I have an very strange Question for you!

[dihelson]

Hello, Friends,

I'm a newbie in DVD burning, but have some good background in Xvid and DivX making (having made about 230 films).

My question is the following:

I've put my hands on some DVDs just fine and rare.
I need to backup these DVDs exactly like they are, no compression.
There's many softs which do this, like CLONE DVD for instance.

BUT...
BUT...

I don't have a DVD burner yet. Probably will buy at the end of the year.
In the mean time, I'd like to maintain these DVDs on my HD and WATCH them EXACTLY as if it were the real dvd, choosing the languages, watching main menu, choosing subtitles, etc.
But, when I finally buy my DVD burner, I'd like to burn them on DVD-R
Since I don't know about the characteristics of the many softwares out there, I ask to you, what's the best solution for my case.???
Softs which make ISO files seems not to permit watching the movies on HD, so what to do ??

01 - I need a perfect DVD Backup.
02 - I need to watch them exactly on the meantime on my HD with subtitles, menus, etc.

What should I do ?
What software do this best ?

thanks in advance.

Dihelson Mendonca

[dihelson]

Hello, Again,

After posting the message above, I tested DVD shrink and (ripped??)
A DVD to my HD, and voila!, I can watch my movie on the HD, with menus, subtitles, etc, and the soft promises that I can Burn my DVD with the folder's content. (when I had a DVD recorder)

I tested DVD decrypter and it rips also, but when I try to play the ripped material on my player (zoomplayer IFO files) it doesn't play anything...I don't know why. Do you know? the IFO files generated by DVD decrypter are different ?

Then , more questions:
I have a friend which says he makes PERFECT copies of DVDs using ISO files made with DVDdecrypter.
I have seen many advertising on internet of softwares which CLONES DVDs and says it makes "perfect" copies of them.

But... DVD shrink does not make PERFECT copies of DVDs also ??
is it ripping less perfect than DVD decrypter for instance or other softs which uses ISO files instead?

Question 2: The only way to make a perfect quality copy is using ISO mode, or copies with DVD shrink doesn't affect the image quality if the compression is set to NONE?

Well, DVD shrink worked, but it really makes perfect copies, or the image is somewhat undersized in relation to softs which makes ISO files ??

I tested CLONE DVD, but for the dvds in question, all tabs looks gray...agghh :(

Thanks,
Dihelson

[Kedirekin]

If you just want to keep the DVD on your hard drive, you could rip them to ISO with DVDDecrypter, then mount and watch them with daemon tools. Daemon tools mounts an ISO and makes it look like another DVD-ROM drive to you operating system. It's pretty much ideal for this use.

If you don't want to keep them on your hard drive, but you want to keep them unaltered, you'd need to split the file some how. I believe WinRAR can segment a file. For example, you could rip to ISO with DVDDecrypter, segment the ISO to 650 MB chunks using WinRAR, and burn the chunks to CDRs. When you want to watch it, copy the chunks back to your hard drive, dechunk them with WinRAR, then mount the reconstituted ISO with daemon tools to watch it. Be aware that chunking, burning, copying, dechunking is time consuming - and can use up to 14 CDRs per DVD.

As for DVDShrink, I believe it will make a perfect copy of the VIDEO_TS directory if you set it to no compression. However, this isn't a perfect copy of the whole disk; only the VIDEO_TS directory. If you use DVDDecrypter to make an ISO, you'll have a perfect copy of the entire disk (minus CSS of course), including nuances such as the DVD volume label.

[echooff]

DvdShrink and Dvd decrypter are removing the copy protection as they rip. It is easier to rip with Dvd decrypter into iso mode and burn to a new dvd using Dvd decrypter. This will only work if the dvd is 4.7 gig or less. Most Dvd's released today are much larger than that. In that case Dvdshrink can transcode it to the correct size for you. If you are not going to be burning these for a while, my advice is to rip it as a iso with Dvd decrypter. You can mount it with deamons tools as a virtual drive. Then when converting to dvd you change your mind about desired output you can revert to a original without re-ripping.

[dihelson]

Originally posted by Kedirekin
If you just want to keep the DVD on your hard drive, you could rip them to ISO with DVDDecrypter, then mount and watch them with daemon tools. Daemon tools mounts an ISO and makes it look like another DVD-ROM drive to you operating system. It's pretty much ideal for this use.



