6 Waves -> 5.1ac3

[tedkunich]

Hi,

I have been searching for a while on this, but have not found anything yet that may solve my problem. I am trying to reconstruct a 5.1 DD track from my LD captures, but have not found a tool that can perform the multichannel WAV interleaving of the data so that I can compress with BeSweet/AC3Machine. I found a Unix tool (ch_wave) that is part of the Edinburgh speech tools library, but the only windows port of this app that I could find, does not like the large files sizes (several Gig). I have confirmed that this tool CAN interleave 6 separate mono WAV files in a sequence that BeSweet/AC3Machine can read and compress into a 5.1 surround track, but that was with 2 minute audio clip.

Am I barking up the wrong tree or is this capability found in some other (uncommon) tool? I have seen no mention of this capability in any of the forum discussions I have seen to date. Again, I do not already have a multichannel WAV, I only have 6 mono WAV's and need to interleave them to be compatible with BeSweet.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Ted

[DJ Bobo]

Use Sonic Foundry Soft Encode

[tedkunich]

Originally posted by DJ Bobo
Use Sonic Foundry Soft Encode


Thanks, but that is really not an option as that product is no longer available, either for sale or as a demo.


T

[The Producer]

Can you feed BeSweet 6 mono .wavs for conversion into a 5.1 AC3? If so, exactly how do you do it?

I've read somewhere in this forum that it could be done, I don't remember where . . .

Any help would be greatly appriciated!!

[DSPguru]

Originally posted by The Producer
Can you feed BeSweet 6 mono .wavs for conversion into a 5.1 AC3? If so, exactly how do you do it?

I've read somewhere in this forum that it could be done, I don't remember where . . .

Any help would be greatly appriciated!! create a textfile that lists all mono waves (a wave per channel) and save as list.mux.
then feed it to BeSweet as input. (-input list.mux)

[The Producer]

Thanks!

I tried it several times, and this is what happens:

(this is the list.mux)
L C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_FL.wav
C C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_C.wav
R C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_FR.wav
SL C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_Ls.wav
SR C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_Rs.wav
LFE C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_LFE.wav

(using this commandline)
"C:\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe" -core( -input "C:\BeSweet\list.mux" -output "C:\Projects\AC3\G2P1.AC3" -ac3enc( -b 384 )

Error 59: Failed to sync to payload's start position : "C:\BeSweet\list.mux"BeSw
eet v1.4 by DSPguru.
--------------------------
Using hip.dll v1.13 by Myers Carpenter <myers@users.sf.net>
Using lame_enc.dll v1.28 (4/6/2002), Engine 3.92 <http://www.mp3dev.org/>.

[00:00:00:000] +------- BeSweet -----
[00:00:00:000] | Input : C:\BeSweet\list.mux
[00:00:00:000] | Output: C:\Projects\AC3\G2P1.AC3
[00:00:00:000] | Floating-Point Process: Yes
[00:00:00:000] | Source Sample-Rate: 48.0KHz
[00:00:00:000] +-------- LAME -------
[00:00:00:000] | Bitrate method : CBR
[00:00:00:000] | MP3 bitrate : 128
[00:00:00:000] | Channels Mode : Joint Stereo
[00:00:00:000] | Error Protection: No
[00:00:00:000] +---------------------
Error 32: No input-data was found (wrong substream?)
Quiting...

Why does it do this? Is the setup of my list file wrong? Is the commandline wrong?
I tries loading the indivdual mono WAV files into BeSweet, and there were no problems.
And in the logfile, instead of using ac3enc, it was using LAME, even though I want AC3.
I'm running Win98SE, using BeSweet v1.4.
Please help!

[DSPguru]

the muxfile should only hold the path for the files. no other preficies are needed.

[Corby]

Originally posted by tedkunich
Thanks, but that is really not an option as that product is no longer available, either for sale or as a demo.


T

It's still there, it's just not standalone product anymore. The name is "5.1 Surround pack" now, and it's packaged as plugin for Sonic Foundry Vegas and ACID. Fits much better in the rest of the SF product line, then as standalone product.

[The Producer]

C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_FL.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_C.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_FR.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_Ls.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_Rs.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_LFE.wav

I removed the "L,C,R,SL,SR,LFE" and tried feeding it.
I still got error 59 "failed to sync to payload's start position".

[DSPguru]

are you using BeSweet v1.5b17 ?

[The Producer]

No, i'm using v1.4.

[The Producer]

Okay, I tried doing it using v.1.5b17, and it worked, but the resulting file is two times as long as the orginial, and upon listening to the file, is so long because it sounds as if it's been streched out.

(logfile)
BeSweet v1.5b17 by DSPguru.
--------------------------
Using AC3enc.dll v0.21 by Fabrice Bellard (http://ffmpeg.org).

