Subtitle issues and fps conversions

[resonator]

Hi!

It's well known that subtitles on NTSC discs have to be imported with a drop frame enabled video on the timeline. I can live with that. However, it's so damn odd that the only way I get subtitles that are in sync off the disc is via Vobsub-vsconvert on NTSC discs (where Subrip fails, subs show 1-2 sec late at around 60-70min into the movie) while the only method that works for PAL titles is Subrip and Vobsub fails (vobsub shows em too late).

Is there a rational explanation for this phenomenon?

Anyway, I'm planning on switching to Scenarist, at least for titles with re-used footage, like films with two different endings on it (Infernal Affairs) or Animatrix, stuff like that.

What kind of "problems" of that kind do you think can I expect when I switch over to Scenarist?

And the third question: Is there a way to comfortably convert a Maestro or Scenarist subtitle file from NTSC to PAL and vice versa? I'm thinking about a PAL-speedup from a 23.976 source up to 25 fps.

[SomeJoe]

Originally posted by resonator
Is there a rational explanation for this phenomenon?

Yes. The unfortunate reason is that most of the freeware/shareware subtitle tools I've seen (and some commercial ones too) do not understand or handle NTSC timecodes correctly.

Typically, what will happen is that the video asset is encoded with a drop-frame timecode, and the subtitle tool produces a file for import into the DVD authoring package (like .stl for Maestro) which contains illegal drop-frame timecodes or contains non-drop-frame timecodes.

The loss of sync that will occur when drop-frame timecodes are read as non-drop-frame or vice versa is about 3.5 seconds per hour of video.

The DVD authoring packages I've used (including Maestro and Scenarist) will import and maintain sync of subtitles perfectly when the subtitle description files contain timecodes that match the video asset.

Originally posted by resonator
What kind of "problems" of that kind do you think can I expect when I switch over to Scenarist?

You will likely experience the same issues. The problems are not with Maestro or Scenarist, they are with the subtitle preparation tools or preparation process.

Originally posted by resonator
Is there a way to comfortably convert a Maestro or Scenarist subtitle file from NTSC to PAL and vice versa? I'm thinking about a PAL-speedup from a 23.976 source up to 25 fps.

Convert: Yes. Comfortably: I doubt it.

You will have to convert all NTSC timecodes in the subtitle file to a frame number, and then convert the frame numbers to PAL timecodes. There will be a 4% difference between the two timecodes due to the speedup.

[resonator]

Thanks for the explanation. I always thought it might have been a bug in Maestro.

Anyway, I know how the procedure of changing would work, changing the framerate of a MDVD-file from 23.976 to 25 (and vice verca) with Subadjust for example, but in order to be able to do so I'd need a program that can convert a son or stl-file to MDVD (temporarily; instead of text it should use the filename of the picture), and such a program doesn't exist as far as I know.

Any ideas about how to convert (the timecodes within) a .son-file to something better usable like a .srt or .ssa?