Aloha!

[UMP]

Hello,

I slightly changed the FairUse code to use the XviD 1.0 beta DLL, and I'm experiencing acces violations in xvid.dll after a few frames encoding.

This does not happen with the latest Koepi's stable build (2002.10.04) and with DivX releases. I only experience this with all xvid.dll that were built after Koepi's 2002.10.04, including the new beta.

After talking with Avery Lee, his opinion was that the problem *might* no be on the FU side.

Here are links to the modified FU executable, and to the modified source code :

http://fairuse.free.fr/FU_XviD10.zip
http://fairuse.free.fr/xvid_1.0_FU_source.zip

Hope this helps,

ump

EDIT :

I'm working on a WinXP SP1 system, and the problem occurs with any clip I tried, no matter what settings I used. I also tried to disable all CPU optimizations, but nothing does.

EDIT2 :

The problem was on my side :

More info here in the development forum : http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&postid=405820#post405820

@Koepi: Please excuse me for bothering you with this "issue". I'm feeling stupid. :o

[Teegedeck]

Thanx for the explanation, sysKin - you're always there to put me right when I'm wrong or to hand me a torch when I'm lost the dark! :D

[cipher]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by cipher
and in "zone", we could also force a range of frames to
use keyframes(I frames) only;
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No, this means that a zone starts with a forced keyframe. You have to use it if you're starting a greyscale zone, but it was originally designed for chapters - it's good when a chapter starts with a keyframe, you have faster/more accurate seeking.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One thing bothering me is the "weight", can someone plz explain what it is?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A weight zones use bitrate scalling proportional to the weight: if a "zone" weights 2.0, it will have twice the bitrate (assuming equal complexity) of a 1.0 zone.
Just use 0.5 if you want credits taking 50% of what it originally took. I'm not sure if weght zone is working however - I must make some tests. 2pass might not have the weight zone implememented correctly atm :/

Radek

oh thank you sysKin for clearifying this.:)

[Mango Madness]

mf, that is the best prototype i've ever seen! ;)

so how bout 1.1? haha, jk...sorry for my useless post. i'll have some hard numbers in a couple of hours to make up for it.

[OBcecado]

Just want to thank every develloper the hard work they've been having on writing a great codec as XviD certainly is.





Long live to XviD, and it's great devs ;)

[RathO]

YEAH! Now that XviD 1.0 beta is out, i'm cancelling my wishlist for christmas. Im calling my family right away since i wont be there for christmas eve 'cause i have some testing to do during my hollidays! :D

Regards

[symonjfox]

Great Job guys!

I've just a little question: is it possible to add the A/R flag in the GUI (for example as 3ivx does)? AFAIK the AR flag was implemented since Devapi 3 but never used in the VfW GUI. Never mind if a directshow filter won't handle it, but just to create good anamorphic encode to play in future MPEG4 players.

PS: I push a lot for this AR Flag, because I used to rip from sat channels, and most of them are 352*576 interlaced, so to create non-anamorphic clips, I would upsize to 720*576 or downsize to 352*288, with loss of quality in both encodes. And also it's a good way to improve compression (reducing horizzontal resolution).

[OUTPinged_]

Is alternate curve compression completely gone or it will be back when things are settled?

Also, is there now a way to see a size of first pass having only a .pass file?

[Bulletproof]

I see a definite improvement without even using the new features, this also has lumi masking/adaptive quant disabled:

Older XviD Build:

http://www.boomspeed.com/boya/Older.PNG

XviD 1.0:

http://www.boomspeed.com/boya/Latest.PNG

Zoom Up (Left: XviD 1.0/Right: XviD Older Build):

http://www.boomspeed.com/boya/Quickcrop.PNG


A tiny cosmetic suggestion I have is that it would be nice to have that new status window "Always on top" so a checkbox for that would be nice. Also, when in two-pass mode and you hit the ".." button under filesize dialogue it always reverts the filesize setting to 700. BTW to everyone, take careful note that the filesize box says "Kbytes" now, so the default setting of 700 is NOT going to make a 700 meg file.

Can't wait to test this against VP6 when they release their fixed build :D

[Koepi]

Outpinged:

look at the statsreader which gets shipped with the binary. open the first pass statsfile with it and enjoy the display of the first pas size and the bitrate graph.

Bulletproof:
Very cool, that's useful feedback (and it's even positive :) ). Thanks!

Regards
Koepi

[Teegedeck]

Originally posted by OUTPinged_
Is alternate curve compression completely gone or it will be back when things are settled?

Well, the plans have been to remove it completely, so I guess it's gone for good.