Hello, Kedirekin,
Thanks for the nice hint.
I didn't know about these so called "daemon tools".
I see now that although DVD shrink is very good and perhaps even could solve the problem, an ISO file is more accurate, and If I could watch it's content with daemon tools, it would be perfect!
As you said, certainly I will backup this ISO in many chunks of 700mb in order to put them on CDs. But, see, it's good, because if I think about the price of these CDs (I tested the size of DVDs and perhaps it takes about 8 to 10 CDs per DVD), as CD-R costing around 40 cents X 10 = 4 dolars. The original DVD imported with taxes would come to me for around 40 dolars, ten times more expensive, so I think it's a good idea. As I said, by the end of the year I should have my own DVD-R and I'll record definetelly.
Now, I'll try to find those "daemon tools" and learn how it works.

Thank you, and thank the other colleague which answered also.

Dihelson Mendonca

[Kedirekin]

Odd, I remember this link being much easier to find earlier. I actually had to dig for it this time.

http://www.daemon-tools.cc/portal/portal.php

[Sbofen]

Won't Nero's Imagedrive do the same thing (comes with Nero)?

Or is this being recommended because its free?

[Kedirekin]

I have no idea if daemon tools and imagedrive do the same thing. I'm not familiar with imagedrive.

I mention daemon tools because I know it works and it's used by many members here. I guess that does qualify as some sort of endorsement.

[diogo6]

first of all, all of us here at DOOM9 own the original disks to every single copy we make, right:sly: :sly: and none of us would never copy movies we don't own (we wouldn't mention it, anyways --hint, hint--).


now what you are asking for would be a dream come true to most of us, but with the current technology there's no such tool that'll duplicate a PERFECT copy of a dvd disc (assuming it goes over 4.37gigs, which most of them do).

If you really wanna keep everything on those discs onto ONE backup disc, you'll most likely have to compress the video, there's just no getting around it... I've been using dvdshrink lately, and it's worked for me (over 600 different movies backed up). Just go with that, it's free, quick and easy to work with, specially for newbies like yourself

oh, almost forgot this, if any of those discs are single layered (under 4.37), then forget all I've said and just make an iso image with dvddecrypter...

PS: depending on how many movies you wanna backup, it'd be better for you to just get a dvd burner now... you could get a sony dru500a for 119 bucks, just use pricegrabber.com to find it

[diogo6]

or if you're willing to wait 'til next year, just buy a dual layer burner...

[dihelson]

Originally posted by diogo6
or if you're willing to wait 'til next year, just buy a dual layer burner...

Hello, friends,
problem almost solved.

A few more questions for you...

I decided to use DVD decrypter making ISO files and DAEMON TOOLS (which is a little good software I didn't know yet) which makes me watch the contents of an ISO DVD on mounted virtual DVD drives.
I tried DVD shrink also, nice piece of software, will serve for the purposes of compression when necessary.

I've just seen that PHILIPS tested dual-layer dvd burners, and next year we'll have many of them. Prices are falling, and if the purpose were not immediate, could be worthy await for these state-of-the-art burners, which would permit us make a perfect DVD copy at last...

I still got a single question for you, my friends:
Since an DVD ISO file is really big...
What's the best way to divide in chunks of 700Mb? WinRAR or Winzip ? What would you use? is there a better method ?
Something which make EXE files, and don't need the original Winrar...
And I'm worried about making ISO files from big DVDs, for the fact I use FAT32, and need to use. Would the DVD decrypter divide these ISO files automatically ?

Thanks in advance,
Dihelson

[MedicineMan]

WinRar, for sure. It will do what you want (compress to a given size; put recovery information if you need it; create a executable to work without the original program if you wish) without any problems.

Things that i could never do reliably with WinZip (never tested the new versions).


As far as I know, an ISO file is just a big, undivided file. So, most of the times it won't fit in a FAT32 partition (DVDDecrypter will warn you about that). If you want to use an ISO file (and the benefits of having a full DVD backup in your hand that you can mount like a regular DVD with Daemon tools, and work with it like a regular DVD far outweight the space problems), you will in almost all cases (unless you find a DVD with less than 4Gb) need to use a Harddrive partition that can handle files bigger than 4Gb (mainly, but not only, NTFS).


Sincerely

MM

[Kedirekin]

I've ripped with DVDDecrypter to FAT32 a couple of times (when the DVD-ROM drive on my primary PC refused to rip). In those few instances, DVDDecrypter split the ISO. Instead of creating an ISO, it created (IIRC) I01, I02 files.

