MenuEdit - Tool to edit DVD Menus

[Fmazzanti]

Well many things can happen that I don't know... :rolleyes:
What I can tell for sure is that the DVDs I've done so far work with the MenuEdit prog, and that they do play fine on my TV and on my two standalones (a pretty expensive Marantz and a pretty cheap CyberHome)... Still I would like to see a fix for this bug since, as I can see, I may encounter problems later with other DVDs...

[mpucoder]

Players have to be tested for compliance, so it is very unlikely there are differences. The spec states that the subpictures are not resized along with the video, but instead their maximum area (720x480 NTSC or 720x576 PAL) represents the full display. This isn't something menu editting needs to worry about, but since it is in the specs differences between players should not be an issue (other than really old players, and software players that were not submitted for compliance, eg Xine, Ogle)

[Fmazzanti]

Well yes... so what? I'd like to decide if I've been simply lucky or my DVDs won't play correctly on other systems. Would you say then that if it plays correctly on my standalone and my 16:9 TV that can be put in 4:3 mode, then it's going to play ok elsewhere?

[mpucoder]

I just wanted to stop any speculation about players and displays, they are not the problem.

The bug VidHack reported will cause problems with either pan/scan or automatic letterboxed display of 16:9 menus. The problem will appear as misplaced highlighting of buttons when viewing a 16:9 menu in a 4:3 mode. The normal buttons will look correct as they are drawn by the subpicture, but the rectangle changed by MenuEdit affects the highlighting. This rectangle also determines when the cursor (for software players) is over the button.

The only way to tell for sure is with a hex editor or VobEdit, players can sense widescreen capable displays and choose a display mode for you. It's very unlikely that the upper left corner of a p/s or lb button should be the same as its widescreen counterpart.

btw, so far we are talking about menus with 2 choices, and therefore 2 sets of 18 buttons. It is also possible to allow all 3 display modes, in which case there are 3 sets of 12 buttons. For these rare menus buttons 1, 13, and 25 are the first of each set.

[Cayne]

Then how can it be, that the messed up buttons which I get on my DVD-Player are gone in WinDVD & PowerDVD?
I think at least these Software-Players do something different, in fact resizing the subpicture for 16:9 to match.

All 16:9 menus done with Maestro should give the problem when editing with menuedit, perhaps backups from industry-dvds are different.

[mpucoder]

Unless you can force the display to be formatted for a 4:3 display, you will be using the widescreen menu.
On my computer with TV-Out WinDVD gives me choices for the display mode (standard, widescreen, computer monitor), but on another computer with no TV-out there are no choices. I'm assuming on that computer "monitor" is the choice.

[Dimad]

Originally posted by VidHack
Notice how button 19 and 21 x/y values are really button 1 and 3 values, this is the error, they should be the same as the original.

Yes, that is THE reason. In all menus I've seen so far coordinates of bounding boxes (button position) were same in all groups. So I used coordinates from the first group in all other groups as well. Well, wrong assumption. This was done to simplify deletion of the button for people who don't know (and do not care) about multiple display modes. And it worked, with a bug though :)

I still think that approach is right - if button is deleted it should be deleted from all groups (correctly deleted of course). For those who would like to have full control over the buttons in different groups it will be possible to edit each group separately (implemented in new release).

Here are few questions I would like to find answers to (I guess it is for mpucoder):
1) what is the correspondence between numerical value of the group type and name of the display mode? It's not on your site.
2) A big one: is there a command to make another button active, automatically? This will eliminate any problems with deletion of the default button. As I can see there is a RSM command, and I can specify highlight button as an argument. Do you know, by any chance, what would be a result of replacing command of deleted button with RSM (highlighted button is one of the buttons left in the menu) and setting an autoAction for this button? Unfortunately I will not be able to test this for couple of weeks, as I don't have any DVD dumped to my laptop. :(
3) What happens if NOP is set as a button's command? It just does not go anywhere when button is selected?

VidHack, mcentee:
I'm sending you a link to the beta version of new release. Could you please check if problems you reported are gone. Please reply to menuedit@dimad.net

[mpucoder]

I never did determine the values for the button group type, and it's one of those little details that gets forgotten about until I get asked. The value may even be a mask (that is a button group may be valid for more than one display mode), I just didn't find and check enough examples. Maybe we can determine this here (or dig through the Ogle code).

