no PCM?
might cause my crash with the Eagles DVD

Nic

19th December 2003, 23:16

Ahhh, ok. Got a tricky dvd that uses LPCM (a Dave Gilmour one :) ). Ill fix that now and then release 0.5d. 0.5d will just have makira's new engine in as the main change.

Cheers,
-Nic

ps
@E-Male: check your PMs :)

E-Male

19th December 2003, 23:46

(checked&replied)

ok, tried the Eagles again without the pcm track and it's multiplexing now, so that was the source of the crash

Amnon82

20th December 2003, 09:28

by Nic Even if Amnon82 presented the information badly, and really shouldn't have posted those IFOs, they did help

Sorry, if it was to "hard" ... ReJig is the best freeware I've seen!!!!:sly:

Sometimes it s+++ks, cos it is still beta, BUT YOU and other guys here fix it REALY quick! Compliment!

I still use this USEFULL software! ... and download every version!

Why should I write guides for it? I LIKE this software!

And I still translate it into german!:devil:

Amnon82

20th December 2003, 09:48

... I just authored 2 DVDs with IFOEdit 0.96. Now I multiplex my CCE M2V with rejig 0.5c to see what happend ...

Original IFO (Matrix 2) VTS overview:

Menu attributes:
Video: MPEG-2 720x576 (PAL) (PAL 625/50) (16:9) (pan-scan)
Audio 1: Not Specified (Dolby AC-3) 2ch 48Kbps DRC
SubPicture 1: Not Specified (2-bit rle )

Title Set (Movie) attributes:
Video: MPEG-2 720x576 (PAL) (PAL 625/50) (16:9) (letterboxed)
Audio 1: English (Dolby AC-3) 6ch 48Kbps DRC (ID: 0x80)
Audio 2: Deutsch (Dolby AC-3) 6ch 48Kbps DRC (ID: 0x81)
SubPicture 1: English (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x20)
SubPicture 2: Deutsch (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x21,0x20)
SubPicture 3: Svenska (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x22,0x20)
SubPicture 4: Norsk (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x23,0x20)
SubPicture 5: Dansk (Danish) (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x24,0x20)
SubPicture 6: Suomi (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x25,0x20)
SubPicture 7: Islenska(Icelandic) (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x26,0x20)
SubPicture 8: English (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x27,0x20)
SubPicture 9: Deutsch (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x28,0x20)

PGC_1 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 1] [02:12:38.00 / 25 fps] (Programs: 36) (Cells: 37) (uses VOB-IDs: 1,2)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 1/ 1] : time: 00:03:42.21 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:03:42.21] [Frames: 5571] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]
[Ch 02] [Pg 02] [Cell 02] [V/C Id: 1/ 2] : time: 00:04:52.19 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:08:35.15] [Frames: 12890] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 03] [Pg 03] [Cell 03] [V/C Id: 1/ 3] : time: 00:03:13.00 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:11:48.15] [Frames: 17715] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 04] [Pg 04] [Cell 04] [V/C Id: 1/ 4] : time: 00:03:57.13 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:15:46.03] [Frames: 23653] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 05] [Pg 05] [Cell 05] [V/C Id: 1/ 5] : time: 00:03:10.17 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:18:56.20] [Frames: 28420] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 06] [Pg 06] [Cell 06] [V/C Id: 1/ 6] : time: 00:03:36.24 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:22:33.19] [Frames: 33844] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 07] [Pg 07] [Cell 07] [V/C Id: 1/ 7] : time: 00:03:47.16 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:26:21.10] [Frames: 39535] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 08] [Pg 08] [Cell 08] [V/C Id: 1/ 8] : time: 00:04:23.06 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:30:44.16] [Frames: 46116] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 09] [Pg 09] [Cell 09] [V/C Id: 1/ 9] : time: 00:01:37.21 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:32:22.12] [Frames: 48562] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 10] [Pg 10] [Cell 10] [V/C Id: 1/10] : time: 00:04:03.16 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:36:26.03] [Frames: 54653] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
cutted of the ch 11 - 37

PGC_2 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 2] [00:00:09.17 / 25 fps] (Programs: 1) (Cells: 1) (uses VOB-IDs: 3)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 3/ 1] : time: 00:00:09.17 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:00:09.17] [Frames: 242] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]

Menu Language Units: 2
Language Menu Unit 1: [English]
Language Menu Unit 2: [Deutsch]

Multipexed IFO by IFOEdit 0.96 (Matrix 2) VTS overview:

Menu attributes:
Video: MPEG-2 720x576 (PAL) (PAL 625/50) (16:9) (letterboxed)

Title Set (Movie) attributes:
Video: MPEG-2 720x576 (PAL) (PAL 625/50) (16:9) (letterboxed)
Audio 1: English (Dolby AC-3) 6ch 48Kbps DRC (ID: 0x80)
Audio 2: Deutsch (Dolby AC-3) 6ch 48Kbps DRC (ID: 0x81)
SubPicture 1: English (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x20)
SubPicture 2: Deutsch (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x21)
SubPicture 3: Svenska (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x22)
SubPicture 4: Norsk (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x23)
SubPicture 5: Dansk (Danish) (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x24)
SubPicture 6: Suomi (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x25)
SubPicture 7: Islenska(Icelandic) (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x26)
SubPicture 8: English (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x27)
SubPicture 9: Deutsch (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x28)

PGC_1 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 1] [02:12:47.12 / 25 fps] (Programs: 37) (Cells: 37) (uses VOB-IDs: 1)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 1/ 1] : time: 00:03:43.06 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:03:43.06] [Frames: 5581] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]
[Ch 02] [Pg 02] [Cell 02] [V/C Id: 1/ 2] : time: 00:04:52.21 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:08:36.02] [Frames: 12902] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 03] [Pg 03] [Cell 03] [V/C Id: 1/ 3] : time: 00:03:12.21 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:11:48.23] [Frames: 17723] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 04] [Pg 04] [Cell 04] [V/C Id: 1/ 4] : time: 00:03:57.09 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:15:46.07] [Frames: 23657] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 05] [Pg 05] [Cell 05] [V/C Id: 1/ 5] : time: 00:03:10.18 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:18:57.00] [Frames: 28425] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 06] [Pg 06] [Cell 06] [V/C Id: 1/ 6] : time: 00:03:37.05 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:22:34.05] [Frames: 33855] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 07] [Pg 07] [Cell 07] [V/C Id: 1/ 7] : time: 00:03:47.14 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:26:21.19] [Frames: 39544] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 08] [Pg 08] [Cell 08] [V/C Id: 1/ 8] : time: 00:04:23.01 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:30:44.20] [Frames: 46120] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 09] [Pg 09] [Cell 09] [V/C Id: 1/ 9] : time: 00:01:37.17 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:32:22.12] [Frames: 48562] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
cutted of the ch 11 - 37

edit: Runing rejig 0.5c multiplex test now ...

Amnon82

20th December 2003, 10:24

ReJig 0.5c multipelxed (Matrix 2)

VTS overview:

Menu attributes:
Video: MPEG-1 720x480 (NTSC) (NTSC 525/60) (4:3) (pan-scan & letterboxed)

Title Set (Movie) attributes:
Video: MPEG-2 720x576 (PAL) (PAL 625/50) (16:9) (pan-scan & letterboxed)
Audio 1: English (Dolby AC-3) 6ch 48Kbps DRC (ID: 0x80)
Audio 2: Deutsch (Dolby AC-3) 6ch 48Kbps DRC (ID: 0x81)
SubPicture 1: English (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x20)
SubPicture 2: Deutsch (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x21)
SubPicture 3: Svenska (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x22)
SubPicture 4: Norsk (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x23)
SubPicture 5: Dansk (Danish) (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x24)
SubPicture 6: Suomi (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x25)
SubPicture 7: Islenska(Icelandic) (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x26)
SubPicture 8: English (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x27)
SubPicture 9: Deutsch (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x28)

PGC_1 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 1] [02:12:47.12 / 25 fps] (Programs: 37) (Cells: 37) (uses VOB-IDs: 1)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 1/ 1] : time: 00:03:43.21 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:03:43.21] [Frames: 5596] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]
[Ch 02] [Pg 02] [Cell 02] [V/C Id: 1/ 2] : time: 00:04:52.23 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:08:36.19] [Frames: 12919] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 03] [Pg 03] [Cell 03] [V/C Id: 1/ 3] : time: 00:03:13.13 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:11:50.07] [Frames: 17757] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 04] [Pg 04] [Cell 04] [V/C Id: 1/ 4] : time: 00:03:56.21 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:15:47.03] [Frames: 23678] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 05] [Pg 05] [Cell 05] [V/C Id: 1/ 5] : time: 00:03:11.10 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:18:58.13] [Frames: 28463] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 06] [Pg 06] [Cell 06] [V/C Id: 1/ 6] : time: 00:03:36.17 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:22:35.05] [Frames: 33880] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 07] [Pg 07] [Cell 07] [V/C Id: 1/ 7] : time: 00:03:47.01 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:26:22.06] [Frames: 39556] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 08] [Pg 08] [Cell 08] [V/C Id: 1/ 8] : time: 00:04:24.08 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:30:46.14] [Frames: 46164] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 09] [Pg 09] [Cell 09] [V/C Id: 1/ 9] : time: 00:01:36.14 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:32:23.03] [Frames: 48578] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]
[Ch 10] [Pg 10] [Cell 10] [V/C Id: 1/10] : time: 00:04:04.20 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:36:27.23] [Frames: 54698] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]

:sly:

Original:

PGC_1 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 1] [02:12:38.00 / 25 fps] (Programs: 36) (Cells: 37) (uses VOB-IDs: 1,2)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 1/ 1] : time: 00:03:42.21 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:03:42.21] [Frames: 5571] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]

IfoEdit:

PGC_1 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 1] [02:12:47.12 / 25 fps] (Programs: 37) (Cells: 37) (uses VOB-IDs: 1)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 1/ 1] : time: 00:03:43.06 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:03:43.06] [Frames: 5581] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]

ReJig:

PGC_1 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 1] [02:12:47.12 / 25 fps] (Programs: 37) (Cells: 37) (uses VOB-IDs: 1)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 1/ 1] : time: 00:03:43.21 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:03:43.21] [Frames: 5596] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]

ReJig is realy near on the original. 5571 frames to 5596 frames. IfoEdit needed 5581 frames... ... even with reencoded m2v-files!

And Nic: Now it is FAST!!!! THANKS!!!!

E-Male

20th December 2003, 14:28

without the pcm track the Eagles DVD backed up fine
but it was undersized by 1GB (still looking fine)

Nic

20th December 2003, 14:57

Did it definitely have to transcode (i.e do 2nd pass after muxing)? I can't see how it could come out that undersized...

(PCM support is more tricky than I first thought...hence the slight delay)

-Nic

robot1

20th December 2003, 15:11

Waiting to test the new engine by Makira. In Rejig 0.5c the old engine was much better than the new in my test (less blocks)

E-Male

20th December 2003, 15:33

yes it did transcode at 75% (50% with pcm)

dragongodz

20th December 2003, 16:19

robot1 - what compression amount ? i had already started making changes to especially improve quality for lower amounts before Makira released the latest new engine update. once Nic has it in a new version of Rejig i will start incorpirating the changes and testing to see what extra i can get out of it.

robot1

20th December 2003, 18:17

I've done 3-4 tests, compression 70-75%
Old engine was always better, for my tastes.
I've already deleted old backups. With next release, I'll post some screenshot of my tests.

ffroms

20th December 2003, 22:42

I have a little problem with DVDAuthoring. First I've demuxed VOBs then created my sup subtitle and author it with ReJig. Everything was great. I've tested new DVD with IfoEdit, WinDVD5 and PowerDVD5 and my sub where there. I've saved DVD to DVD+RW and tested on my stand alone DVD player and there wasn't my subs. Then I went to my friend and tested there and again there was no my sub. When I returned home I've tried DVD with Media Player Classic and again there was no sub. In authoring I've used original English sub and mine Croatian sub. In all tests I could see original (english) sub. To make sub I've used sub2sup.
Is this problem with me or ...?

FFS

Amnon82

20th December 2003, 22:55

@ffroms: To make sub I've used sub2sup

I don't have probs with subs converted by sub2sup. I did my self 5 DVDs with this progie!

I wrote a bugfixfile. You've to create the subs with vobsub and convert them then with sub2sup. Read it in my Guide (http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/main.php?set=shotan#Too%20Many%20Frame%20Drops%20-%20BUG) (german), Translated into English by google.de (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Frj-elektronik.de%2Favideo%2Fmain.php%3Fset%3Dshotan%23Too%2520Many%2520Frame%2520Drops%2520-%2520BUG&langpair=de%7Cen&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=%2Flanguage_tools)

Download Bugfix99a (http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/files/BUGFIX099a.exe)

Hope this helps...

@Nic: what is the PGC for in Your DVD Author at Original IFO Colors?

ffroms

21st December 2003, 11:46

I didn't have problems with sub2sup too. I have problem when authoring DVD 'couse new created sub won't show when playing DVD. I have sub in simple TXT format (well actualy in Micro DVD sub) and they are not on DVD (so I can use vobsub). When I used this sup file with IfoEdit I didn't have any problems with subtitle (there was other problems). Try using new authored DVD with Media Player Classic. I'm using ReJig0.5c.
PGC is need to set to tell ReJig where to look for sub colors.
I've downloaded bugfix but not sure what is for.

FFS

Abnormal1

21st December 2003, 13:19

Hi,

I have a small request to make.

Is there a chance that a CLI for the DVD Author mode could be added as I can see this being very usefull to me and maybe others.

Thanks
Abnormal

Makira

21st December 2003, 15:45

Fixed a small bug (but visible), updated the archive:

http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/m2vrequant_211203.tgz

mmgrover

21st December 2003, 16:40

@Makira

Thanx for the update :-)

mike

Nic

22nd December 2003, 00:20

http://nic.dnsalias.com/ReJig.zip

This basically has LPCM support (although may contain bugs, dont have enough test material) and Makira's new engine. This new engine is definitely an improvement on the "new" engine. But in one short test I did, I still think I preferred the "old" engine. Ill have to test more...Let me know what you think.

Ill add commandline DVD Authoring and try and fix E-Male's problems (as well as others) before moving onto 0.6

Cheers,
-Nic

Rombaldi

22nd December 2003, 00:41

Suggestion for 'engine management'...

with people making may tweaks to the engine, might I suggest a change to the distribution/packaging of ReJig?? Altho it is quite handy to have everything in one small EXE, it could be easier if it was split into an EXE and two DLL's.

The main EXE of course being the main interface processing logic. The DLL's being the ENGINES.

ReJig-E0.DLL being the 'old' encoding engine
ReJij-E1.DLL being the 'new' engine.

that way if a 'new' engine fix comed out, it would just be a simple download of the new DLL and plug in the new code, without having to require a complete re-release of everything..

take this a step further.. decide 'how many engines are enough' (grin) and make part of the settings dialog be

Encoding Engine Manager

(X) E1 (description) (filename/path)
( ) E2 (description) (filename/path)
( ) E3 (description) (filename/path)
( ) E4 (description) (filename/path)
:
( ) Ex (description) (filename/path)

X=Default Engine

where (description) and (filename/path) could be specified in the settings, as well as the 'default' engine.

You could when setting up a compression job, specify which engine (drop down list?)if you didn't want the default to use to compress a file, and obviously if you stack up multiple compressions in a list, a different one for each file.

TAKE IT A STEP FARTHER, lets's say that someone makes a mod of the engine that does VERY VERY VERY good work on animated stuff but not so hot on live action. That could be a seperate DLL that is invoked when needed, someone else does a great engine that compresses very well on slow motion, but not so good on fast action, etc.. etc.. etc...

The obvious advantage of being able to QUICKLY and easily test multiple engine mods is obvious.

Think of it as a set of tools with different plug in adaptors for specific needs (dare I even think about being able to specify a given engine for each title in a backup [well, this is going to be lightly compressed, so use E3, but these extras need to be tightly compress, so use E5, etc...)

kempfand

22nd December 2003, 00:52

@ Nic, Makira, All:

This is off-topic. I'm a silent reader in this section. My application of ReJig is 'simply' to compress my MPEG from DV-conversions, which are sometimes a tiny bit too big to fit ona DVD-R.

But I wanted to say that I really really admire your work on this.

It's fascinating to see the progress, and most importantly, what a 'community' can do to push things forward.

Nuff said. A Big Thank You, and keep up the truely exceptional work.

Happy holidays!
Andreas

DVDRFreak

22nd December 2003, 01:49

@Nic

Tried the new 0.5d verion and it crashes right after multiplexing the streams. It says creating DVD files and then I get a windows exeption error.

Did run it on NARC. Using the DVD backup mode.

Nic

22nd December 2003, 10:48

Grrrr. I think there's a small stack overflow somewhere, as I got a crash once too. But I ripped two films last night and there where no problems.
(However, I have found one of my DVDs does cause subtitle de-sync so I can use that to fix the problem. yay!)

@Rombaldi: That is a nice idea, and would be easy to implement, but Im trying to keep things as simple as possible for the user in this program. DLLs can make things messy as well as harder to debug. Eventually I hope we have just one engine, which will stop any confusion as which one to use.

-Nic

unixfs

22nd December 2003, 11:26

While we still don't have a real 2-pass ReJig ;) is it possible to
instruct the engine not to recompress scenes that have a high
amount of motion (more than a user-specified threshold) ?

Thanks.

m1482

22nd December 2003, 12:38

@Nic: Something is really wrong with new engine!!!

Quality is bad. Compressed image is very blocky, jumpy, and it has some trembling in the screen. The best engine of all is the original ReJig...

katjarella

22nd December 2003, 13:09

Hello NIC,

Unfortunately I do not know good English, therefore is not good it much to understand. But I try it.

My ReJig05d test:

1.Original IFOTitle Set (Movie) attributes:
Video: MPEG-2 720x576 (PAL) (PAL 625/50) (16:9) (letterboxed)
Audio 1: English (Linear PCM) 2ch 48Kbps 16bps (ID: 0xa0)
Audio 2: English (Dolby AC-3) 6ch 48Kbps DRC (ID: 0x81)

PGC_1 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 1] [00:03:08.16 / 25 fps] (Programs: 1) (Cells: 1) (uses VOB-IDs: 1)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 1/ 1] : time: 00:03:08.16 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:03:08.16] [Frames: 4716]

2.ReJig05d > IFO Mode
all Streams, Demux Video (No Compress !) , Correct AC3 Delay=OFF

Result:
AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_0ms.ac3 ( Sound perfectly )
LPCM_Audio_0xBD_0xA0_Delay_0ms.wav ( Sound perfectly )
MPEG_Video_0xE0.m2v

3.ReJig05d > DVD Author
Video = MPEG_Video_0xE0.m2v
Audio1 = LPCM_Audio_0xBD_0xA0_Delay_0ms.wav
Audio2 = AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_0ms.ac3

Result and comparison to original the Ifo:Title Set (Movie) attributes:
Video: MPEG-2 720x576 (PAL) (PAL 625/50) (16:9) (pan-scan & letterboxed)
Audio 1: English (Linear PCM) 2ch 48Kbps 16bps (ID: 0xa0)
Audio 2: English (Dolby AC-3) 6ch 48Kbps DRC (ID: 0x81)

PGC_1 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 1] [00:03:08.16 / 25 fps] (Programs: 1) (Cells: 1) (uses VOB-IDs: 1)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 1/ 1] : time: 00:03:08.16 / 25 fps [Pos: 00:03:08.16] [Frames: 4716]
perfectly !!!!

---------------------------------------------------

BUT!

The sound of the LPCM is very bad and is changed. One hears a little of the original, then noise gets ahead and in such a way.
Then nich again demuxt and a CRC check made.

File - Original Demux CRC - New Demux CRC
AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_0ms.ac3 - EB5CBB8C - 5474DEFD
LPCM_Audio_0xBD_0xA0_Delay_0ms.wav - D8CD3A4A - 38B59E19
MPEG_Video_0xE0.m2v - 8F59F8DD - 8F59F8DD

From where do the differences come?
Are all sounds changed?

Greeting your Katjarella.

ffroms

22nd December 2003, 13:28

Can someone post different link to new version (0.5d) of ReJig 'couse I can't access Nic's page.
Thanks

EDIT: Ignore this. I've got it.

Makira

22nd December 2003, 15:17

@m1482

Your statement doesn't really help. I can show you numerous examples where the new engine gives improved visual quality, both psnr and subjectively. But... you can do the same the other way, I suppose.

Most of the samples I've tried give better quality with the new engine, _when the final size is good_. The old engine is known to produce too big files, ie not following the requested compression factor, and then comparison is invalid.

But I do have some samples where the new one performs worse. While the psnr is still better, the subjective quality due to temporal flickering is worse. I'm thinking of modifying mpeg2psnr so it prints temporal psnr (ie comparing the difference between frames instead of comparing the frames themselves).

Also, bear in mind that testing with files smaller than say 75 megs is not helpful either, since it does not reflect the intented use: the new bitrate controller tends to work better with longer files.

So what can we do? We have to find out _why_ some samples perform better with the old, some others with the new. Then translate this in machine code, and make the engine smarter.

For my particuliar sample where this is most noticeable (a scene from Baraka), while the psnr is better with the new engine, the image seems to flicker. It looks like the I and P frames are really good, while the B frames are not, which make the video flicker because of the alternance of good/bad looking frames. In the old engine, all frames look equally bad (really, they are spatially much worse), but temporaly, it looks a lot better, leading to an overall better subjective quality.

It is _not_ as simple as saying X is always better than Y.

Maybe we could support a 'slow' mode, where the engine could aim for a constant psnr, or maybe we shouldn't rely on the quantiser in the stream to find our own, or maybe there's a whole different way to solve the problem.

I don't know, but I'm sure we can find out. The quickest path to solving this quality problem is properly documenting for what kind of samples, and if possible why, one engine performs better than the other.

E-Male

22nd December 2003, 15:31

i noticed that alternating good and bad frames on "M"
i think it is caused by the grainy source

TCmullet

22nd December 2003, 23:39

Originally posted by Makira
For my particuliar sample where this is most noticeable (a scene from Baraka), while the psnr is better with the new engine, the image seems to flicker. It looks like the I and P frames are really good, while the B frames are not, which make the video flicker because of the alternance of good/bad looking frames. In the old engine, all frames look equally bad (really, they are spatially much worse), but temporaly, it looks a lot better, leading to an overall better subjective quality.Whatever you all do to change rejig, I hope you will apply all compression logic processes equally to I, P, and B frames. I want very much to be able to pause playback and have consistent quality no matter whether I'm paused on a P, B or even an I. And even apart from pausing, I would strongly prefer a result that does not rely on any psychovisual tricks. (Unless you wish to do something like reduce more in the black or nearly black areas--THAT I'd heartily approve of. Or maybe reduce more around the perimeter of the picture, if that's even possible.)

TCmullet

22nd December 2003, 23:43

Originally posted by unixfs
While we still don't have a real 2-pass ReJig ;) is it possible to
instruct the engine not to recompress scenes that have a high
amount of motion (more than a user-specified threshold)?
I second the motion. But I suspect that it might not be appropriate as good mpeg encoders have already divvied up the bits to have more in the fast scenes. But I still like the idea--maybe it's worth a try.

dragongodz

23rd December 2003, 07:49

Makira - i said back in the old thread about some ways that increased quality could be gained. things like a payback system where GOPS with a lower bitrate than the average could be reduced slightly more and the extra could be used for GOPS with a higher bitrate than average. thus higher motion scenes should get less reduction preserving better quality while static/low motion would get reduced more but should be able to handle that. also things like original frame size compressed to the point of actual amount required(with a frame type bias) before writing should work better aswell. that is read original frame size, reduce frame to the percentage required(do not write until it is) with the bias being that I frames are reduced less(say 10%) than the target reduction and B frames are reduced slightly more to make up the correct reduction amount per GOP. for extremly high compression there are other ways to preserve some quality that are not really desirable for low compression. these other methods though could be used on things like extras etc.
if interested then email me but i will be away until after new year so dont expect a reply until then.

Unixfs - if a movie was 50%(or more) action and not compressed at all for action scenes the rest of the movie would be compressed way to much and you would see it(unless only compressing something like a few percent total). so less compression for action would be better. thats basically what the part above about different compression based on original bitrate etc is aimed at. this asumes the original compression used higher bitrate for the action or highly detailed scenes of course.

ffroms

23rd December 2003, 13:11

A little possible bug in DVDAuthoring.
When I run DVDAuthoring first time and everything completed OK. I've exited authoring (not ReJig) and started again authoring, set everything and clicked on Create and program just disappeared from screen. I've tried that few time and with same resolute.

FFS

Nic

23rd December 2003, 13:21

@ffroms: Ahh, that doesn't surprise me. Mplex is coded quite badly in some respects...it also has huge memory leaks afters it's been done. Thanks for the update. I should be able to fix it without too much bother :)

@unixfs: I think the best option would be to support a proper full 2-pass rather than try and change the compression ratios on the fly depending on the motion...I dont think that would always work well.

@Makira: The new engine is definitely better in some scenes that ive tested...Thanks for your feedback and development :)

@katjarella: So, the LPCM was fine when done in IFOMode but when done with DVD Backup it sounded really bad and the files produced were not the same? Is that right? Hmmmm, Did you do IFO Mode first and then try a DVD Backup without closing the program?
(Im trying to guess what went wrong...)

