DAR of 4:3 but contain Widescreen picture. How to convert?

[trutifuti]

Hi,

I need some help with an aspect ratio for a PAL movie in 1.85:1 ratio (suitable for 4:3 TV). When viewed on a 16:9 TV there are black borders on all 4 sides. This I taken from my search and describe my problem:

“There are also DVDs which have a DAR of 4:3 but contain widescreen picture. In fact, it should say letterboxed widescreen. These DVDs have been mastered as just explained. When you watch these DVDs on a 16:9 TV the picture will both have to be stretched horizontally and vertically”

What numbers should I ad to my AviSynth cript, for the movie to fill out the whole screen?
I'm using DVD2SVCD.

Best regards

Trutifuti

[Suzahara]

Just crop off all the black and then resize it to a 16:9 size, like 640x360.

[scmccarthy]

Crop(9,80,702,416)
LanczosResize(576,312)
#CropBottom(4)

This should work without the second crop; I am showing it to you for completeness. If you do need it, you would probubly crop more than 80 lines off the top to begin with. Resizing to (768,416) gives you exactly the same ratio and maximum picture quality; which one you chose would depend on whether you are trying to encode for a single CD or not.

As you can see, I love playing around with numbers like this, otherwise the other reply is normally sufficient. This gave me a chance to play around with the PAL format, which I don't usually do since I only deal with DVD region 1.

DVD FAQ help me with this answer.
http://www.dvddemystified.com/dvdfaq.html

If this raises any DVD questions, please feel free to email me directly.

This is my first post to this Forum. Avisynth is lots of fun due to the flexibility it gives you over your output. We get to choose the exact pixel aspect ratio we want. The best thing to do would be to try it and see if it works. We could discuss why I wrote the script that way, but better to try it instead. The proof is in the pudding.

[trutifuti]

Without understanding how you get the numbers, I changed the AviSynth to Crop(9,80,702,416)
LanczosResize(576,312). I changed the “LanczosResize” to SimpelResize
I’ll be back with the result.

[scmccarthy]

I am curious to know how it turned out. I based it entirely on the best information I could get on the net. I have never even seen a PAL DVD. Even though I am confident it is correct, I still need feedback on what it actually looks like. I am guessing that just a little of the picture (a few columns) on the sides is cropped and a very thin slice of black mattes are left on the top and bottom, so the aspect ratio will be right.

[trutifuti]

Hi again,

I have now tried your suggestion. The aspect ratio seems fine but I have a green line on the right of the picture and just as you predicted, a thin black border on the bottom plus a flickering. The permanent subtitles are kind of “broken in the bottom to.
I also tried to ad “CropBottom(4)” but that didn’t change anything.
As you might have noticed I’m just a new bee in this field, so please bear with me. You on the other hand clearly know what you are talking about. I’m so glad that you take the time to help me. Thanks a lot.

Please let me know I you need more information and sorry for the delayed reply, but it took some time to test the different settings.

[scmccarthy]

Try CropBottom(8), the horizontal and vertical dimensions might need to be evenly divisible by 16; this is called mod16, meaning that with interger division, you will get a remainder of zero if you devide by 16, 304 ÷ 16 equals 19 with remainder 0. Keeping it mod16 might solve the green problem.

DAR stands for Display Apect Ratio, it says nothing about whether the DVD is anamorphic or not, neither does it refer the the movies aspect ratio. DAR for a computer screen is 1:1, for a PAL TV it is 128:117, and for a 16:9 Widesreen PAL movie, it is 512:351. A movie might have an apect ratio of 1.6, 1.78, 1.85, 2.2, 2,35, or even 3.0.

A Widesreen TV streches the picture wider than a regular TV by the ratio 4:3 for both PAL and NTSC. So assuming that your DVD is non-anamorphic, and you plan to view the movie on a Widescreen TV, you might stretch the movie horizontally by a 4:3 ratio and let the TV stretch it the other way across the screen, like this:

Crop(8,32,704,512)
BicubicResize(528,288,0.0625.1) #new favorite Bicubic settings

This is really to convert the image to an anamorphic one for 16:9 TV display only. The picture would look too skinny when previewed on the computer.

This information is only as good as my assumptions about what you are doing given the information you gave and my inexperience with DVD2SVCD. This is only my fourth post in this forum; a more experienced person would always as you to supply all the information he needs before giving any reply. So if you are using a non-anmorphic DVD and can resize the image to play across the whole 16:9 screen and I am right that you only have to compensate for the difference between how much a regular TV will strech the picure and how much the 16:9 TV will and having 288 scanlines is all the need for compatability VCD. If all these assumptions are right, then this new way will work out for you. Otherwise, at least I raised a lot of issues you need to understand better anyway.

If you are going to watch the movie on your computer screen, then try this for better mod16 compatibility:

Crop(8,80,704,416)
BicubicResize(592,320,0.0625,1)

Except adjust the crop to crop out all the black just as the first suggestion said, viewing the .AVS file in Windows Media Player.

