My DVD formula for success

[Steelfanatic]

First of all, I want to give my thanks to : Doom9, Derrow, Lightning UK, Trilight and others for their help in making this tough backup hobby of ours alot easier.

Now this is a thread to HELP others with their backups, NOT to say my way or programs or products I use are the best. These have worked for me 100%, I have backed up about 120 movies and 50-60 PS2 games so I have a little experience under my belt. Ive used many programs also, done VCD, SVCD, and some DivX (thank god for DVD-R) heh. This "system" makes this process alot easier, especially for newbies.

The 2 keys to success is to use "quality media" VERBATIM has been a good choice for me, no let downs from these disks, fantastic quality and can be found for about $3-$4 a disk (worth the money). Secondly always,and I mean always MAKE A DVD IMAGE FIRST!! This gives you about 90-95 percent player compatibility. Im not kidding --tried many DVD players, this WORKS!!

DVD-5: (under 4.37 GB)or PS2 backups make an ((IMAGE)) with DVD Decrypter, burn with DVD Decrypter and be careful of some VIA chipsets, they caused me to almost pull my hair out using my Pioneer AO4 during burning.

DVD-9, (over 4.37 GB) ok here we go..., please dont start a flame war, this worked many times for ME and the quality of my backups are incredible. First File mode with DVD decrypter, select all files, and let it do its work. Now some movies I stripped down with IFO edit (props to Derrow)to get it to or under 4.37 GB, this is fine, but remember to "get VTS sectors" ,then make a ((IMAGE)) with IFOedit, burn with DVD Decrypter.(props to LightningUK)

Next are movies that are just too big and have to be resized. First File mode with DVD decrypter, just movie files (VOB's), and let it do its work. Then I use DVD2AVI 1.76 to make a frame server and select the best sound in .WAV format and use normalization feature. I like 23.976 (forced film) format that this program uses also. Ok TMPGEnc Plus 2.56 is my personal favorite encoder because of the incredible ease of use and great working backups and the "ruler" it uses to size the completed MPEG2 to fit on a blank DVD. For more information (props to Doom9) there is a TMPGEnc guide on this site. Finally Spruce-up (guide on this site too) is my authoring program of choice. It's easy, and never fails me, make your chapters, menus, and finally use it to make an ((IMAGE)) and burn with DVD decrypter.

Ok, I hoped this helped!! Good LUCK!!

[gedo]

I'm very interested in your 'always make an IMAGE to ensure player compatability' comments......

At the moment I don't do any re-encoding and stick to either stripping to fit on 1 DVD or splitting across 2. My biggest issue is player compatability and I've been concentrating on trying different media to solve this.

After splitting or stripping I normally use Nero to burn the disk.

Does anyone else have an opinion on this ??? Why would making an Image 1st increase the chances of a disk playing on a standalone player ???

[011]

@Steelfanatic

Any working method is good I guess but can't see the reason to dump away AC3 encoding and to ruin some incredibly spectacular sound effects. Spruce is fine but can't handle AC3 so you should use some "heavier artillery" :) like DVDmaestro. I personally never use image mode and have no compatibility problems. Just burn with Prassi everything I put in VIDEO_TS folder.

[Steelfanatic]

Originally posted by gedo
I'm very interested in your 'always make an IMAGE to ensure player compatability' comments......

At the moment I don't do any re-encoding and stick to either stripping to fit on 1 DVD or splitting across 2. My biggest issue is player compatability and I've been concentrating on trying different media to solve this.

After splitting or stripping I normally use Nero to burn the disk.

Does anyone else have an opinion on this ??? Why would making an Image 1st increase the chances of a disk playing on a standalone player ???

gedo and 011--check this thread for assistace http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=35397 if thats working for you,that is fine, I did non-image backups for a while..worked fine in a few players,(my older Pioneer, my PC,and APEX) then I purchased one of the new "picker" Pioneer and Toshiba players and I found out all this time that my with my "file" burning method (with nero 5580-5590) I was burning basically coasters.