Ill look into all these things...(I think I fixed the sub de-sync at last)

Cheers,
-Nic

ffroms

23rd December 2003, 14:18

Thanks for quick replay and GREAT tool ! Maybe in next version will be fixed my problem with not showing subs on DVD player (even though they are visible in PowerDVD and WinDVD). I hope it's somehow related with sub de-sync.

FFS

Proff

23rd December 2003, 16:22

Hello there,

i have been following Rejig since the original GPL transcoder topic and the name Rejig wasn't even born yet :)

I think Makira and Nic are both very great people and programmers by making all this possible. Tnx guys, u rule!

Anyway, the reason why i'm posting in this thread, besides thanking these guys, is that i might have something to contribute also. A couple of pages back Nic mentioned that he was using the Intel C++ Compiler 8.0 now, because of speedgains. I have always been a fan of this compiler since it is able to generate code specifically for modern processors. The code im talking about is mmx, sse and sse2 and can't be outputted by for instance the Microsoft Compiler without using intrinsics.

While checking the project settings of Nic's workspace, i noticed that the vectorizer that generates this kind of parallel isn't turn on! The compilerswitch im talking about is /Qax. By using this switch, the compiler checks if certain pieces of code can be sped up by using modern processor extension, and if it does, it generates the appropiate code for it. The 'a' in the switch means that also 'plain x86' code is generated so that the resulting executable can be used on older machines also (no benefit for these older machines ofcourse).

I found that using one addional compiler switch: /QaxKWN , Rejig performed up to 10% faster in my small testcases. I added some lines of code that uses GetTickCount() to measure the time Rejig needs to transcode these test files, and than built Rejig with original compiler settings and again with the /QaxKWN switch. I only tested transcoding mpg files via the command line, maybe there are speedgains in the DVD muxing or other parts of the program too.

Tested 2 SVCD files on my P4 2.4 Ghz 533 bus:

1.) 246 Mb (with sound), transcoded to 200 Mb (without sound).
Rejig original: 24581 ms. (average of 5 tries)
Rejig /QaxKWN: 22815 ms. (average of 5 tries)

2.) 771 Mb (with sound), transcoded to 650 Mb (without sound).
Rejig original: 83969 ms. (average of 3 tries)
Rejig /QaxKWN: 81068 ms. (average of 3 tries)

The Rejig build with mxx/sse(2) code always performed faster than the version without this code. Couldn't test any big dvd's since i don't have enough HD space, but why don't u guys report your speed gains?

I don't have any webspace to host the new executable, but i can upload it anywhere or mail it to people. Nic: will u consider turning on this compiler option on by default for the original Rejig? The only disadvantage i see is that the size of the binary went from 900 kb to 1 Mb, but i consider that to be very small still!

Nic

23rd December 2003, 16:47

(That's very true, I used to use it when I compiled XviD...Forgot about adding that in. For the next release, ill use that switch. Thanks for the reminder :) )

Amnon82

25th December 2003, 18:28

I wanted to backup Tomb Raider 2 ...

TR2 has 1 DTS Audio Track.

Original is so:

AC3 Deutsch
DTS Deutsch
AC3 Deutsch
AC3 English
AC3 English

After multiplexing with ReJig 0.5d I got this:

AC3 Deutsch
AC3 Deutsch
AC3 English
AC3 English
MPG Audio ????

IFO Edit didn't mux DTS ...

@Proff: If You want, I can host Your speedy ReJig ...

mmgrover

26th December 2003, 15:57

@Nic, I missed 0.5d.. MyBad. I posted it.

Is the Rig_src.zip there for 0.5d?

mike

TCmullet

26th December 2003, 20:59

Now that 0.5d became available, I've tried to use the "new" engine again and resume xsvcd authoring. But I've gotten unexpected results. Am hoping someone can explain. (And please forgive if this has been covered but I didn't grasp it.)

(In this note, I'm going to use the 'k' figure displayed in Windows Explorer size column instead of the 'mb' figure in the bottom status line. This will show more precision.)

0.5c took a file (.m2v) that is 760,062k and with old engine and 99.7% made it 757,481k, just right for my XSVCD limit of 795MB w/audio muxed back in. When switching to 0.5d and new engine, I got undersized results. When I tried to increase my percentage to where I'd get the same size as 0.5c-old, I was never able to increase it enough. Here are my figures:

99.7 750,185k
99.8 750,922k
99.9 751,593k
99.95 751,897k
99.98 752,039k
99.99 752,086k
99.999 752,123k
100.0 752,125k

As you can see, even upping it to 100% still compresses over 7MB away! (5MB more than old-engine@99.7%.) How can this be? And why does the "new" new engine behave with less size accuracy than the "old-original"? I tried 105% just for kicks and got an error message.

One more thing-- I thought I was going to ask you all which I should use, the new engine at 100% instead of old at 99.7%, even though the new makes the result 5mb "too" small? But I'm not asking that, because EVERY result with the new engine gives terrible results no matter whether it's 99.7 or 100.0 percent. I get very conspicuous pixelation in every file, but none with the old engine in either 0.5c or 0.5d. Even low-motion looks very bad (pixelated). So it looks like 0.5d with old engine option is the only way for me to go. I'm kinda puzzled as to why anyone can find the new engine useful. Unless perhaps all the movie-type stuff most of you do is less sensitive than my interlaced championship volleyball recorded off of cable-tv.

TCmullet

26th December 2003, 21:01

It would help me a great deal if the same kind of message and audio sound would occur when the transcoding has finished that occurs when I enter a percent value greater than 100. That way, I could do something else in the room, and "wait for the beep" so I can continue my mad dash to get caught up on mpeg file processing, and still get other things done in the room while waiting for ReJig to finish. Of course any change like this should not be allowed to impede those who use the program in command-line fashion (if there are any folks like that).

TCmullet

26th December 2003, 21:05

For some reason, when ReJig is transcoding, all other tasks on my system (Win98-1st-ed) slow way down. Is there some sort of forced high-priority being given to ReJig? Imho, it should have an average priority so I can "run it in the background" so to speak. Or perhaps user-selectable like in VirtualDub or Tmpgenc. But having it grab top priority causes problems sometimes.

Having a "pause" feature would be real helpful too. Tmpgenc has that via the confirmation message to the 'abort' option. VirtualDub does not, but I wish it did.

Nic

27th December 2003, 14:47

http://nic.dnsalias.com/ReJig.zip

Fixes for:
Sup Creation Compatibility fix (adds P-STD buffer info as suggested by jj57 at start of this thread (BTW: submux-dvd does it wrong?!)

Sub timing should be fixed

DTS Support should work now ( oops )

-Nic

jdobbs

27th December 2003, 16:57

The .ZIP file is telling me it is corrupt -- and it's only 64Kb long.

mmgrover

27th December 2003, 17:39

I'm getting same prob with zip file :-(

mike

gigah72

27th December 2003, 18:17

I'm getting an error that "libguide40.dll" is missing.

g.

robot1

27th December 2003, 18:29

It's a math lib used by progs compiled by intel compiler
Probably a google search will solve...

Nic

27th December 2003, 18:30

Ok, all uploaded and fixed
(Jeeze, my kingdom for a floppy drive or CD-R drive that works...grrr)
(The current version doesn't need the libguide40.dll, so re-download)

jj59

27th December 2003, 18:42

@Nic
In which way is submux-dvd doing it wrong?

Nic

27th December 2003, 19:51

@jj:It appears to set the wrong values...I could be wrong however, I havent actually tested it.
But:

header[9] = 0x01; // P-STD buffer scale = 1024 bytes (fixed for DVD see spec)

should read = 0x60 in my opinion. Also look at the function mkpesh1, which does set it to 0x60 (correctly). So it depends which parts of the code are being used. But as far as I can see mkpesh1 is only used if cvd or svcd....(From the code)

I could be wrong, but that's my current opinion :)

-Nic

Proff

28th December 2003, 14:41

Hello everybody, hope everyone had a nice Christmas and everything?

Nic has added the /Qax compiler switch in the 0.5e release, so there is no need for hosting my version of the executable: just download 0.5e!

Nic, i have another question about the other added switches. The /Qpar_threshold that is set to 100. My documentation of this switch says this:

Sets a threshold for the auto-parallelization of loops based on the probability of profitable execution of the loop in parallel, n=0 to 100. n=0 implies "always." Default: /Qpar_threshold75.

By setting it to 100, doesn't mean that is it always disabled?

Nic

28th December 2003, 15:07

Ahh, thats the one bit of the sourcecode I didn't update...having the /Qparallel switch in caused it to need libguide40.dll. So I took that parameter out...
(100 might mean disabled, but I took it to mean it wont only do auto-parallelization if it would be definitely beneficial...either way, doesnt matter now :) )

-Nic

shoarthing

28th December 2003, 17:25

Nic - Hi - very impressed by & grateful for your work: might I suggest [re: main-title backup] that you offer an option to set plural drives [ie: temp & target] for the enormous amount of data-shuffling to-and-fro?

- tho' my setup here is all-SCSI, there is a faint impression of the application's speed in this mode being influenced by disk I/O

TCmullet

28th December 2003, 18:46

Anyone got any ideas concerns the topics described in my 3 posts earlier? (2 day ago) Not to be impatient, but I kinda expected at least some moderate chatter about all 3. I want to do my part to contribute to the effort by giving carefully documented feedback and suggestions. I hope Nic and/or the other experts will have some things to say about each of the 3 items.

@Nic, Thank you again very much for what is turning out to already be a very helpful tool for me and the rest.

E-Male

28th December 2003, 18:50

we're between christmas and new-year
i think we can keep it a lil slow this days :)

TCmullet

28th December 2003, 22:04

Guess you're right. I forget that. I don't do much of the xmas thing. This time is the busiest for me in digital video... Plus seeing 11 posts after mine not relating to mine made me think folks were still active and thought something I said was offensive. Will wait a while longer. :)

Nic

28th December 2003, 23:21

TC:
You im very limited on time, hence all my posts have been short and kurt recently...Also coding code for 0.6.

1) An audio ping. Yup I can stick in a messagebeep, ill make it a setting though that you need to turn on and will be stored in the registry

2) Slow down, that is probably happening because of disk access more than anything else, so thread priority might not help. But I will try and add something to control that. Also, if you can, upgrade to win2000. It is far more suited to heavy duty processing. Also as a stop gap...look up pstools and find pssuspend. That can pause processes until I can find a way to add it to ReJig.

3) The new engine not being accurate at such ranges will probably be/is looking into by Makira or Dragongodz...I want to get down to the engine last after Ive got 0.6 out. Although I use DVDBackup of ReJig and think it's good, it needs to be made much faster and use less diskspace. 0.6 will solve that (I hope!)

Hope thats enough,
-Nic

jamesp

29th December 2003, 02:27

Hi all. I'm using rejig to shrink Mpeg-2 captures and its working fine, but is there a way to mux the m2v back with the mpa after the shrink has happened? Currently i have to mux the streams back together with BBmpeg before authoring with Tmpeg DVD Author. It would be nice if i didn't have to use BBMpeg.

Cheers,

Jim

TCmullet

29th December 2003, 04:49

Originally posted by Nic
3) The new engine not being accurate at such ranges will probably be/is looking into by Makira or Dragongodz...I want to get down to the engine last after Ive got 0.6 out. Although I use DVDBackup of ReJig and think it's good, it needs to be made much faster and use less diskspace. 0.6 will solve that (I hope!)
Hope thats enough,
-Nic
That's a great start, Nic. Thanks! However, you may have missed possibly the most serious part of the post, "...EVERY result with the new engine gives terrible results no matter whether it's 99.7 or 100.0 percent. I get very conspicuous pixelation in every file, but none with the old engine in either 0.5c or 0.5d. Even low-motion looks very bad (pixelated)... I'm kinda puzzled as to why anyone can find the new engine useful. Unless perhaps all the movie-type stuff most of you do is less sensitive than my interlaced championship volleyball recorded off of cable-tv."

Comments?

E-Male

29th December 2003, 10:23

my comment (that i already stated twice before):
the transcoding has very different quality depending on the source

so if you only tried it with your interlaced volleyball and nothing else your test is useless on it's own

IvIark

29th December 2003, 11:17

Currently i have to mux the streams back together with BBmpeg before authoring with Tmpeg DVD Author.

You don't have to do this. Just choose to add the M2V video stream instead of the multiplexed MPG and you can select the appropriate audio stream to go with it.

@Nic: Thanks for this fantastic tool, it's saving me hours with my DVB captures. One thing that I think would be handy though is to be able to choose the display type that is specified in the IFO. 4:3 films are sometimes captured at 528x576 pixels which when displayed as 16:9 pan scan show up as a normal 4:3. At present you have to edit the IFO so that the DVD will use pan scan as default. Is there any chance of adding a selection box to choose this before authoring?

Thanks again
Mark

jamesp

29th December 2003, 11:49

Yes i know, but the audio always has some somrt of delay on it (usually -79ms), and there is no way to do this with TMpeg DVD author.

Jim

Originally posted by IvIark
You don't have to do this. Just choose to add the M2V video stream instead of the multiplexed MPG and you can select the appropriate audio stream to go with it.

Thanks again
Mark

IvIark

29th December 2003, 11:52

the audio always has some somrt of delay on it (usually -79ms)

Rejig can correct that delay though, or a tool like Ac3 Delay Corrector which can handle MPA. It'd take less time to correct the audio than to remux.

Mark

DMagic1

29th December 2003, 12:07

I have to get around to tring the lastest version. Thx to everyone putting time and energy into this project. Just wanted to say it.

katjarella

29th December 2003, 17:03

Originally posted by Nic
@katjarella: So, the LPCM was fine when done in IFOMode but when done with DVD Backup it sounded really bad and the files produced were not the same? Is that right? Hmmmm, Did you do IFO Mode first and then try a DVD Backup without closing the program?
(Im trying to guess what went wrong...)
Hello NIC.
The again remuxte PCM sound is bad. And the new files are not the same. I always again started ReJig.

·· Sonic Foundry Soft Encode Test ·······························································

File: DEMUX_ORIGINAL_REJIG_E > AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_0ms.ac3
File size: 10.560.256 bytes
Total frames: 5.892
Start time: 00:00:0,00 *
End time: 00:03:8,54
Status: No errors were found

File: MUX_REJIG_E > DE-MUX_REJIG_E > AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_0ms.ac3
File size: 10.558.464 bytes
Total frames: 5.891
Start time: 00:00:0,00 *
End time: 00:03:8,51
Status: No errors were found

File: MUX_IFOEDIT > DE-MUX_REJIG_E > AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_20ms.ac3
File size: 10.560.256 bytes
Total frames: 5.892
Start time: 00:00:0,00 *
End time: 00:03:8,54
Status: No errors were found

File: MUX_MAESTRO > DE-MUX_REJIG_E > AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_0ms.ac3
File size: 10.560.256 bytes
Total frames: 5.892
Start time: 00:00:0,00 *
End time: 00:03:8,54
Status: No errors were found

Was noticeable to me, ReJig shortens the AC3 sound.

·· CRC Check ·······························································

Original > Demux ReJig v0.5E > Mux ReJig v0.5E > Demux ReJig v0.5E
MPEG_Video_0xE0.m2v ·························· 8F59F8DD ·· 8F59F8DD
LPCM_Audio_0xBD_0xA0_Delay_0ms.wav ·· D8CD3A4A ·· 38B59E19 ·· Play : PCM Sound Bad !!!
AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_0ms.ac3 ····· EB5CBB8C ·· 5474DEFD

Original > Demux ReJig v0.5E > Mux IfoEdit > Demux ReJig v0.5E
MPEG_Video_0xE0.m2v ·························· 8F59F8DD ·· 8F59F8DD
LPCM_Audio_0xBD_0xA0_Delay_20ms.wav · D8CD3A4A ·· D8CD3A4A ·· Play : PCM Sound Ok !!!
AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_20ms.ac3 ···· EB5CBB8C ·· EB5CBB8C

Original > Demux ReJig v0.5E > Mux Maestro > Demux ReJig v0.5E
MPEG_Video_0xE0.m2v ·························· 8F59F8DD ·· 8F59F8DD
LPCM_Audio_0xBD_0xA0_Delay_0ms.wav ·· D8CD3A4A ·· D8CD3A4A ·· Play : PCM Sound Ok !!!
AC3_Audio_0xBD_0x81_Delay_0ms.ac3 ···· EB5CBB8C ·· EB5CBB8C

·· Demux PCM from Original - HEX ·····································

Decrypter : 5249464621A9210257415645666D7420100000000100020080BB000000EE02000400100064617461FDA821*
REJIG_E: ··· 5249464664A1210257415645666D7420100000000100020080BB000000EE0200040010006461746140A121*
VOBEDIT: ·· 524946465CA1210257415645666D7420100000000100020080BB000070170000040010006461746140A121*

* The remainder is identical.

···················································································
The Mutliplexen functions only correctly with Maestro. Everything else is wrong. Now one can also understand, why so many multiplex problems to have. I will times test the video quality later? is you determines more importantly :)

I hope you understand a little.
Greeting Katjarella

Rombaldi

29th December 2003, 21:17

Originally posted by IvIark
One thing that I think would be handy though is to be able to choose the display type that is specified in the IFO. 4:3 films are sometimes captured at 528x576 pixels which when displayed as 16:9 pan scan show up as a normal 4:3. At present you have to edit the IFO so that the DVD will use pan scan as default.

Don't edit the IFO, use ReStream (http://shh.dvdboard.de/restream.html) to change the MPEG2 headers in the M2V file and you're good to go (Tmpgenc Author will pick it up as 16:9 and act accordingly)

IvIark

30th December 2003, 00:29

Don't edit the IFO, use ReStream to change the MPEG2 headers in the M2V file and you're good to go (Tmpgenc Author will pick it up as 16:9 and act accordingly)

The actual aspect ratio isn't the problem, it treats it correctly as 16:9. The problem is that by default, Rejig sets the display mode to pan-scan AND letterbox, but only pan-scan displays it correctly as full screen 4:3. So if your DVD player defaults to letterbox and you don't edit the Rejigged IFO first, then you'd have to manually put the player into PS mode to show it correctly.

It isn't a big issue as editting the IFO literally takes seconds, but it's just a suggestion to make Rejig more versatile.

Mark

Makira

30th December 2003, 03:34

Originally posted by TCmullet
[...] EVERY result with the new engine gives terrible results no matter whether it's 99.7 or 100.0 percent. I get very conspicuous pixelation in every file, but none with the old engine in either 0.5c or 0.5d. Even low-motion looks very bad (pixelated)... [...]

I've found the reason why. This is due to the alternate quantisation table, which minimize the delta between original value and recompressed value, by sometime using a value higher than the original. While this really improves psnr, the result is less pleasing to watch since it kinds of introduce noise into the image.

It seems psnr isn't always a good measure of quality...

I've updated the engine on my side, fixed this, and added a few other things.

http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/m2vrequant_291203.tgz

@Nic: I would suggest making i_factor, p_factor, b_factor, i_min_stress, p_min_stress and b_min_stress user definable via a setting window (let the user choose his own value, or the presets). You'll also notice the presets are now dependant on the factor used.

TCmullet

30th December 2003, 03:57

THANK YOU Makira! With NO disrespect to E-male, I just knew something had to be wrong if 100% caused deterioration at all, no matter what kind of source material.

@Nic: Maybe you could put Makira's new engine into the same release that will improve the size estimation.

@E-male: I do plan to go back and read your posts-- I'm sure it does apply albeit more so with lower factors such as 70, 80 or even 90. Any deterioration at all at 100% just didn't seem possible. (To me.) And as far as source material, the footage in question had plenty of occasional head shots (for enough seconds) that had little or no motion in them. That's what threw me-- I figured the problem was with the hi-mo of vball, but the lo-mo was just as bad. :)

dragongodz

30th December 2003, 04:27

Makira - how did i know you were going to do that to me ? i had just made some changes when yopu did the last update so put it on hold. then Nic updated so got the source and finally managed a little time to move the changes to the new engine for people to test. then BANG you do it again, another update. :)

will be busy for the next few days but i will do the changes AGAIN once Nic has updated.

oh and i disagree with the idea of having people having to put in their own factor amounts as it is more likly to lead to possible confusion and bad results. wait for the changes i want to add and then lets see from there.

Makira

30th December 2003, 05:30

about the alternate quantisation table:

my test shows that the alt table is probably better on samples without noise/grain, but amplifies the noise otherwise.

Since it is currently difficult to distinguish between low/high noise material, the lastest update completly disable the alt_table.

This may not be the best way to go..

So I'll try something tonight to see if I can make a dynamic choice about using the alternate table or not, and possibly post an update - I just got an idea.

dragongodz, wait a few hours :P

TCmullet

30th December 2003, 06:17

Makira, your comment about noise makes me want to comment. I have suffered the "mistake" of not having a multi-thousand dollar tv monitor. Cheap tvs smooth over noise. That's why EP made it so popular as a VHS tape speed; most folks couldn't see any noise. But at least twice in recent years, I've been disappointingly alerted that my own means for discerning noise were less than adequate.

My captures are from analog cable tv, and there is definitely more noise in the very best signal than in the worst DVD. Most of the folks on this board appear to be dealing with backing up their DVDs, whereas I don't even have a player. I have tons of CD-Rs with a zillion hours of mpeg2 video. And before that started, I had (and only a few months ago counted) over 750 VHS or S-VHS cassettes, the vast majority containing stuff either live (camcorder) or off the air. It has been rather disappointing to me that I can't get 1 hour of 480x480 video on an SVCD. I'm inclined to credit it all to subtle invisible noise that I can't see on my $700 monitor, or measure electronicly in anyway. I can only see how bad the picture gets when I encode or reencode to a smaller size. Typically, even when reducing to 352x480, I still can't get to that goal of an hour per disk with a clean picture. Even with lots of NR filters, etc.

But DVD is another matter. It appears that DVD is much cleaner than anything I can record from cable tv. To preserve a clean picture of volleyball games from cable (espn, sunshine, etc.) I have had to increase the average bitrate to 4 and even 5 Mbits/sec EVEN with a pixel ratio of only 352x480. (Maximum bitrate around 7.)

I guess I'm dumping all this story on you just to emphasize that you are very right about noise being a factor to consider.

Makira

30th December 2003, 06:21

Nevermind the idea: while the alt table does boost the psnr, it just doesn't look as good. Last update is best imho.
I don't intend to touch the engine anymore, at least for some time.

unixfs

30th December 2003, 15:04

Makira,
what's the use of the Logfile.txt?

Is it the first step towards a 2-pass code? :)

DaddyC

30th December 2003, 18:39

Hi,

i tried ReJig on my laptop euquipped with a fat32 formated hdd. i quess you can imagined what happened. the demuxed video never gets bigger then 4gb (because of the filesize limitations). so the whole movie never gets stored unless its smaler than 4gb.

so i think file splitting should be an option.

pieroxy

31st December 2003, 07:41

Hi Nic. Great job, I just can't wait for v1.0 ;););)

Just one comment with my tests so far. I have only tested the Author feature, and to answer "Amnon82" post on the first page of the thread, it is reeeeaaaaally slow. The problem is that it does it in two passes: 1 pass generate a "Mux.vob" file in the target dir, another pass then split it in the VTS_01_X.VOB in the VIDEO_TS directory. There seems to be a third pass, but I couldn't understand its meaning.

One might think this two pass process will take twice as much time, but one might be wrong ;) The thing is I have three hard drives in my machine. Copying one 1GB file from one HDD to another takes 2 minutes. Copying the same file from one HDD to the same HDD takes 10 minutes. 5X the time, due mostly to seek time.

If we could just specify an additional directory for this "Mux.vob" file, let it be called "Temp files directory", that would divide the time taken by the recompress by 3 (at least, for anyone having more than 1 HDD).

Of course, the perfect solution would be to split the big VOB on the fly :p

My $.02

pieroxy

31st December 2003, 08:11

@TCmullet

"It has been rather disappointing to me that I can't get 1 hour of 480x480 video on an SVCD"
800MB is a small container, especially for hi motion full screen video. Plus, the max bitrate of an SVCD isn't what I would call "large". Not mentionning that at the max bitrate you get 40 minutes...

"I'm inclined to credit it all to subtle invisible noise that I can't see on my $700 monitor"
A bad (read: noisy, shaky, etc...) source just force you to have a higher bitrate... But keep on reading...