Logging start : 05/09/03 , 13:33:37.

C:\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe -core( -input C:\BeSweet\list.mux -output C:\BeSweet\test.ac3 -logfilea C:\BeSweet\BeSweet.log ) -ac3enc( -b 384 )

[00:00:00:000] +------- BeSweet -----
[00:00:00:000] | Input : C:\BeSweet\list.mux
[00:00:00:000] | Output: C:\BeSweet\test.ac3
[00:00:00:000] | Floating-Point Process: No
[00:00:00:000] | Source Sample-Rate: 44.1KHz
[00:00:00:000] +------- AC3ENC ------
[00:00:00:000] | Bitrate method : CBR
[00:00:00:000] | AC3 bitrate : 384
[00:00:00:000] | Channels Mode : 5.1
[00:00:00:000] | Error Protection: Yes
[00:00:00:000] +---------------------
[00:06:10:447] Conversion Completed !
[00:06:10:447] Actual Avg. Bitrate : 383kbps
[00:00:39:000] <-- Transcoding Duration
Logging ends : 05/09/03 , 13:34:16.

Do you have any suggestions?

Oh, and what order to the files have to be in, in the muxfile, in order to get them on the right channel? (like L,C,R, etc.)

Thanks! Even since I found out BeSweet could encode 5.1 AC3, it has become a very valuable tool!

[oddball]

I know I use a .mux list of the wav files. But what order should they be in and what is the exact commandline? I cannot seem to get it to work. I do not understand all this -core(...) baloney. Just give me a commandline as if you was going to do it and I will edit it to my own path and filenames.

Thanks.

PS. They are 48khz PCM wav files transcoded via azidts.

filenames are
2msC.wav
2msFL.wav
2msFR.wav
2msSL.wav
2msSR.wav
2msLFE.wav

[Wilbert]

Read this thread:

C:\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe -core( -input C:\BeSweet\list.mux -output C:\BeSweet\test.ac3 -logfilea C:\BeSweet\BeSweet.log ) -ac3enc( -b 384 )

(this is the list.mux)
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_FL.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_C.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_FR.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_Ls.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_Rs.wav
C:\Projects\5.1 WAV\5 mono WAVs\G2P1 Surround_LFE.wav

[oddball]

[00:00:00:000] +------- BeSweet -----
[00:00:00:000] | Input : C:\BeSweet\list.mux
[00:00:00:000] | Output: C:\BeSweet\test.ac3
[00:00:00:000] | Floating-Point Process: No
Error 74: Bad configuration for AC33enc. Couldn't initialize.
Quiting...
[00:00:00:000] Conversion Completed !

Logging ends : 05/13/03 , 14:20:58.

:(

[Stratyon]

Is it possible to create a 5.1 AC3 file from wav files?
If you have separate wav files for front and back speakers or one mono wav for each...
In other words is it possible to make it from scratch (not ripped from a movie)

~Strat

[piano boy]

Yes, I have gone from six original mono wav files to one ac3 file.

Stratyon, I made some music miniDVDs using BeSweet. I produce a mix of six mono files using either:
---Vspace for an ambisonic treatment, then ambidecode with a 5.1 rig;
---build a LR sound stage, reverberate it, putting result in back

I then produced a multichannel wave file with interlx, used BeSweet to build the AC3, then ifoedit to tack on some video and put it in DVD directory structure, then burnt to cd as a miniDVD, then off to the Apex player and Midiland decoder/speaker rig.

One thing I noticed: When I used batch mode, BeSweet GUI did a different channel to speaker assignment. I did the batch process when I lumped three movements into one piece. Also, I had a clicking at the start of each piece whether I rendered them one by one, or as a batch producing one AC3 file.

I've been rendering and mixing some Bach midi files to cut my teeth on the process. When I've got the mechanics down, I have some original material to work over.

I think this is a great way to distribute original surround music, either to friends with home theathers, or just over the net if people have Valex's AC3 decoder installed in Winamp.

[jslombar]

I tried to create a dd5.1 ac3 file from 6 mono wav files using BeSweet
v1.5b17 and my ac3 file came out as 5.0 not 5.1

My list.mux file is
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++=
F:\Rip1\track3_FL.wav
F:\Rip1\track3_C.wav
F:\Rip1\track3_FR.wav
F:\Rip1\track3_Ls.wav
F:\Rip1\track3_Rs.wav
F:\Rip1\track3_LFE.wav
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

My commandline for BeSweet is
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
F:\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe -core( -input F:\Rip1\list.mux -output F:\BeSweet\test.ac3 -logfilea F:\BeSweet\BeSweet.log ) -ac3enc( -b 448 )
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

My Logfie is
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
BeSweet v1.5b18 by DSPguru.
--------------------------
Using AC3enc.dll v0.21 by Fabrice Bellard (http://ffmpeg.org).

