NTSC to PAL dvd to dvd conversion

[zagz]

Ive got some ntsc dvds, I want to make them into pal dvds. I dont know how to do this, is there a quick east way to do it, or is it going to be a 13 hour re-encoding session in Tmpeg?

Cheers fellas

zagz@ntlworld.com

[TactX]

You will have to reencode because NTSC is ~29.9 fps, while PAL is 25 fps. Also the resolutions do not match. NTSC is 720x480 (for DVDs normally) and PAL is 720x576. So you have to

IVTC the source to get it down to 23.97 fps
then speed the result up to 25 fps
resize to PAL resolution
encode and author like you normally would

[adam]

Before you do this check your hardware first. Almost all tv's sold in PAL regions are in fact multiscan systems and can dispaly NTSC just fine. Even if your tv doesn't, most dvd players that support PAL also support NTSC->PAL conversion, because it is a very simple process wherby the signal is just modified to run at 50Hz.

NTSC material is fairly universal, though this is more attributed to the rest of the world's accommodation of it, rather than the merits of the standard itself.

[scharfis_brain]

Even if your tv doesn't, most dvd players that support PAL also support NTSC->PAL conversion, because it is a very simple process wherby the signal is just modified to run at 50Hz.
This is'nt a simple process!

It is simple, if you're dropping every 6th Field of the NTSC-Stream. But the Result will be unacceptable because of heavy motion-jitter.

More complex is the method of weighted blending of nearby fields. This gives much better motion.

The most complex method for 60 -> 50 conversion is motion compensated with motion vectors. This method calculates new Frames by analysing the motion.

NTSC material is fairly universal, though this is more attributed to the rest of the world's accommodation of it, rather than the merits of the standard itself.
Sorry, but since I'm not a native english man, I was not able to understand this sentence completely. Could you explain it a little bit?

[ppera2]

Before conversion you must determine kind of source: is it FILM (noninterlaced source) or it's NTSC interlaced video. In guides you can find about it.

If it's FILM, high quality conversion is possible, and isn't so complicated. Tactx described it briefly, I just can add that you need AVISynth for that (it's possible with other software, but slower), you need to speed up audio, what is in fact hardest part in all - there is many way for that.

In case of interlaced NTSC video: here is one thread with similar theme, there are some AVISynth scripts - try before buy :D
(I mean try them, and see which is best for you)

scharfis_brain:
"The most complex method for 60 -> 50 conversion is motion compensated with motion vectors. This method calculates new Frames by analysing the motion."
I agree. Can you mention some software which work so? I suppose that no freeware for now...

[scharfis_brain]

I only know about Motionperfect from Dynapel, which can do this.

But this software ins't truely usably, because of:
- it's no freeware
- it works only File-based and doesn't accept AVS as input (AVI to AVI)
- it works only with progressive streams ( eg. 30p in 25p out)
- it is EXTREMELY slow
- it produces heavy artifacts when to objects are moving in opposite directions (one in foreground the other in background)

A half year ago, I tried to use it (indirectly) as motion compensated deinterlacer, I'd posted this Idea here: http://ghost.doom9.de/viewtopic.php?t=6600 (it is in German)

The results were not bad, but this method is too complex for "daily use"

[zagz]

Thanks to everyone who replied. However, youve told me what to do but not how to do it, what I can gather though is that this is not a simple easy thing to do so Im gonna take the easy way out, get the dvd in pal format:D

Thanks again folks!

ZagZ

[adam]

Originally posted by scharfis_brain
This is'nt a simple process!

It is simple, if you're dropping every 6th Field of the NTSC-Stream. But the Result will be unacceptable because of heavy motion-jitter.

More complex is the method of weighted blending of nearby fields. This gives much better motion.

The most complex method for 60 -> 50 conversion is motion compensated with motion vectors. This method calculates new Frames by analysing the motion.
It was my understanding that is was a simple modification of the signal as opposed to a full blown conversion which is necessary when doing PAL->NTSC. BTW I am not talking about converting NTSC to PAL, I am talking about converting NTSC to PAL 60Hz, which as I understand it is something that all dvd players sold in PAL regions can do.

http://www.dvddemystified.com/dvdfaq.html#1.19
"...All DVD players sold in PAL countries play both kinds of discs. These multi-standard players partially convert NTSC to a 60-Hz PAL (4.43 NTSC) signal. The player uses the PAL 4.43-MHz color subcarrier encoding format but keeps the 525/60 NTSC scanning rate. Most modern PAL TVs can handle this "pseudo-PAL" signal. A few multi-standard PAL players output true 3.58 NTSC from NTSC discs, which requires an NTSC TV or a multi-standard TV. Some players have a switch to choose 60-Hz PAL or true NTSC output when playing NTSC discs. There are a few standards-converting PAL players that convert from a NTSC disc to standard PAL output. Proper standards conversion requires expensive hardware to handle scaling, temporal conversion, and object motion analysis. Because the quality of conversion in DVD players is poor, using 60-Hz PAL output with a compatible TV provides a better picture. (Sound is not affected by video conversion.)

...Bottom line: NTSC discs (with Dolby Digital audio) play on over 95% of DVD installations worldwide."

If the conversion from NTSC to PAL 60 Hz is in fact very complex, its a moot point if all the players can do it. My only point is that there is probably no need to convert these NTSC disks to PAL at all, simply stick them in the dvd player and go.

Originally posted by scharfis_brain
Sorry, but since I'm not a native english man, I was not able to understand this sentence completely. Could you explain it a little bit?
I was saying that NTSC is fairly universal, meaning that it will play in most places in the world. But I was noting that this is so because other regions have found ways to accommadate it, not because NTSC is somehow more compatible than PAL. Basically, the credit goes to the non-NTSC regions.

zagz, have you tried just playing the disk? The easy way is to just let the tv play it is as is, because it probably supports NTSC anyway and even if it doesn't your dvd player almost surely can convert the signal to PAL 60Hz.

[ppera2]

Originally posted by adam
It was my understanding that is was a simple modification of the signal as opposed to a full blown conversion which is necessary when doing PAL->NTSC. BTW I am not talking about converting NTSC to PAL, I am talking about converting NTSC to PAL 60Hz, which as I understand it is something that all dvd players sold in PAL regions can do.
If the conversion from NTSC to PAL 60 Hz is in fact very complex, its a moot point if all the players can do it. My only point is that there is probably no need to convert these NTSC disks to PAL at all, simply stick them in the dvd player and go.
zagz, have you tried just playing the disk? The easy way is to just let the tv play it is as is, because it probably supports NTSC anyway and even if it doesn't your dvd player almost surely can convert the signal to PAL 60Hz.

Actually there is nothing from conversion by playback at pseudo PAL.
DVD disk has nothing from chroma encoding system (PAL or NTSC). Player will simple encode according to it's settings. Btw. in some Southern American countries they use PAL-M or PAL-N, what is PAL at 60 Hz.

Beside DVD player, TV must be capable to work at 60 Hz, what is usual by newer ones.
However, if FILM is in case, I would perform conversion to get progressive instead telecined video, because of better quality. If it's anamorphic even bigger vertical size of PAL will not require increasing of vertical res. Just need to set flags correctly...

[TerraForce1]

Hi,

if you have an old TV, its likely to display the NTSC source, but without no colours. I have tried it with a Panasonic TV, who is now 10 years old. My widescreen JVC who is 2 years old doesnt have any problems displaying NTSC material.

[scharfis_brain]

If your old TV can display NTSC without colors, than it can surely handle PAL-60 (NTSC with PAL-Color-Carrier).