"I have had to increase the average bitrate to 4 and even 5 Mbits/sec EVEN with a pixel ratio of only 352x480."
In my experience, 352x240 gets a reasonnable quality (for full screen hi motion NTSC video, not film) at around 2MBps, 2.5 being really comfortable. So your numbers seem reasonnable. And I am talking about a DVD source material over here, not just a bad VHS. Maybe the noise in your VHS is not the reason for your failure to get 60 minutes of video on one CD. Maybe MPEG is.

dragongodz

31st December 2003, 15:21

Makira - just had a quick look at that last update. ah you read my mind. i see you have changed the frame type factoring for different compression factors. that is what i was working on but mine is percentage based(since rejig uses percentage) with finer granularity. hmm will have to see if i can just redo mine to factor or maybe convert what you have to percentage when i get the time.

did you read before about my ideas on improving quality ? let me know if you are interested in hearing my thoughts on these things. :)

Makira

31st December 2003, 22:19

Originally posted by dragongodz
Makira - just had a quick look at that last update. ah you read my mind. i see you have changed the frame type factoring for different compression factors. that is what i was working on but mine is percentage based(since rejig uses percentage) with finer granularity. hmm will have to see if i can just redo mine to factor or maybe convert what you have to percentage when i get the time.

did you read before about my ideas on improving quality ? let me know if you are interested in hearing my thoughts on these things. :)

First I would suggest that we work with factor based instead of percent based: turning a percent into factor (and vice versa) is easy (if you have 70%, or 0.70, just do 1/0.70 = 1.43 and you have the factor). You only have to change the percent to factor once, while if we do it the other way, there'll be many place where we'd need to convert values, and we'd have to do it each time...
(I hope you noticed I make a linear interpolation between presets)

Second, I did read your post about improving quality. A few things comes to mind:
-about using different quantisation matrices: while this would certainly be an improvement, I'm not sure by how much, and there is several problems with this idea: each frame would have to be requantised, even at stress 0, even if we reuse the same quantiser. This would slow things down, especially at low factors, since currently I and P frames are likely to be copied as is. It also means some gops could finish bigger than before. Series of black frames comes to mind. You may also have noticed the current code will copy a slice if it ends up bigger than before (that happens maybe on 0.5% of the slices), well this could not be done anymore. This is a rather big problem since DVDRemaster _requires_ that each frame is smaller or equal than the original (and vbv/ps-std also requires this, unless you want to remake your own vbv control). And finally the speed impact would be non-negligeable, since that means at least one multiplication and one division.

-about deep analysis/target size of each frame/2-pass/etc. This would be nice, but the speed impact is obvious, it'll take at least twice the time, or more. Also, I'm not conviced about the quality improvement, for one main reason: we can always consider the original stream to be the first pass! And this would require big changes to the current code, a lot more than changing quantisation matrices

Personnally, I think the best improvement we can do, other than tweaking factor and min stresses, would be to have a better bitrate controller (a pid (http://www.tcnj.edu/~rgraham/PID-tuning.html) or something smarter). For exemple, maybe instead of adding a value to the orig quantiser, we should multiply it bya value. Or take the the derived value of the stress factor into account (this is currently done with m2vdownsizer). Or maybe using recompressed size of the slice after recompression against its original size for feedback into the bitrate controller.

dragongodz

1st January 2004, 05:11

Makira - yes i noticed so i would think my tweaking would only gain small increase in quality if any. still worth playing with to see though. :)

well rejig already has the desired percentage size done(percentage_x variable) which is what i was using for frame type factoring variation. i will probably just play with your presets for now though and see what that brings.

the main method i was advocating(for at least exploration) was the compress frame to the desired size. that is if you were compressing to 50% of original size then you would read frame, reduce frame, measure is frame the desired reduced amount, if not reduce some more, once it is(or even slightly more) then write frame and proceed to next. from my understanding this is exactly what dvd2one is doing with its CBR(Constant Bitrate Reduction) method. the up side is better quality especially for large/long movies and accurate sizing. down side is yes it takes longer(but it should be worth it), I frames and P frames compressed even at low compression amounts(that could be forcfully stopped based on compression amount, so frames would be just copied so never bigger, with B frames compressed slightly more to make up the defecit). actually my proposal was also for weighted amounts by frame type. that is I frames get compressed slightly less than target and B frames slightly more, then tally at end of GOP to see if target reduction achieved and if not then increase B frame compression amount to make it up or if over compressed then reduce slightly to payback the extra bits, if not enough then then I or P frames could also be used for payback except for low compression where they wouldnt be compressed anyway. this brings a slight variation in to the sizing but should benefit quality because I frames quality should be better maintained, especially for large amount of compression.
another thing i havent mention here(i did to Nic by email) was skipped frames(total skipped macroblock for a frame). this would be interesting to investigate for use with very high compression, that is compressing to 40% of original size or smaller. something like make every second B frame of a pair skipped. easy to set in that when read frame if it is I or P frame set pair variable to 0 and if B frame and pair is 0 then set to 1 and compress as normal. if pair is 1 already then make skipped and reset pair to 0. you would lose some smoothness in playback but gain extra bits for the other frames to increase their quality slightly. again this is just something that i thought would be interesting to be investigated. :)

actually i am curious, is anyone else interested in all this or are you skipping past when you see us talking about this stuff ? :D

Vapor

1st January 2004, 08:17

Sorry for going backwards a bit here - just trying to save some time for certain users.

Originally posted by IvIark
Rejig can correct that delay though, or a tool like Ac3 Delay Corrector which can handle MPA. It'd take less time to correct the audio than to remux.

I know this "should" work but in practice only 50% of files input into TMPGDVD Author work correctly if seperate vid/aud are used, regardless of AC3 delay correction.

The problem is not with audio delay usually. The main problem is incorrect timeline, TMPGDVD either gets it wrong or detects no frames at all. This makes chaptering impossible.

These problems occur in near on 100% of cases when the video is NTSC-Film type with pulldown.

Muxing with BBmpeg corrects these problems in 100% of my cases (over 100 mastered DVD's).

It's worth trying TMPGDVD first of course as sticking the files in and checking the timeline in the chapter window takes only 30 secs. If it's wrong mux with BBmpeg.

Another thing in TMPGDVD, make sure you do actually try and add chapters (I use add chapters every 5 mins as a test) as in a few cases it will only produce the full time line after inserting the chapters.

These sort of muxing/mastering problems are also been discussed in the following thread: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=64060

E-Male

1st January 2004, 19:43

ok, i'm still not perfectly recovered from a birthday-party (not mine) and new-year, but i wanna state i'm still alive
and i got 2 things to say

first a problem:
rejig 0.5e
DVD: blair witch project, rc2, pal, german
mode: DVD Backup
keep all tracks (3) and subs (1)
no transcoding needed
after multiplexing (when i expected sub-multiplexing) it stopped and left me with some files, all ~19k if i rememebr correctly
i tried again with same result, but deleted everything
i'll try to reproduce it again and report exactly what happened

and about the engine:
before i start: i got no real idea about about the engine, so i might be totally wrong with my thoughts
the idea is this: sicne noise seems to be a factor, maybe a option for telling the engine how noisy the source is could help, with options like "sofr/video tape" "perfectly clean/digital image" "clean/good film" "normal with film grain" "grainy/old film" "noisy/capture".....
just an idea

CU
E-Male

p.s. just out of curiousity: could the transcoder remove the color onformation (set all to "grey") and so act like a greyscale filter without reencoding?

p.p.s. @TCmullet: sorry, read your post to quickly and misunderstood your point

pieroxy

1st January 2004, 19:54

Hi there, another minor bug (0.5e). At first, I thought the reauthor mode didn't work at all, because it would leave me with all my VOBS, none of the IFO/BUP and crash in the end. Of course, it was my mistake, as I figured later, and the reason was I was out of disk space on my C:\ drive...

When I came back, there was almost 1 GB free because one process that generated temp files was done, and had erased them. So I was there, ReJig crashed, my DVD incomlete and 1GB free on my HDD. It took me a while to figure this one out ;)

Well, just a nice dialog "Not enough disk space" would be perfect for such a situation...

Of course, that is not a P1, blocker or anything...

Makira

1st January 2004, 19:56

Originally posted by E-Male
p.s. just out of curiousity: could the transcoder remove the color onformation (set all to "grey") and so act like a greyscale filter without reencoding?

I guess so, but what for?

Joe Fenton

1st January 2004, 21:39

Originally posted by TCmullet
I have suffered the "mistake" of not having a multi-thousand dollar tv monitor. Cheap tvs smooth over noise.

You are mistaking a TV for a monitor. The purpose of a monitor is to display the incoming signal exactly as-is to the best of it's ability. The purpose of a television is to display the incoming signal in the most pleasing manner possible, even if it means altering the signal. Cheap TVs don't smooth over noise, ALL TVs do. Expensive ones do it better and by more expensive means.

When you watch TV, you want the "best looking" display possible. When you use a monitor, you want to see the details of your display as clearly as possible. When doing video encoding, you want to check your results on a monitor, knowing that on a TV, it will look better. AVIs which are blocky and noisy on my computer look rather nice on my TV set.

E-Male

1st January 2004, 21:59

the greyscale question was mostly out of curiousity
but the purpose would for example be removing chroma noise from black&white caps or similar things

TCmullet

2nd January 2004, 09:12

Originally posted by dragongodz
...actually my proposal was also for weighted amounts by frame type.I very much cast my vote FOR this and AGAINST any scheme where all of reduction is aimed at B frames and none at I frames. I want to be able to single step from frame to frame and not notice a significant quality change. Btw, this is why in the Divx world, I'm not interested (much) in psychovisual enhancements--they all rely on continual motion to obscure their artifacts.
actually i am curious, is anyone else interested in all this or are you skipping past when you see us talking about this stuff?Although a lot of it goes over my head, I do enjoy reading it and possibly learning something. Keep it up. Then someday when I am more knowledgable, I'll reread this thread and say "Hey NOW I know what he's talking about!" Yes, some of it I gloss over, especially when rereading it for purposes of making this post. But please keep up the good work. :)

TCmullet

2nd January 2004, 09:34

Originally posted by Joe Fenton
You are mistaking a TV for a monitor. The purpose of a monitor is to display the incoming signal exactly as-is to the best of it's ability. The purpose of a television is to display the incoming signal in the most pleasing manner possible, even if it means altering the signal. Cheap TVs don't smooth over noise, ALL TVs do. Expensive ones do it better and by more expensive means.

When you watch TV, you want the "best looking" display possible. When you use a monitor, you want to see the details of your display as clearly as possible. When doing video encoding, you want to check your results on a monitor, knowing that on a TV, it will look better. AVIs which are blocky and noisy on my computer look rather nice on my TV set.Thank you for augmenting my slightly hazy perception of the matter. Yes, I've know that a NTSC video monitor is for us serious users to attempt to see exactly what's there. When I said 'cheap tvs smooth over noise', I meant that really old ones are inadvertantly doing that simply due to their limited bandwidth. I didn't know that expensive contemporary TVs do signal cleanup for viewing pleasure on purpose. (Drat!) Today's 30+ inch TVs at circuit city (actually a year ago was the last time I checked) show up more mpeg noise in my captures than my 1992 $700 25" Panasonic industrial grade monitor does with the sharpness turned all the way up! Now you're saying that if I ever "upgrade" to a contemporary consumer tv as my video monitor, I will be viewing thru all that smoothing crap. Crap!

The reason I simplify my comments by saying 'tv' is to distinguish 'video monitor' from 'computer video monitor'. I've spent a good bit of time earlier this year (oops last year-2003) on the Divx forum, and it seems that most of those folks believe in watching their movies on their computer! I am severely opposed to that practice and I voiced my reasons over there. So over there it was easier to say 'tv' than 'ntsc video monitor'.

And btw, I take polite exception to your AVI comment. I had MAJOR disappointment a couple years ago when I painfully discovered that files that looked great on my S-VGA monitor (computer), looked TERRIBLE on my ntsc video monitor (tv). So I NEVER trust my computer monitor--I always get it out to my ntsc set so I can SEE all the potential problems my file may have (noise, interlacing errors, etc.). (I might watch my files on the computer a bit more if it could properly show an interlaced signal at 60fps.)

And btw again, I also dislike the overscan that most tvs do. My monitor has it but not as much.

(Sorry y'all if this is too off point for this thread.)

TCmullet

2nd January 2004, 09:42

Originally posted by E-Male
the greyscale question was mostly out of curiousity
but the purpose would for example be removing chroma noise from black&white caps or similar thingsI've thought about this a number of times over several years. Why encode color signal & noise if it's a B/W show? Unfortunately, an mpeg-knowledgable friend claims that the lack of color per se won't improve compression as mpeg is not particular color-sensitive (my term). But it'd be nice if you guys could prove him wrong. Especially if we can do it in Rejig (as an option switch of course), rather than during a re-encode (such as with Tmpgenc).

E-Male

2nd January 2004, 10:02

well, i didn't mean that it would increase the trancoding quality technically

it would just look better for the eye

2nd January 2004, 14:38

Maybe another way to improve quality is to try to figure out how InstantCopy does such a beautiful job most of the time :) Maybe this article (http://www.cdfreaks.com/article/114/2) can help:

Q: Your InstantCopy product is slower than competing products like DVD2one or DVDShrink?

A: You are comparing apples and peaches. While InstantCopy is a full featured transcoder with highest quality output, both programs you are naming do only a quick “requantization” and ignore the lower quality and signal errors in the resulting stream.

Q: I don’t understand. Can you explain the difference in detail?

A: Well, basically MPEG Video is encoded in groups of pictures called GOPs. In every GOP is a reference frame followed by several difference frames. While the reference frame is encoded as a full picture the difference frames contain only the differences to the “last” frame. While encoding every frame is “quantitized” – this means that small, almost unnoticeable differences in the signal are removed. Both InstantCopy and competing programs change the quantization process. However, InstantCopy is the only program that takes the changes done into account for the following frames. This means that additionally to the “quantization” the whole frames needs to be decoded two times and encoded one time which is indeed very time consuming. However, if you only do the quantization the picture quality gets worse with every frame until the next reference frame is decoded – which is the famous annoying "pumping".

MvB

3rd January 2004, 00:11

Hi Nic,

all DVDs i author with your tool or ifoedit won't play in my Liteon LVD 2001. It plays the first second and than freezes.
Because i have another player who plays the discs fine i didn't recognize that earlier.
Do you have an idea why? I author pulldowned progressive material like in nearly every normal NTSC Movie DVD.

Thanks
MvB

E-Male

3rd January 2004, 13:47

every original ntsc dvd i got is NOT pulldowned

also, does that player play other burned dvds?

MvB

3rd January 2004, 23:32

i've learned that all NTSC-movie DVDs are 2:3 pulldown enabled, that means the coresponding bits for the repeation of the halfframes are set.
If you try to play a stream that is not pulldowned you get a very choppy picture

pieroxy

4th January 2004, 00:02

@MvB:
No, not all NTSC-movie DVDs are 2:3 pulldown, even if that is the right way to do it. Most of them are however.
If you try to play a stream that is not pulldowned you get a very choppy pictureNot necessarily. First of all (assuming your stream is 23.976 fps), this kind of stream is not DVD compliant. So it is not even guaranteed that such a stream will play in a DVD player. Depending on the player you will have different results ;)... Mine play them fine.

ffroms

5th January 2004, 10:09

I have to report, again, problems with subs and authoring. Now I have everything working but somewhere in the middle of movie sub simply disappear and after few seconds player (PowerDVD) freeze. Home DVD player acts a little different (jerky playback) but result is the same. I'm guessing that there is some sub muxing problem couse if turn off sub everything is OK. I was using sub2sup and used simple text file *.sub. I've even tried to author DVD with Maestro and rip sub from that DVD and mux with ReJig but same problem happens but on different part of movie. Movie is NTSC if that helps.
Oh, yes. There is still problem/crashing if you try to author two DVD without exiting ReJig completely.

FFS

djan

6th January 2004, 03:55

Originally posted by JvD
My first test on 0.5

2. I tried backing up (DVD Backup feature) Magolia (appr 3h long) and it ran fine from start to end. BUT the result was only a half movie (second half).
Same problem for me with Traffic using ReJig 0.5e.

Joe Fenton

6th January 2004, 03:55

Originally posted by TCmullet
Now you're saying that if I ever "upgrade" to a contemporary consumer tv as my video monitor, I will be viewing thru all that smoothing crap. Crap!

If you look at the first big-screen TVs to come out, they had a VERY blocky picture. To make the pictures look better, they started doing something akin to deblocking. Cheap TVs just do simple interpolation and look a little blurry. Expensive TVs use digital circuitry to really implement some heavy duty smoothing algorithms.

And btw, I take polite exception to your AVI comment. I had MAJOR disappointment a couple years ago when I painfully discovered that files that looked great on my S-VGA monitor (computer), looked TERRIBLE on my ntsc video monitor (tv). So I NEVER trust my computer monitor--I always get it out to my ntsc set so I can SEE all the potential problems my file may have (noise, interlacing errors, etc.). (I might watch my files on the computer a bit more if it could properly show an interlaced signal at 60fps.)

Uh, you got my statement backwards... good AVIs will look bad on TVs because they lose detail. I said bad AVIs look "better" as the TV covers many of the imperfections.

And btw again, I also dislike the overscan that most tvs do. My monitor has it but not as much.

Yep. I don't like that either. I open my TVs up and adjust the overscan to an acceptable level. It helps if you spent high-school working in a TV repair shop. :D

djan

6th January 2004, 13:50

Will the problem of encoding only the end half of the movie be resolved soon please ? Because it's so annoying. Thx.

And there is also another bug in Ifo Mode. When you deselect chapters, you go to another vts and you come back to that vts, the program doesn't memories the selection you did just before.

But otherwise the program rules !!! Very good Job Nic.

Nic

6th January 2004, 14:31

@djan: On all my DVDs (that I've tried) it works and does the full movie..If you dare to part with your Traffic DVD or feeling particulary generous ( ;) ) and feel like buying and sending me a copy then I could fix it ASAP....But I can't replicate it yet :( You may have to wait until I come across one that shows the same problem...

-Nic

djan

6th January 2004, 16:21

Ok, thx Nic, I sent you a private message about Traffic.

And what about the second problem in Ifo Mode ? Do you know about ?

Thx.

DDogg

6th January 2004, 23:10

... and feel like buying and sending me a copy then I could fix it ASAP Nic, maybe you will break down and do that Amazon wishlist I was beating you up about? :) (you need some NTSC stuff!) :D It would actually help folks get stuff to you a lot easier for them while maintaining address privacy for yourself.

sidders

7th January 2004, 12:44

I have been away from this for a few weeks, and decided to give Rejic 0.5e a try. I opened up the rejig data file created with DoItFast4U and ReAuthorist, and it gave me a size for my 2-pass encode. I left the size at this, let Rejig do its thing, then imported into Scenarist.
I found though that my final size was about 150mb too big. I reduced it in Rejig and did it again and it was fine.

My question is, how accurate is the filesize imported into Rejig? When I use the 'big 3', my file size is always correct. Am I doing anything wrong? Does the Rejig data file give Rejig an accurate figure to work with? I notice that the 1-pass is given in terms of a %. Is this accurate?

Sorry for all the questions, but I'm quite new to Rejig - usually use CCE.

bigjohn

7th January 2004, 14:38

Rejig is crashing on me as well.

I took a ReplayTV mpeg file and loaded it in file mode.
I ran the 1 pass function on the file, then Demuxed it.

Then I loaded the m2v and the mpa file into the Author mode.

About 5 minutes into the multiplexing process the application crashes...

John

bill_baroud

7th January 2004, 15:26

quote:Originally posted by JvD
My first test on 0.5

2. I tried backing up (DVD Backup feature) Magolia (appr 3h long) and it ran fine from start to end. BUT the result was only a half movie (second half).

Same problem for me with Traffic using ReJig 0.5e.

are you sure you're not on a FAT32 system, limiting the file to 4gb ? :D

well sometimes you forget about things like that :sly:

Nic

7th January 2004, 16:25

(One of the things delaying the new release is a little message box that pops up and warns you when using Win9X and/or FAT32 ;) )

@bigjohn: Ill look into that, might be to do with the MPA muxing, I've never tried that with DVDAuthor...

@sidders: I dont know much about the DoItFast4U integration as mmgrover did that...I thought (& in testing) the engine produced accurately sized files...However, ReJig can't overly compress a file, so if it is supposed to be very small compared to the original it could end up being oversized.

@DDogg: You may well be right (As always :) ). I do need NTSC DVDs. English DVDs are so simpley put together as well. (Got a box set of DVDs from the director of Battle Royale for christmas hoping they'd have some wacky subtitle problems (but to no avail))

@djan: ReJig in IFO Mode can only work on one VTS set at a time and hence looses the information if your switching to another. It's not really a bug as such because of it.

-Nic

TCmullet

7th January 2004, 16:50

Originally posted by Joe Fenton
Uh, you got my statement backwards... good AVIs will look bad on TVs because they lose detail. I said bad AVIs look "better" as the TV covers many of the imperfections.I'm not sure I have your stmt bwds; I think I'm disagreeing with your statement that files look "better" on the TV. What I'm saying is that any file which may look okay in Wmp on S-VGA, MAY look bad on my industrial grade NTSC monitor. Or, 'bad AVIs look worse as the NTSC monitor shows all the crap that my S-VGA monitor won't'. I don't think my NTSC monitor is doing all that smoothing stuff you're talking about. However, it DOES appear to 'smooth' just by being 10 years old and weaker technology. BUT not as smoothing as my S-VGA monitor, hence my distrust of S-VGA. (I also haven't seen interlaced video properly on S-VGA-- I'm guessing the players drop a field.)

TCmullet

7th January 2004, 17:14

Originally posted by Makira
..I've updated the engine on my side, fixed this, and added a few other things.

@Nic: Could you please clear this up-- Does 0.5e have the updated "new" engine that Makira fixed apparently on 12-29?

Nic

7th January 2004, 18:31

That engine is not in 0.5e...will be in 0.5f. Already put it, just not released yet (looks good as well...definitely the best "new" engine, still haven't tested fully with the old engine)

-Nic

djan

8th January 2004, 00:09

Originally posted by bill_baroud
are you sure you're not on a FAT32 system, limiting the file to 4gb ? :D
No, don't worry, we are not so stupid.

djan

8th January 2004, 00:11

Originally posted by Nic
@djan: ReJig in IFO Mode can only work on one VTS set at a time and hence looses the information if your switching to another. It's not really a bug as such because of it.

So, imagine there are 3 VST and I choose the one I want and I begin the demuxing, will it only demux the one I was on ?

bigjohn

8th January 2004, 00:20

@nic

if you like, I can send you (or put on a FTP server for you to fetch) an M2V/MP2 combination that crashes your application... NTSC / US television.

John

mmgrover

8th January 2004, 02:51

@sidders

If using the lates ver of DoItFast4U, Rejig should be using
the ReJigData.txt file in 2 pass mode.

mike

sidders

8th January 2004, 13:18

I am using 1.4.0.0 - it did open up in 2 pass mode, but the filesize was slighly too big. Just adjusted manually by a little bit and it was fine. I just wondering whether this filesize is as accurate as CCE, as this method produces filesizes that are pretty much spot on.

Rombaldi

10th January 2004, 23:51

I think this is the longest we've gone without some update :D

Superduck

11th January 2004, 01:03

When trying to encode Band of Brothers disc 6 it only encodes the main title and not all the other small ones. This size is also only 3.1 GB instead of 4.3. This was just the one-click I tried. Do I have to use the IFO mode to get this right or is it a known bug?

dvdnew

11th January 2004, 03:36

I want to create a DVD with 2 audio tracks. I import the first track, select English and audio delay of -1605, then I import the second track, select Spanish and audio delay of -1389. I clic in first track it change the language to English but the audio delay stay at -1389, so I changed that back to -1605, clic in second audio, it shows as Spanish but the delay now show -1605.

The audio delay must be the same to create a DVD with 2 audio tracks with ReJig0.5e, or is just a bug that will get fixed in the next release?

Thanks.

dragongodz

11th January 2004, 04:49

Rombaldi - Nic is really busy at work at the moment and want to test a few things before releasing the next version. dont worry it shouldnt be long. :)

dvdnew - yes this sounds like a bug. you could of course correct the ac3 streams to both have 0 delay and then that shouldnt be a problem.

Superduck - what exactly did you do ? some more detail would probably help.

sorry i cant be of more help guys but i have mostly just done tweaks etc to the engines and suggestions for other stuff.

Superduck

11th January 2004, 10:38

Well I started Rejig 0.5E and then there was this menu. Ok, I then selected the rip dvd I'm not really sure what it's called. It's the one in the top left corner. Then I select that it should try to fit it to 4.3 and it starts ripping, doing first the video, then audio, then mixing it and lastly creating a dvd iso for me. But the file size is only 3.1G and the main chapter was the only thing ripped.

djan

11th January 2004, 10:40

Originally posted by Superduck
Well I started Rejig 0.5E and then there was this menu. Ok, I then selected the rip dvd I'm not really sure what it's called. It's the one in the top left corner. Then I select that it should try to fit it to 4.3 and it starts ripping, doing first the video, then audio, then mixing it and lastly creating a dvd iso for me. But the file size is only 3.1G and the main chapter was the only thing ripped.

ReJig is Movie Only !

E-Male

11th January 2004, 11:21

and "movie only" means no use for series or any other kind of DVDs with more then one "main"-part

djan

11th January 2004, 11:47

Also with IFO Mode ?

E-Male

11th January 2004, 14:58

ifo mode is just ripping, demuxing and transcoding
not authoring

dvdnew

11th January 2004, 16:52

Originally posted by dragongodz
dvdnew - yes this sounds like a bug. you could of course correct the ac3 streams to both have 0 delay and then that shouldnt be a problem.
I'm new with this, any tool that can help me correct the ac3 stream?

Thanks.

E-Male

11th January 2004, 17:26

my good old friend Google told me to try this:
http://home.t-online.de/home/520072193568-0001/

dragongodz

11th January 2004, 17:27

Rejig in the file mode has this for demuxing. that is it can correct the delay in the ac3 when you demux it from the mpeg/vob. this would have to be 1 large mpeg/vob and not split of course. i dont know how adding all the split ones would go, that may work but i have not tried it.

its based on a program called ac3 delay corrector(from memory) which is also a seperate program. a bit of searching and it shouldnt be hard to find. :)

dragongodz

11th January 2004, 17:29

hahaha E-Male we were typing at the same time. :)

lets all please not forget that Rejig is just at version 0.5 so dont expect it to do everything yet. :D

robot1

11th January 2004, 17:32

Ac3 delay corrector:

http://farmi007.bei.t-online.de

robot1

11th January 2004, 17:33

Sorry... I was late!

