Measure DVD write quality! (Only with Lite-On Drives) [Archive]

SVCD4Me

12th April 2003, 01:55

EDIT: Found it doing a search for K's CD/DVD in Yahoo.

http://home.pchome.com.tw/cool/cdtools/kprobe.zip

Anyone know another place to DL it? The page doesn't work for me and I don't have the language pack to even see what's wrong.

Thanks

SVCD4Me

12th April 2003, 02:43

So...

Can anyone tell me what readings are good for a DVD? PI/PO Total, Average?

Thanks.

alexnoe

12th April 2003, 08:12

The picture which I have linked to shows a very good disc.

Here's a bad one: http://www-user.tu-chemnitz.de/~noe/CDF/KProbe_Scans/DVD_Brennquali/Princo/Princo_2x.gif

You can obtain kprobe here:
http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=67428&pagenumber=1

boden11

14th April 2003, 09:22

Taiyo Yuden DVD-R 2x using Sony DRU500a 2.0e in Win XP Home (NO SP1)

boden11

14th April 2003, 09:25

wtf?? i attached the pic...it looked like it upped...tried it on dvdrhelp.com too and i couldnt see the pic. is this just me and the pic IS there or am i doing something wrong?

alexnoe

14th April 2003, 09:38

I don't see the picture either

SVCD4Me

15th April 2003, 00:06

Here's the results from the 2 types I have. Both were written with Instant CD+DVD on Toshiba SD-R5002.

DVDPro (Princo) from Meritline. Glossy white top, light purple bottom, burned @ 1x (http://mywebpages.comcast.net/jamesburley3/Princo%201x.gif)

Ritek G03 from Meritline. Silver top, dark purple bottom, burned @ 2x. (http://mywebpages.comcast.net/jamesburley3/Ritek%20G03%202x.gif)

I burned a disc the other day using DVDDecrypter because I wanted to burn a G03 @ 1x and the results were horrible accoring to KProbe. I didn't save the results and I no longer have the disc.

SomeJoe

21st April 2003, 20:33

Pioneer DVRN-47BPD50F (http://pages.sbcglobal.net/wilsondr/PioneerDVRN47BPD50F-4x.gif): Thermal/Inkjet Printable, 4x media, recorded at 4x on a Primera Bravo Disc Duplicator (Pioneer DVR-105 drive internal to the Primera Bravo).

leisuredoc

25th April 2003, 05:14

@Alexnoe: I just bought a Liteon XJ-HD166S DVD-ROM in order to quantify some accelerated aging tests on various DVD-R media according to your earlier post on Nero DVD Speed (should be done with a DVD-ROM, not DVD burner).

Can you tell me what is the difference between this new K's analysis and Nero's DVD Speed? Of course, I could analyze aged media by both app's but would like to simplify this if I can.

Thanks!

leisuredoc:D

alexnoe

25th April 2003, 08:34

Nero DVD Speed only measures speed! If your disc is of loo low quality, the reader will reduce speed. That's all.

KProbe can measure how much the error correction has to work while reading the disc

ravenone_2000

25th April 2003, 15:12

Allright, this is all very interesting, but can someone indicate what a good set of numbers are vs. bad numbers for PI and PO ?

Looking at the pictures posted above, the RitekG03 looks good to me compared to the Princo. Am I looking at this right?

alexnoe

25th April 2003, 15:24

Yes, the Ritek G03 picture is pretty good.

It's hard to indicate distinct numbers which one can call good or bad. Just look at the pictures. :)

djadjet

25th April 2003, 19:49

Has anybody figured out (or finally got the author to answer), what exactly these measured PI/PO are, because they are definitely NOT PI Sum 8/PIF/POF.

Are they just parity error counts per 16 (or x) LBAs or is there any other relation???

leisuredoc

26th April 2003, 05:50

@alexnoe,

Thanks for the clarification. My LiteON XJ-HD166S is a DVD-ROM and when I run KProbe, it says it only supports LiteON DVD burners. So, alas, I'm back to NERO DVD Speed. But when my Pioneer burner bites the dust, I'll look for a LiteON burner.

EDIT #1: thanks, Alexnoe & djadjet, all I had to do was choose the "Write Strategy" tab with the recorded media in the LiteON DVD-ROM drive. Cool tool! Will be reporting back on some comparisons of same video on different DVD-R's. I'd like to put this to work...

EDIT #2: after a bit of trial and error, I found excellent repeatibility (almost identical scan of the same disk each and every time with K's Probe provided that you:
1). Allow computer to be on awhile before scanning. Don't just turn on the computer and run K's Probe!
2). Reboot before each use of K's Probe.
3). Of course, it's a good idea to clean the media using "CD Cleaning Cloths" before scanning. A little bugger of dust will give you an error spike.
4). Save image, both upper and lower, for future reference.
5). Print image from another graphics editing app, not K's Probe. Printing from K's Probe won't show the statistics. -Enjoy!

leisuredoc
:D

djadjet

26th April 2003, 05:59

@leisuredoc

You can measure PI/PO using KProbe with LiteOn DVD-ROM, but not tracking.

alexnoe

26th April 2003, 08:21

According to Karr, the PI/PO data is read as RAW data from the drive, but is not interpreted by KProbe.
The author assumes that PI is just PI over one ECC block, but for PO, I have no idea. Funny is that crap discs can show PO > 100 values :(

windtrader

26th April 2003, 18:02

Is there a similar tool for the Pioneer A05 drive?

I kept futzing with kProbe unitl it finally dawned on me that it only works on Liteon devices. duh.