Logging start : 05/31/03 , 14:22:39.

F:\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe -core( -input F:\Rip1\list.mux -output F:\BeSweet\test.ac3 -logfilea F:\BeSweet\BeSweet.log ) -ac3enc( -b 448 )

[00:00:00:000] +------- BeSweet -----
[00:00:00:000] | Input : F:\Rip1\list.mux
[00:00:00:000] | Output: F:\BeSweet\test.ac3
[00:00:00:000] | Floating-Point Process: No
[00:00:00:000] | Source Sample-Rate: 48.0KHz
[00:00:00:000] +------- AC3ENC ------
[00:00:00:000] | Bitrate method : CBR
[00:00:00:000] | AC3 bitrate : 448
[00:00:00:000] | Channels Mode : 5.1
[00:00:00:000] | Error Protection: Yes
[00:00:00:000] +---------------------
[00:03:49:909] Conversion Completed !
[00:03:49:909] Actual Avg. Bitrate : 447kbps
[00:00:26:000] <-- Transcoding Duration

Logging ends : 05/31/03 , 14:23:05.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I loaded the test.ac3 file into DVDMaestro and under properties it said it was 5 channels and not 6.

Anybody have any clues? I'd appreciate your help

[jslombar]

Im sorry, I used BeSweet v1.5b18

[DSPguru]

decode your encoded ac3 to six mono waves and compare

[jslombar]

I'm not sure how to do that, could you post the commandline?
Thanks DSPguru

[jslombar]

DSPguru

I figured out how to split it. Here's my logfile

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
BeSweet v1.5b18 by DSPguru.
--------------------------
Using azid.dll v1.8 (b825) by Midas (midas@egon.gyaloglo.hu).

Logging start : 05/31/03 , 17:52:55.

F:\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe -core( -input F:\BeSweet\test.ac3 -output F:\Rip\track1.wav -6ch -logfilea F:\BeSweet\BeSweet.log ) -azid( -c normal )

[00:00:00:000] +------- BeSweet -----
[00:00:00:000] | Input : F:\BeSweet\test.ac3
[00:00:00:000] | Output: FL, FR, SL, SR, C, LFE
[00:00:00:000] | Floating-Point Process: No
[00:00:00:000] +-------- AZID -------
[00:00:00:000] | Input Channels Mode: 3/2, Bitrate: 448kbps
[00:00:00:000] | Total Gain: 0.000dB, Compression: Normal
[00:00:00:000] | LFE levels: To LR -INF, To LFE 0.0dB
[00:00:00:000] | Center mix level: BSI
[00:00:00:000] | Surround mix level: BSI
[00:00:00:000] | Dialog normalization: No
[00:00:00:000] | Rear channels filtering: No
[00:00:00:000] | Source Sample-Rate: 48.0KHz
[00:00:00:000] +---------------------
[00:03:49:888] Conversion Completed !
[00:00:16:000] <-- Transcoding Duration

Logging ends : 05/31/03 , 17:53:11.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I used CoolEdit to make my LFE wav. I took the left and right waves, combined them together converted it from stereo to mono, and filtered all the high frequency stuff out.

When I decoded my created ac3 file to 6 waves, I loaded the LFE wav
back into CoolEdit, and I get a flat line.(No Sound)

Any suggestions?

[amorfeusz]

I get the same results ( No LFE), even tried an older ac3enc.dll (ver .1) and BeSweet1.5b17

Also added the -6ch option, no luck :(

"- support for '-6ch' switch on ac3enc (good for ".mux" inputs)" from changes.txt

Soft Encode even identifies the AC3 as 3/2 only, no LFE

I then transcoded a 3/2+LFE AC3 into with besweet and the LFE was preserved - so at least I now know it's not an encoding bug.

The problem must lie in the input via the mux file

I'm converting a quadrophonic DTS-CD into AC3, and seems I have to use the 6 wav option as the direct transcoding via Azidts or through a single 6 channel wav file results in the Right channel being moved to the originally blank center channel :(

I guess I'll just use the slower Soft Encode until this issue gets resolved - but it'd sure be sweet to use besweet :P

List.mux :

01_FL.wav
01_C.wav
01_FR.wav
01_Ls.wav
01_Rs.wav
01_LFE.wav

Log :

BeSweet v1.5b18 by DSPguru.
--------------------------
Using AC3enc.dll v0.21 by Fabrice Bellard (http://ffmpeg.org).
Manual Dynamic-Compression algorithm by LigH (author of WaveBooster).

Logging start : 06/01/03 , 00:05:32.