E-Male

11th January 2004, 18:16

at least we all agree :)

djan

12th January 2004, 15:03

Originally posted by E-Male
ifo mode is just ripping, demuxing and transcoding
not authoring

Ok, but you can choose the VTS to Encode, so it's not a problem for multi main movies.

And Ifo Mode doesn't make auto Authoring ?

E-Male

12th January 2004, 15:21

it has an option to also author (which i never used)
but i think what you want is to put multiple episodes on one dvdr, and rejig alone won't do that for you (anybody correct me if i'm wrong)

djan

13th January 2004, 01:31

Oh yes, it's right because you have to encode each vts separately but you can then re-author them and put them in the same vts.

dvdnew

13th January 2004, 06:50

Originally posted by robot1
Ac3 delay corrector:

http://farmi007.bei.t-online.de Thanks, it works great, now I can get around the Audio Delay bug in ReJig 0.5e.

ReJig team: How about to include an option to only create a single VOB? This way I can import the VOB into other tool to create the menu and the final DVD. I think ReJig creates a single VOB then break that in 1GB VOBs and create IFOs and BUPs, so this option will not be hard to implement.

Thanks for this great tool.

Mango Madness

13th January 2004, 09:32

i wonder if you could steal some dvd decrytor code to add burning support so that this program could do it all. Just my evil plans.

Nic

13th January 2004, 09:54

@dvdnew: Yup that sounds like a bug, ill fix that soon. Ammon82 has already asked me have a feature that just creates the Vob, so it can be used with other apps, so ill add that too.

@Mango: I can't use DVDDecrypter code, but I could make a .ISO and use DVDDecrypter to burn (But I think for the minute, thats dangerous as the bugs might mean you burn Movies with problems automatically without checking...)

Vapor very kindly bought and sent two NTSC DVDs to me, so ill be testing them tonight, and then release a new version soon (which will also contain Makira's latest engine...)

-Nic

Makira

14th January 2004, 19:29

Originally posted by Nic
[...] and then release a new version soon (which will also contain Makira's latest engine...)

I'll post a bug fix very soon, that was found a few hours ago, so if you can wait till then..

TCmullet

14th January 2004, 19:54

Yes, I'm sure many of us are eager for 0.5f, but MUCH better to wait a little longer and have the engine as bug-free as possible. I hope this feeling is universal. :)

djan

14th January 2004, 20:33

The engine of Makira is just the new one no ? So why not the release a new version keeping the old one and then release another one when the one of Makira is ready.

TCmullet

14th January 2004, 20:41

Here's why: Don't release software with known serious bugs. Fix bugs, then release. There are always enough unknown bugs to cause many releases later anyway. This should apply to all software. If Makira says there's a bug, then Nic ought to hold off for a bit. I'd rather wait a tiny bit longer than proceed to damage my valuable projects by committing to use a KNOWN broken engine.

Makira

14th January 2004, 23:47

It's not just a small bug affecting the quality, it's a hard bug making the whole thing crash completly. The kind of bug you don't want to release unless you happen to like having to answer incessant support requests (...grmbls...)

It is currently fixed, just testing a little more and it'll be posted in the next 24 hours (either this evening or tomorrow's afternoon, depending how much sleepy I'll be).

Nic

15th January 2004, 10:22

Thanks for keeping us informed Makira :) . I've been mainly working on the code for 0.6 which will do the transcoding in the vob and then write out to vob, skipping all the muxing and submuxing, etc etc. (hence the delays...)

-Nic

15th January 2004, 10:45

That's great news, Nic! Does this mean ReJig 0.6 could be used to shrink DVD menu VOBs (VTS_XX_0.VOB) on the fly?

Nic

15th January 2004, 12:06

@RB: My knowledge of Menu Vobs is almost nothing. But my assumption is they have a 0xe0 stream like any other VOB and that can recompressed in the same way. I hope it will work. We'll have to see. got to get my PES writing correct (and the SCR values) first ;)

-Nic

ps
The delay has been really, ive had to write my own DeCSS class, my own demuxing, etc etc all again from scratch for speed.

djan

15th January 2004, 14:07

Keep Running Nic, you're the best. :)

JvD

15th January 2004, 14:58

Oh man, been away for some weeks now, havent even been close to doom9 :eek: soooo I hade a lot to catch up concerning ReJig. I am reaaally impressed. At the moment (after testing the existing builds) I am eager to try that new version with Makiras new engine. Also RBs question put Rejig in a new light, will this be possible? EXCITING! Great work Nic!

Makira

15th January 2004, 22:17

updated:
http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/M2VRequantiser_150104.tgz

dvdnew

15th January 2004, 22:23

Originally posted by Nic
@dvdnew: Yup that sounds like a bug, ill fix that soon. Ammon82 has already asked me have a feature that just creates the Vob, so it can be used with other apps, so ill add that too.

-Nic Thank you, this is a great tool.

djan

15th January 2004, 23:12

Just waiting Nic now for a new version :)

Nic

16th January 2004, 16:31

(Just to let you know, (because I've been so quiet), I have a commandline app now that goes from VOB->VOB with no demuxing and uses the "Old Engine" to do compression...Very Quick ;) ). So once I've got some bugs out of 0.5, 0.6 shouldn't be too far away (and ReJig will finally be able to compete slightly on the movie only backups...

...Then I can begin on full dvd backup for 0.7, but that's getting ahead of myself)

-Nic

ffroms

16th January 2004, 16:44

Whoa!! This sounds so good. Now I only wish to send my self in future to test new ReJig 1.0 :D . I think we going to have DVDShrink substitute and even better.

FFS

duartix

16th January 2004, 17:02

Jolly great work Nic. :)

I just hope the community doesn't forget you or Shrink as soon as the dual layer recorders hit the market.

I surely, won't!

djan

16th January 2004, 20:02

Originally posted by ffroms
I think we going to have DVDShrink substitute and even better.
FFS
Sure, it's already better concerning the quality. This prog is amazing !!!

TEB

20th January 2004, 00:26

Hi, Nic/Makira i sorta asked this before a long time ago, but ill try again.. is it possible to make the program confine to a spesific max bandwith? Like transrate the videostream down from eg. VBR 2-9mbit down to 2-4mbit: like force the peaks to never go over a given max bitrate?

keep up the fantastic work guys!!

teb

Makira

20th January 2004, 03:01

everything's possible, but some things takes more time than others. Anyway, why would you want to do that ?

btw nic, I've just found another bad bug in the last engine I posted, I'll post an update as soon as I've tested everything is ok. It's just a one word change.

Rombaldi

20th January 2004, 07:07

@Makira

I posed this some time back, but after seeing your answer on it it's possible to strip the color I'll re-ask it.

Is it possible to adjust the black level during a transcoding? Add/Subtract 'x' amount? Reason I ask is that I have a pot full of MPEG2 streams that were recorded on a Panasonic DMR-E20 recorder that (on the E20's... changed later) had the black level set to the Japan standard and for US video are 7.5 IRE too high. The E20 (and others) will compensate for it on playback, but most decks won't, giving a washed out appearance unless you back down the brightness. The prospect of re-rncoding (and in most cases, going a generation down) all that dosen't thrill me.

TEB

20th January 2004, 08:55

Well i need it for a Broadband project where our max. bandwith is around 5mbit netto.. The peaks can never go over that for a long time period since its over UDP.

Nic

20th January 2004, 12:31

Thanks for the info Makira, please post the update when you can :)

(Coding for the new DVDBackup mode is going well, it is fast, but looks like im going to have to write my own IFO parsing...grrrr)

-Nic

ps
Ahhh, Worked out how you do IFO parsing, now just got to implement it ;)

Makira

20th January 2004, 19:11

@nic: http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/M2VRequantiser_200104.tgz
@teb: I see. iirc, videolan is using the requantiser for the same purpose, so maybe they implemented something like this, I haven't checked what they did with m2vrequant.
@rombaldi: stripping color is easy for 99% of the blocks, for the other 1%, it would mean some tedious work.. about changing brightness, it should be fairly easy, I'll even test it right now!

Rombaldi

20th January 2004, 19:47

@Makira

If you can pull that off, several thousand Panasonic owners will be at your feet! I've got enough files to test with so LMK!!!

@Nic

sure you don't want to make the engine a DLL for quick changes :D :D

Makira

20th January 2004, 20:16

@rombaldi: well, it's done! btw I accept donations! (see my homepage (http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/), which needs updating, for a paypal link) :D

here's the code: http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/M2VRequantiser_200104_cb.tgz

for normal usage it is better to turn it off, since changing brightness forces you to recompress every slice, even though sometime you'd be better off copying the original.

Anyway it works :)

Amnon82

20th January 2004, 21:28

Yup that sounds like a bug, ill fix that soon. Ammon82 has already asked me have a feature that just creates the Vob, so it can be used with other apps, so ill add that too.

THX nic! I can't wait for the next version!

... K it was a little long time I looked into Your thread nic. I translated QCCE into german, but this is another story.

I'm looking forward. Creating a big nonsplitted VOB-file is usefull for DVDlab. So we can easier creating (motion-)menus for our DVD-Projects.

2cool wrote a guide about this, but it will only work with a big VOBfile. (Guide is not released I think :-) Thanks to 2cool for sending it to me :D )

It is good to know that the DVDAuthor is now faster. Thats cool. I don't know why I only use ReJig for muxing my DVDs. I think it is the best freeware DVDAuthor on the market.

Big THX to You Nic for it!

Rombaldi

20th January 2004, 22:06

Originally posted by Makira
@rombaldi: well, it's done! btw I accept donations! (see my homepage (http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/), which needs updating, for a paypal link) :D

here's the code: http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/M2VRequantiser_200104_cb.tgz

for normal usage it is better to turn it off, since changing brightness forces you to recompress every slice, even though sometime you'd be better off copying the original.

Anyway it works :)

@Makira

bloody hell! I've not the brilliance to do the compile, but I'll await this with open arms while one of the other resident genius make it available! Since the major use for this will be a straight brightness drop and not a recompress it should't look too shabby!

someone make a CL version of this so I can properly test it! Once the word spreads on this, you may well get more than a few from the Panasonic owners!

Makira

20th January 2004, 23:37

Originally posted by Rombaldi
bloody hell! I've not the brilliance to do the compile, but I'll await this with open arms while one of the other resident genius make it available! Since the major use for this will be a straight brightness drop and not a recompress it should't look too shabby!

http://www.info.polymtl.ca/~anmis/M2VRequantiser_200104_cb_win.tgz

You'll note something about not supposed to redistribute with the version of vc++ I have, well, that'll be fixed soon. I don't compile for windows often..

That also means I'll be able to post a windows exe when I request comments on updates.. It shouldn't be difficult keeping something that compiles on macos x, linux and windows, since it's mostly standard C.

The compiled executable only changes brightness, and will not recompress. Usage is:

m2vrequantiser.exe 0 0 size_of_input_m2v_in_bytes brigthness_delta input.m2v output.m2v

(the 2 zeros are ignored values)

<edit>
examples:
m2vrequantiser.exe 0 0 47638234 20 original.m2v brigher.m2v
m2vrequantiser.exe 0 0 47638234 -20 original.m2v darker.m2v
</edit>

Amnon82

20th January 2004, 23:43

Nic, I've a question about the DVDAuthor: Why have I in my multiplexed movies sometimes some picturehangs? I use Your DVDAuthor to multiplex MPV-files created by QCCE.DE (CCE) and the original AC3/DTS tracks.

The last movie I multiplexed was Pirates of the Caribian (POC). It has on the starts on some chapters litle picture hangs. I can see this more on ATI-Cards. On NVIDIA-Cards the hangs are not so long. I think the halftime as on ATI.

Then I multiplexed the same sources of POC with IFOEdit 0.96 and didn't got the picturehangs. What is going wrong?

I think it depends on the multiplexing of DVDAuthor. Don't get me wrong. Your DVDAuthor is better than IFOEdit in multiplexing cos of DTS.
You rewrite the DVDAuthor as written in Your Posts, so I think this will maybe fix this bug.

THX for going on with Your app. I hope the next version will come soon...

robot1

21st January 2004, 00:30

@ Nic
as you're working to the reauthoring module, would it possible to insert an option to re-mux a new .m2v into the vob (a la ifoedit) ...
This option in ifoedit is buggy, and in vobedit isn't very simple to use. It wuold be great to remux without demuxing every stream!

E-Male

21st January 2004, 00:35

hm, while we're at that:
would your ne code allow to add new subs and/or audio-tracks during the vob-->vob?

TEB

21st January 2004, 09:23

Hi, Makira, u mentioned that the Videolan project is using the req. for the same purpose.. didnt know that they used it.. Could be very interresting to see what they did tho this was new to me since i didnt know that they could do anything else than remux from PS to TS..

I would apriciate it immensly if u added VBR - CBR or downscaled VBR with a max bandwith support..

Keep up the intensly good work guys!!

teb

Nic

21st January 2004, 10:38

@robot1: Yes, I could do that now, but it may take a while. It's a fiddily thing ;) jdobbs once said he was writing something to do it. Actually putting the m2v in the vobs is easy, getting it perfect is real tricky....

@e-male: Same thing, tricky. But can be done quite easily, would just need a lot of testing.

@amnon82: Is that the Region 2 of POC? I have that at home, so I can test it...What streams were using? (languages/subs etc)

@Makira: Excellent work, I like the brightness control. :) One of the VideoLan developers works with me, ill ask him what they're upto with m2vrequantiser ;)

-Nic

ps
Finished the IFO Parsing code now, so hopefully can start putting all this code into ReJig now...

TEB

21st January 2004, 10:48

thx nic!

Amnon82

21st January 2004, 13:33

@ Nic, Yes it is the Region 2 Version of Germany. Here are the original IFOs:

http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/filez/POCIFOSDE.exe

I think this will help You to check if You have the same version.

Here are the troubles I've with this movie:

I want to have the english + german AC3s + english and german + subs.
0xE0, 0x80, 0x81, 0x20, 0x21, 0x22, 0x2B (Streaminfo by rejig)

I used Your version 0.5e for demuxing the m2v,ac3s and subs.
m2v I only demux and reencoded it with QCCE.DE with my modded settings to a DRP 2.2 M2V-file (special Template to get a amazing quality and a less Q value in CCE).
The AC3 delay was always 0.
The count of the subs was in ReJig 12.
In IFOEdit 14. (I think this is one of the troubles)

The first time I muxes the DVD with DVDAuthor I had a M2V-Delay.
The AC3 streams were sync with the subs. So I thought it must be a AC3Delay.

So I demuxed the M2V and the AC3s with DVDDecrypter and checked the AC3 Streams and the original demuxed M2V stream in MPC for sync.

They were sync. Then I checked the M2V and the AC3 streams demuxed by ReJig (IFO Mode) with MPC and they weren't sync. So it wasn't QCCE.DE.

Then I reencoded the M2V-file demuxed by DVDDecrypter in QCCE.DE and checked again of syncness in MPC. This version was sync.

I demuxed the subs with Vob2Sub + SubtoSup and muxed this with ReJig DVDAuthor. I got a sync Video + Audio without subs. I can choose them in MPC but never displayed...

Then I used the subs demuxed by rejig and got a Video + Audio sync with Subdelays on all subs. (They are sync if I muxed them with the reencoded M2V demuxed by rejig, but then I got again the M2V delay...)

Here is the Demuxstreaminfo of DVDDecrypter:
0x20 - Subtitle - English / Normal Captions - [SubPicture 01: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 9854 / PTS: 00:00:29.647 / Delay: 29360ms
0x21 - Subtitle - English / Normal Closed Captions - [SubPicture 02: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 8944 / PTS: 00:00:26.607 / Delay: 26320ms
0x22 - Subtitle - Deutsch / Normal Captions - [SubPicture 03: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 3874 / PTS: 00:00:09.607 / Delay: 9320ms
0x23 - Subtitle - Français / Normal Captions - [SubPicture 04: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 3645 / PTS: 00:00:08.967 / Delay: 8680ms
0x24 - Subtitle - Italiano / Normal Captions - [SubPicture 05: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 3648 / PTS: 00:00:08.967 / Delay: 8680ms
0x25 - Subtitle - Español / Normal Captions - [SubPicture 06: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 3818 / PTS: 00:00:09.407 / Delay: 9120ms
0x26 - Subtitle - Turkish / Normal Captions - [SubPicture 07: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 3533 / PTS: 00:00:08.687 / Delay: 8400ms
0x27 - Subtitle - Deutsch / Normal Director's Comments - [SubPicture 08: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 4318 / PTS: 00:00:10.687 / Delay: 10400ms
0x28 - Subtitle - Turkish / Normal Director's Comments - [SubPicture 09: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 4108 / PTS: 00:00:10.167 / Delay: 9880ms
0x29 - Subtitle - Deutsch / Normal Director's Comments - [SubPicture 10: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 2831 / PTS: 00:00:04.527 / Delay: 4240ms
0x2A - Subtitle - Turkish / Normal Director's Comments - [SubPicture 11: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 2838 / PTS: 00:00:04.527 / Delay: 4240ms
0x2B - Subtitle - Deutsch - [SubPicture 12: Wide/Letterbox] / LBA: 3876 / PTS: 00:00:09.607 / Delay: 9320ms
0x80 - Audio - AC3 / 6ch / 48kHz / DRC / English / LBA: 2336 / PTS: 00:00:00.287 / Delay: 0ms
0x81 - Audio - AC3 / 6ch / 48kHz / DRC / Deutsch / LBA: 2337 / PTS: 00:00:00.287 / Delay: 0ms
0x83 - Audio - AC3 / 1ch / 48kHz / DRC / English - Director's Comments / LBA: 2339 / PTS: 00:00:00.287 / Delay: 0ms
0x84 - Audio - AC3 / 1ch / 48kHz / DRC / English - Alternate Director's Comments / LBA: 2340 / PTS: 00:00:00.287 / Delay: 0ms
0x8A - Audio - DTS / 6ch / 48kHz / DRC / Deutsch / LBA: 2338 / PTS: 00:00:00.287 / Delay: 0ms
0xE0 - Video - MPEG-2 / 720x576 (PAL) / 16:9 / Letterboxed / LBA: 2328 / PTS: 00:00:00.287 / Delay: 0ms

I think I try to mux now the subs created by sub2sup with the M2V and AC3s demuxed by DVDDecrypter in IFOEdit to see what append. I'll post the result in a new post...

Can You add a subdelayfix for such hard movies?

Amnon82

21st January 2004, 13:58

Here is the result of multiplexing with IFOEdit 0.96

M2V demuxed by DVDDecrypter, reencoded by QCCE.DE (http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/files/QCCE.DE101RC1.EXE)
AC3 streams demuxed by DVDDecrypter
Subs demuxed by Vobsub + SubtoSup

Result image by IFOEdit (http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/images/POCFD.jpg)

I got framedrops and not working VOBs without ifos.
If I use the demuxed subs by rejig I got subdelays.
How can I convert the demuxed subs by DVDDecrypter to SUPs or get rid of the subdelays of the subs by rejig?

BTW: this is the guide I created by authoring POC:

http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/main.php?set=drp22guide

TEB

21st January 2004, 14:54

just a fast question: I see on Windows Task manager that rejig 5e never uses more than 5-30% cpu time and the rest is free on my pc.
Its a 3ghz P4 800mhz fsb with hyperthreading turned on. How can i get it to use a high % of the cpu's cycles in the system?
Most other encoders tend to use 100%.
Is it that IO bound? I only got a 7200rpm ide drive that its sitting on...

best regards teb

Nic

21st January 2004, 15:14

@ammon82: At present the Sup files have the a PTS stored in them that is in relation to the M2V File. If you re-encode with CCE then the PTSs will change and the SUP will not match...Hmmm, tricky to fix without breaking the SUP format (I'd use an offset that is in relation to the first PTS...but even that proves difficult because PTSs reset, etc at any time)

@TEB: Yup, it has to do so much disk accessing, that the processor usage stays very low for the main part. Even my new code, has v.low usage, maybe i'll try optimising it to use more CPU speed as it might help....

-Nic

TEB

21st January 2004, 15:19

Can u make it use more memory to increase the read cache and write cache? Like read larger parts of the source file in advance and write larger parts of the file in the same chunck to reduce IO overhead through the movement on the HDD heads..

Nic

21st January 2004, 16:06

@TEB: That doesn't always create a faster process. infact it can seriously slow it down on windows....I wrote some code to find the size of an M2V in a VOB. It read large amounts in, then processed it, then read again. This was a lot slower than reading a little bit processing then reading another little bit....

What Im trying to do now is split my new code into two threads, one that reads and transcodes the other that writes...

-Nic

Amnon82

21st January 2004, 16:31

@Nic:

The last conversations were:

Blue Crush - no problems
Daddy Day Care - no problems
Panic Room - no problems
Tears of the Sun - no problems

And Pirates of the Caribian - M2V delay, AC3 Delay, Sub delays

So I think it is cos of the source.
All other movies I done before had only one or 2 PGCs.
POC has 20 PGCs.
So I let the source DVD Image on my HDD and the encoded M2V and AC3s and wait with this movie till Your next version is out.

Today I can demux it with DVDDecrypter into subs, but which programm can resync them and convert them to SUPs? Or should I rip the subs with SupRip to srt and convert them then to SUPs?

What will be the easiest way to crack this 'hard-nut-film'?

TCmullet

21st January 2004, 17:28

Originally posted by TCmullet
@Nic: Could you please clear this up-- Does 0.5e have the updated "new" engine that Makira fixed apparently on 12-29?I hope that when you upgrade 0.5e to 0.5f, that with all the many other changes you're making, that you remember to include the new engine. For me, this will be the only reason to upgrade to 0.5f, as rejiging .m2v files is all I can do right now. (Still don't have DVDs or a player.) But I still stand by my statement that it's better to wait a bit longer for a bug-free engine than to release one and have it crash or damage the .m2v output. (My HD isn't full yet!) :)

robot1

21st January 2004, 17:53

Originally posted by Nic
@robot1: Yes, I could do that now, but it may take a while. It's a fiddily thing ;) jdobbs once said he was writing something to do it. Actually putting the m2v in the vobs is easy, getting it perfect is real tricky....

@e-male: Same thing, tricky. But can be done quite easily, would just need a lot of testing.

If you need testing ... you're welcome.

Amnon82

21st January 2004, 19:25

This is strange!

If I rip form a DVDDecrypter.ISO I got 0ms in all AC3s.
If I rip it instead directly form the DVD I got -480ms in all AC3s...

Whats going on? It is the classicer Reindeer Games btw...

What also strange is, that I can select the only german sub on the disc but rejig dosn't rip it... ... finaly I got a m2p-file... why? M2V was it and it becomes a m2p with 0 mb... I think it cos of the sub...

Also I don't understand why rejig fixes 0ms AC3streams? It is not necessary... can You, nic, add a routine to check if 0ms is present and skip then AC3 Delay correction also when activated in the ripmode.

[EDIT] ... it was the sub-file. If I don't select the sub I got a m2v...

Amnon82

22nd January 2004, 22:30

I found something out about POC German DVD.
The IFO VTS_01_0.IFO has 58 PGCs and the Subs have also this 58 PGCs!!!
I extracted the subs with VOBEdit and found this out.

Now I ripped the SUBs with VobSub again and stripped the wanted subs out with VOBSubStrip. Lets see what now happend...

... I got it somehow ... Nice rejig! this app rocks POC. Now it is all sync

TEB

27th January 2004, 01:49

Anyone noticed that some of the rejigged .m2v files there are errors in the slice-layer. Ive got some STB's that "stutters" during movement. I cant get this to fail on a pc player... But i guess the STB's are more sensitive to faults in the stream. Any idea?

And another thing i saw, i had a 4gb 1hour 25minute clip of LOTR2se, did a rejig 70% of the .m2v and now i have a 3gb 55minute clip? what happened to the timestamps? It seems that the whole movie is there but the timestamps is tottally frekay... It fools the mpeg2 player im using... (elecard 2.2)

Another thing, ive tested the IO performance now in rejig. Im rejigging from 1 Raid 0 volume to my other ide disk on my pc (dual xeon 2.4ghz HT) and i still only use like 10% of the total capacity (cpu wize) and i can see that rejig is writing around 3megs per sec to the ide drive.. It can easily write 15megs to it per sec when i do a normal copy... Like when i use dvdshrink to the same drive i get like 4-5 times more speed...
Whats holding up Rejig? Any idea Nic?

best regards teb

unixfs

27th January 2004, 09:38

I have the same stuttering problem, and sometimes the top stripe of the video seems to missing or shifted to the right; not only in hardware players:
mplayer complains of missing MVs and more when you play
the resulting m2v with -vc ffmpeg12

Nic

27th January 2004, 10:28

@TEB: Which mode are you using ReJig in to get such slow speeds?

I have noticed the TimeStamp thing before, but can't figure where the problem is yet...Ill look into that. Still working on the VOB->VOB code, want it glitch free. Very close to being ready though.

@unixfs: What kind of files are you transcoding?