Or for the same pixel aspect ratio of 128:117 I suggested before for viewing on your computer screen also, but with mod16 compatibility:

Crop(9,32,702,512)
BicubicResize(432,288,0.0625,1)

or

BicubicResize(576,384,0.0625,1)

depending on how big you want it.

Or finally, don't change the aspect ratio at all, just crop off the sides and resize to mod16 of the same ratio.

Crop(4,6,705,564)
SimpleResize(360,288)

but if that were right, you would not normally resize at all.

So you see there are too many possibilities. Remember to be specific and use the right terminology and you will get a responce from people who are more experienced than I.

And remember that you can preview the avs file in any program that can play an avi file before commit to encoding. And remember that perhaps the encoding process might change the aspect ratio again from what you see in the avs file if you are encoding to mpeg-1 VCD format; I don't know enough about VCD and TMPG, having made one myself. Which brings up my final reminder: don't expect people to know about VCD when you post a question in the avisynth forum. This is one of the reasons it is important to stay on topic, I can teach you about aspect ratios and how that applies to editing an avs file and that is about it.

With respect and good luck etc....

Stephen

P.S. If you respond with more specific information answering some of the questions I raised here, then I will give you more specific advice that would be much easier to follow. Otherwise, this should be very helpful, if you can wade through it.

[trutifuti]

All right, the data you ask for would be:
Non-anamorphic PAL DVD, with an aspect ratio of 1.85:1
PAL 16:9 Widescreen TV
Viewing movie on a Widescreen TV only.
Converting DVD to SVCD using DVD2SVCD

I have taken a log example from a typical DVD2SVCD encoding regarding the AVS:

---AVS Begin---
LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\MPEG2Dec\mpeg2dec.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\AVISYN~1.DLL")
mpeg2source("D:\Video\soldiers\DVD2AV~1.D2V")
TemporalSmoother(1,1)
BicubicResize(480,576,0,0.60)
AvisynthSubtitler("D:\Video\soldiers\Subs\","permsubs.txt")
ResampleAudio(44100)
----AVS End----

The movie is “We were just soldiers” (anamorphic 2.35:1 PAL Widescreen)

As for right now, I’m trying your new settings (Crop(8,32,704,512)
BicubicResize(528,288,0.0625,1)

I guess that what I would like is better understanding in the basic of AVS and lots of other things. I know it is out there, but some times it’s rather difficult to understand all the terms, you know me coming form a non English speaking country.

In the mean time I’ll do some more reading on basic terms :)

[trutifuti]

Nop – wrong aspect ratio. Now it is in 4:3 ratio.
Witch numbers stands for what in the Crop and Resize entry?

[scmccarthy]

Crop(9,80,702,416)
BicubicResize(576,312,0.0625,1)

In Crop, 702:416 is the size of the frame without changing the pixel aspect ratio. Now multiply each pixel by 128:117. That ratio makes a frame ratio of 576:312 in the Resize. At 1.8462, this is very close to 1.85 for the movie. But wait, 312 is mod8, not mod16 and 1.85 does not match the 16:9 Pal Widescreen TV Display Aspect ratio of 1.78 anyway. So I will use the exact same pixel aspect ratio, but pad the top and bottom with black mattes:

Crop(9,64,702,448)
BicubicResize(576,336,0.0625,1)

The exact same pixel aspect ratio, but a different frame ratio.
576:336 is 1.7143.

Anamorphic is a 4:3 frame that needs to be stretched across a 16:9 display to look right.

[trutifuti]

YES!!! Thanks a lot. :D

P.S.
What dos the 0,0.0625,1 mean in the Bicubic? Nomaly it would say 0,0.60

[Suzahara]

Originally posted by trutifuti
YES!!! Thanks a lot. :D

P.S.
What dos the 0,0.0625,1 mean in the Bicubic? Nomaly it would say 0,0.60

From the avisynth documentation:

BicubicResize
BicubicResize(clip, int target_width, int target_height, float "b", float "c")
BicubicResize(clip, int target_width, int target_height, float "b", float "c", float "src_left", float "src_top", float "src_width", float "src_height")

BicubicResize is similar to BilinearResize, except that instead of a linear filtering function it uses the Mitchell-Netravali two-part cubic. The parameters b and c can be used to adjust the properties of the cubic, they are sometimes referred to as `blurring' and `ringing,' respectively.
With b = 0 and c = 0.75 the filter is exactly the same as VirtualDub's "precise bicubic," and the results are identical except for the VirtualDub scaling problem mentioned above. The default is b = 1/3 and c = 1/3, which were the values recommended by Mitchell and Netravali as yielding the most visually pleasing results in subjective tests of human beings. Larger values of b and c can produce interesting op-art effects--for example, try b = 0 and c = -5.

If you are magnifying your video, you will get much better-looking results with BicubicResize than with BilinearResize. However, if you are shrinking it, you are probably just as well off, or even better off, with BilinearResize. Although VirtualDub's bicubic filter does produce better-looking images than its bilinear filter, this is mainly because the bicubic filter sharpens the image, not because it samples it better. Sharp images are nice to look at--until you try to compress them, at which point they turn nasty on you very quickly. The BicubicResize default doesn't sharpen nearly as much as VirtualDub's bicubic, but it still sharpens more than the bilinear. If you plan to encode your video at a low bitrate, I wouldn't be at all surprised if BilinearResize yields better quality.

