AhtlonXp 2100+ CCE Sloooow Speed.Help Please...

[a3ternus]

Hey people...I m using WinXP on an AthlonXP 2100+ (Gigabyte GA-7VA,Via KT400 Chipset),512DDR333 RAM and I m doing a 3-pass VBR encoding of a 105min movie using CCE 2.50 SP (Image Quality 17,Anti-Noise Filter 1),but I get a CCE speed of only 0.965 (!).I think this is too slow...What might be the problem ?!?
Here is my DVD2sVCD (latest version) log...Any ideas ?!?
(Also,the resulting movie was one of the worst Quality mpeg i ve seen in a long time...What s happenning here ?!?)
NikitaS.

DVD2sVCD Log
---------------------------
Executing Cinema Craft Encoder.
StreamSectors: 1668571576
AudioSectors: 102476780
VideoPAPO: 24259644
ScanOffsetBytes: 189370
SeqAligningBytes: 12035490
DVDBytes: 0
VideoEndHeader: 8
SubtitleSectors: 0
EmptySectors: 238.00
PictureSectors: 0.00
PureMPEGStream: 1529610284.27
Seconds: 6319.32
CalcMPEGStream: 1529610284.27
Frames: 157808
CDSize: 800.00
Cut point 796.00
Variable Settings:
Frames: 157808
Anti Noise Filter: 3 <-------------Is this the reason ?!? Maybe I should turn it off ?!?
Passes: 3
Image Quality: 17
VAF file creation: On
Video Encoding Mode: Multipass VBR
Min. bitrate: 300
Max. bitrate: 2530
Avg. Bitrate: 1936
Aspect Ratio: 16:9 (borders added, encoded as 4:3)

---AVS Begin---
LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\SIMPLE~1\SIMPLE~1.DLL")
LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\MPEG2Dec\mpeg2dec.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\AVISYN~1.DLL")
mpeg2source("D:\Royal\DVD2AV~1.D2V")
SmartDeinterlace(3,10,True,True,True) <---Is this the reason ?!? Should I use Telecide/PAL ?!?
SimpleResize(480,432)
AddBorders(0,72,0,72)
AvisynthSubtitler("D:\Royal\Subs\","permsubs.txt")
ResampleAudio(44100)
----AVS End----
:( :confused: :(

[auenf]

im not exactly sure, but those two lines (deinterlace and resize) would slow down your processing.

Enf...

[Boulder]

Deinterlacing will definitely slow down the process. There's no need to deinterlace if you watch the movie on your TV. I'm not sure if you'll even have to deinterlace when watching a movie on PC, you might want to test that.

It could be that the movie doesn't compress well and therefore it looks really bad. I have some movies with an average bitrate of 1500 and they look great on both PC and my TV. You could try helping the compression by adding a noise reduction filter but this will slow down the process quite a lot. It's not necessary to use CCE's noise reduction at all, some people (not me) have had problems with it.

If I need any extra compressibility, I use Convolution3d with settings (0,3,4,3,4,2.8,0) , which won't remove details but will make the movie compress a little bit better.

[a3ternus]

Thanx...Convolution3d is getting quite famous day by day...is it so good ?!? I ll give it a try (via Avisynth right ?!?).
NikitaS.
PS.The movie is The Royal Tenenbaum ...

[Milkman Dan]

C3D, while a great filter, is even slower than the Deinterlacing you are using.

And the deinterlacer is going to account for almost all your speed loss there.

[theReal]

Should I use Telecide/PAL ?!? In my experience, ivtc isn't much faster than deinterlacing, if at all. For example telecide() from the decomb plugin uses Fielddeinterlace() for postprocessing unless you put it like telecide(post=false).
In the first case, telecide() is probably slower than a Fielddeinterlace() alone. However, Smartdeinterlace might still be even slower, so I'd try Decomb for deinterlacing - maybe it helps.

[Toti]

Well, I thought you got it fast. I am using my Pentium 4 2.4Ghz with 1gig of RAM and using DVD2AVI 1.86, AviUtil (deinterlace) 0.98B, then VFAPIConv 1.05 to do a fake avi, I get 0.71 of speed using CCE SP V2.66.01.02

Since Movies here in the NTSC world come progressive with one or two of interlace frames at the begining of each chapter I must deinterlace the whole thing which slows down the process from 1.78 to 0.71 in CCE SP.

When using Avisynth I get 0.90 but still is super slow. I do VBR with 9 passes and it takes around 20 hours to do a two hour movie. If anybody has a faster way of compressing progressive with interlace video please let me know.

[LB]

Like I always say when talking about CCE speed. If you are going to filter, then use HUFFY avi for your input. Do a search and you will find out what I'm talking about.

In a nutshell, if you are going to filter, you do all your filtering first and output it to a semi-uncompressed avi using the huffy codec in vdub. A 2hr movie will = 30gb. It's large but the benefit is you only utilize your filters once through that conversion. Then you can feed that directly into CCE and process at the MAX possible speed. For dual 1800s I've found that going to SVCD rez = 3.226 and going to DVD rez = 2.01 RT. Give it a shot. If you are only getting .5 now then it can't hurt. ;p

LB

[DVD__GR]

In my pc (1700+) with deinterlacing i got 0,9 from 1,35 without!!

[timekills]

Originally posted by Toti
Since Movies here in the NTSC world come progressive with one or two of interlace frames at the begining of each chapter I must deinterlace the whole thing which slows down the process from 1.78 to 0.71 in CCE SP.

When using Avisynth I get 0.90 but still is super slow. I do VBR with 9 passes and it takes around 20 hours to do a two hour movie. If anybody has a faster way of compressing progressive with interlace video please let me know.