BTW: I slowly begin to realize that there's now
b-frames
lumi-masking
quarterpel
trellis; for mpeg-quant, too
custom mpeg-matrices
vhq
cartoon mode
GMC
all actually working and all actually working together!
My dreams have come true. Thank you again, XviD-team.

[mikeson]

All XviD devels, great work!! ;)

@sysKin: I have a question. Does Trellis work together with custom matrices?

[kxy]

This thread is going to get big. Soon it will be hard to read between all the praises and bug reports.

May I suggest a sticky on already know bugs, along with some of the things that syskin's explained?

[wannabe]

Koepi, it seems that u jumped out my message, plz try to revisit it, and make a response thank you :)

[Koepi]

Wannabe:

this is the 2nd rules violation you did in this thread. The first one is: use the search function, we discussed it many times, you found the results of the xvid ml - and now you're posting again just to point out your post is more important than others. Another rule vioaltion.
Since you know the answer already it makes no sense to bug around :P

Mikeson:

Yes, trellis even works with custom matrices. Teegedecks summary is quite accurate.

Regards
Koepi

[P0l1m0rph1c]

Originally posted by mikeson
All XviD devels, great work!! ;)

@sysKin: I have a question. Does Trellis work together with custom matrices?


Yes, it does.

[kxy]

Originally posted by sysKin

@all: if you want to share any artifact-related bugs PLEASE try at least two decoders: xvid and ffdshow. It's important to tell us what are the results of both.
Radek

Using this aloha decoder decoding the old xvid clips(assuming b-frame usage), it will always output a b-frame lag msg at the beginning of the clip, and it will display the same msg whenever you are seeking.

Using ffdshow libavcodec, the problem does not exist.

EDIT: This happens while decoding the aloha clips too.

[m99]

A Aloha standalone decoder DirectShow filter would be nice.

[mikeson]

So I think today it is Christmas and Birthday for every XviD user... :)

@Koepi and P0l1m0rph1c: Thanks for answering.

[OUTPinged_]

@Koepi: thank you. Old statsreader from nandub doesnt work anymore (prob. a change in a first pass file format) so i was confused.

Comments: I dont see a bframe treshold setting. Either it is hardcoded into a value that is different from default from older releases or bframe decision algo is changed.

No "constant quantizer" mode.

No "scaled" framesize shown in debug.

I did a quick test with what i was able to do and i get 0.8% better compressibility with all goodies off, chroma me on and me=6.

... and 4% better compressibility with same settings and VHQ=4.

Good job here.

[Sofus]

Great that XviD 1.0 Beta finally is out

Here are some small bugs that I found

First, there is a problem with the new XviD, ffshow and zoomplayer together. When playing back old and new XviD encoded material and selecting XviD in ffshow under decoder, zoomplayer (ore ffshow?) is crashing.

When under XviD configuration, target size is selected and then pressing the “…” button, where there is suppose to be a bit rate calculator, after going back again, the default value for target size is back to default (570000)

The new XviD is very slow, using the same settings, compared to the older builds

---

Ffshow 20031028
Zoomplayer 3.20final

Sofus

[P0l1m0rph1c]

Originally posted by m99
A Aloha standalone decoder DirectShow filter would be nice.

But there is. Disable libavcodec in ffdshow and maybe other filters, like DivX 5.1.1 filter (for generic mpeg-4) or 3ivX 4.5's filter. Aloha brings a Dshow filter, that's for sure.

[OBcecado]

@OUTPinged_ it's name bvop threshold find it selecting the 0 frame and clicking in edit http://ptbox.net/~ob/bvop-threshold.jpg
Greetz.
about constant quantizer: just cap quants :P



All the best.

[cipher]

Originally posted by OUTPinged_
No "constant quantizer" mode.


In "zone" you can do it.

about constant quantizer: just cap quants :P
that's a pretty hopeless attempt in trying constant quantizer :D
Nervermind, OBcecado, just kidding.:D

[P0l1m0rph1c]

Originally posted by Sofus
Great that XviD 1.0 Beta finally is out

Here are some small bugs that I found

First, there is a problem with the new XviD, ffshow and zoomplayer together. When playing back old and new XviD encoded material and selecting XviD in ffshow under decoder, zoomplayer (ore ffshow?) is crashing.

When under XviD configuration, target size is selected and then pressing the “…” button, where there is suppose to be a bit rate calculator, after going back again, the default value for target size is back to default (570000)

The new XviD is very slow, using the same settings, compared to the older builds

---

Ffshow 20031028
Zoomplayer 3.20final

Sofus

Sofus: Don't use the XviD option in ffdshow. Use the Aloha dshow filter or libavcodec. In order to use Aloha's dshow filter, select "disable" in ffdshow, for XviD.