I'm not quite sure what the 2nd question refers to. The PCI has a value for "force select" and "force action", which happens after btn_sl_e_ptm. Prior to that one button is highlighted according to the value in SPRM 8, which cannot be determined by looking at the PCI. Also there are a number of commands which initiate menus and set SPRM 8 at the same time (the hl_bn field of jump/link commands). So the "default" button can be set by the calling PGC.

Be careful with RSM, these commands are just like their counterparts in real computers. A menu may have been entered via jump, so RSM would resume to the caller of a higher menu (not a big problem). In case you're wondering, pressing the "menu" button acts like an interrupt, RSM returns to the point of interruption. CallSS is the other way of entering a menu and being able to resume. There is no stack. Using RSM before any CallSS or menu button press causes most players to stop.

A NOP would render a button inoperative, and the menu would remain displayed.

[VidHack]

I am on it.....Check your email......

[Dimad]

Vidhack, mpucoder: thanks to both of you.

What I'm trying to find out is a best way to treat deleted buttons. Simplest way to do it is to set NOP. It is fine unless deleted button is a "default" one. In this case nothing will be highlighted when menu pops-up. I was thinking may be it is possible to set btn_sl_e_ptm to 0, autoAction for this button to 1, and command that will select some non deleted button in this menu.

If I understood you right, there is another way: set btn_sl_e_ptm to 0 and "force select" to the index of undeleted button.
Although this is not a universal solution :(. Say, undeleted button is highlighted. Since links are corrected, one can't select deleted button with navigation buttons, BUT button may also be selected numerically! In this case no button will be highlighted in the menu. And we return to exactly the same situation we are trying to eliminate. So some other command (not NOP) is preferred.

When vob-file is edited the only things known for sure are VOB-ID, CELL-ID and button indexes. For anything else it's necessary either assume something (like use file name to determine title set) or ask user. Would like to avoid this. Since I don't know much about commands, I can't figure out a command which will jump to needed button in needed VOB-ID/CELL-ID (remember we don't have a menu id).

[mpucoder]

Rather than play with menu-global fields, which can screw up a menu that uses it itself, why not auto-action? Auto-action will cause the command to execute if the button is selected. The command should jump to the same menu, but with a different button highlighted. btn_sl_e_ptm is not used for auto-action, but for forced select and forced action (besides, 0 turns it off)

[Dimad]

Yes, that is what I'm about. Can you help with such command?
What is the smallest value for btn_sl_e_ptm so that it works?

[mpucoder]

I was just digging through the manual (I should put more of it online)
There are three commands that should work, best bet is LinkTopCell, which means to restart the current cell. The others are LinkTopPG (restart current program) and LinkTopPGC (restart current PGC)
In hex:
20 01 00 00 00 00 xx 01 - LinkTopCell
20 01 00 00 00 00 xx 05 - LinkTopPG
20 01 00 00 00 00 xx 09 - LinkTopPGC

The xx is the highlighted button number * 4. IE button 1 = 4, button 2 = 8, etc.

As I said, some menus use btn_sl_e_ptm, best to avoid playing with it, and not necessary for auto-action - but minimum is 1.

[Dimad]

Thanks a lot!!!

[AndyP]

Apologies for a stupid question,

How do you tell, looking at the ifo in ifoedit (or indeed any other way), if a given menu has a fullscreen and widescreen variant that would be susceptible to the above problems. I don't have any of the DVDs discussed but am interested to be able to tell if any of mine will exhibit the same problem.

Kind Regards,
Andy

[mpucoder]

You look in the ifo at the video attributes for the menu (location 0x100). There you can see the aspect ratio, if it's 4:3 (bits 3-2 = 0) then there is only one set of buttons. If 16:9 (bits 3-2 = 3) you then look at the Automatic Pan/Scan (bit 1) and Automatic Letterbox (bit 0) disable flags, if both are "0" you have 3 sets of buttons. If only one is "0" then you have 2 sets of buttons. And if both are "1" you have only one set of buttons.
http://mpucoder.kewlhair.com/DVD/ifo.html#vidatt

Here's a simple chart, looking at the lower nibble of 0x100, Bold is the preferred coding:
0, 1, 2, 3 - 4:3 only
4-b not allowed
c - 16:9 with Automatic Pan/Scan and Automatic Letterbox enabled (3 modes)
d - 16:9 with Automatic Pan/Scan (2 modes)
e - 16:9 with Automatic Letterbox (2 modes)
f - 16:9 only

[AndyP]

Many thanks for the reply. I have checked my DVDs and see that some of the menus are indeed 'multiple'.