You might notice that DVDDecrypter creates a very small MDS file along the ISO files. You might also have noticed that Daemon Tools shows those MDS files when you open the 'mount image' dialog. In fact, on a FAT32 drive, this MDS file is the only one you will see; the inidividual chunks don't appear because they end in I0#, not ISO.

I believe this MDS file just holds pointers to the individual ISO chucks. Go ahead and mount the MDS file and it'll work just fine.

PS. I know you can move the huge single ISO from one place to another and still mount it with daemon tools. I do not know if you can move the chunks and the MDS file and have it work (in other words, I do not know if the pointers in the MDS file are relative or absolute). If you back up the chunked files and the MDS, you may need to restore them to the same location to be able to mount them. You should probably test this before you back one up. If it turns out you do need to restore to the same location, I leave it up to you how to remember where to restore to.

PPS. I assumed we were talking about backing up expensive import DVDs to avoid having to purchase them again if they're damaged. In retrospect, it is a little ambigous. I hope my assumption is correct.

[dihelson]

Originally posted by Kedirekin
I've ripped with DVDDecrypter to FAT32 a couple of times (when the DVD-ROM drive on my primary PC refused to rip). In those few instances, DVDDecrypter split the ISO. Instead of creating an ISO, it created (IIRC) I01, I02 files.

You might notice that DVDDecrypter creates a very small MDS file along the ISO files. You might also have noticed that Daemon Tools shows those MDS files when you open the 'mount image' dialog. In fact, on a FAT32 drive, this MDS file is the only one you will see; the inidividual chunks don't appear because they end in I0#, not ISO.

I believe this MDS file just holds pointers to the individual ISO chucks. Go ahead and mount the MDS file and it'll work just fine.

PS. I know you can move the huge single ISO from one place to another and still mount it with daemon tools. I do not know if you can move the chunks and the MDS file and have it work (in other words, I do not know if the pointers in the MDS file are relative or absolute). If you back up the chunked files and the MDS, you may need to restore them to the same location to be able to mount them. You should probably test this before you back one up. If it turns out you do need to restore to the same location, I leave it up to you how to remember where to restore to.

PPS. I assumed we were talking about backing up expensive import DVDs to avoid having to purchase them again if they're damaged. In retrospect, it is a little ambigous. I hope my assumption is correct.

Hello, Kedirekin,
Thanks for the answer. Indeed, I was worried about these chunks when we move them, and move them back. I don't know if they still will work on another place. I will test the possibilities first, in order to avoid disasters...

P.S - You've assumed right. I already purchased the DVDs. I only would like a backup of this expensive imported material. Some are very rare Jazz DVDs, and making a backup copy is always good safe.

All the best,
Dihelson Mendonca

[Richk50]

"P.S - You've assumed right. I already purchased the DVDs. I only would like a backup of this expensive imported material. Some are very rare Jazz DVDs, and making a backup copy is always good safe."

The audio will be perfect, you will get the original DVD audio tracks you select.

[diogo6]

I must insist that you consider buying a dvdburner... do some calculations, you'll see...

[Kedirekin]

Actually, if you're talking about cost calculations, in many cases it's cheaper to stick with CDR.

For example, the cheapest branded CDR I can get - with sales, rebates, and taxes - is about 12¢ per blank. So I can burn 12 CDRs (enough to back up most DVDs) for about $1.44. A DVD5 will fit on 7 CDRs for 84¢.

The cheapest branded DVDR I can get - again with sales, rebates and taxes - is about $1.40. To make a perfect copy of a DVD9 takes two DVDRs for a cost of $2.80 - almost twice the cost of CDRs. Backup of a DVD5 is a little closer in cost, but CDR is still cheaper.

Comparison with non-branded media is much more favorable to DVDR, but I personally think non-branded DVD is much less reliable* than non-branded CDR, so it's kind-of an apples and oranges thing.

And of course the comparison will vary in different parts of the world, but I'll bet there are few places where DVDR will beat out CDR on a cost per megabyte basis.

Now when you start factoring in the cost of your time and the cost of convenience (actually being able to play a disk instead of reconstituting it), the cost difference in favor of DVDR becomes immense - like $12 to back up to DVDR versus $70 to back up to CDR (I value my time highly).

* I don't mean reliable as in 'lasts for 50 years'. I mean reliable as in 'how many of these blanks will become coasters'. I believe you'll get very few coasters with randomly-selected non-branded CDR. I believe you do get lots of coasters with randomly-selected non-branded DVDR.