-Nic

unixfs

27th January 2004, 10:58

I'm transcoding DVB captures (mpeg-ts).
The original ones play correctly with -vc ffmpeg12, but I'm
using Makira's last version of m2vrequant under linux (sorry for
having forgotten to mention it).

Nic

27th January 2004, 12:05

"original ones" ? Do you mean the original DVB MPEG-2? Does the same problem occur when using the "old engine" of ReJig?

dragongodz

27th January 2004, 13:12

"what happened to the timestamps?"
TEB can you load the original ifo in to something like ifoedit and see if there are any layer breaks or look through the cell entries for discontinuites. these can be where the timestamps are set back to 0 which could(i repeast, could) be part of the problem.

unixfs

27th January 2004, 13:15

Originally posted by Nic
"original ones" ? Do you mean the original DVB MPEG-2?

yes

Does the same problem occur when using the "old engine" of ReJig?

I haven't tested it for a while, I'll try tonight or tomorrow.

TEB

27th January 2004, 15:29

Nic: filemode, 1pass at 70% recompress job..
I see that on my 3ghz p4 HT at work it uses a much higher % of the cpu, but not that much more when i move to different source and destination drives... Im really curious about that... Should really help alot splitting up reads and writes.. any idea?
Dragon: I havent used ifoedit yet.. Ill look into it and check. I can take a chunk of the ftp and put it on a ftp for u to look at guys..

biggy7

27th January 2004, 16:19

having read the good reports about rejig, i decided to have a go.

was doing a dvd movie, got through all the processes and was on demuxing subs, then crashed :( had to close it. This happened to anyone else?

E-Male

27th January 2004, 21:17

quick question:
in what format do i have to enter the chapters when authoring?

Amnon82

27th January 2004, 23:31

@E-Male: In frames. In Chapter-X-tractor it will be

%f \n

Enter this in 'Format' into the field 'Format:'.

And delete the first 0 Frame Chapter.

dragongodz

29th January 2004, 12:46

TEB - since Nic said he has come across this aswell he may want to check it out aswell. i am of course asuming Nic knows how to find layer breaks and discontinuities with ifoedit(no Nic please dont hit me :) ).
if you want to look though then load the relevant ifo and open the VTS_PGCITI and the contained link VTS_PGC_1 (asuming the movie is the first). in the bottom window scroll down to the cell playback. the first cell always has STC discontinuity as YES. see if any of the other cells do aswell. if yes then add all the playback times for the cells up to that and see if that equells the short time.

TomSem

29th January 2004, 14:00

Hi ,
First Rejig rocks , very fast and good quality,
Now i'm backup poc and the multiplexed movie shows
stutters every 2-3 seconds during the whole movie.
I 've had this problem before with narc.
Both poc and narc are interlaced ( bitrateviewer ).
So my conclusion is that rejig can not handle interlaced sources.
Or am i doing someting wrong ?
Tis is my process : smartripper -> rejig -> ifoedit author
Any help ?

Nic

29th January 2004, 14:32

ifoedit author ? Why not use ReJig's DVD Author ? Are you having problems with it? (Apart from it being slow ;) )
Are your Narc and POC NTSC? IFOEdit's Author doesn't like NTSC.

@biggy7: Sorry you had a bad time with ReJig. With luck 0.6 shouldn't be far away and far quicker and less buggy than previous versions...please try again then and hopefully it will be better for you..

-Nic

TCmullet

29th January 2004, 18:15

@Nic, I'm puzzled you don't have 0.5f out 1st, then start working on .6 and .7. Don't most software authors release one version before starting to work on the next? (I used to myself when I had a job as a programmer.) Forgive me, but I'm drooling for that "new" new engine for my overweight .m2v files. :)

Nic

29th January 2004, 18:30

That is true, but it seems silly to release a 0.5f when their are bugs in 0.5e that need fixing. I'd rather fix them and release them as 0.5f than a bug ridden one with the new engine...

DMagic1

30th January 2004, 08:56

Hey all,
I been folowing this since the first qui was made for it. Because of a shortage of time, I fell behind on a lot of the improvements and bugs/problems.

I just did a movie only of Alien Resurrection Special Edition. The quality seemed great. I didn't notice some picture problems that I see with both CloneDVD and a little with DVD95Copy.

There are two problems I notice with Rejig.
1. I selected the standard size but my movie came out to be 4,295,000bytes or what ever. Almost 400mb short.
2. All chapters after the first 2 were off by a couple of seconds.

If this has been talked about before pardon me. I fell a little behind 6 or 7 pages back.

Nic

30th January 2004, 09:50

@DMagic: Thanks for the bug report. Hopefully the new version will fix the filesize issues. I still get the odd undersized file...but this may be due to the old engine. testing on the new engine will begin soon.

Ive changed the way chapters are added and now it's frame accurate (rather than based on a time). Thanks to Vapor ill be able to test NTSC DVDs too so ill make sure that's 100% for the next version.

-Nic

Amnon82

30th January 2004, 12:53

Nice to hear that You now can test NTSCs.
Nic you do great job with rejig. 0.6 must be a great version, I can't wait...
I check every day if you've released a new version (k, not every day...). When is it possible to add more than one title with Your DVDAuthor? For IFOEdit it was planed but till not released with this feature. Nic Your DVDAuthor is the only one in the freeware scene who handles DTS. I had many problems with IFOEdit trying to add DTS streams. So I used Your DVDAuthor since.

I've noticed that I had some picture hangs (sometimes the moviepart speeds up or slow down). I think this will never happend with the transcoded M2V. I encode my M2Vs new with QCCE. So I think I'm almost the only one here in this thread who tests Your DVDAuthor with M2Vs encoded by CCE 2.67.00.23.

This speed ups and slow downs are almost at chapterpoints. I encode now a movie again with I-frames at the chapterpoints. So I'll test if this hangs came up again add tell you the result in the next reply here.

Amnon82

30th January 2004, 14:30

AppName: rejig.exe AppVer: 0.3.0.0 ModName: rejig.exe
ModVer: 0.3.0.0 Offset: 000b79b5

was the errormessage. I tried it twice and it happed exactly at the same positon in the submux-step.
Maybe it was cos of sups created by VOBSUB + SUB2SUP.

IfoEdit muxed the DVD without a error...

btw it was Devils Advocate.

..hope the next DVDAuthor version will fix this...

E-Male

30th January 2004, 16:32

i got a problem which is either caused by rejig dvd author or vobedit

but i have to start a lil more early
i'm experimenting with backing up series, in this case futurama

1. i ripped 3 episodes (the first 2 and a random one from disc 2)
2. with vobedit i changed the ID of the 3rd episode to be sure the 3 episodes hav the IDs 1, 2 & 3, in thw right order
3. i renamed the 3 vobs to be the 3 parts of one vts (and added the original ifo to teh folder)
4.i used the remux/strip-stream-feature of ifoedit to recreate them as correct 1GB vobs

now i have the 3 episodes as one dvdr, everythign workign fine, but the chapters are not right, i want them to be one chapter per episode

a) so i demuxed the vobs wiht vobedit
b) and remuxed them with rejig dvd author, copying sub-colors from the original and using selfmade chapters

but the result had one big error:
all subs are in episode one (and none in 2 and 3)

now this is either caused in step a) or b)

any ideas?
if not consider it a bug-report
but i really don't know if it's vobedit or rejig

CU
E-Male

Nic

30th January 2004, 19:08

Hmmmm....problem due to the PTS values not being continuous....and hence confuses SUPMux...

IFOEdit has a bit that supposedly can correct PTSs (in the VOB Extras bit)...But it's never worked for me...

Ill look into this..

-Nic

maa

30th January 2004, 20:58

Question:

Is rejig dvd author taken from IfoEdit - it looks the same.
I'm having DTS trouble so is the muxing engine the same or not?
(Would save me some experimental time)

thanks

maa

TCmullet

30th January 2004, 22:39

Originally posted by TC @Nic, I'm puzzled you don't have 0.5f out 1st, then start working on .6 and .7. Don't most software authors release one version before starting to work on the next?Originally posted by Nic
That is true, but it seems silly to release a 0.5f when there are bugs in 0.5e that need fixing. I'd rather fix them and release them as 0.5f than a bug ridden one with the new engine...Of course. :) But I wasn't suggesting release .5f with bugs, but rather why not finish debugging and releasing .5f (w/new engine) before working on .6 or .7 at all? Don't misunderstand; I'm not trying to pressure you-- I just don't understand why the 3 versions would be worked on in parallel. (You can do whatever you want--you're the programmer!)

Nic

31st January 2004, 01:22

@maa: No, it's just made to look the same. I have no eye for presentation...at work I leave that to the designer (the same guy who drew the splash image in rejig)

@TC: Ahhh, because 0.6 will mean I can get rid of some code and means other code can change. For example, because of the code i've written in 0.6, dvdauthor mode no longer has to create one big vob and then create the split up vobs. It can now create the vobs in 1gb chunks and IFOs made out of them...
But the main reason is I want ReJig useable by anyone for DVD backup, and 0.5 just isn't...it's got too many bugs & is too slow for most people. 0.6 can backup a DVD on win2k/xp/win9x without any real bugs or desync etc and very quickly too....
But as you say the real main reason is: "You can do whatever you want--you're the programmer!)" ;)

-Nic

ps
Just an update:
Tried ripping Pirates of the Carribean (R2) and with 0.6 it worked fine. However when burnt to DVD it played fine in my yamada DVD player, but had troubles seeking in my sisters toshiba. So ill look into that...but apart from that all flawless (subs and all)

TCmullet

31st January 2004, 01:27

@Nic: Then it sounds like .5f should not be done, and that 0.6a will be the next release. Hope it comes soon... Soon as the new engine can be tested to your satisfaction.

Amnon82

1st February 2004, 00:38

Nice to hear about 0.6, nic. Can't wait for it...:D

Pfc Joker

1st February 2004, 14:05

@Nic......You know I saw this thread go up but never looked into it because I've been so heavy into Scenarist CCE stuff lately. Especially DoItFastForU 1.4.4, why didn't somebody tell me it's a transcoder. ;)

Anyway, it's comparo time now. Can't wait for the .6 version, I know I'm a little late but thanks for the new toy Nic!

Edit-I've used ReJig on a couple of movies now with the DVD Backup mode, the output is undersized but you get out what you put in. For example; "The Grinch" is a 7.64 gb disc but the main movie part is only 4.05 gb of the whole.

TomSem

2nd February 2004, 11:28

One of them is POC RII and Narc RII.
The new engine crash in the middle of POC
The old engine shows skipping every 3 seconds
on some players and other players can't do FF or REW.
So i 'll rebackup Spirited Away RII again to see if Rejig realy has problems with interlaced DVD's.

Nic

2nd February 2004, 11:31

Thanks for the report TomSem. Hopefully the new DVD Backup mode will remove all these problems. And the newest engine will hopefully not crashed. I had FF/RW problems with POC, but I think I've fixed them now...ill be testing tonight.

@all:
I'm thinking of removing IFO mode from the next release. So it will just be File Mode, DVD Backup (for Movie Only backups) and DVD Author. It means less work for me and I think those are the main points. If I can get them bug free then I think ReJig will at a good state and then then 0.7 will copy whole DVDs, etc.

-Nic

maa

2nd February 2004, 12:03

Can something be done about the FAT32 limit when Demuxing ?
I think thats the reason my backups have been cut short and DVDAuthor didn't even start....

Nic

2nd February 2004, 12:09

@maa: That's a bit tricky, I haven't begun work on that yet, but I will. That's all fixed for DVD Backup mode but not for DVD Author mode yet. Just the M2V file itself is going to be larger than the FAT32 boundary...supporting old FAT32 is a bit of a nightmare but ill look into it.

maa

2nd February 2004, 12:43

Surely if you break it into 2 Giga chunks and alow DVDAuthor to accept/join more than one file it should work ?

Nic

2nd February 2004, 14:03

Yeah, I know, but none of the GPL code I use expects multiple files (i.e dvdauthor, mplex, etc), so I have to go in and change it all just because some people insist in living in the dark ages with FAT32 ;) lol

But I will get round to it :)

-Nic

lighty

2nd February 2004, 14:35

@Nic
Why do you have to support FAT32 at all?
At some point it will come obsolete (it already did the moment M$ stopped selling Win98 and announced Win9x series obsolete).

Too bad for people with Win9x machines but if absolute downward compatibility is an issue why not supporting FAT16 as well?
IMO- it's a waste of time trying to make everything 100% compatible with every possible system. Simply assume most of the people use NTFS (and most of the people indeed uses it- especialy the type of people hanging on this forum) and make life easier for yourself.:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Amnon82

2nd February 2004, 14:44

Nice nic. If 0.7 will backup full dvds this will be great.

I use IFO Mode to demultiplex the VOBs, but I can do this also with DVDDecrypter. IFO Mode was great! Can U release the AC3Delay-Corrector as a standalone? This is the reason why I use IFO Mode.
Subtitle demultiplex I can also do with VOBSUB + SUB2SUP but in some reason only the IFO Mode riped the subs corectly. Maybe You can relase also this tool as standalone.

I don't know why other people use IFO Mode. I use it for getting a m2v (demultipexed), subs and sync AC3s, DTSs for the M2V.

If I have the options seperatly, I don't need IFO Mode anymore. What think other people here about IFO Mode?

Nic

2nd February 2004, 15:23

@lighty: I know...Ill see how the mood takes me and how much call there is for it. For DVD Authoring though it seems crazy to attempt it on anything other than NTFS...

@Amnon82: Hmmm, maybe ill leave it in then. Don't know yet. Definitely won't remove the code....Ill make a button sometime that will allow little tools like standalone AC3 Correcter, Creating the VIDEO_TS files for a directory, etc

-Nic

TEB

2nd February 2004, 15:33

I secon that u cut fat32 support.. dont waste any energy on it.. I dont know anyone that uses fat32 :)...

yuinfo

2nd February 2004, 16:10

Originally posted by Nic
Hmmm, maybe ill leave it in then. Don't know yet. Definitely won't remove the code....Ill make a button sometime that will allow little tools like standalone AC3 Correcter, Creating the VIDEO_TS files for a directory, etc

Please leave IFO mode in, if it is possible. It does miracles with AC3 correction and subs. I've tried almost all demultiplexers/multiplexers and had problems with AC3 delay or subs at some point, Rejig does it perfectly.

maa

2nd February 2004, 17:25

Ok - don't get too excited about this.
Nearly all recording studios use FAT32 because it has less overhead and runs more tracks - it is a lot faster.
As I also run a studio, all my HDs are FAT32.
I know thats not a good argument for the developer of a program who has to weigh up the the amount of users with each system.
Fat32 is also easier to recover with dos tools afetr a HD crash etc.

Pfc Joker

2nd February 2004, 18:03

Originally posted by lighty
@Nic
Why do you have to support FAT32 at all?
At some point it will come obsolete (it already did the moment M$ stopped selling Win98 and announced Win9x series obsolete).

Too bad for people with Win9x machines but if absolute downward compatibility is an issue why not supporting FAT16 as well?
IMO- it's a waste of time trying to make everything 100% compatible with every possible system. Simply assume most of the people use NTFS (and most of the people indeed uses it- especialy the type of people hanging on this forum) and make life easier for yourself.:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

I tend to agree with lightly. Most people are going to be using NTSF (Untill we all start running Longhorn a couple years from now) and anyone running big drives or raid arrays I would assume is using NTSF also.

maa

2nd February 2004, 20:12

@Nic,
Do I hear VIDEO_TS.IFO creator ? That would be nice as only DVDFab can do this (only thing I use it for too)

@Anyone who dislikes Fat32 and preferes the slower system.
This is what Microsoft thinks of its NTFS:

From - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/archive/default.asp?url=/technet/archive/ittasks/deploy/fat.asp

The system partition
This article may seem to say that NTFS is superior to FAT and that unless you have a small partition or need compatibility with other operating systems, you should always use NTFS. However, this isn't the case.

As we mentioned earlier, NTFS partitions are accessible only via Windows NT. If you have a fatal error with Windows NT, you can't simply boot a system disk to a command prompt and fix a problem on an NTFS partition. To get around this problem, Microsoft recommends installing a second copy of Windows NT on your hard disk and using this copy to repair problems that occur on NTFS partitions.

Unfortunately, this method has some serious drawbacks. For starters, a second copy of Windows NT could consume up to 150 MB, depending on which options you choose to load. Second, during the boot process, both copies share common files. Therefore, if your system partition (the partition your PC boots from) is formatted as NTFS and has a problem, you may not be able to boot either copy of Windows NT to fix the problem. While you may think the odds of a system partition error are slim, remember that many changes you might make to your disk partitions result in having to manually update the Boot.ini file. If you incorrectly update this file, Windows NT will become unbootable. Since this is an initial boot file on the system partition, every installed copy of Windows NT would share this file.

A better solution is to format your system partition as FAT.

Sorry for going OT here but if security isn't an issue but speed and ease of use is FAT32 is the way to go.
Sure you can buy expensive tools to repair NTFS but why use it all.
The only advantage for a " PC " is the lack of a 4Giga barrier which most audio and video software allows for by creating smaller files.

cheers

maa

rakaz

2nd February 2004, 20:32

@maa: That article was written about 5 years ago. Notice they mention Windows 95, Windows 98 and Windows NT. It says nothing about ME, 2000 or XP. A lot has changed since the article was written.

maa

2nd February 2004, 20:38

- Nothing relative to the points mentioned apart from the Space consideration, in fact it got worse with the different varieties of NTFS.

lighty

2nd February 2004, 20:44

@maa

That is not correct. But I think we're way off topic so I opened a new thread here http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=70073 in the more apropriate section.

TEB

2nd February 2004, 23:37

Nic. Do u think it would be possible in the future to use rejig as a input and output muxing tool for mpeg2's ? like i wanna merge LOTR2se disc1 and 2 into one continuing .m2v file with synced .ac3 and .pcm ? or as a large vob set? just for archiving purposes?

best
teb

dragongodz

3rd February 2004, 04:25

"Do I hear VIDEO_TS.IFO creator ?"
the dvdauthor part of rejig can already do that of course. if you check out dvdauthor(the original program its based on) it supports adding a menus etc aswell. still in its infancy really but very impressive. Nics been taking it even further of course so by rejig 1.0 dvd authoring of whole dvd should be possible. please dont ask this of Nic though since its just what i think. :)

"I've tried almost all demultiplexers/multiplexers and had problems with AC3 delay or subs at some point, Rejig does it perfectly."
filemode of rejig can also correct ac3 delay and demux etc aswell of course.

"possible in the future to use rejig as a input and output muxing tool for mpeg2's ?"
possible ? yes. high on priority ? probably not. i mean it would be better to get the normal dvd to dvdr part working fully first wouldnt it ?

yuinfo

3rd February 2004, 06:53

Originally posted by dragongodz
"I've tried almost all demultiplexers/multiplexers and had problems with AC3 delay or subs at some point, Rejig does it perfectly."
filemode of rejig can also correct ac3 delay and demux etc aswell of course.

Not quite true, Filemode can't do subs. Ifo mode is definitly quite usefull. I wouldn't like to see it go away, but it's Nic's decision.

dragongodz

3rd February 2004, 16:11

"Filemode can't do subs"
true but it could be made to. still ifo mode probably is easier for people to understand that way. :)

Nic

3rd February 2004, 17:42

I almost did make it do, but my heart wasn't in it at the time...lol

While testing yesterday, first time I timed it. 17mins to backup TrainingDay. So it's a lot quicker than it used to be ;)
(with lots of room for improvement too)

-Nic

Amnon82

4th February 2004, 15:10

Great news! When do you release 0.6?
Don't say: When its done (... as id always tell):D

maa

4th February 2004, 17:04

Hey, - this transcoding engine is so good, I tested an output size of 2.2Giga and the result is excellent with one audio channel (except when someone walks in front of the camera) = Two DVDs to One !!

thedavid

5th February 2004, 08:50

On my hard-drive, I have a collection of analogue cable TV captures, which I recorded using a variable bitrate up to a maximum 15mb/s. Of course, the bitrate rarely goes above 10mb/s.

I want to downsize them for DVD authoring because the current bitrate is above the DVD maximum of 9.8mb/s

I have tried using REJIG with default settings and although the quality is very good, I sometimes get a few lines of blockiness across the top of the video. Is there a way to stop this?

Also, what is the purpose of the SETTINGS button on REJIG where is gives the option of OLD ENGINE and NEW ENGINE?

Plus, does this version of REJIG handle motion vectors?

yuinfo

5th February 2004, 10:31

Also, what is the purpose of the SETTINGS button on REJIG where is gives the option of OLD ENGINE and NEW ENGINE?
You have detailed explanations in this thread, shortly: old engine - good for lighter compresions; new engine - will soon be raplaced with new-new engine :)

Plus, does this version of REJIG handle motion vectors?
No. Neither do other transcoders, as far as I know.

layer3maniac

6th February 2004, 01:10

WOW! I haven't tested ReJig for awhile. This is SWEEEET, Nic!

Paced

6th February 2004, 10:03

Originally posted by biggy7
having read the good reports about rejig, i decided to have a go.

was doing a dvd movie, got through all the processes and was on demuxing subs, then crashed :( had to close it. This happened to anyone else?

Yes, it happened to me twice yesterday when I decided to give the program a shot :)

Nic

6th February 2004, 10:55

Could you let me know the films (and region) as well as the streams you were trying to process....so that I can re-create the crash, and hopefully fix it for the next release...

-Nic

Paced

6th February 2004, 11:19

Originally posted by Nic
Could you let me know the films (and region) as well as the streams you were trying to process....so that I can re-create the crash, and hopefully fix it for the next release...

-Nic

Sure thing - Back To The Future (part 1), region 4 (PAL), main movie :) I'll try it on another one of my DVDs tonight, and see if I can get the same crash again (although it happened twice with BTTF). Keep up the good work by the way :)

dragongodz

7th February 2004, 11:51

Paced - tommorow i am getting a lend for a couple of days of back to the future 1 dvd from a freind to try and recreat the problem. can you tell me exactly what you did so i can make sure i do the exact same ?

Paced

7th February 2004, 12:44

Originally posted by dragongodz
Paced - tommorow i am getting a lend for a couple of days of back to the future 1 dvd from a freind to try and recreat the problem. can you tell me exactly what you did so i can make sure i do the exact same ?

Sure :) All I did was run ReJig.exe, clicked on the "DVD Backup" option, and opened the DVD from my hard drive. It was all fine up until it started to mux the subtitles - it ended up crashing :( Let's hope you get the same crash, so we can fix this problem :)

dragongodz

7th February 2004, 14:03

Paced - did you keep all audio and subs or deselect some ? if so which ?

Paced

7th February 2004, 14:26

Originally posted by dragongodz
Paced - did you keep all audio and subs or deselect some ? if so which ?

I kept all subtitles, and kept all audio channels (AC3 and director's comments) - minus the DTS sound.

dragongodz

8th February 2004, 04:11

ok i have the results of over 5.5 hours work.

crash when muxxing subs with back to the future - could not reproduce.
i first did backup direct from dvd and that didnt crash. so then used dvddecrypter 3.1.9.0 to rip in file mode(all files) to HD and tried it from there. again no crash. only stream deselected was the DTS audio track same as Paced did. rejig had to be closed between sessions though since it would crash trying to do 2 backups from the different locations.

Nic - a bug found during all that. when processing from the dvd rejig reports(by this i mean the demuxed names) the audio as having a -560 delay and is corrected. when muxxed etc the audio is out of sync. i tried authoring the non corrected stream and it was in sync. so loaded the vobs from dvd in rejigs filemode and no delay reported. rejig however reported the ripped to hd version as having 0 delay which is of course correct. follow that ? :)

oh and also rejig corrected the audio delay even when it was 0, that should be skipped of course.

maa

8th February 2004, 16:26

Does the authoring part have any support for 24/96 LPCM ?
Any conversion needed ? - or does it cope ?
I read else where that a windows wav file needs converting:
"wav is in Intel byte order and DVD is always in Motorola byte order"
Would be nice if this was the first program to author Stereo 24/96 DVD video / audio.

dragongodz

9th February 2004, 04:13

ok some more hours of testing results with back to the future.

when direct from dvd the audio delay says 0 delay to start with. its not until it goes to the correctiung delay step(or just after demux and before delay correct starts) the files name is renamed to the -560 delay. now thats weird. that doesnt happen when going from the ripped dvd, they stay 0 delay.

also looking at the demuxed .m2v shows a time of 1:14:53 ? hmm ok jumping to the end of the .m2v shows the credits are there so it appears intact. ok so i checked the ifo, no STC dicontinuities but there is a layer break. the cell/chapter that has the layer break finishes at 1:15:06. so this could be the problem area but it really needs confirming with more dvds.

i have to take the dvd back tommorow but will have a couple of hours for a few more tests first so 1 more report with this particular dvd to come. :)

@maa - this is what the dvd authoring in rejig is based on
http://dvdauthor.sourceforge.net/
if you go here
http://dvdauthor.sourceforge.net/doc/dvdauthor.html
and go to the xml description section you will see in the audio it includes pcm and also samplerates of 48khz and 96khz. as for if it needs conversion first, i dont know, you would have to try it out. :)

Amnon82

9th February 2004, 09:45

oh and also rejig corrected the audio delay even when it was 0, that should be skipped of course.