1) You are REALLY wasting your time if you deinterlace a 2 hour movie because of a perceived few frames of interlacing at the beginning of a chapter. Which does not always exist, BTW. NTSC DVDs and Force Film in DVD2AVI are your friend. You'll never notice if there <i>are</i> a couple of inerlaced frames from re-editing of the DVD.

2) Depends on what your output is. I assume this is for DVD backing up. Again, if there a just a couple of frames - don't worry about it. If it is a whole PGC, and you want to keep it - encode the GC separately. This is usually the safest/best way to re-encode movies anyway - by PGC since then you can avoid some of the branching problems. Finally - 9 pass?!?! I use a 2.0 @ 2.4 and get about 1.8 speeds on my progressive NTSC DVD re-encodes. But I do 3 pass AT MOST. 90% I use one pass VBR, and even on a large tube TV (albeit not HD) I rarely see any difference. And a 1.8 speeds, I can re-encode in a jiffy anyway.

I am working on a "for dummies" (No offense at all - you obviously don't fit in there) at my site, which I won't list here, but it does further address some of your concerns if you are interested. Once I am done I'll give it to Doom. It basically updates the Scenarist instructions, but talks about some of your other concerns too (example used is Ocean's 11 which has 7 PGCs in the main title set, 1 of which is straight progressive, some are "true" NTSC (i.e. interlaced through and through).

*phew*

[Boulder]

Jesus, nine passes! Even Custom Technology themselves have stated that the quality max is at 3-4 passes. No wonder it takes so long:D

[Toti]

To TimeKills, I am always open to suggestions and I have tried everything before I go ahead and deinterlace a 2 hour movie. Movies like Traffic, Shrek and others have indeed interlace frames in the movie.

I have analyzed the video after taken out the pulldown & dropdown flags. I have tried forced film on DVD2AVI (which by the way it only takes off the flags but it does not force progressive frames throughout the movie). Trust me that some movies I do not have to deinterlace it but if you don't believe me I can email you just a few seconds where this Mixed video is, so you can do your testing with these kinds of DVDs.

If I encode using the force film with no deinterlacing and then doing the pulldown I get a perfect movie and when it comes to the interlace frame or frames. I see the interlace picture for just a frame or two. This is annoying and very noticeable on my eyes. Maybe I am too picky.

About the 9 passes, I have noticed a big difference between 1 & 3 passes. I have also noticed a smaller difference between 3 & 6 passes. However, between 7 & 9 passes is almost imperceptable but when you are squeezing a 3 hour movie to DVD-R (Gladiator, BraveHeart,Contact...etc.) I don't know if the difference between 7-9 passes is more noticeable because of the lower bitrate. Am I the only one doing these kinds of comparisons???? has anybodyelse taken time to do the different compressions and tested?

My speeds using a P4 2.4Ghz (400 FSB) with 1.5 Gig Ram and a hard drive with 7200 RPM & 8 MB buffer , CCE SP 2.66.07 is the following:

Avisynth 1.66
Avisynth (Smooth Deinterlace) 0.88

Can speed be faster still? Here is the script for Avisynth I use.

NO DEINTERLACING
LoadPlugin("C:......MPEG2DEC.dll")
mpeg2source("G:.....")


IF DEINTERLACING
LoadPlugin("C:......Smoothdeinterlacer.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:......MPEG2DEC.dll")
mpeg2source("G:.....")
SmoothDeinterlace(tff=true) //tff depends on the source

Please people give me some input, if you do get a higher speed using CCE, what version you have what's your computer specs and what method you use. If avisynth, let me know the script.

[atreides93]

I get speeds around 1.7 or 1.8 using Avisynth.
I have an Athlon XP 2100 and PC2700 DDR RAM

By the way, you said you sometimes notice a few interlaced frames, do you watch your movies on your computer or on a tv??

[Toti]

atreides93

I use a 32 inch plasma monitor. I don't know if it would be considered a TV or a monitor. I have it connected via VGA & S-Video to a DVD player. I notice the interlaced lines whether is coming from the DVD player or the Computer DVD-ROM. I even notice some interlace lines from a digital sattellite when watching cartoons. Please post your Avisynth script.

[timekills]

atreides93: Please remember to not specify AVIsynth speeds without also specifying what, if any, filters you use. Getting 1.8 in Avisynth with an XP2100 is about what I would expect with no filters, which I presume is what you are using to get that speed.

toti: I believe you when you mention the inconsistencies with interlacing in movies. Often when post-editing is done, the frames are inserted already interlaced - the dvd player knows not to DF them. So, yes, you will occasionally find these glitches in the middle of movies, and more frequently at the beginning. You are absolutely right - they can be noticed, especially if you already know they are there (i.e. we perfectionists making the backup). On a plasma MONITOR you will notice it more than on a TV, of course. It comes down to which is more important - a second of interlaced artifacts, or a few (possibly more) hours of encoding time.

A possible way to speed up your encode is to encode by either cell or PGC in CCE. You would have to either re-mux the ensuing .m2v files or do the editing in your authoring program of choice, but it would probably save time to just de-interlace the few minutes that actually contained the interlaced footage - i.e. only run the deinterlace on the specific cell or PGC containing the interlaced frames.

[atreides93]

Ah ok, I probably should have specified what settings I used.
I used NO filters at all in AviSynth. Just used mpeg2dec.dll and the ResampleAudio command.
Then I passed it directly to CCE 2.50SP

[benf2]

a3ternus did you reslove your speed issues?

I just built a new machine running the msi kt4ultra, 2100xp, 512mb, ata133raid 0, using cce266107 and just did a movie running speeds between 1.8 and 2.0...i use a basic script though...(setmemorymax 250, loadplugin, load source, killaudio) thats it. XP prof. OS.