[OUTPinged_]

find it selecting the 0 frame and clicking in edit

Good place to hide it where no one would find out. :-)

[seewen]

First of all, thanks for the amazing job ( I don't know about the quality yet, but it's faster than before on P4).


With this new build, it's impossible to limit the bitrate (so that it's playble on a standalone) without choosing a profile.

But when you choose a profile, for example "DXN HT PAL/NTSC", you can only use H.263 matrix.

But standalones (at least the Kiss-Technology family) are able to read xvid with MPEG/Custom Matrix.

Is it possible to change this so that one could limit the bitrate AND use a Custom Matrix at the same time.

--

In the same idea, when you choose "DXN HT" profile, you cannot use QPEL anymore.
But the first standalone able to play QPEL is (quite) out ( http://www.elta.de/english/artikel.asp?Artikel=8883+MP4&Artikel1=8883&x=76&y=23).
But again, the bitrate has to be limited...

--

In fact those profile are great, but you should add the possibility to tweak ALL the settings without it.

[Hiro2k]

Originally posted by kxy
Using this aloha decoder decoding the old xvid clips(assuming b-frame usage), it will always output a b-frame lag msg at the beginning of the clip, and it will display the same msg whenever you are seeking.

Using ffdshow libavcodec, the problem does not exist.

EDIT: This happens while decoding the aloha clips too.

That is not a problem in Xvid, in fact you'll see the same problem with any DivX clip with b-frames. The problem lies with VFW.



Originally postedy bye Stux
It happens because a B frame is a bi-directionally predicted frame. This means you need two frames to predict from

so

I1 B2 P3 B4 P5 might be your display sequence

Now, the B2 frame is predicted from the I1 and P3 frame, so in order to decode the frame the decoder must have I1 and P3 first. So the encoder will write the frames in this order

I1 P3 B2 P5 B4

The problem is the decoder needs the 3rd frame in the file in order to decode the 2nd frame in the original file. So there has to be a frame of delay... unless the decoder runs a frame ahead, which the VfW architecture doesn't allow.

The normal hack is to pack the 3rd frame into the second frame so that its present at the right time.

Now, if you weren't using VfW (say you were using DirectShow instead) then you could simply take the 1 frame of delay into account and run the decoder 1 frame ahead, end of problem.

[zettai]

Originally posted by seewen
In fact those profile are great, but you should add the possibility to tweak ALL the settings without it.

Um... that's what the "unrestricted" profile is for...

(also the AS profiles etc allow you to choose different matrices)

[amango]

I used the 1Pass-Quality mode in XVID all the time for my encodings (size doesn't matter). How can I do this with this new build?

[P0l1m0rph1c]

@amango: you can do that using the zones configuration. Set start frame to zero and then below set the desired quantizer. This version will only allow quantizers, not % of quality.

[amango]

What quantizer-value do I need to get the same size/quality as before? I usually set quality to 95% to encode my videos. Which quantizer is equal to 95% quality?

[HarryM]

Very good news - new XviD version. 1.0beta finally! :D

But I have problems with XviD decoder (xvid.ax). Is DS decoder fully functional for now (I use win98se)?

I can't using a 'dev-api-3' decoders. It is imcompatible? I don't use special div-api-4 features, only b-frames + q-pel. Why is this stream is'nt dev-api-3 compatible???

[Bear]

Yeah, I want to know too. Cos I do 1 pass-quality mode in old xvid only. I always set the quality level to 90-92%.

[P0l1m0rph1c]

Originally posted by amango
What quantizer-value do I need to get the same size/quality as before? I usually set quality to 95% to encode my videos. Which quantizer is equal to 95% quality?

Quantizer 3

[communist]

Great work XviD team :D

Feature request (probably already in work):
A brightness slider for the decoder :) (as in older builds)
Its easier to access this one instead of having to go to display-properties > gfx driver tab... ;)

Oh and the statsreader crashes (exits) if you hit one of the foward / reverse or the "insert keyframe" button when no stats file is loaded.

[Manao]

XviD's dev : thanks a lot !!!

Just a few remarks on the GUI :

- I think it would be better if the three panels commanded by the encoding type were tabbed, and if the tab related to the encoding type selected was shown first.

- A bug : I clicked on the bitrate calculator and since I'm not able to set a final size when doing a second pass : I'm stuck with the "target bitrate".

- It would be great if we could add custom matrices permanently to the list of quantization type.