You have to set
b + 2 * c = 1
for the numerically most accurate filter.
This gives for b = 0 the maximum value for c = 0.5, which is the Catmull-Rom spline and a goog suggestion for sharpness.

From c>0.6 the filter starts to "ring". You won't get real sharpness, what you'll get is crispening like on a TV set.
No negative values are allowed for b. Then stay on b=0.

[scmccarthy]

@trutufuti

Suzahara has got it 100% right.

BicubicResize(702,512,0.0625,1)

I like what the above does to DVDs when I view it on my computer screen probubly because I like the ringing effect. Adding noise is not nessesarily a bad thing, but it will always hurt compressabiligy by definition. 0.0625 softens and smooths slightly. 0,1 is the sharpest possible setting. Even though I like it sharp I guess I have to advocate backing off and never use a setting sharper than this:

BicubicResize(702,512,0.0625,0.625)

As the third number increases it becomes less sharp:

BicubicResize(702,512,0.6,0.6) is back down in the range Suzahara recomended. If you have trouble compressing switching to BilinearResize will help. Lanczos has a reputation for being sharp without ever over sharpening. Most people assume Lanczos will compress better than Bicubic, but not as well as Bilinear.

P.S. 0, 0.6 is very good, as sharp as possible without over sharpening. LanczosResize() only takes two parameters. Bicubic is the only resize filter with extra parameters. Effectively, there is a near infinite number of BicubicResize filters possible.

[trutifuti]

Got it, thanks again.

[trutifuti]

I’m back again,

It looked ok when played in PowerDVD but when I made a copy and played it on my stationary DVD player !!
Now the picture is placed in the upper left corner and only filling out about 2/3 of the screen. The aspect ratio isn’t quit right either. When the TV stretch the picture to 16:9 it become to “flat”. Some thing went very wrong.

[trutifuti]

This is a snapshot from the original VOB file:

[scmccarthy]

I am proceding on the assumption that that is a snapshot of a video frame before processing, as it is stored on the DVD.

[trutifuti]

That is correct.

[scmccarthy]

Good, because I took the liberty to make single frame avi files from the jpeg image; one anamorphic version that only looks right on HDTV if you stretch the image across the whole screen and a square pixel version for viewing on the computer or on HDTV with black bars on the side because you should not stretch it.

You still need black mattes on the top and bottom, just much thinner ones. Remember, you are putting a 1.85 movie into a 16:9 == 1.78 frame and that won't fit right without mattes. I don't have time to explain more right now, so I'll just give you the zip file; you might find it sufficiently self explanatory.

Oops! the file is too large, I have to send the jpeg versions of my avi file. I really did convert your jpeg to a bitmap image I opened in VirtualDub and saved as an avi file. Then I took my new avi files and managed to find a way to convert them back to jpeg files (originally as examples embed in a message explaining them like you did with the first jpeg) using IrfanView. Even two avi frames are just to big to send as an attachment, so my example jpeg files will have to do.

[scmccarthy]

The anamorphic version was not calculated exactly as I meant to. Trying to resize for a non-square display is harder than making AVIs to watch on my computer screen. I don't know if this is right, but this is what I meant to do:

[edit] a single frame in an avi is plenty small. I was using huffy and had no idea how much bigger that would make it This is in divx 3.

[edit] My thinking on this was that the frame will be expanded to 4:3 automatically when you send the picture to the HDTV and then stretch the picture another 4:3 for the 16:9 DAR. So I stretched the picture for a 4:3 TV and then threw the AP off by a factor of 3:4 within the same frame. Clear as mud, huh?

But I don't really know if a Digital TV behaves more like an analog TV or a computer screen if you play something from the computer.

[edit the edit] Actually, if I stretch the picture to 4:3 first, I am assuming the HDTV will not do it for me. So I just contradicted myself. That is the difference between the my two tries anyway. This second one is the one that assumes the HDTV will behave like a computer screen. The first one is the way to go if you burn it back on a DVD. No there are too many factors I can't account for without actually owning an HDTV. The difference is pretty small anyway.[end edit the edit]

[trutifuti]

First of all, it is not a HDTV, it is a normal 16:9 analog Widescreen TV.
Second I don’t understand why we are Cropping 2 times?
Just for your information, when the original DVD is played from the stationary DVD player on the 16:9 analog TV, you get a picture with equal borders on all 4 sides. If you switch the TV over to “Cinema” mode, you thereby stretches the picture both horizontal to 16:9 but also vertical and thereby get the whole screen filled out but with drastic decrease in picture quality..(Hoping I’m making this understandable)

[trutifuti]

Hmmm—I think my second question about why you are cropping 2 times have been answered by your explanation :

"My thinking on this was that the frame would be expanded to 4:3 automatically when you send the picture to the HDTV and then stretch the picture another 4:3 for the 16:9 DAR. So I stretched the picture for a 4:3 TV and then threw the AP off by a factor of 3:4 within the same frame. Clear as mud, huh?"