Thats exactly was i told many threads before...:D

Nic

9th February 2004, 10:15

"oh and also rejig corrected the audio delay even when it was 0, that should be skipped of course"....Yes and I've already answered that. Jsoto who wrote the code for it recommends it gets done anyway to make sure the AC3 stream is 100% correct. But If you want me to turn it off so badly I will.

@maa: PCM Conversion is a weird thing. Lightning_UK taught me all I need to know about it, but I can't remember how far I got with it. I'll look into it.
Currently for 16bit Wavs the byte order needs to be swapped. For 24bit wavs, it's far more tricky. So I create 24bit wavs as 16bit ones currently. Can't remember how DVDAuthor would need them.

@dragongodz: Sounds like my VStrip audio delay code isn't working (which is strange? As I thought that was all ok).

The DVD Backup mode is pretty much finished as far as 0.6a is going to be concerned. It's pretty solid. Just got to work on DVDAuthor mode now. Added the new engine. On my little test file it doesn't perform well unfortunatly....(blocking on scene changes)

-Nic

dragongodz

9th February 2004, 12:10

"Thats exactly was i told many threads before."
sorry Amnon82 its a bit hard to remember what everyone has said in all theses pages.

"Yes and I've already answered that. Jsoto who wrote the code for it recommends it gets done anyway to make sure the AC3 stream is 100% correct. But If you want me to turn it off so badly I will."
calm Nic. how about making it an option in preferences then with default on ? that way if people want to turn it off they can. asuming most people check before burning they can redo it with this on(if they have turned it off).

"Sounds like my VStrip audio delay code isn't working (which is strange? As I thought that was all ok)."
i will see what vstrip thinks of it tommorow aswell.

"Added the new engine. On my little test file it doesn't perform well unfortunatly....(blocking on scene changes)"
well you know i plan to test and tweak the hell out of it anyway. so you know where i am. :)

Amnon82

9th February 2004, 14:49

All good news. Can't wait for 0.6a:D

Nic

9th February 2004, 18:05

@dragongodz: lol.. I'm calm :) If you guys want the AC3 Delay correction off I will, that's all I meant. It's the way I wrote it in the first place, but jsoto recommended otherwise.

Receieved a very nice email from Usman Saleem who spotted the bug in using DVD Author twice in a row causing a crash :) Thanks goto him.

As far as tweaking goes, it may well be the bitrate reaction is a bit slow, so tweaking might help a lot. The Old engine is still the best IMHO (although maybe not very accurate in hitting the precise size)

BTW: Just to be on the safe side, next release will offer two builds one with Decryption and one with out....just to warn you. (Just covering my back ;) )

-Nic

ffroms

9th February 2004, 19:23

I think you misunderstand about AC3 delay. We all want that option but to do correction only if AC3 delay is <>0 (there is no point doing correction when there is no delay;) ).

For crashing in DVDAuthoring I told you long time ago and you said that you gonna fix it in some new version but you forgot. Never mind as long is going to fixed.

Thank you again for great tool and can't wait to test 0.6 version (especially VOB-VOB transcoding).

FFS

flashback8

9th February 2004, 22:00

Hi. I have a question for you all. Last week, I finally upgraded to WinXP and the like. I heard ReJig could correctly add subs to a DVD and gave it a spin. In a nutshell, the disc won't work on my primary DVD player (Malata N996) but plays fine on my PS2 and on my computer.

Longer version: I took my Korean DVD for Ringu and tried to make a subbed DVD of the movie, i.e., without the commercials and such. (For the record, the video is NTSC progressive.) Under WinXP SP1a, I ripped it using DVD Decrypter 3.1.9.0. VOBEdit 0.6 was used to demux the VOBs. I took the video and the Japanese audio and combined them with a SUP file made from a script. ReJig 0.5e was used to remux the video, audio, and SUP file. I then used IFOEdit to correct the sub colors. (I made sure to also save the final file as a BUP.) Finally, Nero Express 6.0.0.15 was used to burn the movie onto a Fuji DVD-R disc made in Japan. Please note that, because the movie could fit on a single layer, the video was left untouched.

Once the disc was burned, I went over to my Malata deck and put it in. The player froze a few seconds after the disc had been inserted. (FYI, the video hadn't started playing yet.) I finally had to do a hard power-down in order to reset the deck and allow the disc to be ejected.

I then decided to try playing the disc on my computer and on my PS2. Both played the disc without a hitch, and the subs were perfect! Several more attempts to play the disc on the Malata failed.

Is there anything I can do to correct this problem? The thing that really annoys me is that my Malata can play DVD-Rs. A friend loaned me one that plays just fine. Under Win98 and using the same setup, I burned the exact same disc, only remuxed under IFOEdit instead of ReJig. (ReJig kept cutting off the last few minutes, probably due to FAT32's 4 GB limit.) The timer and subs were screwed up but the Malata still played the disc. *sigh* Perhaps I should try DVD+Rs?

Thanks for any help you all can provide!

TCmullet

10th February 2004, 03:54

@Nic: With all the problems folks seem to be having in testing your dvd-backup logic, is there any chance you could simply plop the new engine down into the 0.5e code and release 0.5f as nothing more than 5e with the new engine added? That way, those of us who are wanting to use ReJig only for .m2v reduction (via the "new" new engine) could get on our merry way, while you continue to deal with these DVD backup problems more at your leisure. ;)

dragongodz

10th February 2004, 04:30

ok last test with back to the future.

tried ripping iso and mounted. no delay problem.
tried file ripped with correct .m2v time disabled(in dvddecrypter), still no delay problem.
tried just ripping 1 audio stream(not even the video) in ifo mode, file renamed to -560 delay when completed.
looked at it in vstrip 0.8f_css. video PTS 0:00:00.267, audio PTS 0:00:00.267, no delay of course.
so i dont know exactly where the -560 delay is coming from.

Nic-
"If you guys want the AC3 Delay correction off I will, that's all I meant. It's the way I wrote it in the first place, but jsoto recommended otherwise."
well thats why having it as an option would be better all round. actually if people use ifo mode it is selectable for use or not. since dvdbackup mode is basically this slightly automated that shouldnt be hard. actually thinking about it more the dvdbackup mode would be the 1 to disable for now since you can do it all from ifo mode, even automatic authoring. just my opinion of course.
"who spotted the bug in using DVD Author twice in a row causing a crash"
probably the same bug that causes the crash when trying to use dvdbackup mode again after using it fully once. :)
"it may well be the bitrate reaction is a bit slow, so tweaking might help a lot."
more than reaction time, quantative aswell.
"The Old engine is still the best IMHO (although maybe not very accurate in hitting the precise size)"
for reduction to 85% size i would agree but after that you will see where it fails with motion. try 70% with a slow panning shot and watch the focus be lost and then regained and see the juddering. with the new engine the motion is much smoother and the focus is not lost like that. of course i am really talking about the last tweaked version i did and not the one in 0.5e. i never tweaked that since Makira released the changes/fixes so i didnt see the point.
"next release will offer two builds one with Decryption and one with out....just to warn you. (Just covering my back)"
well i did offer a suggestion about that(by email if you remember) way back with rejig 0.4. so there would not need to be 2 versions.

flashback8 -
"Nero Express 6.0.0.15 was used to burn the movie"
this could be the cause. a freind of mine uses IC7 and converts the .pdi to an iso. he then used to burn the iso with nero. they would play fine with his voxon dvd player but his panasonic would have all kinds of problems, half the time they wouldnt even start and the rest of the time they jerked so much they were unwatchable. he found that using 2 specific(expensive) dvd-r media however worked on both but since he had plenty of the first media that was not an ideal solution. he then tried burning the isos with dvddecrypter on the first media and guess what, yep they play perfect with both players. so try different burning software would be my first suggestion. if that doesnt help try different brand media.

flashback8

10th February 2004, 08:03

Hi.

Dragongodz: Thanks. I'd heard Nero wasn't that good but the first disc I burned deceived me, I guess.

Just curious, do anyone know of any good freeware image makers? I'd try burning a Nero image but the discs I have at the moment are $2.50 a piece. Anyway, it sounds like InstantCopy is good but, frankly, I don't want to pay unless it's absolutely necessary.

Sorry for going a bit off-topic. I promise this will be my only one! ;-)

EDIT: Nevermind about the image request. It sounds like IMGTool Classic is the way to go. I'll try it tomorrow.

Nic

10th February 2004, 10:39

@dragongodz: Hmmm, Well I tested this new engine at 70% compared to the old engine at 70% and the old one did best, so I hope you can tune the new one to do better. I finally burnt the source code to CD so I can send it to you later.

If you can send as much of that vob as possible (the first few meg) and the IFO file to my email, ill be able to track down where that delay is coming from.

I looked through your old emails. Yup I remember your proposal now. To have the decryption in a DLL. Hmmm, Still don't like the idea of having ReJig as more than one file. Also I like the idea of offering one that's completely legal one that might be considered not.

-Nic

dragongodz

10th February 2004, 13:38

Nic -
"Well I tested this new engine at 70% compared to the old engine at 70% and the old one did best"
i believe you but also try the same with rejig 0.4 mod3 and see how that looks. that doesnt have changes i planned because Makira already put in some of them with the latest new engine but is tweaked somewhat. the thing is Makira still used his own settings so improvements(IMO)/tweaks i made have to be redone each time.
"I hope you can tune the new one to do better"
i am confident i can but how much will have to wait until i have done it. then others can judge. actually much later i plan to test changing the engine to...maybe i should not say anymore for now. :D
"so I can send it to you later."
cant wait.
"If you can send as much of that vob as possible"
already thought of. just need to get the size right and decide what to include and what to discard.
"Still don't like the idea of having ReJig as more than one file. Also I like the idea of offering one that's completely legal one that might be considered not."
ye i understand totally. still it would save people asking "have i got the right version ?" etc. so really just a thought.

djan

10th February 2004, 17:39

@ Nic :

Well, why to not release ReJig without that new Engine ? I think the old one is much better. You know, I'm always waiting for a new release without that problem of encoding only the end half of the movie like I had with "Traffic". Remember ? I sent you the DVD.

Keep your hard work ! Good chance.

Amnon82

11th February 2004, 14:07

@ flashback8 : I wrote a realy good guide creating DVDs with freeware. In this guide I described how to burn also the disc.

Creating ISO and Burning part of my guide. (http://www.rj-elektronik.de/avideo/maineng.php?set=drp22guide#Creating_the_ISO_and_burning_it)

All need programs You can download on my page www.dvdr-page.tk.

I think this will help you

yuinfo

11th February 2004, 21:24

I've just run Rejig (0.5e) doing only video in File mode side by side with Sonic Foundry Vegas 4 doing only wav->AC3 conevrsion. Intersting, Rejig uses only 0%-9% of the processor, while Vegas grabs the rest.

Can Rejig be a little more agresive for processor usage by default?

Regards and keep up the fantastic work, Nic.

m99

11th February 2004, 23:52

Is it Rejig 0.9 who's on the map to not be released ;-)
Sorry, I've had a cognac, or four.

Amnon82

13th February 2004, 22:44

I think You had five:D

layer3maniac

17th February 2004, 04:35

I just did Star Trek Nemesis and the subtitles are out of sync. Not sure if this is a known problem.

dragongodz

17th February 2004, 11:10

layer3maniac - Rejig 0.6a shouldnt be too far away now. wait until you see all the work Nics been doing, pretty cool. so can you please test it again when it is released ?

layer3maniac

18th February 2004, 02:05

You can count on that. :D This is an impressive project!

maa

23rd February 2004, 12:46

When using the DVD Author mode ReJig makes a MUX.VOB and then copies it to the VIDEO_TS directory on the same drive.
!Very! hard work for the poor HD heads and leaves bad fragmentation and is none Fat32 compatible (but we know that already).
Is this ReJig or the underlying DVD Author thats doing this ?
IfoEdit manages with writing one file.

Any luck with 24/96 ?
I tried the DVD Author Gui from Source forge but its too basic.

cheers
maa

Nic

23rd February 2004, 13:29

@maa: The new unreleased version no longer has to do that :) The subtitle muxing part is done in the main multiplexing part and now when multiplexing, it creates the 1 GB VOBs (not a Mux.vob). Then the IFOs are created from those VOBs. So it's a lot quicker in the next release :) (and you can set the title number, allowing for multiple titles :) )

Cool huh? ;)

Haven't looked into the LPCM side of things yet...Will release 0.6a soon.

-Nic

TEB

23rd February 2004, 14:11

Nic do u know (i think i asked this before about the old engine) if the new engine can resize on max bandwith allowed? As reduce the max VBR tops? Im doing som ADSL tests here at work and rejig is really a nice tool for this tests.. And ive still got a ton of transportstreams that crash rejig... well used to crash the old one that is..

teb

SeeMoreDigital

23rd February 2004, 16:37

Hi Nic,

I've just found your ReJig tool and it's great.

As you may be aware there are a few of us over in the General Discussion forum who have been talking about a Proposed Hi-Def encoding 'Codec Shoot-Out' (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=68292) using HD satellite TV (.ts) streams as a source.

Earlier this month Wilbert posted a couple of CD's to me, which included an 720p encode and some 1080 (1088)i encodes.

However, I've found that some of the encodes he sent me can be demuxed with ReJig and some can't. And as I'm the kind of person who does'nt understand anything about programming I don't know why this happens!

Anyway, if your tool could successfully identify, demux, 'Fix & Correct AC3 Delay' with the .ts streams I have, this would be great news!

I'm also wondering if, maybe sometime in the future, you might consider adding other features to ReJig, such as Mpeg2/AAC stream support. And the ability to delete one of the fields from 720p (50/60fps) Mpeg2/AC3 or AAC .ts streams.

I would be happy to post Wilberts CD's to you for further testing.

Cheers

maa

23rd February 2004, 16:43

@Nic
wow - that far more than I expectd ! Great !
keep up the good work - where's my beta ?

cheers

maa

Rombaldi

2nd March 2004, 06:25

over 2 months since .5e??? The slience is deafening (just checking)

dragongodz

2nd March 2004, 06:39

"where's my beta ?"
i grabbed it from your email as it was running through the lines from Nic to you. :D

seriously.

Nic is very busy at work so he does not have time to do as much as he no doubt would like. thats the wonderful world of freeware. :)
besides he and i have found a couple of bugs in the ifo handling so they may aswell be fixed before releasing 0.6 or people are just going to report and complain about what we already know.

DMagic1

6th March 2004, 05:01

Just wondering how the next version is going?

I've been testing the current version a lot lately.

I'm just looking forward to a fix for the crashing I get often with DVD Backup mode. I'm wishing for a fix to the chapters being off by a second or two also.

Keep up the good work.

dragongodz

6th March 2004, 12:00

well i cant comment on those problems since i never came across them. then again i havent done a lot with dvd backup mode. i can say however that Nic has done a heap of work with it and i think people will be impressed.

as i said though Nic is very busy at the moment so Rejig 0.6 is on hold for the moment. dont worry though it is coming.

actually there may be something for some people to test before then(very soon) anyway. wont say no more for now. :)

Nic

7th March 2004, 01:14

Ill do some work on it tomorrow....sorry for the lack of posts and versions...0.6 has almost been done for ages now, just havent had the time to finish it off and test it. I much prefer this version, and once I get it out I can move onto 0.7.

The DVDBackup should be a lot better (I hope). The chapter numbers timings are generated differently (so hopefully that will fix it, but I still get the odd very slight playing error :( ) and it's alot quicker :) (And will work on Win9X)

(Just work, social life, girlfriend and my attempts at improving someone's computer conversion of a childs boardgame are keeping me busy (in that order ;) ))

-Nic

maa

7th March 2004, 01:37

Well don't rush - as long as its out by Monday .....:devil:

SeeMoreDigital

7th March 2004, 12:49

Originally posted by Nic
...Just work, social life, girlfriend and my attempts at improving someone's computer conversion of a childs boardgame are keeping me busy (in that order ;) ... If you're free. The wife says she wants a 3'wide x7'long x6'deep hole digging in the garden.

I can't think what she want's that for? :D

Don't work too hard. Cheers

dragongodz

7th March 2004, 17:00

ok well i promised a little something before Rejig 0.6 and here it is.

_http://nic.dnsalias.com/Rejig05-test.zip

this is a little blind test and has 2 tweaked versions of the old engine(inside the zip is a self extracting archive with the 2 exes). can some people test them out at different compression levels (such as 90%, 75% and 60%, that sort of thing) and report what you find ? which looks better ? which is closest or more accurate compressed size ?

please understand that only the old engine is different between these and the original Rejig 0.5e release so dont bother looking for any other changes. :)

sooner rather than later would be nice so i can give Nic the better version for the Rejig 0.6 release. thanks.

TCmullet

7th March 2004, 17:39

I'm confused (and concerned). Are you saying that the new engine will remain the same between 0.5e and 0.6????? Since 0.5e, Metakine confirmed that the new engine had serious bugs (which I had reported here). I've been waiting and waiting and waiting for a "new" new engine which incorporates his fixes to the "new engine" side of ReJig. My hard drive is fast filling up with stuff that I'm eager (& desperate) to use with a repaired "new engine".

Please tell me that you mispoke (or I misunderstood), and that 0.6 will include Metakine's repairs to Rejig's "new" engine.

yuinfo

7th March 2004, 21:03

Please tell me that you mispoke (or I misunderstood), and that 0.6 will include Metakine's repairs to Rejig's "new" engine. I'm also looking forward mainly to that new-new engine, and if you ask me just give us that and forget about ver. 0.6 ;)

I think this engine is ver. 0.6's main feature, but Nic insists on vob->vob transcoding as star of the show. So Nic please clarify, is there a "brand-new-kick-ass-engine" in 0.6?

jdobbs

7th March 2004, 21:06

Hmmm... I guess my input is that as long as Nic is doing the work he is calling the shots. I, for one, am just glad he's willing to do any of this at all.

Nic

7th March 2004, 21:07

@TCMullet: The 0.6 on my HD is using the newest "new" engine, but I have not been too impressed with the results as yet. Although it's a great bit of code by Makira, in my short tests it does not work as well as the original. However, it may work better for you. :) Ill test it more soon, and Dgz can comment on it further if he wishes.
(Summary: Yes. ReJig 0.6 will have the newest new engine)

@yuinfo: The newest engine hasn't impressed me yet, but I need to do more tests. Vob->Vob is still the star of the show ;)

-Nic

djan

7th March 2004, 22:34

@dragongodz :

Trying to use the applications, there is the message I receive : "This application has failed to start because libguide40.dll was not found. Re-installing the application may fix this problem."

DMagic1

8th March 2004, 04:40

Originally posted by djan
@dragongodz :

Trying to use the applications, there is the message I receive : "This application has failed to start because libguide40.dll was not found. Re-installing the application may fix this problem."

I get the same message.

celtic_druid

8th March 2004, 09:43

No such problem here, but then I have the DLL, comes with ICL.
program files\common files\intel\shared files\ia32\lib

DMagic1

8th March 2004, 10:13

And i guess there are some runtimes needed?

Nic

8th March 2004, 10:26

This is really dragongodz bit, but this might help: http://nic.dnsalias.com/libguide40.zip

DMagic1

8th March 2004, 10:30

Yes that worked.

djan

8th March 2004, 10:32

Thx Nic. Does ReJig still Movie Only or can it make full Backup ?

EDIT : no, it still Movie Only. So, do you intend to make a Full Backup mode ?

dragongodz

8th March 2004, 10:52

woops, sorry about that. i will blame Nic and intel though. :D

you see in rejig 0.5 source Nic used openmp and parallel compiler options which caused this. it is catually in this thread somewhere where he removed parallel and that fixed it. funny thing is intel docs say that its openmp that should cause it. so anyway the source i have of 0.5 still has them so thats why that happened. i have recompiled with both removed etc and sent that to Nic. seems its not needed now though.

comment on new engine in Rejig 0.6. hmm well when looked at it should be better but it just doesnt seem to be. i have sent Nic a little tweak for him to test against the clip he has that shows it badly. so hopefully it will be atleast ok upon release. we will want to hear peoples experiences once Rejig 0.6 is out of course.

djan - Rejig 0.6 is still movie only. speculation of changes(other than fixes) too version after that should not really be made by Nic so as not to get peoples expectations up. thats just my opinion of course. :)

ummm did i miss anything ?

Nic

8th March 2004, 12:53

@dgz: I always tell people what versions are going to do what...the conclusions and expectations by others are not my fault, as I've never said anything false about what a version does. I tell people this so they know what im working on, some of the code in 0.6 was written before 0.5 was out, etc. Also, it's your fault as I stated in this thread not to use /Qparallel ;) :p (although Intel's docs could be more accurate ;) )

dragongodz

8th March 2004, 13:55

i meant not specualting beyond the next version. such as 0.6 will be movie only still. but this is of course your decision. you are right of course about other peoples expectations but look at the crys for the latest engine(and the misconception that it may not be in 0.6). thats just the sort of thing i meant. :)

yes i remembered the parallel once i saw the reports of the missing dll. it was mentioned quite some time ago now though so not something i thought about.
why dont we just blame intel ? :devil:

ok i went back and checked the docs. heres what they say

"libguide40.dll - DLL version of libguide.lib."
"libguide.lib - Library required for OpenMP* and auto-parallelized programs."

now thats under the section for files installed for itanium.

so go to openmp support libs and you find
"The Intel® C++ Compiler with OpenMP* support provides a production support library, libguide.lib. This library enables you to run an application under different execution modes. It is used for normal or performance-critical runs on applications that have already been tuned.

Note
The libguide.lib library is linked dynamically, regardless of command-line options, to avoid performance issues that are hard to debug."

so it is used for both openmp and auto-parallization. it is only mentioned on the openmp page though and not the auto-parallel pages.

yuinfo

9th March 2004, 00:52

... you are right of course about other peoples expectations but look at the crys for the latest engine(and the misconception that it may not be in 0.6). thats just the sort of thing i meant. :)

It was just a joke (about vob->vob), dragongodz, and Nic got it in that spirit. There are reasons why there are such expectations of the new engine: Makira, author of these engines, seems to think that it is far superior than the old one. Since the old one is, in my opinion, superior than engine in other transcoders (no names here, don't want any flames), your and Nic's word that new-new one isn't that good simply doesn't count ;) That's why your tweaking of the old engine caused panic here - i also have 4 iso files waiting for the Makira's one.

Maybe it is somebodies :) fault that these engines aren't properly versioned, and their upgrade kept separeted from Rejig's.

Beleive me, you and Nic can have as much testers as you want, but keep some light on what we are doing when we practice our favorite sport of moving GigaBytes from one place to another. And there is always distant hope that we can make Nic beleive that we know to mux by hand, which can lead to 0.5f with newest (insert engine version here) engine, and everybody will see that you and Nic are right and Makira is wrong ;)

Cheers, and keep up fantastisc work.

Edit: Sorry engine author is Metakine, not Makira, apologies to both of them.

DMagic1

9th March 2004, 07:52

I've tested both and its a hard call.

I found one very big bug/problem. The output color saturation or brightness is much, much lower. I used the same player and just to be sure went and used the non test version again.

Rejig
http://bellsouthpwp.net/d/m/dmagic1/stuff/rejig.jpg

Rejig Test (1 and 2 same way)
http://bellsouthpwp.net/d/m/dmagic1/stuff/rejigtest.jpg

E-Male

9th March 2004, 08:28

i found something similar with the normal current version
i backed up a black&white dvd and the result was tinted blue

dragongodz

9th March 2004, 12:45

DMagic1 - have you tried a couple of different movies ? this will confirm its not just something about that 1 but a consistant problem.
is it like that at different compression amounts ?
i am asuming you only played 1 clip at a time and not at the same time . its been noted elsewhere that playing 2 clips at once can produce different brightnesses, not Rejig limited problem.

i asume you mean tested againts Rejig 0.5e that Nic released.

once i get your answers i will do some more tinkering i guess. :)

dragongodz

9th March 2004, 12:59

yuinfo - TCmullets post did not contain any smilies so i asumed he was seriously concerned even though my post was strictly about the old engine.

oh and Metakine is the company and Makira is the programmer. so saying Makira is the author of the engines was correct. :)

as for proving him wrong, no its just a matter of what i think(hopefully backed up by users reports) of as slightly better tuning of these very good engines. :D

as for my tweaking the old engine, well i asume you do realise the i tweaked the old engine ages ago so it has not been the exact 1 that Makira did for quite a few versions now. :)

yuinfo

9th March 2004, 14:10

as for my tweaking the old engine, well i asume you do realise the i tweaked the old engine ages ago so it has not been the exact 1 that Makira did for quite a few versions now. :)

OK, what about versioning these engines? We now have:
1. old
2. new
3. old-new1
4. old-new2
5. new-new (well, at least we know this mythical one exists, not many people have seen the beast ;) )

I honestly think this situation doesn't look prety.

Cheers.

dragongodz

9th March 2004, 14:34

actually from memory it was more like

1. old
2. old-new1
3. new
4. new-new
5. old-new2 (the versions posted for testing)
6. new-new-new

plus new had 3 seperate mods from me aswell that were released seperatly.

:D

the thing to remember though is that the new engines are not all brand new. they are fixes and changes to the first new engines. thats why they are still called new. so there is really just the 2 engines which have both been modified since they were first released. example is that Makira did 2 or 3 updates(no i wont read all the way back through this huge thread to count them :) ) from the new version in Rejig 0.5 to the version thats in Rejig 0.6 but its still really an update to the same basic engine.

as for seeing "this mythical beast" well Nic has already said it is nearly ready(Rejig 0.6 that is) so it shouldnt be too far away. :)

DMagic1

9th March 2004, 19:34

Nope, they where played at different times. I didn't even notice at first. It wasn't until I had my folder with all the screen shots open in thubnail view.