- If no zones are defined, the encodes doesn't follow the expected settings ( in my case, it didn't use bframes which were activated )

- The GUI is more powerful, but more confusing imho.

I can't make positive statements on the codec itself, since I can't make any encode yet, but I'm certain I won't be deceived.

Keep on the marvellous work !

[cipher]

I can't using a 'dev-api-3' decoders. It is imcompatible? I don't use special div-api-4 features, only b-frames + q-pel. Why is this stream is'nt dev-api-3 compatible???

dev-api-4's qpel+brames indeed cannot be decoded by dev-api-3's DS decoder, confirmed(long ago):D. But let's wait for someone powerful enough to explain it.

It wouldn't be a big problem anyway. Everybody's gonna update their decoders to XviD 1.0 beta and latter version, aren't they? :D

[ssjkakaroto]

thx a lot all xvid devs for this new release! :D keep up the great work!

this is not actually a bug and you probably know this but since from older builds if you select Twopass 2nd pass and click on the '...' of the target size it'll set the bitrate from single pass as the desired size.

and i have a question, if i have a 1000 frames movie and set the following zones:
0 - W:1.00
500 - Q:5.00
600 - W:1.00
frames 0-499 and 600-1000 will be encoded normally and 500-599 will be encoded using quantizer 5.00?

tia

[P0l1m0rph1c]

Originally posted by ssjkakaroto

and i have a question, if i have a 1000 frames movie and set the following zones:
0 - W:1.00
500 - Q:5.00
600 - W:1.00
frames 0-499 and 600-1000 will be encoded normally and 500-599 will be encoded using quantizer 5.00?

tia

The answer is yes, it will encode 500-600 with quantizer 5.:)

[mfluder]

Originally posted by Hiro2k
That is not a big in Xvid, in fact you'll see the same problem with any DivX clip with b-frames. The problem lies with VFW.
Yes, but this is DirectShow, and DirectShow doesn't have this problem. If it works without showing this message with dev-api-3 filter and ffdshow then it is possible with dev-api-4 filter too. I'm sure that XviD devs already know this and will fix it soon.

mfluder

[XenoDaSouljah]

I Would like to thank koepi and his team for this release. Testing as we speak... :)

[Teegedeck]

Originally posted by P0l1m0rph1c

Originally posted by amango
What quantizer-value do I need to get the same size/quality as before? I usually set quality to 95% to encode my videos. Which quantizer is equal to 95% quality?


Quantizer 3

Actually it's a bit more complex; it depends on your minimum and maximum quantizer-settings and thus 95% may mean a different quantizer for you than it means for amango.

See this thread (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?&threadid=65449)

[P0l1m0rph1c]

@Teegedeck:

I know what it means, i also read that thread. But he asked for a quantizer that would be equivalent to the previous quality standart of his, 95%. So, the most aproximate integral quantizer for 95%, was 3. One correction I should have made was that it wasn't 3, but around 3. Anyway, thanks for the correction :)

[amango]

Originally posted by P0l1m0rph1c
Quantizer 3

Thanks! I just made a test with a 25 second anime video sample.

1-Pass Quantizer 3 new built
3.340 KB

1-Pass Quantizer 3 old built
3.254 KB

1-Pass Qualitybased 95% old built
2.658 KB

Its an old vhs-capture. It seems quality-based encoding is different from quantizer-based encoding. All encoded files looks very equal. I hope that 1-Pass qualitybased will be included in a newer built.

[kxy]

Xvid status window is very nice! It sure beat out the debugview method.

How can we can save the final output either to an ascii or graphic format?

[Hylas]

Can someone confirm that the interlaced mode is working correctly? I get completely screwed output, when I activate that option (colorful macro blocks, etc. in both ffdshow and Xvid decode filters).

[winman]

I don't know if this is too early to ask but:

Could someone put together a "XviD 1.0 Beta FAQ" thread?

It would make it easier o find info on "zone", adaptive quantization, b-frames, trellis, cartoon mode ..etc. I can see this thread is going to be very long.

[jkwarras]

Originally posted by amango
I used the 1Pass-Quality mode in XVID all the time for my encodings (size doesn't matter). How can I do this with this new build?

That's what i will like to know man :D

[Ac3Dc3]

thank you to all the developers for the great new Xvid release !

can some1 put together a comprehensive guide, like koepi's excellent guide for the 24062003-1 release, aswell as a new sticky, preferably asap ? - dont wanna press you guys too hard after such a lot work, but i think i speak for a lot of newbie to intermediate xvid encoders who need a little help with the new gui.

Ac3Dc3.:devil: