Encoded dvd-r won't play in standalone ??

[aftertaste]

Ok here's what I got. Hopefully people will read this thread even though the subject is common. Ok i'll start by saying that dvd-r's play fine in both my standalones (Kenwood dv-5900m and tridex) when using IfoEdit to rip out the main movie if its already under 4.7GB. I have burnt about 30 backups and not one has given me a problem. Now after a successful re encode using dvd dycrypter to decode and demux, dvd2avi to make a d2v, virtual dub mod and huffyuv v2.1.1 - CCESP Patch v0.2.2)

Script:
#ASYNTHER Default (MPEG2Source)
loadplugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth\plugins\Mpeg2dec3.dll")
loadplugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth\plugins\Decomb.dll")
loadplugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth\plugins\avsmon25a.dll")
MPEG2Source("D:\BONE\VIDEO_TS\BONE.D2V")
telecide(post=false,chroma=true,guide=1,gthresh=50)
decimate(mode=0,cycle=5,quality=3)
monitorfilter()

then imported .avi into CCE v2.66. Encoded without a glitch. Used Pulldown but i didn't change any of the settings and maybe thats my problem. Only 3 boxes checked in the Pulldown options. Am i supposed to check these options which are not checked by default?

"framerate (fps): 23.976 25 @29.97"
"aspect ratio: 1:1 4:3 @16:9 2.21:1"

or any option not checked by default? Also i use IfoEdit to author new dvd. I followed the guide except i left out "Copy Colors from the PGC from the Subtitle Color Menu" I am leaving subtitles out of my backups so i figured i did not need this step. After that i used imgtool and dvd decrypter to burn the dvd (like i do with the movies that do not need re encoding) Now when i insert the movie in my standalones it starts reading the disc then stops. Doesn't get into any part of the movie just sits on the standalone logo screen ie. KENWOOD screen. Doesn't give me any errors like "not able to read disc". If i try to hit play it will say "reading" for a quick sec then that will go away and it will sit there. So i tried it in my computer (Pioneer DVD-116) using power dvd xp and disc mode. That worked with no problems (and looked GREAT). So i'm thinking it has to be either the Pulldown step or the authoring step. Hope i gave you fine people enough information to help me out.

[klona]

Did you use ifoupdate to re assemble authored vts and original menus ?

Because it seems you burned only the authored vts from ifoedit according the process you described.

[aftertaste]

no i sure didn't. And thx for the reply cause i tryed checking the extra boxes in pulldown and it still didn't work. Now just so u know I encoded only the main movie no menus. Do i still have to reasemble the vts. And if so i'm not sure how to do this. Do i press the "Get VST sectors" button in IfoEdit like i would with the movies that are originally under 4.7? Or is Ifoupdate a seperate program?

[klona]

Yes, you need to have a correct "get vts sector" but ifoedit do it already when authoring a new dvd.
You can do it again anyway. If OK, nothing will be save again. If not, ifoedit will ask to save, just say yes.

To add menu and so on, you are really closed to. Just need to use ifoupdate and follow Doom9 guides. Easy to do but also easy to choose the wrong file and/or copy the bad one..
Just remember it's ok to use author new dvd in ifoedit if there is only one PGC in the VTS. Else you need to re-author in maestro or scenarist (perhaps next version of ifoedit will do it, if there is a new version one day...)

But, for authoring question, please ask in the authoring forum, and before, read, as you already did.

Thx

[aftertaste]

So your saying that IfoEdit will automatically give me a correct "get vts sectors" when i author a new dvd. If that is the case then there must be something else i'm doing wrong. I have no menus to add just the main movie. Do i have to have the old .ifo open within IfoEdit when i am making the new one or something?

[aftertaste]

Well i figured out the problem only creating 3 coasters along the way :) WOOT and the only reason i messed up the 3rd one is i inserted the wrong 2 channel stereo track OOPS. Anyways it turns out you do need the "Copy Colors from the PGC from the Subtitle Color Menu" even if u are leaving out sub menus. Anyways i am so happy and this is the first time i have had a taste for DTS and OMG is all i have to say. I wish every movie had DTS. Anyways thank you for your help.

[rkorkie]

aftertaste, I'm having the EXACT same problem as you right now, and I have no idea how to fix this without burning coasters. Every DVD that I have so far copied contains ONLY the main movie and the dolby 5.1 sountrack. That's it, that's all, that's all I want, just like you. Every movie I have authored to date has not needed transcoding so it fits on a 4.37GB disc with everything else stripped out. So, I follow Doom's guide using Ifoedit to strip out what I don't want. I DO NOT create an image file (because for some reason I cannot get ImgTool 0.99.7 to work), then I burn the files using Nero, and all works well on my PC AND standalone DVD player. No problems, all is well.

Now, this is where my troubles occur. I am transcoding all the movies that are > 4.37GB, so I use Doom9's CCE guides.

So, I author using CCE 2.50, do a pulldown, then put the movie into Maestro and author. I didn't use IfoEdit to author because it seems to screw up the length of the movie and the chapter files. I'm not sure where I go wrong here, but a 2h30min+ movie registers as just under 2hrs, and the chapters get all out of alignment (anyone know what is wrong there???) So, after Maestro authors, everything looks good. I use the latest Nero, use DVD-Video mode, and put it on a DVD-RW just to make sure it works on my computer. All is good, it works. So, I author a DVD-R the same way, open up Power DVD on my PC, and it plays without a hitch. I take the DVD-R to my standalone, and it just sits there, does nothing. I even tried to take the authored IFO's into IFOEdit and go a "get VTS Sectors", but IFOEdit does absolutely nothing. I doesn't even give me a message. So, I figure something must be up there.

So, here I am, wondering where I keep going wrong. I DO NOT use IFOUpdate, cause it's my understanding that you ONLY use this if you are trying to re-create the same menu structure, etc. as on the original DVD. I do not want menus, just like you.

I have no idea how you fixed your problem with IFOEdit using "Copy Colors from the PGC from the Subtitle Color Menu" even if you aren't using subs. Makes no sense to me, but it doesn't matter to me cause I'm using Maestro instead of IFOEdit (because as mentioned above, it screws up my reported movie length and chapters are all screwed up)
So, here I sit, reading forum after forum, post after post, and I can't seem to find anything that can help me figure things out. PLEASE HELP!!!!

Ryan

[Fredrick]

Depending on what make the stand-alone player is, I sometimes have to play around with the first play to get it to work. When authored with Maestro, the DVD's will play on most of my stand-alones but not my Pioneer 434. To get it to play on my Pioneer also I have to edit the first play in the VIDEO_TS.IFO file. I delete all the statements except the last one which I make either (JumpSS_VMGM) Jump to VGM PGC: 1 or (Jump_TT) Jump to Title 1 or 2) Most of the time the first one works. That one DVD player I have is very picky.

[rkorkie]

Well, I have a brand new Toshiba SD-K710. This thing is good, it will play DVD-RW and DVD+RW's, so I know it's not lacking in any features. Although, it does have some jittering/hang up problems on some DVD+R's.

Needless to say, I do recall some message that Maestro displayed about "No First Play found", or something like that. I just ignored it cause I figured the authoring software would actually take care of whatever should play first, no?

Well, anyways, I just tried to author the transcoded DVD (Minority Report) using IFOEdit. It seems to work fine, but then I check the VIDEO_TS.IFO file for this First Play PCG, and it seems to be empty. All it says is (Programs: 0) (Cells: 0). So, I authored these files in Nero anyways, and they played fine in my Toshiba player, no stalling, no problems. The problem, once again, is the movie length and chapters are completely off. Even when following Doom's guide, the movie is reported under 2 hours when it should be 145 mins and the chapters are nowhere near accurate. Any ideas with that???

I'm still stuck.

Ryan

[Fredrick]

What movie length does Maestro report when you import the file? Just did Minority Report with no problem.

[rkorkie]

Maestro HAS the correct movie length, at 145 mins, it's IFOEdit that I'm complaining about. I follow Doom's guide EXACTLY using IFOEdit, transcoding, saving cell times, and authoring, and the movie comes in around 119 mins. I have no idea why this happens, but every movie I have transcoded and authored with IFOEdit screws up the movie length, THUS the chapters are completely out of whack too.

Like I said, Maestro was fine but couldn't author me a correct DVD because it wouldn't play when put into my standalone, probably something to do with that "first play" item you mentioned.

Basically, just so you know, I'm having problems with BOTH authoring programs, and I'm trying to find a fix for BOTH of them, because I don't hear of anyone else having these problems. Thanx again!

Ryan

[Fredrick]

I only author with Maestro and play around with the first play and get sectors to get it to work correctly with that one player.

[rkorkie]

Thanx, I found the "first play" option in the connections screen. Funny, doom's guide mentions nothing about it, but it in fact is critical to getting it to work properly in a stand alone player without having to press play after you load it.

I am authoring the new one right now. I will let you know how first play works. As far as Get Sectors goes, that's only a feature in ifoedit, right? I didn't see it anywhere in Maestro. I did do a get VTS Sectors on my maestro authored IFO's earlier today, but it didn't do anything, nor did it even report anything. No message, no nothing.

I am astonished that no one has experienced incorrect movie length and screwed up chapters using IFOEdit on transcoded DVD's. I'm using 0.95 on XP, so I'm sure everything I use is up-to-date.

Ryan

[rkorkie]

ok, i tried the "first play" feature in Maestro, still no dice. How can this be so complicated?????

I know my standalone player is perfectly capable of playing the current media I have using the current software I am using to burn. The ONLY difference is that I can't seem to successfully play transcoded dvd's authored with Maestro regardless of that "first play" feature, and transcoded DVD's authored with IFOEdit play just fine, but the movie length and chapters are COMPLETELY out of whack.

After authoring with maestro, I went and checked the VIDEO_TS.IFO file and looked at the "first play PGC" setting in IFOEdit, and it was still apparently blank. So whatever that feature was supposed to do, still didn't seem to work.

All I want is the main movie, one audio track, and NOTHING else. Any more ideas on what to try? Anybody? I can't be the only one trying to do this with this setup.

Ryan

[Fredrick]

When I author with Maestro and set the first chapter in the play list I wind up with 4 pre play commands in the VIDEO_TS.IFO file. I delete the first three and adjust the last one. Then I don't have any problems with the picky DVD player.

[aftertaste]

Well i seem to be having the same issues with this new movie i just did last night. And I found something weird the get VTS Sectors didn't do the same thing they did last time. So i'm starting to believe it has to do with that. On the successful one last night the Get VTS Sectors brought up 3 boxes where i had to hit ok 3 or 4 times something like that. The same holds true for the movies i do that are under 4.3. And the interesting thing is when i do Get VTS Sectors for them movies its after I strip the streams and have the old .ifo open or at least when i have the old .ifo open in IfoEdit. Now when i made the one last night that worked i also had the old .ifo open in IfoEdit. I can't see why this makes any difference but i'm gonna play around with it and hope i can find some relation. I really like IfoEdit but i may try DVD Meastro myself.

[aftertaste]

Well i took the dvd that worked and the one of the ones that didn't work and compared the .ifo files and i couldn't find one thing different between the 2. It just doesn't make any sense. Maybe i just got lucky with the one. I don't know cause I haven't been able to make another one that workes yet. I'm almost starting to think it has something to do with the burner or the discs. Nothing else makes sense. The .ifo files appear to be exact between the 2. And i spent an hour comparing the 2.

[Antonio S.]

@aftertaste:

Last night I discovered a similar problem...

DVD's made using the "MOVIE ONLY" option in Ifoedit0.95, works in my Apex DVD player, but not in other players (Sony, Denon, Mitsubishi, etc.). The strange thing is that the DVD-R is recognize by the player but nothing happens. So I carefully check the DVD-R's that doesn't play in those player and discovered that all were made using Ifoedit0.95 (movie only option or authoring option). When I examined the VIDEO_TS folder of those movies, I noticed that the VTS_01_0.vob was not there. I am not so sure if that file is needed or the "CORRECT VTS OPTION" may not work properly in version 0.95. However when using other authoring programs, the VTS_01_0.vob is always created, even if you doesn't create any menu...

Antonio S.

[rkorkie]

Fredrick, I finally found out where you were talking about the Pre Commands. It was under VMGM_MAT. I am using IFOEdit to view and edit so I hope it is right????

Anyhow, I deleted the first 3 pre commands, and now the only command I have is:

(JumpTT) Jump to Title: 1

So, should I be adjusting that one, or is it good as is?? Given your previous post about changing it to "(JumpSS_VMGM) Jump to VGM PGC: 1 or (Jump_TT) Jump to Title 1 or 2)", I'm not really sure what you were saying to make for changes as that was sort of confusing. Can you make exact clarification? Thanx.

Another major concern I have that no one can answer is why is IFOEdit authoring changing the movie length and screwing up the chapter alignment? I do exactly as the guide tells me, and after authoring, it simply changes it completely. Woe is me...! :-(

[aftertaste]

@Antonio

Hummm very interesting I have also noticed that file is not present either. Although they "ALWAYS" work if I do the movie only option and they are under 4.3. Its only when i re encode and author that i am have issues. And the _0.vob is not present on the movies that work fine in my standalones.

[Garnett]

I am having similar problems to aftertaste and rkorkie in that,

My standalone (Marantz DV4100) will play DVD-R no problem.
I can use IFOEdit to strip a movie down to DVDR size and burn it correctly with correct operation. I can reencode with ReMPEG if necessary and get these creations to work in my standalone (but this takes for ever and sometimes has chapter jumping problems).
However, when I use CCE to create and author with either IFOEdit0.95 or DVD Maestro I hit problems in that the DVD is not recognised by my standalone. Or in the cases where it sometimes works - the chapters and time settings are screwed up.
The common part would seem to be the use of CCE - but this is just an assumption.
I'm going try some of the suggestions and will let you guys know if I have any more luck.