The thing I wanted was long term future compatibility with other players, now my backups work in every player I have tried (about 25 players) with 0% failure rate. Im glad I bought a "picky" player to make me realize I was doing something wrong. I tried all of these brands--

Pioneer,Sony,Apex,PS2,Xbox,RCA,Emerson,Panasonic,Mintek,JVC,GE, Toshiba<-- Toshibas are very picky players as the new Pioneers are. Remember this,gedo, making an image only takes a few more minutes, its worth the time.
Also AC3 encoding is fine too, remember Im just sharing the way that "works for me" and is very very easy. Ive done many movies and this way is childs play.

[TRILIGHT]

Originally posted by Steelfanatic
...I found out all this time that my with my "file" burning method (with nero 5580-5590) I was burning basically coasters...

I think the reason a lot of people run into trouble here is that the directory structure and file order are VERY important if using the UDF/ISO mode that many mention. Apparently some players don't care and others do. My Sony (off the top of my head I think it's a 700P) is picky about this. If I burn a DVD by just dumping my files in there and burning UDF/ISO, it WILL NOT PLAY the disc! This is the reason that, to this day, I still use Nero 5580. Just personal preference, really.

Nero 5580 was the last one that I know of that I could choose the "DVD Video" option (NOT the UDF/ISO) and it would not complain that I altered the files. If you choose the "DVD Video" option, it makes sure that your file structure is just as the player expects it to be. I've not had a problem playing any of my discs on any player I've tried. The reason a lot of people say to make an image is that this file order is automatically taken care of when you create the image. You don't have to worry about it. The only reason I don't do it this way (and again, this is just my opinion) is that I don't like having to wait for an image to be created and then wait again for the burn. I just drop my files in and burn.

[Antonio S.]

2 comments...

1- If you have a full version of SpruceUp (not Demo), it will accept AC3 files so you don't have to convert them to WAVE...

2- It doesn't matter what version of NERO ! Don't use it to burn DVD-R's

Antonio S.

[TRILIGHT]

Originally posted by Antonio S.
2- It doesn't matter what version of NERO ! Don't use it to burn DVD-R's

What? Is this "attack TRILIGHT" day? hehe ;) Your opinion concerning Nero is noted. I'll be glad to stop using it when it stops working for me. :)

[hoops10]

I have to agree with Trilight on this one. I'm using Nero 5580 and using the DVD VIDEO option, it always burns compatible dvds. I've burned using this Nero method and the method of making an image and found that both work the same for me, and that the key is the media. I used Ritek's in both burning methods mentioned above and they still wont work in my Sony DVP-S300 but they will in my Apex 5131. I then tried Verbatim dvd-r's and they work flawlessly in both the Sony and Apex using both methods mentioned above to burn.

[Steelfanatic]

Trilight(props) and hoops, I see your point that Nero (5580)works in the DVD-Video option which is great, but in disagreement, many people cant get this version anymore, which the point of this thread. Making an image takes but maybe 10 minutes and is basically 100% compatible with ALL players I have tried. Also I got tired of wasting disks (DVD-R)and time (DVD-RW). See the trade-off? Image=works everytime or Nero =works sometimes. Like I said before, I really woke up when I bought a picky player. I highly suggest you try Nero disks in many more machines at your local electronics store so your not "stuck" later on. Ask yourself this, why do all the best DVD authoring programs (Spruce,Maestro,etc) have an image option? Just to have it?.............:rolleyes:

[Antonio S.]

TRILIGHT:

Well, I bought NERO about 2 years ago (since version NERO5) and I was very happy with it. Mostly I used it for CD-Audio, VCD, and (later) for SVCD. Since they make the new version for DVD burning, I tried all versions, including 5580, and it is not as compatible as "Prasso Primo DVD". The problem is that it works with some DVD players and with others not ( the "DISK ERROR" warning). I E-Mail them about this, and they are aware of the problem and are working to solve it...