You state above that WinDVD can give an option to use the pan-scan/letterboxed menus on a PC, however I cannot seem to make my copy (WinDVD 4.5 Platinum) do it. Do you happen to know how to force it or how to force any other PC based DVD players (or if any modifications to the IFO can force it) to use one of the additional menus and not the 16:9 widescreen one.

The reason I ask is that I have already backed up some DVDs using the current version of menuedit to alter some buttons and they have 'multiple' menus but I do not currently have a stand-alone DVD player to check with to see if there is actually a problem. So I am just wondering how to test if I need to redo the backups or if they are OK.

Thanks again,
Kind Regards,
Andy

[Black Hole]

Originally posted by mpucoder:
There are three commands that should work, best bet is LinkTopCell, which means to restart the current cell.
The others are LinkTopPG (restart current program) and LinkTopPGC (restart current PGC)If I understood you well, you said that when we use Jump/Link commands to enter a menu, the highlight button field is automatically assigned to SPRM 8 before the jump, in order to select the button. If we make this button auto action with a LinkTop* command and we restart the current menu, the SPRM 8 value would remain unchanged and the same button would be selected again and again in an endless loop ... or maybe I'm wrong and talking nonsenses?

There are 2 possible approaches in MenuEdit ... should a button be deleted like it is done now (despite the bug which I hope will be fixed soon) by hiding it in the upper left corner and relocating the AJBTN_POSI_* values of the surrounding buttons ... or should it simply be made inactive by replacing the command with NOP thus being visible and reachable? ...

Maybe that's a decision the program could offer to the user just in case he wants to delete the default button ... because MenuEdit users are usually more illiterate in IfoEdit inners to be able to change the command sequences themselves : I spent a whole hour last night reading mpucoder page to reconstruct "If GPRM14 = #value1 then Set GPRM14 = #value2" in binary form just to bypass a screen !!!! :D

Greetings from Spain

[mpucoder]

SPRM 8 is ALWAYS the highlighted button, SPRM's have fixed definitions. If you look down at the hex code you will see that LinkTop* commands allow you to specify a new highlight (selected) button. The logic is if a menu is entered with a deleted button selected, the auto-action command will restart the menu with a valid button selected instead.

[djadjet]

Dimad has released the version 1.2.0, that should include the button highlight fix & more. (http://menuedit.dimad.net/download.shtml).

@Dimad
Thanks for great work & effort.

[Black Hole]

I found out that replacing the command with NOP doesn't work in my standalone, it just sits there waiting forever if it's a still menu. I only get control back if we're in a loop menu, when the loop restarts. As it worked perfect in PowerDVD I thought a NOP was safe ... is this normal? Does that problem apply to your standalone sets?

[2COOL]

Originally posted by Black Hole
I found out that replacing the command with NOP doesn't work in my standalone, it just sits there waiting forever if it's a still menu. I only get control back if we're in a loop menu, when the loop restarts. As it worked perfect in PowerDVD I thought a NOP was safe ... is this normal? Does that problem apply to your standalone sets?

An NOP is a "no operation" command which means it does nothing. But for general use, a NOP should be avoided since there's a lot of standalone players out there that may also interpret a NOP command as a Stop command.

[Acerjen]

I have been trying to access http://menuedit.dimad.net/download.shtml
for a few days and it won't come up. Sometimes, it does nothing, and other times it takes me to www.lop.com. Not sure what's up. Could someone please attach the new 1.2.0 version to a message in this thread? I would appreciate it. Thanks. Later.


Acerjen

[Dimad]

It does.
Sometimes there are problems with my web hosting provider. If they will persist I'll look for another web hosting.

[mpucoder]

I've had no problems at any time, possibly there is a problem between the site and Acerjen.

[Acerjen]

Maybe its a DNS problem on my end, I don't know.
Perhaps someone can post the IP of Dimad's site and
I can try to connect directly. Either way, can someone
please attach the new version 1.2.0 to a reply in
this thread. I would appreciate it. Also, I would like
to thank Dimad for this program. VERY useful. Nice job.
Thanks. Later.


Acerjen

[VidHack]

I am putting a .zip file together for you. Need to chat about Version 1.2.0 Please check your email. As always, THANKS for your time and hard work.

VidHack

[Dimad]

@VidHack

thanks for the bug :)

[VidHack]

New Version 1.2.1 avaialable at Dimad's website. Bugs stomped. Good Job Dimad! Fast response, will continue to troll for bugs, THANKS for your continuing efforts.

VidHack

[2COOL]

Originally posted by Dimad
@VidHack

thanks for the bug :)

Hey Dimad, what about me? :confused: I started the first posting.