As for the question about VTS_1_0.VOB being missing - you will find that that VTS_X_0.VOB usually contain a menu (try looking at the file with DVD2AVI and you will see what I mean.) This should not be an issue if you are just doing main movie only).

[rkorkie]

Hey Garnett, you are definitely on to something there. You have identified both exact problems that I am having. I don't believe the common problem is with CCE. I believe it has to do with the fact that we are transcoding a 23.976 frame/sec movie, but then in order to put it into any authoring program, it has to be 29.97 frames/sec. That clearly explains why the movie becomes 20% shorter (as 23.976 is 80% of 29.97). It somewhat explains how the chapters are screwed up, but then again, I never trusted the celltimes.txt file that IFOEdit creates because it adds different chapter positions than what chapter-xtractor does. Took a look and compare the output from either program using the original movie IFO files, the output is not the same. IFOEdit will add chapters that are only just a few cells apart, and it was also adding additional chapters at the end. Instead of taking the celltimes created from IFOEdit, I created a file manually using chapter-xtractor at 23.976 and used it when authoring in IFOEDit and the chapters were much closer in alignment, although they were about a second or tow off. Try it, tell me what you see.

What this doesn't explain is why does Maestro is still able to author a movie of the correct length and IFOEdit is not, even though each movie is 23.97 frames/sec after the authoring is done. I'm still baffled, and no one has yet been able to point me into the right direction!!!! AGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!

[Antonio S.]

to aftertaste, Garnett, and rkorkie:

I am having also similar problems...

I used to made movies using Ifoedit, and all of them can be played correctly in my Apex DVD players. However this week I bought a Mitsubishi progressive scan player and discovered that movies made using Ifoedit0.95 (Authoring option or Movie Only option) doesn't work (even when my new player accepts DVD-R's). At first I thought that the problem may be the missing VTS_01_0.vob. But you were right, that is not the problem! From other forum someone suggest to use Gear Pro DVD6.0 instead of Prassi DVD or Nero for burning the DVD-R's. This guy claims that if something was wrong in the structure of the VIDEO_TS the program won't burn the DVD. So I download a Trial Version of the program and tried to burn some DVD-R's using VIDEO_TS created with Ifoedit... All of them have problems. Gear Pro check the structure and I always get the same error:

"LOAD ERROR ON FILE VTS_01_0.IFO...FILE CANNOT BE LOADED AT THE REQUIRED ADDRESS (646) BECAUSE THE ADRRESS IS ALREADY OCCUPIED. FIRST AVAILABLE ADDRESS IS 659..."

However when using other commercial authoring programs, there was no error.
Does any of you knows how to change the adrress of VTS_01_0.IFO ? Is this a possible bug in Ifoedit ?

Antonio S.

P.D. I always use the "GET VTS SECTORS" option in Ifoedit before burning a DVD

[rkorkie]

ok guys, well after much reading and research and trial and error, the problem is finally solved. The solution is to avoid Nero altogether!!!!! Don't use it to burn dvd-video, dvd udf/iso, dvd images, nothing. Basically, if I have to transcode a video, use CCE, then pulldown, and then your best friend is DVD Maestro to author it. After doing that, use Imgtool 0.89 and create and .img file. Then use DVD Decrypter to burn it. That successful formula played first try on both of my test dvd players without a hitch using a dvd-rw disc. No problems with movie length or chapter alignments!!!!! I am finally very happy to say it's over! Now I can start renting from Netflix!!! :-)

The only time I'll use IFOEdit is if the movie will fit onto a dvd-r without transcoding, because it doesn't have to alter the movie, chapter points, etc.

If you have any questions, ask away, I'll try to help!

Ryan

[aftertaste]

Interesting yet i'm not so sure that was the problem. Something interesting about "Get VTS Sectors". It only seems to work when i close ifo edit after i finish authoring and re-open then run "get VTS Sectors". At that point it brings up 3 seperate boxes that you have to click ok. That is "NOT" the case when trying to "get VTS Sectors" right after authoring. Not sure if that is exactly what fixed the problems but I wouldn't doubt it. Now i am also using the newest version if ImgTool to burn and it has a few dvd compatability boxes that i leave checked. As for nero i'm not sure that is the problem or all of the problem. The newest version of imgtool uses nero to burn and i haven't had a problem since i have been using it. As far as the chapters being out of line it does have to do with the difference between 24 fps and 30fps. Why Maestro doesn't show the difference i can't answer. Now that i have that problem fixed i am unto an even bigger and more dissapointing problem. My Kenwood DV-5900M refuses to play anything i have re encoded without the movie being jerky. I have managed to turn off deinterlacing within the SA but that doesn't seem to help. I have tried many differences throughout the encoding process and the final result is the same JERKY. Maybe it has something to do with the Faroudja deinterlacer or something. They all play back fine in every SA except the kenwood i have tryed them in. It's really nice my $100 tridex plays them fine but my $1400 kenwood is about useless so far. I know this isn't the tread to be posting this on and i will strat a new tread in dvd encoding.