And really, this is not the "attack TRILIGHT" day...:D

Antonio S.

[Steelfanatic]

....1- If you have a full version of SpruceUp (not Demo), it will accept AC3 files so you don't have to convert them to WAVE...

Antonio, I "acquired" the full Spruce-up :cool: and I know it can do full AC3 sound, but, .WAV works best with TMPGEnc Plus with some volume loss. To correct the problem: use normalization with DVD2AVI 1.76 and use TMPGEnc's sound editor and increase the sound to 120%, encode in stereo get amazing sound. Sounds great over my 6 speaker Sony home theater.

[Antonio S.]

What I don't see is , why you said " but, .WAV works best with TMPGEnc Plus with some volume loss". You really don't need to re-encode your audio again. If you enter this new WAV file to TMPGEnc, it will re-encode it as an MP2 file. Even when that type of file is mandatory for (S)VCD, and compatible with DVD, is better to have the original AC3 file when authoring DVD. When you re-encode audio, some quality is lost, and you lost multichannels (5.1 > 2.0). You just re-encode your video to lower it size, then author this new encoded file with you original AC3 audio file(s)...

Antonio S.

[Steelfanatic]

"What I don't see is , why you said " but, .WAV works best with TMPGEnc Plus with some volume loss". You really don't need to re-encode your audio again. If you enter this new WAV file to TMPGEnc, it will re-encode it as an MP2 file. Even when that type of file is mandatory for (S)VCD, and compatible with DVD, is better to have the original AC3 file when authoring DVD. When you re-encode audio, some quality is lost, and you lost multichannels (5.1 > 2.0). You just re-encode your video to lower it size, then author this new encoded file with you original AC3 audio file(s)... "

Antonio S.

I see your point,but, when authoring, with Spruce,I seemed to have difficulties with AC3 when I tried it. Either It would "struggle" with it or go completely out of sync with the video portion. I still get amazing sound with .WAV. Compared my DVD originals with my backups and still can't tell hardly any difference. Also, when I do it this way, I know EXACTLY what the final size will be to fit on DVD-R. Very easy.

[FWMan]

Steelfanatic

You have 0% failure rate, I think it dues to VERBATIM media, not the DVD image.
If you are using PrimoDVD and the under Tool Option -> DATA tab
Enable Recoginze, check, and Format ....option. You should have the same result.

FWMan

[Tron0]

I used Gear DVD pro to burn the DVD and it seems to work well too. Nero failed for me, but it was probably something I did wrong. Since I am a newbie at this Gear worked well and was easy to use. Just my opinion......

[Scoobydeux]

What is the most compatible sofware package for image creation (that lets you put in the JACKET_P folder, which ifoedit image creation does not do...).

Anyone have a preference? I have been doing the direct file method, and have had compatibily problems with a few of my friend's players, and want to up my comp. rate....

Scoobydeux

[TRILIGHT]

I know that both Maestro and Scenarist allow you to set this before you compile to an image.

[Scoobydeux]

This is true if you are authoring from scratch, but what about an 'edited' set of ifo's and vob's that you created new jacket photos for, that you want to include in the image? I have always used ifoedit's image creator without fail, but I would like to continue to add the jacket photos.... Which image creator in this case would get me the highest compatibility?

[Antknee]

:) The guide seems great, although I personally never create an image using SpruceUp. I let SpruceUp burn it.

[Steelfanatic]

I tried that, Ant, just seemed to never work for me=( with Spruce.

[TRILIGHT]

Originally posted by Scoobydeux
This is true if you are authoring from scratch, but what about an 'edited' set of ifo's and vob's that you created new jacket photos for, that you want to include in the image?

You don't have to have it as part of the project. As I've posted in another thread, the JACKET_P folder is not linked to any of the IFO's, etc. Just create any dummy project and then use the JACKET_P folder and files it creates.