I just had to read it a lot of times to get it.
So you want me to try :

Crop(10,83,704,448)
BilinearResize(704,546) # Anamorphic
Crop(0,0,704,498)
AddBorders(0,15,0,15)

Isn’t there some thing about, that in the crop command the numbers must be dividable with 4 ?

[Suzahara]

No, it doesn't HAVE to be a multiple of 4. Some filters require a multiple of 4 or 16 though, and it's better if you can get it to be divisible by one of these numbers, but if a filter doesn't require an input of 4, you're free to crop however you like.

[scmccarthy]

Crop(10,83,704,448)
BilinearResize(704,546) # Anamorphic
Crop(0,0,704,498)
AddBorders(0,15,0,15)


Let's focus on this one script and even put aside the question of whether is works for your purpose. Looking at what this script does step by step.

OK, first of all, the 10 and 83 in the first crop is OK, because you need to crop to even boundaries horzontally and to any line you want.
The frame Crop outputs is 704, mod64 and 448, mod64. I cropped all the black on the left and on the top, leaving the bottom matte for the second crop.

The resize takes a 704:448 frame and makes a 704:546 frame. Calculate the pixel aspect ratio by taking the destination frame size and multiply that by the inverse of the source frame size:

704:546 x 448:704 = 448:546 = 32:39 = 0.8205.

Normally, you would choose the pixel aspect ratio 128:117 for regular and 512:351 for anamorphic and either multiply it by the source frame size to get the destination size to resize to or multiply the inverse pixel aspect ratio by the destination frame in order to decide what to crop the source to at the beginning. Read the paragraph above ten times noting when to crop and when to resize. Now you know exactly what I mean when I say Pixel Aspect Ratio and how it differs from DAR.

The second crop could have been:

CropBottom(48)

First I cropped 83 lines from the top past the first line of picture, because the first line is often halfway into the black matte ahyways. Now I am cropping into the picture again. This will give the top and bottom a very shart line when I add the new black mattes:

AddBorders(0,15,0,15)

Now the output frame is 704:528 = 4:3 = 1.33....

So I must have thought the 4:3 frame would get stretched by 4:3 again in the TV to get 16:9. The tall skinny image will become closer to the correct aspect ratio on the TV.

That is what I thought. But my underlying assumptions about how to do it keep on shifting from under me. Without any practical experience with an anlogue widescreen TV, I can't test to see what works best.

Again, going back to the mod4 question:

704 is mod64 and 528 is mod16. That is what your encoder is going to see, nice big round numbers. Avisynth handles the rest internally, Crop(9,83,704,448) would have been converted by avisynth to Crop(8,83,704,448) without telling you. Each filter only sees the output from the last filter and the encoder only sees the output from the last filter.

Stephen

[trutifuti]

Some thing went wrong with the encoding. I got these CCE encoding errors :

“cce encoding failed: Could not write to file D:video\dino\Encoded_video_CCE_PAL.mpv”

And :

“Fexp_close() failed: Could not write to file D:video\dino\Encoded_video_CCE_PAL.mpv”

Here is my Log:

--------------------------------------------------------
- 20-11-2002 08:38:58
- DVD to SVCD Conversion
- DVD2SVCD ver. 1.0.9 build 3
--------------------------------------------------------
Initializing
Initializing finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 20-11-2002 08:39:02
- Analyzing subtitles
--------------------------------------------------------
Subtitle found: StreamID: 0x22 Language: Norsk
Subtitle found: StreamID: 0x23 Language: Svenska
Subtitle found: StreamID: 0x20 Language: Dansk
Subtitle found: StreamID: 0x21 Language: Suomi

Executing subtitle selection/verification.
Subtitle selection/verification accepted.
1 subtitle streams selected.
Saving Subtitles ini file
--------------------------------------------------------
- 20-11-2002 08:39:12
- DVD2AVI
--------------------------------------------------------
Creating DVD2AVI INI file:
- C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\DVD2AVI\DVD2AVI.INI

Variable settings:
iDCT_Algorithm: 32-bit SSE MMX

Executing DVD2AVI.
Executing DVD2AVI. Commandline:
"C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\DVD2AVI\DVD2AVI.exe" -CS=2 -YR=1 -EXIT -OF=[D:\Video\dino\DVD2AVI_Project_file] -IF=[D:\Video\dino\VTS_01_1.vob,D:\Video\dino\VTS_01_2.vob,D:\Video\dino\VTS_01_3.vob,D:\Video\dino\VTS_01_4.vob,D:\Video\dino\VTS_01_5.vob,D:\Video\dino\VTS_01_6.vob]
Framerate: 25000
DVD2AVI processing done.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 20-11-2002 08:43:08
- Free on drive D: 38956.89 mb
- Extracting the subtitles.
--------------------------------------------------------

Subtitle extraction finished. Extracted these subtitles:
SVCD Stream no: 1 Language: Dansk Num. of subs: 933