Thanks,
don

macrosii

4th June 2003, 16:14

Out of interest I get different results with the Lite-on 166S compared to the 165H. The 165H generally reports higher error rates especially at the end of the disk. The 166S reports lower errors on the same disk. I tried 3 different 166S drives in the same machine with the same disk and the results were very consistent. It may be a dodgy 165H drive, I will see if I can find another 165H to test with.

Regards

Macrossii

abbadon

16th July 2003, 19:19

SVCD4ME:

I too use a Toshiba SD-R5002. How did you get KProbe to work? I tried for awhile before coming to the believe that it only worked on LiteOn drives? If I'm mistaken, please help me. What exactly did you do to get it to work?

leisuredoc

17th July 2003, 02:26

"...written with Instant CD+DVD on Toshiba SD-R5002..."

@abbadon,

I think SVCD4ME said he "wrote" his disks with his Toshiba, not that he used his Toshiba to run K's Probe. I don't know where you live, but I picked up my 166S for about US$35 at a computer fair nearby. That's a pretty cheap investment to have K's Probe at your fingertips plus if you only had a burner before, you now could read from the LITEOn and burn with your burner.

Cheers,
leisuredoc
:)

SVCD4Me

17th July 2003, 02:40

Thats right leisuredoc, I wrote with Toshiba SD-R5002 and used my LiteOn 163 for the K-probe. Sorry for the confusion abbadon.

djadjet

28th July 2003, 04:15

Kprobe 1.1.20

Karr has added the feature to select the # of consecutive ECC Blocks for PI/PO summation. PI Sum 8 measurement is finally possible. Though still no PIF/POF, but nevertheless excellent work.

abbadon

28th July 2003, 08:52

Thanks for the clarification.

Perhaps we should start a thread archiving these results? For example, I'd love to see SVCD4ME's Princo and Ritek results on his SD-R5002 drive, but the links are dead now. Any ideas?

darth rosenberg

28th July 2003, 11:41

Verbatim 2x:
PI sum 8 max = 51
PI sum 8 avg = 15

Datatrack 1x:
PI sum 8 max = 718
PI sum 8 avg = 453

SVCD4Me

28th July 2003, 18:18

If you would like to see the results for PI and PO on Ritek, DVDPro (Princo), and Matrix check out this post, 16th thread down (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=57369&perpage=20&pagenumber=1)

I don't have the new version so there is no PI Sum 8.

Metaluna

3rd August 2003, 18:06

Originally posted by macrosii
Out of interest I get different results with the Lite-on 166S compared to the 165H. The 165H generally reports higher error rates especially at the end of the disk. The 166S reports lower errors on the same disk. I tried 3 different 166S drives in the same machine with the same disk and the results were very consistent. It may be a dodgy 165H drive, I will see if I can find another 165H to test with.

I am observing the exact same phenomenon with my 165H and 166S drives. I think the 166S is just a better DVD reader.

TopHatTheater

27th October 2003, 23:32

Is this an acceptable result if the disc is being used in just computers and not standalone players?

Pic (http://tyyoung.home.mchsi.com/kprobe.gif)

~THT

leisuredoc

28th October 2003, 03:04

@THT,

My fussy Sony standalone (DVP-NS300) would play that all the way through.

My experience with K's Probe: if it stops with an "unrecoverable read error," it will stop at about the same location in the standalone. I have seen some pretty ugly K's Probe results and somehow they make it to the end in this Sony.

BTW - your result reminds me of a Princo or Optodisc. Am I close?

leisuredoc
:eek:

TopHatTheater

28th October 2003, 10:48

It's a memorex disc however here's an updated pic when I had kprobe scan it at 1x; much better IMO.

Pic (http://tyyoung.home.mchsi.com/kprobe2.gif)

~THT

leisuredoc

29th October 2003, 02:30

Sure, I'm much better walking at 1X than than running at 8X. Do you know why the doctor puts you on a treadmill for a heart stress test than having you sit in a chair?

leisuredoc
;)

vcdude

12th May 2004, 05:48

Anyone know of a Kprobe equivalent for Pioneer 106/7?

burnselk

12th June 2006, 05:36

Is this a decent burn?

LocalH

14th June 2006, 02:01

That was an over two year bump, you do realize?

burnselk

14th June 2006, 18:48

That was an over two year bump, you do realize?

Yes I did LocalH, but I wanted to stay in the right category....."CD burning and Measuring DVD write quality". Where should I have put it?

I was hoping someone would tell me if my burn was good or not.

This was my first time to post the results of a burn.....and only my 3rd burn!

Do you have an opinion on the results of my burn?

CWR03

14th June 2006, 19:26

Where should I have put it?
In the DVD Burning forum in its own post, not in a sticky. Your attachment will probably never get approved here. Instead, host it someplace like www.imageshack.us and provide a link to it here.

I know you don't like responses of this sort, but "The only way to tell if the burn is truly successful or not is if it plays properly all the way through" is a truthful one.

burnselk

14th June 2006, 23:51

I know you don't like responses of this sort, but "The only way to tell if the burn is truly successful or not is if it plays properly all the way through" is a truthful one.

Responses like this are totally acceptable CWR03, I appreciate you folks helping me learn about computers, hardware, and software.

You'll never hear me complain about anything in this forum.

What you said about the burn however was right on.....that's what it boils down to.....does it work.

LocalH

15th June 2006, 04:47

It is impossible to say with any certainty "this disc will play 100% perfectly on all DVD players". Compatibility is usually better with newer players, however I do have an older Sony DVD player that doesn't really like CD-Rs, and chokes a little bit on DVD+R when the bitrate spikes, but seems to work perfectly with DVD-R.

burnselk

15th June 2006, 15:45

I've noticed the same thing. The newer the player, the more likely it will play the different formats. I have an older Magnovox surround sound system that is very picky with video disks, but seems OK with most music CD's. Thanks for responding. I keep learning every day.....hopefully.