[Scoobydeux]

I agree. I guess I am not wording it correctly. The IFOEdit image creator ignores the JACKET_P subdirectory when I try to create an image. Which simple and highly-compatible image creation software will INCLUDE the JACKET_P directory along with the AUDIO_TS and VIDEO_TS directories?

[atreides93]

Oh man, I've been burning DVD backups for a while now but somehow I totally missed the concept of burning an Image first. I just pick "UDF/ISO" in Nero and drag the video_ts folder onto it and burn. It always seems to work, but yesterday my Sony player wouldnt' play back a backup I made of star wars episode 2.
I thought maybe its something in episode 2 but maybe I should try the image method first.

i'm using nero 5.5.8.2

[revup67]

I've been ripping with Decrypter to an m2v file and also to an AC3 file. I then use DVD2AVI to VFAPI to CCE then to Maestro to build then compile the files to an ISO. Then write the files with Decrypter. This process has only worked once as I constantly get Media Detection errors. Do you get those? Apparently the video stream (although it shows in Maestro workbench) is invalid. I'm going insane trying to resolve this issue. I noted that you do things a bit differently in that you Decrypt only the movie stream within a VOB file or is the audio packed in there as well? You then process the VOB file in DVD2AVI. Can you elaborate more on exactly what is in the VOB file (sound and video) or are you demuxing with Decrypter. Are you then loading only the VOB with movie portion in DVD2AVI or loading the entire VOB and then demuxing in DVD2AVi. Interested also in the frameserver you spoke on earlier and Maestro doesn't like the 23.97 frames - how do correct this problem in TMPEnc?
Thanks - need help here - pretty frustrated. Countless hours wasted.

Rev

[Steelfanatic]

I've been ripping with Decrypter to an m2v file and also to an AC3 file. I then use DVD2AVI to VFAPI to CCE then to Maestro to build then compile the files to an ISO. Then write the files with Decrypter. This process has only worked once as I constantly get Media Detection errors. Do you get those? Apparently the video stream (although it shows in Maestro workbench) is invalid. I'm going insane trying to resolve this issue. I noted that you do things a bit differently in that you Decrypt only the movie stream within a VOB file or is the audio packed in there as well? You then process the VOB file in DVD2AVI. Can you elaborate more on exactly what is in the VOB file (sound and video) or are you demuxing with Decrypter. Are you then loading only the VOB with movie portion in DVD2AVI or loading the entire VOB and then demuxing in DVD2AVi. Interested also in the frameserver you spoke on earlier and Maestro doesn't like the 23.97 frames - how do correct this problem in TMPEnc?
Rev, Im using Decrypter in file mode, movie files only, so Im extracting sound AND video in my VOB`s.

Ok DVD2AVI [CREATES] my frameserver.(.d2v file)then..

Not demuxing .... Im DECODING to .WAV format, then using the "forced Film" option (23.976). Very important.


When encoding in TMPGEnc Plus,it automatically does 2:3 pulldown. You can edit sound, change the volume,fullscreen,etc...

Folks this encoding program to me is the best because it's so damn easy to do anything, I tried CCE and said "the heck with this."

Said the same for Maestro, I know alot of people like both of them here, but, they were a little too much for me as this is just a hobby, and I wanted to get the movies done, with quality, with ease, and without pulling my hair out.:angry:

Please let me know if this helps.

[TRILIGHT]

Originally posted by Steelfanatic
...Folks this encoding program to me is the best because it's so damn easy to do anything, I tried CCE and said "the heck with this."

Said the same for Maestro, I know alot of people like both of them here, but, they were a little too much for me as this is just a hobby, and I wanted to get the movies done, with quality, with ease, and without pulling my hair out.:angry:

I can sort of understand your point with CCE. If you aren't computer savvy, it can be a bit hard to pick up on. However, Maestro is one of the easiest DVD authoring titles I've seen out there! What are you using for creating your DVD compilation if not Maestro?