Saving Subtitles ini file
--------------------------------------------------------
- 20-11-2002 08:53:43
- Free on drive D: 38934.50 mb
- AUDIO Extraction
--------------------------------------------------------
Found AC3 stream id: 0x80
Filename: D:\Video\dino\Extracted_audio_1.ac3
Audio1 delay: 0 ms
Audio extraction finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 20-11-2002 09:03:04
- Free on drive D: 38558.25 mb
- AUDIO conversion
--------------------------------------------------------

Converting Audio to MP2. Filename: D:\Video\dino\Extracted_audio_1.ac3
Executing BeSweet. Commandline:
"C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe" -core( -input "D:\Video\dino\Extracted_audio_1.ac3" -output "D:\Video\dino\Encoded_audio_1.mp2" -logfile "D:\Video\dino\Encoded_audio_1.log" ) -azid( -L -3db -c normal -g max ) -2lame( -e -b 224 -m s )
Audio conversion of D:\Video\dino\Extracted_audio_1.ac3 finished.

Audio conversion finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 20-11-2002 09:39:25
- Free on drive D: 38370.09 mb
- Converting Pictures
--------------------------------------------------------
Converting: C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\DefaultChangeCD.bmp
Finished converting pictures
--------------------------------------------------------
- 20-11-2002 09:39:35
- Free on drive D: 38369.28 mb
- Video Encoding using Cinema Craft
--------------------------------------------------------
- Editing AVS script file

Executing Cinema Craft Encoder.
StreamSectors: 1666479976
AudioSectors: 200124288
VideoPAPO: 22714632
ScanOffsetBytes: 211346
SeqAligningBytes: 13432238
DVDBytes: 0
VideoEndHeader: 8
SubtitleSectors: 6488608
EmptySectors: 238.00
PictureSectors: 300.00
PureMPEGStream: 1423508855.73
Seconds: 7051.88
CalcMPEGStream: 1423508855.73
Frames: 176122
CDSize: 800.00
Cut point 791.00
Variable Settings:
Frames: 176122
Anti Noise Filter: Off
Passes: 0
Image Quality: 8
VAF file creation: On
Video Encoding Mode: One Pass VBR
Q. Factor: 5
Min. bitrate: 1900
Max. bitrate: 1614
Aspect Ratio: 4:3 (No borders, encoded as 4:3)

---AVS Begin---
LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\MPEG2Dec\mpeg2dec.dll")
mpeg2source("D:\Video\dino\DVD2AV~1.D2V")
Crop(10,83,704,448)
BicubicResize(704,546,0,0.60)
Crop(0,0,704,498)
TemporalSmoother(1,1)
Sharpen(0.30)
AddBorders(0,15,0,15)
ResampleAudio(44100)
----AVS End----


Could it be the order in the AVS ?

[scmccarthy]

The DVD2SVCD must have created an avs script by default, I need to see that initial script in order to edit it so that CCE gets something it can use. I don't know what frame aspect ratio CCE expects. Off hand I would say it can only take a frame size 352x576:

Crop(10,83,704,408)
AddBorders(0,72,0,72)
BicubicResize(352,576)

Which just cuts off the borders on the sides and does not change the aspect ratio at all, if that were the proper output frame ratio. Don't use it though unless you can confirm that that is right. I guess I'll have to break down and actually run DVD2SVCD for myself. Or you could post the default script.

[trutifuti]

Could this be it ?