Doing another movie in a few.

djan

9th March 2004, 21:33

What program do you use to take the shots ? VirtualDub ?

Rombaldi

9th March 2004, 21:35

Do not that this as flames or undue criticism. But a constructive observation.

Long ago I made the comment that the 'engine' should be broken out
as a seperate DLL and provisions in ReJig made for specifying which (of several) engines should be used for a job. Not only would it keep from having multiple versions of the main ReJig program, but could help in keeping a bit easier track of what engine does what. It could also lead to having specially 'tweaked' versions of an engine (ie. one for animation, one for fast action, one for less than pristine sources, etc..) again WITHOUT requiring multiple versions of the program..

The advantage of being able to seperate out engine from main program devlopment should be obvious.

I'll again make that suggestion, this time with more detail and hopefully the powers that be will take the idea a little more seriously.

- ReJig should be set up to maintain in it's configuration a list of engine dll's and in addition to setting a 'default' being able to select which engine to use for a specific transcoding job

- the engine DLL should provide an identification string with a version, date, comment so it's not necessary to figure it out just from the name. AND it would be VERY USEFUL if ReJig would EMBED THAT STRING as a 'user data string' in the (1st) Mpeg header of the output MPEG2 stream (that way you could track WHAT engine did WHICH job)

just some thoughts..

DMagic1

9th March 2004, 22:11

Originally posted by djan
What program do you use to take the shots ? VirtualDub ?

PowerDVD always.

Nic

9th March 2004, 22:34

@rombaldi: Im against that although I can understand your reasons. I want ReJig to be only one file, also I eventually only want one engine rather than a choice of many. Choice just leads to confusion, you can trust me and dragongodz to eventually have one "best" engine....eventually.

-Nic

ps
For all those that use TS streams, I think I've just realised why sometimes it can't detect the PIDs (damn adaption fields...what are they doing in the PMS & PAT ;) )

DMagic1

10th March 2004, 02:28

Hmm,.. I wasn't able to recreate that color loss again. Even on the same movie.

maa

10th March 2004, 10:46

I've seen that kind of color loss between screen shots before - its something to do with the overlay.

djan

10th March 2004, 17:23

Originally posted by DMagic1
PowerDVD always. You can't easely take the exactely same shot twice with PowerDVD as you can't know the frame number you're taking. Isn't better to take the shot with virtualDub as you can take shots by frame ?

dragongodz

11th March 2004, 11:06

ye thats why i aksed about playing both at once. the reason was that with windvd if you play 2 at once(so i read) the second is darker because it can not access the overlay because the first instance is.

as for mutliple engines for specific types of footage, that would be a nightmare. you could end up with 20 different engines with people wondering what the hell they are suposed to be using. not good.

"you can trust me and dragongodz to eventually have one "best" engine....eventually."
thanks Nic for including me. :)
the current problem is which is the better engine. you see technically the new engine is. it can do much more and more accuratly than the old engine can. yet the results from the old engine can look better in some cases aswell. so its finding the balance between the 2 engines, thats why i have been tweaking them.

hmmm not much in test results except DMagic1. very disapointing. i mean is it that hard to encode even a 10 minute clip at a couple of different amounts with the 2 test versions and then say how they look ?

SeeMoreDigital

11th March 2004, 11:34

Originally posted by Nic
...For all those that use TS streams, I think I've just realised why sometimes it can't detect the PIDs (damn adaption fields...what are they doing in the PMS & PAT ;) ) That's great news,

Cheers Nic

Nic

11th March 2004, 13:11

@seemoredigital: PM me your email address and ill send you the latest beta of Rejig, if you've got time to test. It might not make a difference, but it might do. I think it will always work now, apart from on TS streams that have more than on PMS and more than two streams in (in which case it could fail).

-Nic

SeeMoreDigital

11th March 2004, 13:51

Job done!

Cheers

manolito

13th March 2004, 15:35

Hi everybody, and a big Thanks for this wonderful program!

The reason I came over here from the DVD2SVCD thread is that Tylo (author of D2SRoBa) intends to integrate ReJig (or ReQuant) into his Plugin.

Short explanation:
The D2SRoBa method significantly shortens encoding time by avoiding multipass VBR encodes in favour of a quality based One Pass VBR encode. To hit the target size D2SRoBa encodes movie samples first so it can calculate the right Q value to hit the target size. Since this never hits the target by 100% there is an option to do a second VBR sizing pass which of course doubles the encoding time. A few days ago the idea came up if it was possible to use a transcoder like ReJig for the sizing pass instead. Recompression level would probably never exceed 10%, and tests with ReJig (old engine) so far delivered excellent quality even at ultra low bitrates below 1000 kbit/s.

Now here are my questions:
There is some discussion if Tylo should choose ReJig or ReQuant. DDogg made a point that since ReJig still is in an early stage and would probably change considerably over the next versions, ReQuant should be chosen. On the other hand the engines have been tweaked quite a bit for ReJig, which would probably result in better quality.

Which engine version would be the better choice for SVCD bitrates?
Will the command line interface for ReJig change in the upcoming version 0.6?

Thanks in advance

Cheers
manolito

unixfs

13th March 2004, 19:46

Hi,
would you consider adding to Rejig audio re-encoding with Besweet?
For those like me that don't have a 6 channel setup and are used/forced to listen to dvds with an earset (sigh) AC3 is a serious no-no, so I have to normalize/boost/encode to mp2.

Thanks and congratulation for Rejig: it's a real jewel

Nic

13th March 2004, 22:35

@unixfs: Im hoping eventually to do something with ffmpeg, maybe have that in ReJig. Sadly it's mp2 encoding isn't of the highest quality (no psycho acoustic)

@manolito: Really depends on what is needed. If he is going from raw m2v -> raw m2v then he may as well use Requant. The engine's dont differ much at present, so he may as well use the latest ReQuant engine. The commandline will not change (unless someone wants it to change, I dont think it's being used at present). Just post if you need more info.

-Nic

ps:
0.6a is pretty much ready I think...may as well release it soon.

Amnon82

13th March 2004, 22:50

Great news Nic...

Paced

14th March 2004, 05:47

Hi guys, just thought I'd post a 'bug' ( :confused: ) I think I may have stumbled upon (sorry if it's been reported already). Whenever I use ReJig, I always use it together with DIF4U, and I've found that when it comes to the step of importing the .SCP (Scenarist project file) into Scenarist, I get a tonne of "different duration" errors for the *.mpv files ReJig transcoded. However, these errors disappear when I encode the files with DoCCE4U/CCE 2.50. This happens in alot of my demux-by-vobid projects, and also in quite a few PGC projects. I'm a PAL user by the way :) Perhaps someone could clarify this?

dragongodz

14th March 2004, 06:12

Paced - this may have to do with the chapters being off by a second or 2 problem that DMagic1 reported. Nic has said the chapter numbers timing is generated differently with Rejig 0.6 so it will be interesting to hear if that fixes it or not. when Rejig 0.6 is released that is. :)

Manolito - ye basically what Nic said. for shaving 5% or so off it should be hard to pick any difference. however at low bitrates it still may be possible in which case the 1 of the tweaks which is in 1 of those test files should be better, maybe. :D

Nic - well if you have tested the tweak to old engine i sent and find no problems with it then thats the one i would suggest to use for Rejig 0.6. i cant see people rushing to test. pity.

Paced

14th March 2004, 06:13

Originally posted by dragongodz
Paced - this may have to do with the chapters being off by a second or 2 problem that DMagic1 reported. Nic has said the chapter numbers timing is generated differently with Rejig 0.6 so it will be interesting to hear if that fixes it or not. when Rejig 0.6 is released that is. :)

Cool, can't wait :D

DMagic1

14th March 2004, 10:59

By your statements I thought it would be released by now Nic.

I have just the right project waiting on this.

Amnon82

16th March 2004, 15:24

Hi Nic. As You know I compile MEncoder and code a gui for it. So I use Your ReJig for authoring my DVDs.

So here my Question:

How can I check if buffer underrun ocours? Is there a way? Or didn't it happen with Your DVDAuthor?

My first DVD I encoded with MEncoder I can't author with IFOEdit. So I choosed ReJig to do this job. Today I can author the new source (M2V and 2 AC3s with 4 subs) in IFOEdit. Ca. at 5% it wrote into the Log that the data of the videostream will arrive to late. Ergo this is a bufferunderrun.

IFOEdit wrotes Stream E0: data will arrive too late. Current SCR: 30192640, stream DTS:0
and Stream E0: data will arrive too late. Current SCR: 30236672, stream DTS:0

I checked the movie and all is sync. Then I used Your ReJig to do also the same Job. Is there a way to check if ReJig also produce Buffer underruns?

Amnon82

16th March 2004, 15:52

I found a way to check this:

First the IFOEdit result:

MPEG-2 Validator v1.4.0.131 - 16.03.2004 15:46:43

File under analysis: "D:\ifoeditmux\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_1.VOB"..!

Begin Process:

Begin Program Streams Summary:
Missing Progam End Code...
File "D:\ifoeditmux\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_1.VOB" is a DVD MPEG-2 Program Stream
MPEG file size 1024.00 MB
MPEG Packs = 524287
Sectors delay = 0.0 ms
System headers = 2897
Rate Bound = 10080000 bps -> 9843 Kbps
Video Bound = 1 active video streams
Audio Bound = 1 active audio streams
Variable Bitrate Operation (System MPEG-2 VBR)
Video Picture Rate is locked to SCR
Audio Sampling Rate is locked to SCR
MPEG Pack Size = 2048
Packets per Pack = 1
Program Mux Rate = 9843 Kbps
Total PES packets = 531416
PES Packet Lenght Max. = 2028
Number of Video Streams: 1
*Number of Audio Streams: 2
Private Stream 1, ID: BD, packets = 78697, Total = 153939 KB
Substream (DVD): Subpicture stream 20, PES packets = 487, total bytes = 664816
Substream (DVD): Subpicture stream 21, PES packets = 525, total bytes = 714164
Substream (DVD): Subpicture stream 22, PES packets = 463, total bytes = 615648
Substream (DVD): Subpicture stream 23, PES packets = 504, total bytes = 667464
*Substream (DVD): AC3 Audio substream 80
PES packets = 38359,
Total = 75519 KB
*Substream (DVD): AC3 Audio substream 81
PES packets = 38359,
Total = 75519 KB
Padding Stream, packets = 4232, Total = 4202 KB
Private Stream 2, packets = 5794, Total = 5652 KB
Video stream, ID: E0
PES packets = 442693,
Total = 852.04 MB
End Program Streams Summary.

Begin Video Streams Summary:
*Sequence_end_code NOT FOUND, in Stream E0!!
Video Delay Stream E0 = 192.8 ms
Number of Frames = 40277 -> 1611.08 Sec
Number of Sequence Headers = 2897
Sequence Headers Aligned = Yes
Horizontal Size = 720
Vertical Size = 576
*Aspect Ratio = 16:9
Frame Rate = 25 fps
P-STD Buffer Size Bound = 0 KB (From System Header)
VBV Buffer Size = 112 -> (224 KB)
Stream Type = MPEG-2 MP@ML VBR
Chroma Format = 4:2:0
Picture Structure = Frame
Intra DC Precision = 8
*Top Field First = No
*DCT Type = Frame
Quant. Scale = Linear
Scan Type = Alternate
Frame Type = Interlaced
Number of GOPs = 2897
*First GOP Closed = No
Number of Closed GOP = 0
Max. frames per GOP (without first & last) = 15
Min. frames per GOP (without first & last) = 3
Avg. frames per GOP (Total) = 13.90
Max. Frame Size = 128487
Min. Frame Size = 782
Average Frame Size = 22181
Frames I = 2897 -> 7%
Avg. Frame I Size = 301 KB
Frames I Total Size = 131593237 bytes, size 14%
Frames P = 10530 -> 26%
Avg. Frame P Size = 82 KB
Frames P Total Size = 233521575 bytes, size 26%
Frames B = 26851 -> 66%
Avg. Frame B Size = 32 KB
Frames B Total Size = 528296649 bytes, size 59%
Nominal bitrate (Sequence Header) = 9800000 bps -> 9570 Kbps
Average Bitrate = 4332 Kbps
*Peak Bitrate (1 sec) = 10040 Kbps
End Video Streams Summary.

Begin Audio Streams Summary:
End Audio Streams Summary.

Video Stream Duration: 1611.08 sec -> 1611:02 (secs:frames)

Duration Difference from Video to Audio = 1611080 msec
Initial Delay Audio to Video (PTS based) = -193 msec

Processing time: 00:01:16

Result:
Compliance Test: Fail!!

End.

And here the Result of ReJig:

MPEG-2 Validator v1.4.0.131 - 16.03.2004 15:49:44

File under analysis: "F:\Rejigmux\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_1.VOB"..!

Begin Process:

Begin Program Streams Summary:
Missing Progam End Code...
File "F:\Rejigmux\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_1.VOB" is a DVD MPEG-2 Program Stream
MPEG file size 1023.97 MB
MPEG Packs = 524272
Sectors delay = 0.0 ms
System headers = 2897
Rate Bound = 10080000 bps -> 9843 Kbps
Video Bound = 1 active video streams
Audio Bound = 1 active audio streams
Variable Bitrate Operation (System MPEG-2 VBR)
Video Picture Rate is locked to SCR
Audio Sampling Rate is locked to SCR
MPEG Pack Size = 2048
Packets per Pack = 1
Program Mux Rate = 9843 Kbps
*PTS underflow (Mux Error)...!!
Total PES packets = 531411
PES Packet Lenght Max. = 2028
Number of Video Streams: 1
*Number of Audio Streams: 2
Private Stream 1, ID: BD, packets = 78691, Total = 153928 KB
Substream (DVD): Subpicture stream 20, PES packets = 487, total bytes = 664816
Substream (DVD): Subpicture stream 21, PES packets = 525, total bytes = 714164
Substream (DVD): Subpicture stream 22, PES packets = 463, total bytes = 615648
Substream (DVD): Subpicture stream 23, PES packets = 504, total bytes = 667464
*Substream (DVD): AC3 Audio substream 80
PES packets = 38356,
Total = 75513 KB
*Substream (DVD): AC3 Audio substream 81
PES packets = 38356,
Total = 75513 KB
Padding Stream, packets = 4242, Total = 4201 KB
Private Stream 2, packets = 5794, Total = 5652 KB
Video stream, ID: E0
PES packets = 442684,
Total = 852.03 MB
End Program Streams Summary.

Begin Video Streams Summary:
*Sequence_end_code NOT FOUND, in Stream E0!!
Video Delay Stream E0 = 186.3 ms
Number of Frames = 40277 -> 1611.08 Sec
Number of Sequence Headers = 2897
Sequence Headers Aligned = Yes
Horizontal Size = 720
Vertical Size = 576
*Aspect Ratio = 16:9
Frame Rate = 25 fps
P-STD Buffer Size Bound = 0 KB (From System Header)
VBV Buffer Size = 112 -> (224 KB)
Stream Type = MPEG-2 MP@ML VBR
Chroma Format = 4:2:0
Picture Structure = Frame
Intra DC Precision = 8
*Top Field First = No
*DCT Type = Frame
Quant. Scale = Linear
Scan Type = Alternate
Frame Type = Interlaced
Number of GOPs = 2897
*First GOP Closed = No
Number of Closed GOP = 0
Max. frames per GOP (without first & last) = 15
Min. frames per GOP (without first & last) = 3
Avg. frames per GOP (Total) = 13.90
Max. Frame Size = 128487
Min. Frame Size = 782
Average Frame Size = 22181
Frames I = 2897 -> 7%
Avg. Frame I Size = 301 KB
Frames I Total Size = 131593237 bytes, size 14%
Frames P = 10530 -> 26%
Avg. Frame P Size = 82 KB
Frames P Total Size = 233521575 bytes, size 26%
Frames B = 26851 -> 66%
Avg. Frame B Size = 32 KB
Frames B Total Size = 528296649 bytes, size 59%
Nominal bitrate (Sequence Header) = 9800000 bps -> 9570 Kbps
Average Bitrate = 4332 Kbps
*Peak Bitrate (1 sec) = 10040 Kbps
End Video Streams Summary.

Begin Audio Streams Summary:
End Audio Streams Summary.

Video Stream Duration: 1611.08 sec -> 1611:02 (secs:frames)

Duration Difference from Video to Audio = 1611080 msec
Initial Delay Audio to Video (PTS based) = -186 msec

Processing time: 00:01:40

Result:
Compliance Test: Fail!!

End.

Did I something wrong with the bitrates?

[Edit] I found it out! It was the bitrate! I was over the valid one. So I skiped the english Audiostream and got a VOB without a bufferunderrun. Man! I'm doing this so long and now I did this stupied mistake! Bugga. You can learn from mistakes. And I never do this again. MPEG Validator is a realy good tool. I think I add it to my DRPEnc Package. Nic take a look on this tool. ... and I can't wait for ReJig 0.6 :D... If it's out then it's out! ... ;)

r6d2

16th March 2004, 15:59

AFAIK, managing the VBV buffer is the encoder's main task to produce a compliant stream. Proper muxing cannot "fix" a bad stream since the player can get buffer overruns anyway. Again AFAIK, buffer underruns don't have to do with sync issues, but with the ability of data to pass smoothly from the decoder to the display.

So in you're having VBV problems it's mencoder's fault I guess.

But I'm just on page 22 of the book. :). I hope someone more knowledgeable can confirm this.

Nic

16th March 2004, 16:58

That's very true r6d2. I wouldn't worry about it amnon82. If it plays fine then everything is ok.

(This is a 22 page book...gonna close it soon and start afresh with 0.6...just written a new app called QuEnc which may/may not help jdobbs, ill release that first (AVS->M2V Encoding))

-Nic

r6d2

16th March 2004, 19:34

Originally posted by Amnon82
MPEG Validator is a realy good tool.I had a look at it too. Interesting. It keeps complainng about 29.97fps not being compliant though. :( Maybe I'll better post this in the author's thread too.

Amnon82

16th March 2004, 21:02

THX r6d2 for this great information. I encode the movie now with a lower bitrate again. (I don't know why... maybe I'm to long on my machine.)

@Nic Yes You should close this book soon.

Nic what is QuEnc. Is it a new encoder or is it based on someone?
Its always good to here about new apps coming up.
Do You use MEncoder? Till now it works fine for me. And I'm going with every new release of DRPEnc better. Coding is a great hobby!
It makes realy fun.

...Is it now page23?

Nic

16th March 2004, 22:05

Try it:
http://nic.dnsalias.com/QuEnc.exe

Very early beta, sent it to jdobbs to see what he thinks. Should work, just feed an avisynth file (that outputs YV12 (or use ConvertToYV12) and get a raw MPEG-1 or MPEG-2 file. Uses the FFMPEG library for encoding. Got around 30-35fps encoding speed on my box...quality seems good too.

EDIT: Now released and at version 0.2 in the "Other MPEG1/2 Encoders" forum. http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=72827 Please post there on QuEnc

-Nic

Amnon82

17th March 2004, 15:37

Well QuEnc is out. When will You close this book? :cool:

Oldeman

20th March 2004, 21:56

Nic,
Now that DVD-RB has made ReJig a one button application, I think lots of people will use it. So far have done two movies with .5e and quality seems good. Can't wait for next version.

Keep up the good work...

DMagic1

21st March 2004, 10:14

@NIc

Any chance of the v0.6 being released soon?

djan

21st March 2004, 23:10

Right, we are waiting :D

Nic

21st March 2004, 23:39

Lol...Sorry for the delay.
(Blame Mother's Day (should be renamed florist's day) and championship manager for me not releasing it this weekend)

Oldeman

23rd March 2004, 17:03

As a newwbbbiieee in the encoding arena, could someone give me a short list of pros/cons of ReJig versus QuEnc?? Run time considerations?

My gut feeling is that ReJig is simpler to use, but that QuEnc may give better quality.

Thanks
The Oldeman

E-Male

23rd March 2004, 17:18

rejig is a transcoder, it basicly edits the file to make it smaller
on the other side you got a re-encoder that takes the file as source and makes a completely new (smaller) one
generally transcoding as much faster
quality, well, if you only need to shrink a bit, like to 95% then a transcoder might be better, else re-encoding with a good encoder will look better, but for me, only using the dvdrs on a cheap tv, rejig's quality is fine enough to take it's speed advantage

!!anybody correct me if i'm wrong!!

DMagic1

23rd March 2004, 19:03

Originally posted by Oldeman
As a newwbbbiieee in the encoding arena, could someone give me a short list of pros/cons of ReJig versus QuEnc?? Run time considerations?

My gut feeling is that ReJig is simpler to use, but that QuEnc may give better quality.

Thanks
The Oldeman

I too would like some input into which is really better.

r6d2

23rd March 2004, 20:06

The short answer: there is no short answer. A good suggestion would be to try them both and see what pleases you best.

E-Male

23rd March 2004, 20:07

ssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, violating rule 12 might wake sleeping beasts :devil:

as i said, if teh result will be more then a few % smaller then reencoding should give better quality, but it's much(!) slower

i should add that i compare rejig to cce in my posts, i couldn't try the new free encoder yet

djan

23rd March 2004, 21:17

Hi, tested a 85% recompression, ReJig gives better quality for sure. QuEnc isn't good at low bitrates. CCE as encoder is the best, nothing can beat it. But it's not free. :p

Neutrino

25th March 2004, 18:47

I'm a newbie in the field of DVD backups, So bear with me if this is a stupid question.

Can Rejig read encrypted DVDs or do i have to use thirdparty apps for decrypting?

Thanks in advance!

Stephen

DirtyAbdul

25th March 2004, 18:54

Originally posted by E-Male
ssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, violating rule 12 might wake sleeping beasts :devil:

*whispering* e-male, oldeman was NOT asking what was the "best" but rather for a list of pros and cons which IMHO is justified b/c it takes HOURS to read through this (and the old) thread to somewhat understand the implications. ;)
i have silently followed the whole development for months, but can't really provide input -- ain't no programmer and only understand half of what those gurus are talking about. :D therefore, i'd rather let them do the work and not annoy them with questions that the world doesn't need. ;) but believe me, i'm VERY excited like a kid in a candy store everytime a new version comes out. :D

CK

DirtyAbdul

25th March 2004, 19:02

Originally posted by Neutrino
I'm a newbie in the field of DVD backups, So bear with me if this is a stupid question.

Can Rejig read encrypted DVDs or do i have to use thirdparty apps for decrypting?

Thanks in advance!

Stephen

there are no stupid questions, only stupid answers! unfortunately, there are those with little mental capacity who feel good to give stupid answers. :mad:

anyway, my philosophy is: if someone is hungry, don't just feed them, rather teach them how to find food. therefore, why don't you use rejig on an ecrypted disc and see what happens. that'll answer your question :D.

btw, by using rejig, you could eventually contribute to the development of the program ;).

DA

Nic

26th March 2004, 18:13

It does read encrypted discs. Although 0.6 will come out in two flavours one with decryption on without...so you should only really download the version that is "legal" in your country.
(This is just to semi-cover-my-a*s ;) )

-Nic

DirtyAbdul

26th March 2004, 19:36

Originally posted by Nic
It does read encrypted discs. Although 0.6 will come out in two flavours one with decryption on without...so you should only really download the version that is "legal" in your country.
(This is just to semi-cover-my-a*s ;) )

-Nic

nic, he was supposed to find that out himself :D.

DA

jdobbs

27th March 2004, 02:43

Originally posted by Nic
It does read encrypted discs. Although 0.6 will come out in two flavours one with decryption on without...so you should only really download the version that is "legal" in your country.
(This is just to semi-cover-my-a*s ;) )

-Nic You know, Nic, you are one multitasking kinda' guy. How many programming projects do you have open right now? ;)

Oldeman

27th March 2004, 02:57

I can't wait to try .6?

Is Santa Claus coming soon?
:rolleyes:

r6d2

27th March 2004, 03:27

Originally posted by jdobbs
You know, Nic, you are one multitasking kinda' guy. ;) Don't be fouled. They are twins. :D:D:D

onesoul

27th March 2004, 05:55

Clones I say :p

paulers

28th March 2004, 00:51

I tried using rejig in IFO mode with two passes and 3/4 through the second pass I got a windows error and it aborted the process. is there any way I can tell whats going on? I was looking for logs or some type of output but was unable to find any. It looks like the first pass worked fine because I have the complete file, but the second pass is much smaller due to the abort. Any ideas?

Nic

29th March 2004, 11:53

"You know, Nic, you are one multitasking kinda' guy. How many programming projects do you have open right now?"
8.3 billion...all unfinished. ;) lol

-Nic

Amnon82

30th March 2004, 18:16

I understand You nic. I'm running 3 projects at the same time. Its hard to update all at the same time...:D

Neutrino

30th March 2004, 19:42

Originally posted by Nic
It does read encrypted discs.

Ha!, Thankyou.

I tried rejig to back up a DVD9 to DVD 5 using full dvd backup option. This program processed for a long time and then came to end producing only 90MB files in VIDEO_TS folder, eventhough I set 4.7 GB. I found that it has produced about 7 Gb files as intermediate files. I think Rejig does automatic compression on converting DvD9 to DVD5, so is this a problem with me....only.