[aftertaste]

rkorkie did a few morw tests and I conclude you were right. I encoded a movie and did nothing with the color from the pgc nor did I do anything with the Get VTS Sectors. Since I have been using imgtool .99 for burning it has fixed the problems completly. It was all a burning issue. For the rest of you having issues like this try different burning software. I love ImgTool v0.99. I haven't had one dvd give me problems since. Good job rkorkie i think we got this problem licked :) Also fixed my jerky playback problem with my Kenwood. Turns out it was something i had checked in pulldown i wasn't supposed to. For more information on that refer to the DVD Encoding fourm.

[aftertaste]

By the way as for the chapters lining up you have to do alittle math to make them work. In cce the frame rate is 24fps after running pulldown it is 30fps. What u need to do in cce is multiply the frame by 5 and devide that by 4 (20% reducion). Then set that number in cce. When you get to authoring you use the original frame numbers. Then your frames will line up on the final product. Thanks to my buddy Scott for that bit of advice. Why they show up in the authoring program messed up is probably because of the difference from 24 to 30 fps. But it doesn't matter ignore what the authoring is telling you and make sure u set the chapters right during your process and you'll be good to go.

[rkorkie]

hey aftertaste, sounds like a little perserverance gets things done. I'm just suprised that more people weren't chiming in, cause I assume EVERYONE must have had the same problems as we did at one point. Maybe no one noticed! Who knows.

Anyhow, I didn't have to do anything with the chapters file when authoring in Maestro. All I do is when I'm ripping using DVD Decrupter, in the options, it has a setting to create a Maestro .chp chapter file. How sweet it is. Just import that into your Maestro project and all works well. Do you think someone requested that "special" little feature for personal DVD backups?? ;-)

Good luck in the future!

[aftertaste]

As a test i encoded a movie without doing anything with the chapters in CCE. When i get to IfoEdit i insert the celltimes.txt. Everything works fine. Not sure why i have been told over and over to make sure i set the chapters in cce. I think IfoEdit will make sure the chapters fall on an even frame. I believe IfoEdit will pick the closest frame. Which is fine with me. I could care less where the chapters end up. I hardly ever use them and when i do its only to move around the movie faster not to land on a certain chapter.

[rkorkie]

are you saying that when you encoded with CCE, you didn't save the chapters in the .ecl file? I guess I never had a clue why that was supposed to be done. So, as a result of you ommitting that and adding the cell times in IFOEdit when you were authoring the dvd, are you saying all your files came out correctly, with the right movie length and the right chapter positions??? If so, that is GREAT to know. I use chapters for the same reason as you, to get through to various points in the movie more quickly. However, it's always nice to have the chapter points at logical positions in the movie. I'd hate to start sharing these with my friends and family and have that aspect totally out of whack. I hate cutting corners and doing the job half assed...which as you can probably tell is why I've pursued these subjects so adamently.

Ryan

[aftertaste]

i haven't checked it that closely. All i know is i don't get any blocks or weird frames when i change chapters as i was told by many people would occur. I don't care where the chapters end up on the final movie as long as they are there and i can move through the move faster. Like i said i hardly EVER use them. Matter of fact the only time i use them is to test and make sure they work lol. I am quite picky about everything i do. I look for upmost quality (as i do a 4 pass vbr in cce) and so on. But i had to ask myself if it was worth all the time it takes to make something that i never use nor care about line up and match so perfectly. I figure it takes a good 30 mins extra of "MY TIME" not the computers time to make them line up and be so called perfect. I mean were already getting rid of the menus and extras. So in my mind its never gonna be an exact copy. Not to mention u have to remember the life span on dvd-r are about half the life span on a pressed dvd. So i can't justify spending the extra time it takes to make them so called perfect. Plus I copy about 3 dvds a day. But to each is own and i firmly believe in that. If you feel its worth the time it take to make that aspect work perfectly then by all means go for it. And if thats the case then i wouldn't suggest doing it my way because i don't think they line up like the original dvd would.