[Settings]
XPos=236
YPos=431
UseDVDRip=0
UsevStrip=0
UseInternalRip=1
Save diskspace=0
vStrip Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\vStrip\vStrip.exe
vStrip Folder=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Movie
DVD2AVI Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\DVD2AVI\DVD2AVI.exe
DVD2AVI Folder=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Movie
iDCT=0
DVD2AVI Pause=0
WavConv=5
BitRate=7
tooLame Mode=0
Audio Folder=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Movie
Autodetect Azid Gain=1
SubMux Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\WinSubMux\WinSubMux.exe
MPG2Dec DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\MPEG2Dec\mpeg2dec.dll
InverseTelecine DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\InverseTelecine\Donald Graft\decomb.dll
SimpleResize DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\SimpleResize\SimpleResize.dll
CCE Folder=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Movie
NoOfpasses=0
CCE Image Quality=8
CCE Anti noise value=2
CCE Anti noise=0
CBR=0
One Pass VBR=1
Multi Pass VBR=0
Dont Delete Files=1
Create VAF=1
QFactor=5
Linear quantizer scale=1
Zigzag scanning order=1
Pulldown Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\pulldown\pulldown.exe
Pulldown Folder=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Movie
Use2Streams=0
Pri1Audio1=28
Pri1Audio2=-1
Pri2Audio1=-1
Pri2Audio2=-1
Sub1=26
Sub2=-1
Sub3=-1
Sub4=-1
Sub5=-1
Sub6=-1
Sub7=-1
Sub8=-1
Azid Gain Offset=6
Rip subtitles=1
Subpictures Folder=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Movie\subs
Min. Delay. Between Subtitles=100
SVCD subtitles=0
BeSweet Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe
MPEG51 Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\MPEG5.1\pub_enc.exe
Permanent subtitles=0
PAL Y-Pos=406
NTSC Y-Pos=-1
MinsHigh1=50
MinsHigh2=76
MinsHigh3=100
MinsHigh4=125
MinsHigh5=163
NumCd1=1
NumCd2=1
NumCd3=2
NumCd4=2
NumCd5=3
NumCd6=3
CDSize 1=740
CDSize 2=800
CDSize 3=800
CDSize 4=800
CDSize 5=800
CDSize 6=800
MaxBitrate=2530
MinBitrate=1900
MaxAvg=2230
MinAvg=1600
Adjust Audio Bitrate=1
Use Min. Avg.=0
Force Film=2
bbMPEG Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\RunbbMPEG.exe
bbMPEG Folder=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Movie
Movie Offset=2
CDOverlap=2
I-Author Folder=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Movie
Data Preparer=dvd2svcd
VCDImager Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\VCDImager\VCDImager.exe
VCDXBuild Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\VCDImager\VCDXBuild.exe
Use I-Author=0
Use VCDImager=0
No images=0
Use VCDXBuild=1
Title Picture=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\DefaultTitlepicture.bmp
Change CD Picture=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\DefaultChangeCD.bmp
Length of Chapters=60
Use TitlePicture=0
Use ChangeCD Picture=1
Avisynth Bicubic b Value=0
Avisynth Bicubic c Value=0.60
SmartDeinterlace Mode=2
SmartDeinterlace Treshold=10
SmartDeinterlace Denoise=1
SmartDeinterlace Blend=0
SmartDeinterlace Fast=1
Edit Avisynth Script file=2
UseAVI2SVCD=0
UsePVA2SVCD=0
UseDVD2SVCD=1
PVA Executable=
PVA Folder=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Movie
UseCDOverlap=1
Wave Length Adjust Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\WLA\WLA.exe
FirstRun=0
MADPlay Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\MADPlay\madplay.exe
Use CDMage=0
CDMage Executable=
RunPerCDImage=0
RunPerCDImage Executable=
RunFinal=0
RunFinal Executable=
RunPerCDImage Params=
RunFinal Params=
bbMPEG videoDelay Adjustment=180
bbMPEG audioDelay Adjustment=180
bbMPEG audio1Delay Adjustment=180
Use MPEGAV=0
FixedChapters=0
DVDChapters=1
ForceIAuthorSupport=1
TMPGEnc Rate Control Mode=2
Subtitle DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Avisynth Subtitler.dll
BMP Loader DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Avisynth BMP Loader.dll
VFAPI Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\VFAPI\Reader\VFAPIConv-EN.exe
ResizeMethod=0
Resize AVS Position=1
TemporalSmoother AVS Position=2
Sharpen AVS Position=3
UseMPEG1=0
UseMPEG2=1
Convert to Canopus codec=0
Convert to Divx4=0
Use Frameselection=0
New Default Folder=0
DVD2SVCD Level=0
Eject DVD=0
Luminance Gain=0
Luminance Offset=0
Audio1Downsampling=0
Audio2Downsampling=1
Audio1BitRate=10
Audio2BitRate=9
Folder Structure Source=
Folder Structure Video=
Folder Structure Audio=
Folder Structure Muxed=
Folder Structure Subs=Subs
Intra=8,16,19,22,26,27,29,34,16,16,22,24,27,29,34,37,19,22,26,27,29,34,34,38,22,22,26,27,29,34,37,40,22,26,27,29,32,35,40,48,26,27,29,32,35,40,48,58,26,27,29,34,38,46,56,69,27,29,35,38,46,56,69,83
NonIntra=16,17,18,19,20,21,22,23,17,18,19,20,21,22,23,24,18,19,20,21,22,23,24,25,19,20,21,22,23,24,26,27,20,21,22,23,25,26,27,28,21,22,23,24,26,27,28,30,22,23,24,26,27,28,30,31,23,24,25,27,28,30,31,33
Matrice Preset=
Use deafult Matrice=1
LFEDownmixLR6Ch=-3
LFEDownmixLFE6Ch=0
CenterDownmix6Ch=0
SurroundDownmix6Ch=0
DynamicCompression6Ch=1
StereoDownmixType6Ch=0
RearChannelFiltering6Ch=0
DialogNorm6Ch=0
LFEDownmixLR2Ch=-3
LFEDownmixLFE2Ch=0
CenterDownmix2Ch=-1
SurroundDownmix2Ch=-1
DynamicCompression2Ch=1
StereoDownmixType2Ch=0
RearChannelFiltering2Ch=0
DialogNorm2Ch=0
No Audio Conversion=0
TemporalSmoother Strength=1
TemporalSmoother Radius=1
Use TemporalSmoother=1
Use Sharpen=1
Sharpen Value=0.30
Flip Vertival=0
Add ResampleAudio=1
Resize To=0
Use CCE=1
Use TMPGEnc=0
CCE Safe Mode=0
CCE Field Order=2
Progressive=1
Auto Intra DC=1
DVD Compliant=0
Restrict auto I frame insertion=0
Close all GOPs=0
Intra DC=2
M GOP=3
MN GOP=5
SEQ Header=1
Constrained Parameter Set=1
TMPGEnc Motion search precision=4
TMPGEnc Field Order=2
Frames pr spread=25
Spread=60
OffsetFixed CQ Value=80
Use fixed CQ Value=0
DC component precision=0
Output YUV data as Basic YCbCr not CCIR601=0
Use floating point DCT=1
No motion search for still picture part by half pixel=1
Soften block noise=0
Soften Intra=35
Soften NonIntra=35
TMPGEnc GOP I Pictures=1
TMPGEnc GOP P Pictures=4
TMPGEnc GOP B Pictures=3
TMPGEnc SEQ Headers=1
TMPGEnc Max frames in GOP=0
TMPGEnc Close GOPs=0
TMPGEnc Detect Scene Change=1
Enabled Padding=0
SubOutputPalette0=clBlack
SubBlendPalette0=0
SubOutputPalette1=clWhite
SubBlendPalette1=15
SubOutputPalette2=$001E1E1E
SubBlendPalette2=15
SubOutputPalette3=clGray
SubBlendPalette3=15
Resize Subtitles=70
CVD subtitles=1
bbMPEG MPEG1=0
bbMPEG VCD=0
bbMPEG MPEG2=0
bbMPEG SVCD=1
bbMPEG DVD=0
bbMPEG VBR=1
bbMPEG Pad VCD=0
bbMPEG Write PEC=1
bbMPEG Add Scan Offsets=1
bbMPEG Align Sequence Headers=1
bbMPEG Use Private Stream 2=0
bbMPEG Computed Bitrate=1
bbMPEG TimeStamps=0
bbMPEG Pulldown=2
bbMPEG MuxRate=0
bbMPEG Pack Size=2324
bbMPEG Packets Pack=1
bbMPEG Video Buffer=230
bbMPEG Audio 1 Buffer=4
bbMPEG Audio 2 Buffer=4
PBCType=0
Use ChangeCD Picture on All=0
Use EntrySVD=0
Save XML=1
Save Movie Info=1
ProcessPriority=0
Automatic Shutdown=0
[Executables]
PVA Executable=
vStrip Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\vStrip\vStrip.exe
DVD2AVI Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\DVD2AVI\DVD2AVI.exe
BeSweet Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe
MadPlay Executable=
MPEG51 Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\MPEG5.1\pub_enc.exe
CCE Executable=C:\PROGRA~1\CINEMA~1\cctsp.exe
VFAPI Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\VFAPI\Reader\VFAPIConv-EN.exe
TMPGEnc Executable=
Pulldown Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\pulldown\pulldown.exe
SubMux Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\WinSubMux\WinSubMux.exe
bbMPEG Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\RunbbMPEG.exe
I-Author Executable=
VCDImager Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\VCDImager\VCDImager.exe
VCDXBuild Executable=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\VCDImager\VCDXBuild.exe
CDMage Executable=
RunPerCDImage Executable=
RunFinal Executable=
MPG2Dec DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\MPEG2Dec\mpeg2dec.dll
InverseTelecine DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\InverseTelecine\Donald Graft\decomb.dll
Subtitle DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Avisynth Subtitler.dll
BMP Loader DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\Avisynth BMP Loader.dll
SimpleResize DLL=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\SimpleResize\SimpleResize.dll
Title Picture=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\DefaultTitlepicture.bmp
Change CD Picture=C:\Programmer\DVD2SVCD\DefaultChangeCD.bmp
[Folders]
PVA Folder=D:\Video\dino\
DVD2AVI Folder=D:\Video\dino\
vStrip Folder=D:\Video\dino\
Audio Folder=D:\Video\dino\
CCE Folder=D:\Video\dino\
TMPGEnc Folder=D:\Video\dino\
Pulldown Folder=D:\Video\dino\
bbMPEG Folder=D:\Video\dino\
I-Author Folder=D:\Video\dino\
Subpictures Folder=D:\Video\dino\Subs