[VidHack]

Hello to you,

This was a NEW Bug, it has been killed in Version 1.2.1. I am not posting bugs I find in the forum, it was a bug that crashed MenuEdit, but Dimad got his can of "RAID-BugKiller" and nailed it. Thanks. Talk to you soon.....

VidHack

[Dimad]

Originally posted by 2COOL
Hey Dimad, what about me? :confused: I started the first posting.

I do remember you :) :) Problem is, I'm more fluent with writing code rather then with writing messages, so I can't always force myself to post.

Here is the reason for this post:
MenuEdit 1.3.0 is out. With this version one can:
- see actual video content of the cell as the menu background;
- preview cells (with or without menus) in the vob files. In my tests it does not crush :), so I guess it means: "Ta-ta VobRator";
- easily edit button's command by selecting a command from the list and entering required arguments. Almost all commands allowed in the menu are supported!

And, same as the previous versions, this one is small, fast and (I'm crossing my fingers) is stable. :)

Enjoy,

[VidHack]

A Hello an Congrat's on Version 1.3.0. The Mpeg2 frame viewer is a godsend add-on. I have wished for that since you proposed the tool. Thank-You. Though, its NOT bug-free. On some menues, if you switch from VOB-ID to VOB-ID it seems as though the Viewer is showing the wrong VOB-ID (Usually the previous one) If you want a .ZIP file of some samples, let me know. Oh, thanks for the CreateHatchBrush(), been waiting for that also...
Also, this is sort of ironic, (due to that aspect ratio bug), Your Mpeg2 viewer seems to be locked to 1 aspect ratio, and 1 button group aspect ratio, so some of the rectangles are drawn off center from the subpicture background image, if your really bored some day, perhaps the main viewer window could scale from 4:3 to 16:9 depending on the attributes of the video frame size.

Some wish list items:

1. Could you possibly add a COPY/PASTE ability to the Command button editing dialog box? , if you try to do a CNTL-C to copy from one button, then a CNTRL-V to paste to another button, what a mess.

2. Maybe an option to make a .BAK (Backup) of the original menu before modifying it, for those lazy forgetful folks.

Thats about it! The app does as advertised, I simply want to thank you for the time and dedication you have put into MenuEdit, you have listened to us (Whine) in this forum and have added and fixed all the features we need. Your tool is very close to turning a corner into a basic Menu maker app, if you created a non-moving menu default template, then use you app to modify the buttons to link to VOBS....you get the idea, your Molehill is turning into a Mountain. I hope the dough is rolling in, you certainly deserve it...

VidHack

[baddbill]

Hi Dimad, thank you for a god sent app. The new versions work great! I'm now able to modify any menu I want and they all work fine on stand alone players.

Once again thanks for a wonderful app. If you ask me $6.50 is VERY cheap for the ability this program gives you.

Bill

[mikegun]

hi dimad,

thank you for this new version. this is just great !

regards,

mike

[DnGermany]

Thanks for the great program. The only thing i found wrong so far was with the wrong frame being shown as mentioned by vidhack, after switching cell ids. I finally got that paypal figured out. With all the features implemented as of yet, u may want to charge a little more for the program, i for one wouldn't mind paying a bit more.

[Acerjen]

Could someone please post the new version of menuedit for me,
as I am having trouble connecting to menuedit.dimad.net
Thanks in advance. Later


Acerjen

[titou92]

Congratulation for your tool. I survey new version - even if I did not post anything but i'm not fluent english - and it was very usefull for me.
I think there is a little problem with it but first I didn't yet test version 1.3 and I'm not sure it's a bug or an error from me :
when I delete a button from the principal menu, if your come back to this menu after navigating, the deleted buttons are available...? did you meet this ?

[mikegun]

hi,
is this a motion menue ?
sometimes there are different vob ids for the same menue ?!?

regards,

mike

[titou92]

what do you mean ? I don't understand "motion menu". The DVD is "sum of fears". I've deleted buttons for audio and language. When I arrive to the menu after video introduction, this buttons are well deleted.
I go to chapter's menu - wich I keeped - and come back to the main menu : buttons for audio and language are available ?
Is it more clear ?

[mikegun]

hi,
maybe the buttons you see after coming back from chapter menue are in a different vob id ?

mike

[titou92]

ok I will look at this evening and perhaps with the new version it will be easier :-)
Thank's
David

[Fmazzanti]

Have you checked there are no two versions of the same menu? I've found this situation a couple of times, where menues are repeated. You delete buttons in one and forget about the other, and afterwards, depending on how you navigate the dvd, you are led to the second version of the menu where you didn't delete buttons...
What I usually do is load the _0.VOB in dvd2avi and scan all along it to check for menues with unwanted buttons. I'll kill them all and that solves the problem...