W:\DTS\BeSweet.exe -core( -input W:\DTS\list.mux -output W:\DTS\2.ac3 -logfile W:\DTS\BeSweet.log ) -ac3enc( -b 384 )

[00:00:00:000] +------- BeSweet -----
[00:00:00:000] | Input : W:\DTS\list.mux
[00:00:00:000] | Output: W:\DTS\2.ac3
[00:00:00:000] | Floating-Point Process: No
[00:00:00:000] | Source Sample-Rate: 48.0KHz
[00:00:00:000] +------- AC3ENC ------
[00:00:00:000] | Bitrate method : CBR
[00:00:00:000] | AC3 bitrate : 384
[00:00:00:000] | Channels Mode : 5.1
[00:00:00:000] | Error Protection: Yes
[00:00:00:000] +---------------------
[00:03:28:619] Conversion Completed !
[00:03:28:619] Actual Avg. Bitrate : 383kbps
[00:00:39:000] <-- Transcoding Duration

Logging ends : 06/01/03 , 00:06:11.

[pan-man]

Thank you guys! this thread helped me alot!
:D

[DSPguru]

Originally posted by pan-man
Thank you guys! this thread helped me alot!
:D great to see a new member learning from old threads :D !!!

[pan-man]

Originally posted by DSPguru
great to see a new member learning from old threads :D !!!

yup yup :)
Always encoded with Soft Encode but it started to crash lately so i tried BeSweet and its works perfectly.
Thx DSPguru and keep up the good work
:p

[Musitektus]

@DSPguru


Any help on this problem these people (including myself) seem to be having, DSPguru?

When using this command-line to create an 5.1 AC3 file the LFE channel is always left out:

BeSweet.exe -core( -input C:\list.mux -output C:\audio.ac3 -logfilea C:\BeSweet\BeSweet.log ) -ac3enc( -b 448 -6ch)

I've checked this many times by decoding the encoded AC3 to six mono waves and comparing.

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=55610&highlight=5.0+5.1

I found this thread talking about a workaround for this problem (by listing the LFE channel twice in the .mux file hmmm?), but DSPguru has not yet commented about this thread.

[DSPguru]

the workaround is good, but isn't needed since latest v1.5b19.

[KpeX]

Originally posted by DSPguru
the workaround is good, but isn't needed since latest v1.5b19.
:D Tested and confirmed, workaround is no longer needed. Thanks very much for the great program and continual updates, DSPguru.

[kenma]

Originally posted by Corby
It's still there, it's just not standalone product anymore. The name is "5.1 Surround pack" now, and it's packaged as plugin for Sonic Foundry Vegas and ACID. Fits much better in the rest of the SF product line, then as standalone product.

how do you feed the plugin (5.1 surround pack) with six waves to encode ?

[Eye of Horus]

Originally posted by kenma
how do you feed the plugin (5.1 surround pack) with six waves to encode ?

LOL !!! Good question......
I am glad I have the standalone :-)

I don't know what these companies are doing....
They are all bundling and the end result is that you pay more and receive less.....

Examples : Softencode, Nero (version 6 has all, but sucks on burning compared to last version 5), DVD Architect... no longer available as standalone, but only in a package.... and of course there are more...

For the people only interested in audio encoding without the need for a full DVD authoring package it's a shame !!


regards,

EoH

[kenma]

Originally posted by Eye of Horus
LOL !!! Good question......
I am glad I have the standalone :-)


which one do you have ?

[Eye of Horus]

Originally posted by kenma
which one do you have ?

- Sonic Foundry Soft Encode
- Nuendo Dolby Digital Plugin
- Daikin AC3 encoder (part of Scenarist 2.7)
- AC3enc.dll (freeware)


regards,

EoH

[kenma]

it seemed that you meant hardware by stand-alone...

[Eye of Horus]

Originally posted by kenma
it seemed that you meant hardware by stand-alone...

Nope......

Sonic foundry Soft Encode was available as a standalone application, but is no longer.
They sell it now only as plugin for their other products.

kind regards,

EoH

[YZ_-Freak]

If any one here can guide me on how to get 6 mono wavs to 5.1 AC3 to work correctly I would be most grateful. I can not get the ouput to AC3 to be correct.
here is thread with my log file:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?threadid=65766

the AC3 file either does not turn out to be 5.1, or if I try to make a 5.1 wav file, it is twice as long as the original and the playback is about 4x too fast.

[Eye of Horus]

Originally posted by YZ_-Freak
If any one here can guide me on how to get 6 mono wavs to 5.1 AC3 to work correctly I would be most grateful. I can not get the ouput to AC3 to be correct.
here is thread with my log file:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?threadid=65766

the AC3 file either does not turn out to be 5.1, or if I try to make a 5.1 wav file, it is twice as long as the original and the playback is about 4x too fast.

I answered you in your original thread....
Here it is again : first get rid of the freeware ac3 encoder and get Sonic's !! If you gon on using the freeware one, you're on a dead end.

8th message in this thread has the asnwer :
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=58073


regards,

EoH