[scmccarthy]

No, I need the AviSynth script that DVD2SVCD creates. So I ran the program and found Avisynth_Script_file.avs in the movie subdirectory:

LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\MPEG2Dec\mpeg2dec.dll")
mpeg2source("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\Movie\DVD2AV~1.D2V")
BicubicResize(480,480,0.0,0.6)
AddBorders(0,0,0,0)

For PAL the size should be 480x576.

Both scripts are for a non-anmorphic 1.85 movie, as you need. Use the anamorphic version, because it will convert your non-anmorphic movie so you can size it to the full screen of a widescreen TV. Both scripts only work for any 1.85 non-anamorphic movie.

LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\MPEG2Dec\mpeg2dec.dll")
mpeg2source("D:\Video\dino\DVD2AV~1.D2V")
Crop(10,0,702,576)
AddBorders(0,63,0,63) #702x702
BicubicResize(480,960,0,0.6) #stretch vertically by 2:1;
#4:3 for anamorphic, 3:2 for VCD
Crop(0,192,0,576) #VCD needs 480x756

So this is it; the key is the 720x576 --> 480x576 resize that must happen for SVCD. There is a difference in resizing to get the pixel aspect ratio you need and cropping and resizing while retaining the same aspect ratio. You need to understand and study carefully how to crop off what you do not need without affecting the aspect ratio.