[titou92]

No, I'm new in DVD's world :-)...one monnth experience only !
...and I didn't know that the same menu can be in different Vob Id.
After successfully made "simple" backup (only main movie), I'm ok with ripping, reencoding (CCE) but I want to pass next step : keep menu and only some extra.
I will try your method and looking at how this DVD is "structured"
Thank's for your help

[Dimad]

Originally posted by VidHack
On some menues, if you switch from VOB-ID to VOB-ID it seems as though the Viewer is showing the wrong VOB-ID (Usually the previous one) If you want a .ZIP file of some samples, let me know.

Yes, please, send it to me. Is it too big? Write me, and I'll send you a link to directory where you can ftp it.
Corrected: No need to send these. I've fixed this problem. I'll wait for some more time to see if enything else comes up and then will release 1.3.1.

Also, this is sort of ironic, (due to that aspect ratio bug), Your Mpeg2 viewer seems to be locked to 1 aspect ratio, and 1 button group aspect ratio, so some of the rectangles are drawn off center from the subpicture background image, if your really bored some day, perhaps the main viewer window could scale from 4:3 to 16:9 depending on the attributes of the video frame size.

I've not seen any defenition/rule on how to get 16:9 picture out of 4:3 one, so I'm not exactly sure what is the right way of doing it. Could you send me a cell from the vob where you observe this problem?

[Dimad]

Fmazzanti and mikegun are exactly right.

I know it may sound strange (I do it quite seldom myself :)), but: "Try to look into the MenuEdit FAQ next time!" :)

It is not big one, but I put there questions I get most often.

by Fmazzanti
What I usually do is load the _0.VOB in dvd2avi and scan all along it to check for menues with unwanted buttons. I'll kill them all and that solves the problem...

With 1.3.0 there is no need to use external application.

[titou92]

ok mister :-)
...there is so many forum about DVD and I've passed so long time before to find this forum where I've fast all learned about DVD backup that it's a reflex now for me to come here before searching anywhere.
Doom9 site and forums is really the best site I've found to learned !
...but promise now, I'll look at your faq before each time I'll have a question :-)
Thank's

[VidHack]

Please check your email, sent a .ZIP with the OffCenter (Viewer only) button bug, also I have found another bug that can crash your app in Vers. 1.3.0, its 3.3Mb compressed. What do you want me to do? Email? FTP? Let me know. Thanks as always.

VidHack

[mpucoder]

For 4:3 and 16:9 widescreen display no scaling is used.
For 16:9 auto-letterboxed:
Only the video gets resized, the subpicture remains the same. What this means is you squeeze it vertically to 75%, then add blank lines above and below. The subpicture will then overlay correctly without modification.
For NTSC resize to 720x360 and center (60 blank lines above and below)
For PAL resize to 720x432 and center (72 blank lines above and below)
A simple way to do this is to discard every fourth line, and cheap players do just that.

It gets nastier for 16:9 Pan/Scan - you must interpret the P/S offset, take that 540x480 (or 540 x 576) window and resize to 720x480 (720x576). Again, the subpicture remains the same (because there is no scaling ever on subpictures, they are mixed after the video scaler)

Depending on how much control you have over the MPEG decode, you might want to leave the video alone, and scale the subpicture accordingly. The problem here is 16:9 auto-letterboxed, it has black bars which can be overlaid by the subpicture, probably rare in a menu, but possible. Of course if you decode to an internal bitmap you can just use the bitblt to resize.

[VidHack]

Files Sent...

I guess I should clearify the bug, Its just that the rectangles drawn in the MPEG2 viewer are at 1 Button Group scale, in other words, only 1 set of buttons X/Y coordinates are used to show the physical location of the buttons, so if you are modifying buttons from another button group, then the actual button layout location on the screen are wrong as drawn in the viewer. This has nothing to do with the final edited buttons. They will be perfect on your TV. So, to clearify, the actual background picture doesn't need scaling, the rectangles need to be shifted to the proper X/Y location to line up to the background image, depending if the background is 4:3 or 16:9. I hope this clears up everything.

MPUcoder: Thanks for the info on scaling, I am beginning to think that there isn't anything you don't know! Thanks for all the technical info. Wow.

VidHack