Edit:
Btw, Do menu will be supported in full dvd backup?

Amnon82

31st March 2004, 23:45

First Question: Normaly it does it this way:

Demultiplex the steams
transcode the M2V to a rejig.m2v
Doing the delay correction
multiplex it to a big vob
mulitplex the sub into the big vob
authoring the big vob to 1 gig vobs and adding the chapters.
(nic correct me if I'm wrong...)

Second Question: Till now not. It is only a movieonly backup. Maybe in 0.6

... guess why we're waiting for the next version? ...;)

2COOL

31st March 2004, 23:50

Originally posted by Nic
Lol...Sorry for the delay.
(Blame Mother's Day (should be renamed florist's day) and championship manager for me not releasing it this weekend) Well...it has been an awful long delay. At least, DVD-RB testing is keeping most of us pre-occupied for the moment.

rayvt

1st April 2004, 02:31

Any hope for getting rejig to read avs files? That would trim a lot of time off a DVD-RB job.

dragongodz

1st April 2004, 06:17

Amnon82 -
Rejig 0.6 doesnt do all those steps, or should i say does it all at once. you will see what i mean when Nic releases it. :)
Rejig 0.6 is movie only still, well the copy i have is anyway. the main change is to the first question you asked.

2cool -
ye i have emailed Nic saying now would be a good time to release Rejig 0.6 while he is waiting for ffmpeg rate control to be rewritten. so hopefully soon. :D

2COOL

1st April 2004, 08:04

@dragongodz

:thanks: for the nudge. ;)

Amnon82

2nd April 2004, 06:40

Yea dragongodz. Nic show me what dragongodz want me to tell.

Oldeman

4th April 2004, 00:03

Oh jolly Saint Nic;

How about a Easter post of ReJig .6 for our basket?

We've all been good Easter bunnies....

No Easter eggs required.

HoHoHo:)

boombastic

5th April 2004, 15:14

I tried the ifo mode with 0.5e version:i had the ac3,the m2v and the sup but after the authoriting iget only the two folders Audio and video TS no file within.Then i also tried to re-author manually but again i see in the working directory during the process only one file increasing in size but at the end it disappears and nothing in the two folders created.What's wrong?

boombastic

5th April 2004, 18:10

I managed to author by deselecting the option "copy subtitle option",i don't know what's wrong with it.For the chapters:if i load the chapter information that DVD decrypter gives to me i can't jump from a chapter to another playing the vob file i obtain

WONDERBOY

6th April 2004, 15:38

Any chance of a release of 6.0 today? it's my birthday...

djan

6th April 2004, 15:40

Originally posted by WONDERBOY
Any chance of a release of 6.0 today? it's my birthday... Haha, you dream. :D

WONDERBOY

6th April 2004, 18:28

I meant 0.6

Amnon82

6th April 2004, 22:44

Happy birthday. How old are You now? ...

I think Nic is searching for the ReJig 0.6 Eggs. Maybe he is the easterrabbit and did a good job ...

dragongodz

7th April 2004, 12:28

well just to let you guys know ,i have been putting in heaps of effort for you. have put a little reminder in practically every email i have sent Nic. he actually hasnt gotten shirty(meaning mad) with me about it either. nice guy. :)

all i can say for sure is that Nic is still very very very busy at work and that other personal things have been going on. that means he doesnt have the time to do all he wants at the moment. he has told me he is trying though so a little more patience is required. ye i know its hard with the anticipation one builds up but thats life i am afraid.

its the small things you never see or hear about that take more time than people may realise. what may sound simple can prove a right pain in the @$$. and thats speaking from experience. :)

Nic

7th April 2004, 14:19

Just been busy with other stuff..Got four days off at easter, and hopefully, if I dont go out too much, ill be able to get some ReJig/QuEnc stuff done....

-Nic

NobbyNobbs

7th April 2004, 16:14

@Nic

You should not have told us about actually having a real life :D

We´re supposed to tell a programmer to "get a life", he is not supposed to take the advice :D :D

WONDERBOY

7th April 2004, 16:16

Originally posted by Amnon82
Happy birthday. How old are You now? ...

I'm 17.

jdobbs

7th April 2004, 16:37

Originally posted by WONDERBOY
I'm 17. I have shoes older than you. They're my new ones. Hope you had a good birthday.

WONDERBOY

7th April 2004, 16:40

Thanks. It was fine. And just how old are your old shoes?

jdobbs

7th April 2004, 17:52

Originally posted by WONDERBOY
Thanks. It was fine. And just how old are your old shoes? Much younger than my feet, but older than my socks.

WONDERBOY

7th April 2004, 21:01

Then, I assume all of the above mentioned are older than me?

Nic

8th April 2004, 20:19

Hopefully....ill get ReJig out this weekend...

Rumours of me having a real life are vastly exagerated...currently drunk playing mario double-dash with two other mates....at the age of 23.lol

-Nic

The_Flash

8th April 2004, 20:32

<---Better than doing the same and being 25.

Joergen

8th April 2004, 20:36

I do it too (well usually manly football or racing games on the oh so manly PEE ESS TWO ;)) and I'm 23.

YaoMing11

8th April 2004, 22:23

Is the quality of Rejig better than the quality of Instant copy 8? Im wanting to rip a movie that needs to be compressed to 76%. Will I notice a difference in quality if I use Rejig with DVD-rb instead of Instant Copy 8?

NobbyNobbs

9th April 2004, 00:18

@YaoMing11

This is the third post I´ve seen where you are asking the same question, try the different programs, and decide for yourself.

What is best questions seldom have just one answer, and beside that both what is best and double posting is against the rules on the Doom9 forum.

YaoMing11

9th April 2004, 00:25

It's against the rules to ask for peoples opinions? There is a DVD-shrink vs. CCE post 6 pages long a few below this one.:confused: I didnt cross-post dude. I was asking similiar questions in other threads that were on the subject of rejig. I have about 13 movies that need to encoded in about 1-2 days, and on top of that I have a slow ass computer. :mad:

Im only trying to find out if the majority people here would reccomend using IC8 or is Rejig worth taking 2 hours more to get the job done.:confused:

NobbyNobbs

9th April 2004, 00:32

@YaoMing11

Sorry if you felt I was rude, but questions about witch program gives best quality usualy have no clear answer, one really have to make up one´s own mind.

How do you manage to use two more hours with ReJig than with Instant Copy ?
My experience is that ReJig is fast, and Instant Copy is quite slow (not as slow as CCE or other encoders, but definitly the slowest of the transcoders).

YaoMing11

9th April 2004, 00:49

Im not sure. I use IC8 and keep the menus while ripping extras and audio and it takes about 80min sometimes to complete a movie on high quality. Using DVD-RB with Rejig it takes about 2 hours or more to complete a movie with the same setup.

NobbyNobbs

9th April 2004, 01:17

Although I think Jdobbs is on the way to making a great program, and even if I myself is not a regular Instant Copy user, I would use Instant Copy if I had 13 movies to backup in just a few days, beta software is just that, beta.
I love trying out ReJig and DVD RB, but if I had a deadline, beta software might not be the best idea. (beta testing is about finding the inevitable bugs in a program, so that the developer can fix them before going final.) :D

djan

9th April 2004, 01:29

Originally posted by YaoMing11
Im not sure. I use IC8 and keep the menus while ripping extras and audio and it takes about 80min sometimes to complete a movie on high quality. Using DVD-RB with Rejig it takes about 2 hours or more to complete a movie with the same setup. It's not normal, IC8 must take much more time to make its work. ReJig is very fast transcoder and it doesn't have to take so much time. Now, for your backups, if you have IC8, use it, it's a very good program and it gave me very good results. Also, you'll be able to keep the menus. Keep the menus and the movie and strip extras and audios. You'll get good backups. Now, if you have nothing to do with the menus and the extras, just use ReJig that gives very good quality too. Finally, the twos are very good. It depends what you want.

nicksteel

9th April 2004, 10:18

How is best way to convert from NTSC 29.97 to FILM 23.976 when using Rejig for DVD to DVD? Could this result in higher quality due to smaller size requirements?

jdobbs

9th April 2004, 10:55

Originally posted by YaoMing11
It's against the rules to ask for peoples opinions? There is a DVD-shrink vs. CCE post 6 pages long a few below this one.:confused: I didnt cross-post dude. I was asking similiar questions in other threads that were on the subject of rejig. I have about 13 movies that need to encoded in about 1-2 days, and on top of that I have a slow ass computer. :mad:

Im only trying to find out if the majority people here would reccomend using IC8 or is Rejig worth taking 2 hours more to get the job done.:confused: You are mistaken. ReJig will finish a job typically in less than half the time of a decent IC-8 encode. If you are using IC-8 in its fast-encoding mode pretty much anything is better in terms of quality. If you are using it in its high-quality mode then I think it will do a little better than ReJig (but will take probably 4 times longer than ReJig).

On my system a full DVD backup with ReJig and DVD-RB takes about a half hour.

jdobbs

9th April 2004, 10:59

Originally posted by nicksteel
How is best way to convert from NTSC 29.97 to FILM 23.976 when using Rejig for DVD to DVD? Could this result in higher quality due to smaller size requirements? You can't. ReJig is a requantizer. It works within the compressed domain and never gets to a level at which it could do this. Even if it did, it's a bad idea. Removing frames from 29.97 video to get it to FILM reduces the quality of the output except when the original was truly 23.976 and got to 29.976 through telecining... If that is the case you don't have to do anything. Pretty much all s/w packages (including ReJig) take care of that for you. (it's actually that rate anyway)

nicksteel

9th April 2004, 14:34

Thanks, jdobbs. Answered my question.:)

Another question. I would like to decrease the audio size by producing 192 bitrate mp2 with headac3he and muxing with m2v from rejig with tmpgenc author. This can increase the compression factor a good bit due to smaller audio size. Only problem is tmpgenc author gives message about combined video+audio bitrate exceeding the standard DVD rate of 9800. Is there any way to avoid this?:confused:

jdobbs

9th April 2004, 15:03

Originally posted by nicksteel
Thanks, jdobbs. Answered my question.:)

Another question. I would like to decrease the audio size by producing 192 bitrate mp2 with headac3he and muxing with m2v from rejig with tmpgenc author. This can increase the compression factor a good bit due to smaller audio size. Only problem is tmpgenc author gives message about combined video+audio bitrate exceeding the standard DVD rate of 9800. Is there any way to avoid this?:confused: I'm not that familiar with TMPGENC's authoring portion... but probably what is happening is that the original stream is tagged at 9800 in the Sequence Headers (you see that a lot in DVD video). ReJig probably leaves them untouched (not sure) -- so when you try to combine it with anything else it looks like you've exceeded the limit... There has to be a tool out there somewhere that can retag the headers... I'm not the right guy to ask for that, because I would generally take the hard road and write a routine that scans through and changes it -- it's a pride thing I think.

nicksteel

9th April 2004, 16:29

Originally posted by jdobbs
I'm not that familiar with TMPGENC's authoring portion... but probably what is happening is that the original stream is tagged at 9800 in the Sequence Headers (you see that a lot in DVD video). ReJig probably leaves them untouched (not sure) -- so when you try to combine it with anything else it looks like you've exceeded the limit... There has to be a tool out there somewhere that can retag the headers... I'm not the right guy to ask for that, because I would generally take the hard road and write a routine that scans through and changes it -- it's a pride thing I think.

Thanks. I'll try to find something. Reducing the audio size has a real effect on the available video size. For example, a two hour video does 80% with original audio file, 86% with 192bps.

Thanks again.:)

Amnon82

9th April 2004, 16:52

Hi nicksteel. The tool You searching for is coded in germany. It is called DVDPatcher. Normaly it is used to change the resolution in the header, but You can also change the bitrate.

Here is a link for downloading (http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/files/DVDPatcher_v106.zip) it from my page.

Stay tuned.

Phil

nicksteel

9th April 2004, 18:13

Originally posted by Amnon82
Hi nicksteel. The tool You searching for is coded in germany. It is called DVDPatcher. Normaly it is used to change the resolution in the header, but You can also change the bitrate.

Here is a link for downloading (http://rj-elektronik.de/avideo/files/DVDPatcher_v106.zip) it from my page.

Stay tuned.

Phil

Thanks, Phil. Downloaded DVDPatcher. How do I set the bitrate for a 720x480 DVD (M2V) ?

Amnon82

9th April 2004, 18:55

Hi nicksteel. Normaly the using of the app is easy. Load the M2V-file.
There is a field called 'Patch MPEG2 File to'. At Bitrate U use 'Custom' and enter the wanted bitrate. At 'Horizontal Size' choose '720' and at 'Vertical Size' I think it is for You '480'. At Framerate I think it is for You '29.97 fps'. In the Patchfield choose 'Entire file' and hit 'Patch now!'. Thats it.

YaoMing11

9th April 2004, 20:06

Jdobbs, Can the reason that DVD-RB & Rejig is taking about 2 hours to encode is because I run it through DVDClone first to remove extras and unwanted audio while keeping the menus. I then run it through DVD-RB using Rjeg in the 1 click mode and it always takes about 2 hours on a 2400+ AMD system.

With IC8 I made sure all settings were correct and set for high quality and it takes me anywhere from 80-100 minutes to complete. That is strange that everybody here gets the opposite of me. :confused:

Also when I use IC8 I always just keep the first title and the menu. I uncheck everything else. I also only keep 1 track of the english audio.

lab-one

9th April 2004, 20:32

@YaoMing11

Jdobbs, Can the reason that DVD-RB & Rejig is taking about 2 hours to encode is because I run it through DVDClone first to remove extras and unwanted audio while keeping the menus. I then run it through DVD-RB using Rjeg in the 1 click mode and it always takes about 2 hours on a 2400+ AMD system.

I have a 2400+ AMD as well. I used DVDShrink to rip the movie only and ran it through DVD-Rb using rejig (basically to do a comparison of rejig and DVDShrink). It took about 2.5 hours. The first phase took at least 45 minutes and the balance to the final stages. I was expecting it to happen faster. But I have no experience with Rejig to gauge this against....

jdobbs

9th April 2004, 21:03

Originally posted by lab-one
@YaoMing11

I have a 2400+ AMD as well. I used DVDShrink to rip the movie only and ran it through DVD-Rb using rejig (basically to do a comparison of rejig and DVDShrink). It took about 2.5 hours. The first phase took at least 45 minutes and the balance to the final stages. I was expecting it to happen faster. But I have no experience with Rejig to gauge this against.... Wow. I have an AMD 2400+ with 512MB RAM and a 160MB caching hard drive hooked to an ASUS MB that I use for video processing. If I choose ReJig and run it through DVD-RB only, it takes somewhere from 30-40 minutes end-to-end. Most movies come in at around 30 minutes.

lab-one

9th April 2004, 21:51

@jdobbs

Wow. I have an AMD 2400+ with 512MB RAM and a 160MB caching hard drive hooked to an ASUS MB that I use for video processing. If I choose ReJig and run it through DVD-RB only, it takes somewhere from 30-40 minutes end-to-end. Most movies come in at around 30 minutes.

My PC is also 512MB. I have no idea why it takes so long. I may redo it tonight after a fresh boot and see how it performs.

rayvt

9th April 2004, 22:30

One reason that a rejig rebuild takes so long is that rejig can't read avs files, so DVD-RB has to create the MPV files itself, as a separate step.

jdobbs

10th April 2004, 01:20

Originally posted by lab-one
@YaoMing11

I have a 2400+ AMD as well. I used DVDShrink to rip the movie only and ran it through DVD-Rb using rejig (basically to do a comparison of rejig and DVDShrink). It took about 2.5 hours. The first phase took at least 45 minutes and the balance to the final stages. I was expecting it to happen faster. But I have no experience with Rejig to gauge this against.... The first stage (demuxing) should take about 15 minutes. Of course, if you have a hard drive that is near full or is segmented it could be much longer. It can also be affected by what other software you have running at the same time.

lab-one

10th April 2004, 01:45

@jdobb

The first stage (demuxing) should take about 15 minutes. Of course, if you have a hard drive that is near full or is segmented it could be much longer. It can also be affected by what other software you have running at the same time.

69.2gb total, 42.4gb free. Not segmented or fragmented. I wasn't at the computer running anything while running the process. Have Norton and firewall running at all times. One thing I've noticed is that DVD-RB runs at about 25-40% of available CPU while System Idle Process allocates the balance. I have DVD-RB set to run at Normal.

Joergen

10th April 2004, 03:19

lab-one check that your drives are not in PIO mode, but in ULTRA DMA mode.

lab-one

10th April 2004, 04:21

@joergen

lab-one check that your drives are not in PIO mode, but in ULTRA DMA mode.

In BIOS it shows HDD as UDMA 5. How else can I check this?

YaoMing11

10th April 2004, 07:33

Can somebody please help me out? Ive encoded 2 movies with no problems with Rejig using DVD-RB, and now every movie I try it encodes but I dont have audio. I make sure I keep all the audios checked, but it's like it encodes it without audio. Im having problems with IC8 and relying on Rejig since it gives me the best quality next to IC8.

jdobbs

10th April 2004, 12:15

Originally posted by YaoMing11
Can somebody please help me out? Ive encoded 2 movies with no problems with Rejig using DVD-RB, and now every movie I try it encodes but I dont have audio. I make sure I keep all the audios checked, but it's like it encodes it without audio. Im having problems with IC8 and relying on Rejig since it gives me the best quality next to IC8. Please post these kinds of questions in one of the DVD-RB threads. This thread is discussing ReJig -- and really isn't related to your problems.

jdobbs

10th April 2004, 12:35

Originally posted by WONDERBOY
Then, I assume all of the above mentioned are older than me? Hmmm... let's see

((WONDERBOY .LT. SHOES) .and. (SHOES .LT. FEET)) -> (WONDERBOY .LT. FEET)

but (WONDERBOY .LT. SHOES) .and. (SOCKS .LT. SHOES) .not. -> (WONDERBOY .LT. SOCKS)

The socks are up in the air... the premises are insufficient to determine the answer.

DirtyAbdul

11th April 2004, 23:26

Originally posted by lab-one
@joergen

In BIOS it shows HDD as UDMA 5. How else can I check this?

1. [Start] button
2. Control Panel
3. System
4. "Hardware" tab
5. [Device Manager] button
6. Under "IDE ATA/ATAPI controllers" double-click on "Primary" or "Secondary IDE Channel"
7. "Advanced Settings" tab
8. Under "Transfer Mode:" click on "DMA if available".
9. repeat that for all devices ("0" and "1") and all ide channels.

DA

ps: there are also registry settings, but can't remember the mods anymore. maybe some1 else can help? or do a search in this forum... ;)

m99

18th April 2004, 07:59

Any news about 0.6? Or is it still "when it's ready"?

PS! DL is here soon.

casio7131

23rd April 2004, 07:37

Originally posted by jdobbs
((WONDERBOY .LT. SHOES) .and. (SHOES .LT. FEET)) -> (WONDERBOY .LT. FEET)

but (WONDERBOY .LT. SHOES) .and. (SOCKS .LT. SHOES) .not. -> (WONDERBOY .LT. SOCKS)
i see you're a fortran'er --- good to see another one.

jdobbs

23rd April 2004, 10:44

Originally posted by casio7131
i see you're a fortran'er --- good to see another one. Man, that's been a long time.

dragongodz

23rd April 2004, 15:40

m99 - i do still keep asking Nic and he still hasnt bitten my head off yet. :)

Amnon82

23rd April 2004, 20:53

good news that U've still ur head where it belongs to... :D

Nic

24th April 2004, 15:12

Was going to release another QuEnc today...but far too sunny. Maybe tomorrow. Good English weather is hard to come by, so I have to make the most of it.lol

Thanks all for your patience :)

-Nic

jdobbs

24th April 2004, 16:35

Originally posted by Nic
Was going to release another QuEnc today...but far too sunny. Maybe tomorrow. Good English weather is hard to come by, so I have to make the most of it.lol

Thanks all for your patience :)

-Nic Get out of here... go enjoy the weather!

jdobbs

24th April 2004, 16:50

@NIC

When you get back indoors and are sitting around wondering what to do next... could you give some thought to adding command line options to QuEnc that can reset (uncheck) Trellis, kvcd, and 2 pass? Right now if I turn them on with the command line (DVD-RB) they can't be reset without opening QuEnc and manually doing it.

Thanks!

Nic

24th April 2004, 17:19

My arms and face are bright red now with sunburn...lol. Like a lot of programmers I tend to be a translucent white colour, so I burn quickly ;) lol

Yup those switches are high on my list. :)

Actually after the next release, Ill send you the source, just incase I stop coding for a while and you need to change something simple. (although it's a bugg*r to compile as dgz will tell you ;) )

-Nic

jdobbs

24th April 2004, 18:13

Thanks!

dragongodz

25th April 2004, 06:01

you guys do relise this is the Rejig thread right ? :D

and yes compile options/switches for ffmpeg/libavcodec are so under documented its a pain. then theirs downloading so much stuff for cygwin etc and compiling ffmpeg fine but linking the libs to QuEnc NOT working .... urggghh. maybe its just me though. :)

jdobbs

25th April 2004, 11:51

Originally posted by dragongodz
you guys do relise this is the Rejig thread right ? Good point -- theres a rule or something about that around here I think...;)

dragongodz

26th April 2004, 13:07

wow, over 500(this should be 501) replies in this thread now. hmm maybe time for a new thread Nic ? :D

Amnon82

26th April 2004, 20:10

This will be the 502th post on this thread. What is the record? :D

Nic

26th April 2004, 21:39

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=73051

Is pretty big...and pretty darn new...impressive.

-Nic

Mtz

26th April 2004, 23:50

Every day I enter on doom9 forum I'm looking for "ReJig 0.6 Released" thread. And every day I am a little sad because I can't find this thread. And I'm waiting also for the new DVD2SVCD. But maybe someday I'll be lucky...
When dragongodz wrote something about "hmm maybe time for a new thread Nic ?" I hope that he knows more than me. ;)

dragongodz

27th April 2004, 07:18

I hope that he knows more than me.
Mtz please dont give me lines like that. its just asking for a snappy smartarse comeback. :D

mmgrover

27th April 2004, 16:39

Hey all, The ReJig.org site has had no traffic for some time,
Does anybody see a need to keep it going?

thanx, Mike

RastaMasta

28th April 2004, 00:52

Ok, I've had just about enough of this crap! We've been waiting 4 to 5 months now for the 0.6 release. Some of us having been putting projects on hold for months now waiting for this new version. Now I understand that Nic is doing this out of the kindness of his heart and I respect that. But once you launch a project of this magnitude and interest you have some obligation to the community to keep us abreast of it's progress. If you're having problems with step X in the creation of the program let us know, we will understand and help if possible. If the program/project is dead, just tell us already! But all we get are these half-ass excuses of "I'm off to dance in the sunshine" or "I'm drinking a beer" or some crap. Please Nic, give us a straight and honest answer of when 0.6 of Rejig will be available if at all. Thank you.

crusher

28th April 2004, 01:39

RastaMasta,

That's about the most blatantly self-serving post I've read. Obviously you don't know the meaning of the word "respect" or you'd understand people need or want to take a break and enjoy life. I'm sure Nic will provide an update when he thinks it's ready...too bad it's not possible to exclude you from it when he does.

Crusher

RastaMasta

28th April 2004, 01:47

:rolleyes:
I understand that people need to take breaks and enjoy life. No problem with that whatsoever. But how long does it take to sit down and type a message that says "Hey guys, I'm going to take a break from the Rejig project for a couple of months. I'll let you know when I'm up and running again." THAT is a little respect.

E-Male

28th April 2004, 06:41

>>"..we will understand and help if possible.."
in you're first poist you start bitching, so much for your "help"
and who/what is "we"?

don't speak for the comunity in your first (bitching) post

and maybe look up "respect"

i know i'm not the most helpful person here because a) i don't have the programming skills (yet, i work on it) b) i'm not that good at constuctive posts c) i can't invest much time d) i'm lazy
BUT at least i don't bash people for taking time with their hobbies
especially on such complicated hobbies (have you ever programmed?)

and now please back on topic

E-Male

p.s. yes, i wait for a new rejig version, too, but i don't come here to tell everyone about it

dragongodz

28th April 2004, 07:03

Now I understand that Nic is doing this out of the kindness of his heart and I respect that.
hmm no either you do not understand or not fully respect that from what you say next.

once you launch a project of this magnitude and interest you have some obligation to the community to keep us abreast of it's progress
sorry but that is a misconception. if Nic wishes to say anything then it is as a curtiousy and he is in no way obliged to.

If the program/project is dead, just tell us already
if you read back you will see that both Nic and i have said that there is a Rejig 0.6 in the works. surly thats pretty straight forward enough.

all we get are these half-ass excuses of "I'm off to dance in the sunshine" or "I'm drinking a beer" or some crap
Nic has had a lot of things going on. by that i mean his real paying job, other project(such as QuEnc, found in other mpeg encoders section) and personal stuff. none of that is any of your business so why should he tell you everything thats going on ?

THAT is a little respect.
no that is a curtiousy.

RastaMasta - you seem to be under the illusion that Nic owes you something, he doesnt. he has released a program for people to use or not as they please. you didnt pay for it and Nic did not guarentee you some sort of service for it. try looking at it as a gift, if you want the latest model/version/whatever then wait and see if someone gives it to you, DONT try and demand it.