SVCD standard 720x576 = 1.25 --> 480x576 will be the same pixel aspect ratio for 702x561.6 = 1.25 --> 480x576 or 700x560 --> 480x576 or 50x40 = 1.25 --> 480x576 all gives the same PAR for the portion of the frame left after the crop, however small. So the only reason the straight non-anamorphic verson is more complicated than:

Crop(10,8,700,560)
BicubicResize(480,576,0,0.6)

Which will work perfectly for any PAL DVD that was mastered with black on each side, is so you can have 702 lines for the same PAR:

LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\DVD2SVCD\MPEG2Dec\mpeg2dec.dll")
mpeg2source("D:\Video\dino\DVD2AV~1.D2V")
Crop(10,54,702,468)
BicubicResize(480,480,0,0.6)
AddBorders(0,48,0,48) #VCD needs 480x756
UnFilter(-8,0) #This seems to sharpen it,
#but it is really a softening setting.

They are exactly the same except one retains two more columns of picture from the source. So remember, to not change the pixel aspect ratio, crop to the same frame ratio, in this case 1.25.

Please note that up to now I was speaking in complete ignorance of what SVCD required. I contradict myself many times in this thread, due to the fact that I did not understand SVCD. I don't have to apologise for that because this is the avisynth thread. You found someone who understands AviSynth and the difference between pixel aspect ratio, frame aspect ratio, and display aspect ratio. Nevertheless, if you do reread the thread with that in mind, you will probubly get a lot out of it.

Good luck and I have one more zip file to attach:


This time you can copy it directly, since I even used the name of your source file.

[trutifuti]

Sorry to say, but now I get this error for the SVCD_anamorphic.avs :

AVIFileGetStream:No data

Could it be the "BicubicResize(480,960,0,0.6)" that is out of range (the 960)?

P.S. you have no idea, how much i appreciate your efforts.

[scmccarthy]

No, check to see it your d2v file still exists. Try using CCE by itself. Just open the Avisynth script in CCE and find the subtitles and mp2 audio file. Now that everything has been ripped, you don't need DVD2SVCD anymore. Look in a folder called movie for some of it.

[trutifuti]

Hi again,

Sorry, can't make it work. CCE starts loading the scripts and then stops just before it should begin the encoding.
Some thing is wrong whit the script??? If I leave out the Crop-line and the AddBorders-line, CCE comes with an error:

Frame size 480x960 is not supported. Supported frame size is up to 720x576 :(

[scmccarthy]

BicubicResize(480,960,0,0.6)
Crop(0,192,480,576)

Don't change the script, 480x576 is standard PAL SVCD format.

The lines above crop off 192 from the top and bottom:

960 - 192 - 192 = 576.

CCE only sees the output from the scripts last line. Everything else is internal to avisynth. AviSynth makes whatever application that opens it think it is opening a regular avi file. That is the whole idea behind avisynth.

If you remove the last line, then CCE sees a 480x960 avi file. That's the wrong size.

An alternative way to write Crop is:

Crop(0,192,0,-192)

Does the same thing.

You are trying to create an SVCD file aren't you?

[scmccarthy]

By the way, the script I called anamorphic is meant to be watch on the TV when you use the Cinema switch. Otherwise it will look wrong. Anamorphic is probably a confusing word for it.

[Faceman101]

Far as anyone has tried, you can not make an Anamorphic SVCD.

[scmccarthy]

I agree; WideScreen TVs, do have the ability to strech a 4:3 image across the full 16:9 width, distorting the image unless it is anamorphic. If indeed the TVs Cinema setting does stretch the picture 4/3s wider than normal, why not stretch the image 4/3s taller than normal? An anamorphic lens in movie making is a lens that sqeezes a wide image into a standard filmstock, there is no such thing as an anamorphic film stock, only an anamorphic lens. Similiarily, there is only one frame size for a DVD, but two ways to resize the picture on the TV screen. Normally, the DVD adjusts automatically for the type, unless you use a widesreen TV; then you want the DVD player to treat every DVD as non anamorphic and use the Cinema setting for anamorphic DVDs and the regulat setting for regular DVDs.

[trutifuti]

Some friendly person send my a privet e-mail with this solution to the problem:

LanczosResize(720,768) <--- or 480,768 .. if you want a PAL-SVCD
Crop(0,96,480,576)

Wupti- and there it was! Now looking at the result I must say, that this cannot be don with a good result. The movie is all “blocked up” with the biggest macro blocks I’ve ever seen. So unless there is some solution to this --- forget it.

I want to thank you all, especially Nesti and scmccarthy, for you big efforts in helping me with this.

Best regards

Trutifuti

[frank]

FitCd by SHH is the best known tool for resizing and bitrate calculations. It generates an Avisynth script too.
Usable for all media (DVD, SVCD, VCD, Divx (PAR1:1))
FitCD Homepage (http://shh.dvdboard.de/)

[scmccarthy]

I just remembered that macroblocks can be eliminated if you add noise and that the cleanest and easiest form of noise is the over-sharpening effect you get with BicubicResize(width,height, 0, 1) that you were warned against.

Stephen