[atreides93]

In terms of ease of use, SpruceUp kicks Maestro's butt!! Maestro is a lOT easier to use than Scenarist though. But it still has a bit of a learning curve.

One thing I've found that confuses the hell out of me is if I split a DVD by demuxing each VOB file, i often get invalid m2v files or ac3 files. Its very annoying. I guess you can't just split them wherever you want, obviously there are headers and if you split it in the wrong place you lose the header.
So I am still trying to find out how to know where to split it....

Anyone know a good way to manually split DVD's? I'm talking about decoding it and re-encoding using Tmpgenc and then re-authoring using spruce up?

[Steelfanatic]

Very computer savvy, I am a computer builder (A+ technician) and still didn’t like CCE, started with TMPGEnc for VCD/SVCD and have been "spoiled" since.

Using Spruce for authoring...its extremely easy.To each his/her own I guess.

[Steelfanatic]

Anyone know a good way to manually split DVD's? I'm talking about decoding it and re-encoding using Tmpgenc and then re-authoring using spruce up?

Why split it? Why use up 2 DVD-R's? Why have to get up to change disks during a movie? This is 1 of many reasons I DO NOT do VCD/SVCD anymore. I Just resize it.

[atreides93]

Originally posted by Steelfanatic
Why split it? Why use up 2 DVD-R's? Why have to get up to change disks during a movie? This is 1 of many reasons I DO NOT do VCD/SVCD anymore. I Just resize it.

I don't mind getting up to change disks. In fact, its good to get some exercise once in a while and not sit down for 2 hours straight :)

Plus, I like to keep the movie at the original encoding rate or as high as the original rate, so I don't lose quality.

[TRILIGHT]

Originally posted by atreides93
I don't mind getting up to change disks. In fact, its good to get some exercise once in a while and not sit down for 2 hours straight :) Plus, I like to keep the movie at the original encoding rate or as high as the original rate, so I don't lose quality.

Why the hell do you bother going to any trouble at all then? Just get that new POS DVDxcopy and be done with it. That's all that thing does anyway. I don't even see why you would need the forum.

Originally posted by Steelfanatic
Very computer savvy, I am a computer builder (A+ technician) and still didn’t like CCE

Dude, are you kidding me?! If you're A+ certified and you don't understand CCE, I just lost all respect for the cert. (As if I ever had any. hehe)

[Steelfanatic]

Dude, are you kidding me?! If you're A+ certified and you don't understand CCE, I just lost all respect for the cert. (As if I ever had any. hehe)

Trilight, Im taking that as an insult, and losing respect for you in the meantime. Im just trying to help others on here and DO NOT appreciate those comments.

I never said I didn't understand it, just thought TMPGEnc was EASIER to use.

Have a nice evening.

[TRILIGHT]

Originally posted by Steelfanatic
I tried CCE and said "the heck with this."...they were a little too much for me...without pulling my hair out.:angry:
Sorry. Everyone else who makes comments like these don't understand the tools they're working with. I guess you use these comments differently than everyone else who says the same things about programs they don't understand. I've just never seen anyone speak this way about things that make sense to them. My mistake.

[Scoobydeux]

Do we have to call a time out here...:rolleyes: What fun!

[revup67]

Steelfanatic: you wrote -
>Rev, Im using Decrypter in file mode, movie files only, so Im >extracting sound AND video in my VOB`s.

Confused me here - are you saying you ripped a VOB file with the video stream only or both the video and audio within the same VOB.

Thanks,

Rev

[SidDan]

One thing´s for sure... I´ll never be any good at this unless a super duper software drops on my head from the all mighty above.

I have only burnt one successfully DVD movie which was fitted directly to to DVD-R...

and since I can´t make an iso from Ifoedit I can´t burn my other movie cus the software (Titanium using mac) just won´t accept the vts ifo file... instead of complaining about that file it says there is not enough memory available... stupid